Why does God Choose Just So Many Now for Salvation?

[Paul Hazelwood]

G5591  psuchikos  psoo-khee-kos'

from G5590;

sensitive, i.e. animate (in distinction on the one hand from G4152, which is
the higher or renovated nature; and on the other from G5446, which is the
lower or bestial nature):--natural, sensual.




First the natural according to how God made us.  We are higher and renovated over other things in creation.  Soulish is the nature in which we are in the natural.   Our spiritual nature is beyond the flesh, beyond what we can demonstrate physically or with our feelings.

[Tony N]

G5591  psuchikos  psoo-khee-kos'

from G5590;

sensitive, i.e. animate (in distinction on the one hand from G4152, which is
the higher or renovated nature; and on the other from G5446, which is the
lower or bestial nature):--natural, sensual.




First the natural according to how God made us.  We are higher and renovated over other things in creation.  Soulish is the nature in which we are in the natural.   Our spiritual nature is beyond the flesh, beyond what we can demonstrate physically or with our feelings.

Dear Paul,
What does that have to do with:
The first man, Adam, "became a living soul: the
last Adam a vivifying Spirit."  (46)  But not first the spiritual,
but the soulish, thereupon the spiritual."  (47)  The first man was
out of the earth, soilish; the second Man is the Lord out of heaven." 

It's not about us but about Adam and Christ.

[Paul Hazelwood]

It is about us because we are on the journey from the natural to the spiritual.

The bible is the message for us and it uses Adam and Christ as a picture to tell us our journey. 

[Tony N]

It is about us because we are on the journey from the natural to the spiritual.
The bible is the message for us and it uses Adam and Christ as a picture to tell us our journey. 

Excellent thought, Paul! It makes sense.

1Co 15:46-49  But not first the spiritual, but the soulish, thereupon the spiritual." 
(47)  The first man was out of the earth, soilish; the second Man is the Lord out of heaven." 
(48)  Such as the soilish one is, such are those also who are soilish,
and such as the Celestial One, such are those also who are celestials." 
(49)  And according as we wear the image of the soilish, we should be
wearing the image also of the Celestial."

I see where you are coming from and where you are heading.

[Taffy]

1Cr 2:14 But 1161 the natural 5591 man 444 receiveth 1209 not 3756 the things 3588 of the Spirit 4151 of God

2316: for 1063 they are 2076 foolishness 3472 unto him 846: neither 2532 3756 can 1410 he know 1097 [them], because 3754 they are spiritually 4153 discerned 350 .

1Cr 15:44 It is sown 4687 a natural 5591 body 4983; it is raised 1453 a spiritual 4152 body 4983. There is 2076 a natural 5591 body 4983, and 2532 there is 2076 a spiritual 4152 body 4983.

1Cr 15:46 Howbeit 235 that [was] not 3756 first 4412 which is spiritual 4152, but 235 that which is natural 5591; and afterward 1899 that which is spiritual 4152.


Jud 1:19 These 3778 be 1526 they who separate 592 themselves 1438, sensual 5591, having 2192 not 3361 the Spirit 4151.

The natural man is not the sensual\soulish man

spliting hairs and words over NOTHING

Jam 3:15 This 3778 wisdom 4678 descendeth 2076 2718 not 3756 from above 509, but 235 [is] earthly 1919, sensual 5591, devilish 1141.

[Taffy]

It is about us because we are on the journey from the natural to the spiritual.
The bible is the message for us and it uses Adam and Christ as a picture to tell us our journey. 

Excellent thought, Paul! It makes sense.

1Co 15:46-49  But not first the spiritual, but the soulish, thereupon the spiritual." 
(47)  The first man was out of the earth, soilish; the second Man is the Lord out of heaven." 
(48)  Such as the soilish one is, such are those also who are soilish,
and such as the Celestial One, such are those also who are celestials." 
(49)  And according as we wear the image of the soilish, we should be
wearing the image also of the Celestial."

I see where you are coming from and where you are heading.

Yaposted this over me Tony....
Amen...

sorry to repeat types, shadows , similtudes, but the scroptures repeat this

Tis what I refer to as
Flesh v Spirit
Old man v new Man
Old C V New C
Drakness v Light
Night VDay
esau v Jacob
Cain VAbel\Seth
Old Jerusalem v New Jerusalem
Physical Temple V spiritual Temple
and list just goes on T...is there a Better way to learn than Repition?


T

[Tony N]

1Cr 2:14 But 1161 the natural 5591 man 444 receiveth 1209 not 3756 the things 3588 of the Spirit 4151 of God

2316: for 1063 they are 2076 foolishness 3472 unto him 846: neither 2532 3756 can 1410 he know 1097 [them], because 3754 they are spiritually 4153 discerned 350 .

1Cr 15:44 It is sown 4687 a natural 5591 body 4983; it is raised 1453 a spiritual 4152 body 4983. There is 2076 a natural 5591 body 4983, and 2532 there is 2076 a spiritual 4152 body 4983.

1Cr 15:46 Howbeit 235 that [was] not 3756 first 4412 which is spiritual 4152, but 235 that which is natural 5591; and afterward 1899 that which is spiritual 4152.


Jud 1:19 These 3778 be 1526 they who separate 592 themselves 1438, sensual 5591, having 2192 not 3361 the Spirit 4151.

The natural man is not the sensual\soulish man

spliting hairs and words over NOTHING

Jam 3:15 This 3778 wisdom 4678 descendeth 2076 2718 not 3756 from above 509, but 235 [is] earthly 1919, sensual 5591, devilish 1141.

Taffy, that's my whole point. Adam was not a natural man but a soulish man. That is what the Scriptures tell us.
They are not the same thing.

You wrote:

Tis what I refer to as
Flesh v Spirit
Old man v new Man
Old C V New C
Drakness v Light
Night VDay
esau v Jacob
Cain VAbel\Seth
Old Jerusalem v New Jerusalem
Physical Temple V spiritual Temple
and list just goes on T...is there a Better way to learn than Repition?

Good points bro.
Don't forget one more: Soulish V Spiritual  :laughing7:

[sheila]

  It is because ADAM[Man] is a two part creation

  for this reason animals with split hooves that chewed the cud were considered clean.

 Secrets of Enoch  30;12  I conceived a cunning saying to say
  I created man from invisible and visible nature, of both are his death and life and image, he knows speech like some created thing, small in greatness,and again great in smallness.

 And I placed him on earth, a second angel, honourous,great and glorious. And I appointed him as ruler to rule on earth,
and to have my wisdom, and there was none like him on earth
of all my existing creatures

  as we have born the image of the corruptible,so,too, we shall
 bear the image of the incorruptible

                                   Sheila

[Taffy]

1Cr 2:14 But 1161 the natural 5591 man 444 receiveth 1209 not 3756 the things 3588 of the Spirit 4151 of God

2316: for 1063 they are 2076 foolishness 3472 unto him 846: neither 2532 3756 can 1410 he know 1097 [them], because 3754 they are spiritually 4153 discerned 350 .

1Cr 15:44 It is sown 4687 a natural 5591 body 4983; it is raised 1453 a spiritual 4152 body 4983. There is 2076 a natural 5591 body 4983, and 2532 there is 2076 a spiritual 4152 body 4983.

1Cr 15:46 Howbeit 235 that [was] not 3756 first 4412 which is spiritual 4152, but 235 that which is natural 5591; and afterward 1899 that which is spiritual 4152.


Jud 1:19 These 3778 be 1526 they who separate 592 themselves 1438, sensual 5591, having 2192 not 3361 the Spirit 4151.

The natural man is not the sensual\soulish man

spliting hairs and words over NOTHING

Jam 3:15 This 3778 wisdom 4678 descendeth 2076 2718 not 3756 from above 509, but 235 [is] earthly 1919, sensual 5591, devilish 1141.

Taffy, that's my whole point. Adam was not a natural man but a soulish man. That is what the Scriptures tell us.
They are not the same thing.

You wrote:

Tis what I refer to as
Flesh v Spirit
Old man v new Man
Old C V New C
Drakness v Light
Night VDay
esau v Jacob
Cain VAbel\Seth
Old Jerusalem v New Jerusalem
Physical Temple V spiritual Temple
and list just goes on T...is there a Better way to learn than Repition?

Good points bro.
Don't forget one more: Soulish V Spiritual  :laughing7:

DID SO T..flesh, not sarx..

i forgot the comma bro..for the Natural\flesh\soulish\sensual man is the soulish man..not to be mistaken with the natural animals....

[Nathan]

G5591  psuchikos  psoo-khee-kos'

from G5590;

sensitive, i.e. animate (in distinction on the one hand from G4152, which is
the higher or renovated nature; and on the other from G5446, which is the
lower or bestial nature):--natural, sensual.




First the natural according to how God made us.  We are higher and renovated over other things in creation.  Soulish is the nature in which we are in the natural.   Our spiritual nature is beyond the flesh, beyond what we can demonstrate physically or with our feelings.

Dear Paul,
What does that have to do with:
The first man, Adam, "became a living soul: the
last Adam a vivifying Spirit."  (46)  But not first the spiritual,
but the soulish, thereupon the spiritual."  (47)  The first man was
out of the earth, soilish; the second Man is the Lord out of heaven." 

It's not about us but about Adam and Christ.

Adam and Christ are "in" us.  Scripture is simply about the Father and his two sons.  The first Adam that manifested on earth, fell out of order, the Last Adam gave his life to restore the order in the first Adam back to the Father.  It's instantaneous and it's a process.  Soulishness = carnality  A man's fleshly desires is a man's carnal lusts.  Adam was a natural man, led by his soulish mind.  Which is to say, his natural reasoning was his compass.  But we are called to be led by the spirit . . .broken record . . . but still holds true.

What does "flesh and blood" mean to you?

[claypot]

The word which came to Jeremiah from Jehovah, saying,  2  Arise, and go down to the potter's house, and there I will cause thee to hear my words.  3  Then I went down to the potter's house, and, behold, he was making a work on the wheels.  4  And when the vessel that he made of the clay was marred in the hand of the potter, he made it again another vessel, as seemed good to the potter to make it.jer18.1

Can it be any clearer what God is doing?

cp

[Taffy]

The word which came to Jeremiah from Jehovah, saying,  2  Arise, and go down to the potter's house, and there I will cause thee to hear my words.  3  Then I went down to the potter's house, and, behold, he was making a work on the wheels.  4  And when the vessel that he made of the clay was marred in the hand of the potter, he made it again another vessel, as seemed good to the potter to make it.jer18.1

Can it be any clearer what God is doing?

cp

DIFFERENT pots CP, if one look Outwardly ....But Im wid ya...same piece -RE-MADE.... :icon_flower:

[Tony N]

The word which came to Jeremiah from Jehovah, saying,  2  Arise, and go down to the potter's house, and there I will cause thee to hear my words.  3  Then I went down to the potter's house, and, behold, he was making a work on the wheels.  4  And when the vessel that he made of the clay was marred in the hand of the potter, he made it again another vessel, as seemed good to the potter to make it.jer18.1

Can it be any clearer what God is doing?

cp

It is concerning the house of Israel.

Jer 18:6 As this potter am I not able to do to you? O house of Israel, an affirmation of Yahweh. Lo, as clay in the hand of the potter, So [are] you in My hand, O house of Israel."

[Nathan]

1st dimension . . .he's making a literal clay vessel
2nd dimension . . .he's making Israel/corporate church
3rd dimension . . .he's making me.

[claypot]

The house of Israel.

The temple of God.

IMO and Scriptures, it seems, I am the temple of God.

So much figurative language in Scripture and, when deciphered, its always like jumping in a cool lake on a very hot day!

cp

[Tony N]

The house of Israel.

The temple of God.

IMO and Scriptures, it seems, I am the temple of God.

So much figurative language in Scripture and, when deciphered, its always like jumping in a cool lake on a very hot day!

cp

What does the Potters House have anything to do with Why Does God Choose Just So Many For Salvation?

As a Potter God was shaping the destiny of Israel. As a potter smashes the clay so will God smash Israel and all her inhabitants for all the evil they were doing. But God is responsible because just as the clay was marred in the hand of the potter, so Israel was purposely marred by God's hand.

[sheila]

  actually ,all are made for salvation

   vessels of wrath fitted for destruction...and vessels of mercy

   prepared before hand for glory

[Tony N]

sheila,
Do you think it possible that the subject of the potter in Jeremiah and the potter of Romans 9 are about two different events?

[claypot]

The house of Israel.

The temple of God.

IMO and Scriptures, it seems, I am the temple of God.

So much figurative language in Scripture and, when deciphered, its always like jumping in a cool lake on a very hot day!

cp

What does the Potters House have anything to do with Why Does God Choose Just So Many For Salvation?

As a Potter God was shaping the destiny of Israel. As a potter smashes the clay so will God smash Israel and all her inhabitants for all the evil they were doing. But God is responsible because just as the clay was marred in the hand of the potter, so Israel was purposely marred by God's hand.

And so was Adam Brother.

cp

[sheila]

  they are both related...the old covenant nailed to a stake
     vessel of wrath..New Covenant..vessel of mercy.

   I think His work multiplies until it fills the universe...all in all

    what the law could not make perfect..the mercy and grace and spirit of God can.

  sin's law in my flesh[old covenant/imperfect/wrath]
  Royal Law of love and mercy[new covenant/perfect/mercy]

  truth is truth..all the way up to the heavens
  truth, within and without, in the earth as heaven
  in us all and through us all..and in Him and through Him

[Tony N]

The house of Israel.

The temple of God.

IMO and Scriptures, it seems, I am the temple of God.

So much figurative language in Scripture and, when deciphered, its always like jumping in a cool lake on a very hot day!

cp

What does the Potters House have anything to do with Why Does God Choose Just So Many For Salvation?

As a Potter God was shaping the destiny of Israel. As a potter smashes the clay so will God smash Israel and all her inhabitants for all the evil they were doing. But God is responsible because just as the clay was marred in the hand of the potter, so Israel was purposely marred by God's hand.

And so was Adam Brother.

cp

I agree.

[sheila]

..  Romans 11;13   I am talking to you gentiles.Inasmuch
  as I am the apostle to the gentiles. I make much of my
  ministry,in the Hope that I may somehow  AROUSE MY OWN
  PEOPLE to envy [this is the just so many now] and SAVE some of them.[bring old covenant into new]

    For if their rejection is the reconciliation of the world,
   what will their acceptance be,but life from the dead[resurrection?]

   you could see the same thing today/Babylon is Babylon

   whether 2000 years ago or today...it is what Jesus followers
  come out of[old/wrath-New/mercy]

    the same falling away,thereof that we were instructed to come out of

    get thrown out..or come out of

   He has restored ...He has told us..ALL will be saved ...

   why just so many now? why so few of us have come out of it now...what about the billions still in Babylon?

   because unto you it has been given the Kingdom of Heaven..and to them it is hidden..through the speaking of
parables,,, so that they hear and do not understand

  and why..becauseth whomever I desire I hardeneth..and whomever on whom I have mercy,I have mercy

   It is His Great Mercy and tenderness unto us that we
  have such treasure in our vessels.....

[sheila]

  the vessels of Wrath...receive the same judgement .

  in their flesh[as ye judge so shall ye be judged]

  in every way they try to hurt/ kill the two wittness's they are

   hurt/killed]

     He who judges without mercy,shall have his judgement

  without mercy...

we are the vessels of mercy...we have the spirit of grace and mercy in our vessels...and not the wrath of God

   our vessels will also be emptied out..of the mercy that is in it

   but their vessels will also be emptied of the wrath in them...
   for they pour forth wrath upon one another and consume one another and devour one another

   christendom/muslim/jews   Just think of the literal Jerusalem at this moment...the warring and wrath being poured out.
   [ I think of the earthquake and the city in three parts]

   various factions of Abraham's seed...and nation against nation
   and kingdom[heaven] against kingdom[darkness]

   famines; spiritual [for hearing the Word of God] and literal

   why does He choose so few to know him in this earth?

    I don't know..He just always has done that...Jesus said

    few would find the way...always,it seem He chooses a remnant

    Amos 3;12  This is what the Lord says ' As a shepherd
 
  saves from the lion's mouth only two leg bones or a peice of

  an ear, so will the Israelites be saved

   I think this,too..may be part of the 'especially' of those who

   beleive....