Eph. 4:8- What happened?

[micah7:9]

What does Eph 4:8  teach? I have always been told that Jesus went and set those before the Cross free.
But is that what Eph. 4:8-10 offers?
Eph. 4:8Wherefore he saith, When he ascended up on high, he led captivity captive, and gave gifts unto men.
Eph 4:9  (Now that he ascended, what is it but that he also descended first into the lower parts of the earth?
Eph 4:10  He that descended is the same also that ascended up far above all heavens, that he might fill all things.)

I ask.

[sheila]

Hey Micah..the wqy I read it is like this. When He come in flesh[born on earth in body] is His descent...

  of which went He went down in death is His descending into further descent.  And His rising was first

up from the grave....and then even untoo the heavens to the presence of God.  In the presence of God

   the Father give the Holy spirit to be poured out on men. Thus the gifts  to men[Holy spirit]...

in apostles prophets evangelist pastors teachers...to minister and prepare peple..to build up and

mature us into the fullness of Christ[maturity]

    His 3 1/2 year ministry when He accompanied and taught his disciples ws preparatory to receiving

   the 'authority/power' that the Holy spirits ministry function would fulfill.

   their sins were freely forgiven...and the truth in the word He spoke to them set them free fromformer

   erronous teachings....all prepatory for receiving the authority and power of the ministry of Holy spirit...as

  gifts to men.

   when Jesus was with them bodily..He did these things for them..teaching...admonishing,preparing them

sending them out in two's etc.  But after His return unto the Fther..this is done through the Holy spirit

   and He give 'gifts' to men of the Holy spirit to do this.

 

[micah7:9]

 :iagree: Sheila :dsunny:

What of this?....Wherefore he saith, When he ascended up on high, he led captivity captive,

[ded2daworld]

Perhaps hell (the grave) is captivity and Jesus has full control of hell (holds it captive)

Kinda silly the ET'ers think Satan, the devil, lucifer, will reign in their kingdom of the dead while God watches approvingly as humans are tortured. :Peace2:

[Tom]

What does Eph 4:8  teach? I have always been told that Jesus went and set those before the Cross free.
But is that what Eph. 4:8-10 offers?
Eph. 4:8Wherefore he saith, When he ascended up on high, he led captivity captive, and gave gifts unto men.
Eph 4:9  (Now that he ascended, what is it but that he also descended first into the lower parts of the earth?
Eph 4:10  He that descended is the same also that ascended up far above all heavens, that he might fill all things.)

I ask.

"7 The readjustment of the saints, changing them from a condition of tutelage and dependence on the blessings of Israel to mature manhood and independent celestial blessings, was effected by sending them specially endowed apostles and prophets, pastors and teachers. The service of the apostles and prophets is now superseded by the Scriptures, such as this epistle, which were written to accomplish the same end. This is in contrast to the giving of the law, which brought them into captivity (Ps.68:18). This grace sets aside all enslaving laws and decrees." (Ephesians 4:7-12 Concordant Commentary on the New Testament page 291)

http://concordant.org/expohtml/ConcordantCommentary/CC00.htm

http://concordant.org/online/index.html

See attachment for Psalm 68:18.

[attachment deleted by admin]

[micah7:9]

Eph 6:12  because we have not the wrestling with blood and flesh, but with the principalities, with the authorities, with the world-rulers of the darkness of this age, with the spiritual things of the evil in the heavenly places;
Eph. 4:8Wherefore he saith, When he ascended up on high, he led captivity captive, and gave gifts unto men.
Eph 4:9  (Now that he ascended, what is it but that he also descended first into the lower parts of the earth?
Eph 4:10  He that descended is the same also that ascended up far above all heavens, that he might fill all things.)

8 Wherefore He is saying, Ascending on high, He captures captivity And gives gifts to mankind.
9 Now the 'He ascended,' what is it except that He first descended also into the lower parts of the earth?
10 He Who descends is the Same Who ascends also, up over all who are of the heavens, that He should be completing all.(CLT)

Here is how I have been given to re-understand Eph. 4:8
When he ascended up on high[ Eph. 6:12 "..... with the spiritual things of the evil in the heavenly places;"] here in the heavenly, high places where
the devil is in captivity and is led captive; the devil is in captivity....because Christ rose from the dead...and the devil being led captive(bound)
Jesus gives gifts unto men.

This descending, Mat 12:40  For as Jonas was three days and three nights in the whale's belly; so shall the Son of man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth.
Note, the Son of man shall be  three days and three nights in the heart of the earth.
Eph. 4:9 he also descended first into the lower parts of the earth..

I no longer believe this 3 days and 3 nights is speaking of the tomb(explanation for another time) Jesus spent those days and nights in the heart of the earth, that earth
Writes Paul  that man is 1Co 15:47  The first man is of the earth, earthy: the second man is the Lord from heaven. 
Jesus at the time, before, the second man the Lord from heaven....  was of the earthy man and 3 days and 3 nights was in the lower parts of the earth, agony in the garden, the shame of the lash, the crown of thorns, the spittle, the entire
burden of the worlds sin layed upon Him, He aquainted Himself with all the griefs and sorrows of the earthy man. All this in the time before He gave up the ghost/spirit.
Psa 139:8  If I ascend up into heaven, thou art there: if I make my bed in hell, behold, thou art there.
Captivity is led captive and is still captive because HE ROSE.
10 He Who descends is the Same Who ascends also, up over all who are of the heavens, that He should be completing all.(CLT)

[rosered]

:iagree: Sheila :dsunny:

What of this?....Wherefore he saith, When he ascended up on high, he led captivity captive,

1Cr 15:26 The last enemy [that] shall be destroyed [is] death.

    we Know the Lord Jesus Christ   [His body ]   is where     HE ONLY is the Lord of ther dead and living ,      we know now that Jesus destroys death in Hid Body and that is where also we  come    forth out of Him alive unto God      , this is the sons of God being revealed !!
  for the creature / holy one is made new in Christ / the annointing , same Holy Spirit and fire   that is of God 's Spirit

1Jo 2:27 But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him.

Strong's G5545 - chrisma
1) anything smeared on, unguent, ointment, usually prepared by the Hebrews from oil and aromatic herbs. Anointing was the inaugural ceremony for priests

Lexicon Results
Strong's G5548 - chriō
χρίω
Transliteration

chriō
Pronunciation

khrē'-ō (Key)


Part of Speech

verb

Probably akin to χράομαι (G5530) through the idea of contact  

1) to anoint

a) consecrating Jesus to the Messianic office, and furnishing him with the necessary powers for its administration

b) enduing Christians with the gifts of the Holy Spirit

Dan 9:24 Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy.


Isa 10:27 And it shall come to pass in that day, [that] his burden shall be taken away from off thy shoulder, and his yoke from off thy neck, and the yoke shall be destroyed because of the anointing.


Jam 5:14 Is any sick among you? let him call for the elders of the church; and let them pray over him, anointing him with oil in the name of the Lord:
  the spiritually sick   shall be healed   , the  new priesthood       out of Christs BODY      is whats    being done those works are the greater works because He  goes   to the FATHER    interceeding for us all [dead and living ]   , alot more than just this to  speak about  . like not being spued out of His mouth  / rejected

[jbertonbounds]

Hey Micah..the wqy I read it is like this. When He come in flesh[born on earth in body] is His descent...

  of which went He went down in death is His descending into further descent.  And His rising was first

up from the grave....and then even untoo the heavens to the presence of God.  In the presence of God

   the Father give the Holy spirit to be poured out on men. Thus the gifts  to men[Holy spirit]...

in apostles prophets evangelist pastors teachers...to minister and prepare peple..to build up and

mature us into the fullness of Christ[maturity]

    His 3 1/2 year ministry when He accompanied and taught his disciples ws preparatory to receiving

   the 'authority/power' that the Holy spirits ministry function would fulfill.

   their sins were freely forgiven...and the truth in the word He spoke to them set them free fromformer

   erronous teachings....all prepatory for receiving the authority and power of the ministry of Holy spirit...as

  gifts to men.

   when Jesus was with them bodily..He did these things for them..teaching...admonishing,preparing them

sending them out in two's etc.  But after His return unto the Fther..this is done through the Holy spirit

   and He give 'gifts' to men of the Holy spirit to do this.

Awesome, Sheila. :thumbsup:

[jbertonbounds]

:iagree: Sheila :dsunny:

What of this?....Wherefore he saith, When he ascended up on high, he led captivity captive,

1Cr 15:26 The last enemy [that] shall be destroyed [is] death.

    we Know the Lord Jesus Christ   [His body ]   is where     HE ONLY is the Lord of ther dead and living ,      we know now that Jesus destroys death in Hid Body and that is where also we  come    forth out of Him alive unto God      , this is the sons of God being revealed !!
  for the creature / holy one is made new in Christ / the annointing , same Holy Spirit and fire   that is of God 's Spirit

1Jo 2:27 But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him.

Strong's G5545 - chrisma
1) anything smeared on, unguent, ointment, usually prepared by the Hebrews from oil and aromatic herbs. Anointing was the inaugural ceremony for priests

Lexicon Results
Strong's G5548 - chriō
χρίω
Transliteration

chriō
Pronunciation

khrē'-ō (Key)


Part of Speech

verb

Probably akin to χράομαι (G5530) through the idea of contact  

1) to anoint

a) consecrating Jesus to the Messianic office, and furnishing him with the necessary powers for its administration

b) enduing Christians with the gifts of the Holy Spirit

Dan 9:24 Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy.


Isa 10:27 And it shall come to pass in that day, [that] his burden shall be taken away from off thy shoulder, and his yoke from off thy neck, and the yoke shall be destroyed because of the anointing.


Jam 5:14 Is any sick among you? let him call for the elders of the church; and let them pray over him, anointing him with oil in the name of the Lord:
  the spiritually sick   shall be healed   , the  new priesthood       out of Christs BODY      is whats    being done those works are the greater works because He  goes   to the FATHER    interceeding for us all [dead and living ]   , alot more than just this to  speak about  . like not being spued out of His mouth  / rejected

Very interesting.  Love those word studies!
Thanks, Rose.  :dsunny:

[rosered]

 

  Thank you Bro J , for just   considering it  :friendstu:

[JulieTang84]

Perhaps hell (the grave) is captivity and Jesus has full control of hell (holds it captive)

Kinda silly the ET'ers think Satan, the devil, lucifer, will reign in their kingdom of the dead while God watches approvingly as humans are tortured. :Peace2:

The fact that Hell is associated with The "Cleansing" Lake of Fire" is mind boggling in itself. Yet as you say the fully believe that Satan will rule the very place he is going to be thrown into.


Just goes to show, more credence is given to doctrine than either Scripture or Spirit.


Thanks for making a point that should never be missed  :HeartThrob:


Love Julie

[sheila]

   taking captivity captive.. Jesus was annointed to set the captives free.  Hebrews 2;15    and free those who

  all their lives were held in slavery by their fear of death.     the scriptures are rich with 'captive/captivity"

     and a word search/study would benefit.....Paul speaks of 'leading me captive to sin's law"

        the reversing of such cqptivity is intimately associated withthe freedom of the sons of God and

    those set free in Christ.

    the covenant curses under the law for disobedince  was a going into captivity/exile  Deut 28;15-68

   the Roman invasion ws part of it.   Christ come to set the captives free.   Fufilling the law and

  laying down His life.......tok waay the lw covenant with it's curses fr disobediance..and nailed it

to the cross.

[micah7:9]

"Christ come to set the captives free." (Sheila)

Ehp. 4:8   Wherefore he saith, When he ascended on high, he led captivity captive.......

Where is there anything about captives set free?

It reads "captivity" is led "captive" unless I am reading the verse in error. :HeartThrob:

[sheila]

Luke 4;18..........He explains the mission of the Messiah..what He was annointed for and why Father sent him.

      ...He has sent me to proclaim freedom for the captives and recovery of sight for the blind....

    the 'captives' are those in 'captivity"...so in other wrds..you could say...He bound that which was

  binding us.             

[eaglesway]

It is alternately translated, "led captives in His train" and I have read a couple other translations- its a tough one but here goes my  :2c:

IMO the ascension of Jesus is universal, and "captivity" itself (Romans 8, whole creation captive to futility) is being "gathered into one in Christ"(Eph1:9-11). The last enemy, death(futility/chaos) will be disarmed/nullified at the conclusion of the age times when God is ALL IN ALL.

