Sin

[FreeAtLast]

What does this word mean to you ?
Is there a clear bible definition to what Sin actually is ?
if you Sin what are you doing ?

1st John 3:4----is the true biblical definition of Sin
Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also THE LAW,for SIN is the transgression of THE LAW(notice THE in front of LAW)

verse6--whosoever abideth in him sinneteth not(does not transgress THE LAW)whosoever sinneth(transgresses THE LAW)hath not seen him,neither known him.

if you keep reading down further it speaks even more.

this is what Sin is and the definition of it means to me---and what it meant to the new testament Church

So everytime you see the word Sin---you can put in its place (Transgression of THE LAW)  :HeartThrob: :HeartThrob: :HeartThrob:

[Seth]

I agree with that definition. The great thing about following the Spirit for righteousness, rather than moral codes, is that the Spirit inspires love, and love does not transgress the Law.

Galatians 5
13 You, my brothers and sisters, were called to be free. But do not use your freedom to indulge the flesh; rather, serve one another humbly in love. 14 For the entire law is fulfilled in keeping this one command: "Love your neighbor as yourself." 15 If you bite and devour each other, watch out or you will be destroyed by each other.

16 So I say, walk by the Spirit, and you will not gratify the desires of the flesh. 17 For the flesh desires what is contrary to the Spirit, and the Spirit what is contrary to the flesh. They are in conflict with each other, so that you are not to do whatever[c] you want. 18 But if you are led by the Spirit, you are not under the law.

19 The acts of the flesh are obvious: sexual immorality, impurity and debauchery; 20 idolatry and witchcraft; hatred, discord, jealousy, fits of rage, selfish ambition, dissensions, factions 21 and envy; drunkenness, orgies, and the like. I warn you, as I did before, that those who live like this will not inherit the kingdom of God.

22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, forbearance, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, 23 gentleness and self-control. Against such things there is no law. 24 Those who belong to Christ Jesus have crucified the flesh with its passions and desires. 25 Since we live by the Spirit, let us keep in step with the Spirit. 26 Let us not become conceited, provoking and envying each other.

[FreeAtLast]

I agree with that definition. The great thing about following the Spirit for righteousness, rather than moral codes, is that the Spirit inspires love, and love does not transgress the Law.

Galatians 5
13 You, my brothers and sisters, were called to be free. But do not use your freedom to indulge the flesh; rather, serve one another humbly in love. 14 For the entire law is fulfilled in keeping this one command: "Love your neighbor as yourself." 15 If you bite and devour each other, watch out or you will be destroyed by each other.

16 So I say, walk by the Spirit, and you will not gratify the desires of the flesh. 17 For the flesh desires what is contrary to the Spirit, and the Spirit what is contrary to the flesh. They are in conflict with each other, so that you are not to do whatever[c] you want. 18 But if you are led by the Spirit, you are not under the law.

19 The acts of the flesh are obvious: sexual immorality, impurity and debauchery; 20 idolatry and witchcraft; hatred, discord, jealousy, fits of rage, selfish ambition, dissensions, factions 21 and envy; drunkenness, orgies, and the like. I warn you, as I did before, that those who live like this will not inherit the kingdom of God.

22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, forbearance, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, 23 gentleness and self-control. Against such things there is no law. 24 Those who belong to Christ Jesus have crucified the flesh with its passions and desires. 25 Since we live by the Spirit, let us keep in step with the Spirit. 26 Let us not become conceited, provoking and envying each other.

so you are saying that you actually keep THE LAW through LOVE ???

[Seth]

I am saying I don't keep moral codes, but the Spirit inspires me to love my neighbor.

[FreeAtLast]

I am saying I don't keep moral codes, but the Spirit inspires me to love my neighbor.

Paul said in Romans 3:30-31  that we are justified through faith

Do we then make void THE LAW through faith ??? Yah forbid   Yea we establish THE LAW

when you make void something it is done away(not of any use)  Paul taught that the law was NOT made void(not done away with)through faith

But it is our Faith that THE LAW is established

it is very clear that John said if you transgress THE LAW(break it)then that is what Sin is

if you don't go out and steal from your neighbor--then you are establishing the law through faith--you are keeping it in LOVE
if you don't go out and commit adultery against your neighbor--you are establishing the law through faith--keeping it in LOVE

Shall I go on and on--it all keeps coming back to this    LOVE   is why we do what we do now and not because of Bondage of the law

the only thing that has changed is that it is through faith and LOVE that we do it now and not under bondage of THE LAW  :HeartThrob: :HeartThrob:

of course being led by the Spirit to do so  :dsunny: :dsunny:

[Seth]

Paul said in Romans 3:30-31  that we are justified through faith

Do we then make void THE LAW through faith ??? Yah forbid   Yea we establish THE LAW

when you make void something it is done away(not of any use)  Paul taught that the law was NOT made void(not done away with)through faith

But it is our Faith that THE LAW is established

That's because faith brings the Holy Spirit. The Spirit inspires love and love does not transgress the Law. So, again, we don't follow moral codes. It's inspiration of the Spirit daily without being under the Law.

if you don't go out and steal from your neighbor--then you are establishing the law through faith--you are keeping it in LOVE

If you don't go out and steal from your neighbor, it is because the Spirit has inspired love in your heart, not because you follow moral codes. That is how the law is established without being under it.

[Seth]

If you didn't know how to read, and never knew the moral codes of the law of Moses, you could still establish the Law by inspiration of the Spirit without following moral codes, simply by being inspired to love your neighbor.

Love does not transgress the Law, but neither do you need to follow moral codes in order to love.

[FreeAtLast]

If you didn't know how to read, and never knew the moral codes of the law of Moses, you could still establish the Law by inspiration of the Spirit without following moral codes, simply by being inspired to love your neighbor.

Love does not transgress the Law, but neither do you need to follow moral codes in order to love.

you are saying the same thing I am---but you don't want to admit it   :dsunny: :dsunny:

its by LOVE--but you are still keeping THE LAW--although you are not doing it under the bondage of the law but by the Spirit who directs you to do so

[Seth]

you are saying the same thing I am---but you don't want to admit it 

its by LOVE--but you are still keeping THE LAW--although you are not doing it under the bondage of the law but by the Spirit who directs you to do so

No, I am saying something completely different. Love is not done by keeping the Law. Love is done by following the Spirit, but love happens to not transgress the Law.

You said "You don't know how to properly LOVE without guidelines" and that is where I completely disagree. You can properly love by inspiration of the Spirit. You don't need to follow written guidelines. If you do, then the inspiration of the Spirit is not enough for you. But it is for me.

[FreeAtLast]

you are saying the same thing I am---but you don't want to admit it 

its by LOVE--but you are still keeping THE LAW--although you are not doing it under the bondage of the law but by the Spirit who directs you to do so

No, I am saying something completely different. Love is not done by keeping the Law. Love is done by following the Spirit, but love happens to not transgress the Law.

You said "You don't know how to properly LOVE without guidelines" and that is where I completely disagree. You can properly love by inspiration of the Spirit. You don't need to follow written guidelines. If you do, then the inspiration of the Spirit is not enough for you. But it is for me.

so if LOVE just happens to lead you to not break the law--its an accident ? that it does that ?

let me ask you a question-- are you grieved by that Spirit you speak of when you Sin ??

[FreeAtLast]

you are saying the same thing I am---but you don't want to admit it 

its by LOVE--but you are still keeping THE LAW--although you are not doing it under the bondage of the law but by the Spirit who directs you to do so

No, I am saying something completely different. Love is not done by keeping the Law. Love is done by following the Spirit, but love happens to not transgress the Law.

You said "You don't know how to properly LOVE without guidelines" and that is where I completely disagree. You can properly love by inspiration of the Spirit. You don't need to follow written guidelines. If you do, then the inspiration of the Spirit is not enough for you. But it is for me.

and the way you make it sound is that we never needed the written word after the Spirit came in us ??? Did Yahshua say that to his disciples ??he told them to search the scriptures--the spirit will not lead you against the written word--if it does--you got an unholy spirit.

[sheila]

exactly Seth!  Jesus was accused of breaking the Sabbath because He healed on the

sabbath...it is lawful to do good works of the Father on the Sabbath.

   for the Sabbath was created for the benefit of man,not man for the benefit of the

  Sabbath......it was unlawful to eat the bread of the presence unless you were a preist..

  but when David and his men were hungered they ate it.

   there is no law against love. GOD HAS DECLARED THAT PERFECT LOVE BE FREE

  and not bound in any way,or by any commandment.

Jesus touched lepers to heal them..something unlawful for a high Preist......see

the parable of the good samaritan...and how the commandments on seperation

caused those bound by them to not show love.[sin spring up and kill love]

   Perfect love keeps no account of the injury,no record of sin..it blots it out and

covers it with love..like a garment that clothes someones nakedness and shame and sin.

  He said 'ye must be perfect as your'e heavenly Father is perfect."  Jerusalem Above

the Free Woman is of which we must all be born again.

   those who love are born of God.

[Seth]

so if LOVE just happens to lead you to not break the law--its an accident ? that it does that ?

Love doesn't lead anyone to break laws. You can't break a law you are not under. Love causes people to treat each other with respect and kindness and does not seek for itself. What Law could you break if do those things?

let me ask you a question-- are you grieved by that Spirit you speak of when you Sin ??

If I sin, the Spirit convicts my conscience, and returns me to love my neighbor. I am under the Spirit not the letter.

and the way you make it sound is that we never needed the written word after the Spirit came in us ??? Did Yahshua say that to his disciples ??he told them to search the scriptures--the spirit will not lead you against the written word--if it does--you got an unholy spirit.

I am not saying not to search scriptures. What I am saying is that you don't need the written word in order to be inspired by God to love your neighbor.

If you did, someone who couldn't read could never love. But if the Spirit inspired him to love, he could do it without the ability to read.

[FreeAtLast]

so if LOVE just happens to lead you to not break the law--its an accident ? that it does that ?

Love doesn't lead anyone to break laws. You can't break a law you are not under. Love causes people to treat each other with respect and kindness and does not seek for itself. What Law could you break if do those things?

let me ask you a question-- are you grieved by that Spirit you speak of when you Sin ??

If I sin, the Spirit convicts my conscience, and returns me to love my neighbor. I am under the Spirit not the letter.

and the way you make it sound is that we never needed the written word after the Spirit came in us ??? Did Yahshua say that to his disciples ??he told them to search the scriptures--the spirit will not lead you against the written word--if it does--you got an unholy spirit.

I am not saying not to search scriptures. What I am saying is that you don't need the written word in order to be inspired by God to love your neighbor.

If you did, someone who couldn't read could never love. But if the Spirit inspired him to love, he could do it without the ability to read.

are you under any law ??


you always mention loving your neighbor---which is right  :dsunny:

you never mention Loving Yah like Yahshua did at the same time he said to love your neighbor ???

why is this ?

I don't quite understand--Yahshua put them both together and you only use 1 of them ?

[Seth]

exactly Seth!  Jesus was accused of breaking the Sabbath because He healed on the

sabbath...it is lawful to do good works of the Father on the Sabbath.

   for the Sabbath was created for the benefit of man,not man for the benefit of the

  Sabbath......it was unlawful to eat the bread of the presence unless you were a preist..

  but when David and his men were hungered they ate it.

   there is no law against love. GOD HAS DECLARED THAT PERFECT LOVE BE FREE

  and not bound in any way,or by any commandment.

Jesus touched lepers to heal them..something unlawful for a high Preist......see

the parable of the good samaritan...and how the commandments on seperation

caused those bound by them to not show love.[sin spring up and kill love]

   Perfect love keeps no account of the injury,no record of sin..it blots it out and

covers it with love..like a garment that clothes someones nakedness and shame and sin.

  He said 'ye must be perfect as your'e heavenly Father is perfect."  Jerusalem Above

the Free Woman is of which we must all be born again.

   those who love are born of God.

Amen Sheila,
The sabbath is a shadow of the body of Christ. Therefore those who are in the body of Christ can never break it.

[Seth]

are you under any law ??

I am not under any written moral codes.

you always mention loving your neighbor---which is right  :dsunny:

you never mention Loving Yah like Yahshua did at the same time he said to love your neighbor ???

why is this ?

I don't quite understand--Yahshua put them both together and you only use 1 of them ?

The Spirit inspires us to love my neighbor and love God. Not because we are under written commandments. I only mention loving one's neighbor because Jesus equates loving him with feeding his sheep.

[FreeAtLast]

so do you ever commit Sin ??

[Seth]

Sometimes I don't love my neighbor, which is a sin. But rather than follow the moral codes to love my neighbor again, I repent to the Lord and the Lord cleanses my heart by the washing of the Spirit and inspires me to love again.

[sheila]

love covers sin..it doesn't try to expose it.....love love's your'e brother as yourself..

  Joseph was considered right by God because he elected to nothold Mary up to public

  shame for her perceived sin. Same with Japeth and  Shem with Noah when he was

  uncovered...Jesus said to the woman caught in the act of sin..woman,where are your'e

  accusors? He had sent them away by revealing their hypocrisy to them[judge not lest

  ye be judged]  She said 'no man,Lord" He said 'neither do I accuse you...go and sin

  no more"   Under the law at the mouth of two or three wittness's a man was

condemned without mercy.  Sacrifice and offerings I did not desire,but in mercy was my

delight.

[FreeAtLast]

Leviticus 19:18  Thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself.
Deuteronomy 6:5  Thou shalt love Yah thy God with all thine heart,soul,might.

Taken directly from within the Law--both are corresponding to the keeping of ALL of his commandments,statues,Laws(10 commandments
in everything Yahshua ever said he quoted it from the old testament--just as the apostles done also.

whether youll receive it or not--these 2 LOVE commandments came directly from  THE LAW

again--we do not do because we are under the law Bondage but under grace and the Spirit leads us into Righteousness   :HeartThrob: :HeartThrob: :HeartThrob:

[FreeAtLast]

Sometimes I don't love my neighbor, which is a sin. But rather than follow the moral codes to love my neighbor again, I repent to the Lord and the Lord cleanses my heart by the washing of the Spirit and inspires me to love again.

do you go by manmade laws and obey them ??  do you break the speed limit ???

You could not know that breaking the speed limit was without a sign to let you know the limit not to break

the spirit is gonna lead you according to the written word has already told you--through the written word is how the Spirit reveals truth--without the written word man would have nothing to be revealed unto him through the spirit--that's why Yah gave it and the Spirit unto us  :HeartThrob: :HeartThrob:

[Seth]

Leviticus 19:18  Thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself.
Deuteronomy 6:5  Thou shalt love Yah thy God with all thine heart,soul,might.

Taken directly from within the Law--both are corresponding to the keeping of ALL of his commandments,statues,Laws(10 commandments
in everything Yahshua ever said he quoted it from the old testament--just as the apostles done also.

whether youll receive it or not--these 2 LOVE commandments came directly from  THE LAW

again--we do not do because we are under the law Bondage but under grace and the Spirit leads us into Righteousness   :HeartThrob: :HeartThrob: :HeartThrob:

They actually came from God himself, the Spirit, before they were written down. So, as I have been saying, without being under moral codes such as you have quoted, God inspires us to love. God does not steer us wrong. We can love without written codes.

Just as Abraham obeyed without the Law.

[sheila]

Genesis 3;21  and the Lord God made garments of skin for Adam and Eve,and

covered their nakedness....

[sheila]

when somenes life depends on your'e getting to the hospital....the ambulance and police

  disregard the stopsigns and speed limits...the law gives way to love of life.

[FreeAtLast]

Leviticus 19:18  Thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself.
Deuteronomy 6:5  Thou shalt love Yah thy God with all thine heart,soul,might.

Taken directly from within the Law--both are corresponding to the keeping of ALL of his commandments,statues,Laws(10 commandments
in everything Yahshua ever said he quoted it from the old testament--just as the apostles done also.

whether youll receive it or not--these 2 LOVE commandments came directly from  THE LAW

again--we do not do because we are under the law Bondage but under grace and the Spirit leads us into Righteousness   :HeartThrob: :HeartThrob: :HeartThrob:

They actually came from God himself, the Spirit, before they were written down. So, as I have been saying, without being under moral codes such as you have quoted, God inspires us to love. God does not steer us wrong. We can love without written codes.

Just as Abraham obeyed without the Law.

Abraham without THE LAW ???

Genesis 26:5

Because that Abraham obeyed my voice,and kept my charge,my COMMANDMENTS,my STATUES,and my LAWS

Abraham had THE LAW and kept it according to scripture---just because yah didn't inform us before Moses time that he actually gave his LAW to his people---doesn't mean they didn't have it--scripture reveals this very same thing  :HeartThrob: :HeartThrob: