Tidbits of Jugghead

[rosered]

  I believe you are on to something  also and loved how you broke it down  and explained your thoughts Cardinal

  and Marie 
I believe Jesus said , they missed something when the resurrection happens   
  it is they are like the angels   , not male or female , but new creatures in Christ , that become the  special anointing  of fulfilling Gods  end desire


Matt 22 29Jesus answered, "You are mistaken because you do not know the Scriptures or the power of God.


30In the resurrection, people will neither marry nor be given in marriage.

Instead, they will be like the angels in heaven.

31But concerning the resurrection of the dead, have you not read what God said to you: 32'I am the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob?' He is not the God of the dead, but of the living."

Jesus explains this beautifully in John 11



I Am the Resurrection and the Life
17 So when Jesus came, He found that he had already been in the tomb four days. 18 Now Bethany was near Jerusalem, about two miles away. 19 And many of the Jews had joined the women around Martha and Mary, to comfort them concerning their brother.

20 Then Martha, as soon as she heard that Jesus was coming, went and met Him, but Mary was sitting in the house. 21 Now Martha said to Jesus, "Lord, if You had been here, my brother would not have died. 22 But even now I know that whatever You ask of God, God will give You."

23 Jesus said to her, "Your brother will rise again."

24 Martha said to Him, "I know that he will rise again in the resurrection at the last day."

25 Jesus said to her, "I am the resurrection and the life. He who believes in Me, though he may die, he shall live. 26 And whoever lives and believes in Me shall never die. Do you believe this?"

27 She said to Him, "Yes, Lord, I believe that You are the Christ, the Son of God, who is to come into the world."

Jesus and Death, the Last Enemy
28 And when she had said these things, she went her way and secretly called Mary her sister, saying, "The Teacher has come and is calling for you." 29 As soon as she heard that, she arose quickly and came to Him. 30 Now Jesus had not yet come into the town, but was in the place where Martha met Him. 31 Then the Jews who were with her in the house, and comforting her, when they saw that Mary rose up quickly and went out, followed her, saying, "She is going to the tomb to weep there."

32 Then, when Mary came where Jesus was, and saw Him, she fell down at His feet, saying to Him, "Lord, if You had been here, my brother would not have died."

33 Therefore, when Jesus saw her weeping, and the Jews who came with her weeping, He groaned in the spirit and was troubled. 34 And He said, "Where have you laid him?"

They said to Him, "Lord, come and see."

35 Jesus wept. 36 Then the Jews said, "See how He loved him!"

37 And some of them said, "Could not this Man, who opened the eyes of the blind, also have kept this man from dying?"

Lazarus Raised from the Dead
38 Then Jesus, again groaning in Himself, came to the tomb. It was a cave, and a stone lay against it. 39 Jesus said, "Take away the stone."

Martha, the sister of him who was dead, said to Him, "Lord, by this time there is a stench, for he has been dead four days."

40 Jesus said to her, "Did I not say to you that if you would believe you would see the glory of God?"

41 Then they took away the stone from the place where the dead man was lying. And Jesus lifted up His eyes and said, "Father, I thank You that You have heard Me.

42 And I know that You always hear Me, but because of the people who are standing by I said this, that they may believe that You sent Me."

43 Now when He had said these things, He cried with a loud voice, "Lazarus, come forth!" 44 And he who had died came out bound hand and foot with graveclothes, and his face was wrapped with a cloth. Jesus said to them, "Loose him, and let him go."
   
I see the power of death can no longer hold anyone   when THE TRUTH IN CHRIST   SPEAKS  and sets them FREE ..

  Gal 3 28 27For all of you who were baptized into Christ have clothed yourselves with Christ. 28There is neither Jew nor Greek, slave nor free, male nor female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus.

    and Christ is Gods   1 Cor 15 The Order of Resurrection



...27For "God has put everything under His feet."

Now when it says that everything has been put under Him, this clearly does not include the One who put everything under Him.


28And when all things have been subjected to Him, then the Son Himself will be made subject to Him who put all things under Him,

so that God may be all in all.


29If these things are not so, what will those do who are baptized for the dead? If the dead are not raised at all, why are people baptized for them?...

new creatures in Christ
just as the angels   , as messengers of God   though the anointing of the HOLY SPIRIT  AS RECONCILING  EVERYTHING TO GOD   that is doing the very purpose of GODS  DESIRE   and this is the  unforgivable sin to me is to not blaspheme against the HOLY SPIRIT OF LIFE ......

  Ambassadors for Christ

...16So from now on we regard no one according to the flesh. Although we once regarded Christ in this way, we do so no longer. 17Therefore if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creation. The old has passed away. Behold, the new has come! 18All this is from God, who reconciled us to Himself through Christ and gave us the ministry of reconciliation:...


   TO ME   as I can tell  it is  the resurrection life ..........being made new in Christ as a new creation that is no longer in an image  of God  but is the real thing !  :2c:


"Do not call to mind the former things; pay no attention to things of old.

Isaiah 43:19
Behold, I am about to do something new; even now it is coming. Do you not see it? Indeed, I will make a way in the wilderness and streams in the desert.

Isaiah 65:17
For behold, I will create new heavens and a new earth. The former things will not be remembered, nor will they come to mind.

Ezekiel 36:26
I will give you a new heart and put a new spirit within you; I will remove your heart of stone and give you a heart of flesh.


