Your third eye . . .

[Nathan]

[quote
Dying to self means nothing other than to be free.

[/quote]

Another revelation!  People who build their observation deck from a fallen perspective, see dying to self is to mean much self-discipline to everything that doesn't have God tatooed on it.  Ya can't quite get them to see that man did not conjure up the ability to lust, or to "be" fleshly . . . we were born into it and it was bred into us.  Which is to say that when we as humans do what humans do, when we cater to our flesh and such . . .God doesn't disdain us for being and doing what we were born to be and do.  Religion is what gave our flesh it's power over us.  If we could just grasp the fact that when Christ is invited "in" us . . .HE is who begins making changes on the inside which eventually manifest on the outside.  We just simply "let" him do what he does best . . .transforming our hearts first, and everything else falls into alignment because we are created to have our spirit in dominion over our soul and our flesh . . .over our mind and our bodies. 

Dying to the flesh . . .for me . . .is to stop giving power to the things that are not of the Spirit.  Which is to say . . .stop focusing on them, stop worrying about why you can't shake a bad habit or a sinful thing from you .. . ignore it . . . die to it . . .when you stop PAYING attention to it, it will also die to you.  And even that part of it must come "in" from the Father "above".  Otherwise . .. it becomes a law again.  If I take action as a result of my head rather than my heart, I'm setting myself up for failure . .but when we walk in the spirit, when we're "in" the spirit . . . you ever get into one of those worship services that are so powerful and strong that you wish you could just "live" in that . .you don't want it to stop, you don't want to go home . . .you just want to absorb as much of that as you can??  Notice that your "self" nature is no longer nagging at you?  That your mind isn't accusing you anymore when you're in that "state" of worship?

It's because when you worship . . .you are feeding your spirit and not your flesh.  Which ever one you feed, that's the one that has the control over you.  When you walk in the spirit . . .flesh can't control . .and when flesh can't control, freedom then takes the throne in you and grace abounds . .you're still human, you still screw up . . .but there's no power in it anymore because you finally killed it when you stopped feeding into it.  Let Freedom Ring!!

[Cardinal]

 :cloud9: Yes.....dying to self is really all about the motive being cleansed. We give whatever it is to Him, put it on the altar, and let Him take it from there. What He does is cleanse the motive of it and "give" it back to us.

I have shared this example before, but stubbornness and I were best friends for a long time. If you had looked in the dictionary under that word, you would have found a picture of a mule and me, not necessarily in that order. I was aware of it, and cursed that thing constantly, seeking to have the Lord deliver me of it.

One day, in the midst of my cursing the darkness, the Lord spoke to me and told me HE had left it there because He had need of it. He showed me how the stubbornness had been used every time I hit a "bump" in the road with Him, felt defeated, got ridiculed, thought about going back to before I knew Him and so much seemed to be expected of me, ect. It was part of the strength I was drawing from in those times, and I didn't even know it.

My "enemy" was actually a thing of beauty in the Master's hand, because I had offered it up to Him to be consumed in the fire of His Spirit, and He had consumed it, cleansed the motive of it, and made it part of the Rock I stand on. What an awesome God we serve, who is able to take the base things of the "world" (that we are) that held us in bondage, and turn them into something magnificent in Christ! No wonder then it says to agree with your adversary while you are in the way with him. Blessings.....

[Nathan]

:cloud9: Yes.....dying to self is really all about the motive being cleansed. We give whatever it is to Him, put it on the altar, and let Him take it from there. What He does is cleanse the motive of it and "give" it back to us.

I have shared this example before, but stubbornness and I were best friends for a long time. If you had looked in the dictionary under that word, you would have found a picture of a mule and me, not necessarily in that order. I was aware of it, and cursed that thing constantly, seeking to have the Lord deliver me of it.

One day, in the midst of my cursing the darkness, the Lord spoke to me and told me HE had left it there because He had need of it. He showed me how the stubbornness had been used every time I hit a "bump" in the road with Him, felt defeated, got ridiculed, thought about going back to before I knew Him and so much seemed to be expected of me, ect. It was part of the strength I was drawing from in those times, and I didn't even know it.

My "enemy" was actually a thing of beauty in the Master's hand, because I had offered it up to Him to be consumed in the fire of His Spirit, and He had consumed it, cleansed the motive of it, and made it part of the Rock I stand on. What an awesome God we serve, who is able to take the base things of the "world" (that we are) that held us in bondage, and turn them into something magnificent in Christ! No wonder then it says to agree with your adversary while you are in the way with him. Blessings.....

Wow!  You're the first I've seen that has had the same thing happen to you.  I first saw this with Paul's thorn . . and then the word "antidote" came to mind . . . it's like someone who has cancer and has to take "chemo" treatments to fight it off . . .the treatments are actually smaller doses of the very thing they're trying to rid their bodies of .  . . but it's given in smaller doses to cause the body's immune system to build itself up to fight off the actual disease.

Chicken pocks . . .mumps, measles . . . all those shots they give you to avoid getting the disease are actually smaller doses of the very thing you don't want to catch.  How is this relevant?  There are things in us that "we" think God would be pleased if we removed them . .when in many cases . ..God is the one that put them there so that we would rely on his grace and not our own disciplines and egos.  It's also connected with the wheat and tares in us . . . the things we think are nasty things in us that MUST be removed, are not the same things that God is trying to remove from us. 

How much better am I if I finally was able to quit smoking . . .but I still have no patience for people?  I'm not saying that it's okay to smoke . . . spiritually, does it really matter that much?  Physically . .it'll kill you . . . but I'm leaning much more toward personality traits that need God's attention more than personal ticks and crutches.  God leaves the ticks and crutches to assist in his purpose of bringing my relationship to a more healthy and mature place in him . . .it doesn't always fit natural logic . .but the more I get into the kingdom, the clearer it becomes that it isn't "just" his ways not my ways and this thoughts are not my thoughts . .but it's becoming more evident that his ways our "opposite" of my ways and his thoughts are "opposite" of my thoughts.

So if I take what logically makes sense to me . .flip it upside down . . . I will then get a glimpse of what it is God originally intended.  It makes no sense to me to inject myself with the very disease I'm trying to avoid.  It makes no sense to me that God would not remove Paul's thorn.  But when I reverse the logic and state that God "needed" to leave Paul with the thorn . . . I "need" to inflict myself with the very thing I'm trying not to get . . .my head will usually just give up trying to figure it out . . .which then God begins "revealing" to my spirit what he was trying to get into me in the first place . .but my argumentative mind wouldn't allow it to enter unless it could be reasoned out first.  Again . . .faith doesn't work in this kind of environment.

[Cardinal]

 :cloud9: Amen Nathan. Just like it makes no sense that the "antidote" to death's sting (which is sin), would be the "anti-venom" of the cross. If we want to live, we have to first die. Up with God is down, and down with God is up. Blessings....

[claypot]

Hey Nathan, you hit a tender spot for me and I'd like your and Cards and whoevers take on it. You wrote......

If we could just grasp the fact that when Christ is invited "in" us . . .HE is who begins making changes on the inside which eventually manifest on the outside.  We just simply "let" him do what he does best . . .transforming our hearts first......

This wording scares me. If I have to 'invite Christ in' and 'let Him.....' I feel as if I am doomed. In your opinion what will happen if I don't invite Christ in or let Him?

cp

[Cardinal]

 :cloud9: Cp, for me it was this way. I did pray that way, not knowing what I was doing on a country road, alone, one night 23 years ago. And He met me where I was at.

But many years later, He showed me He was the spark in all men that come into the world, AND the measure of faith to receive Him. No where in there can you find to "ask Him in". This might rankle some, but the fact is, He is already there, but does not quicken or make alive this revelation until that heart turns unto the Lord. To quicken or make alive, means we awakened to truth, and the first truth we awaken to is that He is Lord and we are accepted in the Beloved. This is why it says nothing including death can separate us from the Lord, because He is already there with us.

