Was Jesus God?

[Dandelion]

I personally think it is less important what we call God, the Father; Jesus, His only begotten Son; and the Holy Spirit, and more important how we see their relationship and the implications for our viewpoint
and how we see the connection between their love; their mission and their unity.

As I said, I come from a trinitarian background. Born and raised a Roman Catholic, went to Catholic School for 12 years, and remained a RC for 47 years, faithfully going to Church and volunteering at Church, every week of my life, without skipping a beat. My son attended a Lutheran College and after only a few weeks there, decided to become Lutheran. In a few months, so did I and soon after began studying to be a Deacon and then a rostered Lutheran teacher, in the church. I have had much training in theology in both the RC church and the Lutheran Church, and have taught in both churches, and studied theology and continue to do so, in other denominations, as well. Many trained ministers in various traditions are close friends and comrades in ministry with me.

So, in the traditions I am most familiar with, I am very much the standard regarding the trinity. In fact, I am probably much more liberal in my thinking, than most.

But, I do enjoy hearing all of your views and it is important to always keep an open mind, heart, and soul to the Holy Spirit......whatever you would like to call Him.      :Book:

I do so enjoy the Tent.     :cheerleader:

D.

Just wanted to add, more for me than for you all, is that, all the above makes me no closer to God.

Knowledge is good, but God judges us by our hearts, not our heads. And, knowledge, without faith, hope and especially love, will get us nowhere.

I know we are saved by faith, not by works.

Sometimes, we need to listen to what we are saying. Just reading a book called The Prodigal God, and I realized that this blurb had to be adjusted. I see some pride seeping in the above statement, and I had to address that. Do I hear an Amen?

Thanks, folks, for letting me put that out there.       :gimpossible:           :gumbrage:   


D. 

[lastpost]

I personally think it is less important what we call God, the Father; Jesus, His only begotten Son; and the Holy Spirit, and more important how we see their relationship and the implications for our viewpoint
and how we see the connection between their love; their mission and their unity.

As I said, I come from a trinitarian background. Born and raised a Roman Catholic, went to Catholic School for 12 years, and remained a RC for 47 years, faithfully going to Church and volunteering at Church, every week of my life, without skipping a beat. My son attended a Lutheran College and after only a few weeks there, decided to become Lutheran. In a few months, so did I and soon after began studying to be a Deacon and then a rostered Lutheran teacher, in the church. I have had much training in theology in both the RC church and the Lutheran Church, and have taught in both churches, and studied theology and continue to do so, in other denominations, as well. Many trained ministers in various traditions are close friends and comrades in ministry with me.

So, in the traditions I am most familiar with, I am very much the standard regarding the trinity. In fact, I am probably much more liberal in my thinking, than most.

But, I do enjoy hearing all of your views and it is important to always keep an open mind, heart, and soul to the Holy Spirit......whatever you would like to call Him.      :Book:

I do so enjoy the Tent.     :cheerleader:

D.

Just wanted to add, more for me than for you all, is that, all the above makes me no closer to God.

Knowledge is good, but God judges us by our hearts, not our heads. And, knowledge, without faith, hope and especially love, will get us nowhere.

I know we are saved by faith, not by works.

Sometimes, we need to listen to what we are saying. Just reading a book called The Prodigal God, and I realized that this blurb had to be adjusted. I see some pride seeping in the above statement, and I had to address that. Do I hear an Amen?

Thanks, folks, for letting me put that out there.       :gimpossible:           :gumbrage:   


D.

Dear Dandelion,

While I personally do not adhere to any of the methods of Biblical tradition that you have named (the creeds and three Persons in One in the traditional sense), I see that they have been Divinely beneficial to you. It is refreshing (to me anyway) to hear honesty and non-egotistical acceptance of self-criticism.

I was brought up a Roman Catholic at primary school but Father Moore never told us anything theological, he just spoke of Jesus. I was never swamped with religion as I went to church on Sundays and my mother and father sat at home smoking and drinking, but Communion was nice to do though. My elder brother went to a Catholic school, De La Salle, and it certainly did not do him any harm. I have been in Evangelical and Pentecostal services but I have to admit I found them empty and the spirit that I sensed was earthy and material and I personally did not find it uplifting, if I may put it like that.

Regarding the Father, Son and Holy Spirit, I have learnt that I should make myself aware hourly of the enemies of the Light all around, and signing the Cross is one quick method I often use which is something that the Spirit, which I trust through years of experience, suggested, because combined with the heart motive it is truly powerful against unseen foes who hate to see the Light making progress but hate to feel the love of the Cross. (If things are getting tough then it is a good sign.) I will say no more about that.

Personally, I consider it to be the case that it is not what you believe so much as what what you believe has done to you, in the sense of bringing you closer to the God who rules us all and who lives in us too as Christ (as you quoted: "We will come and make out home with them"). I truly believe that the Christ Spirit is the dominant factor over theologies (rather than theologies stifling the Christ Spirit), and there will come a time in the Spirit when all differences in theological belief will melt away in the unity of Service. What was so desperately important about this word and that word which even caused a spiritual friendship to fracture will be seen to have been so petty when compared to the Life of opportunity now set before the follower of Christ Himself.

I have been trying to understand why people believe what they do and in so doing I have realised that fear plays such a huge part in all of this. Fear of being wrong after so much effort and thought has been put in to devising a theological structure; fear of having to reorganise a very intricate way of thought; fear indeed of the unknown; and fear of evil itself.

I cannot help but see one world being made up of both the Spiritual and Material worlds. I do not personally take visions literally and create a theology out of them. I also think it is a dangerous pedestal to climb upon for anyone to be thinking of the right to judgement of others at their own judgement – are they even capable of judging themselves, because that is the way of it in my understanding – our higher Selves, the Spirit within which God has given will judge us, everything, commissions, missed opportunities, second and third best choices, hatred of others who have harmed us, that dark human desire for revenge which was harboured for years. And in the Spirit nothing is hidden from anyone, all is seen as a picture book on and in ones being, no more pretence, no more superiority, no more difference...

My own beliefs would not only transgress the boundaries set for this forum should I voice them (guests should make every effort to be polite), but I also realise that what I believe would be frightening to some, and the only way that the Spirit works in my book is through Love alone.

Most of what I say theologically is not from me but it is me saying what I have heard from what I personally believe to be the Spirit, and it has not come from the inspired mind of a man or woman whether in the Bible or not, but that is something that I have to live with as I see it is too different for many. I am not here to change anyone's mind, I am here now and again to learn why others seem to think what they think and also because my greatest joy is the chance to think of the Christ, for in thinking of Him as the Tender Teacher or as the Spiritual Saviour brings around me and in me the only thing I ever want – more of Him.