Will He reconcile all THINGS? or all PEOPLE?

[eaglesway]

Really ain't bothered by all the if's and such. ALL is all, and as I said my  :2c: whether the all incorporates, skeeters, wasps, flies, grubs, etc. When we start thinking like this I..my opinion...we start showing our bottom. Either way, ALL is ALL, I'll let the the "what" up to the Creator. :dsunny:

:thumbsup:

[gregoryfl]

Perhaps not reconcile, but set free might be a better term with regard to the entire creation, as separate from mankind. Creation...whatever may encompass that, will share the freedom of God's children, which of course is speaking about humans.

(Rom 8:19)  For the creation is eagerly awaiting the revelation of God's children,

(Rom 8:20)  because the creation has become subject to futility, though not by anything it did. The one who subjected it did so in the certainty

(Rom 8:21)  that the creation itself would also be set free from corrupting bondage in order to share the glorious freedom of God's children.

Ronen

[Tom]

The universe is the manifestation of the power of God from the largest star in outer space to the smallest atom. God is spirit. Life is the activity of spirit. God is who all came out of; God is who is operating all through his will; and God is who all will eventually return into. I think the most comprehensive statement in the inspired written word of God is Romans 11:36 because it says exactly that. See the attachment.

[attachment deleted by admin]

[lomarah]

I, for one, cannot wait to hug a lion. (Seriously.)

I have heard so many stories of people seeing what life will be like after He makes an end of sin and it pretty much always includes animals, and almost always at least one (tame) lion! I don't know why but I have just always wanted to snuggle up to a lion.

(I have also always hoped for no mosquitos, spiders, ticks, and other creepy things to be around for eternity but whatever He's got planned I'm sure it's all good.  :winkgrin:  )

[Tom]

Amen, sis.

[joeteekay]

Greek word G3956 (pas or panta) is translated as "all" or "all things" in most English versions.  As the previous posts, especially by JB and Tom,  indicate "all things" is incorrect.

All is usually an appropriate translation IMO, but not always.  All does not always mean all, entire or whole. In most cases it does.  But sometimes it can mean :as many as", depending on the context. Yeh I know context, context, context.


Strong G3956
all, the whole
Strong's:
πᾶς
all, any, every, the whole
Derivation: including all the forms of declension; apparently a primary word;
KJV Usage: all (manner of, means), alway(-s), any (one), X daily, + ever, every (one, way), as many as, + no(-thing), X thoroughly, whatsoever, whole, whosoever.
Thayer:
1) individually
1a) each, every, any, all, the whole, everyone, all things, everything
2) collectively
2a) some of all types[/size]

In the KJV "all things" is found in 152 verses, in the New Testament, and 80 times in Paul's writings.

In Col. 1:20, all does mean all, the entirety, the whole.

Attach 1

This is the case with most scriptures where we find the G3956 - pas, or its declensions.

In the scripture below it does not mean all, but "as many as" IMO.

KJV - Mat 3:5  Then went out to him Jerusalem, and all Judaea, and all the region round about Jordan,

Attach 2


Sometimes a qualifying term is used in conjunction with the word "pas 0r panta", as in Rom. 8:28 where all is used with "working together"

Attach 3

At the consummation God will be "all in all":

KJV -  1Co_15:28  And when all things shall be subdued unto him, then shall the Son also himself be subject unto him that put all things under him, that God may be all in all (panta en pasin).


KJV -Eph_1:23  Which is his body, the fulness of him that filleth all in all (panta en pasin).

Therefore context is helpful in deriving the intent of a word.  Therefore I suggest that in most cases "all" (pas and its derivatives) really does mean "all",  mosquitoes not with standing.

I have no idea if my attachments will work, just learning.  :dontknow:


[attachment deleted by admin]

[rosered]

 
  For Me its the evil that is done away with      ,  all forms of evil
    when study of evil its what brings   on all the suffering        and  Evil eats and consumes the good         http://www.studylight.org/lexicons/greek/gwview.cgi?n=4190  Psalms 14

http://www.studylight.org/lexicons/greek/gwview.cgi?n=4102

Our faith in what God does though the works   of CHRIST     can and does destroy   the works of evil   
By allowing the grace of God to   work within you    to the saving   gift  by the SPIRIT OF TRUTH    is the Spirit of Prophecy   and Testimony of Jesus Christ   

   
Psalms 114 this prophecy  /fortelling      to be revealed      within us by the Spirit of truth

1Only fools say in their hearts,
"There is no God."
They are corrupt, and their actions are evil;
not one of them does good!
2The LORD looks down from heaven
on the entire human race;
he looks to see if anyone is truly wise,
if anyone seeks God.
3But no, all have turned away;
all have become corrupt.a
No one does good,
not a single one!
4Will those who do evil never learn?
They eat up my people like bread
and wouldn't think of praying to the LORD.
5Terror will grip them,
for God is with those who obey him.
6The wicked frustrate the plans of the oppressed,
but the LORD will protect his people.
7Who will come from Mount Zion to rescue Israel?
When the LORD restores his people,
Jacob will shout with joy, and Israel will rejoice.