This gathering is an "administration", i.e. a process of assimilation through the stewardship of the "ministry of reconciliation" which began at the cross where "the seed fell into the ground"(Chist the seed/logos sown into the "whole creation" including all time and every being) and died and is now producing grains like unto itself(many sons unto glory first- then the whole creation set free into the glorious liberty of the first-fruits/children of God)

First Chrst was sown into the earth(entire cosmos redeemed)
Then Christ is sown into my earth(spirit, soul, body redeemed)
Then Christ is reaped in our earth(Body of Christ ascends)
Then Christ is reaped in the whole creation(all things made new)

This is the picture I get from those verses and I think they apply like an arrow into the heart of a three dimensional sphere layered through history past, present and future and all beings past, present and future( I Am That I Am, Who Was and Is and Will be)

[sheila]

pretty good 2 cents worth! :iagree:   

[JulieTang84]

pretty good 2 cents worth! :iagree:

A big AMEN to that Sister  :gimmefive:

[eaglesway]

Its amazing what two cents can be worth in the kingdom, eh? :o)

[micah7:9]

"It is alternately translated, "led captives in His train" and I have read a couple other translations- its a tough one but here goes my  :2c:"

So far I have found that "alternately translated" one time in Noyes. Gone through about 20 are there others? Can you point me in the direction? Thanks.

1)First Chrst was sown into the earth(entire cosmos redeemed)
2)Then Christ is sown into my earth(spirit, soul, body redeemed)
3)Then Christ is reaped in our earth(Body of Christ ascends)
4)Then Christ is reaped in the whole creation(all things made new)

This is the picture I get from those verses and I think they apply like an arrow into the heart of a three dimensional sphere layered through history past
My count has 4.
Number 2, has me  :Chinscratch:ing.. spirit=breath... soul=breath; ah but yes He is sown in my earth(body) besides isn't redeemed past tense?  my :2c: is... I, that's me, believe that I am in the process of being redeemed.

It is my opinion and  :2c: is that the "captivity captive" is the devil. Certainly those of history who have died are in the captivity of the dust, but will be set free, where as it says He led "captivity captive" does that not mean still captive? And Romans 8:1 is awesome, no condemnation.

[eaglesway]

The devil

I agree that the devil is a part of the captivity. "If anyone does not believe our gospel it is because the god of this world has veiled their eyes that they might not see the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Christ". He will be one of the last adversaries, as I see it, to bow the knee. But I think leading captivity captive means all that is in chaos and held captive in futility- all who oppose themselves and every condition that leads to destruction, as I said before.

glorified bodies/resurrection

i believe we have received eveything pertaining to life and godliness(full redemption, spirit soul body) through the incorruptible seed. But it is "first the shoot, then the stalk, then the full ear"- as the leaven of the kingdom(Christs nature) is kneaded(trials, tribs, discipleship, Fathers hand) into the three measures of meal(spirit soul body) until all is leavened.

We have been sown in hope. Hope makes not ashamed,but kno one hopes for what they already hav fully completed in them. Our redemption is in us but it s not yet fully through us. IMO our bodies will die and become dust until the day they are raised incoruptible- a day the whole creation longs for. At present, the down payment that guarantees the final possession(full restoration) is in us, the Spirit of resurrection- like the measure of leaven in three bushels of meal. The price is paid and guaranteed, the transfer of title has already taken place, the property, however- is still "in the process" of renovation :o) When it is complete in the last sons to come into this ministry of reconciliation, and "announcement" will be made :o) We will appear with Him and begin the next stage of the restoration of all things- whatever that is.

"If we suffer with him we will also reign with him"

"I count not the sufferings of this present time worthy to compare to the glory that is to be revealed in us"

"Forgetting what lies behind I press on into the upward call of God in Christ, if by any means I might attain to the "out resurrection"(exanastasis) from among the dead."

Paul was still walking in hope as well- who tasted the powers of the age to come perhaps more than any man who ever lived.

"If the same spirit that raised Christ from the dead dwells in you it will also quicken your mortal body". As I see it, It is mortal until it is quickened, then death will be swallowed up in immortality, in other words, aionian life fully revealed in us(we know not yet what we shall be but we kno that when He appears we shall be like Him for we shall see Him like He is/ the whole creation eagerly awaits the revelation of the sons of God)

When Christ is revealed we will be revealed with Him in glory- veil of death and the devil taken away completely.(Body of Christ ascends) Now we see in part and kno in part, then we will know as we are known. Then(I believe) we will begin reaping the earth for God on a whole new level :o)

[JulieTang84]

Eaglesway, I always apreaciate your input :HeartThrob:

I am going to voice something that has always intrigued me.

