If You Were God

claypot · March 09, 2009, 05:56:51 PM

Quote from: Paul Hazelwood on March 09, 2009, 05:30:21 PM
Quote from: claypot on March 09, 2009, 05:14:10 PM
Quote from: Paul Hazelwood on March 09, 2009, 04:44:14 PM
Quote from: claypot on March 09, 2009, 04:35:49 PM

People say evil is here to teach us yet I wonder if we would learn more if evil, like lying, were not here.

I don't know for sure, but here is what I have experienced. I was treated very horribly as a child, according to how I felt. I can look back and see that some of the things were beneficial, others I still retain and struggle over. I'd love for those struggles to not be there at all, I have pleaded and screamed at God to take many of them away.

Yet, I am now seeing that without all those things in place, i could not actually "know" "believe" and "understand" what love really is about. I know people that didn't have such a hard life, that say they love, they make a big deal about their willingness to love. But after getting to know them more, their love is actually more of a pity that people aren't more like they are.

I could be wrong, but I do not see that as love.

Paul, with all due, I mean it, respect to your childhood nightmares you are not saying that others who have had a good childhood learn 'love' in a lesser way are you?

cp

No, actually I'm making a point about how do we determine what love is? Is it feelings? Is it experiences?

I don't believe I love very well, even if I might think I understand it. Someone telling me they wish I had been raised like them, is that really love?

What is love? If we are going to pretend to play God then what is it exactly God ought to be doing?

Exactly where I am going in my thoughts and thus this thread.

Paul, your question, 'What is love' brought back so many memories. It is the question that brought me to God. I asked that question a million times before I ever opened a Bible. I got invited to church one day and the Pastor said God is love and that began my journey some 28 years ago and I'm still finding out what love is via finding out who God is.

Questions like I am proposing on this thread is a real step for me in understanding this God I say I believe in.

Why would I think I would stop all lying and suffering if I had the power when I see God allowing it and He has the power? Again my question probably should not be 'If we were God......' but 'If we had the power to do this or that.......'

cp

Cardinal · March 09, 2009, 06:05:12 PM

:cloud9: I've always jokingly said my first official act as a manifested Son of God if I had my way, would be to evaporate all spiders and poisonous snakes. :mblush: What?! You were expecting something spiritual? :laughing7: Blessings....

Paul Hazelwood · March 09, 2009, 06:46:45 PM

I understand what your saying CP. There are a lot of things I might eliminate if I had the power. It is one reason I don't want it I guess.

I know whats inside me and whether it is always good to let other people know, thats just how I am.

In reality, if I had the power I'd make utopia and we wpuld all be robots and be good and loving and kind and live a wonderful pleasant life and no one would know the difference.

We work out the problem of evil and suffering to make some kind of sense out of it because we do not have a choice but to live with it.

There is a verse that I use and some people get upset that I am reducing God and his glory, but there is a reason for every single scripture whether we like them or not,. whether we understand them all or not.

1C 1:25 for the stupidity of God is wiser than human men, and the weakness of God is stronger than human men.

People will contextualize this various ways I think, but I believe there is some significance to the ramifications of this life.

If God could have just made a utopia and we actually could learn love without going through all of this, then is God actually a monster after all?

If he really could of done it different, then why are we defending him?

If you knew of someone who did something painful to someone and their defence was that the outcome was good you might reconsider how you felt about that person. However what if you found out that they KNEW of a way to do the same thing painlessly, would your view of that person be the same?

I think while God can never be weaker than us, I still believe that god cannot do "everything". What if there is only one process to perfection and even God cannot do anything about it, and we are in that process right now and thats just how it is and even God can't change it.

Thats the only purpose I see for that verse. and it is the only verse that keeps me from giving the finger to God sometimes and thats just me being honest.

claypot · March 09, 2009, 06:48:19 PM

Quote from: Cardinal on March 09, 2009, 06:05:12 PM
:cloud9: I've always jokingly said my first official act as a manifested Son of God if I had my way, would be to evaporate all spiders and poisonous snakes. :mblush: What?! You were expecting something spiritual? :laughing7: Blessings....

Not from you Card, not from you! :laughing7:

cp

claypot · March 09, 2009, 06:59:30 PM

Quote from: Paul Hazelwood on March 09, 2009, 06:46:45 PM

I understand what your saying CP. There are a lot of things I might eliminate if I had the power. It is one reason I don't want it I guess.

I know whats inside me and whether it is always good to let other people know, thats just how I am.

In reality, if I had the power I'd make utopia and we wpuld all be robots and be good and loving and kind and live a wonderful pleasant life and no one would know the difference.

Sounds like a description of heaven minus the robot part.

Quote from: Paul Hazelwood on March 09, 2009, 06:46:45 PM
We work out the problem of evil and suffering to make some kind of sense out of it because we do not have a choice but to live with it.

Amen, I hear ya.

Quote from: Paul Hazelwood on March 09, 2009, 06:46:45 PM
There is a verse that I use and some people get upset that I am reducing God and his glory, but there is a reason for every single scripture whether we like them or not,. whether we understand them all or not.

1C 1:25 for the stupidity of God is wiser than human men, and the weakness of God is stronger than human men.

People will contextualize this various ways I think, but I believe there is some significance to the ramifications of this life.

If God could have just made a utopia and we actually could learn love without going through all of this, then is God actually a monster after all?

If he really could of done it different, then why are we defending him?

If you knew of someone who did something painful to someone and their defence was that the outcome was good you might reconsider how you felt about that person. However what if you found out that they KNEW of a way to do the same thing painlessly, would your view of that person be the same?

I think while God can never be weaker than us, I still believe that god cannot do "everything". What if there is only one process to perfection and even God cannot do anything about it, and we are in that process right now and thats just how it is and even God can't change it.

Thats the only purpose I see for that verse. and it is the only verse that keeps me from giving the finger to God sometimes and thats just me being honest.

Heavy stuff Brother but I hear the honesty coming forth and I know God honors honesty. I can be pretty point blank with God too and it's scary. I want to do some thinking on your words before I say more.

cp

CHB · March 10, 2009, 12:42:57 AM

I agree with Martin. :happy3: Why even try to imagine to do things differently than the most intelligent being in the universe does?

CHB

claypot · March 10, 2009, 01:20:19 AM

Quote from: CHB on March 10, 2009, 12:42:57 AM

I agree with Martin. :happy3: Why even try to imagine to do things differently than the most intelligent being in the universe does?

CHB

God invites us to reason with Him and I think reasoning with Him creates intimacy.

Imagining is using ones brain and can bring one outside the box and that's where I think God lives.

CHB, isn't almost all of our knowledge of God via the Scriptures, guesswork of a sort. I mean I know God loves us, but what does even that entail. We know so much and yet we really don't.

cp

claypot · March 11, 2009, 09:01:54 PM

Quote from: Cardinal on March 09, 2009, 06:05:12 PM
:cloud9: I've always jokingly said my first official act as a manifested Son of God if I had my way, would be to evaporate all spiders and poisonous snakes. :mblush: What?! You were expecting something spiritual? :laughing7: Blessings....

That is exactly what you are doing as a manifested Son of God, evaporating spiders and poisonous snakes. It doesn't get any more spiritual than that!!!

cp

WhiteWings · March 11, 2009, 09:09:57 PM

Quote from: Cardinal on March 09, 2009, 06:05:12 PM
:cloud9: I've always jokingly said my first official act as a manifested Son of God if I had my way, would be to evaporate all spiders and poisonous snakes. :mblush: What?! You were expecting something spiritual? :laughing7: Blessings....

What kinda god you are? Not even giving them immortal bodies and then into hell with them? You know they really asked for it!

(http://img.brothersoft.com/icon/softimage/f/flame-spider_-_sitemap_generator-191865.jpeg)

Cardinal · March 11, 2009, 09:43:51 PM

Quote from: claypot on March 11, 2009, 09:01:54 PM
Quote from: Cardinal on March 09, 2009, 06:05:12 PM
:cloud9: I've always jokingly said my first official act as a manifested Son of God if I had my way, would be to evaporate all spiders and poisonous snakes. :mblush: What?! You were expecting something spiritual? :laughing7: Blessings....

That is exactly what you are doing as a manifested Son of God, evaporating spiders and poisonous snakes. It doesn't get any more spiritual than that!!! cp

:cloud9: roflol, that's true, cp.......hadn't thought of it that way...... :laughing7: :thumbsup:

Cardinal · March 11, 2009, 09:46:51 PM

Quote from: WhiteWings on March 11, 2009, 09:09:57 PM
Quote from: Cardinal on March 09, 2009, 06:05:12 PM
:cloud9: I've always jokingly said my first official act as a manifested Son of God if I had my way, would be to evaporate all spiders and poisonous snakes. :mblush: What?! You were expecting something spiritual? :laughing7: Blessings....

What kinda god you are? Not even giving them immortal bodies and then into hell with them? You know they really asked for it!

(http://img.brothersoft.com/icon/softimage/f/flame-spider_-_sitemap_generator-191865.jpeg)

:cloud9: roflol.....apparently these are one of things Adam birthed (named/natured out of his own heart) that I just don't feel the love for......no group hug with them here. :laughing7:

Redlettervoice · March 11, 2009, 09:56:41 PM

If I were God.............???? well, now let's see.

God is LOVE.

So if "I" were God...........

LOVE is OF GOD!!!

No matter how many say they are God, they can't find the
dayspring! They can't make the eagle mount up! They can't
exhalt the low and put down the high. They can only "do" what
God does "thru" them. And shouldn't even try to do more. Jesus
didn't.

They can't "be" but what they are!

And GOD can't be but what HE is!

Enjoy whatever He gives you!

claypot · March 11, 2009, 10:15:59 PM

Quote from: Redlettervoice on March 11, 2009, 09:56:41 PM

If I were God.............???? well, now let's see.

Red, I should have asked.....if you had maximum control over any vice in the world, how would you use it and what do you think the ramifications would be? Like if you could stop all lying, what do you think the condition of the world would be like in one year and in 20 years.

Quote from: Redlettervoice on March 11, 2009, 09:56:41 PMNo matter how many say they are God, they can't find the
dayspring! They can't make the eagle mount up! They can't
exhalt the low and put down the high. They can only "do" what
God does "thru" them. And shouldn't even try to do more. Jesus
didn't.

Red, I sure don't want to imply that we can ever be God. I am trying to get at something in my own head and this is the only way I know how to get there and you commenting on my question will help as did all the others who commented.

Quote from: Redlettervoice on March 11, 2009, 09:56:41 PMThey can't "be" but what they are!

And GOD can't be but what HE is!

Enjoy whatever He gives you!

We can't, He can't and I will. Thanks Red. Say Hi to Jack for me.

cp

Redlettervoice · March 12, 2009, 12:53:25 AM

I think Jack is writing as Juan over on the Snowman board.

That's the only place I see him lately!

I don't know how to answer your questions............so..........

sorry. But I think I would choose "deceit" rather than lying.

There "is" a difference, you know. One of these days, God

will have a chain, unity, linked together that he will use to

put a lid on the bottomless pit and the devil will no longer

"deceive" the nations. Yeah, I'd choose "deceit."

But what will happen when God does this is written.

claypot · March 12, 2009, 03:05:32 AM

Quote from: Redlettervoice on March 12, 2009, 12:53:25 AM

I think Jack is writing as Juan over on the Snowman board.
That's the only place I see him lately!

Got a link? I don't know a Snowman board.

QuoteI don't know how to answer your questions............so..........

sorry. But I think I would choose "deceit" rather than lying.

There "is" a difference, you know.

I know.

QuoteOne of these days, God

will have a chain, unity, linked together that he will use to

put a lid on the bottomless pit and the devil will no longer

"deceive" the nations. Yeah, I'd choose "deceit."

But what will happen when God does this is written.

I hear ya. That chain and lid are Jesus Christ in me and you I'm a thinkin.

cp

Redlettervoice · March 12, 2009, 03:45:52 AM

See it all just as you do.

http://www.treasuresofthesnow.citymaker.com/page/page/2973482.htm

News:

If You Were God

Paul Hazelwood

Redlettervoice

Redlettervoice

Redlettervoice