666 pebbles

[redhotmagma]

Jab the 49 are the same books just some are combined like the minor prophets is one book.

[jabcat]

ty   :thumbsup:

[marie glen]

I'm on mobile /texting so can't quote but am responding to the 1st post by Whitewings. I didn't know that about the "white stone"! Thanks! :thumbsup:

[BirdSong]

Birdsong I've actually put something forth about this a while back on here.  Basically it was about the arrangement of 66 books compared to the 49 as shown by Dr. Ernist Martin (which is timely since Ken has been posting stuff based off his work right now here). 

In the book of Revelation, you see 3 classes of people. 

Those who dwell in the heavens, which I see as the barley company, the overcomers.
Those who dwell in the sea, which is the grapes company, the dead (now) as the sea represents the dead (as in let the dead bury the dead)
Those who dwell on the earth, which is the wheat company, the "church".

Now it says all those who dwell on the earth take the mark.  It says nothing of the overcomers/those who dwell in the heavens taking the mark. 
Those who dwell in the sea are dead, they know nothing, they have no desire for the bible, or the things of God, and so can't be deceived, as they are dead.

That leaves "the church".  IMO the whore of babylon is none other than Circe, "the church".  And we see her riding on the back of the beast --the carnal mind.  And the confusion they bring is shown in the 66 books.

I do believe that the bible is idolized by many christians.  Thats not to remove it from its position of what its meant to do, but is not meant to replace Christ in you.

I totally agree! I'd be very interested to read what you previously wrote about this. I looked for it, but couldn't locate the post/thread.  Someone else I know from another forum was "hinting" at this idea as well, so it would seem there may be many with similar thoughts. Thank you for your post.

[redhotmagma]

I'll see if I can find it, but I think what I just wrote probably sums it up, though it was on the end of a long conversation if memory serves.

[BirdSong]

Originally Posted by Jabcat,

Birdsong, aka Illuin -

His wife jabcat  :LH:  Illuin told me this is the only forum worth joining. He has the stomach and the patience for debating in the "turn-or-burn" fundamentalist forums, but not me. He does help me format posts sometimes, but I pretty much know how to do that now.

[BirdSong]

I'll see if I can find it, but I think what I just wrote probably sums it up, though it was on the end of a long conversation if memory serves.

Thank you.    :dsunny:

[BirdSong]

Originally Posted by jabcat,

Yes, thanks for the clarification Pete.

Jenny..... Like in Forest Gump. I guess it doesn't matter, we are one anyway; right?

[marie glen]

Very interesting thread.. I especially like Jabcat's posts on the Word! :2thumbs:

And was it Lazarus who said there's likely many interpretations of 666, and mentioned the Bison?

I'm thinking there's been a few antiChrists, which were, were not and then were again.. The one we're most familiar with being the Roman Empire, (and one, application of 666 is adding together the roman numerals at use at the time,1,5,10,50,100,500) then it wasn't, and then it was or became the Holy Roman Empire..

Most folks don't think of the League of Nations, was, then wasn't. It expired because the U.S didn't sign on after all, even though it was a u.s. president which dreamed it up, Woodrow Wilson. Then after the occurrences of 1945 over Hiroshima and Nagasaki, the world was convinced to rebuild it as the u.n., and at which time was hailed as a new age. Definitely a new arrangement of powers, or a new day..

The two horned, as a bison, imo, fits as to a u.s. two horned/seat office, one which brought fire down upon the earth in the sight of men.. It's my opinion, the 'little' beast (rev 13:11-18) will step into the prime seat of the 'big' beast (1-10) giving it (finally) authority/breath. Daniel 9:27 "he makes a covenant for one week" (Strong's includes "league") - the two horned office pinpointing a place he will have been?

Originally Posted by Jabcat,

Birdsong, aka Illuin -

His wife jabcat  :LH:  Illuin told me this is the only forum worth joining. He has the stomach and the patience for debating in the "turn-or-burn" fundamentalist forums, but not me. He does help me format posts sometimes, but I pretty much know how to do that now.

Hi Birdsong! tell your husband posting straight scripture helps, as it's hard to argue so much with straight scripture...

Some of the things you posted have reminded me of the teaching that sunday worship is the mark of the beast.. but I have a hard time with that 1st, because it seems to me to be a voluntary mark, not clandestinely given or received.

..and it seems to me it's those without the seal of God on their forehead who receive the mark, not everyone upon earth..

2ndly, the Holy Roman Empire used God's Word, mostly by burning it and forbidding folks to read it.. And also what Jesus said about the church, "the gates of `hell`" (the grave, gehenna?) "will not prevail against it" - the church that is.. and even tho there's error - some of the GLORY of the GOOD NEWS has been lost, and some BAGGAGE picked up along the way, they are still our Lord's own.. surely? And don't forget, blindness in part has happened to Israel, so the gentiles would be grafted in..

Also to consider, perhaps is the method of execution carried out against those found not having the mark - in verse rev 20:4, is perhaps a clue as to who else may be involved in the modern day fulfillment. They being an ally, defended often as being peaceful (later coming to be harnessed?)

The harlot, if we examine the scriptures, imo, clearly shows who this one is, even in its final application. Again, she goes (is going) global (7 hills/continents). The Greek word translated "harlot" is "pornos" and "to sell".

Note how the (world) beast and the 10 kings/divisions which rule one (final) hour with him, will hate the harlot, raze her and devour her (R 17:12-18). (Extreme) socialism will finally devour (extreme) capitalism which embraced "pornos" to sell, sell, sell, and has by it enchanted and seduced the nations making them drunk, her forehead is all confusion/babble "responsible for ALLslain upon earth" since Earth's beginning - God has put it in their hearts (the 10 kings/divisions) to do so!

She has a golden cup of her side effects, murders, perversions, abortions?, sex slave trade?..
She is described of course in rev chapters 17 and 18. She made the merchants wealthy, and they will weep at her fall/crash (in one hour, but also in one day "all your towers will fall" Isaiah). The kings/politicians of the earth are in bed with her.. Her products are listed, right down to the bodies and lives of people.

:gsmile: Welcome to Tentmaker forums!

[BirdSong]

Here is a picture jab.... for the record. This was taken May 2012 - Illuin (Pete) and BirdSong (Jenny):






[attachment deleted by admin]

[jabcat]

:)   :thumbsup:    I'm not posting a picture of me!   :laugh:

[BirdSong]

:)   :thumbsup:    I'm not posting a picture of me!   :laugh:

How come? Maybe it's me, but I think it's easier to talk to people in forums if you see them. Makes it more personable - like you're actually talking to a "real person" instead of a computer screen.  :Peace2:

[jabcat]

The harlot, if we examine the scriptures, imo, clearly shows who this one is, even in its final application. Again, she goes (is going) global (7 hills/continents). The Greek word translated "harlot" is "pornos" and "to sell".

Note how the (world) beast and the 10 kings/divisions which rule one (final) hour with him, will hate the harlot, raze her and devour her (R 17:12-18). (Extreme) socialism will finally devour (extreme) capitalism which embraced "pornos" to sell, sell, sell, and has by it enchanted and seduced the nations making them drunk, her forehead is all confusion/babble "responsible for ALLslain upon earth" since Earth's beginning - God has put it in their hearts (the 10 kings/divisions) to do so!

She has a golden cup of her side effects, murders, perversions, abortions?, sex slave trade?..
She is described of course in rev chapters 17 and 18. She made the merchants wealthy, and they will weep at her fall/crash (in one hour, but also in one day "all your towers will fall" Isaiah). The kings/politicians of the earth are in bed with her.. Her products are listed, right down to the bodies and lives of people.

Good insight, thanks.   :thumbsup:

[jabcat]

:)   :thumbsup:    I'm not posting a picture of me!   :laugh:

How come? :Peace2:

haha, ok, this is as close as it comes.  blessings.

http://tentmaker.org/forum/humor-poems-songs-movies/where-would-i-be-members'-songs/msg143790/#msg143790

[BirdSong]

:)   :thumbsup:    I'm not posting a picture of me!   :laugh:

How come? :Peace2:

haha, ok, this is as close as it comes.  blessings.

http://tentmaker.org/forum/humor-poems-songs-movies/where-would-i-be-members'-songs/msg143790/#msg143790

Wow. Is that you? That is beautiful! Seriously. It made me cry. It really gives you a real feeling of Christ's TRUE unconditional love for everyone in a powerful way. Pete is also a musician, but WILL NOT SING  :sigh:  He is an amazing jazz guitarist though, and still teaches part time - and he loves listening to "other people" sing.

Really beautiful jab. And it's nice to see and "hear" who I'm talking with.

[jabcat]

 :mblush:

:thanks:

awesome on the guitar playing..really cool!

[BirdSong]

Originally Posted by marie glen,

The harlot, if we examine the scriptures, imo, clearly shows who this one is, even in its final application. Again, she goes (is going) global (7 hills/continents). The Greek word translated "harlot" is "pornos" and "to sell".

Note how the (world) beast and the 10 kings/divisions which rule one (final) hour with him, will hate the harlot, raze her and devour her (R 17:12-18). (Extreme) socialism will finally devour (extreme) capitalism which embraced "pornos" to sell, sell, sell, and has by it enchanted and seduced the nations making them drunk, her forehead is all confusion/babble "responsible for ALLslain upon earth" since Earth's beginning - God has put it in their hearts (the 10 kings/divisions) to do so!

She has a golden cup of her side effects, murders, perversions, abortions?, sex slave trade?..
She is described of course in rev chapters 17 and 18. She made the merchants wealthy, and they will weep at her fall/crash (in one hour, but also in one day "all your towers will fall" Isaiah). The kings/politicians of the earth are in bed with her.. Her products are listed, right down to the bodies and lives of people.

Interesting angle. Very interesting....  :Chinscratch:

[BirdSong]

Originally Posted by marie glen,

The two horned, as a bison, imo, fits as to a u.s. two horned/seat office, one which brought fire down upon the earth in the sight of men.. It's my opinion, the 'little' beast (rev 13:11-18) will step into the prime seat of the 'big' beast (1-10) giving it (finally) authority/breath. Daniel 9:27 "he makes a covenant for one week" (Strong's includes "league") - the two horned office pinpointing a place he will have been?

Really good insights Marie.  :thumbsup:

Also interesting to note is that King James (the 6th King of Scotland) was also the 1st King of England (England and Scotland - i.e. - two horns). And it is interesting the SECOND BEAST from the EARTH (EARTH = carnal, natural man), who has two horns "like" a lamb ("like" as in, "appears" to be like the Lamb of God - i.e. - in SHEEP'S CLOTHING), is a two horned (two powers) beast - and there are two powers in orthodox Christianity (Catholic and Protestant).

Just some more thoughts.

[sheila]

...one has but to watch commercials.

selling a product.that have nothing to do with the sexes..become all about

sexual inuendo and lewdness..to see her merchandising. sex sells!!!!!!! Ticks me off! When I have always

bought a product..and liked it..then see a 'sexually driven' commercial..and stop buying it!!

   rapid white...tooth bleaching gel..for one!!  5 minute tooth stain remover

   

[marie glen]

Good reason to buy things generic! & Hope it's not sold via innuendo elsewhere! Ticks me off too, and throwing over decency laws has wrecked our society.

[BirdSong]

Good reason to buy things generic! & Hope it's not sold via innuendo elsewhere! Ticks me off too, and throwing over decency laws has wrecked our society.

I do not see our society as being wrecked. At least in the US, I think it's actually far better than it was even 50 years ago. Think about it, at the height of our so-called "church going" morally responsible years, African Americans weren't allowed to sit in the front of the bus  :doh:, and we were dropping nuclear weapons on innocent women and children  :sigh:. On the whole, I believe we are maturing spiritually as a civilization. I personally am not offended by the innuendos in question. I really only see sin as not "loving God and each other, as He loved us" (our only command). Granted, using sex to sell doesn't exactly qualify, but I personally do not see it as being determining factor in a society's spiritual evolution. It's just carnal humans doing what they do until God calls them. Wars and killing on the other hand.......well...... At least we are seeing the light as far as the barbarity of war - and we are infinitely more mature and enlightened in the civil rights arena.  :thumbsup:

[reFORMer]

A recent post contained the following statement:

The bible, because of so many different interpretations and countless different 'WINDS (spirits) of doctrine,' has been used (and misused) to rule and kill more people than anything or anyone in human history, and it is still being used by the nations who worship it to go to war and kill.

This is simply not true.  There were less people killed by what even remotely could be said to be "Christian" in the last 2,000 years, including the Crusades and the later Inquisition, than were killed in two years by the Aztecs for their religion.  This, with much more, is in What If The Bible Had Never Been Written? by Dr. D. James Kennedy, a book I would promote as, at the least, an antidote to such faulty views of scripture.

Christians never had their own army.  The closest, the Knights Templar, were mostly security guards for the Holy Land tours of their day.  Over half the Christians worldwide in our day meet in their homes.  Many of us reject Institutional Christianity as false brethren, the false vine and the false bride, even as Mystical Babylon and her daughters.

The problem is people don't read the Bible.  Whether natural and unregenerated or quickened to newness of life by the Holy Ghost, to read Scripture as God has given it to us -- from the beginning of a book through to its end, and the books fall in groups -- this is the big solution to matters both religious and secular in our times.  A marker at Genesis and another at Matthew, reading 2 chapters in the OT for every chapter in the NT, you'll read the NT approximately twice for every once you read the OT.  This is the simplest plan I know.

The only two gifts more important than the Bible that God has given us is Himself, specially His son and the indwelling Holy Spirit, and each other.

The only clear reason people are not simply head over heels in love with the Bible and its wondrous effects in their lives is they just do not read it for themselves!!!

[CHB]

Yes, thanks for the clarification Pete.  That's helpful.  I've been thinking about you and praying for you last night, and I was a little puzzled - because I saw elsewhere where you had posted something like "we need to pay attention to the Word of God", which in context, it seems like you were saying "the sayings, instructions, [including written] Words from God.  So aha!, there's more to the story, and again, thanks for clarifying.  I just don't know about the 66 vs. 49 books, haven't looked into it that much, and IMO, I think one would need to be VERY careful about deciding which ones to weed out  :mshock: - maybe Dr. Martin is able to do that - but right now, I'm going to hold my reservations about that - I'm doubtful.  I believe what Lazarus Short shared about the mathematical equation of the earliest manuscripts - on which BASICALLY MOST translations are based, is powerful stuff.  I'm not ready to go tampering with it myself.  Still, I believe some of the things you've clarified are helpful, thanks.
--------

Something I read the other night that really got my attention;  When satan tempted Eve in the garden, and with Jesus in the desert - he didn't do a full frontal assault.  He whispered things like "can it be true", "can you..", "it says...(while leaving out part of "what it says" - check it out - he only quoted part of a verse to make it what he wanted).  In other words, he planted DOUBT.

    I don't believe "the Bible" [more accurately, scripture] is meant to replace "Christ in you" either.  However, I don't think it's even necessarily separated from "Christ in you", because of what I just posted in another thread -  i.e., the logos of God at work in us, separating, dividing, cutting, etc., in the Greek means SAYINGS of God.  So connectedly, God said the Holy Spirit spoke through holy men of old, and also that all scripture is inspired [GOD-BREATHED].  So my believe is, ANY thought, saying (spoken or written), and Jesus the Word made flesh in us, are all the Word of God and are to be handled with extreme care.  Personally, I think it's very important to be sure we're identifying that it's how the carnal mind may HANDLE the Words of God, vs. the Message itself being "bad".   :2c:    "In the beginning was the logos.."   God has many ways of passing that down to us.

Much to consider, I'm just not sure the scriptures have any real role in the Mark of the Beast.  If so, I think it would be just in how certain people use them - or maybe more correctly, how satan in people twist and MIS-use them. 

May we just simply trust Him more.  Amen, blessings.

Hi Jabcat,

Here is an article/book that Dr. Martin wrote about "Restoring the Original Bible".  Dr. Martin doesn't remove any books of the Bible just puts them in the right order.   

http://askelm.com/restoring/index.asp

CHB

[BirdSong]

Hi Birdsong! tell your husband posting straight scripture helps, as it's hard to argue so much with straight scripture...

Hi Marie,

Thank you for the suggestion, even though he snorted 'hmmmph!!!' when I told him. He was sitting at his Mac in the other room this morning carrying on, hemin' and hawin' about some discussion in the forum, and I told him exactly what you said Marie.

He just said, "Arrrrrrgghh!" then waved his hand like a bitter old man, and growled; "Yeah riiiiiiigghhtt! No matter what passage from scripture you give them, they twist it into a threat or ultimatum from God."

Teeheee  :grin: He's from Brooklyn, NY and moved down South 3 years ago, so that's his way of saying, "I love you."  :laughing7:

[WhiteWings]

• Revelation 13:11 "And I saw another beast ascending up from the earth, and it had two horns, like a lamb; and it spake as a dragon."

That verse can be summarized as: ET


[quoute]The bible is used and misused to control the flocks of 38,000 denominations - who ALL think they know the truth. The bible, because of so many different interpretations and countless different 'WINDS (spirits) of doctrine,' has been used (and misused) to rule and kill more people than anything or anyone in human history, and it is still being used by the nations who worship it to go to war and kill.

"For the letter kills, the Spirit gives life." (2 Corinthians 3:6)[/quote]I think that verse is often used for false teachings. "It's all spiritual". The perfect verse to shove Scripture aside and invent your own fantasy doctrine.
Imo that verse doesn't in the most miniscule part implies something bad about the Bible's written word. It's more like "Mankind is able to turn even the most holy thing in distructive perversion.
Jesus quoted extenisvly from the killing letters. Did He overlook some vital point?

The bible is composed of 66 books - composed and assembled to control mankind (6).

7x7=49 books. Church has cut the OT into books that never exited at Jesus time. For example 1Kings and 2Kings didn't exist as seperate books during Jesus time.[/list]