Welcome to 1984

[jabcat]

Card's friend said "we need you".

I said, "to do...what?"

And started this list;

1. trust God
2. pray
3. love each other
4. inform each other
5. get ammo (White Wings)
6. call your congressperson (Molly)
7. run for office (Molly)

is this a good list?  is there more?

I may split this off, unless the main players involved in this thread are OK with it being here.  It was related to Card's post...

[jabcat]

Is that a little harsh for someone who's truly interested and concerned?

IMO, sometimes just "doing something" can be worse than doing nothing - especially if we aren't clear or in good consciense about what we're doing.  That's why I'm asking for specific ideas folks have.  

Only you and God know what your strengths are.  We are each given a talent.  We each know what we can do.  So, multiply it by ten and do it.

Now is the time for all good men to come to the aid of their country.  [typing test].

But, you're going to have to leave your comfort zone and follow Christ out of the boat.

Again, serious question - not mocking.  But I do want to respond to this;  First of all, I guess being comfortable is a relative term.  Secondly, that's what I'm after here - what would "following Christ out of the boat" look like?  Walking a picket line in Washington waving a sign?  Hunkering behind my window with a gun?  Calling someone 100 times a day to complain and demand?  Or something else...

[jabcat]

I think I need to continue looking to God for what I should do specifically.  He'll lead...I just thought there may be some specific ideas, and I said, insight/revelations into Romans 13:1 and the "live quiet peaceable lives" passage.  Sorry for any contentiousness.

[Beloved Servant]

Luke 20:

20 And scrutinizing Him, they dispatch eavesdroppers, feigning themselves to be just, that they may get hold of a word of His, so as to give Him up to the sovereignty and the jurisdiction of the governor.

21 And they inquire of Him, saying,
"Teacher, we are aware that you are saying and teaching correctly, and are not taking the surface view, but of a truth the way of God you are teaching.

22 Is it allowed us to give a tax to Caesar, or not?"

23 Now, considering their craftiness, He said to them,

"Why are you trying Me? 24 Show Me a denarius."

Now they show Him one, and He said,

"Whose image and inscription has it?"

Now answering, they say, "Caesar's."

25 Now He said to them,

"Now then, be paying Caesar's to Caesar, and God's to God."

26 And they are not strong enough to get hold of a declaration of His in front of the people.

And, marveling at His answer, they hush.  (CLV)

[Beloved Servant]

Matthew 11

28 Hither to Me, all who are toiling and laden, and I will be giving you rest.
29 Lift My yoke upon you and be learning from Me, for meek am I and humble in heart, and you shall be finding rest in your souls,
30 for My yoke is kindly and My load is light."

[Molly]

Walking a picket line in Washington waving a sign?  Hunkering behind my window with a gun?  Calling someone 100 times a day to complain and demand?  Or something else...

No one here has suggested doing any of the above.  Why do you think of all action as 'extreme'?  Because clearly, the above is what you heard.

what would "following Christ out of the boat" look like? 

Moses.  Joshua.  Caleb. Jesus.  Apostle Paul. 

[Beloved Servant]

www.youtube.com/watch?v=sVH1zmvigN8

[Molly]

Last town hall meeting I went to had a bunch of World War II and Korean war veterans.

Old guys, they had fought for their country when they were young, and they were still fighting for it by showing up when they perceived they were needed and speaking the truth.

Just show up and speak the truth.  How hard is that?

You are the authority.

[Cardinal]

 :cloud9: For my response Jab, I know what you mean.....prayer has to be first on the list.

I've personally emailed or called every one in congress and the senate, and I've emailed the White House. Out of all of it, I got one reply, from my own congressman, and it was basically a form letter of, "this is what I've been doing on your behalf". None of it addressed what I said, of course.

I joined Change.org to cast my vote on issues. I don't particularly like all they support, they're too liberal, but at least they're speaking up and get people to sign petitions on issues I DO agree with, and those I "sign" on.

In that one video I posted, someone recounted how Clinton said he couldn't do anything because there was a government inside the government. This is why nothing changes really, because all we do is "elect" another one of their bought and paid for, puppets. How do you vote out people you can't even "see"? Back to step one, prayer....  :crywipe:

[jabcat]

Thank you for the direct answer, Card.  

So you've contacted some people, and of course, prayed.  Sounds good.

No one here has suggested doing any of the above.  Why do you think of all action as 'extreme'?  Because clearly, the above is what you heard.

I didn't say anyone had suggested those things specifically, nor did I say that's what I've heard in this discussion.  They are examples/possibilities, an apparently poor effort to attempt to generate discussion/ask people for specifics.  A few have been given.  Maybe that's all folks have or want to offer.  :dontknow:

However, someone may still have some more specific thoughts on how a child of God who's seeking the Father's will, reconciles with the aforementioned scriptures and with the gentleman in Card's letter's request for help.  That was my original question, along with what do people think a Christian should actually do?

I asked my question sincerely...

[CHB]

It's all in His hands. I think there is a purpose for every thing that is happening here. If God wants us to do something he will see to it that we do it. Nothing more, nothing less. We do not have the power to change history or anything else for that matter, only God has this power. Someday we will be able to see the purpose for this disaster and all the other disasters that have occured. We are just actors in a play.

Just my  :2c:

CHB

[jabcat]

That's an interesting perspective, C.  Thanks.

Sometimes I vascillate between 1) praying, 2) trusting God, and 3) doing.  Seems like you may be saying 1 and 2 will lead to 3 when and if God brings it specifically about (empowers and moves us) - otherwise, prayerfully trusting Him is a good place to be, because He is the One working all to His good pleasure.  He's in control, it's all for a purpose.  Is that close?

[WhiteWings]

But I would defend this country (from without, so what about from within?)

Doesn't the OT give examples of taking care of things "from within"?
When the Isrealites were captive in Egypt where they Egyptians? Did they have the right to go against Farao's wishes?
If they were Egyptians (I'm sure the Farao saw them a Egyptian property) then you have your answer of rebeling against leadership.
If they where not Egyptians it's a bit more different. But basicly your leaders are not your leaders if they are not elected. Or don't do what they are not elected for.

A major problem is lack of unity between the states. Imigrants in Arizona? Who cares, I live in Nebraska.

[WhiteWings]

What would you personally do if "they came to take you away"? 

That's such an odd thing to say.  Why would you even let it get to that point?

That's not the question you should ask Molly. A better question is: What are we going to do now they are taking people away.

If you study history, you will see that these things don't happen overnight.  You should train yourself to see that move coming ten steps before it happens--and stop it in its tracks.

Unless you are speaking of very tiny steps you are to late Molly. We got a global infection? What does the USA need info on my bankaccounts and my fingerprints to nam ejust two things.

Evil reigns when good men do nothing.  If you really think we are going in that direction, it's time to run for office.

The US system is designed in such a way that only dishonest people can make it to the top. Say you run for president Molly. Are you prepared to spend 30+ miljon on your campaign? Or do you hope BP helps you with the needed cash? Even when you have the cash then the media can kill your chances by ignoring you or starting a hate campaign against you.

[WhiteWings]

See, that's the thing.  This thread is almost 30 pages long, with IMO, lots of good information.

But Cardinal's letter she posted included a specific plea..."we need you"...so to me, the obvious question is, "so church, what do we do?  What's "within the bounds of 'holy'/acceptable behavior"?

Personally, I've been thinking through that for some time, and I guess I really shouldn't expect anyone to have the answer for me.

I understand you want to do it scriptually. Then the first thing you should do is figure out what scripture says on the subject. I think it would be a good new topic.
In this topic it will get swamped by all kind of news clippings I think.

[WhiteWings]

I have an answer.  Stop thinking and do something.

But what. Every action isn't a good action. Suppose Jabcat's idea is to throw a stone through the Whitehouse windows. He will be in jail to the end of times without having done anything good for the country. A strone through the window only works if 5000 people do so as a group.

Just look at Alex Jones. A real loudmouth. Sells videos, t-shirts etc. Has a radio show. Is bugging 'them' constantly. And what is the effect of say his 9/11 info?
50% still believes Osama is behind all of it. 50% believes it was an inside job. What does the last 50% do with that info? Do nothing. Or post a video on YouTube.
9/11 was almost 9 years ago. It's for at least 7 years widely know by many something isn't right. What did change in those 5 years beside you have some of your liberties takes away?

[jabcat]

See, that's the thing.  This thread is almost 30 pages long, with IMO, lots of good information.

But Cardinal's letter she posted included a specific plea..."we need you"...so to me, the obvious question is, "so church, what do we do?  What's "within the bounds of 'holy'/acceptable behavior"?

Personally, I've been thinking through that for some time, and I guess I really shouldn't expect anyone to have the answer for me.

I understand you want to do it scriptually. Then the first thing you should do is figure out what scripture says on the subject. I think it would be a good new topic.
In this topic it will get swamped by all kind of news clippings I think.

Good idea.  I may do that.  :thumbsup:

[WhiteWings]

Maybe that's all folks have or want to offer.  :dontknow:

Maybe looking at history gives the answer. Are there examples of a corrupt regime being removed without force?

[jabcat]

Maybe that's all folks have or want to offer.  :dontknow:

Maybe looking at history gives the answer. Are there examples of a corrupt regime being removed without force?

I've split this off into a new thread, "What Does A UR [or any true] Believer's Political Activism Look Like?"   http://www.tentmaker.org/forum/index.php?topic=8409.msg100278;topicseen#msg100278

[WhiteWings]

Lockerbie Resurfaces: Police Evidence Points to CIA Involvement and Fake Evidence. Megavi is innocent
http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php?context=viewArticle&code=20100723&articleId=20243

[Molly]

That's not the question you should ask Molly. A better question is: What are we going to do now they are taking people away.

:Sparkletooth:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L91qImuizYY

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-cNwktuzrHY&feature=related

[Beloved Servant]

Maybe that's all folks have or want to offer.  :dontknow:

Maybe looking at history gives the answer. Are there examples of a corrupt regime being removed without force?

Our very lives attest to it!


Colossians 1:    (Weymouth)

21 And you, estranged as you once were and even hostile in your minds, amidst your evil deeds, 22 He has now, in His human body, reconciled to God by His death, to bring you, holy and faultless and irreproachable, into His presence; 23 if, indeed, you are still firmly holding to faith as your foundation, without ever shifting from your hope that rests on the Good News that you have heard, which has been proclaimed in the whole creation under Heaven, and in which I Paul have been appointed to serve.

Our very loves can attest to that!

[Cardinal]

 :cloud9: Check it out....founder of John Birch society speech in 1958 about plans to overthrow the USA.....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AZU0c8DAIU4

[jabcat]

The effort to World Government today is just as contrary to the will and word of God as was Babel of old. And the whole world, including the people of God, must yet again, one more time, come face to face with the word of the Lord: "They shall mingle themselves with the seed of men: but they shall not cleave one to another, even as iron is not mixed with clay."

The present nations of the earth, and most of the christians of the world today, will be surprised... shocked... when God steps in again and derails the well laid and proud and boastful plans of the great men of the earth - and brings forth a company of unknown and unrecognized Sons of God - who shall become the instrument of God to establish in the earth HIS OWN WORLD GOVERNMENT.

"But the saints of the most High shall take the kingdom, and possess the kingdom for ever, even forever and ever... the Ancient of days came, and judgement was given to the SAINTS of the most High; and the time came that the saints possessed the kingdom... and the kingdom and dominion, and the greatness of the kingdom under the whole heaven shall be given to the people of the saints of the most High, whose kingdom is an everlasting kingdom, AND ALL DOMINIONS SHALL SERVE AND OBEY HIM" (Dan. 7:18, 22, 27). Hallelujah!

by J. PRESTON EBY

[Molly]

wow!  :Sparkletooth:
[I see you got your answer, Jab]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=usfiAsWR4qU