I believe this is the same and ONE  HOLY SPIRIT OF LIFE , that leads to all truth and life  and says there is no need that anyone teach you  , but it is the same mininersting   messengers reconciling the world in CHRIST  , though flesh and blood cannot see this at all ..." Hebrews 1:7, NASB: "And of the angels He says, 'WHO MAKES HIS ANGELS WINDS, AND HIS MINISTERS A FLAME OF FIRE.    [ see them as   some wind  that blows the coals  and also lakes of fire  myself ]  not an ocean or  sea , but lakes [personal  and enduring ]  by the same baptism of Holy Spirit & fire  , to purify and cleanse   though the same suffering  as children/creatures in Christ  by Light and fire  purium   being corrected  and disciplined  as received  of Him ... 
John 3:3
Jesus replied, "Truly, truly, I tell you, no one can see the kingdom of God unless he is born again."[born of the wind /spirit HEARING HIS VOICE  and LIVE ]

Romans 6:4
We therefore were buried with Him through baptism into death, in order that, just as Christ was raised from the dead through the glory of the Father, we too may walk in newness of life.

  I just wanted to explain   a bit on  that  , in my own faith ....

[sheila]

From the beginning God made them male and female. The glorified sisters are called the daughters of God/virgins.

Paul was speaking of God not being a respector of persons/nations/gender etc in His salvation plan.

Let no man put asunder what God has joined togather. all enter the ARK two by two.

    The Wedding Feast of the Lamb is the reunion of what was separated. God and Jerusalem Above[yourmother] are ONE SPIRIT like

a man is one flesh with his wife. God's word is written in our heart[woman] and mind[male]

the world at this very minute is expierencing much gender confusion reflecting the churches confusion in this manner. :2c:

[sheila]

 :2c:I AM not ashamed of being a woman in Love[spirit] made in the image of Jerusalem ABOVE..SOS ch 4.

   El Shaddai's image..many breasted one..that nurtures children with breasts...and protects[destroys]the enmitious seed.

I do not wear a man's garment...be He covers me with a corner of HIS.[Ruth]

[marie glen]

I love how the story of God's administration of the ages is a beautiful and simple one which speaks to all.. And is easily communicated.. if not easily heard, due to the shadows of the myth called hell and afterlife incarceration or torments .. And myths of eternal life without Jesus.. But.. these will fall away, and that will be wonderful and amazing! Because truth and He, are both wonderful and amazing!

Bless you sisters! :girlheart:

[Cardinal]

From the beginning God made them male and female. The glorified sisters are called the daughters of God/virgins.

Paul was speaking of God not being a respector of persons/nations/gender etc in His salvation plan.

Let no man put asunder what God has joined togather. all enter the ARK two by two.

    The Wedding Feast of the Lamb is the reunion of what was separated. God and Jerusalem Above[yourmother] are ONE SPIRIT like

a man is one flesh with his wife. God's word is written in our heart[woman] and mind[male]

the world at this very minute is expierencing much gender confusion reflecting the churches confusion in this manner. :2c:

Just a side note......He told me the root of respect of persons is preferring the flesh over the Spirit, and it goes all the way back into the garden, because she wanted what she could see and feel and feed her natural inclinations.  Sometimes what looks like something fleshly is actually His Spirit, and vice versa, sometimes what looks like it should be His Spirit is actually flesh. He is forever testing us to see if we will follow Him, even into things others swear could not be His Spirit leading you into. Story of my life.... :icon_jokercolor:

[rosered]

  rev 19 10.

I am your fellow servant, and of your brethren who have the testimony of Jesus. Worship God! For the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy."  Paul desired  that everyone had this gift , but it was   at  Gods    discretion , not our own ,   I hate being evil  and do not like the power it has over me  at all!!!!  , but find myself failing  certain test of faith  at times and it is  just as  said ,,,,,,, so overcome ......bound and  tied up in it  and  a mess really .


  Jesus Christ  is the name  given for salvation among mankind under heaven , but in heaven it is  with His new name  , that no earthly soul  knows .




  no one can have the ''Spirit of prophecy''   as the ones that were  given this from the foundation of the world   in my own  thoughts believe it to be so . by the scriptures , as God knows and no man knows but the ones that receive it .by hearing what the Spirit is saying to them  and teaching them the truth  in that time and place and matter by Jesus Christ testimony /witness .

 
and what does the name Jesus / Joshua   mean  exactly ? for me it is Most dictionaries will translate Jesus' name (which was apparently more properly translated to Joshua than "Jesus") to be "God is salvation." "God is salvation" is a phrase that ascribes a passive quality to God. ... Yah is short for Yahweh, and shuah is from yeshuah which means "to save, save alive, rescue."
  we are all searching for the clues  here   , right ? but Christ is a title , not a name  but The word Christ was a title or office ("the Christ"), not a given name. It derives from the Greek Χριστός (Christos), a translation of the Hebrew mashiakh (משיח) meaning "anointed"  one , and is usually transliterated into English as "Messiah".

This is why so many false christs  or fake anointings become so  confusing   , it is the  BABYLON  spirit  of mixing  flesh and spirit    and truth with lies   , very   corrupt 
   what is pure is pure and what becomes corrupted is  evil is present .....

  and  Jesus Christ said if it were possible  even the very chosen ones picked  for a  certain age and  place and time and purpose   were going to   do  just that declare TRUTH .  or be chosen to be the false christs  , Yes,  I believe some were chosen for this very purpose   to be deceived and to deceive   for a time  , but not forever   Thanks be to God    Jer 17 ;9

Romans 1:21
For although they knew God, they neither glorified Him as God nor gave thanks to Him, but they became futile in their thinking and darkened in their foolish hearts.

Romans 7:11
thFor sin, seizing its opportunity through the commandment, deceived me and through the commandment put me to death.   
Gods word or Sword of truth puts to death  that  which  is evil and must be cut  down  ..

Ephesians 4:22
to put off your former way of life, your old self, which is being corrupted by its deceitful desires;

but if it were possible even the very elect of God would be deceived   Matt24

23At that time, if anyone says to you, 'Look, here is the Christ!' or 'There He is,' do not believe it. 24For false Christs and false prophets will appear and perform great signs and wonders that would deceive even the elect, if that were possible. 25See, I have told you in advance.


Because JESUS  warns us of  this by the Spirit of prophecy  by having the mind of Christ in authority over you ... as headship .... foretelling prophecy  of what is to come upon us all .   

a discourse emanating from divine inspiration and declaring the purposes of God, whether by reproving and admonishing the wicked, or comforting the afflicted, or revealing things hidden; esp. by foretelling future events

Used in the NT of the utterance of OT prophets

of the prediction of events relating to Christ's kingdom and its speedy triumph, together with the consolations and admonitions pertaining to it, the spirit of prophecy, the divine mind, to which the prophetic faculty is due

of the endowment and speech of the Christian teachers called prophets

the gifts and utterances of these prophets, esp. of the predictions of the works of which, set apart to teach the gospel, will accomplish for the kingdom of Christ
The Return of the Son of Man
(Mark 13:24-27; Luke 21:25-28)

26So if they tell you, 'There He is in the wilderness,' do not go out; or, 'Here He is in the inner rooms,' do not believe it. 27For just as the lightning comes from the east and flashes as far as the west, so will be the coming of the Son of Man. 28Wherever there is a carcass, there the vultures will gather.

29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days:

'The sun will be darkened,

and the moon will not give its light;

the stars will fall from the sky,

and the powers of the heavens will be shaken.'

30At that time the sign of the Son of Man will appear in heaven, and all the tribes of the earth will mourn. They will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven, with power and great glory.

31And He will send out His angels with a loud trumpet call, and they will gather His elect from the four winds, from one end of the heavens to the other.

This is why I believe as I do  , because    the age of mankind is shortened to  70  years [ captivity ]  of being flesh and blood  more or less  , but as the scriptures declare   it  is so   and this is the confusion   the Bible  speaks of  in my own opinion , because this is when God would  gather us up one by one as His own  into Himself , there are some  other  scriptures
  but an example 
here is one

John 11:52

and not for the nation only, but in order that He might also gather together into one the children of God who are scattered abroad.

Being gathered into Jesus Christ  as Him being our Life    and can never die  , but LIVES  in us  and we are to keep this hope alive   into the glory of the Father .

How many times I would have gathered you Matt 23 Lament over Jerusalem
36Truly I tell you, all these things will come upon this generation. 37O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, who kills the prophets and stones those sent to her, how often I have longed to gather your children together, as a hen gathers her chicks under her wings, but you were unwilling! 38Look, your house is left to you desolate....
Berean Study Bible · Download
Cross References
Ruth 2:12
May the LORD repay your work, and may you receive a rich reward from the LORD, the God of Israel, under whose wings you have taken refuge."

Isaiah 5:4
What more could have been done for My vineyard that I did not already do in it? Why, when I waited for it to yield good grapes, did it bring forth sour fruit?

Jeremiah 32:31
For this city has aroused My wrath and fury from the day it was built until now. Therefore I will remove it from My presence

Jeremiah 36:26
Instead, the king commanded Jerahmeel, a son of the king, as well as Seraiah son of Azriel and Shelemiah son of Abdeel, to seize Baruch the scribe and Jeremiah the prophet. But the LORD had hidden them.

Hosea 7:13
Woe to them, for they have strayed from Me! Destruction to them, for they have rebelled against Me! Though I would redeem them, they speak lies against Me.

Matthew 5:12
Rejoice and be glad, because great is your reward in heaven; for in the same way they persecuted the prophets before you.

Matthew 23:31
So you testify against yourselves that you are the sons of those who murdered the prophets.

Luke 13:34
O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, who kills the prophets and stones those sent to her! How often I have longed to gather your children together as a hen gathers her chicks under her wings, but you were unwilling.

Luke 13:35
Look, your house is left to you desolate. And I tell you that you will not see Me again until you say, 'Blessed is He who comes in the name of the Lord.'"

Acts 7:52
Which of the prophets did your fathers fail to persecute? They even killed those who foretold the coming of the Righteous One. And now you are His betrayers and murderers--

   we water the seed/ WORD OF GOD  and  sow the seed in the hearts of mankind , it is God whom causes Spiritual growth  , though the HOLY SPIRIT  OF TRUTH  RECONCILING THE WORLD   BACK INTO HIMSELF   to me .

[marie glen]

I finally realized not too long ago, that I always think in the collective.. when I study, etc. My standing with God is not my 'goodness', it is Jesus'. My faith in Him declares me righteous, and I assume - innocent. The verdict is innocent. So I don't worry about it. The person I was before knowing Jesus (and God our Father) I no longer know. I am not perfect. Not at all.. but I don't want to do those things that lead to death.. I do struggle for instance, with impatience under my breath.. cussing, even, in my head.. Or thoughts other than holy thoughts.. that will pop into my head.. like noticing someone's weight or something.. but I apologize to the Lord.. and pretty much forget about it, because John wrote if we repent of it God is faithful to help us - to cleanse us of all unrighteousness, and ultimately imperfection. But He sees us I believe as who HE created us to be. So, even though I will often call myself a dweeb, sometimes in humor, sometimes in all seriousness.. I forget about it just as quickly as the wayward thought or word came drifting in.. or up? It feels like drifts in, but my being imperfect, it finds a brief roosting spot, hopefully only for a second! Repent, call myself a dweeb and go on. (Now you know the real me, lol :laughing7: ) This impersonal attitude frees me to study and consider God's Word as a collective, all of us, story and "administration of the ages". Not so much personal, as I'm not worried about all that anymore. Been there, did it. Seems futile. I just seek to stay submitted.. and to pursue His Spirit (the wine) and the loaf/the bread, the Logos - "reasoning expressed in words" - His logos, His reasoning.. What other reasoning do we want? Or need.

Collective, not personal. I'm wondering if this might be why most folks can't understand what some of us are talking about, they're still working on and focused on the personal application.. which it seems to me is what many churches and teachings do, keep us focused, thus struggling still, with the personal. :dontknow: But I have realized my focus when it comes to God's Word and study, is "collective". A collective story and journey, and this is where I'm coming from (as the saying goes). And is why the literal interests me much more than the inner metaphor, and collective prophecy and fulfillment over the inner workings, though of course that too is glorious! "The Spirit at work in us, is the same Spirit which rose Jesus from the dead" (nekros) Romans 8:11.
:friendstu:

[Cardinal]

I finally realized not too long ago, that I always think in the collective.. when I study, etc. My standing with God is not my 'goodness', it is Jesus'. My faith in Him declares me righteous, and I assume - innocent. The verdict is innocent. So I don't worry about it. The person I was before knowing Jesus (and God our Father) I no longer know. I am not perfect. Not at all.. but I don't want to do those things that lead to death.. I do struggle for instance, with impatience under my breath.. cussing, even, in my head.. Or thoughts other than holy thoughts.. that will pop into my head.. like noticing someone's weight or something.. but I apologize to the Lord.. and pretty much forget about it, because John wrote if we repent of it God is faithful to help us - to cleanse us of all unrighteousness, and ultimately imperfection. But He sees us I believe as who HE created us to be. So, even though I will often call myself a dweeb, sometimes in humor, sometimes in all seriousness.. I forget about it just as quickly as the wayward thought or word came drifting in.. or up? It feels like drifts in, but my being imperfect, it finds a brief roosting spot, hopefully only for a second! Repent, call myself a dweeb and go on. (Now you know the real me, lol :laughing7: ) This impersonal attitude frees me to study and consider God's Word as a collective, all of us, story and "administration of the ages". Not so much personal, as I'm not worried about all that anymore. Been there, did it. Seems futile. I just seek to stay submitted.. and to pursue His Spirit (the wine) and the loaf/the bread, the Logos - "reasoning expressed in words" - His logos, His reasoning.. What other reasoning do we want? Or need.

Collective, not personal. I'm wondering if this might be why most folks can't understand what some of us are talking about, they're still working on and focused on the personal application.. which it seems to me is what many churches and teachings do, keep us focused, thus struggling still, with the personal. :dontknow: But I have realized my focus when it comes to God's Word and study, is "collective". A collective story and journey, and this is where I'm coming from (as the saying goes). And is why the literal interests me much more than the inner metaphor, and collective prophecy and fulfillment over the inner workings, though of course that too is glorious! "The Spirit at work in us, is the same Spirit which rose Jesus from the dead" (nekros) Romans 8:11.
:friendstu:

I refer to it as the "macrocosm" view of things. The "microcosm" view is the one applying things to us personally. It takes Him to show you the big picture, for sure. Blessings...

[jugghead]

I was watching a sermon by Peter Heitt and there was one thing he said that really stood out,

"it hurts God when we doubt His love for us"

in which, all I could see was the cross, what men did to the embodiment of Love, but His grace abounds much more in the words "forgive them Father, for they know not what they do"

"doubt", a seed planted by the enemy of which He will destroy, for the works of the devil shall be destroyed, all doubt shall be destroyed and we shall see Him face to face and we shall know the truth and the truth shall set us free

To be free from doubt is to believe the resurrected Word, that Word being Love, the embodiment of the Father. :myahoo:

[rosered]

 :dsunny:  amen bro!!!    :banana:    :HeartThrob: 

[marie glen]

I was watching a sermon by Peter Heitt and there was one thing he said that really stood out,

"it hurts God when we doubt His love for us"

in which, all I could see was the cross, what men did to the embodiment of Love, but His grace abounds much more in the words "forgive them Father, for they know not what they do"

"doubt", a seed planted by the enemy of which He will destroy, for the works of the devil shall be destroyed, all doubt shall be destroyed and we shall see Him face to face and we shall know the truth and the truth shall set us free

To be free from doubt is to believe the resurrected Word, that Word being Love, the embodiment of the Father. :myahoo:

:dsunny:  amen bro!!!    :banana:    :HeartThrob: 

Amen.. Well said Rose!  :iagree: totally! :gsmile: :cloud9:

[jugghead]

As long as the mind can deceive the heart, the heart remains an empty tomb, but when the stone is rolled away, Peace will rise from the dead and walk out giving new life.

[rosered]

As long as the mind can deceive the heart, the heart remains an empty tomb, but when the stone is rolled away, Peace will rise from the dead and walk out giving new life.

Beautifully said  bro J !!!      Amen !   :dsunny: :HeartThrob:  Let go and let God  do His perfect work !!

[jugghead]

This is more than a tidbit, something from the past two weeks.

Ability to Judge

We all have the ability to judge, but how many of us actually sit down and think about what we use this ability for? In its simplest form, we use it to judge what we like and what we dislike. It comes down to the simplest principle: if we like something, we make a judgment for it, but if we do not like something, we make a judgment against it. This principle applies to everything we know, from choosing what we may consider unimportant, like the food we eat, to what we may consider the most important, choosing what we believe. And do we even realize, or even consider, that, just like food, knowledge is something that we consume?

People, through what they hear and read by what others speak and write about, have been given the knowledge of good and evil, the knowledge of right and wrong, the knowledge of what is just and what is unjust, the knowledge of what is righteous and what is unrighteous, and that all our decisions, which is the same as saying, all our judgments; our verdicts, our choices, are always based upon what we like or what we dislike. So, do you consider this to be a truth in your life? A truth in what you believe?

With any knowledge that we have, it always comes down to this simple principle; do we "like" what we hear or read or do we "not like" what we hear or read? And do we fully understand the concept that "we are a judge"? A judge of everything in our lives? Again, a judge who decides from what we "will" eat or what we "will not" eat, to what we "will" believe or what we "will not" believe?

If two different foods are placed in front of you, you have a choice between the two foods. But again, your decision of which food to choose comes down to if you like it or if you dislike it. And if you like both, it will come down to which food you like more, and even to the point of, if you want to eat both, which one are you going to eat first? Going even further to the point of; which one are you going to take your first bite from? Or the decision to even taking a little bit of both in your first bite?

My point is, we all know we are faced with choices every single moment of our lives, and again, every decision we make is based on whether we like it or dislike it. But, is liking and disliking something, the only basis upon which we make our choices? No, it is not.

Have we sat down and thought about the thought process itself? What I mean by this is: do we sit down and actually think about everything that goes into the process of making a choice, the process of making a decision? Because, if you stop and think about it, it is not just the fact that we like or dislike something, it is also based upon whether we will gain something by that decision or if we will lose something by that decision. So, with this said, do we also understand that if we would gain from a decision, we would like it, and if we would lose from a decision, we would dislike it? And do we also understand that if we would gain something we do not like, we would probably make a decision against it? And that if we would lose something that we do not like, we would probably make a decision for it? So, again, it comes down to the principle of liking or disliking.

There are only two ways to interpret the Bible, either "some" will be saved or "all" will be saved. The reason I say this is because there are verses that are translated that tend to point to the salvation of only "some" will be saved and there are verses that are translated that tend to point to "all" will be saved. So, in order for the whole Bible to be correct, all verses have to line up with the idea that only "some" will be saved or all the verses have to line up with the idea that "all" will be saved. Would you agree with this? If so, let me ask this question, which idea do you like? Do you like the idea that only "some" will be saved over the idea that "all" will be saved? Or do you like the idea that "all" will be saved over the idea that only "some" will be saved?

I stated earlier that "we are all judges", that we judge everything we hear and read, and that our own judgments are based on what we like and what we dislike. And do we fully realize that "what we believe" is also based upon what we "like" and what we "dislike"? So, with this being said, which do you like better and why do you like one better than the other? Isn't that why you believe it? Have you actually sat down and thought about the fact that another judgment you have made can change your mind about what you like or dislike?

For example; we may like the idea that "all" will be saved compared to the idea that only "some" will be saved, or we may "dislike" all will be saved compared to only some will be saved. So, when we compare the two ideas, what would determine your decision to like one idea "over" the other? In the Bible, we know that God had a covenant of law and He also had the covenant of grace. So, have we compared these two covenants side by side and made a decision of which one we "like" and which one we "dislike"? What I mean by this is: do we "like" the covenant of the law more because we fully believe the guilty should be punished? Or do you "like" the covenant of grace more because we fully believe the guilty will be forgiven, just like we were?

Now we know that when charges are brought against a person, the charges are always an accusation that the person broke the law, then according to the evidence presented, they are either found guilty or they are found innocent. Here are two pieces of evidence that I would like to present at this time.

"As it is written, there are none righteous, no, not one" (Romans 3:10), taken from Psalm 14:3 and Psalm 53:3
AND
"For all have sinned and come short of the glory of God" (Romans 3:23)

Is this not evidence that "all" have sinned, that "all" are found guilty of breaking the law?

Therefore, let me ask this question, is the judge a righteous judge if he lets "some" off for breaking the law and condemns others if "all" are guilty? Is that justice? Is that "just"? The problem with the justice system in this world is that men have divided the law and have convinced themselves that the breaking of one law is not as bad as the breaking of another law. Now this may be true with the laws of men, but is this true with the law of God?

Is it not written:
"for whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all" (James 2:10).

If James understood that if we break one law of God, we have broken them all, shouldn't we understand it in this way also? And if "all" have offended in one point, "all" are guilty of "all", should that not mean that everyone has broken the whole (every) law according to Scripture? And if everyone is guilty of breaking every law of God, is it "just" to not condemn some while condemning others if everyone is guilty of breaking every law of God? Is that perfect justice? Is that fair? How can we look at the sin of another, knowing that by sinning they have broken every law of God and not look at ourselves and know that we have sinned, thereby also breaking every law of God, and then believe that we will not be condemned by God but another will be?

If God's law is to be carried out to the letter, not one person should be saved from condemnation, in other words, not one person should be saved from death, yet we believe there are. How can we, as Christians, believe that "some" will be saved from death while others are not if everyone is guilty of the same thing; if everyone is guilty of breaking every law of God by just breaking one?

God subjected "all" of mankind to sin and made it impossible for any; "all" of mankind to obey the law perfectly, showing us that "all" have sinned and come short of the glory of God. Paul also writes, "For God hath concluded them all in unbelief, that He might have mercy upon all" (Romans 11:32 KJV). The NASB translates it as; "For God has shut up all in disobedience so that He may show mercy to all". How is it possible for God to show mercy to "some: and not "all" if we have "all" disobeyed God? Is that perfect justice? How is it possible for God to show mercy to "some" and not "all" if "all" have not believed God? Believed what? That it is possible to show mercy to all by forgiving "all" of "all" sin?

Is it not spoken by Jesus and written; "and forgive us our sins, for we also forgive every one that is indebted to us" (Luke 11:4 KJV), have we sinned by not forgiving others of their debt (sin) against us? And then, have we twisted this law and say to ourselves "I do not have to forgive a person that did not sin against me"? But if we are to be like God, and He forgives even one person of their debt, is it "just" to forgive one and not another if "all" have sinned in the same way? Is that perfect justice?

People say, you have to ask for forgiveness in order to be forgiven. So, I have to ask this question, are we capable of doing something that God can't? Meaning, if I am able to forgive someone of their sin against me without them asking for forgiveness, why is it we can believe God can't? All good things come from above, don't they? And if He can give us that ability, shouldn't it stand to reason He has it? And that is because, you cannot give what you don't have. How can we believe He can't forgive us unless we ask for it, despite the fact that we are capable of doing it? Are we capable of doing more than God?

I can go on and on trying to explain what I believe and why I believe it, but if someone is not willing to believe that it is possible "all" can be saved, they will always reject that possibility.

Are you willing to put as much time into studying the Bible in the "all" context as you have in studying it in the "some" context? The answer to that question for most would probably be "no". And that is because, it means they would have to start all over again from scratch, as if they know nothing. But, with that in mind, doesn't Jesus Himself say, "Verily I say unto you, except ye be converted and become as little children, ye shall not enter into the kingdom of heaven." (Matthew 18:3). (Emphasis is mine). Doesn't every child start from scratch, as if they know nothing? You be the judge? For God has given you the ability to judge for yourself.

The thing is, I am not asking you to throw away everything that you believe, I only ask that you set it aside while studying the Bible in the "all will be saved" context. The reason I say this is because, if someone approached you with a verse that is in the context that "all will be saved", you know for a fact that you can quote a verse that is in the context that only "some will be saved". Therefore, what you quoted, you believe to be a correct translation and what they quoted, you believe to be an incorrect translation. So, try putting yourself in their place, believe that what they quoted was a correct translation and what you quoted to be an incorrect translation and see what you come up with. Again, being a righteous judge views both sides of the case as if they are telling the truth.

Do we even realize that if we do not have the ability to judge, the ability to judge good and evil, we can't stop doing evil? The reason for this is, how can we stop doing evil if we don't even know what evil is? Therefore, God caused "all" to eat from the tree through the flesh of Adam, so He could show mercy to "all". And I myself fully believe it was the righteous thing to do. Because if He hadn't, we would never know what evil is, thereby nullifying any ability to stop doing it.

Most people jump to a conclusion that "all" being saved is a lie, can a righteous judge jump to a conclusion without investigating both sides of the case? You be the judge, you were given that ability and that ability came from God as a gift, it was freely given. Don't use it unrighteously without investigation. The easiest thing to do is reject what you don't like, but do we ask ourselves "Why don't I like it?" And the easiest thing to do is reject what we don't understand, but do we ask ourselves, "Why don't I understand it?"

my  :2c:

[rosered]

:HeartThrob:







Isaiah 25:8
He will swallow up death forever. The Lord GOD will wipe away the tears from every face and remove the disgrace of His people from the whole earth. For the LORD has spoken.


It will be said on that day,
    "Behold, this is our God; we have waited for him, that he might save us.
    This is the Lord; we have waited for him;
    let us be glad and rejoice in his salvation."
   

[jugghead]

The highest and purest form of love is the kind that will forgive any and all acts of betrayal against you

That is what I believe the definition of agape is and that our risen Lord is the manifestation of its fullness

He "IS" the personification of its fullness

my  :2c:

[jugghead]

Just like the arteries have to be connected to the heart in order for the blood to flow throughout the body

so do the arteries of compassion have to be connected to a heart of love so that the blood of forgiveness can flow throughout the body of grace

[jugghead]

What we speak of reveals the heart.

"But those things which proceed out of the mouth come forth from the heart; and they defile the man" (Matthew 15:18)

Under what covenant do they speak? It is my opinion that those who believe in hell (as men teach it) have a heart of law, but it is mans way of the law in this world, and it is because of that heart of man's way of the law that they define "justice" as:

salvation (from hell/prison) for those who obey the law
AND
punishment (in hell/prison) for those who disobey the law

Jesus also says: "For where your treasure is, there will your heart be also" (Matthew 6:21)

If we treasure man's way of the law it becomes easy to believe in hell (as men teach it)

When we take man's system of law, punishment and prisons; and then apply it to God, then hell (as men teach it) becomes God's prison system that He created under the same kind of system of law and punishment as man.

But if we have a heart of grace (the new covenant), it is then that we come to understand who God truly is:

That He is all about destroying the evil "IN" a man thereby saving the man from doing evil to others

Their masters of theology is FROM MEN and the context they study the word of God under is:
the context of law and punishment (man's system)
NOT
the context of law and correction (God's system)

repentance is of the mind, for "to repent" means to think differently, think differently about man's system of law and punishment and SEE God's system of law and correction

are we to believe that the words "I will draw all men unto me" is not a law that Christ Himself has to obey, because if He doesn't, then does that not make God the Father a liar if Christ is the exact representation of the Father?

I do not believe that it is possible for God to say He will do something and then not do it

He will draw all men unto Himself to destroy the evil that is "IN" the man, thereby saving the man

correcting what came "INTO" the man through the first Adam

and if we do not believe God can do this after our physical death, then we remain under man's understanding of who God is and not God's Himself

my opinion

[Andrew]

"I will draw all men unto me"

Jugghead could you analyze those words more to make it more meaningful?


like does the "all" actually mean everyone and even if He does "draw" all men does that mean that they accepted his offer or do some get drawn but go there own way?

Thanks

[Cardinal]

"I will draw all men unto me"

Jugghead could you analyze those words more to make it more meaningful?


like does the "all" actually mean everyone and even if He does "draw" all men does that mean that they accepted his offer or do some get drawn but go there own way?

Thanks

Good point. I've shared before that I believe in what I later found out is the Jewish purgatory, because I was taken there by His Spirit. He can and does save all to the uttermost, even from those things that weigh down the soul and keep it bound, it's only for a season of repentance which He illustrated when He went into the heart of the earth and brought men out who were seen of many. His arm is not so short it cannot reach, nor His love so shallow it only applies to this life. That IS good news. Blessings...

[jugghead]

"I will draw all men unto me"

Jugghead could you analyze those words more to make it more meaningful?


like does the "all" actually mean everyone and even if He does "draw" all men does that mean that they accepted his offer or do some get drawn but go there own way?

Thanks

In understanding the physical principle that "a father can have a son", to have the spiritual principle revealed can have a very drastic impact on how we think and how we understand the Bible. If we know that God is the Father and we believe the words of John when he says that "God is Love" (1st John 4:16), would it not stand to reason, that to say "the Father is love" is same as saying "God is love"?

Now let me ask a question, would Love give birth to Forgiveness or unforgiveness? Let's stop for a second and bring in the subjects of law and obedience; is there any reason for forgiveness to even exist if the law is obeyed? And for that matter, is there any reason for unforgiveness to even exist if the law is obeyed? We know for a fact that both forgiveness and unforgiveness exist, but if the law is obeyed, forgiveness and unforgiveness have no purpose for existence. It is here we need to understand that it is only through "the breaking of the law" that a need for the existence of forgiveness and unforgiveness comes into the picture.

The simple reason that this is true is because,

When it comes to forgiveness:
you can only be forgiving when the law is broken because there is nothing to forgive when the law is obeyed

and the same holds true

When it comes to unforgiveness:
you can only be unforgiving when the law is broken because there is nothing to not forgive when the law is obeyed.

We can understand that we can have forgiveness in us and we can also understand that we can have unforgiveness in us, and we can understand that we can have both of these in us at the same time? But now let me ask this question, if we have the capability to have both in us, which do we love more? Do we love forgiveness more than we love unforgiveness or do we love unforgiveness more than forgiveness?



It is here I would like to bring up the subjects of law and grace. We know that in the Bible, God had two covenants, the covenant of law and the covenant of grace and since the covenant of law came first and then came the covenant of grace, we can see and understand a difference between the two of old and new, the old covenant, which is law and then the new covenant, which is grace.

The word "covenant" as defined by a dictionary is: as an agreement, usually formal, between two or more persons to do or not do something specified. Under the agreement of law, what is it that is specified to do or not to do? Is it not obedience, to obey the law? But also, under this agreement we have a choice, we can either be forgiving when the law is broken or we can be unforgiving when the law is broken and as long as we are under this agreement of law, it is not wrong to be unforgiving hide forgiveness for a time, because the hiding of forgiveness is temporary and will be revealed at a later time.

But where the two agreements differ is that under the agreement of grace, the thing that is specified to do or not do has to do with forgiving and not forgiving. If we enter into the agreement of grace, we have agreed to "not be" unforgiving and this is because, if we agree to be a person of grace, we are always to freely give forgiveness, because if we do not freely give forgiveness then we are withholding it. Which, by the withholding of forgiveness, we can place ourselves back under the agreement of law by not giving it.

What I myself believe, when it comes to the two agreements (the two covenants) is what we are tempted to do under each covenant (agreement). Under the agreement of grace, unforgiveness is the temptation of breaking the law of love, whereas, under the agreement of law, the temptation is the breaking of the law itself.

Understanding that our progression forward is to be perfect in love, which I believe means to also be perfect in forgiveness. Because our downward journey (backward progression) can be from always being forgiving to being tempted to withhold forgiveness, then to being tempted to be unforgiving, then to being tempted to go back to the old covenant of the law, to being tempted to condemn those who break the law, to wanting death for those who break the law, because is it not the person of grace that dies through this downward progression?

So, if you have entered into the agreement to forgive as you have been forgiven, to not be led into temptation, why do we constantly break this agreement when this is all said in the Lord's prayer.

Our Father which art in heaven, hallowed be thy name. Thy kingdom come. Thy will be done in earth, as it is in heaven. Give us this day our daily bread. And forgive us our debts, as we forgive our debtors. And lead us not into temptation, but deliver us from evil. For thine is the kingdom, and the power, and the glory, forever. Amen. (Matthew 6:9-13).

Are you willing to repent? Meaning: Are you willing to think differently? If so, then can you see what I see in this prayer?

Love which is in heaven, hallowed be thy name. (The Father's name is Love)
Thy kingdom come. (His kingdom of forgiveness under the covenant of grace)
Thy will be done in earth (His will is the forgiveness of sin/debt in the earth)
As it is in heaven (Love forgives sin/debt in heaven)
Give us this day our daily bread. (His forgiveness of sin/debt))
And forgive us our debts (Which He does daily)
As we forgive our debtors (Giving forgiveness to others)
And lead us not into temptation (To withhold forgiveness)
But deliver us from evil (The breaking of the Law of Love)
For thine is the kingdom (Forgiveness belongs to Him and He freely gives it)
And the power (His power is forgiveness)
And the glory (His glory is forgiveness)
Forever (Forgiveness lasts forever)
Amen. (So be it)

I fully believe that John understood this also, because when he wrote "the word became flesh", it is to be understood that Christ Jesus IS "the forgiveness of God" that dwelt among us in the flesh and men crucified the Son of God, they crucified the Forgiveness of the Father; they crucified who the Father sent.

In the short explanation:
The forgiveness of sin is the good news and it is freely given to cast out the fear of death

the Son (the personification of Forgiveness) will draw all men unto Himself so that the Father (the personification of Love) is revealed in the hearts and minds of men

Forgiveness died because of the law but is raised up again because of grace

my  :2c:

When Forgiveness is exalted (lifted up)

Needed to edit what I believed to be wrong in my explanation, the edit is in blue

[Andrew]

very interesting explanation Jugghead...you definetly gave the verse a deeper look.

nice to hear your thoughts Cardinal

Do you think that "Salvation is from the jews" could it also have a meaning to point to their jewish perguratory idea?

[marie glen]

"I will draw all men unto me"

Jugghead could you analyze those words more to make it more meaningful?


like does the "all" actually mean everyone and even if He does "draw" all men does that mean that they accepted his offer or do some get drawn but go there own way?

Thanks

Amen, the Lord said He will draw "all" to Himself -

The verse, John 12:32 (w/ context) -

- "...31 Now judgment is upon this world; now the prince of this world will be cast out. 32 And I, when I am lifted up from the earth, will draw all men to Myself." 33 He said this to indicate the kind of death He was going to die."

"All" is the word "pas"= "all, every, the whole" — especially, taking into consideration other verses, for example, like - 1 Corinthians 15:22 - "like all die in Adam, all will live in Jesus.." and Ephesians 1:10 and Colossians 1:20 which speak of "all in heaven and earth" - "being gathered into Jesus".

The verse - John 12:32 - https://biblehub.com/interlinear/john/12-32.htm
- word #3956 - https://biblehub.com/greek/3956.htm
:thumbsup: :Peace2: :banana:

p.s. - 2 Peter 2:9 - "...the LORD knows how to preserve the unjust" (the not yet just!) "for CORRECTION/kolazo on day of judgment" (represented by Israel's ancient Day Of Atonement, in between Trumpets and Tabernacles)

The Lord said (John 5:28-29) "ALL in the tombs" (graves) " will hear His voice and come forth" (out of the graves/tombs) "..some in the resurrection of life" (at Jesus' return, Rev.20) "and some in the resurrection of judgment" (which is "after the thousand years"/millennium (Rev.20).

[Cardinal]

very interesting explanation Jugghead...you definetly gave the verse a deeper look.

nice to hear your thoughts Cardinal

Do you think that "Salvation is from the jews" could it also have a meaning to point to their jewish perguratory idea?

:cloud9: Thanks. He has opened my eyes to so much pertaining to this and more since HE started having me be Torah observant, it's almost like I'm reading a new book, which is pretty much what it's like every time He gives you a new revelation, ie. you see it mirrored EVERYWHERE in there like the multifaceted jewel it is. It's pure life to those that find it. Blessings....

[jugghead]

very interesting explanation Jugghead...you definetly gave the verse a deeper look.

nice to hear your thoughts Cardinal

Do you think that "Salvation is from the jews" could it also have a meaning to point to their jewish perguratory idea?

:cloud9: Thanks. He has opened my eyes to so much pertaining to this and more since HE started having me be Torah observant, it's almost like I'm reading a new book, which is pretty much what it's like every time He gives you a new revelation, ie. you see it mirrored EVERYWHERE in there like the multifaceted jewel it is. It's pure life to those that find it. Blessings....

Hi Cardinal, what I put in bold in your response is what happens with me also, as if each revelation is a master key that opens up everything in new light.

For me, if it wasn't for that, the written word would get very boring, and I also believe it can be compared to salt, you can't see the flavor in it but you know for a fact that its there because you can taste it

and I still remember the very first time I tasted it, it was with this verse in the NASB:

For ground that drinks the rain which often falls on it and brings forth vegetation useful to those for whose sake it is also tilled, receives a blessing from God; (Hebrews 6:7)