  It is Gods consuming fire that will  eat up and consume the works of evil     and the Light of it will SHINE LIKE   BRILLIANT  dazzling, vivid, intense  GLORY !

[Tom]

Greek word G3956 (pas or panta) is translated as "all" or "all things" in most English versions.  As the previous posts, especially by JB and Tom,  indicate "all things" is incorrect.

All is usually an appropriate translation IMO, but not always.  All does not always mean all, entire or whole. In most cases it does.  But sometimes it can mean :as many as", depending on the context. Yeh I know context, context, context.


Strong G3956
all, the whole
Strong's:
πᾶς
all, any, every, the whole
Derivation: including all the forms of declension; apparently a primary word;
KJV Usage: all (manner of, means), alway(-s), any (one), X daily, + ever, every (one, way), as many as, + no(-thing), X thoroughly, whatsoever, whole, whosoever.
Thayer:
1) individually
1a) each, every, any, all, the whole, everyone, all things, everything
2) collectively
2a) some of all types[/size]

In the KJV "all things" is found in 152 verses, in the New Testament, and 80 times in Paul's writings.

In Col. 1:20, all does mean all, the entirety, the whole.

Attach 1

This is the case with most scriptures where we find the G3956 - pas, or its declensions.

In the scripture below it does not mean all, but "as many as" IMO.

KJV - Mat 3:5  Then went out to him Jerusalem, and all Judaea, and all the region round about Jordan,

Attach 2


Sometimes a qualifying term is used in conjunction with the word "pas 0r panta", as in Rom. 8:28 where all is used with "working together"

Attach 3

At the consummation God will be "all in all":

KJV -  1Co_15:28  And when all things shall be subdued unto him, then shall the Son also himself be subject unto him that put all things under him, that God may be all in all (panta en pasin).


KJV -Eph_1:23  Which is his body, the fulness of him that filleth all in all (panta en pasin).

Therefore context is helpful in deriving the intent of a word.  Therefore I suggest that in most cases "all" (pas and its derivatives) really does mean "all",  mosquitoes not with standing.

I have no idea if my attachments will work, just learning.  :dontknow:

Your attachment works, and in case you didn't know you can show all three modules as a comparison. I see you have the CLV, but, assuming you have all three modules, you can click the + or - at the top right to add or subtract between one and three modules. You can also right click on the module initials to change how you want them stacked. The Interlinear Scripture Analyzer is a handy search tool. The only problem is the Old Testament section of the CLV needs to be updated. I was just told recently that the retired president of the Concordant Publishing Concern, Jim Coram, is going to speak to Andre, the author of the program, about getting that done. I proofread the New Testament section of the CLV for Andre quite a while ago, and he told me not to bother doing the Old Testament because he was going to replace it, but then he got involved with some money making stuff and never got around to it. Anyway, maybe now we'll see it sometime soon which would definitely help. Now what I usually do is search something in the Old Testament with the ISA and then compare the text with the CVOT PDF file here. http://concordant.org/online/index.html That's also a good place to check the text of the CLNT PDF file against the HTML CLNT here http://concordant.org/version/CLNT_Intro.htm because it's still got a few typos. I proofread that years ago too, but I've since found a few minor errors, mostly punctuation or spelling, using my text to speech version that haven't been corrected yet. I also prefer the Concordant Keyword Concordance to Strong's that I see you're using because it is for the King James Version. Anyway, I'm sure you're going to find that ISA helpful, and you've got the attachment thing down, bro.

[attachment deleted by admin]

[joeteekay]

thanks Tom  :thumbsup:

[Tom]

PS: I've been told that the CVOT PDF file is soon to be updated a bit also because they are finally about ready to go to print with the book, but right now it is already more accurate than the ISA Old Testament section of the CLV module. If you want to see something funny, search the word "cars" in the ISA, and then compare your results with the CVOT PDF file. That's just one of the bloopers that I remember. I used to have a list of the ones I found, but then I trashed it when I heard a new version was going to be added. When I first read that I thought it was kind of strange because I didn't know they had "cars" in Genesis.

[jbertonbounds]

There can be several ways of looking at this whole thing:

(1) All things are reconciled, meaning that each and every individual person, gnat, fly, mosquito, etc will be resurrected and reconciled to Yah.  Yah certainly can make that work for us, but the quantity of insects produced by this scenario is a real problem for me to comprehend.  It would certainly be a different world, this new creation!

