Which God are you serving?

[HungerForTruth]

I found this on another website and thought it was an uplifting read.  Enjoy!!

Which God are you serving?
 
The god of Calvinism sacrificed his son Jesus Christ to die on the cross for his elect few only, and he predestined only his elect to be saved. This must also mean that he predestined, knowingly and willingly, to cast the vast majority of humanity (the non-elect) into hell to be tortured forever. This makes the god of Calvinism an evil god, infinitely and unimaginably more evil than Hitler could ever be.
 
The god of Arminianism sacrificed his son Jesus Christ to die on the cross for all people, and he wills all people to come to the knowledge of the truth and be saved, but he has made himself weak and helpless to save all people by allowing man's free will to override his will in salvation. Against his will, the god of Arminianism is forced to throw the vast majority of humanity into hell to be tortured forever, because for one reason or another, they failed to accept Jesus Christ in this life before they died. Even worse than that, the god of Arminianism knowingly and willingly created human beings with the full foreknowledge that the vast majority of them would reject salvation and end up being tortured in hell forever. This makes the god of Arminianism both an evil god, as evil as the god of Calvinism, and a weak god who allows the free will of fallen man to override his will in salvation.
 
The God of the Bible is the one true Father God Yahveh Elohim who sent His only begotten Son, Jesus Christ Yeshua Elohim, to sacrificially die on the cross for the sins of the whole world. Jesus Christ died for all people; past, present and future, and God wills all people to come to the knowledge of the truth and be saved. He has unlimited love and power to save all people in His time and in His order, extending beyond this age. This makes the one true God of the Bible the all-powerful, all-loving, wise, just, merciful, forgiving and gracious Father God.
 
 
Conclusion

Make no mistake about it. You are profoundly affected by how you understand these three beliefs: Calvinism, Arminianism, and Universalism. Your understanding of God's sovereignty, His love, His justice, His righteousness, His forgiveness and His grace are all fundamentally governed and coloured by each belief system.
 
People who believe that God will punish unbelievers in hell forever or annihilate them limit God's sovereignty, power, love, forgiveness, grace and the very Gospel of Jesus Christ itself. They deny that Jesus Christ, the only begotten Son of God, is indeed the Saviour of the world.

From:  http://www.godsplanforall.com/calvinismarminianismanduniversalism

[ed]

Make no mistake about it. You are profoundly affected by how you understand these three beliefs: Calvinism, Arminianism, and Universalism.

So very true.

:dsunny:

[bushy]

Yes, what we believe is very important. "You shall know the truth and the truth shall set you free." Believing a lie won't do that.

[HungerForTruth]

Yes, what we believe is very important. "You shall know the truth and the truth shall set you free." Believing a lie won't do that.

Exactly.  I was a Calvinist for a long long time.  I thought I was free - but now I can see I was cynical and an doctrinal judgementalist.  Bad fruit.  :punish:

[sheila]

knowledge puffs up,love builds up.  He who does not gather with me..scatters. Some just have 30 fold..revelation of the width/depth/heigth

of Christ. Some 60 some 100.Think not that God gave us the knowledge of the salvation of all men..that we judge men.

   Christ is NOT divided...men by their knowledge..become puffed up..and think themselves something in Christ..and set their brother's at

nought. The House of prayer for all men became divided....through knowledge puffing up...wisdom would have built up the house.

  ex; if I visit an apostolic church....some...who think there is more than one God...and does not realize that there is only one true God

....would wrongfully judge me of idolatry against God.[meat from an idol when an idol is nothing] Missing the mark of love and

  not realizing that those in that congregation..may just be 30 fold in their revelation of Christ.......and would be just as guilty of the

same sin/lack they were acusing such of.

   the beast that destroys the harlot..is not the spirit of God or Christ...it is wicked...but it is God who who uses evil for the good of

those who love Him.    The spirit of Christ says to the woman caught in adultery...go and sin no more..lest something worse befall you

   if a beast but touch the mount of God,he is to be stoned to death[with the same judgement ye judge/ye shall be judged]

   Rev 22;18-20

   the kingdom of heaven is like..a woman that took a measure of leavening[faith] and hid it in 3 measures of flour..until all was leavened.

   Daniel prophesied ..the saints were overcome...first the jewish believers[who rejected Christ] then christendom[who divided Christ]

.........that all be saved and no flesh boast.    Yes...those sinner men out there in the world..that the churches preached et and ed

against..are recievers of grace from God each in his order...3rd measure=all.

   and in the last days I shall pour out my spirit on ALL FLESH.

   some become over-righteous,some-over wicked,some over-comers.   Greater is Christ that is in you..then he who is in the world.

[HungerForTruth]

   Christ is NOT divided...

:iagree:  True - but the so called "CHURCH" is seriously divided.   

[sheila]

you can have 100 fold faith[salvation of all men] 100 fold knowledge[of depth/height/width of God] but without 100 fold love

  you are but a clanging cymbol.  do you not know that Israel was blinded until the fullness of the gentiles come in..and all Israel will

be saved? and so too, Christendom was divided[failed in flesh] that all[3rd measure recieve grace] and all have been bound up in sin

that mercy shall be shown to all?

   though they be as an enemy[et and ed]for the sake of the gospel[ur/us] yet they are precious to God.

   in the house of prayer/temple arrangement as a shadow of the heavenly reality..there is the outer court,inner court and Holy of Holies

    God's throne/mercy seat/Christ in your heart...in this house of prayer for all men.

[HungerForTruth]

  you are but a clanging cymbol.
   

Ahhhh......but I prefer to think of myself as a bass drum.   :laughing7: :laughing7: :laughing7:

[sheila]

 :laugh:    I'm just wanting us all to push past the resentment of Christendom..and to forgive any mistreatment harm..as He commands

   they know not what they do..anymore than we did..when we were in it.  Or may even still be doing..when we try and limit the depth/width

  heighth of Christ's sacrifice to anything less than all. :friendstu:

[HungerForTruth]

:laugh:    I'm just wanting us all to push past the resentment of Christendom..and to forgive any mistreatment harm..as He commands

   they know not what they do..anymore than we did..when we were in it.  Or may even still be doing..when we try and limit the depth/width

  heighth of Christ's sacrifice to anything less than all. :friendstu:

Yes - you are right of course.   :iagree:  Thank you for the encouragement.   :friendstu:

[sheila]

  so glad you are not offended...I don't always spit out the right way..what I'm trying to say.   I botch it. :HeartThrob:

[Seth]

Make no mistake about it. You are profoundly affected by how you understand these three beliefs: Calvinism, Arminianism, and Universalism.

So very true.

:dsunny:

:iagree:

[Cardinal]

 :cloud9: Amen, Sheila, good word.  :thumbsup: Good to keep in mind when so many things grieve the Spirit in us daily....

[HungerForTruth]

:cloud9: Amen, Sheila, good word.  :thumbsup: Good to keep in mind when so many things grieve the Spirit in us daily....

Being a new "UR Convert" it is so easy for me to think theology war.....which is what I got as a Calvinist, and my friends will certainly think I have lost my mind if I come out of the closet so to speak. 

Anyway, thank you Sheila for the restoration.  :thumbsup:  I repent and want the love of Christ to be shed apart in my heart, even towards those that may persecute me for my change in eschatology.  :punish:

[Seth]

Personally, I agree that we should not be resentful of Christianity. However, insofar as what you actually said, I don't think you need to repent of that. If you had some ulterior motive maybe.

What you did was compare theologies to expose the dreadful consequences of each, and to say that we are affected by what we believe. All true.

You conclude by saying, " People who believe that God will punish unbelievers in hell forever or annihilate them limit God's sovereignty, power, love, forgiveness, grace and the very Gospel of Jesus Christ itself. They deny that Jesus Christ, the only begotten Son of God, is indeed the Saviour of the world. "

I don't see anything untrue about that or anything that led me to think you were motivated by resentment. In fact, it sounds like something Gary Amirault would write. Great OP. You should be encouraged for standing up for the truth, rather than rebuked.

[CHB]

:laugh:    I'm just wanting us all to push past the resentment of Christendom..and to forgive any mistreatment harm..as He commands

   they know not what they do..anymore than we did..when we were in it.  Or may even still be doing..when we try and limit the depth/width

  heighth of Christ's sacrifice to anything less than all. :friendstu:

Amen sheila,

We only know what God has given us.  They are here for a reason that I don't understand and sometimes get frustrated at but one has to keep in mind that even we don't know all the truth.

CHB

[Cardinal]

I don't see anything untrue about that or anything that led me to think you were motivated by resentment. In fact, it sounds like something Gary Amirault would write. Great OP. You should be encouraged for standing up for the truth, rather than rebuked.

:cloud9: My  :2c: I personally didn't take it as a rebuke at all, anymore than I took the original post to be detrimental. Just two sides of the same coin, bringing balance? :dontknow:

[Seth]

Yeah, I don't fundamentally disagree with either side. I just don't think he should feel that he said anything worthy of repentance. That's up to him, I just wanted to provide some encouragement in standing for the truth he spoke which is not easy especially in the Calvinism culture.

[HungerForTruth]

I just do not want to seem divisive.  A theological debate can easily get tempers going.   I do hold some theological tension in my blood it seems, so it rang true with me.

[Seth]

I just do not want to seem divisive.  A theological debate can easily get tempers going.   I do hold some theological tension in my blood it seems, so it rang true with me.

If you have some resentments or tension then by all means repent if you are led. Just know that I was blessed by your OP

[HungerForTruth]

BTW - I still go to this church with the Calvinistic flavor.  My son is an associate pastor there.  This is going to be tough when I tell them my change in eschatology.  I can remember them calling Rob Bell a heretic.  I didn't know what they were talking about - then.  Now I do.   And Rob Bell just pojked about the issue.  I am dogmatic about it.    Oh boy.  Pray for me.  At least my wife agrees with me.

[Seth]

Trust me, I have been there too. I lost friends, was called a heretic and removed from fellowship. You will be in my thoughts, and I greatly respect your passion and willingness. I was lucky to have a wife that agrees too... :LH:

You have a safe place to land here.

[sheila]

 actually, I wrote my post on this only 'Which God are you serving" Hey,I been there,come out of that.....that sentence alone..infers

charges/accusations of adultery.   I come from a history of 'we serve the one true God,everyone else but us are idolators against God!"

   the very warring theology thing sftt spoke of. And I,too, personally had to repent and overcome my own resentment against the

  spiritual harm/damage I suffered"   HE, is refining all of that out of us! so we can be useful unto Him.


  now,lets not neglect all the posts in the past on the board when we had proof in the posts of this very attitude being exhibited

   I've read em,youv'e read em...I may of even wrote some of em..even if I didn't write them..I'm sure I was in agreement with

them at times.

    I myself hated the harlot at times in my heart!!!I exposed her nakedness too!..I agreed with the beast that she was a hypocrite and

  was more than happy to condemn her!

     that is the way of things.....the two wittness's at the end of their testimony were overcome and killed of the beast...and lay

dead 3 days....til....the spirit of life in Christ entered them..and they stood on their feet.....and a voice in heaven said......

   'COME UP HERE!"  my thoughts are not your thoughts...My ways are much higher!

....

[Seth]

I agree, Sheila, there is an understandable anger and frustration that can come if trying to spread the gospel in a world that hates it, and we must be guarded about that. I saw "which God are you serving" as a reminder that Paul spoke of "another Jesus" and "another Gospel." So I saw those words mirroring what was already spoken by the Apostles. I didn't take it as a condemnation, at least not according to the words themselves.  :2c:

[sheila]

 :thumbsup:  two sides of the same  judgement/salvation coin/talent..........