Conspiracy?

[Molly]

Public Broadcasting (PBS), did a television documentary on this a few years ago.
The Amish gene pool is degenerating and they are very aware of this.

You mean some day they might catch up to all the babies injected with thimerosal who got autism and learning disabilities?

Or, what do you mean by degenerating?  Seems like you are addressing another issue.

[Beloved Servant]

Another issue.
The Amish are too closely related to each other by blood.

[WhiteWings]

Public Broadcasting (PBS), did a television documentary on this a few years ago.
The Amish gene pool is degenerating and they are very aware of this.

I would think a degenerating genepool would be the cause of autism. Not the cure...
Besides of that the Amish autism stats are stable. It's the stats of the average American that is climbing.

[Beloved Servant]

1 in every 10,000 Amish children in the US has autism.
(Amish don't vacinate)

I wonder if the Amish lifestyle has more to do with that than just lack of vaccinations?

I was adding to Paul's remark.

[WhiteWings]

Wiznitzer admits to Amish vaccination rates being around 50%

In that case I would expect half of 166. So 1 out of 332.

However most sources (all I found) report (close to) zero vaccination rates.
Possibly all copying articles from eachother.

[WhiteWings]

1 in every 10,000 Amish children in the US has autism.
(Amish don't vacinate)

I wonder if the Amish lifestyle has more to do with that than just lack of vaccinations?

I was adding to Paul's remark.

Yep, I've read that in your reply to Molly.
We were posting at about the same time.
Jews have a similar problem.

[Molly]

Wiznitzer admits to Amish vaccination rates being around 50%

In that case I would expect half of 166. So 1 out of 332.

However most sources (all I found) report (close to) zero vaccination rates.
Possibly all copying articles from eachother.

There are different populations of Amish.  The UPI reporter studied a control population in pennsylvania who had not received vaccinations.

From that other article--

After learning that "Autism Rates Rocket – 1 in 38 British Boys – Cambridge Study" we now find Dr. Max Wiznitzer, a key vaccine proponent admitted on Friday night's US TV programme Larry King Live that the rate of autism in northeastern Ohio, the largest Amish community in the USA with low rates of vaccination, was 1 in 10,000. He should know, he said: "I'm their neurologist."

[Paul Hazelwood]

Wiznitzer admits to Amish vaccination rates being around 50%

In that case I would expect half of 166. So 1 out of 332.

However most sources (all I found) report (close to) zero vaccination rates.
Possibly all copying articles from eachother.

There are different populations of Amish.  The UPI reporter studied a control population in pennsylvania who had not received vaccinations.

From that other article--

After learning that "Autism Rates Rocket – 1 in 38 British Boys – Cambridge Study" we now find Dr. Max Wiznitzer, a key vaccine proponent admitted on Friday night's US TV programme Larry King Live that the rate of autism in northeastern Ohio, the largest Amish community in the USA with low rates of vaccination, was 1 in 10,000. He should know, he said: "I'm their neurologist."

I read that part too,  what does it then say that this guy seems to contradict himself in the very same article?

Is there really a conspiracy or in general do people see the stats then look around at the pool of people they know and see a different story.


How many autistic children in your personal lives have you actually come across? 

I've been to 10 different churches with a pool of 1000+ kids among them all, helped in the childrens ministry in all of them and never came across one autistic child in the bunch or parent who even talked about theirs.  Prayer requests that I remember revealed some references to a couple of requests in that nature.

One child I have known that had asbergers, from the knowledge I have. the Mother used drugs during pregnancy, but they will not admit this to an official source.

Considering drug use has increased in the US,  certainly there is a factor there, but if the studies can't factor in the unknown,  it's hard to know for sure.

[WhiteWings]

Paul,

Is there really a conspiracy

Some people do everything for an extra $. So perhaps there is one (on a small scale)
But, as I noted in a previous post, it can just as well be a honest medical mistake.
Just like the the drug that caused softenon. It has be recognised and taken of the market.
I think stats like presented in this thread are always the first step to take a drug of the market.

I've been to 10 different churches with a pool of 1000+ kids among them all, helped in the childrens ministry in all of them and never came across one autistic child in the bunch or parent who even talked about theirs.

Are you still visting church today? I ask because the rise of autism is in children that are now at a max. age of 20.
Did people in your church vaccinate? Amish are not the only ones that don't vaccinate.

You know Paul, one of the biggest problems with this kind of stuff is locating unbiased research.
Big pharma will never publish anything that shows they sell junk/poison.
It's all about advertising, PR and preventing law suits. Personally I never seen a commericial pointing out the bad things of a certain product.
Conspiracy? That's up to you to decide. If greed is conspiracy, then yes there is huge conspiracy going on IMO

I tried to find similar research for Europe. Didn't find anything yet.
If for example Europe has a far different autism number and use exactly the same vaccination then that sheds a far different light on the whole topic...

[Molly]

One child in 60 'suffers from a form of autism'

By Sue Reid
Last updated at 11:33 PM on 20th March 2009


Far more children have autism than previously thought, a study of British school pupils has found.

Researchers now believe as many as one in 60 children has some form of the condition.

The disturbing findings, which are due to be made public within weeks, mean that up to 216,000 children in the UK could suffer from an autistic condition, although many have not yet been diagnosed.

The research could have a major impact on public services in Britain with many more youngsters potentially needing a lifetime of special care.


http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1163606/One-child-60-suffers-form-autism.html

[jabcat]

My niece is autistic.  My wife was on the phone with her just this morning.  She's 8 (not my wife, my niece  :laughing7:).   Brilliant, but with neuroligical impairment.  It's obvious, and has been evident since she was probably 1.5-2 years of age.

[Molly]

25And he shall speak great words against the most High, and shall wear out the saints of the most High,...

--Dan 7

[Paul Hazelwood]

Many children who have a form of autism have not been diagnosed

Shocking,  there are many many extraterrestials on the planet we just have not found them yet.

[jabcat]

My niece is a real person with autism.  The numbers may be in question, and the diagnosis and diagnostic criteria will likely be tweaked through the years as more is found out about it.  But the phenomenon is real.  She exists.

[Paul Hazelwood]

My niece is a real person with autism.  The numbers may be in question, and the diagnosis and diagnostic criteria will likely be tweaked through the years as more is found out about it.  But the phenomenon is real.  She exists.

Not disputing that,  disputing the things that are said in articles that jusrify the numbers.


I'm all for eliminating things, but  misinformation does not help matters.

[jabcat]

I agree.  It's hard to know on a large scale.

[jabcat]

If I'm on my game, I may believe about half what I read. 

[Paul Hazelwood]

There are also more ultra sounds done now than before, who can say that is not a factor as well.

Could it also be a factor of our obsession to eliminate every negative thing in our lives through mans ability is being proven futile through unintended consequenses?

[Paul Hazelwood]

My niece is a real person with autism.  The numbers may be in question, and the diagnosis and diagnostic criteria will likely be tweaked through the years as more is found out about it.  But the phenomenon is real.  She exists.

Not disputing that,  disputing the things that are said in articles that jusrify the numbers.


I'm all for eliminating things, but  misinformation does not help matters.

Basicly you only trust articles that agree with the number you have in mind. Right?

I don't have a number in mind, now what?

[WhiteWings]

The number you have in mind is always different from any article/link posted. I'm not gonna waste any more time on your petty little game.
This was my last reply to you until your stop your childish trolling.

[Paul Hazelwood]

The number you have in mind is always different from any article/link posted. I'm not gonna waste any more time on your petty little game.
This was my last reply to you until your stop your childish trolling.

*Mod cut.  Inappropriate language/response.

[Molly]

I devoted time to study this issue because I believe that this is a moral crisis that must be addressed. If, as the evidence suggests, our public-health authorities knowingly allowed the pharmaceutical industry to poison an entire generation of American children, their actions arguably constitute one of the biggest scandals in the annals of American medicine. "The CDC is guilty of incompetence and gross negligence," says Mark Blaxill, vice president of Safe Minds, a nonprofit organization concerned about the role of mercury in medicines. "The damage caused by vaccine exposure is massive. It's bigger than asbestos, bigger than tobacco, bigger than anything you've ever seen."

--Deadly Immunity, IBID


Incompetence and gross negligence is the nicest thing you could say about them.  I would use other words, myself.

[Paul Hazelwood]

For the record this troll simply points out things that are questionable.

You can throw videos and weblinks at me all day long, so what?

This thread is about conspiracy,  not whether something is a problem.  Is autism a problem?   YES IT IS.

So do we hunt the cure or do we hunt the conspiracy and get nowhere?   Hunting conspiracies will not solve the problem, never has.   It only clouds the issue and makes people skeptical because there is always exaggeration when it comes to conspiracies, there are no exceptions that I have ever seen.

Hunting the specific cause and or cure can possibly fix autism and the conspiracy if there is one will either be exposed or it will be made useless because of that.

Other articles makes it this a huge plague that is coming upon america, perhaps it is.  Perhaps we can learn something through this for the future.

If we are going to wait till there is a large number before we care about it and work hard at it then that is just as negligent as anyone elses accusation.

What if it was only 1 in one million?   Do we then think the new world order is not at stake, do we think there is no conspiracy and go home and not give a crap any more.


Troll out...

[jabcat]

Mod Note.  Suggestion;  if any of us doesn't like a particular topic, perhaps consider posting an opinion (or not) and then move on to another topic and let those that wish to discuss it continue to do so.  Obviously, please refrain from inappropriate language.

[Paul Hazelwood]

Hey as long as people get away with being hateful by calling people blind and asleep and trolls, then you can ban me.


Please do so.