(2) All things are reconciled, meaning that every individual person will be resurrected and reconciled to Yah, but all the rest of creation will simply be restored to its original, perfect state.  All the gnats, flies, etc will not all be individually resurrected, yet new gnats, flies, trees, plants, etc will be a part of the perfectly balanced new creation.

(3) All humanity is reconciled, meaning that each and every individual person will be resurrected and reconciled to Yah, and the rest of the new creation will be pleasing to us, yet may not fully resemble in perfect state what we know here on the earth today.  There may not be all of everything we know here on earth present in the new creation.  Is there a law that says Yah must re-created everything just the way is was before, only perfect?

[joeteekay]

Of the 3 choices, I pick #3.

Things is a word not found in the original text.
All humanity will be reconciled.

The new Heavens and new Earth do not need anything physical like our sun.
It will ALL be spirit. I do not believe in spiritual mosquitoes.   :laughing7:

[eaglesway]

In order to be reconciled, imo, the being must be sentient. There are other verses that must be considered. The gathering together of all into one in Christ, as has already been shared, there is no "things" in the greek. It is simply 'pas'.

In someplaces the translators added "all things", or ""all men, or they translated pas into "everything"- with no consistency it seems to me. I really don't care how far into the creation(flies, mosquitoes, etc.) the restoration goes, but really, I think the emphasis of the scriptures is on sentient beings.

I don't think plants will be resurrected. I don't think every chicken or bird or rodent or roach will be resurrected, but that is just my opinion :o) The earth was made for man, for us to dwell in at at God's pleasure. As a result of the fall, corruption and chaos entered in. As a result of the new creation- all chaos and corruption will be undone. I have confidence that whatever we will be, and the scripture clearly says, "We do not yet know what we will be", the creation within which we dwell will be awesome and wonderful and beautiful- as iour God has already shown us in this corrupted creation which, nevertheless, declares the glory of God.

"The heavens declare the glory of God, and the firmament shows His handiwork".

"For since the creation of the world God's invisible qualities—his eternal power and divine nature—have been clearly seen, being understood from what has been made, so that people are without excuse".

[micah7:9]

I'm just wondering and it is an opinion, why did the "mind of CHRIST" in a believer ever venture into a thought like this? If my memory serves, 1Co 15:22  For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.
The "subject" is man. And the Lord God told man, Gen 2:16  And Jehovah God layeth a charge on the man, saying, `Of every tree of the garden eating thou dost eat;
Gen 2:17  and of the tree of knowledge of good and evil, thou dost not eat of it, for in the day of thine eating of it--dying thou dost die.'
What The Almighty Redeemer has in His mind for Rev 21:1  And I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth did pass away, and the sea is not any more;
I do not believe should trouble us... Isa. 11:6-9 and Isa. 65:25 I believe are parables. (imo)







t

[Tom]

Well, I've had pets in the past, but I don't anymore. So I'm not going to miss any critters if they don't show up especially roaches and mosquitoes, and plants aren't living souls. I think Isaiah 11:6-9 & 65:25 refer to the new earth where there will probably be plants because even the former carnivores mentioned will be grazing together with their former prey. I agree that mankind is the primary focus though, and I also think only members of the body of Christ are destined for eonian life as ambassadors of conciliation in the celestial realm as Israel has been chosen to be in the kingdom of the heavens on earth. This information is only known through Paul's evangel though not Revelation, and it's also according to the belief that the body of Christ and the bride of the lamb are not the same which I know some folks here will disagree with. We all have our own interpretation of scripture though, and this is just mine.

"He Who has the bride is the Bridegroom. Yet the friend of the Bridegroom, who stands and is hearing Him, is rejoicing with joy because of the Bridegroom's voice. This, my joy, then, has been fulfilled." (John 3:29)

That verse seems to refer to John the baptist as the friend of the bridegroom who is Christ and the "bride" as the baptized Israelites. 

"And I perceived the holy city, new Jerusalem, descending out of heaven from God, made ready as a bride adorned for her husband." (Revelation 21:2)

"And one of the seven messengers who have the seven bowls brimming with the last seven calamities came, and he speaks with me, saying, "Hither! I shall be showing you the bride, the wife of the Lambkin." And he carries me away, in spirit, on a mountain, huge and high, and shows me the holy city, Jerusalem, as it is descending out of heaven from God, having the glory from God." (Revelation 21:9,11)

The prophecy of John in Patmos indicates that the "bride" is the new Jerusalem descended out of heaven from God. This has always been the hope of the Jewish people. That is to say a future "kingdom of the heavens" on earth ruled by their Messiah in Jerusalem.

"On this behalf I, Paul, the prisoner of Christ Jesus for you, the nations--since you surely hear of the administration of the grace of God that is given to me for you, for by revelation the secret is made known to me (according as I write before, in brief, by which you who are reading are able to apprehend my understanding in the secret of the Christ, which, in other generations, is not made known to the sons of humanity as it was now revealed to His holy apostles and prophets): in spirit the nations are to be joint enjoyers of an allotment, and a joint body, and joint partakers of the promise in Christ Jesus, through the evangel of which I became the dispenser, in accord with the gratuity of the grace of God, which is granted to me in accord with His powerful operation. To me, less than the least of all saints, was granted this grace: to bring the evangel of the untraceable riches of Christ to the nations, and to enlighten all as to what is the administration of the secret, which has been concealed from the eons in God, Who creates all, that now may be made known to the sovereignties and the authorities among the celestials, through the ecclesia, the multifarious wisdom of God, in accord with the purpose of the eons, which He makes in Christ Jesus, our Lord; in Whom we have boldness and access with confidence, through His faith." (Ephesians 3:1-12)

It is only through Paul that we receive God's revelation to the nations. Before this epistle we were blessed to be in the "body of Christ" and guests of the promise, but we were subordinate to the Jews. This epistle reveals that we are "joint enjoyers of an allotment, and a joint body, and joint partakers of the promise in Christ Jesus." We have a celestial allotment on equal terms because we are members of a joint body that is not dependent on being a Jew.

"The Lord will be rescuing me from every wicked work and will be saving me for His celestial kingdom: to Whom be glory for the eons of the eons. Amen!" (2 Timothy 4:18)

The hope of Israel will be realized with their terrestrial allotment, but we of the nations along with Paul and his companions have a celestial allotment.

http://concordant.org/expohtml/CorrectPartitioning/AreTheBrideAndBodyIdentical1.html


[attachment deleted by admin]

[Seth]

I don't believe there is any separation between  Jewish and Gentile believers. The wall of partition is down so that the two are one with each other, sharing the same inheritance.

[Tom]

I think the words "in spirit" say how we of the nations are "one" not only with Jewish "believers" but also with Christ and the Father.

[joeteekay]

 :thumbsup:

[Seth]

I agree. There's no difference between us and them. I am as much a Jew as a Jewish believer. A Jewish believer is as much a Gentile as me. No difference. No distinguishing, and therefore all in one kingdom.

[Tom]

And that "kingdom" is inside you (Luke 17:21).

[Seth]

 :iagree:

And we are also inside the kingdom (Colossians 1:13)

[Tom]

Right, the spirit of God is inside and out. In fact there's probably really nothing in between. When they look through a microscope powerful enough, there seems to be mostly space between atoms in matter which are powered by a mysterious force that appears to be aware it is being observed on the quantum level. That's why the atheists' faith in the material world is kind of strange. It seems like they believe in God without knowing it. Then the whole thing about the DNA code in living things is so obvious that they're having to go through all kinds of contortions trying to explain it. It's funny how they're finally willing to acknowledge that it could have come from a superior intelligence, but it had to be aliens in outer space because it couldn't be God.

[jbertonbounds]

I'm just wondering and it is an opinion, why did the "mind of CHRIST" in a believer ever venture into a thought like this? If my memory serves, 1Co 15:22  For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.
The "subject" is man. And the Lord God told man, Gen 2:16  And Jehovah God layeth a charge on the man, saying, `Of every tree of the garden eating thou dost eat;
Gen 2:17  and of the tree of knowledge of good and evil, thou dost not eat of it, for in the day of thine eating of it--dying thou dost die.'
What The Almighty Redeemer has in His mind for Rev 21:1  And I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth did pass away, and the sea is not any more;
I do not believe should trouble us... Isa. 11:6-9 and Isa. 65:25 I believe are parables. (imo)

To answer your question, "why did the "mind of CHRIST" in a believer ever venture into a thought like this?," I am questioning the accuracy of the translation of Collosians 1:20 in most bibles.  The OP was about whether the scripture should be translated "all things" or simply "all [humanity]."  As UR believers, we base much of what we believe upon the fact that most mainstream bible translations have translation errors of key Greek and Hebrew words.  Those who don't question these things, will never escape from ET prison.

However, don't worry - I'm not troubled over the matter.

[dajomaco]

Right, the spirit of God is inside and out. In fact there's probably really nothing in between. When they look through a microscope powerful enough, there seems to be mostly space between atoms in matter which are powered by a mysterious force that appears to be aware it is being observed on the quantum level. That's why the atheists' faith in the material world is kind of strange. It seems like they believe in God without knowing it. Then the whole thing about the DNA code in living things is so obvious that they're having to go through all kinds of contortions trying to explain it. It's funny how they're finally willing to acknowledge that it could have come from a superior intelligence, but it had to be aliens in outer space because it couldn't be God.

Yes the smallest (thing) that can be observed by an atomic microscope,
is a stringed vibration.(string theory)   
They Can actually see Gods voice vibrating.

[Tom]

Yeah, I've heard about the string theory. We need to concentrate on good vibes, bro.