You wrote according to Scripture: "If we suffer with him we will also reign with him"

Who will be reigned over? Or is this just pertaining to the 1000 yrs before the final cleansing?

It has been given me that we will be all, each one of us totally immersed in the Love of the Father and Jesus Christ will be in and through everyone.  :HeartThrob:

Of course there are 100's if not many more "theories" of what will happen next. Quite frankly the possibilities are endless. I just have a very distinct feeling that what we believe "is" and what really IS is beyond our limited comprehension. It is so far out there that to place limits on it is to place limits on both Love and Father, which are of course one and the same.  :HeartThrob:

Exciting times await us all  :girlheart:

Love Julie

[micah7:9]

The devil

I agree that the devil is a part of the captivity. "If anyone does not believe our gospel it is because the god of this world has veiled their eyes that they might not see the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Christ". He will be one of the last adversaries, as I see it, to bow the knee. But I think leading captivity captive means all that is in chaos and held captive in futility- all who oppose themselves and every condition that leads to destruction, as I said before.

glorified bodies/resurrection

i believe we have received eveything pertaining to life and godliness(full redemption, spirit soul body) through the incorruptible seed. But it is "first the shoot, then the stalk, then the full ear"- as the leaven of the kingdom(Christs nature) is kneaded(trials, tribs, discipleship, Fathers hand) into the three measures of meal(spirit soul body) until all is leavened.

We have been sown in hope. Hope makes not ashamed,but kno one hopes for what they already hav fully completed in them. Our redemption is in us but it s not yet fully through us. IMO our bodies will die and become dust until the day they are raised incoruptible- a day the whole creation longs for. At present, the down payment that guarantees the final possession(full restoration) is in us, the Spirit of resurrection- like the measure of leaven in three bushels of meal. The price is paid and guaranteed, the transfer of title has already taken place, the property, however- is still "in the process" of renovation :o) When it is complete in the last sons to come into this ministry of reconciliation, and "announcement" will be made :o) We will appear with Him and begin the next stage of the restoration of all things- whatever that is.

"If we suffer with him we will also reign with him"

"I count not the sufferings of this present time worthy to compare to the glory that is to be revealed in us"

"Forgetting what lies behind I press on into the upward call of God in Christ, if by any means I might attain to the "out resurrection"(exanastasis) from among the dead."

Paul was still walking in hope as well- who tasted the powers of the age to come perhaps more than any man who ever lived.

"If the same spirit that raised Christ from the dead dwells in you it will also quicken your mortal body". As I see it, It is mortal until it is quickened, then death will be swallowed up in immortality, in other words, aionian life fully revealed in us(we know not yet what we shall be but we kno that when He appears we shall be like Him for we shall see Him like He is/ the whole creation eagerly awaits the revelation of the sons of God)

When Christ is revealed we will be revealed with Him in glory- veil of death and the devil taken away completely.(Body of Christ ascends) Now we see in part and kno in part, then we will know as we are known. Then(I believe) we will begin reaping the earth for God on a whole new level :o)

:dsunny:

[sheila]

  it is my understanding that we will reign over all that has been against us...in the image and likeness of the

   Father/SON.  whether,death,sin,the devil his angels..the weak flesh,the judgement of men..this age or the

next..no carnal understanding,mind of beast..lust of the flesh,no spirit of rebellion,no other gvernment

..etc...no weapon formed against you shall suceed.[nothing seperate us from the love of God in Christ]

   DO NOT BE AFRAID. I AM THE FIRST AND THE LAST. I AM THE LIVING ONE;I WAS DEAD,

A ND BEHOLD I AM ALIVE FOR EVER AND EVER!

  AND I HOLD THE KEYS OF DEATH AND HADES!!!!!!!!

   and the whole new creation shall PRAISE HIM..AND GIVE HIM GLORY FOR THE WORK OF HIS HANDS!!!

     Destroy this temple[all men in Christ/Father] and I shall raise it on the third day[no chaos,destruction

  against it shall suceed]   though the serpent bruise the" heel"...the Christ seed will crush the 'head'

  of the serpent.......

   

     

[eaglesway]

Eaglesway, I always apreaciate your input :HeartThrob:

I am going to voice something that has always intrigued me.

You wrote according to Scripture: "If we suffer with him we will also reign with him"

Who will be reigned over? Or is this just pertaining to the 1000 yrs before the final cleansing?

It has been given me that we will be all, each one of us totally immersed in the Love of the Father and Jesus Christ will be in and through everyone.  :HeartThrob:

Of course there are 100's if not many more "theories" of what will happen next. Quite frankly the possibilities are endless. I just have a very distinct feeling that what we believe "is" and what really IS is beyond our limited comprehension. It is so far out there that to place limits on it is to place limits on both Love and Father, which are of course one and the same.  :HeartThrob:

Exciting times await us all  :girlheart:Love Julie

Thanx Julie :o)

One thing we will rule over for sure is US. I mean we will reign in life- no more adversaries WITHIN. I am so aware of how I often live in Romans 7 but long to move more fully into Romans 8(Romans 7 - with my mind I serve the law of God but my members/flesh are at war with my best intentions; Romans 8 - Thank God for Jesus who set me free from the body /flesh of this death/futility...There is therefore now no condemnation because sin in the flesh is already judge..... now grace in the Spirit is carrying me into that glorious liberty of the children of God)

I think the reign of God is service/giving/teaching/building up- and occasionally destroying. but only as a potter destroys a flawed vessel to remake it according to the design he foresaw for it. This(imo) is what ALL kolassis/correction/punishment is about.

We will reign in life over death, demolishing fortresses and strongholds that exalt themselves against the true knowledge of God(even as are doing now, but on a grander scale)- which is teaching how loving and just He is. Reigning as guiding hands. Reigning as priests unto God. Every man/woman becomes a priest when he/she is chosen from among men to represent God(Hebrews). We are the elect, the chosen, foreordained to be conformed to His (inward) image, many sons unto glory(Paul), a kind of first-fruits of creation(James)- having received an inheritance as sons to bring all creation into the inheritance of sons- freedom. No more captives of futility! Is that good news or WHAT :o)

[micah7:9]

"Who will be reigned over? Or is this just pertaining to the 1000 yrs before the final cleansing?

It has been given me that we will be all, each one of us totally immersed in the Love of the Father and Jesus Christ will be in and through everyone."

Julie that is a good question and I have no real answer but and opinion. We[man] live in this age and we understand in this age and it's thinking. We[man] take our understanding of reign from all we have gathered as to what reigning means, for me as a man today, it means dominance, subbordination. 
And that to me is a negative thought when I consider where we will be; because it seems to mean control over something or some one. As believers our understanding of reigning is King David reigned, King Saul reigned, King Solomon reigned, so in my opinion, that is how your question has come about for many. Who will we reign over?
As well as myself at times.

According to Strong's G932 reign means "rule," again when I see rule, I am still thinking dominance; and comes from G935 and means "sovereign"  which is greatest, chief, supreme...king(dom).
Rev 5:10  and didst make us to our God kings and priests, and we shall reign upon the earth.'(YLT)   Thou dost also make them a kingdom and a priesthood for our God, And they shall be reigning on the earth."(CLT)
The root of reign and sovereign is G939 "basis" and means to walk; a pace (by implication) the foot. We get our word basis=the base, foundation or chief
supporting factor of anything.
We will be kings and priests all walking in that way we learned through our chastizing to become sons, no "robots" here;
only the walking in Love.
Rev. 21: 24,25 And the nations shall be walking by means of its light, and the kings of the earth are carrying their glory into it." 25 And its portals should under no circumstances be locked by day; for there shall be no night there.(CLT) No circumstances means no dominance(imo)

I guess what I am trying to say, in my opinion, there will be no dominance, I and the Father, are, one, and as far as I'm concerned, at this time, I, we, all will be one. The reigning and rule will be of love, ONE LOVE, and the nations will not have the fear that anything will change....Now the words of the Lord God Almighty are more  true than ever...........For I, Jehovah, change not..........now, there is a seal. :dsunny: