Revivified

[Jock]

Can somebody explain to me (in scripture) how those who have been cast into the Lake of Fire are revivified? this would have to be a 3rd resurrection and to resurrection of ashes?

Cheers

Jock

[JulieTang84]

Hi Jock I spoke about this on the "Saved from what" thread.


Paul gave us a wonderful expose of what has and will happen: "no one can lay any foundation other than the one already laid, which is Jesus Christ. If anyone builds on this foundation using gold, silver, costly stones, wood, hay or straw, their work will be shown for what it is, because the Day will bring it to light. It will be revealed with fire, and the fire will test the quality of each person's work. If what has been built survives, the builder will receive a reward. If it is burned up, the builder will suffer loss but yet will be saved—even though only as one escaping through the flames." - 1Cr 3:11-15


Check out the "Saved from what" you might find alot you can use.


Love Julie

[Jock]

Thanks Julie, I'll do that. What you gave was spot on though. I realized that all through my past church affiliations, I didn't know the real meaning of that portion of scripture. Thanks.



:dsunny:

Jock.

[Seth]

Hi Jock,
Great question. Here is what I think about it:

Isaiah 9:18-20
His anger is not turned away, his hand is still upraised. Surely WICKEDNESS burns like a fire; it consumes briers and thorns, it sets the forest thickets ablaze, so that it rolls upward in a column of smoke. By the wrath of the Lord Almighty the land will be scorched and the people will be fuel for the fire; they will not spare one another. On the right they will devour, but still be hungry; on the left they will eat, but not be satisfied.

Wickedness of man burns like a fire and destroys. You can see that evident all around you. Rwanda is a good example. The sin of mankind leaves his house desolate and burning. Take note of the "roll upward in a column of smoke." Does that remind you of "the smoke of their torment rises unto the age of the age?" That's no accident. It's all prophecy.

There is another fire of judgment as well, and you may recall in Acts, how that there were tongues of fire which settled upon the heads of Apostles. That is the fire of truth, which exposes that which is hidden in the darkness (the outer darkness).

Revelation 22:17
The Spirit and the bride say, "Come!" And let the one who hears say, "Come!" Let the one who is thirsty come; and let the one who wishes take the free gift of the water of life.

That is how fire revives. It makes people thirsty. Think of the Prodigal Son. He lost everything in his own wickedness, his spiritual house ruined by fire. But it caused him humility, and he went to his father, and his father celebrated his return. Those who have houses built with bad materials will have their houses destroyed and suffer loss, by the fire which is of their own wicked works, but will be revived in that they come OUT of the fire and drink the water of LIFE (Spirit) which is free.

I have much more info: http://mercifultruth.com/links-savedbygrace.html

[Jock]

Seth

Outstanding! and so well put. Thanks bro

Have a banana  :banana:

Jock.

[Seth]

Mmmm...studies have shown that dancing bananas have the most flavor.....and funk.

[Seth]

I came across a reality show about addiction one day, and I heard something really interesting: "An addict can usually only be helped when they hit rock bottom." This was from a former addict who said it. He had turned into a councilor.

The reasoning there, is that as long as the addict has not hit rock bottom, they still have confidence in their drug, but when they hit that bottom, they realize their drug can't help them, and in fact has always been harming them. At that point, hopefully, the addict looks to recovery for help, knowing that the drug has betrayed them. Yes, addicts tend to think the drug is a friend, which is why it's so hard to quit. They have to say goodbye to a friend. It's hard to write this, not because I have experienced this personally, but because my heart goes out to them.

I think that is what the "fire" is for, coming to the end of ourselves, realizing that sin is not our friend. It will betray us eventually. This is why I believe that Jesus included the Prodigal Son in his canon of parables. It really shows the descent, and the betrayal of sin until he had nothing left. When you have nothing left, what do you do? Run to the One who has everything you need.

God is so wise.

[Jock]

You're right Seth. Kinda reminds me of the Pharisee and the publican. The publican couldn't even look up, he was ashamed, whilst the Pharisee thought " I'm glad I am not like that man. You know the story, the publican left justified that night.

Shalom

Jock  :Peace2:

[Graph1159]

Have you read the Vivification chapter of A.E. Knoch's book All in All? The book can be read for free online at Concordant Publishing's website. Knoch's discussion of resurrection and vivification is among the best in my opinion. I don't agree with his teaching on cessation of consciousness at death but otherwise I have found the book very helpful.

[Jock]

Thanks Graph, I'll check it out. Just curious, I thought that we go into a soul sleep at death. What's your take on that?

Jock.

[Seth]

Not to hijack the thread, but although I think the Concordant Publishing Concern speaks wonderfully on the salvation of all mankind, I strongly disagree with the idea of two covenants, one for Jewish Christians and another for Gentile Christians. I believe there is only one Gospel, though there might be an evangel to the Jews and another to the Gentiles, that does not mean it's a different message entirely. Just a different audience.

[Seth]

Just one tidbit about that: The very fact that Paul himself was a Jew according to the flesh (a member of the Circumcision) unravels the entire argument that the evangel to the Circumcision is different from that to the Uncircumcision. It would mean that Paul was not a benefactor of the Gospel he preached, and yet clearly he was, and clearly applied its tenets to himself. Why would he be a benefactor of his own Gospel, as a Jew according to the flesh, and yet others even today are not? It's not logical.

[Graph1159]

Not to hijack the thread, but although I think the Concordant Publishing Concern speaks wonderfully on the salvation of all mankind, I strongly disagree with the idea of two covenants, one for Jewish Christians and another for Gentile Christians. I believe there is only one Gospel, though there might be an evangel to the Jews and another to the Gentiles, that does not mean it's a different message entirely. Just a different audience.

I agree. That's the way I look at it.

[eaglesway]

Not to hijack the thread, but although I think the Concordant Publishing Concern speaks wonderfully on the salvation of all mankind, I strongly disagree with the idea of two covenants, one for Jewish Christians and another for Gentile Christians. I believe there is only one Gospel, though there might be an evangel to the Jews and another to the Gentiles, that does not mean it's a different message entirely. Just a different audience.

I agree. That's the way I look at it.

Ditto. Strongly.

[Jock]

The thing that we should be concerned about is circumcision of the heart, not the flesh.

[Seth]

 :iagree:

[micah7:9]

Look into the nomenclature of the Lake of Fire and you may see how The Almighty, in His Wisdom, works His "reviving." Noting first, that the Lord God is a consuming Fire. He is so Wonderful!
In the words of Johnny Cash "....and it burns, burns, burns..." and Johnny(but actually June, she wrote it) sings it's all about LOVE. :dsunny:

[Jock]

Concerning the Lake of Fire, do any of you guys get that voice in your head, that you will be cast in there too? I get that a lot.

So, I asked my question out of fear and the Lord doesn't seem to be allowing me to understand this at this time. I gotta wait for Him to illuminate these things for me.

Jock   :dontknow:

[eaglesway]

IMO, The blood of Jesus provides deliverance from the lake of fire for ALL all who are cleansed by it(the blood). The only way that fire will catch on a believer's rainment is if there is a stain of reproach that was not submitted to the light (everything brought to the light becomes light-Paul), (if we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and cleanse us from ALL unrighteousness-John).

Believers are already in the testing fire daily. Those who overcome through its trials will wear the crown of life.

Personally, I think the fire spoken of in 1 Corinthians 3:11-15 is not the lake of fire. I think it is the judgment seat of Christ that Paul spoke of, where believers will give account for their stewardship.

Of course, if it was a simple as theology or if it was as easy as us defining it, there would be no need for the Great White Throne and/or God discerning the secrets of men's hearts through Jesus on the Day(Romans chptrs 1&2).

I know, I opened a can of worms. :o)

[Seth]

I agree with you. Fire seems to be a very general term to describe judgement, but may come in many forms depending on who is being judged. This is why there is a trial of faith which is more precious than gold, yet James talks about how the tongue is a fire, a world of iniquity. First fire is good, second fire is bad. Both are judgements but you'd want to the first fire to strengthen your faith rather than the second fire to destroy your house and make you repent.  First fire is good and it is intended to strengthen faith whereas the second fire is intended to bring the unfaithful to their knees. That is what I believe the lake of fire is.

[micah7:9]

"I know, I opened a can of worms. :o)"
I certainly don't see an opening and don't even see how you could have, but that is just me o:)

[Jock]

Eaglesway, what you say is true. The blood of Christ washes all clean. I had forgotten that any spirit that comes at us with threats and condemnation, is never the Christ like Spirit. We can send the enemy packing, knowing these things.

We do encounter fire daily because God wants to purify us of all uncleanliness, but we can never be pure in this life, so this causes us to run into Christ who is our refuge.

Thanks guys, for your wisdom in these matters.

Shalom

Jock  :gimmefive:

[eaglesway]

"I know, I opened a can of worms. :o)"
I certainly don't see an opening and don't even see how you could have, but that is just me o:)

Probly an unnecessary comment :o) 

[WhiteWings]

Concerning the Lake of Fire, do any of you guys get that voice in your head, that you will be cast in there too? I get that a lot.

I'm most certain all will be in the lake of fire. I'm not so sure it's a future event. Many, including Jesus, have been in it. And, imo, many are in it right now.

[WhiteWings]

IMO, The blood of Jesus provides deliverance from the lake of fire for ALL all who are cleansed by it(the blood).

In theory.

The only way that fire will catch on a believer's rainment is if there is a stain of reproach that was not submitted to the light (everything brought to the light becomes light-Paul), (if we confess our sins,

Meaning no none will escape the lake.

He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and cleanse us from ALL unrighteousness-John).

Cleaning is a reference to the lake.

Believers are already in the testing fire daily. Those who overcome through its trials will wear the crown of life.

Meaning believers are in the lake. Unbelievers won't escape the lake. So everyone will be in the lake at some point in time.

Personally, I think the fire spoken of in 1 Corinthians 3:11-15 is not the lake of fire. I think it is the judgment seat of Christ that Paul spoke of, where believers will give account for their stewardship.

Personally I think it's unBiblial to separate judgement and the lake.