A consuming fire

[Jock]

I've been thinking about that lake of fire and what sort of fire this is. It is written: Heb 12.23  for our God is a consuming fire. I was thinking and wondering about this fire which I believe many have mistaken to be hell.

Moses stood in front of a burning bush but that bush was not consumed: Ex 3:2 The angel of the LORD appeared to him in a blazing fire from the midst of [fn]a bush; and he looked, and behold, the bush was burning with fire, yet the bush was not consumed

The same could be said of Shadrack, Meshak and Abednago: Then Nebuchadnezzar came near to the door of the furnace of blazing fire; he responded and said, "Shadrach, Meshach and Abed-nego, come out, you servants of the Most High God, and come here!" Then Shadrach, Meshach and Abed-nego came out of the midst of the fire.

The Lord was in there with them and loosened their bonds but not a hair of their heads was singed. I think that this is a picture of the fire in the Lake? Their bonds could, in a spiritual sense, be the things that bound them in the flesh. That would make this fire a fire of purification and cleansing. A far cry from the eternal torture believed by the Greeks and certain early church fathers.

Does anyone have thoughts and/or wisdom to share in this matter?

Blessings to all   :Peace2:

Jock.

[WhiteWings]

Fire = Law = HS

:2c:

[Jock]

WW, don't get it, can you elaborate?

Jock

[JulieTang84]

This might help.

Mal 3:2 But who can endure the day of his coming? Who can stand when he appears? For he will be like a refiner's fire or a launderer's soap.

The consuming fire consumes impurities just like soap washes them away.

1Cr 3:15 If it is burned up, the builder will suffer loss but yet will be saved—even though only as one escaping through the flames.

The builder is saved, only the sinful impurities are consumed.

Love Julie  :HeartThrob:

[Jock]

Thanks Julia, that does help!

Cheers   :banana:

Jock

[sheila]

   I offer two prophetical testimonies. Lamentations/ekah/HOW!during judgement and

chastisement   Lamentations 3;p22  YET,this Icall t omind andtherefore I have hope....

    BECAUSE OF THE LORD'S GREAT LOVE WE ARE NOT CONSUMED,FOR HIS COMPASSIONS

  NEVER FAIL............for men are not cast offby the LORD,FOREVER


   Malachi 3;6  againregarding the day of JUDGEMENT....I THE LORD DO NOT CHANGE,SO,

  YOU DESCENDANTS OF JACOB,ARE NOT DESTROYED.....


CH  4  the Dayofthe Lord...itwill burn like a furnace...arrognce and evil doers[works of the devil]

  will be stubble...not a root or branch left/trampled as ashes under our feet


    Elijah comes..before thegreat day........to turn the hearts of the fathers to thechildren..andthe

hearts of thechildren to the fathers...[please note how the offspring ofvipers lay up heavy loads

impossible to be boreon men's shoulders/ and contrast that withJesus turningthe people's hearts

to their Father inheaven..saying, come,my yoke is light] ........this is the making of straight paths

for the feet of the children..as well as shwing as Elijah did..who was really GOD/FATHER....and

the false Baal  [LORD]worship.[see Baalworshippers burn up God's children in fire....the

true God  has no such thought come up in Hisheart..to consume His children infire/evenJesus

showed itis the tares that are gathered andburned..not the wheat...root/branch/seed

of arrogant andwicked works of devil are consumed.}


   so,ifthe sons of men are not consumed..because of Hisgreat love...whatisconsumed?..itis just

this...the root and branch..of the arr0gant one[Prvrbs 21;4 Haughty eyes andaproud heart,

the lamp ofthe wicked are sin![Psalms 101;4-8]


      SOS8;6,7   for LOVE isas strong asdeath,it'sjealousy unyeilding as the grave.

  IT BURNS LIKE BLAZING FIRE,LIKE A MIGHTY FLAME.............


     inthefurnace..in Daniel...that which was consumed..inthefire...was that which attempted

to consume  [REV 11;5 Ifanyonetries to harm them,fire comesfrom their mouths and devours

theirenemies. This is how anyone who wants to harm them must die]

      thus...the sowing ofthe tares[sin]inthefeild..inthe night..by theenemy...that attempts

  to cause the overgrown  wheatfeild of tares to begiven up to burning of the entire

feild[wheat along with tares]

finds that..first the tares are seperated forburning...and the wheat gaathered....that the wheat

is not consumed of the fire.

    so,man's sin[weed/tares] will NOT SUCEED IN CAUSING GOD TO CONSUME HIM IN FIRE...

  BUT GOD HIMSELF WILL CONSUME IN FIRE MAN'S SIN...AND DELIVER UNTO HIMSELF MAN

FROM THIS EVIL/WICKEDNESS[pray..deliver us from the wicked/evil one]

     woman/wickedness ina basket taken to the landofShinar..[lead lid on basket/dross]

....the smoke ofher burning ascends forever.


  p.s.   and anyssuffering of loss..that man may expierence..is but thedross

  compare the burning of Babylontothe beauty of New Jerusalem..andsee that which was lostwas

dross/lead.   alsothis.......Isaaih 10;22  then youwill defile youridols overlaidwith silver

and your imagescovered with gold,you will throwthem away like afilthy rag..andsay...

  'AWAY WITH YOU!"

[WhiteWings]

WW, don't get it, can you elaborate?

Jock

God is a consuming fire.
Moses receives the fire law on Mt. Sinai.
On Pentecost the HS descended as a flame.
Imo the HS is the essence/character of the Father.
The lake of fire is lake filled with the law.
Etc.

My understanding: http://home.online.nl/spamfree/Lake/index.html

[Jock]

The things you guys are saying makes sense to me now. Whitewings, I'll go through your website in due course. I'm really thankful the Lord led me to Tentmaker, I am learning all the time!

Jock

[rosered]

  Hi Jock

  what they say are true  , its somthing that helped me to know  as well and  not to fear the FIRE of Gods  consuming law  , its perfect and righteous in all ways  ,  this   chapter in itself conviced me   totally when stumbling upon it  , ZION/SION   the HOLY CITY IS  HOLY SPIRIT FILLED FIRE OF GODS  LAW  AND LOVE ,  His creatures are  seraphims [fiery creatures whom serve Him  and know His holiness

Please consider   those whom use the fire to  invoke fear in others    a beast fears fire , but new creatures in Christ  are the fire  dwellers
I totally agree withWW ,   GODS Fiery  law   is   His nature and  purification  process .  done in Love  and purity  and makes clean   and holy  ones .  you have come to Mt Zion / Sion , in the City company of innumerable angels [messengers ]

Isaiah 33
New Life Version (NLV)

A Prayer for Help
33 It is bad for you, O destroyer, you who were not destroyed yourself! You cannot be trusted, but others have trusted you. As soon as you finish destroying, you will be destroyed. As soon as you stop lying, others will lie to you.

2 O Lord, be kind to us. We have waited for You. Be our strength every morning. Save us in the time of trouble.

3 At the loud noise of battle, the people run. When You lift Yourself up, nations divide and run.

4 The things taken in war will be gathered as the caterpillar gathers. Men rush upon it like locusts.

5 The Lord is honored, for He lives on high. He has filled Zion with what is right and fair and good.


6 He will be for you what is sure and faithful for your times, with much saving power, wisdom and learning. The fear of the Lord is worth much.


7 See, their men with strength of heart cry in the streets. The men sent to bring peace cry many tears.

8 The roads are empty. The traveler does not travel. He has broken the agreement. He has hated the cities. He does not care for man.

9 The land is filled with sorrow and wastes away. Lebanon is put to shame and wastes away. Sharon is like a desert. And Bashan and Carmel shake off their leaves.

10 "Now I will rise up," says the Lord. "Now I will be honored. Now I will be lifted up.

11 You bring life to what is of no worth. You give birth to what is of no use. My breath will destroy you like a fire.
12 The people will be burned to white dust, like thorns cut down and burned in the fire.

13 "You who are far away, hear what I have done. And you who are near, speak of My power."


14 Sinners in Zion are filled with fear. The sinful shake with fear. They cry, "Who among us can live with the fire that destroys? Who among us can live with the fire that burns forever?"

15 He who walks with God, and whose words are good and honest, he who will not take money received from wrong-doing, and will not receive money given in secret for wrong-doing, he who stops his ears from hearing about killing, and shuts his eyes from looking at what is sinful,
16 he will have a place on high. His safe place will be a rock that cannot be taken over. He will be given food and will have water for sure.

17 Your eyes will see the King in His beauty. They will see a land that is far away.

18 Your heart will think about fear, asking, "Where is he who numbers? Where is he who weighs? Where is he who numbers the towers?" 1

9 You will not see people who show no pity, people whose language no one knows, whose strange tongue you cannot understand.

20 Look upon Zion, the city of our special suppers! Your eyes will see Jerusalem, a quiet resting place, a tent that will not be moved. Its tie-downs will never be pulled up, and none of its ropes will be broken.


21 But there the Lord in His great power will be for us. It will be a place of rivers and wide waterways, where no rowboats can go, and where no powerful ships can pass.

22 For the Lord is our judge. The Lord is our law-giver. The Lord is our king. He will save us.

23 Your ropes are loose. They cannot hold the sail up in its place or spread it out. Then the many riches taken in battle will be divided. Even those who cannot walk will take the riches.

24 And no one living there will say, "I am sick." The people who live there will be forgiven of their sin.

[Jock]

Thanks Rosered


:iagree:

Jock

PS. I used to work in a small tweed mill in Scotland and we sent the finished cloth to England whare it cleaned. But a guy I worked with told me that in the old days they would clean the cloth in another part of the mill. Apparently it smelled pretty bad but the soap used got down into the cloth deep. Then the impurities would bubble up to the top and the finished cloth was always softer and could be made into garments.

The man who performed this was called a "Fuller"

[WhiteWings]

Yeah it smelled so bad the ancient fullers weren't allowed near the city.


The fuller's soap contained traces of brimstone. Fuller is an Anglo-Saxon name for 'to whiten' because the fuller made wool clean and white before garments were made out of it. The Hebrew word rendered as "fuller" means "to trample" or "to tread," suggesting that action as a major part of the craft. The fuller removed the oily and gummy substances from material before it could be used by washing it in some alkaline such as white clay, putrid urine, or nitre, as there was no soap in those days. The alkaline was washed out by treading on the material repeatedly in running or clean water. The trampling seems to indicate the cleaning process can be unpleasant.


The Revelation grape harvest is pressed/trampled.

[Jock]

Cool stuff there WW, many paralells. Thanks for sharing

Jock

[Tom]

I've been thinking about that lake of fire and what sort of fire this is. It is written: Heb 12.23  for our God is a consuming fire. I was thinking and wondering about this fire which I believe many have mistaken to be hell.

Moses stood in front of a burning bush but that bush was not consumed: Ex 3:2 The angel of the LORD appeared to him in a blazing fire from the midst of [fn]a bush; and he looked, and behold, the bush was burning with fire, yet the bush was not consumed

The same could be said of Shadrack, Meshak and Abednago: Then Nebuchadnezzar came near to the door of the furnace of blazing fire; he responded and said, "Shadrach, Meshach and Abed-nego, come out, you servants of the Most High God, and come here!" Then Shadrach, Meshach and Abed-nego came out of the midst of the fire.

The Lord was in there with them and loosened their bonds but not a hair of their heads was singed. I think that this is a picture of the fire in the Lake? Their bonds could, in a spiritual sense, be the things that bound them in the flesh. That would make this fire a fire of purification and cleansing. A far cry from the eternal torture believed by the Greeks and certain early church fathers.

Does anyone have thoughts and/or wisdom to share in this matter?

Blessings to all   :Peace2:

Jock.

"Hell" is obviously not "the lake of fire" because "hell" will be cast into "the lake of fire" (Revelation 20:14)

"And the Adversary who is deceiving them was cast into the lake of fire and sulphur, where the wild beast and where the false prophet are also. And they shall be tormented day and night for the eons of the eons." (Revelation 20:10) These three all must be spirit beings not subject to death because immortality of the soul is a lie.

Those who die as unbelievers who stand before "the great white throne" and are condemned to "the second death-the lake of fire" will not be "tormented day and night for the eons of the eons." They will be dead. They will not experience "eonian life" in Christ, but they will be vivified at the consummation of the eons when death is abolished.

Immortality of the soul is the philosophy of Plato, adopted as church doctrine, that originally came from the serpent's lie in the garden of Eden.

"And saying is the serpent to the woman, 'Not to die shall you be dying'" (Genesis 3:4)

The dead are reposing. As far as their consciousness is concerned, from the moment they die, the very next thing they will know is that they are alive again regardless of how long they have been dead. There is no consciousness in death.

"The living know that they shall die, But the dead know nothing whatsoever." (Ecclesiastes 9:5)

[Jock]

Good stuff Tom!

One question: If "hell" and death are cast into the Lake of fire and we don't believe that hell exists, how can there be a hell to cast into the Lake? Do they mean Hades?

[rosered]

 

  Yes good stuff being shared , Thanks to all    and you Jock for bringing it up  !
  I always wondered if and  have also considered the Great white Throne judgment to be  all the  saints clean and white in those garments [ righteous acts of the saints ] to be the WHITE THRONE    that God and Christ sits on ,  to sit on somthing also means to be able to ''hold and contain ''it
you shall judge angels /messengers    telling/gathering in Christ / the truth or scattering with lies
     it seems the fullers soap  and that brimstone/sulphur  smells ''like  rotton eggs ''   we have some ''pits''   around these parts that omit   that smell     that have been mined   , but leaves a bluish green  luster over  the waters , I always associate  the blue and green   teaming with ''new life''

  the dead seas are the many voices below , that shall be cast into the lake of fire  for purification

   Jesus come to bring FIRE on the earth  ,   that was His purpose and baptism   Luke 12;  49

  I dont know  every detail , nor claim to , but it sure is a lovely  thing to ponder  in times of   distress ,  that God is in control  and His plan is perfect  , complete and entire    and has no want for nothing .

[Tom]

Good stuff Tom!

One question: If "hell" and death are cast into the Lake of fire and we don't believe that hell exists, how can there be a hell to cast into the Lake? Do they mean Hades?

The church has a history of torturing and killing people just for reading scripture, and the church still considers it heresy to believe scripture correctly translated rather than the doctrine of church tradition.

There is a common misconception about "hell," an Old English word translated from the Greek "hades" literally meaning "un-perceived," or "unseen," referring to the "unseen" state of a dead soul, but the meaning of "hell" has been distorted by intentional mistranslation of "Gehenna" as "hell" twelve times in the King James Version and the Douay-Rheims Catholic Version in the following verses: Matthew 5:22,29,30, 10:28, 18:9, 23:15,33; Mark 9:43,45,47; Luke 12:5; James 3:6. "Gehenna" actually refers to the ravine of Hinnom, southwest of Jerusalem, used by the ancient apostate Jews to sacrifice their children in fire to Moloch, an Ammonite god, and later used to burn the corpses of criminals condemned to death as it will be in the coming eon.

"And it will come to be, as often as the new moon comes in its monthly time, And as often as the sabbath comes in its sabbath cycle, All flesh shall come to worship before Me, says Yahweh. And they will go forth and see the corpses of the mortals who transgressed against Me, For their worm shall not die, And their fire shall not be quenched, And they will become a repulsion to all flesh." (Isaiah 66:23,24)

The intentional mistranslation of "Gehenna" as "hell" is used to support the myth of "hell fire." The church failed to suppress scripture by killing people with fire, but the church changed scripture to terrorize people with torture in fire forever after they die.

[WhiteWings]

     it seems the fullers soap  and that brimstone/sulphur  smells "like  rotton eggs "   we have some "pits"   around these parts that omit   that smell     that have been mined   , but leaves a bluish green  luster over  the waters , I always associate  the blue and green   teaming with "new life"

300 AD (?) a historian wrote about a sulpferious mist hanging over the Dead Sea. A writer around Jesus time wrote people in that area lived shorter because of the frequent sulfur smell from the Dead Sea.
That, btw, aligns quite nicely with Sodom and the 4 other cities who sold tar (to Egypt)

[WhiteWings]

  the dead seas are the many voices below , that shall be cast into the lake of fire  for purification

The seas represent nations in turmoil.

Hebrew uses lots of parallelism. A piece of wisdom expressed in different ways. I highlighted the part about the sea in red and the parallel part equaling the sea to humanity in yellow. Obviously there are also many verses where the word sea just means a literal sea, lake or other body of water like the Laver
Isa 17:12 Ah, the uproar of many peoples, who roar like the roaring of the seas, and the rushing of nations, that rush like the rushing of mighty waters!
Isa 23:11 He has stretched out his hand over the sea. He has shaken the kingdoms. LORD has given commandment concerning Canaan, to destroy the strongholds of it.
Isa 57:20 But the wicked are like the troubled sea, for it cannot rest, and its waters cast up mire and dirt.
Isa 60:5 Then thou shall see and be radiant, and thy heart shall thrill and be enlarged, because the abundance of the sea shall be turned to thee. The wealth of the nations shall come to thee.
Jer 6:23 They shall lay hold on bow and spear; they are cruel, and have no mercy; their voice roars like the sea; ....
Jer 49:23 Of Damascus. Hamath is confounded, and Arpad, for they have heard evil news. They are melted away. There is sorrow on the sea; it cannot be quiet.
Ps 65:7 Which stills the noise of the seas, the noise of their waves, and the tumult of the people.
Ps 89:9 You rule the raging of the sea: when the waves thereof arise, you still them. 10 You have broken Rahab in pieces, as one that is slain; you have scattered your enemies with your strong arm.
Ezek 26:3 therefore thus says lord LORD: Behold, I am against thee, O Tyre, and will cause many nations to come up against thee, as the sea causes its waves to come up.
Jas 1:6 But let him ask in faith, nothing wavering. For he that wavers is like a wave of the sea driven with the wind and tossed.
Jude 1:13 Raging waves of the sea, foaming out their own shame; wandering stars, to whom is reserved the blackness of darkness for ever.
Ezek 28:2 Son of man, say to the ruler of Tyre, Thus says lord LORD: Because thy heart is lifted up, and thou have said, I am a god. I sit in the seat of God, in the midst of the seas. Yet thou are man, and not God, though thou did set thy heart of Elohim.


With that in mind read:

Mark 4:35 And the same day, when the even was come, he said to them, Let us pass over to the other side.
Mark 4:36 And when they had sent away the multitude, they took him even as he was in the ship. And there were also with him other little ships.
Mark 4:37 And there arose a great storm of wind, and the waves beat into the ship, so that it was now full.
Mark 4:38 And he was in the hinder part of the ship, asleep on a pillow: and they awake him, and say to him, Master, care you not that we perish?
Mark 4:39 And he arose, and rebuked the wind, and said to the sea, Peace, be still. And the wind ceased, and there was a great calm.
Mark 4:40 And he said to them, Why are you so fearful? how is it that you have no faith?
Mark 4:41 And they feared exceedingly, and said one to another, What manner of man is this, that even the wind and the sea obey him?

For me that passage gets an extra meaning when replacing sea with nations.

[irenic-inkwell]

The things you guys are saying makes sense to me now. Whitewings, I'll go through your website in due course. I'm really thankful the Lord led me to Tentmaker, I am learning all the time!

Jock

re: I am learning all the time!   Me, too  :girlheart:

Thanks everyone-  I thoroughly enjoyed reading the many different writing styles that blend together so many thought-provoking, Scripturally sound, challenging, edifying, encouraging posts.  I've been so focused on my study re: Deuteronomy recap of Law/Revelation recap of grace and truth (John 1:17 For the law was given by Moses, but grace and truth came by Jesus Christ)   that I didn't take time  to read the Consuming Fire thread until now -- again many thanks to all for helping me to learn spiritual truths.  Irene

[rosered]

     it seems the fullers soap  and that brimstone/sulphur  smells "like  rotton eggs "   we have some "pits"   around these parts that omit   that smell     that have been mined   , but leaves a bluish green  luster over  the waters , I always associate  the blue and green   teaming with "new life"

300 AD (?) a historian wrote about a sulpferious mist hanging over the Dead Sea. A writer around Jesus time wrote people in that area lived shorter because of the frequent sulfur smell from the Dead Sea.
That, btw, aligns quite nicely with Sodom and the 4 other cities who sold tar (to Egypt)

:thumbsup:  I did not know that ! Thanks WW.

Quote from: rosered on Today at 09:19:52 PM
  the dead seas are the many voices below , that shall be cast into the lake of fire  for purification The seas represent nations in turmoil.

Hebrew uses lots of parallelism. A piece of wisdom expressed in different ways. I highlighted the part about the sea in red and the parallel part equaling the sea to humanity in yellow. Obviously there are also many verses where the word sea just means a literal sea, lake or other body of water like the Laver
Isa 17:12 Ah, the uproar of many peoples, who roar like the roaring of the seas, and the rushing of nations, that rush like the rushing of mighty waters!
Isa 23:11 He has stretched out his hand over the sea. He has shaken the kingdoms. LORD has given commandment concerning Canaan, to destroy the strongholds of it.
Isa 57:20 But the wicked are like the troubled sea, for it cannot rest, and its waters cast up mire and dirt.
Isa 60:5 Then thou shall see and be radiant, and thy heart shall thrill and be enlarged, because the abundance of the sea shall be turned to thee. The wealth of the nations shall come to thee.
Jer 6:23 They shall lay hold on bow and spear; they are cruel, and have no mercy; their voice roars like the sea; ....
Jer 49:23 Of Damascus. Hamath is confounded, and Arpad, for they have heard evil news. They are melted away. There is sorrow on the sea; it cannot be quiet.
Ps 65:7 Which stills the noise of the seas, the noise of their waves, and the tumult of the people.
Ps 89:9 You rule the raging of the sea: when the waves thereof arise, you still them. 10 You have broken Rahab in pieces, as one that is slain; you have scattered your enemies with your strong arm.
Ezek 26:3 therefore thus says lord LORD: Behold, I am against thee, O Tyre, and will cause many nations to come up against thee, as the sea causes its waves to come up.
Jas 1:6 But let him ask in faith, nothing wavering. For he that wavers is like a wave of the sea driven with the wind and tossed.
Jude 1:13 Raging waves of the sea, foaming out their own shame; wandering stars, to whom is reserved the blackness of darkness for ever.
Ezek 28:2 Son of man, say to the ruler of Tyre, Thus says lord LORD: Because thy heart is lifted up, and thou have said, I am a god. I sit in the seat of God, in the midst of the seas. Yet thou are man, and not God, though thou did set thy heart of Elohim.


With that in mind read:

Mark 4:35 And the same day, when the even was come, he said to them, Let us pass over to the other side.
Mark 4:36 And when they had sent away the multitude, they took him even as he was in the ship. And there were also with him other little ships.
Mark 4:37 And there arose a great storm of wind, and the waves beat into the ship, so that it was now full.
Mark 4:38 And he was in the hinder part of the ship, asleep on a pillow: and they awake him, and say to him, Master, care you not that we perish?
Mark 4:39 And he arose, and rebuked the wind, and said to the sea, Peace, be still. And the wind ceased, and there was a great calm.
Mark 4:40 And he said to them, Why are you so fearful? how is it that you have no faith?
Mark 4:41 And they feared exceedingly, and said one to another, What manner of man is this, that even the wind and the sea obey him?

For me that passage gets an extra meaning when replacing sea with nations.

Good stuff again Bro T !! aka WW

[rosered]

The things you guys are saying makes sense to me now. Whitewings, I'll go through your website in due course. I'm really thankful the Lord led me to Tentmaker, I am learning all the time!

Jock

re: I am learning all the time!   Me, too  :girlheart:

Thanks everyone-  I thoroughly enjoyed reading the many different writing styles that blend together so many thought-provoking, Scripturally sound, challenging, edifying, encouraging posts.  I've been so focused on my study re: Deuteronomy recap of Law/Revelation recap of grace and truth (John 1:17 For the law was given by Moses, but grace and truth came by Jesus Christ)   that I didn't take time  to read the Consuming Fire thread until now -- again many thanks to all for helping me to learn spiritual truths.  Irene

Me too sis!      I love chapters Deut 28  -32  its all of the Lord !   the song of moses Deut31, 32   gave lots to  think upon and again the song of moses mentioned in Rev


Rev 15:3 And they sing the song of Moses the servant of God, and the song of the Lamb, saying, Great and marvellous are thy works, Lord God Almighty; just and true are thy ways, thou King of saints.

All the Law is fulfilled in Christ Jesus !

[irenic-inkwell]

Thanks Rosie:  much to add to my study of Dt and Rev...  and so I continue learning :)

re:  All the Law is  fulfilled in Christ Jesus

seems to me to be a summary of the scriptures shared by jbertononbounds on the thread re: Jesus the narrow way?  thanks jbb so much for all those scriptures and your final line
"The law made NOTHING perfect.  Hope is through Jesus, through whom, like a narrow gate, we draw near to God."  reinforces my current meditation on Hope and Jesus being the only way... and, of course, brings to mind the beautiful song/hymn MY HOPE IS BUILT...

[Jock]

Scripture states that death and hades/hell are cast into the Lake of Fire. How can hell be cast into the Lake if it doesn't exist?

Jock

[WhiteWings]

The lake, death and hades all exist.
The real question is what exactly are those things?

Is hades the grave, hell, a greek god, Hebrew angel of death?
Is death just that death or is the it the greek god hades or the hebrew angel of death?
Is the lake ET hell like, is it the Temple laver, something else?

[Jock]

Well, I'm clear on the LOF and I'm clear on death. Death is the absence of life, the dead know nothing. I know that Hades is a Greek God of the nether world. I am left with the question. Is Hades really, Sheol?