What if you guys are all wrong about universal salvation?

[rosered]

I grew up in the Kansas City area, and made it my business to understand the WBC, as Topeka is near by.  It all began with Fred Phelps, a Kansas lawyer, who was so irascible and unfair in the courtroom, that he was disbarred.  His unforgiving hatefulness contaminates his church and family to this day.  They go out and protest in hopes of a tire being slashed, a windshield broken, or one of them assaulted.  Then they sue, and that is how they make a living.  It's a scam, and people are waking up to the best way to deal with them:  ignore, and offer them no services in your town.

Wow.  That's enlightening.  Had no idea it was just a scam.  I thought it was a fanatic preacher misleading his congregation.  That explains a lot.  Either way, it is a group of people who are mislead into evil deeds and hurting others.

That could be more for filthy lucre and greedy gain  than !    thats  a bad  condition to be in  :sigh:

[sheila]

I read on the internet a few months back..that a gay activist group bought a house catty0cornered from them,and are

painting it the colours of the rainbow..just to get their goaat up

[lomarah]

I read that too... I don't know how I should feel about it... but I laughed my head of hahahahaha.  :msealed:

[sheila]

 made me smile too.  but kinda reminds me of an expierence I had as a child,when I thought it good fun to poke a yellow

jackets nest on the porch.

[jbertonbounds]

made me smile too.  but kinda reminds me of an expierence I had as a child,when I thought it good fun to poke a yellow

jackets nest on the porch.

:laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:

[jbertonbounds]

I read on the internet a few months back..that a gay activist group bought a house catty0cornered from them,and are

painting it the colours of the rainbow..just to get their goaat up

Let those who practice evil continue to do evil, and those who do good continue to do good.
Let those who antagonize continue to antagonize, and those who are trying to be funny continue to try to be funny.
As for how we should react?  We should each be the judge of whether we should laugh or cry or shake our heads.
Just whatever you do, however you react, only do it if you can do it with a clear conscience (assuming you are following the Spirit's leading).

[dajomaco]

Well I have a clear conscience and I am laughing.
Hold on there is something wet in my eye I think I am crying.
Wait now my head is moving back and forth.

[jbertonbounds]

Well I have a clear conscience and I am laughing.
Hold on there is something wet in my eye I think I am crying.
Wait now my head is moving back and forth.

:winkgrin:

[jabcat]

I read on the internet a few months back..that a gay activist group bought a house catty0cornered from them,and are

painting it the colours of the rainbow..just to get their goaat up

IMO, both are abhorrent.  There was a time God winked...

Blessings, James.

[jbertonbounds]

I read on the internet a few months back..that a gay activist group bought a house catty0cornered from them,and are

painting it the colours of the rainbow..just to get their goaat up

IMO, both are abhorrent. There was a time God winked...

Blessings, James.

Huh?

[lomarah]

Well I have a clear conscience and I am laughing.
Hold on there is something wet in my eye I think I am crying.
Wait now my head is moving back and forth.

:iagree:

[jabcat]

Thanks for asking.

In my personal opinion, neither Westboro nor the homosexual group are funny.  The scripture reference is, there was a time God winked, but now He calls all men everywhere to repent.

I also think of the scripture that says to not have pleasure in unrighteousness.  If anyone wants to laugh at sin/sinfulness, it's their business.  I know I've often failed in that area, and will again, but I personally don't feel OK laughing (taking pleasure) in evil/evil-doers.  :2c:

[lomarah]

I get your point James! There are definitely many times when there is no humour at all about sin. On the other hand even God poked fun at the Israelites for bowing down to a piece of wood haha. :) I think sometimes He shows us how ridiculous our sin is through humour. It definitely takes the discernment of the Spirit for sure!

[jabcat]

Thanks for the input Lo.  It kind of opens up other areas of thought.  I like a good joke, find many things funny, laugh a lot.  Also, as jberton originally said, and you just did, everyone should follow the Spirit - in everything.  However, there are also instructions/admonitions given to us, and if not done in a condemning way, I believe are meant to share with each other.

I don't know - perhaps when God poked fun at the Israelites, that was during the past times when He winked?  (I think that's probably a whole big study, as to the many things that issue entails [God having in past times winked at ignorance]).  Also, God has the power to instantly change any bad situation He so chooses, so He can laugh a second, snap His fingers, and it's remedied/the remedy set in motion.  Was He also possibly using the "jest" at them as a way to chide them into seeing their folly, beginning the remedy?  I don't know the scripture reference(s).  Regardless, He had the power to change it, we don't, so my yukking it up at evildoing is likely not doing any good for the situation.   :2c:  I probably won't dig into it fully, but it's an interesting discussion.

I'm not a Puritan, but PERSONALLY, my conscience is offended if I laugh or tell  something that IN MY OWN SPIRIT I sense is "over the line".  I try to "be in tune" with that leading, but I cross that line often, and always need to learn from it.  For me, it's growing in Him, having self-control, etc., of which I often fail.   :2c:

[eaglesway]

God is the I AM. He is purely Himself. I am the Lord, I change not. He is teaching us to be as He is, like a river of goodness with no thought of return, like the wind, you hear the sound of it but you don't know where it is going or from where it comes.

The voice of the Lord is like the rushing of many waters. "Deep calls unto deep at the sound of your waterfalls O Lord". This is(imo) the glorious liberty of the children of God. The more we are transformed into the image of Christ, who is the image of God- the more spontaneous our love is, the more the Voice of God is heard throughus- "Come all who thirst, drink freely of the water of life".

[jabcat]

What, John, are you getting us back on track or something?!   :laughing7:

God is the I AM. He is purely Himself. I am the Lord, I change not. He is teaching us to be as He is, like a river of goodness with no thought of return, like the wind, you hear the sound of it but you don't know where it is going or from where it comes.

The voice of the Lord is like the rushing of many waters. "Deep calls unto deep at the sound of your waterfalls O Lord". This is(imo) the glorious liberty of the children of God. The more we are transformed into the image of Christ, who is the image of God- the more spontaneous our love is, the more the Voice of God is heard throughus- "Come all who thirst, drink freely of the water of life".

:thumbsup:   :dsunny:

[sheila]

well,I understand a personal conscience....


        wisdom laughs at folly...Proverbs 1;24-33

       laugh at your disaster.......it is not an expression of heartlessness,but a reaction to the absurdity of fools,who

   laugh at wisdom..  I can appreciate the absurdity of both westborough and the rainbows in this instance.

   Just as I can look back on my own foolishness/absurdity when I poked the yellow-jacket nest..

          Blessing :HeartThrob:s

[jabcat]

Yeah, I wasn't picking at you sheila so much as the overall issue/your post was "handy" to respond to.  What I hear you saying is different than being entertained by debauchery ["yeah, they got them, hahaha"].

Again, it's a good study probably.  I personally see a difference between laughing at the ridiculousness of something, being amazed by it, mocking its absurdity - vs. enjoying/deriving pleasure from the sinfulness involved.   While both groups are proudly proclaiming their own brand of sin, there's probably very little either group could do that I personally should find entertaining - such as one group antagonizing the other with their own wickedness.   :2c:   

So on one hand I can see laughing at the ridiculousness of a situation or activity, but if I'm actually taking pleasure in the activities of either the haters or the sodomites, TO ME, that's sinful FOR ME and has a definite flavor of "laughing it off"/minimizing, perhaps in some instances even condoning the behavior.   On a base/carnal level, there are many things my flesh can revel in.  But on a spiritual level, Jesus said what fellowship has light with darkness (they don't mix);  and I have a LONG way to go, but I believe my mind should be set on [and rejoicing in] things above, rather than depravity.   :2c:

[sheila]

 :thumbsup:   JC.....I just don't want any hurt feelings because of my comment.....for the laughers,head-shakers or smilers..

   I think their a pretty good bunch!!   as are you !    :HeartThrob:

[jabcat]

Oh, you know how one thought leads to another, then that opens up a need to study something out further, etc.    Got me thinking about some things.

What did we do before these discussion forums?  Probably actually talked to the people around us.   :laughing7:

:HeartThrob:

[eaglesway]

I see two things, that we can be like a well. We can lower down a bucket and get water and the water is good- that is, if the bucket is not so full of holes it will hold no water :o) Or we can be like a fountain, water springing up from our innermost being- water of life, the Spirit of I AM.

The only difference is volume.

No one can make that happen- only the supply of the Spirit of Life in Christ Jesus will cause the water to flow or draw the thirsty to the watering hole.

It IS a DESERT out there- no matter how good it looks on TV. If the supply of the Spirit is abundant, the aroma of the life of Christ will draw the lost and the water of life will rain down on them, showers of blessing all over His holy mountain.

As David prayed, Oh for a drink from the fountain in Jerusalem.

By the rivers of Babylon we hung our harps and we remembered Zion- all my springs of Joy are in thee.

Upon this mountain I will remove the veil that covers the people.

Time to GET UP :o)

He makes my feet like hinds feet and causes me to go upon my high places.

Seated in the heavenly realms in Christ Jesus. Walking in the Spirit. Only grace allows it. Only humility and love allow grace.

Lord, Have Mercy!

Is there a fountain on your mountain? :o)

[Jock]

It's kinda hard to think that the Phelps clan from Topeka will also be saved. I don't hate them (I refuse to) but I do hate what they are saying and doing. They are driving people away from Christ. They are spreading the virus but then, a lot of churches are doing that.

Jock

[mplsfitter539]

It's kinda hard to think that the Phelps clan from Topeka will also be saved. I don't hate them (I refuse to) but I do hate what they are saying and doing. They are driving people away from Christ. They are spreading the virus but then, a lot of churches are doing that.

Jock

Jock,

I agree except you said "a lot of churches" I think that it is more like 99%.  Seriously is there such a place where a UR person can attend meetings every week or even monthly called a "church"?

We are more like an ekkelsia than any church that I have heard of.

[rosered]

It's kinda hard to think that the Phelps clan from Topeka will also be saved. I don't hate them (I refuse to) but I do hate what they are saying and doing. They are driving people away from Christ. They are spreading the virus but then, a lot of churches are doing that.

Jock

Jock,

I agree except you said "a lot of churches" I think that it is more like 99%.  Seriously is there such a place where a UR person can attend meetings every week or even monthly called a "church"?

We are more like an ekkelsia than any church that I have heard of.

  Jesus said  the Father seeks those to worship Him in Spirit and in truth , I do believe He is  chooing out of the world and  setting  us in a place of His choosing  ,  if the temple of God is  YOU !

  and where  2 or 3 are gathered in His name we  have church  in the moment  , where time and   concrete things , such and building and mindsets  like that   never matter at all

[Jock]

Yes, Rosered, I agree that 99% of churches and that Christ has saved them all. The prostitutes and publicans may enter before them but once the Lord is done with us all, I think we'll be different creatures indeed.

Regards


Jock  :2c: