Natural and Spiritual

[Cardinal]

What turns my crank is what is going on RIGHT NOW IN ME. This makes me sit up and take notice of every word, jot and tittle of Scripture if it is a writing from God to and about the making of me and all my fellow humans RIGHT NOW. cp

:cloud9: AMEN cp, that is EXACTLY it, the whole thing is a love letter, and an ordering of our steps back to where we started, which is one with Him from the foundation of the world. He told me one day, that He was literally TURNING US INSIDE OUT, as one would a garment. He is on the inside, but soon to be on the outside, as He turns us inside out. The Word that is Spirit, is both inside us, and what turns the "crank", LOL....Blessings....

PS. Let me take that a little farther. His garment had no seams, ie. no beginning and no end = no time = Spirit and everlasting life. Our garment has a beginning and an end = woven into the fabric of time, and therefore subject to death. Here is the principle for the glorified body.

[claypot]

I will go as far as to say that even a person by the name of Jesus Christ being crucified by the Romans on trumped up charges really means very little to me unless there is more to it than that. Even 2 people running around naked in a garden, while making a good story, does not excite me very much, even if I am a bastard because of them. What can I do about what they did way back then? I can repent you might say? Why, because of what 2 people did so long ago that it's almost unbelievable? Repent of what? Being born?

It just makes no sense unless the Bible is a work about each individual life and our corporate creation life and what is occuring RIGHT NOW within all of creation. The physical assists this communication but only assists, it is not the goal nor the purpose of creation.

cp

[claypot]

My frustration is I think I see what I see from the outside and not the inside. Jesus walked in the spirit world while walking in this world of flesh. He did get frustrated and angry which seemed to be fleshly oriented but of course it never mastered Him like it does me. The first step to walking in the spirit world, I suppose, is to 'see' it so maybe I'm close but I feel very much on the outside looking in. I have brief moments where I seem to be in the spirit but they are brief.

Wife is mad at me now so maybe that's why I feel so in the flesh. Hmmmmmmm. Discord with a spouse is very frustrating, very.

cp

[Tony N]

:cloud9: God's pattern is to deal with a firstfruits company in everything, so I think it is FIRST those that are going to be matured into being one with the Head, and then those that remain. Part of the confusion in the church IMO is in that they don't realize that there is a bridegroom company (those to be joined with the Head) AND a bride company ,ie. those He (in a many membered bridegroom company) is coming "back" for. They entered the ark in TWO'S, the foundation of the church is built upon the apostle and prophet, Head and Body, ie. two's are all over the place.

And notice the pattern that God always speaks to the man (Head/firstfruits/spirit) first, whereas as Satan always speaks to the woman (body/soul), bypassing the Head. Blessings....

They also entered the ark in SEVENS (Genesis 7)

[Cardinal]

 :cloud9: That they did..... :thumbsup:

[Tony N]

I will go as far as to say that even a person by the name of Jesus Christ being crucified by the Romans on trumped up charges really means very little to me unless there is more to it than that. Even 2 people running around naked in a garden, while making a good story, does not excite me very much, even if I am a bastard because of them. What can I do about what they did way back then? I can repent you might say? Why, because of what 2 people did so long ago that it's almost unbelievable? Repent of what? Being born?

It just makes no sense unless the Bible is a work about each individual life and our corporate creation life and what is occuring RIGHT NOW within all of creation. The physical assists this communication but only assists, it is not the goal nor the purpose of creation.

cp

But cp, we wouldn't know what the real application of Christ's death for all is without words. It was words, literal words, in the evangel which tell us all the good news that has come and will yet come out of Christ's obedience to the cross.

The real spiritual application of what Christ did on the cross is that it saves all mankind. Of course you know that. I'm just thinking out loud.

Two naked snot nosed brats in the garden got us into this mess. Without them we would have no need for a Saviour. Their sin was necessary and justified. There was nothing hyper spiritual about what they did. There was no hidden esoteric meaning as to what they did. There was no secret which can only be gained by belonging to a club to find out what they did. They sinned. They disobeyed God. In fact, the cards were stacked against them so they would sin. The real spiritual lesson comes into play though when God slays the lamb to clothe the errent couple. The types, shadows and figures in that primal scene against the backdrop of a luscious garden with crisp fresh air unspoiled by death and disease are wonderful indeed!

Well I'm done with my 2 cents worth for now.

Tony

[bobf]

:cloud9: Yes, Amen, bobf, He calls those things that are not as though they were. This is why the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy, because the root of the spirit of prophecy IS to call those things that are not as though they were. So in essence, He was/is prophesying over us those things that are not YET, as though they were, because the Spirit dwells outside of time, and so in the Spirit, THEY ARE ALREADY.

We, on the other hand, at least 2/3 of us (body and soul), dwell in time. Standing in faith then, (to take the "promised land" = the promises of God/on the MOUNTAIN TOPS) is simply placing one foot on what God has spoken to us by His Spirit (outside of time), BELIEVING, and the natural will then manifest what was spoken by the Spirit, because heaven/Spirit rules in the affairs of men. This is bringing heaven/Spirit and earth/flesh into agreement/covenant, because everything is out of course. Didn't He say, fear not, it is your Father's good pleasure to bring you the kingdom?

Planets "walk" in courses (science calls them orbits), so did the priests serve in their courses, remitting sins by the laying on of hands, and then slaughtering the "offending" flesh, which in essence, was putting "one world" back on course, which is walking in the Spirit/right relationship with God.

What we many times do not realize that we are the Word made flesh also. That sounds shocking on the surface of it, but if you know that ALL the waters below the firmament (heaven) ARE the Word (which is the Spirit of God) made flesh, it's not so hard to fathom. ALL creation is His mirror, He poured Himself into it to create it, and therefore it cannot BE (manifest His nature and glory which are His attributes) anything less than what He IS (in the Spirit). Man was made in His image, but so was the creation, only it is fragments of His image, put there to witness some aspect of His glory, thus ALL the heavens (this is the first of the 3 heaven's Paul spoke of) declare (or show openly) His glory.

Didn't intend to go here this morning, but oh well  :dontknow: :happygrin: Blessings....

Excellent thoughts Cardinal....  and I agree with you about the Word made flesh too.

[bobf]

Molly, here is my main and only real point and I see it in Cards, Nathans, Bobs, Taffs and so many more. It is this, some things of Scripture will take place and have and are taking place in the flesh, literally. To me though, it just doesn't matter what happened 10 years ago or 20 or 1000 or 2000. It just doesn't. It doesn't affect my life what might happen in the flesh or physical 10 years from now or 20 or 1000 or 2000. What turns my crank is what is going on RIGHT NOW IN ME. This makes me sit up and take notice of every word, jot and tittle of Scripture if it is a writing from God to and about the making of me and all my fellow humans RIGHT NOW.

cp

Amen.  It wouldn't surpise me to see all kinds of literal fulfillment, but it also wouldn't change my viewpoint in the least.

[bobf]

Two naked snot nosed brats in the garden got us into this mess. Without them we would have no need for a Saviour.

I think we each got ourselves into our own mess "...and so death spread to all men, because all sinned."

[Molly]

What turns my crank is what is going on RIGHT NOW IN ME. This makes me sit up and take notice of every word, jot and tittle of Scripture if it is a writing from God to and about the making of me and all my fellow humans RIGHT NOW. cp

:cloud9: AMEN cp, that is EXACTLY it, the whole thing is a love letter, and an ordering of our steps back to where we started, which is one with Him from the foundation of the world. He told me one day, that He was literally TURNING US INSIDE OUT, as one would a garment. He is on the inside, but soon to be on the outside, as He turns us inside out. The Word that is Spirit, is both inside us, and what turns the "crank", LOL....Blessings....

PS. Let me take that a little farther. His garment had no seams, ie. no beginning and no end = no time = Spirit and everlasting life. Our garment has a beginning and an end = woven into the fabric of time, and therefore subject to death. Here is the principle for the glorified body.

God's pattern is to deal with a firstfruits company in everything, so I think it is FIRST those that are going to be matured into being one with the Head, and then those that remain. Part of the confusion in the church IMO is in that they don't realize that there is a bridegroom company (those to be joined with the Head) AND a bride company ,ie. those He (in a many membered bridegroom company) is coming "back" for. They entered the ark in TWO'S, the foundation of the church is built upon the apostle and prophet, Head and Body, ie. two's are all over the place.

And notice the pattern that God always speaks to the man (Head/firstfruits/spirit) first, whereas as Satan always speaks to the woman (body/soul), bypassing the Head. Blessings....

Ah, yes, that's beautiful--the friend of the bridegroom.

John 3:29
He that hath the bride is the bridegroom: but the friend of the bridegroom, which standeth and heareth him, rejoiceth greatly because of the bridegroom's voice: this my joy therefore is fulfilled.

[claypot]

Two naked snot nosed brats in the garden got us into this mess. Without them we would have no need for a Saviour.

I think we each got ourselves into our own mess "...and so death spread to all men, because all sinned."

Bob, you spoke much to me in so few words. The idea that God is saying one guy is responsible for billions sinning has always struck me as wrong because even if everyone is saved in the end I always wonder about the suffering people go through. Can you imagine being Adam? I know a lot of people who would like to punch him in the schnoz and worse, yet if we see Adam as representing each person then there is no one individual to blame but all are to blame.

Now I hear Tony saying 'Then what about Jesus? Isn't it through just Him that all are saved?'

I would say that IMO Jesus was, is and always will be a real person yet more importantly to me He represents the Divine Saving Force (the Son of God) that is sent into me (world) to save me and more from myself.

cp

[Tony N]

Two naked snot nosed brats in the garden got us into this mess. Without them we would have no need for a Saviour.

I think we each got ourselves into our own mess "...and so death spread to all men, because all sinned."

Dear Bob, Scripture does not agree with that assumption.

Rom 5:12 Therefore, even as through one man sin entered into the world, and through sin death, and thus death passed through into all mankind, on which all sinned -

In other words, sin entered the world when Adam sinned. After Adam sinned death began its process in Adam. And since all mankind came from Adam, death passed through into all mankind. Based upon death passing through into all mankind, all sinned.

It does not say that "all sinned and due to that, death passed through into all mankind."

Paul adds to his reason:

Rom 5:13-14  for until law sin was in the world, yet sin is not being taken into account when there is no law;"  (14)  nevertheless death reigns from Adam unto Moses, over those also who do not sin in the likeness of the transgression of Adam, who is a type of Him Who is about to be."

Paul is saying that sin was not even being taken into account because the law of Moses was not given yet, nevertheless death reigns from Adam unto Moses (before the law was given).

So this proves that death did not come because everyone sins but due to Adam's transgression.

Death entered into Cain and Able the moment they were born. The death process was already working in them causeing them to sin.

(YLT)  because of this, even as through one man the sin did enter into the world, and through the sin the death; and thus to all men the death did pass through, for that all did sin;

Let's expand on the last part of the above verse:

"for that all did sin." Expanded: [and it is] for [that reason of death passing through] that all did sin.

[claypot]

Two naked snot nosed brats in the garden got us into this mess. Without them we would have no need for a Saviour.

I think we each got ourselves into our own mess "...and so death spread to all men, because all sinned."

Dear Bob, Scripture does not agree with that assumption.

Rom 5:12 Therefore, even as through one man sin entered into the world, and through sin death, and thus death passed through into all mankind, on which all sinned -

In other words, sin entered the world when Adam sinned. After Adam sinned death began its process in Adam. And since all mankind came from Adam, death passed through into all mankind. Based upon death passing through into all mankind, all sinned.

It does not say that "all sinned and due to that, death passed through into all mankind."

Paul adds to his reason:

Rom 5:13-14  for until law sin was in the world, yet sin is not being taken into account when there is no law;"  (14)  nevertheless death reigns from Adam unto Moses, over those also who do not sin in the likeness of the transgression of Adam, who is a type of Him Who is about to be."

Paul is saying that sin was not even being taken into account because the law of Moses was not given yet, nevertheless death reigns from Adam unto Moses (before the law was given).

So this proves that death did not come because everyone sins but due to Adam's transgression.

Death entered into Cain and Able the moment they were born. The death process was already working in them causeing them to sin.

(YLT)  because of this, even as through one man the sin did enter into the world, and through the sin the death; and thus to all men the death did pass through, for that all did sin;

Let's expand on the last part of the above verse:

"for that all did sin." Expanded: [and it is] for [that reason of death passing through] that all did sin.

Tony, you said....

It does not say that "all sinned and due to that, death passed through into all mankind."

But it does doesn't it. Are not all people included in Adam? Kind of like all the kindreds of earth in Abraham.

And I will bless them that bless you, and curse him that curseth you: and in you shall all families of the earth be blessed. gen12.3

cp

[Tony N]

cp, 1 Cor.15:22 says that "in Adam all are dying." It does not say that once one sins they get placed into Adam and then begin to die.

Likewise, in Romans 5:12 Paul is dealing with how it is that all mankind sin. The reason is because of death. Death passing through into all mankind causes all mankind to be sinners. It is not the other way around in which all sin and this causes all mankind to have death passed through into them due to what Adam did.

[Nathan]

cp, 1 Cor.15:22 says that "in Adam all are dying." It does not say that once one sins they get placed into Adam and then begin to die.

Likewise, in Romans 5:12 Paul is dealing with how it is that all mankind sin. The reason is because of death. Death passing through into all mankind causes all mankind to be sinners. It is not the other way around in which all sin and this causes all mankind to have death passed through into them due to what Adam did.

Man . .. this thread has been busy!  I hate to go home from work any more for fear that I'd miss getting in on something . .or getting something out of you guys.

Tony, our wonderful flatlander . . .(see http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BWyTxCsIXE4&feature=related) you do struggle much with us don't you. 

Did Jesus not tell Peter "flesh and blood has not taught you these things, but the Father has chosen to REVEAL them to you . . ."  Jesus doesn't care in the least on what you were taught about who he is . . .he wants to know what has the Father "revealed" to your spirit?  Does that sound like Peter needed to know a chapter and verse?

Time and time again, the pattern has always been, relationship births revelation, which natural works then manifest that revelation.  But yet, we in our limited thinking and yes, there is an antichrist in every one of us . . .it's called my carnal mind . .it's that which is at emnity against God.  Jesus said, you are either for him, or against him . . .now my mind convinces me I am for him . . .but my mind knows nothing about him . .only what another taught my mind to accept.  It's not "the" truth, but instead, it's my "image" of what truth is.

But then, as I grow, even though it may have been based on natural reasoning up to now, my intent has never been evil, but always striving to be pure . .. and in that intent, I grow.  And I come to the point where my maturity "outgrows" my intent.  Because good intentions, in and of themselves, do not beget righteousness.  God does not despise good intentions . .he matures them.  I go from a two dimensional being, into a three dimensional . . .but my mind doesn't have the capacity for that kind of transformation . . .my personality can only take me so far . . .this isn't an intellectual transformation, but a spiritual one.

So here we are.  On one side, you have those who've chosen to lay their mind down and let it die . . .so that they could then be led by their spirit . .and as a result, their mind resurrects, but in a different form.  And as we continue to grow, our mind is still carnal, but it can grow . . .much like any serpent, in order for it to get bigger . .more mature, it must first SHED THE SKIN that it currently is living in.

There is an antichrist in me . . .there is a serpent, there is a dragon, a devil, and satan . .they are all one and the same.  They are pictures of my mind, the mind of carnal man, and the characteristics of that man, the nature of that man . . .but in order to "see" this, there first must be a shedding of my natural reasoning. 

As cp, Cardinal, Bob, Zeek, Taf, Rose, who else has been such a blessing on this thread?  Ask any one of these guys "what schooling did you go through to learn what you know?"  And I guarentee you . .their answer will be the same as mine . . ."Flesh and blood has not taught me . .but the Father has revealed . . . ."

Everything is spiritual man.  everything.  Everything is literal to.  But . . .again .  . the literal piece isn't for us to apply to our literal generation . .it was to be taken literally for those to whom it was originally written to "then".  The reason you don't see these things Tony is because you've already chosen not to . .you've already decided that we're all wrong.  And your questions to us are not because you're interested in learning, but you're looking for a way to corner us and say HA!  YOU WERE WRONG! 

And as it's been explained . . . emphasizing the natural just isn't why we're doing what we're doing.  Taking what was written literally, and applying it literally, is not walking spiritually.  "that's" why there's such a chasm.  But as was also mention, feel free to continue to trip us up . . .because so many are getting so much more from this spiritual perspective because of your arguments, than they normally would if we just posted a revelation and moved on.

This is the meat of Truth . . . it needs to be chewed over and over before it can be swallowed, digested, and becomes a part of us. 

There is a literal temple that was destroyed.  1st dimension
We are all living stones, fitted together that forms the Temple of God 2nd dimension
What?  Know ye not that "you" are a temple of the holy ghost? 3rd dimension.

The word "temple" there that Paul uses, is the exact same Greek word that he uses in 2 Thesalonians when speaking of the abomination of desolation.  The throne is in "me".  Physically, it is beleived to be the pineal gland. . .but that's another thread.

[bobf]

Dear Bob, Scripture does not agree with that assumption.

Tony, it was not an assumption.  The translation I quoted says exactly what I said.  "...and so death spread to all men, because all sinned."

Let's expand on the last part of the above verse: "for that all did sin." Expanded: [and it is] for [that reason of death passing through] that all did sin.

In other words, sin entered the world when Adam sinned. After Adam sinned death began its process in Adam. And since all mankind came from Adam, death passed through into all mankind. Based upon death passing through into all mankind, all sinned.

That's one way to expand it.  Every translation I read that expands it, expands it as "because all sinned" or equivalent.

• NKJV Therefore, just as through one man sin entered the world, and death through sin, and thus death spread to all men, because all sinned
• NLT When Adam sinned, sin entered the entire human race. Adam's sin brought death, so death spread to everyone, for everyone sinned
• NIV Therefore, just as sin entered the world through one man, and death through sin, and in this way death came to all men, because all sinned–
• ESV Therefore, just as sin came into the world through one man, and death through sin, and so death spread to all men because all sinned
• NASB Therefore, just as through one man sin entered into the world, and death through sin, and so death spread to all men, because all sinned
• RSV Therefore as sin came into the world through one man and death through sin, and so death spread to all men because all men sinned
• HNV Therefore, as sin entered into the world through one man, and death through sin; and so death passed to all men, because all sinned

It does not say that "all sinned and due to that, death passed through into all mankind."

That is exactly what all the translations that expand it say.

Paul is saying that sin was not even being taken into account because the law of Moses was not given yet, nevertheless death reigns from Adam unto Moses (before the law was given).

Something is wrong with that theory Tony, God is taking sin into account here...

• Genesis 4:15 And the LORD said unto him, Therefore whosoever slayeth Cain, vengeance shall be taken on him sevenfold. And the LORD set a mark upon Cain, lest any finding him should kill him.

<br>

• Genesis 6:13 And God said unto Noah, The end of all flesh is come before me; for the earth is filled with violence through them; and, behold, I will destroy them with the earth.

<br>

• Genesis 9:5 And surely your blood of your lives will I require; at the hand of every beast will I require it, and at the hand of man; at the hand of every man's brother will I require the life of man. 6 Whoso sheddeth man's blood, by man shall his blood be shed: for in the image of God made he man.

<br>

• Genesis 18:20 And the LORD said, Because the cry of Sodom and Gomorrah is great, and because their sin is very grievous; 21 I will go down now, and see whether they have done altogether according to the cry of it, which is come unto me; and if not, I will know.

<br>

• Genesis 18:23 And Abraham drew near, and said, Wilt thou also destroy the righteous with the wicked? 24 Peradventure there be fifty righteous within the city: wilt thou also destroy and not spare the place for the fifty righteous that are therein? 25 That be far from thee to do after this manner, to slay the righteous with the wicked: and that the righteous should be as the wicked, that be far from thee: Shall not the Judge of all the earth do right? 26 And the LORD said, If I find in Sodom fifty righteous within the city, then I will spare all the place for their sakes.

<br>

• Genesis 38:10 And the thing which he did displeased the LORD: wherefore he slew him also.

I would say that Paul is saying that even though the law had not been explcitly spelled out until Moses, death STILL reigned through sin.

So this proves that death did not come because everyone sins but due to Adam's transgression.

For me, it would take alot more than what you presented to prove that the wages of death is sin.


Bob

[bobf]

As cp, Cardinal, Bob, Zeek, Taf, Rose, who else has been such a blessing on this thread?  Ask any one of these guys "what schooling did you go through to learn what you know?"  And I guarentee you . .their answer will be the same as mine . . ."Flesh and blood has not taught me . .but the Father has revealed . . . ."

I can attest to that.  I was raised on literalism.  Scriptures are literal unless not true to fact (bzzz circular logic).  For example "out of their bellies shall flow rivers of living waters" we knew THAT wasn't literal.  But that's about it.

It was in the process of trying to confirm for sure if UR was true, I was studying OT scriptures alot, suddenly WHAM...  I started seeing scriptures in a new light...   I actually had to go look for anyone who might be seeing things the same way, because I thought I was  :icon_joker: nutso  :icon_jokercolor: or something... LOL

[Nathan]

I really can't explain why I was so hungry for seeing things this way  . . . well . .actually, yes I can . . .my spirit was recognizing spiritual truth . . .but my mind had never heard these things before, nor could it understand "how" people could take the exact same verse that I had in my Bible . . .and have a completely different understanding of it.  And when they explained it . . . there would be a leaping in my womb . . .an excitement as understanding began to emerge.  I asked that same question to those who introduced it to me . . ."where did you go to learn this stuff?"  All I got from them was a smile. 

They told me later, it comes through experience.  They purposefully didn't answer my deluge of questions because they didn't want to shock me away from pursuing more.  Little did they know . . . wild horses couldn't keep me away at that point.  But for me, I was asking the questions out of hunger for more, not out of a hidden agenda to corner them and trip them up. 

I sure have enjoyed you're guy's conversations.

[Taffy]

As cp, Cardinal, Bob, Zeek, Taf, Rose, who else has been such a blessing on this thread?  Ask any one of these guys "what schooling did you go through to learn what you know?"  And I guarentee you . .their answer will be the same as mine . . ."Flesh and blood has not taught me . .but the Father has revealed . . . ."

I can attest to that.  I was raised on literalism.  Scriptures are literal unless not true to fact (bzzz circular logic).  For example "out of their bellies shall flow rivers of living waters" we knew THAT wasn't literal.  But that's about it.

It was in the process of trying to confirm for sure if UR was true, I was studying OT scriptures alot, suddenly WHAM...  I started seeing scriptures in a new light...   I actually had to go look for anyone who might be seeing things the same way, because I thought I was  :icon_joker: nutso  :icon_jokercolor: or something... LOL

 Yo Freako..Cards started a Que....want
to getin line, a Little joke we shared earlier :icon_flower:

What of your Gold is cankered....theres more thn a few in the New asya well Know :icon_flower:

[Taffy]

out of their bellies shall flow rivers of living waters

Gee I love that Scrip....the BIRTH of a New mind..HIS in US :icon_flower:  NEW LIFE, NEW beginnings :icon_flower: SPEAKING TRUTH :icon_flower:

[Nathan]

out of their bellies shall flow rivers of living waters

Gee I love that Scrip....the BIRTH of a New mind..HIS in US :icon_flower:

Hey Taf . . .why the belly?  Why not the mouth?  Why not the mind?

[Taffy]

whoops...Go check..i ammended it some while ya posted this...

the Belly\Bowels are  metaphors  for OUR mind Bro..... :HeartThrob:

[Nathan]

Well, golly Gee . . .if he meant my mind, why didn't he just say that?  Why all the secrecy? 

[Taffy]

heart\mind...the Bowles of mercy and compassion :icon_flower:

Pro 18:20 A man's belly shall be satisfied with the fruit of his mouth; [and] with the increase of his lips shall he be filled.  
Pro 20:27 The spirit of man [is] the candle of the LORD, searching all the inward parts of the belly
er 4:19 My bowels, my bowels! I am pained at my very heart; my heart maketh a noise in me; I cannot hold my peace, because thou hast heard, O my soul, the sound of the trumpet, the alarm of war.  
Jer 31:20 [Is] Ephraim my dear son? [is he] a pleasant child? for since I spake against him, I do earnestly remember him still: therefore my bowels are troubled for him; I will surely have mercy upon him, saith the LORD.  
Lam 1:20 Behold, O LORD; for I [am] in distress: my bowels are troubled; mine heart is turned within me; for I have grievously rebelled: abroad the sword bereaveth, at home [there is] as death

Phm 1:12 Whom I have sent again: thou therefore receive him, that is, mine own bowels:  
Phm 1:20 Yea, brother, let me have joy of thee in the Lord: refresh my bowels in the Lord.  
1Jo 3:17 But whoso hath this world's good, and seeth his brother have need, and shutteth up his bowels [of compassion] from him, how dwelleth the love of God in him?

[Taffy]

Well, golly Gee . . .if he meant my mind, why didn't he just say that?  Why all the secrecy? 

  :icon_flower:

mmm ,...Good question....never did figure that out  :icon_flower: