God created the universe and everything in it.
Does the Bible state that we are the only creation (except perhaps angles depending on your view what they are)
I just wondered if our ever existing God created before.
Is there anything in the Bible that gives a small hint on the above.
Hi ya WhiteWings
Doesnt' Apostle Paul state the at the name of Jesus every knee shall bow whether celestial, terrestrial and sub-terranean (whatever that is).
Also that there are principalities and powers among the celestials!
Just a thought!
Godbless
Nancy
Quote from: WhiteWings on September 05, 2009, 11:48:28 PM
God created the universe and everything in it.
Does the Bible state that we are the only creation (except perhaps angles depending on your view what they are)
I just wondered if our ever existing God created before.
Is there anything in the Bible that gives a small hint on the above.
I've wondered about this too. I don't really see any reason why He couldn't have. Also, I wouldn't be entirely surprised if we some day find "aliens" on another planet or something. Maybe I'll meet some aliens after I die. lol
Lots of aliens.
ETs alienated from the truth. :laughing7:
Quote from: Nancy on September 09, 2009, 11:07:19 PM
Also that there are principalities and powers among the celestials!
Agreed!
But that's about 'our' universe.
Are there more?
Did God create other universes before this one?
Personally I can't find anything that hints to that.
But neither I can find something that states it's not so.
I think there might be celestial "races", where the believers will take part in to help to reconcile them to God in the ages to come.
[we] "wrestle" [..against]
G3823
πάλη
palē
pal'-ay
From πάλλω pallō (to vibrate; another form for G906); wrestling: - + wrestle.
"principalities"
G746
ἀρχή
archē
ar-khay'
From G756; (properly abstract) a commencement, or (concrete) chief (in various applications of order, time, place or rank): - beginning, corner, (at the, the) first (estate), magistrate, power, principality, principle, rule.
"powers"
G1849
ἐξουσία
exousia
ex-oo-see'-ah
From G1832 (in the sense of ability); privilege, that is, (subjectively) force, capacity, competency, freedom, or (objectively) mastery (concretely magistrate, superhuman, potentate, token of control), delegated influence: - authority, jurisdiction, liberty, power, right, strength.
"rulers" [of the darkness of this age]
G2888
κοσμοκράτωρ
kosmokratōr
kos-mok-rat'-ore
From G2889 and G2902; a world ruler, an epithet of Satan: - ruler.
[spiritual wickedness in] "high" [places]
G2032
ἐπουράνιος
epouranios
ep-oo-ran'-ee-os
From G1909 and G3772; above the sky: - celestial, (in) heaven (-ly), high.
I don't think any of these are aliens.
Quote from: Molly on September 10, 2009, 01:03:40 AM
[we] "wrestle" [..against]
G3823
πάλη
palē
pal'-ay
From πάλλω pallō (to vibrate; another form for G906); wrestling: - + wrestle.
"principalities"
G746
ἀρχή
archē
ar-khay'
From G756; (properly abstract) a commencement, or (concrete) chief (in various applications of order, time, place or rank): - beginning, corner, (at the, the) first (estate), magistrate, power, principality, principle, rule.
"powers"
G1849
ἐξουσία
exousia
ex-oo-see'-ah
From G1832 (in the sense of ability); privilege, that is, (subjectively) force, capacity, competency, freedom, or (objectively) mastery (concretely magistrate, superhuman, potentate, token of control), delegated influence: - authority, jurisdiction, liberty, power, right, strength.
"rulers" [of the darkness of this age]
G2888
κοσμοκράτωρ
kosmokratōr
kos-mok-rat'-ore
From G2889 and G2902; a world ruler, an epithet of Satan: - ruler.
[spiritual wickedness in] "high" [places]
G2032
ἐπουράνιος
epouranios
ep-oo-ran'-ee-os
From G1909 and G3772; above the sky: - celestial, (in) heaven (-ly), high.
I don't think any of these are aliens.
Not to God, no they wouldn't be alien.
lol, Good point Paul.
And they would be created in His image.
To God, they are those we are to vibrate against--since that's what he tells us.
G906
βάλλω
ballō
bal'-lo
A primary verb; to throw (in various applications, more or less violent or intense): - arise, cast (out), X dung, lay, lie, pour, put (up), send, strike, throw (down), thrust. Compare G4496.
Quote from: Molly on September 10, 2009, 01:03:40 AM
[we] "wrestle" [..against]
G3823
πάλη
palē
pal'-ay
From πάλλω pallō (to vibrate; another form for G906); wrestling: - + wrestle.
"principalities"
G746
ἀρχή
archē
ar-khay'
From G756; (properly abstract) a commencement, or (concrete) chief (in various applications of order, time, place or rank): - beginning, corner, (at the, the) first (estate), magistrate, power, principality, principle, rule.
"powers"
G1849
ἐξουσία
exousia
ex-oo-see'-ah
From G1832 (in the sense of ability); privilege, that is, (subjectively) force, capacity, competency, freedom, or (objectively) mastery (concretely magistrate, superhuman, potentate, token of control), delegated influence: - authority, jurisdiction, liberty, power, right, strength.
"rulers" [of the darkness of this age]
G2888
κοσμοκράτωρ
kosmokratōr
kos-mok-rat'-ore
From G2889 and G2902; a world ruler, an epithet of Satan: - ruler.
[spiritual wickedness in] "high" [places]
G2032
ἐπουράνιος
epouranios
ep-oo-ran'-ee-os
From G1909 and G3772; above the sky: - celestial, (in) heaven (-ly), high.
I don't think any of these are aliens.
:cloud9: Me either, but I think they do a good job of impersonating them. Blessings....
Quote from: Molly on September 10, 2009, 04:14:43 PM
To God, they are those we are to vibrate against--since that's what he tells us.
G906
βάλλω
ballō
bal'-lo
A primary verb; to throw (in various applications, more or less violent or intense): - arise, cast (out), X dung, lay, lie, pour, put (up), send, strike, throw (down), thrust. Compare G4496.
Sure, that's probably what someone would use to justify intergalactic war.
\
One I specially remember was something like a sea-anenome that had a much smaller orange skinny spider like being that nervously skittered about through the waving papillae. To translate its speech resulted in something like a few words culled from an Ezra Pound poem. It wasn't known which of the symbiotic pair was the one with intelligence, or even if it was to be thought of like that. (What novel I read approximately that in I don't recall. I like it though.)
Quote from: Paul Hazelwood on September 12, 2009, 06:51:18 AM
Quote from: Molly on September 10, 2009, 04:14:43 PM
To God, they are those we are to vibrate against--since that's what he tells us.
G906
βάλλω
ballō
bal'-lo
A primary verb; to throw (in various applications, more or less violent or intense): - arise, cast (out), X dung, lay, lie, pour, put (up), send, strike, throw (down), thrust. Compare G4496.
Sure, that's probably what someone would use to justify intergalactic war.
\
yeah. It can get nasty.
Mark 16:17
And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues;
"cast out"G1544
ἐκβάλλω
ekballō
ek-bal'-lo
From G1537 and G906;
to eject (literally or figuratively): - bring forth,
cast (forth, out), drive (out), expel, leave, pluck (pull, take,
thrust) out, put forth (out), send away (forth, out).
"devils"G1140
δαιμόνιον
daimoniondahee-mon'-ee-on
Neuter of a derivative of G1142;
a daemonic being; by extension
a deity: - devil, god.
Yep, if their is life on other planets of course they are automatically devils cuz the byble sez. Such nonsense.
But still it's true Paul.
They fell of a planet north of us.
The so called fallen angels :pointlaugh:
Quote from: Paul Hazelwood on September 12, 2009, 04:04:05 PM
Yep, if their is life on other planets of course they are automatically devils cuz the byble sez. Such nonsense.
He made it all for us. That's what the Bible says.
We have dominion over everything.
14And God said, Let there be lights in the firmament of the heaven to divide the day from the night; and let them be
for signs, and for seasons, and for days, and years: 15And let them be for lights in the firmament of the heaven
to give light upon the earth: and it was so.
--Gen 1
Quote from: Molly on September 12, 2009, 04:16:37 PM
Quote from: Paul Hazelwood on September 12, 2009, 04:04:05 PM
Yep, if their is life on other planets of course they are automatically devils cuz the byble sez. Such nonsense.
He made it all for us. That's what the Bible says.
We have dominion over everything.
14And God said, Let there be lights in the firmament of the heaven to divide the day from the night; and let them be for signs, and for seasons, and for days, and years:
15And let them be for lights in the firmament of the heaven to give light upon the earth: and it was so.
--Gen 1
Oh I am sure Hitler had his passages too.
Quote from: WhiteWings on September 12, 2009, 04:06:10 PM
But still it's true Paul.
They fell of a planet north of us.
The so called fallen angels :pointlaugh:
LOL
QuoteOh I am sure Hitler had his passages too.
Hitler? Hitler was a demon worshipper. Check it out.
Quote from: Molly on September 12, 2009, 04:48:57 PM
QuoteOh I am sure Hitler had his passages too.
Hitler? Hitler was a demon worshipper. Check it out.
Whatever you need to say to feel better about exterminating life on another planet.
Quote from: Paul Hazelwood on September 12, 2009, 05:00:09 PM
Quote from: Molly on September 12, 2009, 04:48:57 PM
QuoteOh I am sure Hitler had his passages too.
Hitler? Hitler was a demon worshipper. Check it out.
Whatever you need to say to feel better about exterminating life on another planet.
LOL!
Show me life on another planet first.
Quote from: Molly on September 12, 2009, 05:01:56 PM
Quote from: Paul Hazelwood on September 12, 2009, 05:00:09 PM
Quote from: Molly on September 12, 2009, 04:48:57 PM
QuoteOh I am sure Hitler had his passages too.
Hitler? Hitler was a demon worshipper. Check it out.
Whatever you need to say to feel better about exterminating life on another planet.
LOL!
Show me life on another planet first.
No, you'll kill them all.
Quote from: Paul Hazelwood on September 12, 2009, 05:02:48 PM
Quote from: Molly on September 12, 2009, 05:01:56 PM
Quote from: Paul Hazelwood on September 12, 2009, 05:00:09 PM
Quote from: Molly on September 12, 2009, 04:48:57 PM
QuoteOh I am sure Hitler had his passages too.
Hitler? Hitler was a demon worshipper. Check it out.
Whatever you need to say to feel better about exterminating life on another planet.
LOL!
Show me life on another planet first.
No, you'll kill them all.
ok Keep them hidden, then. I can see them in the movies.
Good stuff guys , got my chuckle for the day LOL :icon_flower: HA HA !
The Image thingy , lots to ponder in that area , there is a True and there is a false Image
deciding factor being to me the positive and negative charge of each
causing Chaos to us ,but not to God because everything is in His Power
:thumbsup: rose
There's lots of inhabited worlds out there, with lots of people of every description you can think of, lots of descriptions you couldn't imagine, and there's also the demonic and angelic realms. There's more inhabited planets than there are that are uninhabited, but not all planets are within a single universe. There's an entire multiverse out there with many parallel worlds. And I'm not talking about the many worlds theory where given enough rolls of the dice then each world would have somebody in some universe somewhere. I'm not talking about that at all 'cause there is nothing that's random about the multiverse and it's not based on probability but on God's Divine counsel. There's Kings that'll walk by the light of New Jerusalem and bring their glory and honor into it eons after the Kingdoms of this world are become the Kingdoms of our Lord, of His Christ, and of His saints in practical experiential ways.
Do you have any scripture for that Martin [lots of inhabited worlds...with lots of people of every description you can think of, lots of descriptions you couldn't imagine...There's more inhabited planets than there are that are uninhabited...] ?
It's the first time I've heard you say something without at least five scriptural references...
Quote from: Molly on September 12, 2009, 05:10:32 PM
Quote from: Paul Hazelwood on September 12, 2009, 05:02:48 PM
Quote from: Molly on September 12, 2009, 05:01:56 PM
Quote from: Paul Hazelwood on September 12, 2009, 05:00:09 PM
Quote from: Molly on September 12, 2009, 04:48:57 PM
QuoteOh I am sure Hitler had his passages too.
Hitler? Hitler was a demon worshipper. Check it out.
Whatever you need to say to feel better about exterminating life on another planet.
LOL!
Show me life on another planet first.
No, you'll kill them all.
ok Keep them hidden, then. I can see them in the movies.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Soon I am going to the movies this next coming November, a show about the ending of the Mayan calendar on December 21, 2012.
There should be plenty of other worldly spirit beings chaoticly disrupting and intervening into the natural laws and affairs
of this world that can be seen at work in that movie, shall be keeping you posted,
first though we need to get past the spirits that are going to be lurking in the shadows on the approaching to Halloween.
Peace,
Fire Walker
Harold Camping, www.familyradio.com, is saying the rapture will occur on May 21, 2011!
Bring your own snacks. Due to budget restrictions, forced by the current economic climate, Family Radio will no longer offer meals during this flight.
I know that a lot of believers in aliens etc quote the passage where Jesus says "I have sheep from another fold, i must bring them also", (or something like that), to try to 'prove' alien life.
Im not sure what he means there.
But i will tell you this, ive seen a ufo. Close up as well.
:cloud9: I have too........several of them........they're called ET's.........sorry..........couldn't resist a bad pun........... :winkgrin: :laughing7: Blessings....
ok wait. A ufo is just an "unidentified flying object".
I've seen TONS of ufo's!
:happy3:
Now if you're talking "other worldly, not from this planet" spacecraft... that's a whole other thing. :OhNo:
by the way, it wouldn't surprise me if we were NOT the only creation.
But then again, it wouldn't surprise me if we were.
It would be a little scary if we were the only creation.
and it would be a little scary if we WEREN'T the only creation.
:laughing7: I can see it both ways, I guess.
Quote from: Cardinal on October 06, 2009, 03:42:17 AM
:cloud9: I have too........several of them........they're called ET's.........sorry..........couldn't resist a bad pun........... :winkgrin: :laughing7: Blessings....
Haha! Very good lol.
Quote from: sparrow on October 06, 2009, 04:14:37 AM
ok wait. A ufo is just an "unidentified flying object".
I've seen TONS of ufo's!
:happy3:
Now if you're talking "other worldly, not from this planet" spacecraft... that's a whole other thing. :OhNo:
Sparrow, yeh i know what your saying.
Ive seen thousands of faked videos and shoddy photos that show no detail etc claiming to be UFOS.
The ufo i saw and a good friend saw happened in winter about 7 years ago.
We were driving down a country lane and i saw somthing really strange in the sky. I asked my friend to stop the car, we both got out, we couldnt see the thing in the sky anymore. Just then my friend said -
"AHHH!!! Look above you!"
And there in the sky, a stone throw away was a massive craft, just sitting there in the sky, it was like it was stuck on the sky it wasnt moving an inch and made no sound at all. It was black, had lights circling around its base. I got a bit scared, thinking of those mad movies where the UFO sucks people inside it with some kind of beam and i told my friend, "Lets get out of here!"
So we jumped back in the car, and my friend drove of.
Just then my friend screamed again and told me
"That thing has just shot straight up into the sky".
I turned around and there was no sign of it.
Was it from another world?...I have NO idea, but ive never seen anything like it on earth before or since.
Just the sheer size of the universe makes me think it unlikely that we are truly the only life existing within it. Seems like an awful lot of wasted and unused space if there's nothing out there. :laughing7:
The way the craft i saw behaved made it seem very surreal, i for one believe ufos are not from another planet but rather another dimension. The thing i saw just didnt belong in the sky, it was too big, there was no sound of any motor running or anything, in fact no sound at all and it looked like it was frozen onto the sky because it was totally motionless. If we hadnt looked up when we did we wouldnt have even been aware that it had been there.
Ive no idea what it was, and im not even going to guess. Im just glad it didnt suck me on board!
UFO's are our own technology.
Quote from: Molly on October 06, 2009, 03:20:57 PM
UFO's are our own technology.
Yep.
Saucers too :winkgrin:
Quote from: WhiteWings on October 06, 2009, 03:26:57 PM
Quote from: Molly on October 06, 2009, 03:20:57 PM
UFO's are our own technology.
Yep.
Saucers too :winkgrin:
They come in all shapes and sizes now.
Rumor has it the natives of planet earth will be united by a staged invasion soon, and stumble and fall into a one world order. I hate when that happens. :mblush:
I love it when a plan comes together! :Sparkletooth:
Quote from: WhiteWings on October 06, 2009, 03:35:33 PM
I love it when a plan comes together! :Sparkletooth:
Yep. It's worth a try. You gotta give them credit for that.
But I predict we'll all be zipping around on our own little free energy machines soon, instead. The whisleblowers are going to come out of the woodwork and give this technology to its rightful owners--the people of the world.
All guesswork dear Molly.
You have a zero point there... :winkgrin:
Quote from: Molly on October 06, 2009, 03:31:59 PM
Quote from: WhiteWings on October 06, 2009, 03:26:57 PM
Quote from: Molly on October 06, 2009, 03:20:57 PM
UFO's are our own technology.
Yep.
Saucers too :winkgrin:
They come in all shapes and sizes now.
Rumor has it the natives of planet earth will be united by a staged invasion soon, and stumble and fall into a one world order. I hate when that happens. :mblush:
LOL
Quote from: Molly on October 06, 2009, 03:42:04 PM
Quote from: WhiteWings on October 06, 2009, 03:35:33 PM
I love it when a plan comes together! :Sparkletooth:
Yep. It's worth a try. You gotta give them credit for that.
But I predict we'll all be zipping around on our own little free energy machines soon, instead. The whisleblowers are going to come out of the woodwork and give this technology to its rightful owners--the people of the world.
Well, if your facts are sound, then what are you waiting for?
Quote from: Paul Hazelwood on October 06, 2009, 04:00:03 PM
Quote from: Molly on October 06, 2009, 03:42:04 PM
Quote from: WhiteWings on October 06, 2009, 03:35:33 PM
I love it when a plan comes together! :Sparkletooth:
Yep. It's worth a try. You gotta give them credit for that.
But I predict we'll all be zipping around on our own little free energy machines soon, instead. The whisleblowers are going to come out of the woodwork and give this technology to its rightful owners--the people of the world.
Well, if your facts are sound, then what are you waiting for?
The oil cartel to get outta the way?
You can't make money on free energy, alas!
Quote from: WhiteWings on October 06, 2009, 03:50:56 PM
All guesswork dear Molly.
You have a zero point there... :winkgrin:
LOL. I'm NO EINSTEIN, that's for sure.
Quote from: jesushandsarekindhands on October 06, 2009, 12:31:22 PM
The way the craft i saw behaved made it seem very surreal, i for one believe ufos are not from another planet but rather another dimension. The thing i saw just didnt belong in the sky, it was too big, there was no sound of any motor running or anything, in fact no sound at all and it looked like it was frozen onto the sky because it was totally motionless. If we hadnt looked up when we did we wouldnt have even been aware that it had been there.
Ive no idea what it was, and im not even going to guess. Im just glad it didnt suck me on board!
:cloud9: You guys didn't experience any missing time afterwards, did ya? :mshock: Blessings....
Quote from: Molly on October 06, 2009, 04:02:04 PM
Quote from: Paul Hazelwood on October 06, 2009, 04:00:03 PM
Quote from: Molly on October 06, 2009, 03:42:04 PM
Quote from: WhiteWings on October 06, 2009, 03:35:33 PM
I love it when a plan comes together! :Sparkletooth:
Yep. It's worth a try. You gotta give them credit for that.
But I predict we'll all be zipping around on our own little free energy machines soon, instead. The whisleblowers are going to come out of the woodwork and give this technology to its rightful owners--the people of the world.
Well, if your facts are sound, then what are you waiting for?
The oil cartel to get outta the way?
You can't make money on free energy, alas!
Why do you have to wait on that, if your facts are sound, blow the whistle yourself, tell the world and the problem will take care of itself.
The lack of knowledge is what is keeping them in power, you have the knowledge Molly, you say all this satuff is true and you argue that it is true a lot, so go tell the world.
Names, places, explain the science behind it, prove to the world it is true.
Who are the whistle blowers that are going to give this technology to the world and when is it going to happen.
You think the oil cartels are gonna move on their own, I don't believe you know what your talking about concerning free energy, so prove me wrong, tell the world rather than slinking around googling and posting weblinks, I for one am tired of paying for Gas in my car.
Don't cop out now.
Prove to the world your right, don't say the world won't listen because if this kind of thing is true, then it could not be stopped once proven to the world it exists.
Some at one point were against even driving a car at 60 mph, it was one of those barriers that was just sitting there daring someo9ne to break it.
Free energy is another one, break the barrier down already, enough with your excuses.
Quoteexplain the science behind it, prove to the world it is true.
People are already doing that, Paul. Unfortunately, they have to reinvent the wheel with no funding because the discoveries of Tesla have been suppressed and hidden for one hundred years.
As for the whistleblowers, it's up to them when they might consider risking their lives...
"Electric power is everywhere present in unlimited quantities and can drive world's machinery without the need of coal, oil, gas, or any other fuels." Nikola Tesla
Quote from: Molly on October 06, 2009, 03:42:04 PM
But I predict we'll all be zipping around on our own little free energy machines soon, instead. The whisleblowers are going to come out of the woodwork and give this technology to its rightful owners--the people of the world.
Well, you got me good, I actually thought you was serious. :mpardon:
Quote from: Paul Hazelwood on October 06, 2009, 05:49:50 PM
Quote from: Molly on October 06, 2009, 03:42:04 PM
But I predict we'll all be zipping around on our own little free energy machines soon, instead. The whisleblowers are going to come out of the woodwork and give this technology to its rightful owners--the people of the world.
Well, you got me good, I actually thought you was serious. :mpardon:
About my prediction? I am serious. It's my hope for the best possible outcome.
But first, good must triumph over evil.
Quote from: Molly on October 06, 2009, 06:27:35 PM
But first, good must triumph over evil.
What exactly do you mean by that Molly?
That the whistle blowers come out or that Jesus return?
Jesus has 7 trumpets. Does that count as a whistle? :winkgrin:
Quote from: Cardinal on October 06, 2009, 04:24:51 PM
Quote from: jesushandsarekindhands on October 06, 2009, 12:31:22 PM
The way the craft i saw behaved made it seem very surreal, i for one believe ufos are not from another planet but rather another dimension. The thing i saw just didnt belong in the sky, it was too big, there was no sound of any motor running or anything, in fact no sound at all and it looked like it was frozen onto the sky because it was totally motionless. If we hadnt looked up when we did we wouldnt have even been aware that it had been there.
Ive no idea what it was, and im not even going to guess. Im just glad it didnt suck me on board!
:cloud9: You guys didn't experience any missing time afterwards, did ya? :mshock: Blessings....
No Card there was no change in time.
The experience I had encouraged me do a lot of research on the subject and I quickly discovered how many people have seen them, including people who lived centuries ago when aircraft hadn't even been invented and of course many famous people not to mention astronomers, astronauts, pilots, etc etc.
Many people lost their jobs because they spoke out about what they had seen, which further adds to the mystery surrounding the subject.
There are UFO accounts from Christopher Columbus, Edmund Halley (Hallye's comet) who was an astronomer, geophysicist, mathematician, meteorologist, and physicist, so basically he knew quite a LOT about space and I'm sure he could tell the difference for example between a UFO and a cloud). (Lol)
William Shatner, Muhammad Ali, the president Jimmy Carter, Graham Washington, John Lennon etc etc.
I find the subject fascinating. But to people who have never seen a ufo its very easy for them to simply dismiss it, despite great evidence for the case if anyone would research the subject with an open mind.
Here's an interesting website on the subject.
http://www.ufoevidence.org/Cases/CaseView.asp?section=FamousPeople
Quote from: Molly on October 06, 2009, 06:27:35 PM
Quote from: Paul Hazelwood on October 06, 2009, 05:49:50 PM
Quote from: Molly on October 06, 2009, 03:42:04 PM
But I predict we'll all be zipping around on our own little free energy machines soon, instead. The whisleblowers are going to come out of the woodwork and give this technology to its rightful owners--the people of the world.
Well, you got me good, I actually thought you was serious. :mpardon:
About my prediction? I am serious. It's my hope for the best possible outcome.
But first, good must triumph over evil.
Well, your placing this scenario in the aspect of technology, much technology has came out while the ney sayers sat and scoffed.
Breaking the sound barrier was one of the big ones that was filled with fear, yet it was achieved, so this Good must triumph over Evil stuff along these lines doesn't seem to be as great a factor as your making it appear.
Free energy is another barrier that scientists would love to break, yet you post a note like you believe the technology is just sitting there waiting for something.
If you don't really know, it is ok for you to say so, if it is just assertions that you read online, that's ok too.
I'd love to have a free energy craft and I know that the majority opinion is how evil the oil companies are. Because of that the time is ripe for what you say you know to be revealed to the world. So what exactly do you know and why after your comment are you still waiting?
You could cause Good to Triumph over Evil simply by showing the world proof the technology exists. I'm actually excited that such a thing could happen. If it's true, don't hold back now.
Quote from: jesushandsarekindhands on October 06, 2009, 12:31:22 PM
The way the craft i saw behaved made it seem very surreal, i for one believe ufos are not from another planet but rather another dimension.
Planets in outer space are in another dimension. Outer space and other dimensions are equivalents, at least as far as the 10 to 26 that make up this universe that they have a reasonable amount of assurance of being there in Superstring theory. For the sci-fi buffs, the so-called "warp technology" has existed, at least finally "figured out" since 1997 on this planet. So, if there were anybody out there, not hard for others to have gotten at least that far as well with traveling those large distances. Other dimensions simply mean the ability to travel large distances within the dimensions that we currently call home. Nothing inherently demonic about that stuff being out there. Although there's the demonic out there as well, in the way that theology and exorcists would look at it. That's just one of the hazzards of this current Creation.
Quote from: PaulFree energy is another barrier that scientists would love to break, yet you post a note like you believe the technology is just sitting there waiting for something.
I'm just saying those craft everyone is seeing is our own technology. There is secret technology that is 100 or more years ahead of anything the public knows about. Imagine some native population which had never seen the 20th century suddenly seeing black hawk helicoptors and jet airplanes. What would they think? Beings from another dimension? Beings from another world? Gods?
So the first time we see anti-gravity electro-magnetic propulsion, we think we are seeing something from another dimension or aliens. Nothing can be that big and be that quiet and move that fast, right?
That's what the natives said about the f16. We have this technology right now.
If you are really interested in this, there's plenty of information around about it out there.
Tesla was stuck in a hotel room by the bankers while Einstein took the scientific world down a rathole.
Quote from: Molly on October 06, 2009, 10:32:52 PM
Quote from: PaulFree energy is another barrier that scientists would love to break, yet you post a note like you believe the technology is just sitting there waiting for something.
I'm just saying those craft everyone is seeing is our own technology. There is secret technology that is 100 or more years ahead of anything the public knows about. Imagine some native population which had never seen the 20th century suddenly seeing black hawk helicoptors and jet airplanes. What would they think? Beings from another dimension? Beings from another world? Gods?
So the first time we see anti-gravity electro-magnetic propulsion, we think we are seeing something from another dimension or aliens. Nothing can be that big and be that quiet and move that fast, right?
That's what the natives said about the f16. We have this technology right now.
If you are really interested in this, there's plenty of information around about it out there.
Tesla was stuck in a hotel room by the bankers while Einstein took the scientific world down a rathole.
Well, if your generalizing now, um ok. I was thinking pretty specific. A free energy vehicle is quite specific, I can search the web and find the goobers and their conspiracies. So what?
Quote from: Molly on October 06, 2009, 04:42:00 PM
Quoteexplain the science behind it, prove to the world it is true.
People are already doing that, Paul. Unfortunately, they have to reinvent the wheel with no funding because the discoveries of Tesla have been suppressed and hidden for one hundred years.
As for the whistleblowers, it's up to them when they might consider risking their lives...
"Electric power is everywhere present in unlimited quantities and can drive world's machinery without the need of coal, oil, gas, or any other fuels."
Nikola Tesla
Out of curiosity, how exactly would this "free energy" work?
I ask because the only ways I can see that working is for us to either create energy out of nothing or to create a mechanism where 100% of the energy inserted into a machine to make it run is preserved as energy that is capable of being used later, thereby not requiring any additional external infusion of energy. The former would violate the conservation of energy, which is the third most fundamental law in the entirety of physics, and the latter would violate the second law of thermodynamics. The overturning of either of those laws would be a discovery of such magnitude that whoever made it public would be hailed as the greatest scientist in at least the next century, if not the entire millennium.
Quote from: Paul Hazelwood on October 07, 2009, 02:08:47 AMI can search the web and find the goobers and their conspiracies. So what?
roflol -- yup! I had to be delivered of the dispensational premillenialist conspiracies, though I guess those conspiracies also go with amillenialism 'cause it's the same thing on "the devil's gonna get us" before Jesus steps in and completes all He told us to do, rather than sitting right where He's at 'til His Feet are on top of all things. And the Feet are in the Body rather than sticking out of the face. Amillenialism goes great with the annihilation theology many folks around here have had that you're annihilated before the resurrection, 'cause it's the defeatest attitude that death not only still reigns under Christ, but took on additional levels that it never had before 'cause otherwise, how did the witch of Endor come by who she was a medium for in the Bible?
And as to Molly's comments: governments aren't the only ones with advanced technology. Private corporations have it too. Private, independent, individuals have it as well. Most of it isn't hard to come by, but isn't sold thru regular channels 'cause most folks aren't going to spend what it takes to have that. So, you've got to do your research when you're in the market for a car that's liable to cost a couple million dollars, but is the last car you'd have to ever buy, if you lived longer than Methuselah. Many things are just cost prohibitive for you to be able to get it at the mall or at your local dealer. Really cool technologies have existed since around WWII.
QuoteMany things are just cost prohibitive for you to be able to get it at the mall or at your local dealer.
I don't know what you're referring to but people are building these free energy machines in their barns and basements now. They can't get patents. They can't get investors. They get threatened. Some are driven out of the country, some die under inauspicious circumstances [like the guy who was powering his car on water]. But they keep coming, I don't think they can keep a lid on it now. God is raising them up. We will have free energy in the not too distant future--and not the inefficient types like solar and wind. But, true free energy--what Tesla tried to give us 100 years ago and was stopped by the bankers.
And, the world will change overnight.
God bless these brave inventors.
37They were stoned, they were sawn asunder, were tempted, were slain with the sword: they wandered about in sheepskins and goatskins; being destitute, afflicted, tormented;
38(Of whom the world was not worthy:) they wandered in deserts, and in mountains, and in dens and caves of the earth.
39And these all, having obtained a good report through faith, received not the promise:
40God having provided some better thing for us, that they without us should not be made perfect.
--Heb 11
Quote from: martincisneros on October 07, 2009, 03:19:18 AMReally cool technologies have existed since around WWII.
And WW the
prototype original :thumbsup:
Quote from: Molly on October 07, 2009, 03:40:05 AM
I don't know what you're referring to but people are building these free energy machines in their barns and basements now. They can't get patents. They can't get investors. They get threatened. Some are driven out of the country, some die under inauspicious circumstances [like the guy who was powering his car on water]. But they keep coming, I don't think they can keep a lid on it now. God is raising them up. We will have free energy in the not too distant future--and not the inefficient types like solar and wind. But, true free energy--what Tesla tried to give us 100 years ago and was stopped by the bankers.
How will this free energy work?
Cars that run on water (which have been seen elsewhere, with inventors who are not dead) aren't anything approaching free energy, because the way they work is through water electrolysis to generate hydrogen, and then through the burning of that hydrogen to create energy that powers the car. This electrolysis requires an input of electrical energy, and given the ever-pervasive second law of thermodynamics, this energy input will inevitably be greater than the energy output. Far from free energy, this is actually an energy
deficit.
The reason why energy sources like coal and oil are viable for human use is because most of the energy input needed to create the fuel is provided by Earth, not by humans. For example, the creation of oil requires intense pressure and heat, but this is provided by the regions of Earth immediately under the surface. This means that the net energy gain for
humans is positive, even if in truth it is still the case that the total energy in is greater than the total energy out. And until someone overturns the second law of thermodynamics, this will always be the reality on the ground: for a fuel to be viable for human use, it must get at least some of the energy input for its creation from sources external to those of human origin, because otherwise its creation will require a larger energy input than the energy produced through its burning, thereby negating its entire purpose.
I don't want to be a downer or too much of a naysayer, but I always tend to get a little skeptical whenever I hear people speaking of free energy. There's no such thing as a free lunch in life, at least not that we've seen thus far.
I do certainly think there are some promising things on the horizon, though. For instance, there's this research at MIT (http://web.mit.edu/newsoffice/2008/oxygen-0731.html) into the storage of solar energy by mimicking what plants have been observed to do, thereby eliminating one of the main barriers to the widespread usage of solar energy. The sun is the biggest contributor of energy in the entire solar system, so if we let it do our work for us that would be a big gain. There's also the examination of hydrogen gas forming from sewage sludge (http://www.sciencedirect.com/science?_ob=ArticleURL&_udi=B6V3F-4538H45-1&_user=10&_rdoc=1&_fmt=&_orig=search&_sort=d&_docanchor=&view=c&_searchStrId=1037769328&_rerunOrigin=google&_acct=C000050221&_version=1&_urlVersion=0&_userid=10&md5=aa4860ea1536d8bad53a63c34859b616) and the possibility of putting it to practical use, as it too is a case where something else is doing the work for us. The possibility has also been raised of using nuclear power to produce electricity, and then using that electricity on water to run the electrolysis to form hydrogen - although the creation of power through fission does create some waste byproduct and is technically non-renewable, it is estimated that the sun would burn out before we ran out of fissionable material, and the amount of waste created in nuclear reactors is getting less every day.
Quote from: Paul Hazelwood on October 06, 2009, 07:28:00 PM
Quote from: Molly on October 06, 2009, 06:27:35 PM
Quote from: Paul Hazelwood on October 06, 2009, 05:49:50 PM
Quote from: Molly on October 06, 2009, 03:42:04 PM
But I predict we'll all be zipping around on our own little free energy machines soon, instead. The whisleblowers are going to come out of the woodwork and give this technology to its rightful owners--the people of the world.
Well, you got me good, I actually thought you was serious. :mpardon:
About my prediction? I am serious. It's my hope for the best possible outcome.
But first, good must triumph over evil.
Well, your placing this scenario in the aspect of technology, much technology has came out while the ney sayers sat and scoffed.
Breaking the sound barrier was one of the big ones that was filled with fear, yet it was achieved, so this Good must triumph over Evil stuff along these lines doesn't seem to be as great a factor as your making it appear.
Paul,
I a way you ask something that can't be answered without having the stuff yourself.
a] Free energy is availble for anyone => you won't ask this question because you already use the stuff.
b] Free energy is a hoax => lots of 'proof' on Google it works. Obviously we will never see it in real life.
c] Free energy does exist but is supressed => Real absolute proof on Google but because you still can buy it you don't believe in it.
To your example of breaking the sound barrier. Before that steam trains were proven impossible by science because at speeds greater than ?? m/h it was impossible to breath. Back in the dark ages was about everything special seen as witchcraft. Now assume that in the year 1100 some has invented a real airplane. It's not yet completly build but all math and small scale tests prove it should work. And as we know today it does work. It was quite hot news. Many people heard stuff from people that heard it from other people. They were called lunatic conspiracy people. But why didn't the inventor simply build that plane and prove the world he is right. Well church has determined that teh Bible says that it is forbidden for man to fly. The inventor is smart but but wealthy. Neither is he handy; so he need craftsmen that can do the actual building. But he can find neither of them because church simply controls things. The inventor dies at old age. No invention. Everyone things he was insane because he talked 40 years about a plane but has zero to show. But was he really insane?
And that's just the whole point of a conspiracy. Things leak out. Some chose only to believe 'Church' and some choose to believe the inventor/Google.
And after 50 years of debate still nothing is solved.
I agree with what Gab wrote. But OTOH impossible things of the past are now possible. Laws of nature were not exactly as they were assumed to be. Not long ago leeches and drilling holes in ones head was all that medical science had to show for. And now....
At the same time the combustion engines was invented. And right now we have... a combustion engine.
Surely the current generation of engines is vastly superior to the first prototype.
But still I wonder: Why not really diffrent things?
Quote from: gab
How will this free energy work?
This is how it works--
"Electric power is
everywhere present in unlimited quantities and can drive world's machinery without the need of coal, oil, gas, or any other fuels."
--Nikola Tesla
The idea which was being explored in the 19th century before Einstein took science on a wild goose chase is that we are not living within a dead airspace but we are living in a sea of electro-magnetic energy, which they called the ether. How do you get a huge effect of energy output from a small input? Modern science says a perpetual motion machine is impossible because it assumes we are dealing with a closed system. But these scientists have learned how to tap into an open system of an abundant energy source. Tesla was literally pulling huge quantities of electrical energy out of the air.
You can see how primitive our current science is by its lack of understanding of gravitational effects. Maxwell had set the stage, and others were just starting the exploration of electro-magnetic forces, when Einstein came along with his jury rigged and plagiarized theories which are really part of an older philosophy, and not true science. If the powers that be didn't actually commission this high school drop out patent clerk to do this [along with his mathematician wife who probably did all the mathematics, he gave her his nobel prize money after they divorced], then they certainly took great advantage of it by using it to trample on the scientists who were doing the real work in science at the time. When they tried to give him the nobel prize for relativity, the scientists of the time raised such a hue and cry, they could not do it. It's not his theory, after all--simple as that.
Thus, whole generations of scientists were taught that certain things were impossible, and we were sentenced to 100 years of fossil fuel ingestion which made a small group of people richer than Creosus. If you can start to see science as just another means of political and economic control, you will understand. So we now teach new generations of students that we are living in a world of scarcity [instead of the world of abundance that we know is the hallmark of our God] and certain things just cannot be done. We teach them that a 'perpetual motion' machine is impossible while we are sitting on one. It's hilariously funny. I'll stop laughing when the earth stops revolving around the sun.
The name Einstein has become synonymous with the word, 'genius'. I look forward to the day when the name is synonymous with, 'the joke's on you.'
The earth is not a perpetual motion machine, if it was, then its rotational speed would not be gradually slowing down over time and it's internal core temperature cooling off.
So if someone says they have a great theory for an invention can't even understand what perpetual motion actually is, then it is no wonder they cannot get funding.
QuoteThe earth is not a perpetual motion machine,
If you can use the same principles that keep the earth revolving around the sun to run your car, you, quite frankly, won't care that it only works aeoniously--i.e. forever.
Quote from: Molly on October 07, 2009, 04:24:06 PM
QuoteThe earth is not a perpetual motion machine,
If you can use the same principles that keep the earth revolving around the sun to run your car, you, quite frankly, won't care that it only works aeoniously--i.e. forever.
And what would those principals be that are not already in use?
Quote from: Molly on October 07, 2009, 02:17:33 PM
"Electric power is everywhere present in unlimited quantities and can drive world's machinery without the need of coal, oil, gas, or any other fuels."
--Nikola Tesla
The "problem" with Tesla was that he wanted to make electrical power available for all people on earth for FREE...the powers that be do not subscribe to that concept...they must control all resources and charge you for it
Quote from: Paul Hazelwood on October 07, 2009, 04:39:14 PM
Quote from: Molly on October 07, 2009, 04:24:06 PM
QuoteThe earth is not a perpetual motion machine,
If you can use the same principles that keep the earth revolving around the sun to run your car, you, quite frankly, won't care that it only works aeoniously--i.e. forever.
And what would those principals be that are not already in use?
That's not already in use?
What's in use is that you pay some private entity 2,3,4,5, 20, or 40 dollars a gallon for a fuel to run your car or boiler which they totally control. That's what's in use.
Almost anything else [including back in the day when every farmer was distilling alcohol from his crops for engine fuel until the rockefellar interests made such practice illegal with the 18th amendment--prohibition--to give himself a monopoly on engine fuel] would be preferable.
I'm beginning to think I'm wasting my time lol.
Quote from: Molly on October 07, 2009, 05:23:39 PM
Quote from: Paul Hazelwood on October 07, 2009, 04:39:14 PM
Quote from: Molly on October 07, 2009, 04:24:06 PM
QuoteThe earth is not a perpetual motion machine,
If you can use the same principles that keep the earth revolving around the sun to run your car, you, quite frankly, won't care that it only works aeoniously--i.e. forever.
And what would those principals be that are not already in use?
That's not already in use?
What's in use is that you pay some private entity 2,3,4,5, 20, or 40 dollars a gallon for a fuel to run your car or boiler which they totally control. That's what's in use.
Almost anything else [including back in the day when every farmer was distilling alcohol from his crops for engine fuel until the rockefellar interests made such practice illegal with the 18th amendment--prohibition--to give himself a monopoly on engine fuel] would be preferable.
I seem to think I'm wasting my time lol.
Yeah, you actually are wasting your time, simply because your greivances doesn't change anything.
If you are to believe some inventor has some secret and makes an untrue statement to support his claim then you do not understand the inherant problem.
His appeals will only affect those who do not see his deception contained in the very statement he made.
If you say the earth is a perpetual motion machine, then there is no way that you have invented one.
Quote...then you do not understand the inherant problem.
The inherent problem is us--all of us--who believe every piece of garbage this sick system feeds us, who do not trust our own God, who do not try to gain knowledge for ourselves instead of relying on an education system which is nothing more than propaganda, who care about no one except ourselves, who do not value our own freedom, liberty, independence, or the common sense that the good Lord gave us--that's the problem.
'We have met the enemy and he is us.'
--Pogo
John 10:10
The thief cometh not, but for to steal, and to kill, and to destroy: I am come that they might have life, and that they might have it more abundantly.
Quote from: Molly on October 07, 2009, 05:51:10 PM
Quote...then you do not understand the inherant problem.
The inherent problem is us--all of us--who believe every piece of garbage this sick system feeds us, who do not trust our own God, who do not try to gain knowledge for ourselves instead of relying on an education system which is nothing more than propaganda, who care about no one except ourselves, who do not value our own freedom, liberty, independence, or the common sense that the good Lord gave us--that's the problem.
'We have met the enemy and he is us.'
--Pogo
John 10:10
The thief cometh not, but for to steal, and to kill, and to destroy: I am come that they might have life, and that they might have it more abundantly.
Well, I guess it is a matter of perspective, I do not swallow everything fed to me.
I know the problem with the oil company saying production costs more so that's why the increase in gas prices and then making record profits. The profits are not what bothered me it was the lie that is observed when you realize that record profits is not the additional costs being absorbed by increased production costs.
So I did not believe that lie, but I still need to put gas in my vehicle to drive it.
I also do not believe the lie that says the earth is a perpetual motion machine therefore the guy saying this has some kind of special theory on perpetual motion.
So, if you swallowed that lie, then it certainly is not me with the problem.
Among other things, tapping into the electro-magnetic field surrounding Earth has already been mentioned and we've heard the comment in various forms, that lightening from an average thunderstorm over the city of New York releases enough energy to provide all the electrical needs of New York for about two years.
The only power we lack is brain power.
Quote from: Molly on October 07, 2009, 02:17:33 PM
Quote from: gab
How will this free energy work?
This is how it works--
"Electric power is everywhere present in unlimited quantities and can drive world's machinery without the need of coal, oil, gas, or any other fuels."
--Nikola Tesla
The idea which was being explored in the 19th century before Einstein took science on a wild goose chase is that we are not living within a dead airspace but we are living in a sea of electro-magnetic energy, which they called the ether. How do you get a huge effect of energy output from a small input? Modern science says a perpetual motion machine is impossible because it assumes we are dealing with a closed system. But these scientists have learned how to tap into an open system of an abundant energy source. Tesla was literally pulling huge quantities of electrical energy out of the air.
But that doesn't even approach explaining anything about how it
works. You speak so authoritatively that this is the case and that this will be a reality, but you can't seem to actually tell me how it
works. I mean no offense by this, but I kind of get the sense that you don't understand how the magnetic induction of electrical current works. I won't go into the precise scientific details, but electrical current can only be induced through a magnetic field that changes with respect to the surface area of the object into which an electrical current is induced. You can't just hold up a wire and, hey presto, get an electrical current in it just from the presence of a magnetic field; the field must be constantly changing.
Quote from: Molly on October 07, 2009, 02:17:33 PM
You can see how primitive our current science is by its lack of understanding of gravitational effects. Maxwell had set the stage, and others were just starting the exploration of electro-magnetic forces, when Einstein came along with his jury rigged and plagiarized theories which are really part of an older philosophy, and not true science. If the powers that be didn't actually commission this high school drop out patent clerk to do this [along with his mathematician wife who probably did all the mathematics, he gave her his nobel prize money after they divorced], then they certainly took great advantage of it by using it to trample on the scientists who were doing the real work in science at the time. When they tried to give him the nobel prize for relativity, the scientists of the time raised such a hue and cry, they could not do it. It's not his theory, after all--simple as that.
No offense, but... I don't even know what you're saying here. Einstein's theories were "part of an older philosophy"? Einstein's theories were so revolutionary and new that he is now regarded as the father of modern physics. Yes, there was special and general relativity - both of which have stood the test of time and independent tests of their predictions - but the extent of his contributions are much more wide-ranging than that, including wave-particle duality, cosmology, and the behavior of an entire class of particles called bosons. He predicted that light should bend around objects with large gravitational force, and it does. He predicted that certain particle phenomena should be seen at very low temperatures, and they do. He introduced the concept of a photon, which has proven accurate. He is lauded as the greatest scientific mind of the twentieth century by pretty much everyone.
Quote from: Molly on October 07, 2009, 02:17:33 PM
Thus, whole generations of scientists were taught that certain things were impossible, and we were sentenced to 100 years of fossil fuel ingestion which made a small group of people richer than Creosus. If you can start to see science as just another means of political and economic control, you will understand. So we now teach new generations of students that we are living in a world of scarcity [instead of the world of abundance that we know is the hallmark of our God] and certain things just cannot be done. We teach them that a 'perpetual motion' machine is impossible while we are sitting on one. It's hilariously funny. I'll stop laughing when the earth stops revolving around the sun.
The name Einstein has become synonymous with the word, 'genius'. I look forward to the day when the name is synonymous with, 'the joke's on you.'
But perpetual motion
is impossible, at least with what we know now. The second law of thermodynamics is one of the most fundamental laws there is. It's difficult to explain in simple terms precisely why this is the case, but it suffices to say that it fundamentally comes from the statistical behavior of particles and the improbableness of uniformity at a large scale. This isn't "scientists keeping the masses down"; this is just a consequence of everything we know to date about the behavior of fundamental particles. Even if it were the case that you could derive electricity from thin air with the help of the magnetic field, it would still be the case that any transfer of energy will result in at least some of that energy being lost to entropy. You can certainly have a source of energy that will outlive the Earth, but that's not perpetual motion.
Quote from: reFORMer on October 07, 2009, 07:22:37 PM
Among other things, tapping into the electro-magnetic field surrounding Earth has already been mentioned and we've heard the comment in various forms, that lightening from an average thunderstorm over the city of New York releases enough energy to provide all the electrical needs of New York for about two years.
The only power we lack is brain power.
Saying that lightning from an average thunderstorm releases that much energy isn't really telling the whole story. The sun releases enough energy to power the entire world. That doesn't mean we can do anything with it. Turning raw energy into useful and reliable energy is no small feat, although there is research underway as I said to utilize the energy of the sun in the way that plants do, which I think is quite promising.
QuoteBut perpetual motion is impossible, at least with what we know now.
QuoteI also do not believe the lie that says the earth is a perpetual motion machine therefore the guy saying this has some kind of special theory on perpetual motion.
So, if you swallowed that lie, then it certainly is not me with the problem.
It's attitudes like this that are going to soon make America a third world country. You want to nit pick about the phrase perpetual motion? I'll use the phrase overunity instead. You say that the motion of the planets is not perpetual motion enough for you? It is an example of a mechanical system that has been and will be running forever, especially from your points of view.
I've just decided that I will not buy another car until it contains this new technology with a total non reliance on oil products. I don't expect to have to wait that long. But I will probably have to do something I vowed never to do--buy a Japanese car.Kohei Minato and the Japan Magnetic Fan Company: a maverick inventor's breakthrough electric motor uses permanent magnets to make power -- and has investors salivating
by John Dodd
When WE first got the call from an excited colleague that he'd just seen the most amazing invention -- a magnetic motor that consumed almost no electricity -- we were so skeptical that we declined an invitation to go see it. If the technology was so good, we thought, how come they didn't have any customers yet?
We forgot about the invitation and the company until several months later, when our friend called again.
"OK," he said. "They've just sold 40,000 units to a major convenience store chain. Now will you see it?"
In Japan, no one pays for 40,000 convenience store cooling fans without being reasonably sure that they are going to work.
...
Looking carefully at the rotor, we see that it has over 16 magnets embedded on a slant -- apparently to make Minato's machines work, the positioning and angle of the magnets is critical. After she kicks the wheel into life, it keeps spinning, proving at least that the design doesn't suffer from magnetic lockup.
She then moves us to the next device, a weighty machine connected to a tiny battery. Apparently the load on the machine is a 35kg rotor, which could easily be used in a washing machine. After she flicks the switch, the huge rotor spins at over 1,500 rpms effortlessly and silently. Meters show the power in and power out.
Suddenly, a power source of 16 watts or so is driving a device that should be drawing at least 200 to 300 watts. Nobue explains to us that this and all the other devices only use electrical power for the two electromagnetic stators at either side of each rotor, which are used to kick the rotor past its lockup point then on to the next arc of magnets. Apparently the angle and spacing of the magnets is such that
once the rotor is moving, repulsion between the stators and the rotor poles keeps the rotor moving smoothly in a counterclockwise direction. Either way, it's impressive.
Next we move to a unit with its motor connected to a generator. What we see is striking. The meters showed an input to the stator electromagnets of approximately 1.8 volts and 150mA input, and from the generator, 9.144 volts and 192mA output. 1.8 x 0.15 x 2 = 540mW input and 9.144 x 0.192 = 1.755W out.
.....
Minato's motors consume just 20 percent or less of the power of conventional motors with the same torque and horse power. They run cool to the touch and produce almost no acoustic or electrical noise. They are significantly safer and cheaper (in terms of power consumed), and they are sounder environmentally.
The implications are enormous. In the US alone, almost 55 percent of the nation's electricity is consumed by electric motors. While most factory operators buy the cheapest motors possible, they are steadily being educated by bodies like NEMA (National Electrical Manufacturers Association) that the costs of running a motor over a typical 20-year lifespan comprise a purchase price of just 3 percent of the total, and electricity costs of 97 percent. It is not unusual for a $2,000 motor to consume $80,000 of electricity (at a price of .06 cents per kilowatt hour).
.....
Minato's invention and its ability to use remarkably less power and run without heat or noise make it perfect for home appliances, personal computers, cellphones (a miniature generator is in the works) and other consumer products.
The magnetic motor will be cheaper than a standard motor to make, as the rotor and stator assemblies can be set into plastic housings, due to the fact that the system creates very little heat. Further, with the motor's energy efficiency, it will be well suited for any application where a motor has limited energy to drive it. While development is still focused on replacing existing devices, Minato says that his motor has sufficient torque to power a vehicle.
With the help of magnetic propulsion, it is feasible to attach a generator to the motor and produce more electric power than was put into the device.
Minato says that average efficiency on his motors is about 330 percent. Mention of Over Unity devices in many scientific circles will draw icy skepticism. But if you can accept the idea that Minato's device is able to create motion and torque through its unique, sustainable permanent magnet propulsion system, then it makes sense that
he is able to get more out of the unit than he puts in in terms of elctrical power. Indeed, if the device can produce a surplus of power for longer periods, every household in the land will want one.
http://www.japaninc.com/article.php?articleID=1302
Quote from: Molly on October 08, 2009, 06:56:08 AM
It's attitudes like this that are going to soon make America a third world country. You want to nit pick about the phrase perpetual motion? I'll use the phrase overunity instead. You say that the motion of the planets is not perpetual motion enough for you? It is an example of a mechanical system that has been and will be running forever, especially from your points of view.
Nit picking over a lie? Nope.
Quote from: Paul Hazelwood on October 08, 2009, 07:36:45 AM
Quote from: Molly on October 08, 2009, 06:56:08 AM
It's attitudes like this that are going to soon make America a third world country. You want to nit pick about the phrase perpetual motion? I'll use the phrase overunity instead. You say that the motion of the planets is not perpetual motion enough for you? It is an example of a mechanical system that has been and will be running forever, especially from your points of view.
Nit picking over a lie? Nope.
Get back to me with your proof or relevance when the solar system stops moving.
Quote from: GabNo offense, but... I don't even know what you're saying here. Einstein's theories were "part of an older philosophy"? Einstein's theories were so revolutionary and new that he is now regarded as the father of modern physics.
If Einstein's theory of relativity was so new and revolutionary, why didn't he receive the Nobel prize for it? Ans: the scientific community of the time would not allow it because it was neither new nor revolutionary.
Here's what the inventor of A/C [alternating current] electricity --that miracle that happens every time you flick the light switch in your house--has to say about Einstein--and I'm sure he was being more polite than he would have preferred--
Today's scientists have substituted mathematics for experiments and they wander off through equation after equation and eventually build a structure which has no relation to reality.
The theory of relativity is like a beggar clothed in purple whom ignorant people take for a king - its exponents are brilliant men but they are metaphysicists not scientists.--Nikola Tesla NY Times 7/11/1935
Quote from: reFORMer on October 07, 2009, 07:22:37 PM
Among other things, tapping into the electro-magnetic field surrounding Earth has already been mentioned and we've heard the comment in various forms, that lightening from an average thunderstorm over the city of New York releases enough energy to provide all the electrical needs of New York for about two years.
The only power we lack is brain power.
Throughout space there is energy - It is a mere question of time when men will succeed in attaching their machinery to the very wheelwork (cosmic wheel) of nature. So astounding are the facts in this connection that it would seem as though the Creator himself had electrically designed this planet.
--Nikola Tesla
Quote from: Molly on October 08, 2009, 06:56:08 AM
It's attitudes like this that are going to soon make America a third world country. You want to nit pick about the phrase perpetual motion? I'll use the phrase overunity instead. You say that the motion of the planets is not perpetual motion enough for you? It is an example of a mechanical system that has been and will be running forever, especially from your points of view.
It's not a nitpick. It's a fundamental distinction. Perpetual motion describes a machine that may be started and which will then do work forever without ever requiring any additional energy input. A machine that requires input is by definition not in perpetual motion, even if there is a limitless supply of fuel. The phrase "do work" refers to the situation where a transfer of energy occurs, such as lifting up a weight (the potential energy of the weight increases, and this energy comes from the machine lifting it up). The motion of the planets is not "perpetual motion" as the term is understood in terms of a machine that does work; the planets are not doing any work. In this respect, the phrase "perpetual motion" is actually a bit of a misnomer; a better term might be "perpetual work".
What I want is for people to understand what can and cannot be done. There are many forms of resources that are vastly more abundant than fossil fuels. I absolutely think it's fantastic the work that people are doing to tap into these forms of energy, as they are less polluting than fossil fuels as well. I just want people to understand the science behind it, because I see a lot of people acting as though if we just tried hard enough we can create something that creates more energy than it requires for its functioning. We can't. This is an obstacle to be worked around, not overcome.
As the inventor in your article says, he has not broken the second law of thermodynamics; it is simply the case that the energy output comes from a source other than man-made electrical power. If his invention succeeds, all the more power to him. I think you are incorrectly taking my words as if to say that I don't want people to succeed, whereas I am not; I am merely stating limitations that must be contended with. If I wanted to climb a cliff, you would surely think it rather silly if I decided to do so by attempting to jump up and then hoping that I defy gravity. Attempting to build a machine that outputs more energy than it requires for functioning is on the same level. We have to harness nature to do some of the work for us if we want to receive a net energy gain from our perspective from a machine.
Quote from: Molly on October 08, 2009, 08:17:08 AM
If Einstein's theory of relativity was so new and revolutionary, why didn't he receive the Nobel prize for it? Ans: the scientific community of the time would not allow it because it was neither new nor revolutionary.
Er, he did, in 1921, at which time he received a blanket Nobel Prize for all of his contributions to theoretical physics. Although his theory of relativity is now his best-known work, he also contributed many other things, as I said, such as work on the photoelectric effect (which was singled out as an especially impactful piece of work). His theory of relativity was met with controversy at its introduction not because it was nothing new, but because it was
so new that people thought he was off his rocker. He singlehandedly took the hallowed scientific assumption of absolutes, in place ever since Newton put together his laws of motion centuries earlier, and demolished it in one fell swoop.
If you want vindication for his theory of relativity and of the equivalence of matter and energy, look no further than the fission of any atom in a nuclear power plant, an event which would not be possible were it not for Einstein's work. Einstein's major work has all been vindicated through repeatable scientific experiments that proved the predictions of his theories to be correct. For example, light has been observed to bend around large celestial objects with a high gravitational force. Score one for general relativity. High-speed short-lived particles have been observed to have a much longer lifespan than they ought to using Newtonian mechanics. Score one for special relativity. He has gained his status as an unparalleled genius precisely because his contributions and theories have been found to withstand scientific rigor, and consequently laid the groundwork for much of the future developments in physics in the 20th century.
Quote from: Molly on October 08, 2009, 08:17:08 AM
Here's what the inventor of A/C [alternating current] electricity --that miracle that happens every time you flick the light switch in your house--has to say about Einstein--and I'm sure he was being more polite than he would have preferred--
Today's scientists have substituted mathematics for experiments and they wander off through equation after equation and eventually build a structure which has no relation to reality.
The theory of relativity is like a beggar clothed in purple whom ignorant people take for a king - its exponents are brilliant men but they are metaphysicists not scientists.
--Nikola Tesla NY Times 7/11/1935
That comment was made during the time at which the theory of relativity was met with disbelief and at which time experiments had not been performed to conclusively prove its correctness. Einstein's vindication quite literally came in with explosive force upon the detonation of the first nuclear bomb. That he is now given the highest praise for his work is not a conspiracy - it is because he was proven to be absolutely right on nearly all counts. Nikola Tesla, regardless of the contributions he might have made, was absolutely dead wrong when he said that.
QuoteAs the inventor in your article says, he has not broken the second law of thermodynamics; it is simply the case that the energy output comes from a source other than man-made electrical power.
There you go. You are starting to understand. These are open systems which use the principles of electro-magnetism which God gave us for free and in unlimited abundance. Hence free energy.
QuoteEr, he did, in 1921, at which time he received a blanket Nobel Prize for all of his contributions to theoretical physics.
Ha! They don't mention relativity do they? When has a scientist ever received the Nobel prize for a discovery not mentioned? That would be never. They didn't mention it because they couldn't get away with it. The theory wasn't his own. He just jury rigged the theories of scientists before him and published it. Take a look at the history of science. We have Fermi and others to thank for the fission of an atom, not Einstein. Einstein is no more a genius than my next door neighbor. As far as laying the ground work for 20th century physics, I'll give you that. He helped them all become mostly useless and ignorant.
Tesla, on the other hand, invented the 20th century. .
To say that in the presence of large bodies that space becomes curved is equivalent to stating that Something can act upon Nothing. I for one refuse to subscribe to such a view.
--Nikola Tesla
Quote from: Molly on October 08, 2009, 07:56:09 AM
Quote from: Paul Hazelwood on October 08, 2009, 07:36:45 AM
Quote from: Molly on October 08, 2009, 06:56:08 AM
It's attitudes like this that are going to soon make America a third world country. You want to nit pick about the phrase perpetual motion? I'll use the phrase overunity instead. You say that the motion of the planets is not perpetual motion enough for you? It is an example of a mechanical system that has been and will be running forever, especially from your points of view.
Nit picking over a lie? Nope.
Get back to me with your proof or relevance when the solar system stops moving.
Proof? Spin a top on the floor and watch it slow down and stop and then you will understand the same principal of the earths rotation applied within it's own atmosphere to objects with mass and frictional forces presents something you don't even understand.
If you understood it, you would see the crack pots lie for what it is.
Get back to me when you can "explain" and demonstrate how to spin the top, make it seemingly turn forever and power a car with it so that it cn do something more useful than entertain a child, or spin in a glass bulb and look cool.
I just did with Kohei Minato's amazing magnetic motor. It's not forever but it's going in the right direction. Lead, follow, or get out of the way.
Tesla taps Panasonic for Model S batteries
October 6, 2009 | Camille Ricketts | Comments | Greentech Media has broken news that electric vehicle heavyweight Tesla Motors has chosen Panasonic to supply the battery packs for its Model S sedan, its more affordable model, still in development — this, according to anonymous sources at Panasonic.
This slipped out less than a week after Panasonic's announcement that it has discovered a way to bind lithium ion batteries traditionally used in personal computers into packs suitable for powering cars. The Japanese company's foray into the automotive market gained momentum last December when it purchased Sanyo, one of the biggest lithium-ion battery makers in the world. But even before then, it teamed with Toyota Motors in a joint venture called Panasonic EV Energy.
The Model S will minimally require battery packs of 5,500 lithium-ion cells, capable of carrying the car 160 miles per charge, at least. Tesla says 8,000-cell upgrades will also be available to push this range to 230 or 300 miles.
When it comes to the EV business, Panasonic faces competition from other major electronics corporations like Sony, Samsung, LG and BYD, and newer entries like Johnson Controls and recently-public A123Systems. Considering this field, Tesla's blessing could be a big win for Panasonic. It could also give Tesla an advantage, as Panasonic has said its existing battery assembly lines will allow it to churn out automotive products faster and cheaper than others.
http://green.venturebeat.com/2009/10/06/tesla-taps-panasonic-for-model-s-betteries/
I work for ford, that has hybrids that already use the lithium ion cells, there is nothing new here. The issue is making it out to be something it is not.
A more efficient electric motor is not advancing perpetual motion or anything of the kind. This electric motor has to have an external power source, it simply uses what we already know more efficiently and I am all for that.
Why do teslas cars have to be plugged in? Where is this great car that is self powered if he knows how to just stick an antenna up in the air and draw all the electrons to it? In fact why must he use the technology of another company?
None of this has anything to do with spinning a top or the rotation of the earth. It has to do with something that has to have a power source external to the device and it simply uses that power more efficiently.
Thats great, but when it comes to taking the principals of the earths rotation and applying it to an automobile, this is not what is happening here.
So what explaination do you have for the technology that must exist for a selfcontained car that never has to have gasoline and never has to be plugged in to an electrical socket?
QuoteSo what explaination do you have for the technology that must exist for a selfcontained car that never has to have gasoline and never has to be plugged in to an electrical socket?
I love Ford and am a loyal customer. I have been looking at their hybrid which seems really nice.
But, this Tesla is a totally electric car. That means at today's rates you can go for about 230 miles for 5 dollars. Now if that technology is available, why wouldn't every car manufacturer go for it and end our reliance on oil once and for all? Plus if you are generating your own electricity with wind/solar, now you are no longer reliant on the electric company.
This new electric car does not seem to have any degradation in performance, Zero to 60 in 3.8 seconds. The only drawback is the price because it is a start up company, but they have already turned a profit, so that will change.
Tesla himself invented an electric car and built a prototype in the 1930's. Why did we have to wait 80 years to be able to buy it? I"m sure if Tesla invented it, there was something spectacular under the hood [they didn't have lithium batteries in those days] but since all his work has been classified and disappeared, we will never know. So we hobble along trying to slowly catch up to technology that was invented 100 years ago...
Still, I look forward to the day when the world will be able to plug into God for all our energy needs.
"Let the future tell the truth, and evaluate each one according to his work and accomplishments. The present is theirs; the future, for which I have really worked, is mine."--Nikola Tesla
Quote from: Molly on October 09, 2009, 02:45:44 AM
QuoteSo what explaination do you have for the technology that must exist for a selfcontained car that never has to have gasoline and never has to be plugged in to an electrical socket?
I love Ford and am a loyal customer. I have been looking at their hybrid which seems really nice.
But, this Tesla is a totally electric car. That means at today's rates you can go for about 230 miles for 5 dollars. Now if that technology is available, why wouldn't every car manufacturer go for it and end our reliance on oil once and for all? Plus if you are generating your own electricity with wind/solar, now you are no longer reliant on the electric company.
This new electric car does not seem to have any degradation in performance, Zero to 60 in 3.8 seconds. The only drawback is the price because it is a start up company, but they have already turned a profit, so that will change.
Tesla himself invented an electric car and built a prototype in the 1930's. Why did we have to wait 80 years to be able to buy it? I"m sure if Tesla invented it, there was something spectacular under the hood [they didn't have lithium batteries in those days] but since all his work has been classified and disappeared, we will never know. So we hobble along trying to slowly catch up to technology that was invented 100 years ago...
Well, there is a mystery that I see beyond the physical molly, while the conspiracy theorists contemplate the modern world government no one can really fully explain how the pyramids were built.
There is only speculation, what government supressed that? I suspect there is a vast amount of scientific knowledge contained there if we actually knew the intricate details. According to modern "intelligence" the stones fit with a precision that is unknown to our knowledge of how they could have managed that in that time period.
As far as nikolas inventions and the supression of his technology. Let's try to at least be clear that since we do not actually have any of his documents we are at the mercy of what we may want to believe and that will embellish anything we might speculate on.
While it is "believable" that the government has suppressed information that would save the world. It is also "believable" that there is mostly hype behind the inventions that seem purely magical when it comes to gathering energy with nothing more than some wire coils and antenna to the degree to propel an electric car at 90 mph in the 1930's.
There is also another aspect, one few would believe, but one I think is believable if you can get past the constant shroud of evil that our government gets painted to be.
Perhaps nikola's inventions are of such a magnitude that it makes the hydrogen bomb look like a firecracker and the safety of the planet , not just the united states, would benefit from never knowing how to use such power. I wonder if the world could handle such power responsibly? It is an easy answer.
While people can say what they want and believe what they want based on what they can find wrong, the united states tries to go the direction of godliness as much as people would like to tear it down. Perhaps we want more for the world than the world can manage to want for itself. While people rail on about the ills of occupancy the intent is freedom, people can shake their fists all they want. I think within our own borders can be seen the intent of goodness.
What do we suffer from the most though in that pursuit?
Imperfection. While we strive for perfection, I for one as an american will not apologize for a flaw we did not ask for.
QuoteStill, I look forward to the day when the world will be able to plug into God for all our energy needs.
If we disagree in most things, I agree here.
"Wisdom," (a "darling little mother..." [Pv 8:30] "...delighting [cavorting] with the sons of mankind..." [v.31]) which is what Christ is made unto us, is God in a feminine relationship with human persons.
Proverbs 8:12: "I wisdom dwell with prudence, and find out knowledge of witty inventions."
Proverbs 8:21: "That I may cause those that love me to inherit substance; and I will fill their treasures."
Quote from: reFORMer on October 11, 2009, 02:53:41 AM
"Wisdom," (a "darling little mother..." [Pv 8:30] "...delighting [cavorting] with the sons of mankind..." [v.31]) which is what Christ is made unto us, is God in a feminine relationship with human persons.
:cloud9: Amen, that He is.......El Shaddai as the "hen"........Blessings.....