Cursing

[Eduard]

Now, some priests, at least from what I've witnessed, say we shouldn't curse and especially not mention the devil or hell because that would mean we love the devil. Well, I disagree. If a Jew mentions Hitler and the Holocaust often, does that mean he loves them?

When I say "What the devil just happened?" I mean to say that what happened is so despicable that it may as well be the devil's work, not that I approve. Also, Paul mentioned handing a pair of believers to Satan so that they would learn not to speak blasphemy. In Romania we have a common "swear word" that translates as "May the devil come to you"

[ded2daworld]

The reasoning(IMO) is that any swearing is disagreement or dissatisfaction with what is occurring or has occurred. It implies that the person swearing does not believe God is in control and is working out his perfect plan according to his perfect will.
If we are to treat all as if Christ himself was standing next to us and/or in us, would we swear at or belittle any that the Lord loved? (and He Loves them all)

[Eduard]

That's a good point, but I never swear to express disagreement with God's will. Nevertheless, there are others who do...

[marie glen]

I never heard that before! About not saying the devil, or hell (or, h, e, double toothpicks?) :laughing7:

that it would mean you revere them! do people sit around just dreaming up new commandments?

or maybe it's a clever way for (you know who) to get no one mentioning 'him' the less folks hear of u no who, the better.. Talk about clandestine!

blessings!
glenda marie

[jbertonbounds]

do people sit around just dreaming up new commandments?

YES!

:laughing7:

[jbertonbounds]

The reasoning(IMO) is that any swearing is disagreement or dissatisfaction with what is occurring or has occurred. It implies that the person swearing does not believe God is in control and is working out his perfect plan according to his perfect will.
If we are to treat all as if Christ himself was standing next to us and/or in us, would we swear at or belittle any that the Lord loved? (and He Loves them all)

Good point.  But I wouldn't carry it too far.  Don't want to be a moral robot.  What does God care if I say dang, darn, or damn?  It's all the same.  If one is OK, they are all OK.  If one is a sin, they all are a sin.  We need not confuse good morals with good etiquette - that will lead to Pharisee-ism.  I don't believe in bad words.  Only bad language usage - you know, when use words to hurt others, to build your self up, or for dishonest gain.  In my opinion, slanderous gossip is a sin - saying a cuss word not.  But if you are going to cuss, you must be able to do it in good faith, not believing you are sinning. :2c:

[ded2daworld]

my point was that if swearing is an expression of dissatisfaction with what is, then it is sin.
Ask yourself, can I even imagine Jesus talking or acting in this way?
(He is our model and if inside us as He is in all true believers, is what we said or did contrary to Him?)

[jbertonbounds]

I understand.  What I was saying was basically the same thing, only I applied it to how we use language.  I agree, to use language to complain about the status quo is a sin because God created the status quo.  :thumbsup: However, not all "cussing" is complaining - i.e. to use an expletive as part of an expression of surprise.  :2c:

[rosered]

  Peter struggled with frustration and lack of control   and cussed and swared  and even swore  an oath ,  :sigh: all  3 a  bad  deal , Jesus knew   Peter would fail Him

I can see myself as Peter sometimes     , we fail in things we never thought we  would fail in , those trials and these examples in His Word  , give me hope that  none of us any better off than the other    , we learn  what we are made of  than we Learn what God is made of and  it by trusting in  Him and His Spirit will any of us survive at all

  remember  it was satan whom desired to sift  Peter as wheat   Jesus fortold him  so .Now Peter was sitting outside in the courtyard, and a servant-girl came to him and said, "You too were with Jesus the Galilean." 


Mat 26:70 But he denied it before them all, saying, "I do not know what you are talking about." 
Mat 26:71 When he had gone out to the gateway, another servant-girl saw him and [!] said to those who were there, "This man was with Jesus of Nazareth." 


Mat 26:72 And again he denied it with an oath, "I do not know the man." 


Mat 26:73 A little later the bystanders came up and said to Peter, "Surely you too are one of them; for even the way you talk [fn]gives you away." 


Mat 26:74 Then he began to curse and swear, "I do not know the man!" And immediately a rooster crowed. 
Mat 26:75 And Peter remembered the word which Jesus had said, "Before a rooster crows, you will deny Me three times." And he went out and wept bitterly.

[Eduard]

Thank you rosered, that was beautiful. You too Glenda Marie.   :iagree:

jbertonbounds also made a great point, that we should be convinced in our hearts that we're not sinning while we are cussing.

[jabcat]

Often I think things I shouldn't, and sometimes I say things I shouldn't. 

I'm convinced in my heart that it's my flesh/satan in me that curses - in any manner - and dirties my conscience before God.  When I confess it (agree with Him I've sinned) it's cleansed, forgiven, and forgotten.

Blessings.

[rosered]

Often I think things I shouldn't, and sometimes I say things I shouldn't. 

I'm convinced in my heart that it's my flesh/satan in me that curses - in any manner - and dirties my conscience before God.  When I confess it (agree with Him I've sinned) it's cleansed, forgiven, and forgotten.

Blessings.

Yes , So do I  !!  Bro James  :HeartThrob:

the Word of God comes and washes   the dirty conscience , usually God forgive me and start praying for the  reason I cussed in the first place ! 
 
   :thumbsup:
 
 

Hi  bro Eduard ,  I think we should be aware  of our weaknesses , Just   as Paul states  when  he is weak  ,
  than He is strong  any strength  to overcome  our failures 

comes from trusting in Jesus ,

As we ask Him for the help , to stay right with Him


I dont think cleanlineness can dwell in a dirty place  ,

that is why its  [ the mind  ]  in so many places in the WORD  that must be changed first  and is dealt with first   , as we are given the mind of Christ /obedience to the will of God
We sure are learning obedience  with our new minds and hearts towards God   :HeartThrob:

[micah7:9]

Thus the word Repent.....G3340  metanoeō to think differently or afterwards, that is, reconsider 
From G3539 noieō to exercise the mind (observe), that is, (figuratively) to comprehend, heed: - consider, perceive, think, understand.
1Co 2:14  and the natural man doth not receive the things of the Spirit of God, for to him they are foolishness, and he is not able to know them , because spiritually they are discerned;
1Co 2:15  and he who is spiritual, doth discern indeed all things, and he himself is by no one discerned;
1Co 2:16  for who did know the mind of the Lord that he shall instruct Him? and we--we have the mind of Christ.
2Co 11:3  and I fear, lest, as the serpent did beguile Eve in his subtilty, so your minds may be corrupted from the simplicity that is in the Christ;

[rosered]

Thus the word Repent.....G3340  metanoeō to think differently or afterwards, that is, reconsider 
From G3539 noieō to exercise the mind (observe), that is, (figuratively) to comprehend, heed: - consider, perceive, think, understand.
1Co 2:14  and the natural man doth not receive the things of the Spirit of God, for to him they are foolishness, and he is not able to know them , because spiritually they are discerned;
1Co 2:15  and he who is spiritual, doth discern indeed all things, and he himself is by no one discerned;
1Co 2:16  for who did know the mind of the Lord that he shall instruct Him? and we--we have the mind of Christ.
2Co 11:3  and I fear, lest, as the serpent did beguile Eve in his subtilty, so your minds may be corrupted from the simplicity that is in the Christ;

:thumbsup:   Wonderful  Micah ,   appreciated   timely scriptures  :HeartThrob:

[jbertonbounds]

IMO     IMO     IMO     IMO     IMO
Here's the way I see it:

Cussing and cursing are not the same thing, though they are often used interchangeably.
To cuss is to use expletives - words to accentuate your speech (like added spices to food).
Cussing is otherwise benign, and has synonyms that are generally acceptable.
Webster says to curse is to say "a prayer or invocation for harm or injury to come upon one."
The scriptures say "bless and do not curse" and "abstain from filthy language."
Now let's define "filthy language."
Since scripture says it, and since scripture is inspired, then it is God talking.
What is filthy to God?
Sin.
Since language conveys thoughts, filthy thoughts are sinful thoughts.
Therefore, filthy language conveys sinful thoughts - language that promotes sin.
Cussing alone does not promote sin.

To curse is sin.
To use filthy language is sin.
Cussing is not a sin.

Examples of filthy language:  men talking about how many women in their office they would like to "do"; slanderous gossip (since slander is lies that hurt people); a person talking about taking revenge on someone else; a group of teens talking about their plans to cheat on a test or steal something; morally corrupt jokes;  complaining.

Examples of cursing:  "Go to Hell!";  "Damn you!";  "I hope you drop dead!";  "God will take care of you!";  "You may not believe in hell now, but you will when you get there!";  pronouncing (or wishing) ill will toward another.

Examples of benign cussing:  You hit your thumb with a hammer and say "Damn!";  you get startled when your dog jumps on you and say "Oh, crap!";  you are suprised at how hot the weather is and say "It's hot as hell out there!"  (How, pray tell, did these words ever become "dirty"?  Take heed not to subscribe to Pharisee-rules and call them God's precepts!)

That's the way I see it.
IMO     IMO     IMO     IMO     IMO
:2c: :2c: :2c: :2c: :2c: :2c: :2c:

[jabcat]

I know that's the way you see it j, and that's between you and God, your conscience.

Mine says differently.  Also, to me, it's a bad witness.  I don't believe I should talk like the world, without remorse or apology; adopting the language that basically "everyone" - including the world themselves - identify as being sinful language.  But in the end, it's between each person and their own conscience before God.

Blessings.

[jbertonbounds]

Let me add this - Just a little something to mull over.

Cussing (not cursing) openly and publicly, as I just defined in my last post, is not usually a wise thing to do because it is socially unacceptable in most situations.
Perhaps doing something you know is not wise is a sin in itself.
I only cuss a little, and I am careful where and when I cuss - I am usually alone.
But if it's just between me and Jesus, I do it with a clear conscience - even sometimes while I am praying! :laughing7:

I never curse!
I never talk morally dirty!

[Wayfaring Stranger]

IMO     IMO     IMO     IMO     IMO
Here's the way I see it:

Cussing and cursing are not the same thing, though they are often used interchangeably.
To cuss is to use expletives - words to accentuate your speech (like added spices to food).
Cussing is otherwise benign, and has synonyms that are generally acceptable.
Webster says to curse is to say "a prayer or invocation for harm or injury to come upon one."
The scriptures say "bless and do not curse" and "abstain from filthy language."
Now let's define "filthy language."
Since scripture says it, and since scripture is inspired, then it is God talking.
What is filthy to God?
Sin.
Since language conveys thoughts, filthy thoughts are sinful thoughts.
Therefore, filthy language conveys sinful thoughts - language that promotes sin.
Cussing alone does not promote sin.

To curse is sin.
To use filthy language is sin.
Cussing is not a sin.

Examples of filthy language:  men talking about how many women in their office they would like to "do"; slanderous gossip (since slander is lies that hurt people); a person talking about taking revenge on someone else; a group of teens talking about their plans to cheat on a test or steal something; morally corrupt jokes;  complaining.

Examples of cursing:  "Go to Hell!";  "Damn you!";  "I hope you drop dead!";  "God will take care of you!";  "You may not believe in hell now, but you will when you get there!";  pronouncing (or wishing) ill will toward another.

Examples of benign cussing:  You hit your thumb with a hammer and say "Damn!";  you get startled when your dog jumps on you and say "Oh, crap!";  you are suprised at how hot the weather is and say "It's hot as hell out there!"  (How, pray tell, did these words ever become "dirty"?  Take heed not to subscribe to Pharisee-rules and call them God's precepts!)

That's the way I see it.
IMO     IMO     IMO     IMO     IMO
:2c: :2c: :2c: :2c: :2c: :2c: :2c:

:iagree:

Words are just words, they are a tool to convey thoughts and expressions.  A new language could develop in the future in which "and" was a "cuss word" but that doesn't make "and" a bad word, it's all about your heart and intent. 

The good man out of the good treasure of his heart doth bring forth that which [is] good; and the evil man out of the evil treasure of his heart doth bring forth that which [is] evil; for out of the abounding of the heart doth his mouth speak.

-Luke 6:45

If you have evil and hate in your heart your words will follow and a hate-filled person may not cuss but they will speak evil things in "clean" language.  I used to cuss a lot, I mean A LOT.  I didn't see it at the time but I was filled with hate and anger and out of the abundance of my heart did my words drip with hate and anger even when using G rated language.  Since I had my dream/vision in which the Lord called me back to Him I do not cuss hardly at all.  I believe the Lord has put it on my heart that cussing is not for me, I believe it would be a stumbling block for me because of the sinful ways in which I used colorful language in the past.

I believe I am a new creation in Christ but I am not a finished product yet, God is still working on me and the hate and anger I used to feel frequently is ceding into the background.  I no longer feel the need to cuss but that's part of my spiritual journey and my walk with the Lord.  Some may be able to cuss with it out being a stumbling block for them and that is between them and Jesus and I do not judge them.

[micah7:9]

 :banana: :thumbsup:

[shawn]

my point was that if swearing is an expression of dissatisfaction with what is, then it is sin.
Ask yourself, can I even imagine Jesus talking or acting in this way?
(He is our model and if inside us as He is in all true believers, is what we said or did contrary to Him?)

I have to humbly disagree.  I believe we can express dissatisfaction or frustration and it not be sin.  Did not the disciples get frustrated and dissatisfied with false teachers, and those turned away?   While God is certainly in control of the destination, not so sure he micromanages the journey. 

As for curse words, I agree with J..words are words...God judges the heart.  My only issue is that they offend some people, and I don't want to be an offense...or for that to harm my witness.

[jbertonbounds]

Words are just words, they are a tool to convey thoughts and expressions.  A new language could develop in the future in which "and" was a "cuss word" but that doesn't make "and" a bad word, it's all about your heart and intent. 

The good man out of the good treasure of his heart doth bring forth that which [is] good; and the evil man out of the evil treasure of his heart doth bring forth that which [is] evil; for out of the abounding of the heart doth his mouth speak.

-Luke 6:45

If you have evil and hate in your heart your words will follow and a hate-filled person may not cuss but they will speak evil things in "clean" language.  I used to cuss a lot, I mean A LOT.  I didn't see it at the time but I was filled with hate and anger and out of the abundance of my heart did my words drip with hate and anger even when using G rated language.  Since I had my dream/vision in which the Lord called me back to Him I do not cuss hardly at all.  I believe the Lord has put it on my heart that cussing is not for me, I believe it would be a stumbling block for me because of the sinful ways in which I used colorful language in the past.

I believe I am a new creation in Christ but I am not a finished product yet, God is still working on me and the hate and anger I used to feel frequently is ceding into the background.  I no longer feel the need to cuss but that's part of my spiritual journey and my walk with the Lord.  Some may be able to cuss with it out being a stumbling block for them and that is between them and Jesus and I do not judge them.

:thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup:

[jbertonbounds]

my point was that if swearing is an expression of dissatisfaction with what is, then it is sin.
Ask yourself, can I even imagine Jesus talking or acting in this way?
(He is our model and if inside us as He is in all true believers, is what we said or did contrary to Him?)

I have to humbly disagree.  I believe we can express dissatisfaction or frustration and it not be sin.  Did not the disciples get frustrated and dissatisfied with false teachers, and those turned away?   While God is certainly in control of the destination, not so sure he micromanages the journey. 

As for curse words, I agree with J..words are words...God judges the heart.  My only issue is that they offend some people, and I don't want to be an offense...or for that to harm my witness.

LIKE

[jabcat]

Ask yourself, can I even imagine Jesus talking or acting in this way?

Not at all.

[jbertonbounds]

That is hard to imagine.  But it's all about societal conditioning.  We have been conditioned to believe that the cuss words are BAD!  So we naturally disassociate Jesus from them.  Who knows, maybe they didn't have expletives in Jesus' day and society.  But I do know this:  Jesus would never have joked about immoral things, passed along slanderous gossip, said anything to intentionally hurt anyone, lied for dishonest gain, or talked about doing anything sinful.  In other words, Jesus would never have misused language in a sinful way (he would never have communicated filthy language).   :2c:

[jabcat]

I agree with that in large part, j.   

But here's where I also take a little different route.  I understand the premise that "words are just words", especially if they just existed in a vacuum.  But let me come at it from a different angle. Words are the vehicle God gave us by which to communicate to ourself, Him, and others.  So they're important.   Isn't there a scripture that says words carry in them the power of life and death?  Not sure what all that means, but I believe there's a pretty good study there in that are.

Anyway, "words are just words".  Here are my other thoughts on it, and I REALLY think you, Shawn, and others have actually indicated pieces of the following (while at the same time expressing some general disagreement in other areas).  And it's this;  there've been statements about society and about certain things affecting a witness, etc. - so words do not exist within a vacuum.  A letter of the alphabet is "just a letter".  But letters put together, words begin to be associated with all kinds of meaning, not just of specific content, but with many other connections.  Then depending on how those words are used, there's of course even more meaning attached.  I'd suggest that with their connections though, words in themselves carry context, imagery (pleasant, helpful, nasty, harmful), emotion (not just stated, but perceived, received, triggered, in others), connotation (pure or evil), identification ("would Jesus speak like this, or more likely, would it be the lost in the world"?), etc., etc...So if words are JUST words, without all the complex, generally universally recognized and accepted meaning that goes with them, we could talk like we want, no one's faith would ever be damaged, no one's feelings would be hurt, no one's conscience would ever bother them, no unbeliever would come away saying "if that's a Christian, I don't need it - I can already live like that".  But language does have meaning, and though I often fail, I believe we should make every attempt to keep our speech clean and also to not wound with words.

I compare it to the eating meat sacrificed to idols thing.  Paul said that in themselves, there was nothing wrong with the meat, that the idols were just baloney, nothing to them.  But he went on to indicate, that because others make connections to it and/or they may be encouraged to do things that offend their own conscience, hampering their living in the kingdom (righteousness, peace, and joy), then it becomes harmful.  So it's not simply "meat is just meat".   :2c:

But like I said to begin with.  As long as we're not just in denial or trying to rationalize, I believe it's each person's conscience before God.

Blessings.