How prophecy was sealed

[Doug]

Daniel's prophecy of the 70 weeks was intended to seal up prophecy, so it would not be understood by most of the world, but only by those who Daniel refers to as the "wise." The sealing up of Daniel's prophecies is mentioned in Daniel 12:4, "But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book, even to the time of the end: many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased."

To "seal up the vision and prophecy" was one of the things the 70 weeks in Daniel 9 were to accomplish.

Daniel 9:24
Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy.

Daniel was told that the prophecies he was given were not to be understood till the end of the age, at which time the wise would understand, but none of the wicked.

Daniel 12:8-10
8 And I heard, but I understood not: then said I, O my Lord, what shall be the end of these things?
9 And he said, Go thy way, Daniel: for the words are closed up and sealed till the time of the end.
10 Many shall be purified, and made white, and tried; but the wicked shall do wickedly: and none of the wicked shall understand; but the wise shall understand.

How does the 70 weeks prophecy seal up other prophecies? One of the most common mistakes people make when interpreting this prophecy is to assume that the three sections of the prophecy all have the same units. The prophecy consists of three parts, which are groups of "sevens." These sevens are usually called "weeks." The prophecy does not say what kind of sevens they are, and no time units are mentioned at all.

Dispensationalists insist that all the 70 "sevens" or weeks are years, so that the prophecy consists of 490 years, and then they insert a gap of thousands of years between the 69th and the 70th week, to make the 70th week future. This style of interpretation, while it is followed by many, is seriously flawed. I suggest those who follow the doctrine of the dispensationalists have been deceived, and dispensationalism has helped fulfil Daniel's prophecy that "none of the wicked shall understand."

If the units in the three sections of the prophecy can differ, what might they be? The first two sections span the time from the decree to rebuild Jerusalem to the appearance of the Messiah. This decree was given by Cyrus in the first year of his reign, the year 538 BC. In fact, the prophet Isaiah said the Cyrus would be the one to issue the decree.

Isaiah 44:23-28
23 Sing, O ye heavens; for the LORD hath done it: shout, ye lower parts of the earth: break forth into singing, ye mountains, O forest, and every tree therein: for the LORD hath redeemed Jacob, and glorified himself in Israel.
24 Thus saith the LORD, thy redeemer, and he that formed thee from the womb, I am the LORD that maketh all things; that stretcheth forth the heavens alone; that spreadeth abroad the earth by myself;
25 That frustrateth the tokens of the liars, and maketh diviners mad; that turneth wise men backward, and maketh their knowledge foolish;
26 That confirmeth the word of his servant, and performeth the counsel of his messengers; that saith to Jerusalem, Thou shalt be inhabited; and to the cities of Judah, Ye shall be built, and I will raise up the decayed places thereof:
27 That saith to the deep, Be dry, and I will dry up thy rivers:
28 That saith of Cyrus, He is my shepherd, and shall perform all my pleasure: even saying to Jerusalem, Thou shalt be built; and to the temple, Thy foundation shall be laid.

The statement in the last verse quoted above shows that Cyrus, the Persian king who captured Babylon, would give the word or the decree to build Jerusalem, and the temple. This points to a date of 538 BC for the beginning of the 70 weeks prophecy. But using that start date, and taking the units in the first two sections as ordinary years, does not work out; it points to a date of about 48 BC for the coming of the Messiah, and no Messiah appeared at that time.

If the units in the first seven weeks are taken to be leap years, having an extra month, which occurred every second or third year in the Hebrew and Babylonian calendars, the first section, of 49 leap years, would span 133 years. Taking the units in the second section to be regular years, the second section is 62x7, or 434 years. Thus the first two sections together span 567 years, which fits the time from the decree of Cyrus to the coming of Christ in 28 AD precisely. This amazing fact was hidden from the Bible scholars, and the "wise" of the world, and it demonstrates how Daniel's 70 weeks prophecy has sealed up prophecy, as while the 70 weeks prophecy is one of the most studied and best known of all the prophecies in the Bible, and has been studied carefully for thousands of years, it was not fully understood. As Daniel foretold, "the wicked shall do wickedly: and none of the wicked shall understand; but the wise shall understand."

The 70th week has also been misunderstood by many, and especially by dispensationalists. This last week is the time in which Christ confirms his covenant with his saints, which of course is the New Covenant or the gospel. The 70th week is not a literal seven years, but it corresponds to "seven times," and for its interpretation, we may consider the four periods of "seven times" mentioned in Leviticus 26. These are referred to as the "curse" in Daniel 9:11, where Daniel says in his prayer of confession that the curse of the law of Moses had been poured out upon Israel. This must refer to the first of the four periods of seven times, which was poured out on the Jews during their captivity in Babylon. The three sections in the prophecy of the 70 weeks correspond to the other three periods of "seven times" in Leviticus 26. In the last of these, God would remember his covenant with Abraham, and become reconciled to Israel.

The 70th week corresponds to the last of the four periods of "seven times" in Leviticus 26. In both of these periods, God's covenant with Abraham is confirmed, which is what Christ came to accomplish.

The 70th week is when Christ "confirms the covenant with many." Paul identified God's covenant with Abraham as the gospel in Galatians 3:8; Christ's "week" of confirming the covenant began when he was baptized by John the Baptist. God's promise to remember his covenant with Abraham was mentioned in a prophecy given by John's father Zacharias.

Luke 1:67-75
67 And his father Zacharias was filled with the Holy Ghost, and prophesied, saying,
68 Blessed be the Lord God of Israel; for he hath visited and redeemed his people,
69 And hath raised up an horn of salvation for us in the house of his servant David;
70 As he spake by the mouth of his holy prophets, which have been since the world began:
71 That we should be saved from our enemies, and from the hand of all that hate us;
72 To perform the mercy promised to our fathers, and to remember his holy covenant;
73 The oath which he sware to our father Abraham,
74 That he would grant unto us, that we being delivered out of the hand of our enemies might serve him without fear,
75 In holiness and righteousness before him, all the days of our life.

One thing to notice is that there can be no gap in the 70 weeks, such as the one proposed by dispensationalists, as the four periods of "seven times" correspond to the duration of the curse in Leviticus, and in Daniel, to the duration of the desolation of Jerusalem. A gap would imply a lapse in the curse, and that God was temporarily reconciled to his people. But that has not happened; any reconciliation between God and his people must be permanent.

Daniel 9:27 shows that the abolition of sacrifices and oblations was to occur "in the midst of the week." It occurred as a result of the destruction of the temple in 70 AD. But the last half-week continues, as Christ still confirms his covenant with us. The final half of the 70th week is the "time, times, and a half," and is symbolic, and includes the entire time of the church, in which the gospel goes to the world.  It is the duration of the age in which we are now.

Other prophecies in the Bible refer to the "time, times, and a half," in various ways. It is mentioned in Revelation 12:14, where the woman, who represents the church, flees to the wilderness for that period of time. It is referred to in the same chapter as 1,260 days, and also in Revelation 11:3. And the references to 42 months in Revelation 11:2, and 13:5, are to the same prophetic time period. These are some of the ways that Daniel's prophecy of the 70 weeks seals other prophecies of the Bible. Understanding the 70 weeks prophecy opens up several other prophecies that have been previously obscure.

Doug

[Nathan]

I know this is a couple months old, but I'd like to throw a few things out on it anyway.  For me, it's kind of like the other thread that questioned whether or not things literally happened as Old Testament passages depict.  And this really is the same pattern as that in that it "was" meant to be understood literally to those to whom it was literally written to. 

There was a definite beginning to this 490 years as explained in Daniel.

Daniel 9:25
25Know therefore and understand, that from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem unto the Messiah the Prince shall be seven weeks, and threescore and two weeks: the street shall be built again, and the wall, even in troublous times.

It began by the decree of a natural king who held them in captivity at the time.  God used a natural man to release a spiritual plan upon a natural nation.  7 weeks added to threescore and two is 69 weeks.  This really is uncanny when you do take the time to really and ACCURATELY get into the literal understanding of what was actually going on.  But the 69 weeks was actually the preparation for what Jesus was about to do on the 70th week.

And using the week = year principle, you can actually follow the timeline from the day king Cyrus actually issued the decree.  That's what moved Daniel to pray, he was reading the prophecy of Jerimiah regarding this and what Danile recorded was the response to the prayer.  This is why the books of Ezra and Nehemiah are so important.  They are documenting the rebuilding of both the temple and the city.  From the decree given, this timetable of the 70 weeks began.

Ezra 5
13'However, (A)in the first year of Cyrus king of Babylon, King Cyrus (B)issued a decree to rebuild this house of God.

If there is a beginning, there is also an ending.

Daniel 9
26"Then after the sixty-two weeks the Messiah will be (AZ)cut off and have nothing, and the people of the prince who is to come will (BA)destroy the city and the sanctuary And its end will come with a (BB)flood; even to the end there will be war; desolations are determined.

27"And he will make a firm covenant with the many for one week, but in the middle of the week he will put a stop to sacrifice and grain offering; and on the wing of (BC)abominations will come one who makes desolate, even until a (BD)complete destruction, one that is decreed, is poured out on the one who makes desolate

When Jesus came on the scene, Israel was not it's own nation.  They were governed by Rome.  That all actually began at the end of the 62 weeks which is 434 years after the original decree was given. (62 x 7 = 434) From then until Jesus it would be another
49 years (the remaining 7 of the 69 years, 7 x7 = 49)

Then Jesus ministry begins.  Not his birth, but his ministry.  Do you know what the year of Jubilee is?  It's the year following the 49th Sabbath year.  I'm beginning to feel like Cardinal here just a little bit. Okay, at the beginning of the 70th week, the last set of 7's a firm covenant was made to many for one week which is what Jesus' ministry did.

"But wait . . .Jesus ministry didn't last seven years . . ."  And that's absolutely right, but it's also exactly what the prophecy says.  27"And he will make a firm covenant with the many for one week, but in the middle of the week he will put a stop to sacrifice and grain offering.  Jesus ministry went for 3 1/2 years before he was murdered.  But it was also when the sacrifices ended.  Thus the tearing of the veil. 

So there are still 3 1/2 years left that are unaccounted for.

Nuts . . .I'm at work and my break is over . . .I'll finish this in a bit.

[Nathan]

To finish the thought of where I left off . . .3 1/2 days of the 70th week are still unaccounted for.  The crucifixion was the event that interrupted the last week.  In the 70th week, the firm covenant was the New Covenant Jesus brought upon his shoulders.  His message was originally to who?  That's the same thing the 70 weeks were set aside for.  The ministry of Jesus originally came to the Jews. 

Daniel 9
24 "Seventy 'sevens'  are decreed for your people and your holy city to finish transgression, to put an end to sin, to atone for wickedness, to bring in everlasting righteousness, to seal up vision and prophecy and to anoint the most holy.

This is what Jesus was declaring from the cross when he said "It is finished".  He finished the transgression.  He put an end to sin.  He atoned for our wickedness and he brought in everlasting righteousness.  And for me, the sealing up was not closing away, but fulfilling "in" him.  I like the way the Message translation puts this verse.

24 "'Seventy sevens are set for your people and for your holy city to throttle rebellion, stop sin, wipe out crime, set things right forever, confirm what the prophet saw, and anoint The Holy of Holies

Jeremiah could very well be simply saying when the Messiah comes, he will fulfill what he, the prophet, Jeremiah was seeing and saying.  Either way, Jesus did all of that in the middle of the last week.  But even though he stopped the sacrifices and he died, there were still 3 1/2 years where there was still a time-line unfolding for the Jews alone . . primarily. 

It's even recorded as to when this changed.  it began when Peter fell asleep with an appetite and saw the sheet come down to him.  Up to that point remember it wasn't even lawful for a Jew to congregate with a Gentile.  But yet, Peter experienced the change.  He saw with his own eyes the spirit poured out upon the Gentiles.  There was  a shifting already taking place.  The act that sealed it and ended the 70 week prophecy came with the murdering of the "1st" martyr. 

The last thing Stephen said before he gave up his spirit was that he saw Jesus . .not seated, but standing.  Positioning is everything.  I believe the reason why he saw Jesus standing at the right hand of God and not seated at the right hand of God is because this event was the culmination of 490 years of promise.  Later in Scripture we find Christ is once again seated at the right hand with the Father.

But for me, the 70 weeks definitely does have a literal application and Jesus fulfilled it literally to the letter.  And no, there was no break of 2000 years or any break of any kind.

[Doug]

27"And he will make a firm covenant with the many for one week, but in the middle of the week he will put a stop to sacrifice and grain offering; and on the wing of (BC)abominations will come one who makes desolate, even until a (BD)complete destruction, one that is decreed, is poured out on the one who makes desolate

When Jesus came on the scene, Israel was not it's own nation.  They were governed by Rome.  That all actually began at the end of the 62 weeks which is 434 years after the original decree was given. (62 x 7 = 434) From then until Jesus it would be another
49 years (the remaining 7 of the 69 years, 7 x7 = 49)

Then Jesus ministry begins.  Not his birth, but his ministry.  Do you know what the year of Jubilee is?  It's the year following the 49th Sabbath year.  I'm beginning to feel like Cardinal here just a little bit. Okay, at the beginning of the 70th week, the last set of 7's a firm covenant was made to many for one week which is what Jesus' ministry did.

"But wait . . .Jesus ministry didn't last seven years . . ."  And that's absolutely right, but it's also exactly what the prophecy says.  27"And he will make a firm covenant with the many for one week, but in the middle of the week he will put a stop to sacrifice and grain offering.  Jesus ministry went for 3 1/2 years before he was murdered.  But it was also when the sacrifices ended.  Thus the tearing of the veil. 

So there are still 3 1/2 years left that are unaccounted for.

Hmm.. The sacrifices and oblations ceased when the temple was destroyed, which was 70 AD. So, that event must have occurred "in the midst of the week." The 70th "week" continues today. It corresponds to the last of the four periods of "seven times" in Leviticus 26, in which God is reconciled to Israel. The last half-week, called "a time, times, and a half," spans the entire period since the crucifixion. It is also the age in which the "little horn" of Daniel 7 dominates the saints. [Daniel 7:25] Its "eyes like the eyes of a man" suggest it represents a "human point-of-view."

Your approach, that the last half-week is a literal three and a half years, implies the 70 weeks prophecy was fulfilled, without any of the apostles of the Lord being aware of it. But, how likely is that, considering that they had the Spirit, wrote scripture, and some among them had the gift of prophecy, etc?

Doug

[Nathan]

This is partly why it's difficult to emphasize the natural implications only.  There's a lot left to the "unknown".  Who's to say the disciples "didn't" know it was the fulfillment of the 70 weeks?  But at the same time, it's simply another event that literally took place that the most one can do with it is observe and imagine.  If my observation is accurate, now what?  If my observation is not accurate . .same question. 

This kinda falls back on the other thread where the question was raised about the benefit of debates.  If all they are is disputing points of view then I'm not accomplishing much.  But if debating the natural things lead us into seeing the spiritual principles then we've accomplished much.  So what would be the implications of the 70 weeks spiritually?

As I was laying out what I saw, what struck me the most was that the 70th week was the year of Jubilee.  That is where the quickening was in that it led to the very thing Christ proclaimed the moment he left the wilderness in power, he went to the temple and gave notice to the religious system that change was coming.  All debts were about to be paid in full.  The year of Jubilee had arrived and it wasn't just about a span of time, but it was about the nature of God manifesting redemption to man.

7 as even traditional mainline churches understand, is the number of completion and fulfillment.  10 is the number of law.  This event transpiring had much deeper qualities to it than meet the eye.  The fulfillment of law had come.  Again, Jesus proclaimed that as well.  He didn't come to do away with the law, but to fulfill it. 

I guess the reason why I choose to believe to see it as I explained it is because as I saw it coming together, nothing was left out of place.  There really "is" a change of emphasis in Acts where the targeted group of people went from Jew to Gentile and at the introductory of the 70 week thing in Daniel, it specifically stated that it was established to focus on Jews only . . .which is just what Jesus ministry did.  But then when the emphasis went to Gentile . . .it could only mean one thing, the time set aside for Jews only had come to an end.

[Nathan]

The other literal issue to this is . . .how did the priests continue to carry out their sacrificial duties if the veil, the most sacred artical that separated God's glory from the labors of the church . . .was now opened for all the world to see??  And is there any "proof" that they actually "did" continue in their sacrifices?

I'm just curious really.  Not looking to prove or disprove.  I just always assumed they carried on with their sacrifices .  . . but to my knowledge, Scripture never really mentions that they did.

[Doug]

This is partly why it's difficult to emphasize the natural implications only.  There's a lot left to the "unknown".  Who's to say the disciples "didn't" know it was the fulfillment of the 70 weeks?  But at the same time, it's simply another event that literally took place that the most one can do with it is observe and imagine.  If my observation is accurate, now what?  If my observation is not accurate . .same question. 

How can a "week" be a "year"? That makes no sense!

There is some evidence the ministry of John the Baptist began in a sabbatical year of the 7 year cycle. This was supported in an article by Ben Zion Wacholder, Professor of Talmud and Rabbinics at Hebrew Union College, Cincinnati, Ohio.

It would fit the idea of the 62 weeks being 7-year sabbatical cycles.

The first section of 7 weeks, IMO, are best understood as 49 leap years, with an extra month. 49 of them span 133 years. With this approach, the 70 weeks begin with the decree of Cyrus, 538 BC, and the first two sections end in 27-28 AD, the period when John the Baptist was preaching in the wilderness.

See my "70 Weeks Calculator," where you can try various start dates for calculating the 70 weeks.
   
http://vinyl2.sentex.ca/~tcc/OP/calc70a.html

This kinda falls back on the other thread where the question was raised about the benefit of debates.  If all they are is disputing points of view then I'm not accomplishing much.  But if debating the natural things lead us into seeing the spiritual principles then we've accomplished much.  So what would be the implications of the 70 weeks spiritually?

Perhaps it is as Daniel said, they "sealed up" prophecy so it would not be understood till the end time.

Doug

[Beth]

I really enjoyed what you shared Nathan... I had never heard that before and I thought you brought up some interesting points regarding Stephen.

How can a "week" be a "year"? That makes no sense!

I think Nathan's calculations were a day for a year - 70 weeks = 490 years is a day for a year.

Eze 4:6   And when thou hast accomplished them, lie again on thy right side, and thou shalt bear the iniquity of the house of Judah forty days: I have appointed thee each day for a year. 

[Nathan]

Prophetic language seldom means what it literally says.  It's intended to be spiritually applied before it can be naturally observed.

[Beth]

Yes I agree.  I was merely pointing out why we can apply the "day" for a "year" in prophetic interpretation.

[WhiteWings]

The 69 th week is exactly at His baptism
:2c:

[micah7:9]

Prophetic language seldom means what it literally says.  It's intended to be spiritually applied before it can be naturally observed.

Good! :bigGrin: :thumbsup:

[Doug]

The 69 th week is exactly at His baptism
:2c:

That's reasonable, and it would fit the statements of Jesus about "the acceptable year of the Lord," being in that year.

At the synagogue in Nazareth, where he had been brought up, Jesus read from the book of Isaiah a prophecy that refers to "the acceptable year of the Lord," which Jesus said was fulfilled on that very day.

Luke 4:17-22
And there was delivered unto him the book of the prophet Esaias. And when he had opened the book, he found the place where it was written,
The Spirit of the Lord is upon me, because he hath anointed me to preach the gospel to the poor; he hath sent me to heal the brokenhearted, to preach deliverance to the captives, and recovering of sight to the blind, to set at liberty them that are bruised,
To preach the acceptable year of the Lord.

What was special about that particular year? The "acceptable year of the Lord" was the year that Jesus began his ministry. It has to do with the beginning of the last of the four periods of seven times in Leviticus 26, when God would be reconciled to Israel.

Luke 4:20-21
And he closed the book, and he gave it again to the minister, and sat down. And the eyes of all them that were in the synagogue were fastened on him.
And he began to say unto them, This day is this scripture fulfilled in your ears.

The occasion was during the first year of his ministry, soon after his baptism by John. It was after the first two sections of the prophecy of Daniel about the 70 weeks had been fulfilled.

In his prayer of confession, Daniel referred to the covenant.

Daniel 9:4
And I prayed unto the LORD my God, and made my confession, and said, O Lord, the great and dreadful God, keeping the covenant and mercy to them that love him, and to them that keep his commandments;

At the end of the first two sections of seven weeks and sixty-two weeks, the Messiah would appear.

Daniel 9:25
Know therefore and understand, that from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem unto the Messiah the Prince shall be seven weeks, and threescore and two weeks:

During the 70th week, Daniel said, Christ would "confirm the covenant with many for one week." [vs. 27]

The word "covenant" refers to all the revelations and promises of God. Examples are:

    * the "everlasting covenant" which is represented by a rainbow;  [Genesis 9:16]
    * God's covenant with Abraham represented by circumcision, [Genesis 17:4-10] which was to be established with Isaac; [Genesis 17:18-19]
    * the Sabbath; [Exodus 31:16]
    * the Mosaic legislation; [Jeremiah 34:13-14]
    * the "sure mercies of David;" [Isaiah 55:3]
    * the regular succession of day and night; [Jeremiah 33:20-22]
    * etc.

The covenant includes the promises; the promise of the land, which Abraham did not receive in his lifetime, was the basis for his confidence in a resurrection. Paul said the covenant had been confirmed to Abraham. [Galatians 3:17] He used this as the basis of his argument about the role of the law which was given centuries later.

All the promises of God are included in the covenant that Christ confirms with the saints in the 70th week; and it includes his righteous life, that was offered up as a sacrifice to take away the sin of the world.

Daniel said:

Daniel 9:27
And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease,...

The "midst of the week" includes the death of Jesus on the cross, and the end of the sacrificial system, when the city and temple were destroyed.

Jesus was baptized during the ministry of John the Baptist. The date for the beginning of John's ministry was given by Luke.

Luke 3:1-3
Now in the fifteenth year of the reign of Tiberius Caesar, Pontius Pilate being governor of Judaea, and Herod being tetrarch of Galilee, and his brother Philip tetrarch of Ituraea and of the region of Trachonitis, and Lysanias the tetrarch of Abilene,
Annas and Caiaphas being the high priests, the word of God came unto John the son of Zacharias in the wilderness.
And he came into all the country about Jordan, preaching the baptism of repentance for the remission of sins;

The first year of Tiberius was 14 AD. So we have:

1st year of Tiberius 14 AD
2nd year of Tiberius 15 AD
3rd year of Tiberius 16 AD
4th year of Tiberius 17 AD
5th year of Tiberius 18 AD
6th year of Tiberius 19 AD
7th year of Tiberius 20 AD
8th year of Tiberius 21 AD
9th year of Tiberius 22 AD
10th year of Tiberius 23 AD
11th year of Tiberius 24 AD
12th year of Tiberius 25 AD
13th year of Tiberius 26 AD
14th year of Tiberius 27 AD
15th year of Tiberius 28 AD

The year 28 AD was the start of the 70th week of Daniel's prophecy. It also began a new sabbatical cycle. It was when Jesus read from Isaiah's prophecy in the synagogue at Nazareth on a sabbath day. Jesus said:

Luke 16:16
The law and the prophets were until John: since that time the kingdom of God is preached, and every man presseth into it.

The year 28 AD marked the beginning of a new era, the seven times of the reconciliation of God with his people, when God remembers his covenant with Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob.

    Leviticus 26:42
    Then will I remember my covenant with Jacob, and also my covenant with Isaac, and also my covenant with Abraham will I remember; and I will remember the land.

The 70th week is the week when Jesus confirms the covenant. It began in 28 AD.

Beginning with the decree of Cyrus, the first two sections of the 70 weeks work out correctly to 28 AD, when the first 7 weeks are 49 leap years having an extra month. Seven weeks of leap years spans 133 years. The second section is 62 x 7 = 434 years, and together that is 567 years, the time from the decree of Cyrus in 538 BC, to the beginning of the ministry of Jesus in 28 AD.

Some claim that the fulfillment of the first 69 weeks occurred at the end of the ministry of Jesus, rather than the beginning of it, but their interpretations require one or more gaps, and some offer dubious manipulations of historical dates, or spurious schemes contrived in order to get the dates to work out to the year of the crucifixion, which was probably 30 AD.

Daniel said, of the 70th week, "In the middle of the 'seven' he will put an end to sacrifice and offering." [vs. 27, NIV]

This seems to mean the Mosaic temple sacrifices. They ended when the temple was destroyed, in 70 AD. So that must be the middle of the seven, which makes sense, since the first three and a half years were natural, but the last three and a half years apply to the heavenly Jerusalem, and so are symbolic. Earth days, earth months, earth years do not apply to things divine and spiritual. Rather, they are symbols or types.

The 69th week ended in 28 AD, if one counts from the decree of Cyrus, 538 BC, and if leap years are used in the first section, of 7 weeks. This avoids invoking a gap between the end of the 70 years of Jeremiah, and the beginning of the 70 weeks. In fact, Daniel said the "curse" written in the Law of Moses had been poured out, Daniel 9:11, which alludes to the curse that is outlined in Leviticus 26. This consisted of four periods of seven times. In the last of the four periods of seven times, God would be reconciled to his people.

The beginning of the last of the four periods of seven times, the one during which God would be reconciled to his people, was the "acceptable year of the Lord," that Jesus referred to.

If the captivity in Babylon was the first of these four periods of "seven times," the three sections of the 70 weeks correspond to the remaining three periods of seven times. There can be no gap in the curse, as that would imply that God was temporarily reconciled to Israel. The curse does not lapse, and resume again. Any reconciliation with God is a permanent one.

The 70 years of Jeremiah, plus the three sections of the 70 weeks, are the four periods of seven times described in Leviticus 26, and they are continuous, right to the end of the age, and "the times of restitution of all things."

Acts 3:20
And he shall send Jesus Christ, which before was preached unto you:
Whom the heaven must receive until the times of restitution of all things, which God hath spoken by the mouth of all his holy prophets since the world began.

Doug

[Doug]

I really enjoyed what you shared Nathan... I had never heard that before and I thought you brought up some interesting points regarding Stephen.

How can a "week" be a "year"? That makes no sense!

I think Nathan's calculations were a day for a year - 70 weeks = 490 years is a day for a year.

I think my comment quoted above was in response to this statement by Nathan:

what struck me the most was that the 70th week was the year of Jubilee.

The 70th week may have been the beginning of a 7 year sabbatical cycle. But it is a "week" of some kind; that is, "seven times" where the units of "times" is not stated. They turn out to be years, but there are two kinds; real years, and symbolic ones. The first half-week, of course, is the ministry of Jesus. Those are natural years. The last half-week is represented by a three and a half years that is represented by various numbers of days: 1,335, 1,290, 1,260, and three and a half. They imply years that are not natural. In a real three and a half years, the number of days is about 1,278 for solar years; and about 1,240 for 42 months. If a leap year is included, then it is about 1,270 days. So for the last half-week, the prophetic numbers used to represent the three and a half years, 1,335 days, 1,290 days, and 1,260 days, do not correspond to literal years. The numbers not corresponding to reality indicates that they represent a symbolic and figurative period, to which earthly units do not apply. They are used for describing time schedules for building the heavenly Jerusalem, which is the city built "without hands." Its "builder and maker is God." [Hebrews 11:10]

Doug

[Nathan]

The 69 th week is exactly at His baptism
:2c:

I like that!!!

[Beth]

I think my comment quoted above was in response to this statement by Nathan:

Quote from: Nathan
what struck me the most was that the 70th week was the year of Jubilee.

Thanks for clarifying that... I admit I wasn't sure what you were talking about which was why I responded.  Obviously you've done a bit of studying on this subject, but I also admit, it is rather difficult for me to follow.   I do agree the gap theory of 2,000 years is not "sound doctrine".  I can see the connection you are making with Lev. 26, however, the calculations  seem to be going over my head.

[reFORMer]

That a year is given for a day and a day for a year is from Moses.

The Seed, the head is planted in the midst of the week.  The crop, His many membered body (His Spirit sent in His name from the throne having entered into them) is represented til the martyrdom of Steven at the end of the week. (???????)

[WhiteWings]

The 70th week may have been the beginning of a 7 year sabbatical cycle. But it is a "week" of some kind; that is, "seven times" where the units of "times" is not stated.

The other question: is it about the start or end of the 69th or 70th week?
I think the end of the 69th is baptism. End of 69th is of course the start of the 70th week. That's 1 week of ministry to the Jews. Halfway that week Jesus is cut off/dies. That's 3.5 year of ministry by Jesus. The other 3.5 years by His apostles.
When the 70th week ends the Gospel to the Genitles starts???

Why should a week only be either 7 days, months, years etc?
It just as well can be a double phropesy.
So when we use years we find very significant dates (see above)
But I think the 70 weeks can ALSO be Jubilee years.
But that's perhaps a bit of topic so please look here:  http://www.tentmaker.org/forum/members_lounge/the_decending_dove_his_baptism_is_new_jerusalem_9156.0.html

[Molly]

...however, the calculations  seem to be going over my head.

You're doing better than I am.  The whole thing is going over my head.

I just want the bottom line--the [rough] date when Jesus is going to return to take over
the rule of this world.

Somebody give me a date. :laughing7:

[WhiteWings]

As I was laying out what I saw, what struck me the most was that the 70th week was the year of Jubilee.

I think that's not true. The start of the 70th week was sabbath year. The end of that week is a regular year. The start of the 71th week is a sabbath year.
Most important events took place in a Sabbath year.
The Jubilee cycle causes much confusion. Some say it's 49 years others say 50 year.
I think it's possible both...
If I read quotes by Jews (historians) then a 49 year cycle seems to be real Jubilee cycle.
I would say the birth or death is of Jesus is some importance in Christianity....
But no Sabbath or Jubilee years on those years.
But if we take a 50 year cycle then things look different (still working on it)
Then we find multiples of 1000s all over the place.
I have some proof some event in Jesus life was on the year 4000 (4th day) since creation. I say some because it needs to be aligned to contradicting dates from secular sources.

[Doug]

Obviously you've done a bit of studying on this subject, but I also admit, it is rather difficult for me to follow.   I do agree the gap theory of 2,000 years is not "sound doctrine".  I can see the connection you are making with Lev. 26, however, the calculations  seem to be going over my head.

In Daniel 12:7 a swearing angel declares that when the time period called "a time, times and a half" is fulfilled, all the things in Daniel's prophecies will be fulfilled. This period, then, must extend to the end of the age, and to the resurrection of the saints. At the end of the chapter he gives two numbers, 1,290 days and 1,335 days, that are somehow connected with the "time, times and a half." [Daniel 12:11-12]

I mentioned previously that these numbers do not fit any real, earthly three and a half years. The same is true of the 1,260 days that John introduces in Revelation. But they all fit the pattern of "a time, times and a half," or three and a half symbolic years, where months are 30 days, and there are various combinations of regular years of 12 months, and leap years of 13 months.

    1,335 days = 12 x 30 + 2 x 13 x 30 + 13 x 30 / 2
    1,290 days = 13 x 30 + 2 x 12 x 30 + 12 x 30 / 2
    1,260 days = 12 x 30 + 2 x 12 x 30 + 12 x 30 / 2

These all represent an "unreal" or non-literal three and a half years.

Now we need to consider why these numbers, which seem to allude to three and a half years, have an unreal character. The explanation is because they apply to things that are spiritual, rather than to the earthly Jerusalem. The first two sections of the 70 weeks, the 7 weeks and the 62 weeks, apply to the earthly Jerusalem. The first half of the last week, that represents the ministry of Jesus, does also. These times are all natural years. But the last half-week applies to the heavenly city,

Isaiah said, Mount Zion and Jerusalem would be raised up, to the tops of the mountains [Isa. 2:1-3] and in the New Testament, Jerusalem is located in heaven. So Isaiah's prophecy was fulfilled.

Hebrews 12:22-23
But ye are come unto mount Sion, and unto the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, and to an innumerable company of angels,
To the general assembly and church of the firstborn, which are written in heaven, and to God the Judge of all, and to the spirits of just men made perfect,

This is also seen in Galatians 4:26, "But Jerusalem which is above is free, which is the mother of us all."

The "time, times and a half" of Daniel 7:25 & 12:7, and Revelation 12:14 apply to the heavenly Jerusalem, the Church. When Christ ascended to heaven, the Jerusalem to which Daniel's prophecy applies was the heavenly city which is the saints. Thus it is invalid to apply those numbers to the earthly city of Jerusalem. The times that apply to the heavenly city are not like the previous ones; the units are symbolic. The 1,335 days, the 1,290 days, the 1,260 days represent the diminishing time remaining for the age of the church, the last half week of the 70th week, when Christ continues to confirm the covenant with his saints. He reigns in the heavenly Jerusalem, which is a spiritual kingdom, not an earthly one. And so the time units for its duration are not given in terms of earthly years, or months, or days, but in divine language, that is, in symbolic units.

The "time, time and a half" represents the whole age of the church, and the expression also applies to the remaining part of it. The three days and a half of Revelation 11:11 fits the same pattern. Below, I have listed the numbers in decreasing order. The largest one is the 1,335 days. It is the time for which the angel says, "Blessed is he that waiteth, and cometh to the thousand three hundred and five and thirty days." [Daniel 12:12] This seems to refer to Christ, the bridegroom who waits for his bride, and the marriage supper, at the end of the age. Next is the 1,290 days. It represents the remaining time after the abomination of desolation is set up, and the sacrifices are taken away. The end of the sacrificial system was in 70 AD. After that is a smaller number, 1,260 days, representing the remaining time, after John wrote the book of Revelation, probably in the last decade of the first century AD. And near the end of the church age, there is a short period, which he represents by 3.5 days, when the two witnesses are lying like corpses in the street.



                      Time, times and a half
    _____________________________________________________
   |                                                     |
   |                       1,335 days                    |
   |_____________________________________________________|
     |                                                   |
     |                       1,290 days                  |
     |___________________________________________________|
        |                                                |
        |                      1,260 days                |
        |________________________________________________|
                                            |            |
                                            |  3.5 days  |
                                            |____________|



All these numbers are symbolic, and apply to the heavenly city, where time is not determined by the period of the earth's rotation, or by the period of its orbit around the sun; Jesus said, heaven is God's throne, and earth his footstool. Would God order his works according to things happening in his footstool? The units of days, and years, and times, when they apply to heavenly and spiritual things, are not earthly units. That is why, I think, the character of the last half-week of the 70 weeks differs from the previous 69.5 weeks.

Doug

[Doug]

That a year is given for a day and a day for a year is from Moses.

The Seed, the head is planted in the midst of the week.  The crop, His many membered body (His Spirit sent in His name from the throne having entered into them) is represented til the martyrdom of Steven at the end of the week. (???????)

A bit of history, from Paul:

Galatians 1:15-24
But when it pleased God, who separated me from my mother's womb, and called me by his grace,
To reveal his Son in me, that I might preach him among the heathen; immediately I conferred not with flesh and blood:
Neither went I up to Jerusalem to them which were apostles before me; but I went into Arabia, and returned again unto Damascus.
Then after three years I went up to Jerusalem to see Peter, and abode with him fifteen days.
But other of the apostles saw I none, save James the Lord's brother.
Now the things which I write unto you, behold, before God, I lie not.
Afterwards I came into the regions of Syria and Cilicia;
And was unknown by face unto the churches of Judaea which were in Christ:
But they had heard only, That he which persecuted us in times past now preacheth the faith which once he destroyed.
And they glorified God in me.
Galatians 2:1-2
Then fourteen years after I went up again to Jerusalem with Barnabas, and took Titus with me also.
And I went up by revelation, and communicated unto them that gospel which I preach among the Gentiles, but privately to them which were of reputation, lest by any means I should run, or had run, in vain.

There are two trips to Jerusalem mentioned above. The first three years after Paul's conversion, mentioned in Acts 9:26. The second visit was 14 years after his conversion. It is the one described in Acts 11:29-30.

Acts 11:27-30
And in these days came prophets from Jerusalem unto Antioch.
And there stood up one of them named Agabus, and signified by the Spirit that there should be great dearth throughout all the world: which came to pass in the days of Claudius Caesar.
Then the disciples, every man according to his ability, determined to send relief unto the brethren which dwelt in Judaea:
Which also they did, and sent it to the elders by the hands of Barnabas and Saul.

Notice that this visit was "by revelation." Prophets had come and foretold a famine.

While Paul and Barnabas were in Jerusalem, Herod Agrippa died. [Acts 12:23]

After that, Paul returned from Jerusalem. [Acts 12:25]

The death of Herod Agrippa occurred in 44 AD. The visit to Jerusalem was said to have occurred 14 years after Paul was converted. It is likely that the counting was inclusive (see note below), thus Paul was converted in the year 31 AD. Before that, he persecuted the church. And Stephen's death occurred before Paul's conversion. [Acts 7:58] So clearly, the death of Stephen was not the end of the 70th week of Daniel's prophecy, as Stephen must have died in 31 AD.

Doug

Note
Inclusive counting is usually encountered when counting days in a calendar. Normally when counting "8" days from Sunday, Monday will be day 1, Tuesday day 2, and the following Monday will be the eighth day. When counting "inclusively," the Sunday (the start day) will be day 1 and therefore the following Sunday will be the eighth day. For example, the French phrase for "fortnight" is quinze jours (15 days), and similar words are present in Greek (δεκαπενθήμερο, dekapenthímero), Spanish (quincena) and Portuguese (quinzena). This practice appears in other calendars as well; in the Roman calendar the nones (meaning "nine") is 8 days before the ides; and in the Christian calendar Quinquagesima (meaning 50) is 49 days before Easter Sunday.

The Jewish people also counted inclusively. For instance, Jesus announced he would die and resurrect "on the third day," i.e. two days later. Scholars most commonly place his crucifixion on a Friday afternoon and his resurrection on Sunday before sunrise, spanning three different days but a period of around 36–40 hours.[citation needed]

Musical terminology also uses inclusive counting of intervals between notes of the standard scale: going up one note is a second interval, going up two notes is a third interval, etc., and going up seven notes is an octave.
From:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Counting

[Nathan]

As I was laying out what I saw, what struck me the most was that the 70th week was the year of Jubilee.

I think that's not true. The start of the 70th week was sabbath year. The end of that week is a regular year. The start of the 71th week is a sabbath year.
Most important events took place in a Sabbath year.
The Jubilee cycle causes much confusion. Some say it's 49 years others say 50 year.
I think it's possible both...
If I read quotes by Jews (historians) then a 49 year cycle seems to be real Jubilee cycle.
I would say the birth or death is of Jesus is some importance in Christianity....
But no Sabbath or Jubilee years on those years.
But if we take a 50 year cycle then things look different (still working on it)
Then we find multiples of 1000s all over the place.
I have some proof some event in Jesus life was on the year 4000 (4th day) since creation. I say some because it needs to be aligned to contradicting dates from secular sources.

Whoa!!  I stand corrected.  You are right WW, it is the 50th year that is the year of Jubilee . . .however, what Jesus proclaimed in the temple . . .the favorable year of the Lord . . .and understanding that the Sabbath is a depiction of Jesus himself and not only is he just the fullness of days which is what the number 7 is connected to concerning the Sabbath day, but he's the Sabbath of Sabbaths . . .the King of kings, the Lord of lords . . .we are the Lords and Kings He is Lord and King over.  And we are the Sabbath's that He is Sabbath "of".  He is the Sabbath "of" Sabbaths, which is the Jubilee.

So I would "still" say that the last day of the 70th week and the year of Jubilee could very well have fallen on the same year as God's patterns have no loose ends, everything is folded into everything.  Just as the 3rd day and the 7th day are the same day . . .Jesus proclaimed the "favorable year" of the Lord . . .not a literal day, but a spiritual experience had come.  What we see Scripture to portray in the literal sense, God was revealing what he'd already done in the spiritual sense.

70 weeks . . .490 years were set aside for the Jews ONLY . . .Gentiles were left out of it.  Jubilee may have been established "in" the Jewish culture, but it affected Gentiles as well, but not the 70 weeks . .the 70 weeks were Jews Only.  But once the 70 weeks were complete,  the emphasis changed from Jew to Gentile . . .WW . . .there is a pinpoint event in Acts that subltly marks the end of the 70 weeks . . . it's when Scripture states that Stephen was the "first" martyr, that's why that particular event is so important in Acts.  It is the milestone marker that brings closure to the focus of the Jew and turns to the day of the Gentile, the year of Jubilee had finally come to ALL men.

Acts starts out with Peter's ministry to the Jews, but at the stoning of Stephen, we are introduced to Saul, who later becomes Paul, who is the Patriarch of the New Testament sent to the Gentiles.  The switch from Jew to Gentile is quite visible.

[WhiteWings]

As I was laying out what I saw, what struck me the most was that the 70th week was the year of Jubilee.

I think that's not true. The start of the 70th week was sabbath year. The end of that week is a regular year. The start of the 71th week is a sabbath year.
Most important events took place in a Sabbath year.
The Jubilee cycle causes much confusion. Some say it's 49 years others say 50 year.
I think it's possible both...
If I read quotes by Jews (historians) then a 49 year cycle seems to be real Jubilee cycle.
I would say the birth or death is of Jesus is some importance in Christianity....
But no Sabbath or Jubilee years on those years.
But if we take a 50 year cycle then things look different (still working on it)
Then we find multiples of 1000s all over the place.
I have some proof some event in Jesus life was on the year 4000 (4th day) since creation. I say some because it needs to be aligned to contradicting dates from secular sources.

Whoa!!  I stand corrected.  You are right WW, it is the 50th year that is the year of Jubilee . . .however, what Jesus proclaimed in the temple . . .the favorable year of the Lord . . .and understanding that the Sabbath is a depiction of Jesus himself and not only is he just the fullness of days which is what the number 7 is connected to concerning the Sabbath day, but he's the Sabbath of Sabbaths . . .the King of kings, the Lord of lords . . .we are the Lords and Kings He is Lord and King over.  And we are the Sabbath's that He is Sabbath "of".  He is the Sabbath "of" Sabbaths, which is the Jubilee.

Every Sabbath is a year of the Lord.
I don't have the details at hand but the diffrence is something like:
On a Sabbath and Jubilee years all debts are canceled but in a Jubilee year also slaves are set free.
There is a disagrement among scholars what years a Sabbath years. But the difference is only a year.
The Jubilee cycle is obviously linked to the Sabbath cycle but doesn't even come near teh date of the verse you mentioned.
The closed 49 year Jubilee cycle is 3.5 years after He died.
But POSSIBLY  the 50 year cycle is on that date.
A day is like a 1000 years. Jesus ministry was around year 4000 or day 4.
80th Jubilee since creation

So I would "still" say that the last day of the 70th week and the year of Jubilee could very well have fallen on the same year as God's patterns have no loose ends, everything is folded into everything.

But it would be equally logicial if not.
For example the start of His ministry is of lesser value than His resurrection. (I think)
So perhaps ministry=Sabbath and resurrection is 4th day (aka start of 5th day)
Carnally speaking we are now at Friday evening minutes before sunset.

  J

ust as the 3rd day and the 7th day are the same day . . .Jesus proclaimed the "favorable year" of the Lord . . .not a literal day, but a spiritual experience had come.  What we see Scripture to portray in the literal sense, God was revealing what he'd already done in the spiritual sense.

70 weeks . . .490 years were set aside for the Jews ONLY . . .Gentiles were left out of it.

Didn't the Gospel to the Gentiles started at the start of week 71?

Jubilee may have been established "in" the Jewish culture, but it affected Gentiles as well, but not the 70 weeks . .the 70 weeks were Jews Only.  But once the 70 weeks were complete,  the emphasis changed from Jew to Gentile . . .WW . . .there is a pinpoint event in Acts that subltly marks the end of the 70 weeks . . . it's when Scripture states that Stephen was the "first" martyr, that's why that particular event is so important in Acts.  It is the milestone marker that brings closure to the focus of the Jew and turns to the day of the Gentile, the year of Jubilee had finally come to ALL men.

Seems I got my answer...

Acts starts out with Peter's ministry to the Jews, but at the stoning of Stephen, we are introduced to Saul, who later becomes Paul, who is the Patriarch of the New Testament sent to the Gentiles.  The switch from Jew to Gentile is quite visible.

That's what I always thought. I tend to find dates by secular records (no other choice with no dates in the Bible). That often is quite hard because most dates are "about".
But once I find one that falls on a special year and date I know enough.

BTW I think the dove at baptism was New Jerusalem....

[CHB]

Hi,

This may be a dumb question but does any one know how many Jubilees there has been up until now?  Also, when does the next one start or end? If I am not mistaken, a Jubilee is 49 years.

CHB