For me personally, this revelation changed the way I talk to people, and apparently removed a great deal of condemnation right off the bat, and made them more receptive to hear. And I also think it brought more of an anointing to the message, or at least more anointing manifested tangibly. The Word is anointed and the closer we come to the Word that is Spirit and Truth, it stands to reason the more anointing would be released. I think the FULL gospel that the apostles taught has yet to be completely recovered in understanding, that only comes from the Spirit. My  :2c: Blessings....

[Taffy]

This might rankle some, but the fact is, He is already there, but does not quicken or make alive this revelation until that heart turns unto the Lord. To quicken or make alive, means we awakened to truth, and the first truth we awaken to is that He is Lord and we are accepted in the Beloved. This is why it says nothing including death can separate us from the Lord, because He is already there with us.

Yeah can Rankle some...TO-RE-VEAL is to make Known whats already There..To RE-VEAL HIS Son In Me...paul says... :happygrin:


:icon_flower:

[Zeek]

This might rankle some, but the fact is, He is already there, but does not quicken or make alive this revelation until that heart turns unto the Lord. To quicken or make alive, means we awakened to truth, and the first truth we awaken to is that He is Lord and we are accepted in the Beloved. This is why it says nothing including death can separate us from the Lord, because He is already there with us.

Yeah can Rankle some...TO-RE-VEAL is to make Known whats already There..To RE-VEAL HIS Son In Me...paul says... :happygrin:


:icon_flower:

:icon_flower: :icon_flower: :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :bgdance: :bgdance: :boyheart: :girlheart: :grin: :grin:

[Molly]

17Do not ye yet understand, that whatsoever entereth in at the mouth goeth into the belly, and is cast out into the draught?

18But those things which proceed out of the mouth come forth from the heart; and they defile the man.

19For out of the heart proceed evil thoughts, murders, adulteries, fornications, thefts, false witness, blasphemies:

20These are the things which defile a man: but to eat with unwashen hands defileth not a man.

--Mat 15



It is the spirit which defiles the body, not the body which defiles the spirit.

Isn't that what he is saying?

This is why our warfare is a spiritual one because the battle is in the spiritual realm, not the physical realm.

People who are committing sin are literally not in their right minds.  Forgive them, they know not what they do.

People who chose to do evil have defiled themselves to the point where they are full of darkness.  That spark of light that is Christ has gone out and how great is that darkness!  Then how will they escape the damnation of Hell?  Their house is left to them desolate.

It is the spirit which defiles, not the body.

Therefore, take care!


44For every tree is known by his own fruit. For of thorns men do not gather figs, nor of a bramble bush gather they grapes.

45A good man out of the good treasure of his heart bringeth forth that which is good; and an evil man out of the evil treasure of his heart bringeth forth that which is evil: for of the abundance of the heart his mouth speaketh.

46And why call ye me, Lord, Lord, and do not the things which I say?

--Luke 6

[claypot]

:cloud9: Cp, for me it was this way. I did pray that way, not knowing what I was doing on a country road, alone, one night 23 years ago. And He met me where I was at.

But many years later, He showed me He was the spark in all men that come into the world, AND the measure of faith to receive Him. No where in there can you find to "ask Him in". This might rankle some, but the fact is, He is already there, but does not quicken or make alive this revelation until that heart turns unto the Lord. To quicken or make alive, means we awakened to truth, and the first truth we awaken to is that He is Lord and we are accepted in the Beloved. This is why it says nothing including death can separate us from the Lord, because He is already there with us.

For me personally, this revelation changed the way I talk to people, and apparently removed a great deal of condemnation right off the bat, and made them more receptive to hear. And I also think it brought more of an anointing to the message, or at least more anointing manifested tangibly. The Word is anointed and the closer we come to the Word that is Spirit and Truth, it stands to reason the more anointing would be released. I think the FULL gospel that the apostles taught has yet to be completely recovered in understanding, that only comes from the Spirit. My  :2c: Blessings....

Its a tricky situation for sure. I don't want to get out of any responsibility I have in this salvation process but it does seem to be all of God ultimately. What burns my britches is when people say God is love and if you don't let Him in or accept Him or whatever then you are doomed. I always argue that if God (Love) is not powerful enough to save me, even from me not wanting to be saved, then what good is it?

cp

[Zeek]

Joh 1:4  In him was life; and the life was the light of men.

Joh 1:5  And the light shineth in darkness; and the darkness comprehended it not.

[Zeek]

:cloud9: Cp, for me it was this way. I did pray that way, not knowing what I was doing on a country road, alone, one night 23 years ago. And He met me where I was at.

But many years later, He showed me He was the spark in all men that come into the world, AND the measure of faith to receive Him. No where in there can you find to "ask Him in". This might rankle some, but the fact is, He is already there, but does not quicken or make alive this revelation until that heart turns unto the Lord. To quicken or make alive, means we awakened to truth, and the first truth we awaken to is that He is Lord and we are accepted in the Beloved. This is why it says nothing including death can separate us from the Lord, because He is already there with us.

For me personally, this revelation changed the way I talk to people, and apparently removed a great deal of condemnation right off the bat, and made them more receptive to hear. And I also think it brought more of an anointing to the message, or at least more anointing manifested tangibly. The Word is anointed and the closer we come to the Word that is Spirit and Truth, it stands to reason the more anointing would be released. I think the FULL gospel that the apostles taught has yet to be completely recovered in understanding, that only comes from the Spirit. My  :2c: Blessings....

Its a tricky situation for sure. I don't want to get out of any responsibility I have in this salvation process but it does seem to be all of God ultimately. What burns my britches is when people say God is love and if you don't let Him in or accept Him or whatever then you are doomed. I always argue that if God (Love) is not powerful enough to save me, even from me not wanting to be saved, then what good is it?

cp

what about "receive" him?  do you see a difference between "receive" and "accept"?

[claypot]

:cloud9: Cp, for me it was this way. I did pray that way, not knowing what I was doing on a country road, alone, one night 23 years ago. And He met me where I was at.

But many years later, He showed me He was the spark in all men that come into the world, AND the measure of faith to receive Him. No where in there can you find to "ask Him in". This might rankle some, but the fact is, He is already there, but does not quicken or make alive this revelation until that heart turns unto the Lord. To quicken or make alive, means we awakened to truth, and the first truth we awaken to is that He is Lord and we are accepted in the Beloved. This is why it says nothing including death can separate us from the Lord, because He is already there with us.

For me personally, this revelation changed the way I talk to people, and apparently removed a great deal of condemnation right off the bat, and made them more receptive to hear. And I also think it brought more of an anointing to the message, or at least more anointing manifested tangibly. The Word is anointed and the closer we come to the Word that is Spirit and Truth, it stands to reason the more anointing would be released. I think the FULL gospel that the apostles taught has yet to be completely recovered in understanding, that only comes from the Spirit. My  :2c: Blessings....

Its a tricky situation for sure. I don't want to get out of any responsibility I have in this salvation process but it does seem to be all of God ultimately. What burns my britches is when people say God is love and if you don't let Him in or accept Him or whatever then you are doomed. I always argue that if God (Love) is not powerful enough to save me, even from me not wanting to be saved, then what good is it?

cp

what about "receive" him?  do you see a difference between "receive" and "accept"?

I do believe we must receive Him or accept Him (same thing to me) but where will my desire and power come from to do this?

cp

[Taffy]

Joh 1:4  In him was life; and the life was the light of men.

Joh 1:5  And the light shineth in darkness; and the darkness comprehended it not.

Luk 11:33 No man, when he hath lighted a candle, putteth [it] in a secret place, neither under a bushel, but on a candlestick, that they which come in may see the light.


Luk 11:34 The light of the body is the eye: therefore when thine eye is single, thy whole body also is full of light; but when [thine eye] is evil, thy body also [is] full of darkness.


Luk 11:35 Take heed therefore that the light which is in thee be not darkness.


Luk 11:36 If thy whole body therefore [be] full of light, having no part dark, the whole shall be full of light, as when the bright shining of a candle doth give thee light

[Taffy]

:cloud9: Cp, for me it was this way. I did pray that way, not knowing what I was doing on a country road, alone, one night 23 years ago. And He met me where I was at.

But many years later, He showed me He was the spark in all men that come into the world, AND the measure of faith to receive Him. No where in there can you find to "ask Him in". This might rankle some, but the fact is, He is already there, but does not quicken or make alive this revelation until that heart turns unto the Lord. To quicken or make alive, means we awakened to truth, and the first truth we awaken to is that He is Lord and we are accepted in the Beloved. This is why it says nothing including death can separate us from the Lord, because He is already there with us.

For me personally, this revelation changed the way I talk to people, and apparently removed a great deal of condemnation right off the bat, and made them more receptive to hear. And I also think it brought more of an anointing to the message, or at least more anointing manifested tangibly. The Word is anointed and the closer we come to the Word that is Spirit and Truth, it stands to reason the more anointing would be released. I think the FULL gospel that the apostles taught has yet to be completely recovered in understanding, that only comes from the Spirit. My  :2c: Blessings....

Its a tricky situation for sure. I don't want to get out of any responsibility I have in this salvation process but it does seem to be all of God ultimately. What burns my britches is when people say God is love and if you don't let Him in or accept Him or whatever then you are doomed. I always argue that if God (Love) is not powerful enough to save me, even from me not wanting to be saved, then what good is it?

cp

what about "receive" him?  do you see a difference between "receive" and "accept"?

I do believe we must receive Him or accept Him (same thing to me) but where will my desire and power come from to do this?

cp

...
Maybe as EVE WAS brought TO Adam, The Church(us) are DRAWN to HIM....Kinda reminds me of a Peacock..call it MALE magnitism :icon_flower:

[Zeek]

Pro 4:11  I have taught thee in the way of wisdom; I have led thee in right paths.

Pro 4:12  When thou goest, thy steps shall not be straitened; and when thou runnest, thou shalt not stumble.

Pro 4:13  Take fast hold of instruction; let her not go: keep her; for she is thy life.

Pro 4:14  Enter not into the path of the wicked, and go not in the way of evil men.

Pro 4:15  Avoid it, pass not by it, turn from it, and pass away.

Pro 4:18  But the path of the just is as the shining light, that shineth more and more unto the perfect day.

Pro 4:19  The way of the wicked is as darkness: they know not at what they stumble.

Pro 4:20  My son, attend to my words; incline thine ear unto my sayings.

Pro 4:21 Let them not depart from thine eyes; keep them in the midst of thine heart.

Pro 4:22  For they are life unto those that find them, and health to all their flesh.

Pro 4:23  Keep thy heart with all diligence; for out of it are the issues of life.

Pro 4:24  Put away from thee a froward mouth, and perverse lips put far from thee.

Pro 4:25  Let thine eyes look right on, and let thine eyelids look straight before thee.

Pro 4:26  Ponder the path of thy feet, and let all thy ways be established.

Pro 4:27 Turn not to the right hand nor to the left: remove thy foot from evil.

[Zeek]

Rom 1:19  Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath showed it unto them.

Rom 1:20  For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:

Rom 1:21  Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened.

Rom 1:23  And changed the glory of the incorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things.

Rom 1:24 Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonor their own bodies between themselves:

Rom 1:25  Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshiped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed forever. Amen.

Rom 1:26 For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature:

[Taffy]

ya on a roll Zeek :icon_flower:

[Cardinal]

 :cloud9: I see a difference between receive Him and accept Him, Zeek. I think we receive Him as a bride receives her husband. We were already betrothed to Him (He is the light of all men that come into the world), but just like in the arranged marriages of the time, many times they did not see their husband fully until their wedding day (initial revelation). They might steal a glance at him at the markets, ect., but they were not allowed to intermix.

This is as the Shulamite in Song of Solomon, where she is dark but comely (our soul in darkness/ignorance of Him) and she sees Him fleetingly, through the lattice (in part). Then as it progresses, her attributes change as she draws closer and closer to her beloved. Blessings....

[Molly]

...keep them [my words] in the midst of thine heart.

Pro 4:22  For they are life unto those that find them, and health to all their flesh.




8And the LORD God planted a garden eastward in Eden; and there he put the man whom he had formed.

9And out of the ground made the LORD God to grow every tree that is pleasant to the sight, and good for food; the tree of life also in the midst of the garden, and the tree of knowledge of good and evil.

--Gen 2





15And the LORD God took the man, and put him into the garden of Eden to dress it and to keep it.

16And the LORD God commanded the man [al Adam], saying, Of every tree of the garden thou mayest freely eat:

17But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die.

--Gen 2

[Taffy]

:cloud9: I see a difference between receive Him and accept Him, Zeek. I think we receive Him as a bride receives her husband. We were already betrothed to Him (He is the light of all men that come into the world), but just like in the arranged marriages of the time, many times they did not see their husband fully until their wedding day (initial revelation). They might steal a glance at him at the markets, ect., but they were not allowed to intermix.

This is as the Shulamite in Song of Solomon, where she is dark but comely (our soul in darkness/ignorance of Him) and she sees Him fleetingly, through the lattice (in part). Then as it progresses, her attributes change as she draws closer and closer to her beloved. Blessings....

Come to the Point Girl :HeartThrob:...... :icon_flower: :cloud9:

[Zeek]

:cloud9: I see a difference between receive Him and accept Him, Zeek. I think we receive Him as a bride receives her husband. We were already betrothed to Him (He is the light of all men that come into the world), but just like in the arranged marriages of the time, many times they did not see their husband fully until their wedding day (initial revelation). They might steal a glance at him at the markets, ect., but they were not allowed to intermix.

This is as the Shulamite in Song of Solomon, where she is dark but comely (our soul in darkness/ignorance of Him) and she sees Him fleetingly, through the lattice (in part). Then as it progresses, her attributes change as she draws closer and closer to her beloved. Blessings....

i was looking at the different words in greek for receive, and one is a passive reception and one is an active reception, "to take". 

for example:

2Co 11:4  For if he that cometh preacheth another Jesus, whom we have not preached, or if ye receive another spirit, which ye have not received, or another gospel, which ye have not accepted, ye might well bear with him.
G2983
λαμβάνω
lambanō
lam-ban'-o

A prolonged form of a primary verb, which is used only as an alternate in certain tenses; to take (in very many applications, literally and figuratively [probably objective or active, to get hold of; whereas G1209 is rather subjective or passive, to have offered to one; while G138 is more violent, to seize or remove]): - accept, + be amazed, assay, attain, bring, X when I call, catch, come on (X unto), + forget, have, hold, obtain, receive (X after), take (away, up).


thanks for your reply, i'm gonna look into this some more.

:grin:

Z

[Molly]

Lambano is an important word.


But as many as [lambano] received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God...

--John 1



John 6:63
The Spirit gives life; the flesh counts for nothing. The words I have spoken to you are spirit and they are life.

[Molly]

His words, the tree of life, are in the midst of our hearts--the holy of holies--yes, that's right, isn't it?

But, we cannot go in there without the high priest? without the covering of the mercy seat?

Without being sufficiently purified--it is the most holy place--without a pure heart.

But, every man has a conscience, even those who do evil all day long.


Matthew 5:8
Blessed are the pure in heart: for they shall see God.

[claypot]

Lambano is an important word.


But as many as [lambano] received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God...

--John 1



John 6:63
The Spirit gives life; the flesh counts for nothing. The words I have spoken to you are spirit and they are life.

Hey Molly, where do I get the pure heart? I do need to receive Him but where does this ability to receive Him come from?

How does one get a pure heart?

cp