Why did God create the universe in the first place

[Ross]

I.M.O God  created Satan.
Gave him a job to do; and this was all before man was created.
Jesus states Satan was a murderer from the beginning.[John 8;44]
John also points this out in 1 John3;8 about the devil sinning from the beginning.
Paul mentions handing a couple of dude to Satan for their correction - 1 Tim 1;20
Jesus recognised Satan as ruler of this age whilst being tempted in the wilderness.

Seems Satan throws the book at us about legal matters. Twists everything in an ambiguous manner and inflicts punishment to the max.
Wants every person to worship him, just like Nebuchadnezzar demonstrated. I.M.O this is why we are told in church to
              "heads down, eyes closed."
Jesus tells us to come like a child, and no child comes freely with the head down or the eyes closed, otherwise they would bump into all sorts of things, and not see where they are going- just like the church seems to behave without being aware of that similarity.

All of this for a reason- which is revealed to us all at our appointed time as part of our wisdom in what to truly value, and the literality of love conquering all.

[marie glen]

Amen! That's very interesting.. I agree with just a slight difference. All ordered, arranged and engineered by God - not some surprise event which oh dear, whatever shall God do now!? :doh: :laughing7: I think of the adversary as part, or that is, head of "the angels which left their first place" (appointment). As the verse points out angels can leave their (appointed) place (position?) And I tend to believe it occurred once and not twice as it seems some believers have come to believe, with two classes or groups of fallen or dark angels.

And I believe God only created the universe and man and woman / Adam and Eve, after what I think of as the first bound to occur rebel thought, not only occurred but had ripened into outright potential sedition and rebellion. As it seems the most logical to me that thinking ability includes the ability to make choices. (But not of course the biggie/ the big choice! But that one is ONLY arranged and ordered ["Kosmos" or form of/ordered] by God.) ..."left their place".. Which boils down to, does rationality include being able to make, ultimately, all range of choices (except the one for God, that being only ordered by God, each in their own order (division?)

This, to me, portrays His Great patience.. "Beginning" of course can refer, like Genesis, to the beginning of earthly creation..)

But! If He did create Satan as a mastermind of evil originally, that would explain, to me anyway, the "scapegoat" as one who does actually or forever "perish". Simpler to create an evil dude and then cast him out/throw him away.. than to wait millennia for that first bound to occur idea of, do we really have to do everything God's way?!" As it seems like it could be a long wait, when there was only the Father/His Presence, the Son, and the angels/like winds, that there wouldn't be that much to go astray about. But at the exactly right moment.. that 'little' garden in a vast universe, innocent and ripe/not so difficult to deceive, and lead to the wRong road of living which becomes the road of death, as opposed to the one of Life.

But upon which road all in heaven and earth are learning good from evil (life from death? Nonlife) whereby He is writing (deeply engraving) His Law (love!) upon every heart and mind. (Sealing us? Like we are being exposed to evil, like being vaccinated against it?) lol. ALL arranged and ordered/kosmos by God.. not some unforeseen occurrence, which of course is impossible!
:Peace2:

[1 Larry H]

What is the full preterist view of the future? Does anything happen to change the age we're in, or does life and generations and nations rising and falling continue into all foreseeable future..?

Yes, that seems to be the scenario of the full preterist view since they believe all things were fulfilled in the first century.  My take is a little different then the full Preterist  ending, we die, and enter into the heavenly household of God in the likeness of Jesus.

In short this life is only a bus stop to the next. I don't find it  strange  that in the natural order of this planet all things get eradicated, including the biological human being. Since Adam and Eve never did have eternal life in the first place prior to the fall.

God left them, all with the blood of Adam, with a free will to choose for themselves in a world of corruption which I think caused the scenario question. It seem to me this world with never be a paradise as suggest by those who take Revelation 21:4 literally.

[marie glen]

 :Oops: :offtopic: :mlaugh:   (Or that is, wrong thread - http://tentmaker.org/forum/welcome-central/preterism-the-new-frontier-of-eschatology/msg212771/?topicseen#msg212771

[1 Larry H]

I cut and pasted this, what do you think :Chinscratch:

"The Father and Jesus Christ existed from the beginning and always will exist. It is Their plan and desire to add to Their kind— "bringing many sons to glory" (Hebrews 2:10). Just as all life was made to reproduce after its own kind as stated throughout Genesis 1, so God patterned man after the God kind. This is the ultimate meaning of Genesis 1:26, where God says, "Let Us make man in Our image, according to Our likeness."

This is a two-stage process. First, God made mankind physical, of the dust of the earth. Then, through conversion and faith in Christ and obedience to God's spiritual law of love, each person becomes spiritually a "new creation" (2 Corinthians 5:17; Ephesians 4:24). This leads to the final birth of new children into the divine family, who are then "like" Christ, Himself the first born Son of God (Romans 8:29; Galatians 4:19; 1 John 3:2).

Indeed, just as human children are the same kind of beings as their parents (that is, human beings), so will God's children be the same kind of beings as the Father and Christ (that is, divine beings). This is the awesome destiny of mankind! The God family will expand through God's wonderful plan as revealed in His Word.

All children of this family—including Jesus Christ, who has always been with the One whom He revealed as "the Father" (John 1:18; Matthew 11:27)—will forever in the future willingly be under the ultimate sovereignty and leadership of the Father (1 Corinthians 15:28). Led by the Father and Jesus Christ, the members of this divine family will share a glorious and righteous future into eternity.

This, then, is the sense in which God is a family—indeed a growing family, presently comprising two divine Beings, the Father and Jesus Christ the firstborn, yet ultimately to be joined by a vast multitude of others."

[guest6088]

Love creates.

God is love.  :HeartThrob:

[marie glen]

I cut and pasted this, what do you think :Chinscratch:

"The Father and Jesus Christ existed from the beginning and always will exist. It is Their plan and desire to add to Their kind— "bringing many sons to glory" (Hebrews 2:10). Just as all life was made to reproduce after its own kind as stated throughout Genesis 1, so God patterned man after the God kind. This is the ultimate meaning of Genesis 1:26, where God says, "Let Us make man in Our image, according to Our likeness."

This is a two-stage process. First, God made mankind physical, of the dust of the earth. Then, through conversion and faith in Christ and obedience to God's spiritual law of love, each person becomes spiritually a "new creation" (2 Corinthians 5:17; Ephesians 4:24). This leads to the final birth of new children into the divine family, who are then "like" Christ, Himself the first born Son of God (Romans 8:29; Galatians 4:19; 1 John 3:2).

Indeed, just as human children are the same kind of beings as their parents (that is, human beings), so will God's children be the same kind of beings as the Father and Christ (that is, divine beings). This is the awesome destiny of mankind! The God family will expand through God's wonderful plan as revealed in His Word.

All children of this family—including Jesus Christ, who has always been with the One whom He revealed as "the Father" (John 1:18; Matthew 11:27)—will forever in the future willingly be under the ultimate sovereignty and leadership of the Father (1 Corinthians 15:28). Led by the Father and Jesus Christ, the members of this divine family will share a glorious and righteous future into eternity.

This, then, is the sense in which God is a family—indeed a growing family, presently comprising two divine Beings, the Father and Jesus Christ the firstborn, yet ultimately to be joined by a vast multitude of others."

That sounds perfect to me! I read somewhere not too long ago  (in this thread?) that Jesus is the prototype.. I think there has to be something to that!

[marie glen]

Love creates.

God is love.  :HeartThrob:

:thumbsup: