A question about Time

[eaglesway]

Who has known the mind of the Lord     (Your pea brain cannot fathom most of what God thinks :Chinscratch: )

Who has been His counselor     (If He needs your input, He will ask for it- yea, rite :dunno2: )

Who has given to Him that He should repay    (Nothin you think you know controls anything He does :punish: )

For from Him and through Him and To Him are All Things    (And evrything will turn out great :skittles: )

To whom be the glory forever   (So just say thanks and get off your high horse :banana: )

[Molly]

It says, He has "put eternity in the hearts of men".





"eternity"

H5769
עלם    עולם
‛ôlâm  ‛ôlâm
o-lawm', o-lawm'

From H5956; properly concealed, that is, the vanishing point; generally time out of mind (past or future), that is, (practically) eternity; frequentative adverbially (especially with prepositional prefix) always: - always (-s), ancient (time), any more, continuance, eternal, (for, [n-]) ever (-lasting, -more, of old), lasting, long (time), (of) old (time), perpetual, at any time, (beginning of the) world (+ without end). Compare H5331, H5703.

[VineBranch]

The future is the source out of which the present comes to us. This is a fundamental "law of physics" that is not open for speculation or debate, though it may not tickle the ears of those who like to remain in their comfort zone.

I have seen quite a few paragigms used to show the immutable 'law of physics.'  When I started teaching the whole rage was to do away with notions of before and after.  Past and present were concepts, the cyclical nature of the repeating universe now that was where it was at.  We knew we were right becaue we had the math to prove it.  I came to see that physics, like most of the things we teach in order to try to help those ignorant ones who couldn't think in our rarefied ways, was a metaphor.  But then the metaphor changed, and lo and behold, the ignorant slobs had to be retaugh all over again because we were in charge of Truth, Reality, and telling them what wine to drink.  The vanity went on, and unfortunately we had taugh enough egos to copy us with their own generation ... I see that generation did the same thing.  Pity.

The reason so many false doctrines exist is because people would rather speculate and remain content within their comfort zone, rather than digging deeper to learn the facts, both Scripturally and scientifically. 

The reason there are so many false doctrines is because Christians would rather win than love.

[Illuin]

The future is the source out of which the present comes to us. This is a fundamental "law of physics" that is not open for speculation or debate, though it may not tickle the ears of those who like to remain in their comfort zone.

I have seen quite a few paragigms used to show the immutable 'law of physics.'  When I started teaching the whole rage was to do away with notions of before and after.  Past and present were concepts, the cyclical nature of the repeating universe now that was where it was at.  We knew we were right becaue we had the math to prove it.  I came to see that physics, like most of the things we teach in order to try to help those ignorant ones who couldn't think in our rarefied ways, was a metaphor.  But then the metaphor changed, and lo and behold, the ignorant slobs had to be retaugh all over again because we were in charge of Truth, Reality, and telling them what wine to drink.  The vanity went on, and unfortunately we had taugh enough egos to copy us with their own generation ... I see that generation did the same thing.  Pity.

The reason so many false doctrines exist is because people would rather speculate and remain content within their comfort zone, rather than digging deeper to learn the facts, both Scripturally and scientifically. 

The reason there are so many false doctrines is because Christians would rather win than love.

Win at what? Everyone has gifts God has given them to share with others. It is common for many to hear someone else's insights that differ from their own and scoff and ridicule them, and then fall back on the immature cliche of telling them they do not have love in their hearts. That is something I would expect to hear in a fundamentalist forum VB, not in a Universalist forum, which by default, should be way beyond the milk doctrines and instead exploring the deeper, beautiful hidden truths of God in the Spirit. Lose the chip on your shoulder VB. Love and suppressed anger in the same body is like matter and antimatter colliding with each other..... they cancel each other out, leaving nothing = ZERO = VANITY.

[micah7:9]

It says, He is "the eternal God."


"eternal"

H6924
קדמה    קדם
qedem  qêdmâh
keh'-dem, kayd'-maw
From H6923; the front, of place (absolutely the fore part, relatively the East) or time (antiquity); often used adverbially (before, anciently, eastward): - aforetime, ancient (time), before, east (end, part, side, -ward), eternal, X ever (-lasting), forward, old, past. Compare H6926.


In other words, he is the first in place and time.

Absolutely!  :dsunny:

[micah7:9]

It says, He has "put eternity in the hearts of men".





"eternity"

H5769
עלם    עולם
‛ôlâm  ‛ôlâm
o-lawm', o-lawm'

From H5956; properly concealed, that is, the vanishing point; generally time out of mind (past or future), that is, (practically) eternity; frequentative adverbially (especially with prepositional prefix) always: - always (-s), ancient (time), any more, continuance, eternal, (for, [n-]) ever (-lasting, -more, of old), lasting, long (time), (of) old (time), perpetual, at any time, (beginning of the) world (+ without end). Compare H5331, H5703.

Are you shuffling the deck. As far as I know the word eternity is only used once in my Bible (H5703/5710), and I cannot find your quote, It says, He has "put eternity in the hearts of men".

[Molly]

He has made everything beautiful in its time. He has also set eternity in the hearts of men; yet they cannot fathom what God has done from beginning to end.


Yet God has made everything beautiful for its own time. He has planted eternity in the human heart, but even so, people cannot see the whole scope of God's work from beginning to end.


He has made everything appropriate in its time. He has also set eternity in their heart, yet so that man will not find out the work which God has done from the beginning even to the end.

He has made everything beautiful in its time. Also, he has put eternity into man's heart, yet so that he cannot find out what God has done from the beginning to the end.


He made everything appropriate in its time. He also placed eternity within them—yet, no person can fully comprehend what God is doing from beginning to end.


It is beautiful how God has done everything at the right time. He has put a sense of eternity in people's minds. Yet, mortals still can't grasp what God is doing from the beginning to the end [of time].


He has made every thing beautiful in its time: also he has put eternity in men's hearts, so that no man can find out the work that God does from the beginning to the end.


He has made everything beautiful in its time. He has also set eternity in their hearts, yet so that man can't find out the work that God has done from the beginning even to the end.


--Ecc 3:11

[micah7:9]

11 He has made `.everything fitting in its season;
However, He has put `.obscurity in their heart
So no that the man may not find out `.His work,
That which the One, Elohim, does
from the beginning to the terminus.(CLT)

Ecc 3:11  The whole He hath made beautiful in its season; also, that knowledge He hath put in their heart without which man findeth not out the work that God hath done from the beginning even unto the end. (YLT)

Ecc 3:11  He hath made every thing beautiful in his time: also he hath set the world in their heart, so that no man can find out the work that God maketh from the beginning to the end. (KJV)

Ecc. 3:11 he assigned each to its proper time, but for the mind of man he hath appointed a mystery, that man may never fathom God's 0wn purpose from the beginning to the end.(Moffat)

Ecc. 3:11 He hath made everything beautiful in its time; also he has made the world dear to man's heart, so that no man can find out the works which the
Lord has done from the beginning to the end. (Lamsa)

Ecc 3:11  He hath made every thing beautiful in its time: also he hath set the world in their heart, yet so that man cannot find out the work that God hath done from the beginning even to the end.(RV)

[Lazarus Short]

Ecclesiastes 3:11

He has made everything beautiful in its season.  He has also placed Eternity in their minds, with the intention that man should never discover, from beginning to end, the complete Creation which GOD has made.  (Ferrar Fenton Version)

[micah7:9]

WOW! And I mean that as a good WOW. :dsunny:  So many translations and versions for one word used only one time.
The dictionary would carry a meaning as well and it gets its meaning from eternal.

So is time eternal in eternity, does time stop......somewhere or (I can't say some"time" it would be silly)? :dsunny: :HeartThrob:

[Molly]

No, time doesn't stop.


Heaven and earth will pass away, but My words will never pass away.

--Luke 21:33


World without end!

[micah7:9]

No, time doesn't stop.


Heaven and earth will pass away, but My words will never pass away.

--Luke 21:33


World without end!

:thumbsup: :dsunny: :Peace2: :HeartThrob: :iagree: :cloud9:

[ded2daworld]

IMO, There is no time if there is no matter. Matter is what we use to calibrate time.
Even if time did exist without matter, it would be meaningless with nothing to compare it to.
All would be aeonian - an indefinite period of time.

[VineBranch]

Win at what? Everyone has gifts God has given them to share with others. It is common for many to hear someone else's insights that differ from their own and scoff and ridicule them, and then fall back on the immature cliche of telling them they do not have love in their hearts. That is something I would expect to hear in a fundamentalist forum VB, not in a Universalist forum, which by default, should be way beyond the milk doctrines and instead exploring the deeper, beautiful hidden truths of God in the Spirit. Lose the chip on your shoulder VB. Love and suppressed anger in the same body is like matter and antimatter colliding with each other..... they cancel each other out, leaving nothing = ZERO = VANITY.

If you have a moment, I would recommend you read J. Vernon McGee's introduction to the KJV Bible he used for his programme.  It might help (or not, who knows)

" That is something I would expect to hear in a fundamentalist forum VB, not in a Universalist forum ..."

Well no actually, this is not a site devoted to univeralism, it is a site devoted to Universal Reconciliation.  Two very different things.

"It is common for many to hear someone else's insights that differ from their own and scoff and ridicule them, and then fall back on the immature cliche of telling them they do not have love in their hearts."

So, because I have the insight that no amount of human knowledge allows the understanding which comes from a loving relationship with the Father, and that differs from yours, you now have the right to call me names, and ridicule me, and accuse me of being a fundamentalist (a word which has so many negative connotations).

"Lose the chip on your shoulder VB. Love and suppressed anger in the same body is like matter and antimatter colliding with each other..... they cancel each other out, leaving nothing = ZERO = VANITY."

Didn't you take Eagle to task for what you perceived as name-calling, and personal attacks?  Is it different when you do it?  Do you have special dispensation because your paradigm is more current.

May I respectfully draw your attention to the fact that this is a discussion forum, not a debate. 

But, if it is important to you that you be right, congratulations you win.

[VineBranch]

Ecclesiastes 3:11

He has made everything beautiful in its season.  He has also placed Eternity in their minds, with the intention that man should never discover, from beginning to end, the complete Creation which GOD has made.  (Ferrar Fenton Version)

I just read the first part of Genesis in the Fenton version Laz, neat stuff!!!!!

[ded2daworld]

Illuin and VB - please remember to use the IMO and  :2c:
I know I forget to use it myself and the stronger I feel about a topic, the less
likely I am to use it. In my mind I am obviously right and anyone disagreeing is obviously wrong.
But whatever we currently believe, we used to believe something different
The only people that still believe things like they did when they were 10 hasn't reached age 11 yet, IMO.

[micah7:9]

IMO, There is no time if there is no matter. Matter is what we use to calibrate time.
Even if time did exist without matter, it would be meaningless with nothing to compare it to.
All would be aeonian - an indefinite period of time.

Ded, I believe or imo that this maybe the "matter".
1 Now faith is an assumption of what is being expected, a conviction concerning matters which are not being observed;
2 for in this the elders were testified to.
3 By faith we are apprehending the eons to adjust to a declaration of God, so that what is being observed has not come out of what is appearing.

[Molly]

IMO, There is no time if there is no matter. Matter is what we use to calibrate time.
Even if time did exist without matter, it would be meaningless with nothing to compare it to.
All would be aeonian - an indefinite period of time.

But, that's not what God says.  He's not counting time in matter, he's counting it in words, in letters even.

I am the alpha and the omega, the beginning and the end...


He's counting time in consciousness.    I Am.

[ded2daworld]

By matter, I was referring to something with physicality
not it's importance. :Peace2:

Like to a non-believer, "all that matters is matter for there is no proof of anything immaterial." (non-matter)

[ded2daworld]

Since God sees the beginning to the end, IMO that indicates time will end since it had a beginning.
Everything with the exception of God has a beginning and an end. This includes time.

[Molly]

Since God sees the beginning to the end, IMO that indicates time will end since it had a beginning.
Everything with the exception of God has a beginning and an end. This includes time.

He will see a matter from beginning to end, or he will see an age from beginning to end, but where does it say time ends?   It might say it somewhere, I have just not seen it.

It says ages to the ages.   World without end!





Unto him be glory in the church by Christ Jesus throughout all ages, world without end. Amen.

To him be glory by his church in Yeshua The Messiah to all generations of the eternity of eternities. Amen.

--Eph 3:21

[Molly]

By matter, I was referring to something with physicality
not it's importance. :Peace2:

Like to a non-believer, "all that matters is matter for there is no proof of anything immaterial." (non-matter)

Do you consider energy matter?

What about Spirit?

[ded2daworld]

I didn't say that time will end.
I said IMO it will end if there is no physical matter anywhere.
If the world never ends, time will surely never end. :dsunny:

Energy is matter.  Matter is energy. Spirit by definition is immaterial and therefore not matter. IMO

[Molly]

I didn't say that time will end.
I said IMO it will end if there is no physical matter anywhere.
If the world never ends, time will surely never end. :dsunny:

Energy is matter.  Matter is energy. Spirit by definition is immaterial and therefore not matter. IMO

But didn't he just tell us that we don't need heaven and earth for time?

If his word continues forever, don't we still have time?

Maybe spirit is a type of energy we just haven't defined yet.

[ded2daworld]

Since God continues forever, surely his word will also. :dsunny: :Peace2: