Let there be light

[Beloved Servant]

 
   YOU WILL!!!

Perhaps I'll soon read his obituary.

[thinktank]

Sheila what is this?   Satan was formerly in heaven and provide the 'evil' for the first

  12[archangels] of which Jesus was one

Jesus is no archangel. He created them.


Colossians 1:16
For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:



Revelation 4:11
Thou art worthy, O Lord, to receive glory and honour and power: for thou hast created all things, and for thy pleasure they are and were created.


Matthew 11:27
All things are delivered unto me of my Father: and no man knoweth the Son, but the Father; neither knoweth any man the Father, save the Son, and he to whomsoever the Son will reveal him.

[redhotmagma]

1:5 For to which of the angels did God 12  ever say, "You are my son! Today I have fathered you"? 13  And in another place 14  he says, 15  "I will be his father and he will be my son." 16  1:6 But when he again brings 17  his firstborn into the world, he says, "Let all the angels of God worship him!" 18  1:7 And he says 19  of the angels, "He makes 20  his angels spirits and his ministers a flame of fire," 21  1:8 but of 22  the Son he says, 23
"Your throne, O God, is forever and ever, 24
and a righteous scepter 25  is the scepter of your kingdom.
1:9 You have loved righteousness and hated lawlessness.
So God, your God, has anointed you over your companions 26  with the oil of rejoicing." 27
1:10 And,
"You founded the earth in the beginning, Lord, 28
and the heavens are the works of your hands.
1:11 They will perish, but you continue.
And they will all grow old like a garment,
1:12 and like a robe you will fold them up
and like a garment 29  they will be changed,
but you are the same and your years will never run out." 30
1:13 But to which of the angels 31  has he ever said, "Sit at my right hand until I make your enemies a footstool for your feet"? 32  1:14 Are they not all ministering spirits, sent out to serve those 33  who will inherit salvation?

[thinktank]

Even the Father calls His own Son God. But Jesus said Father is greater, for Father is before the Son.

[Beloved Servant]

That, was while Jesus walked the earth.

[Molly]

Even the Father calls His own Son God. But Jesus said Father is greater, for Father is before the Son.

1In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

2The same was in the beginning with God.

--John 1

[sheila]

    they are ALL ONE TT.......the 'creature' is the whole creation...[Heavens included]  GOD IS ALL IN ALL

      the 'word of God' is Father's  Creative POWER. HE IS MAKING AN IMMORTAL FAMILY...our design is pattered after the Heavenly...

   in him was life,and that life was the light.....the children of the light.... they are like the angels..they are God's children

     In the beginning was the 'word''.....let us make man in our image...but do not forget the previous 6 days of creation...


    All things are created by him and for Him[God].. the FATHER IS GREATER THAN I...the Father and I are 'one'

   1 Cor 15;26 the last enemy to be destroyed is death,for he has put everything under his feet.....


    NOW........WHEN IT SAYS THAT EVERYTHING HAS BEEN PUT UNDER HIM;IT IS CLEAR THAT THIS DOES NOT INCLUDE GOD HIMSELF[note this distinction]

   WHO PUT EVERYTHING UNDER CHRIST  WHEN HE HAS DONE THIS....THEN THE SON HIMSELF WILL BE MADE SUBJECT TO HIM WHO PUT

  EVERYTHING UNDER HIM........SO THAT GOD MAY BE ALL IN ALL

[thinktank]

Even the Father calls His own Son God. But Jesus said Father is greater, for Father is before the Son.

1In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

2The same was in the beginning with God.

--John 1

I understand your reluctance on this. But it does not take anything from Jesus, but adds understanding, at least from what I have read from both the terminology used and the following scriptures.


Some people say he is called Son to give us understanding of a close relationship.
If Jesus was from everlasting then he would be called the brother of YAHWEH Father GOD LORD OF HOSTS. But

Colossians1
3We give thanks to God and the Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, praying always for you,


12Giving thanks unto the Father, which hath made us meet to be partakers of the inheritance of the saints in light:
13Who hath delivered us from the power of darkness, and hath translated us into the kingdom of his dear Son:
14In whom we have redemption through his blood, even the forgiveness of sins:
15Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:
16For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:
17And he is before all things, and by him all things consist.
18And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence.
19For it pleased the Father that in him should all fulness dwell;
20And, having made peace through the blood of his cross, by him to reconcile all things unto himself; by him, I say, whether they be things in earth, or things in heaven.


Hebrews 1:3
Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high:

1 Corinthians 8:6
But to us there is but one God, the Father, of whom are all things (Jesus the Only begotten SON), and we in him; and one Lord Jesus Christ, by whom are all things(The WORD by Him ALL things created), and we by him.

[Molly]

The heavens praise your wonders, O LORD, your faithfulness too, in the assembly of the holy ones.

--Psa 89:5


In the council of the holy ones God[el] is greatly feared; he is more awesome than all who surround him.
--Psa 89:7

[thinktank]

    they are ALL ONE TT.......the 'creature' is the whole creation...[Heavens included]  GOD IS ALL IN ALL

      the 'word of God' is Father's  Creative POWER. HE IS MAKING AN IMMORTAL FAMILY...our design is pattered after the Heavenly...

   in him was life,and that life was the light.....the children of the light.... they are like the angels..they are God's children

     In the beginning was the 'word".....let us make man in our image...but do not forget the previous 6 days of creation...


    All things are created by him and for Him[God].. the FATHER IS GREATER THAN I...the Father and I are 'one'

   1 Cor 15;26 the last enemy to be destroyed is death,for he has put everything under his feet.....


    NOW........WHEN IT SAYS THAT EVERYTHING HAS BEEN PUT UNDER HIM;IT IS CLEAR THAT THIS DOES NOT INCLUDE GOD HIMSELF[note this distinction]

   WHO PUT EVERYTHING UNDER CHRIST  WHEN HE HAS DONE THIS....THEN THE SON HIMSELF WILL BE MADE SUBJECT TO HIM WHO PUT

  EVERYTHING UNDER HIM........SO THAT GOD MAY BE ALL IN ALL

It pleased the Father to give All things to His Son.

The Son rules the universe. But one day the Father will commence rulership and the Son will be subject to His Father.


1 Corinthians 15:28
And when all things shall be subdued unto him, then shall the Son also himself be subject unto him that put all things under him, that God may be all in all.

We are patterned after the heavenly by being made into the image of His only begotten Son.

3Who hath delivered us from the power of darkness, and hath translated us into the kingdom of his dear Son

that we cry within ourselves a spirit of adoption, Abba Father.

[sheila]

 EXODUS 4;22

         THEN SAY TO PHAROAH,"THIS IS WHAT THE LORD SAYS; ISRAEL IS MY FIRSTBORN SON[including the twelve patr{iarchs}"

         AND I TOLD YOU LET MY SON GO,SO HE MAY WORSHIP ME"   BUT YOU REFUSED TO LET HIM GO,SO I WILL KILL YOUR FIRSTBORN SON"

[thinktank]

Could Israel be the first born human patterned after the Son?

Or perhaps the first born of the seed of Abraham, the seed of promise.

[sheila]

 
    Isaac-Jacob/ISRAEL....12 sons...12 tribes..twelve pearls,twelve foundations,twelve apostle's christ dwelt in..and were wittness of HIM

    Isaac=son of the free woman-

    Abraham as FATHER[symbol of GOD/Father of sands of sea and stars of heaven]  ISAAC   =SON OF FREE WOMAN..BEGETS_JACOB/ISRAEL 12 sons

[sheila]

   Isaac was a 'word of promise/seed] given to Sarah[free woman] when the word was given to her,she laughed

    Gen 21;6  Sarah said,"GOD HAS PREPARED LAUGHTER FOR ME"....Abraham tested..son as sacrifice...remarkable similarity

[sheila]

   when I think of a son of laughter....I think of the twinkling of the eye

    Pr 23;15,16      My son,if your heart is wise,then my heart will be glad,my inmost being will rejoice,when your lips speak what is right

[eaglesway]

IMO The Father of lights/spirits is the genative, original, spirit - Over all and Before all -Who alone dwells in unapproachable light

1 Tim 6:15

God, the blessed and only Ruler, the King of kings and Lord of lords, 16 who alone is immortal and who lives in unapproachable light, whom no one has seen or can see. To him be honor and might forever. Amen.

The fulness of the deity dwells in Jesus because "it pleased the Father to make all the fulness dwell in Him"

Whether as a trinity or as presiding over a council of lesser eloyhim or as Father and Son united in one spirit(the holy twoity) it really doesnt matter too much to me. I don't think it can be seen clearly on this side of the veil, but I think there is one generative Father of all - For from Him and through Him and too Him are all things-Includng Jesus the Messiah.......... "Let there be light" and the light shines in the darkness and the darkness cannot overcome it.

[micah7:9]

It was Jesus Christ who spoke  "Let there be light."

Joh 1:18  God no one hath ever seen; the only begotten Son, who is on the bosom of the Father--he did declare.

declared  to consider out (aloud), that is, rehearse, unfold: - declare, tell.

Joh 5:37  `And the Father who sent me Himself hath testified concerning me; ye have neither heard His voice at any time, nor His appearance have ye seen;

Col 1:17 and He is before all, and all has its cohesion in Him."

[eaglesway]

Ah, perhaps so, but we do see through a glass darkly, don't we? I hesitate to boast assured knowledge about things so well cloaked in mystery.

For HE(the Father) HAS PUT ALL THINGS IN SUBJECTION UNDER HIS(Jesus) FEET. But when He says, "All things are put in subjection," it is evident(manifest/obvious) that He(the Father) is excepted who put all things in subjection to Him(Jesus). When all things are subjected to Him(Jesus), then the Son Himself also will be subjected to the One(the Father) who subjected all things to Him(Jesus), so that God (the Father)may be all in all.
(1Co 15:27-28)

[eaglesway]

Did the Word speak itself into existence or did the Father speak the Word(Logos-expressed/manifest thought) into existence? Was the Word with God WITHIN God? Like a seed hanging on a tree maybe? Or like an egg within a womb? Was the Word before God? Was the Son before the Father? If God is light, was there light before God said, "Let there be light"? Was that spoken light a subset within the allness of God? Certainly God was Light before the Word spoke "Let there be light" into the chaos over which the Spirit brooded. Does "the beginning" mean at the first manifestation of creation or does it mean before time when there was only eternity? "Let there be light" established the first day, but it was not the first light.

I love a good mystery :o)

[micah7:9]

Did the Word speak itself into existence or did the Father speak the Word(Logos-expressed/manifest thought) into existence? Was the Word with God WITHIN God? Like a seed hanging on a tree maybe? Or like an egg within a womb? Was the Word before God? Was the Son before the Father? If God is light, was there light before God said, "Let there be light"? Was that spoken light a subset within the allness of God? Certainly God was Light before the Word spoke "Let there be light" into the chaos over which the Spirit brooded. Does "the beginning" mean at the first manifestation of creation or does it mean before time when there was only eternity? "Let there be light" established the first day, but it was not the first light.

I love a good mystery :o)

Joh 1:1  In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God;  God is but a title of a deity.
Joh 8:58  Jesus said to them, `Verily, verily, I say to you, Before Abraham's coming--I am;'
Joh 8:12  Again, therefore, Jesus spake to them, saying, `I am the light of the world;

Word..logos something said (including the thought); by implication a topic (subject of discourse), also reasoning (the mental faculty) or motive; by extension a computation; specifically
Joh 1:1  In the beginning was the Word
Gen 1:1  In the beginning...rê'shı̂yth the first, in place, time, order or rank (specifically a firstfruit): - beginning, chief (-est), first (-fruits, part, time), principal thing.
1Co 15:20 (Yet now Christ has been roused from among the dead, the Firstfruit of those who are reposing."

[eaglesway]

 Amen.....All glimpses of what was in the beginning, wonderful beautiful words. One day we will see what is before the beginning, from a place where time no longer factors into the equation. Our lines of interpretation weave in and around and near the truth I am sure, because it is the Fathers pleasure to give us the kingdom, but as Paul said, If any man thinks he knows anything, he knows not yet as he ought to know....... For now we know in part, then we shall kno as we are known. I can't wait! :o)

John 16:27
   For the Father himself loves you, because you have loved me, and have believed that I came out from God.

1 Corinthians 8:1-3
  Knowledge puffs up, but love builds up. And if any man thinks that he knows any thing, he knows nothing yet as he ought to know. But if any man loves God, the same is known of him.

[Beloved Servant]

Amen.
Only those that love God can know the love of God.
You are the One Who married Me.

[eaglesway]

"God is but a title of a deity"

IMO This is a semantical statement. In some places elohym has nothing to do with deity at all, meaning simply "mighty ones". It is in the context of the section of scripture that the meaning of an particular usage becomes clear. While many students and teachers make many confident assertions resulting from their take on the implications of things such as the use of plural form of Elohym used in Genesis, it could mean any of the following....

It could mean, Father Son and Holy Ghost and the assemblage of angels or watchers or other "mighty ones" who were created or in existence before the "foundation" of the kosmos.

It could be the Father Son and Holy Ghost(if you are trinitarian)

It could be the Father and the Son (if you are a binitarian)

It could be the Father and the aforemention assemblage of mornings stars and/or mighty ones (if you are a biblical unitarian)

It could be Jesus and the stars of the morning

Etc., Etc.,

I believe YHWH has left it shrouded in mystery for a reason. What a beautiful surprise of glory and understanding we we will awaken to! I don't claim to have any authoritative understanding. I do think that it is a great conversation and subject for study when taken in the context of the entire written voice, with respect, love, a sense of awe and humility. I have no respect, or use..... for the dogma of any brand of orthodoxy. But that's just me :o) What would I convince anyone of? Only that

1) God is love and that evryone who loves knows God and is known by God
2) Jesus, as the Only Begotten son, is the radiance of the Fathers glory and the living icon of His(YHWH) divine nature
3) That Jesus lives and is making intercession for all, especially those of the household of faith.
4) When time is fulfilled God will be All in All, having reconciled all things to Himself by the blood of the cross of His son Jesus, and All will be One in His glory

Beloved, we know not yet, what we shall be, but this we kno- when He appears we shall be like Him, for we shall see Him as He is

[Molly]

Ye Watchers and Ye Holy Ones

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JxKA6iydgbw

[Beloved Servant]

"God is but a title of a deity"

Who does that quote belong to, eaglesway?