Prophecy

[marie glen]

I personally don't believe 70 ad was the end of an age.

IMO. The new age began either at the resurrection of Jesus or at the day of Pentecost(I prefer the latter). The prophesy Jesus made regarding the fate of Jerusalem which was accomplished in 70 AD was only the burial of the body that was destroyed when He took the keys of sheol and death and made the law of no effect for everyone who believed and became "born of God" by faith. When Jeruslem was destroyed the gospel was already preached throughout the known world and the kingdom of God in Christ was well on its way to becoming the little stone that strikes the feet of Babylon.

....absolutely! but there was judgment and collapse/razing of a system in 70 A.D. It's noted historically that the priests repaired the rent veil and carried on the sacrifices as though Messiah had not come (the first time).

[eaglesway]

Yes, but as we know, the veil was already rent in Christs body, the way into the holy place(heavenly realms) revealed. It was finished.

[Molly]

There were some wonderful scenes in The Bible miniseries last week.   One was the three servants thrown into the fire, and the Lord appearing among them.   And, one was the story of Daniel.  We see Daniel, one of the greatest heroes of the Old Testament, praying just like we do and for the same things, the renewing of the Holy Spirit within and the presence of our God.



Have mercy upon me, O God, according to thy lovingkindness: according unto the multitude of thy tender mercies blot out my transgressions.

10 Create in me a clean heart, O God; and renew a right spirit within me.

11 Cast me not away from thy presence; and take not thy holy spirit from me.

12 Restore unto me the joy of thy salvation; and uphold me with thy free spirit.

--Psalm 51





If our timing is right, Today [Mar 22,2013] is the turning point for the next 3.5 years.   Otherwise, it's another 20 years until the signs are right again.
:2c:




13 I saw in the night visions, and, behold, one like the Son of man came with the clouds of heaven, and came to the Ancient of days, and they brought him near before him.

14 And there was given him dominion, and glory, and a kingdom, that all people, nations, and languages, should serve him: his dominion is an everlasting dominion, which shall not pass away, and his kingdom that which shall not be destroyed.

--Daniel 7

[CHB]

If our timing is right, Today [Mar 22,2013] is the turning point for the next 3.5 years.   Otherwise, it's another 20 years until the signs are right again.

molly could you explain this a bit more? How did you come to this date? Are you saying the next 3.5 years will bring the end?

CHB

[eaglesway]

These kinds of prophecies encourage me. When Today passes, and nothing out of the ordinary occurs- i will expect to be free from impending apocalypse reports for 20 years YAYYYYYY!

(really, just kidding...... I love impending apocalypse reports. Ever since the "Jupiter Effect" through "YK2" I have had more solid entertainment through them than any other "end- times" chicanery out there.)

[Molly]

Time Magazine cover for March 25, 2013 ['Eve of Passover'--first seder]


Picture of Pope Francis


TIME

"NEW WORLD POPE"


http://www.time.com/time/covers/0,16641,20130325,00.html

[lomarah]

I seriously hope we don't have to wait another 20 years!!

God spoke to one of my friends about a decade ago. He said when the world's love has grown cold, when there is very little love left (REAL love), even within families, that's when the end would come. I think we're about there. (He also told him it would be very soon... it was a few years back that he wrote the end would start in a few short years. Of course to God 20 years could be a few short years... I just hope it's not that long.)

[CHB]

I seriously hope we don't have to wait another 20 years!!

God spoke to one of my friends about a decade ago. He said when the world's love has grown cold, when there is very little love left (REAL love), even within families, that's when the end would come. I think we're about there. (He also told him it would be very soon... it was a few years back that he wrote the end would start in a few short years. Of course to God 20 years could be a few short years... I just hope it's not that long.)

Amen to that Lomara.

CHB

[marie glen]

If our timing is right, Today [Mar 22,2013] is the turning point for the next 3.5 years.   Otherwise, it's another 20 years until the signs are right again.

molly could you explain this a bit more? How did you come to this date? Are you saying the next 3.5 years will bring the end?

CHB

hi! Molly, is that something having to do with (I'm not sure I can remember) a few months back on forums on facebook, it was all the buzz about ancient Israel Holy Days and moon phases or eclipses maybe.. I think maybe that was it.. eclipses, and they traced some history.. well, I do think Holy Days and historical happenings to do with Israel have occurred, but to tell ya the truth, when i was reading all that stuff, I thought, wouldn't it be better to discern what it was Jesus said about those days.. I do like to study up on that..

Personally I used to figure, 30, maybe even 40 years for things to shape up more concretely, you know global this and global that, for one thing.. but after a while recently, I've wondered if 20, possibly even less could be possible, for things to BE concretely, you know, global.

It's not so much for me that I want to know!! I think i know the signs.. And the danger days, I think, are a lot less in number than prophecy buffs have been saying and teaching.. And the Lord and also Isaiah said basically, be a bit hidden/low profile for a few days.. Anyway, it's my kids and, or grand kids I'm thinking of! :Pray:
:Peace2:

[eaglesway]

Come, my people, enter thou into thy chambers, and shut thy doors about thee: hide thyself as it were for a little moment, until the indignation be overpast. For, behold, the LORD cometh out of his place to punish the inhabitants of the earth for their iniquity: the earth also shall disclose her blood, and shall no more cover her slain.
(Isa 26:20-21)

Woe unto you that desire the day of the LORD! to what end is it for you? the day of the LORD is darkness, and not light. As if a man did flee from a lion, and a bear met him; or went into the house, and leaned his hand on the wall, and a serpent bit him. Shall not the day of the LORD be darkness, and not light? even very dark, and no brightness in it?
(Amo 5:18-20)

[marie glen]

(Isa 26:20-21)

:thanks: for posting that verse..

[eaglesway]

YW. Its one of my favorite verses :o)

[sheila]

Arise Shine,for your light has come,and the glory of the Lord rises upon you.....see...

  darkness covers the earth..and thick darkness is over the peoples,but the Lord rises upon you

   and His glory appears over you. Nations will come to your light,and kings to the brighteness

  of your dawn.[note the day of the Lord when Jesus was on the cross/judgement..and it was dark]

    the year of the Lord's favour......The spirit of the Sovereign Lord is upon me,because the Lord has

annointed me, to preach good news to the poor,He has sent me to bind up the broken-hearted

to proclaim freedom for the captives..and release from darkness for the prisoners

  TO PROCLAIM THE YEAR OF THE LORD'S FAVOUR,AND THE DAY OF VENEGEANCE OF OUR GOD


      Isaaih speaks of the passover..the entering the house and shutting the door..of which the Blood of Lamb

is on the doorpost. The Egyptians had not light in their houses..but Israel had light.....

    the Egyptians/Pharoah symbolize satan and the prince of this world...satan will not let go...God

works the plagues against him..toward the deliverance of His people from this world....

   hide yourself for but a moment...and your life shall appear..when He is revealed..for you are hidden in Him.

   where is this promised coming of His? Isaaih 5;19]    woe to those who draw sin along with cords of

  deceit,and wickedness as with cart ropes..to those who say,'Let God hurry,let Him hasten His work

  that we may see it" Let it approach, let the plan of the Holy one of Israel come,so we may know it...

   this is in relation to the mockers..the scorners...the wicked [evil spirits] that mock the coming vengeance

on the Kingdom of darkness..and the deliverance of mankind from satan's power.

    those that are awaiting His return..are told to lift themselves erect for their deliverance draws near...

   when they see all these occurring.  the admonition and woe..is toward those that mock them.

    have the believers had woe,also? Yes, for satan knows his time is short..and demonic madness[wrath]

  has covered the earth as a great darkness.

   God shall mock those who mock those awaiting Him.......

    we need to be aware of what is coming.....the end of the good/evil exercize...the end of the corrupt image

   the deliverance of the body undergoing this death..in man.

   Dan 9;24.........to finish transgression..to put an end to sin..to atone for wickedness....

   TO BRING IN EVERLASTING RIGHTEOUSNESS, to seal up vision and prophecy..and to anoint

  the MOST HOLY

   Rev 7;14   and He said, these are they who have come out of the great tribulation[Great Crowd]

   in number they are like the sand on the seashore[God's covenant with Abraham-children as sand

  on seashore[dragonstood on the seashore=overcomeman]..stars as the heaven=if I be lifted up I will

draw all men unto me[into the heavens=wise shall shine like the stars of heaven..and lead many

to righteousness]

[Molly]

Dire Straits - 17th of Tammuz to the 9th of Av

This year, 2013, It will be June 25 to July 16

The Three Weeks or Bein ha-Metzarim (Hebrew: בין המצרים, "Between the Straits" cf "In Dire Straits") is a period of mourning commemorating the destruction of the first and second Jewish Temples. The Three Weeks start on the seventeenth day of the Jewish month of Tammuz — the fast of Shiva Asar B'Tammuz — and end on the ninth day of the Jewish month of Av — the fast of Tisha B'Av, which occurs exactly three weeks later. Both of these fasts commemorate events surrounding the destruction of the Jewish Temples and the subsequent exile of the Jews from the land of Israel. According to conventional chronology, the destruction of the first Temple, by Nebuchadnezzar II, occurred in 586 BCE, and the second, by the Romans, in 70 CE.


Time of danger

The Three Weeks are historically a time of misfortune, since many tragedies and calamities befell the Jewish people at this time. These tragedies include: the breaking of the Tablets of the Law by Moses, when he saw the people worshipping the golden calf; the burning of a Sefer Torah by Apostomus during the Second Temple era; the destruction of both Temples on Tisha B'Av; the expulsion of the Jews from Spain on Tisha B'Av 1492; and the outbreak of World War I on Tisha B'Av 1914, which overturned many Jewish communities.

--Wikipedia



"In traditional Judaism the time period between the 17th of Tammuz and the 9th of Av is called 'bein ha Metzarim' which is translated between the narrow places or dire straits. It comes from Lamentations 1:3: 'Amidst affliction and harsh labor,

Judah has gone into exile. She dwells among the nations; she finds no resting place. All who pursue her have overtaken her IN THE MIDST OF HER DISTRESS.'

"This phrase IN THE MIDST OF HER DISTRESS can also be translated "between the straits or narrow places." It is traditionally a 3-week mourning period in Judaism commemorating the breaching of the walls of Jerusalem on the 17th of Tammuz and the destruction of the Temple on the 9th of Av. It is a time of mourning with no weddings occurring during this season along with other mourning traditions.

---Chuck Pierce



"Between the narrow places"



13 Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat:

14 Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.

--Mat 7



"Narrow" [is the way]

G2346
θλίβω
thlibō
thlee'-bo
Akin to the base of G5147; to crowd (literally or figuratively): - afflict, narrow, throng, suffer tribulation, trouble.



Narrow is the way--it's describing the birth canal, and birth is being given through a sense of crowding, pressure, tribulation, trouble.



21 For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.--Mat 24

It's the same word:

[great] "tribulation"

G2347
θλίψις
thlipsis
thlip'-sis
From G2346; pressure (literally or figuratively): - afflicted, (-tion), anguish, burdened, persecution, tribulation, trouble.


Pressure, Crowding--

Its describing a birth, as the birth pangs come closer and closer together,

the baby is entering the birth canal.



23 Then if any man shall say unto you, Lo, here is Christ, or there; believe it not.

24 For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect.

25 Behold, I have told you before.

26 Wherefore if they shall say unto you, Behold, he is in the desert; go not forth: behold, he is in the secret chambers; believe it not.

--Mat 24



March 20, 2013:  Entering Jerusalem the same day as Jesus

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WUx4wKyvV94





27 For as the lightning cometh out of the east, and shineth even unto the west; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

---Mat 24



Mat 24:27 Describes the birth which will happen on the Feast of Trumpets



Dear friends, we are already God's children, but he has not yet shown us what we will be like when Christ appears. But we do know that we will be like him, for we will see him as he really is. --1 John 3:2

[marie glen]

(What a beautiful picture on the youtube video of Jesus' triumphal entry!!)

..I hadn't heard anything about world frog day.. that's interesting too.. quite co-incidental all these things.. Very good word study too, and I for one, had never heard of the narrow straits..   :thumbsup: :Chinscratch:

[Molly]

If our timing is right, Today [Mar 22,2013] is the turning point for the next 3.5 years.   Otherwise, it's another 20 years until the signs are right again.

molly could you explain this a bit more? How did you come to this date? Are you saying the next 3.5 years will bring the end?

CHB

Take a look at this, CHB.  I like the way he explains things although it does not have to necessarily go exactly this way.  We are watching for certain things to happen, but I've found that they do not have to unfold the way you think they will.  I found this past week to be a very quiet turning of the tides, imo.  I thought what happened was huge, but few noticed.  Future events will confirm.  Watch Israel.


Daniel Unsealed
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VUk6mKotx0c

[jabcat]

So it seems basically a lot of folks are saying the new Pope and Obama tied to Israel are both significant.

Molly, you know more about this, so correct me if I'm off on something.  I have a short attention span, so I scan things and look for summarization :)

In looking at some things others are saying, I've seen these points; 

>the new pope will sit in the upper room and also sit somewhere on David's throne when he visits Israel.  This permission has already been given.
>Obama entered Jerusalem the exact same day of the year Jesus did (and in a certain timeline with Passover?)
>Obama received the Nobel Peace Prize 1260 days prior to March 23/2013 (?)   (some believe that started the first 3.5 years of tribulation?)...that it was the "agreement" or "promise" of future peace...
>Obama will make every effort to bring peace to the Middle East this year and maybe next with agreements between Israel and Palestinians, but it's predicted he will basically end up breaking all "promises" for peace - including the Nobel Peace Prize "assumed contract" of working for peace.
>Some who believe in a mid-trib rapture point to around the first of April 2013, just prior to things really beginning to blow up?
>Others, post-trib believers, point to 3.5 years from March 23, 2013 as the time of Jesus' return.

The fellow in the following states Jesus actually gave the name of the anti-Christ in the Aramaic in the scriptures, and shows why he thinks so and who he thinks it is in the following video.  He uses scripture and references Strong's to show his evidence.  The video is long, but what I'm mentioning is IN THE FIRST 4 MINUTES OF THE VIDEO.    Thoughts?


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oBuwQ1_P89w&feature=player_embedded

[CHB]

Jabcat, all those things people are saying are interesting but the guy who said the words "yes you can"  is actually "thank you Satan" is a bit of a stretch. Sometimes I think people try to make things happen and use innocent people to accomplish it. I don't think Obama is anti-christ, he might have something to do with how things are going to play out but so does everyone else. I wonder about the ant-christ and if this didn't happen in 70AD, what does Gary say about this?

CHB

[Molly]

Jabcat, all those things people are saying are interesting but the guy who said the words "yes you can"  is actually "thank you Satan" is a bit of a stretch. Sometimes I think people try to make things happen and use innocent people to accomplish it. I don't think Obama is anti-christ, he might have something to do with how things are going to play out but so does everyone else. I wonder about the ant-christ and if this didn't happen in 70AD, what does Gary say about this?

CHB

Did Christ return in 70 AD ?

And then shall they see the Son of man coming in the clouds with great power and glory.

--Mark 13:26

Has the first resurrection already happened?

[dajomaco]

IMO
IMO
The Italian government is going to be forced by the EU.
To raise money through austerity measures.
The Italians will not want to pay higher taxes.

The people will say why are you taxing us.
Make the Vatican pay more.
They will come up with a special tax on the Vatican.
The new pope is not Italian or European.
They will demand the Vatican bail out the Italians.

The pope will see this coming and start moving large sums of money,
to the poor of South America .The same groups and the children of the
groups that moved European resources to south America after the fall
of Nazis , will be used again.

EU governments will be at war in the Financial sense, with the Vatican. 

The largest sums of money that have ever been recorded will be
moved around the world looking for a save place to land.
As this money moves ,where it lands there will be joy and prosperity
But it will be very short lived as it will not settle for long .
Once it moves on the people will despair of ever having a good life.

This pool of money will get bigger and bigger.
The head of this money starts off being the pope .
Watch for the one who has final control of this fund.

Our joy will be directly affected according to how much joy we receive from
MONEY

[CHB]

Jabcat, all those things people are saying are interesting but the guy who said the words "yes you can"  is actually "thank you Satan" is a bit of a stretch. Sometimes I think people try to make things happen and use innocent people to accomplish it. I don't think Obama is anti-christ, he might have something to do with how things are going to play out but so does everyone else. I wonder about the ant-christ and if this didn't happen in 70AD, what does Gary say about this?

CHB

Did Christ return in 70 AD ?

And then shall they see the Son of man coming in the clouds with great power and glory.

--Mark 13:26

Has the first resurrection already happened?

I think Jesus will come again and I do think there will be a resurrection but as for the anti-christ I am not so sure.

CHB

[eaglesway]

John and Paul spoke of anti-christs(plural) and the anti-christ/ son of perdition(singular). IMO there have been and are many anti-christs. I think there will be a final anti-christ(physical embodiment/person) at the end of the age at the crescendo of the conflict in the earth between the Spirit of Christ and the anti-chist anti-christ spirit, just previous to the second coming.  :2c:

IMO Obama does not scripturally qualify for "the anti-christ" who will be a spiritual figure, as well as a political one.

[marie glen]

The youtube video - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oBuwQ1_P89w&feature=player_embedded was very interesting.. I looked up the word references

#1299/1300 Hebrew/Aramaic..? "baraq" lightning flash
#1116 - "bamah"
   Wow! That is quite co-incidental, I have to admit! add the "poetry" of "O" or "U" in the middle, like he says, and it's even more interesting..!

From,

The fellow in the following states Jesus actually gave the name of the anti-Christ in the Aramaic in the scriptures, and shows why he thinks so and who he thinks it is in the following video.  He uses scripture and references Strong's to show his evidence.  The video is long, but what I'm mentioning is IN THE FIRST 4 MINUTES OF THE VIDEO.    Thoughts?


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oBuwQ1_P89w&feature=player_embedded

In connection with this, i've believed for some time now when it comes to the final "man of sin" (singular) that we can pinpoint an office he occupies, at least for a time, perhaps previous to his final seat of power, if we study and prayerfully consider rev 13:13. Another (obvious!?) 'clue' from God..?!

Rev 13, verses, 1-10 is the 'big' beast, or world beast.. (or world body which ends up acting like a beast which is what governments of man do)

Rev 13:11-18 is the 'little' beast, he's a man, for "we have his number" (or more specifically in verse 13:13, a particular office, two horned). This office brings fire from the sky in the sight of mankind. (I don't know how this is missed... but what about that new fire, atomic? in 1945!

What I am thinking is a u.s. president, whether presently at the time, or past at the time, has been in that office.. I believe will sit in the prime seat of  the world beast. When that does occur it will give breath (authority, finally) to the world body.

To me, the Pope and the Holy Roman Empire, and the Roman Empire before it, are beasts (world and office) of a yesteryear.. Not the final 'last' days one..

It's my belief we shall see wars and rumors of wars concerning Israel then something thermal-nuclear (last I knew that's what it was called.. and atomic).. Which I think is the opening of the 7th seal, after the pause of atomic warfare, after it was first opened (rev 7:1, unless this verse, and just previous, which is the 6th seal are known, you might not know what I'm talking about:) will paste..

Isn't Israel supposed to wipe out 'Damascas'? Or something.. I'm not real familiar with Ezekiel which is where I believe it's prophesied.. Any Ezekiel buffs?

So I think this occurs before the man of sin is revealed and steps up to the plate..

Most Bible prophecy buffs have thought of all the revelation characters as the Pope and the RC church.. The [1]world beast; [2]the man/office/little beast/eventually the 666 guy; [3]the false prophet(teaching); [4]$ity BabbleOn gone global, all 7 continents; and; [5]her forehead responsible for all slain upon Earth, Mystery Babylon/Babble.. all confusion and error, the psyche of the fallen into error world.

I'm not making sense? :laughing7: please let me know if you can see what I'm trying to say, after reading the following..

Revelation 6:12-17 (New King James Version) note:seals are described as a blend of (a)what they are when 1st opened and (b)what they are when fully matured - this locks the vision for a time..

12 I looked when He opened the sixth seal, and behold, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became like blood. 13 And the stars of heaven fell to the earth, as a fig tree drops its late figs when it is shaken by a mighty wind. 14 Then the sky receded as a scroll when it is rolled up, and every mountain and island was moved out of its place. 15 And the kings of the earth, the great men, the rich men, the commanders, the mighty men, every slave and every free man, hid themselves in the caves" (and in bomb shelters, I remember!) "and in the rocks of the mountains, 16 and said to the mountains and rocks, "Fall on us and hide us from the face of Him who sits on the throne and from the wrath of the Lamb! 17 For the great day of His wrath has come, and who is able to stand?"

Revelation 7:1-3 (New King James Version)

7 After these things I saw four angels standing at the four corners of the earth, holding the four winds of the earth, that the wind should not blow on the earth, on the sea, or on any tree. 2 Then I saw another angel ascending from the east, having the seal of the living God. And he cried with a loud voice to the four angels to whom it was granted to harm the earth and the sea, 3 saying, "Do not harm the earth, the sea, or the trees till we have sealed the servants of our God on their foreheads." (atomic warfare paused until foreheads sealed 144,000 of Israel - mt 23:39 - and a great crown unable to number)

Revelation 13 (NKJV) snipped for brevity.. I think prophecy is not always given in proper order, or order of fulfillment

13 Then I stood on the sand of the sea. And I saw a beast rising up out of the sea.. And I saw one of his heads as if it had been mortally wounded" (expired, fell apart,Dan 9:27, "covenant" 7yr, hebrew ="league") and his deadly wound was healed. And all the world marveled and followed the beast. 4 So they worshiped the dragon who gave authority to the beast; and they worshiped the beast, saying, "Who is like the beast? Who is able to make war with him?"

5 And he was given a mouth speaking great things and blasphemies, and he was given authority to continue for forty-two months. 6 Then he opened his mouth in blasphemy against God, to blaspheme His name, His tabernacle, and those who dwell in heaven. 7 It was granted to him to make war with the saints and to overcome them. And authority was given him over every tribe, tongue, and nation. 8 All who dwell on the earth will worship" (be in allegience to) "him, whose names have not" (yet) "been written in the Book of Life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world..
....11 Then I saw another beast coming up out of the earth, and he had two horns like a lamb and spoke like a dragon. 12 And he exercises all the authority of the first beast in his presence, and causes the earth and those who dwell in it to worship the first beast, whose deadly wound was healed. 13 He performs great signs, so that he even makes fire come down from heaven on the earth in the sight of men. 14 And he deceives those who dwell on the earth by those signs which he was granted to do in the sight of the beast, telling those who dwell on the earth to make an image to the beast who was wounded by the sword and lived"(2nd version). 15 He was granted power to give breath to the image" (panel? w/ a circle of horns on its head?seats?) "of the beast, that the image of the beast should both speak and cause as many as would not worship the image of the beast" (swear allegience) "to be killed. 16 He causes all, both small and great, rich and poor, free and slave, to receive a mark on their right hand or on their foreheads, 17 and that no one may buy or sell except one who has the mark or the name of the beast, or the number of his name.

18 Here is wisdom. Let him who has understanding calculate the number of the beast, for it is the number of a man: His number is 666.

..it's my belief these political forces make a 7 year peace treaty, whether world or middle east (...?)
and the 666 days will be 45 (b'cause of the numbers of Daniel 12:11,12)
--------------------------------------------------------------------

I think there have been times of 'fast forward' often.. perhaps just very recently.. (shown to some of God's people by this little illustration of Pres. Obama on a donkey to Jerusalem, also coinciding with world frog day.. not that it makes things imminent, imo.. :smile:  :2c: (now back to reading the rest of this thread:)

[marie glen]

John and Paul spoke of anti-christs(plural) and the anti-christ/ son of perdition(singular). IMO there have been and are many anti-christs. I think there will be a final anti-christ(physical embodiment/person) at the end of the age at the crescendo of the conflict in the earth between the Spirit of Christ and the anti-chist anti-christ spirit, just previous to the second coming.  :2c:

IMO Obama does not scripturally qualify for "the anti-christ" who will be a spiritual figure, as well as a political one.

:iagree: Eaglesway.. with what you said about the man of sin, plural and singular, and the word crescendo fits into the Book of Revelation perfectly as many things in Revelation are like tones of music which begin, and add to, and continue to the 'end' like an increasing crescendo.. (and visions within visions)

..and I agree the final man of sin (singular) will be many different things to many different factions.. including spiritual.. but it may also be true that if he be on the world scene currently, perhaps not all his face is revealed.. :dunno:

[jabcat]

CHB, I'm not sure exactly where Gary is on this.  He has many preterist leanings, but the most clearly I've heard him on that is, "we need to pay attention, some major things happened in 70 AD".  I THINK for one, he means the end of temple worship, the "final piece of the move" from Law-grace, etc...

I've also heard him say "I'm not saying some things might not have double fulfillment", i.e., something that prophetically happened already may have some sort of repeat, even bigger future occurrence.   So IMO, that's not "hard and fast" either way on a total fulfilled or future perspective.   :2c:


marie, yes, interesting - whether everything fits for finality, I personally just don't know.  I'm watching.  I also believe as you mention, some things are stretched to fit sometimes, and even imagined...and since Revelation is basically a huge puzzle for me of which I can put very few pieces together, I'm not the best one to say.   :mblush:

Blessings.