Holy Spirit in everyone?

[Molly]

The New Testament uses three words to describe us.

Body is soma

Soul is psuche  [I think our word 'psychology' comes from this Greek word]

Spirit is pneuma

So the New Testament is very clear that we are made up of body, soul/mind, and spirit in its choice of words.  We are tripartite creatures.

[jabcat]

I would be interested in your thoughts  regarding  the "spirit of man" as discussed in Prov 20:27; Eccl. 3:21; Zechariah 12:1; and 1 Cor 2:11. 

thanks, anna274

Hi anna.  Here's my simplistic version of my thoughts - my "outline" - which is often actually most of what I think I know.   :laughing7: 

In the scriptures you mention, including what most of the translations call "the spirit of man", they appear to me to have to do with the "spirit God gave him" Ecc. 12:7.  Perhaps placed within the body of dust, lent for just awhile until it returns to God.  This as opposed to the body that returns to the dust, and the Holy/Pure Spirit of God. 

Some thoughts/suggestions;

the "spirit of man" is the spark, the spirit God gives to light/enlighten every man. 

Prov. 20:27  The spirit of man is the candle of the Lord – it's how mankind is lightened/enlightened, the conscience..  Young's translation is interesting; "The breath of man is a lamp of Jehovah, Searching all the inner parts of the heart."

Eccl. 3:21  man's existence will be with God, in the heavenlies;  "brutes/beasts", are of/pertaining to, the earth

Zechariah 12:1  different than the body. It is a spirit within Him – separate entities. 

1 Cor 2:11  only man's spirit can know himself, the thoughts of MAN -  (his own, not others').  On the other hand, God's Spirit knows the thoughts of God.

[anna274]

Thanks James for taking the time to study and reply... as usual you have given me  some things to consider or maybe even reconsider re: spirit of man.  There is much to learn, isn't there?  Now comes the difficult part, at least for me... what to do or what not to do with new "knowledge"...
God bless you, Anna

[jabcat]

Thanks James for taking the time to study and reply... as usual you have given me  some things to consider or maybe even reconsider re: spirit of man.  There is much to learn, isn't there?  Now comes the difficult part, at least for me... what to do or what not to do with new "knowledge"...
God bless you, Anna

And I am sure I am missing some things, and that there is still much to learn about it, as you say.  It's just the way I'm able to understand it right now.  I'm sure there are varying opinions on it.  Some of it may even be right.  lol.

Thanks, blessings, James.

[eaglesway]

God was in Christ reconciling the world to Himself.  Is this the Spirit of God that was in Christ?  The Spirit of God making Jesus the parakletos.  There is one God and one mediator between God and man, the man Christ Jesus.

What about the seven spirits of God?  Is there seven holy Spirits?  Is that seven different "people"?

I see why Micah kept asking "what is spirit"?

In my opinion, the seven spirits of God are simply multiple aspects and functions of one spirit, even as light thru a prism refracts into 7 colors of light. "there was a stone with seven eyes....." language of parable, one stone with 7 eyes. God is the one stone. IMO, The Spirit of Christ is only "in" those who have a relationship with Jesus, but, I don't think that relationship functions through a point of knowledge- I think it is by the love of God...."the one who loves knows God and is known by God.........The Lord knows those that are His.......".

Many who know(head knowledge) all about Jesus(in their minds) do not have His spirit in them.... "If any man says he knows God and hates his brother he is walking in darkness still...... Lord, Lord didnt we blah blah blah.....Yea, but I was hungry and you gave me nothing to eat....depart from me u lawless ones I never knew you"

Knowing Him is love. Some, who may not know all about Him in their heads, nevertheless demonstrate that they know Him in their living, in their love(see the parable called 'The Good Samaritan'....read Romans 2:12-16)

Ro 5:5," His love is shed abroad in our hearts by the Holy Spirit who is given us"

That the spirit of God animates evry living thing is simple for me. This fundamental essence of life flows around in the outer court(body and natural mind/soul of every conscious being. It appears to me that intercourse with (knowing) God in the Spirit is an issue of sacrificial love, laying down ones life for a friend(or better yet even an enemy). This is where the Spirit of God 'abides/dwells/tabernacles " in the inner court of the heart. To me the difference is in the relationship to God and the way in which He relates to us in whatever condition we may be in, suiting Himself to our needs, and flowing through any open door He can find. To some He is "the spirit of judgment and burning". To some, He is the "spirit of comfort and consolation". To some He is the "spirit of wisdom and revelation". All of these "refractions" or "expressions" of God's eternal power and divine nature are for the accomplishing of the many faceted wisdom of God.

IMO, in this dispensation of the ages, the Holy Spirit convicts men of righteousness and judgment and teaches the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Christ. He indwells believers in a measure unavailable to unbelievers and previously(in ages past) unavailable to any but a few chosen prophets and sages and priests and fathers. 

[WhiteWings]

My understanding;

1)  soul, everyone
2) spirit, everyone
3) Holy Spirit, the saved

I've come more and more to see that the soul is more the essence of the living person, their sentience - who we are, per se, by the breath of God.

I also believe we all have a spirit, given by God.  (Ecc., "the spirit returns to God who gave it').  We all have that spirit, that "spark" of God "that lights every man".  But then there's the Holy or Pure Spirit of God, that He sends forth to do as He pleases - working inside and outside of whoever/whatever fulfills His grand purpose.  IMO, not everyone has the infilling of the Spirit.

So most people are composed of 3 "units" but true Christians of 4 'units" ?
Or does the HS upgrade or replace the regular spirit?

[SkyOverCloudNed]

My understanding;

1)  soul, everyone
2) spirit, everyone
3) Holy Spirit, the saved

I've come more and more to see that the soul is more the essence of the living person, their sentience - who we are, per se, by the breath of God.

I also believe we all have a spirit, given by God.  (Ecc., "the spirit returns to God who gave it').  We all have that spirit, that "spark" of God "that lights every man".  But then there's the Holy or Pure Spirit of God, that He sends forth to do as He pleases - working inside and outside of whoever/whatever fulfills His grand purpose.  IMO, not everyone has the infilling of the Spirit.  I believe the Holy/Pure Spirit dwells, makes its home in, the (through grace, in order) spiritually reborn (saved) believer.

Blessings.

that same 'spark', God's breath of life is the same  thing that gives life to allliving creatures,not just man. in that respect there is no difference between that which  gives man life and that which gives worms, trees or beasts life.

the sentience, which separates man from beast is something altogether different. but that sentience, which includes the memories, is lost as death.

other than God's breath (aka spirit) of life unregenerate man has no spirit (as in spirits/ghosts/spirit woprld, etc), all too often this is confused with the term spirit when referring to (for example) breaking a horse's spirit or a man who has a strong spirit, etc.

[SkyOverCloudNed]

MAN (psychologically), pneuma being imparted to man, making him "a living psuche" (= "a living soul", or being, as in Gen 2:7. Psa 104:29, 30. Ecc 12:7). When taken back to and by God, man, without pneuma, becomes and is called "a dead soul" in each of the thirteen occurrences rendered in A.V. "dead body", &c. See Ap. 13. ix, p. 21).

[SkyOverCloudNed]

Hi Sky:  I appreciate your very scholarly approach to searching the Scriptures ...  and will look at your posts more carefully; and, although I very probably already have most of the same information and am quite diligent in using this information, I will print your posts for future reference. Thanks.  Anna

Thank you for your kind words. the copy/paste quotes, which did not come through as I had hoped thus making it a little hard to understand. if you have either eSword or Bible Analyzer (very similar to eSword, a clone even) the Companion Bible and its Appendixes (198 of which 3 I tried to copy above) are free to download for eSword and, as I recall only about $5 for the Bible Analyzer program.

[WhiteWings]

Lot of Bullinger stuff: http://www.oocities.org/thatblessedhope/plin9k1.htm
Appendixes: http://www.davidcox.com.mx/library/B/Bullinger-Appendix_to_Companion_Bible(b).pdf

[SkyOverCloudNed]

My understanding;

1)  soul, everyone
2) spirit, everyone
3) Holy Spirit, the saved

I've come more and more to see that the soul is more the essence of the living person, their sentience - who we are, per se, by the breath of God.

I also believe we all have a spirit, given by God.  (Ecc., "the spirit returns to God who gave it').  We all have that spirit, that "spark" of God "that lights every man".  But then there's the Holy or Pure Spirit of God, that He sends forth to do as He pleases - working inside and outside of whoever/whatever fulfills His grand purpose.  IMO, not everyone has the infilling of the Spirit.

So most people are composed of 3 "units" but true Christians of 4 'units" ?
Or does the HS upgrade or replace the regular spirit?

other than God's breath of life and the psychological references to spirit i am aware of no passages that state unregenerate man has a spirit (as in spirits in the spirit world, etc).

but, yes, as i understand it, man is a living soul (ex 3000 souls ie lives died on 9-11) and that ceases to exist at death.

so there is:
for the unbeliever:
1 God's breath of life that animates all living creatures.

added to that, for the believer:
there is:
2 the believer's spirit received upon conversion
3 The Holy Spirit


then there is the sentience/memories/brain as it were but that is lost as death.

[SkyOverCloudNed]

Lot of Bullinger stuff: http://www.oocities.org/thatblessedhope/plin9k1.htm
Appendixes: http://www.davidcox.com.mx/library/B/Bullinger-Appendix_to_Companion_Bible(b).pdf

it never ceases to amaze me that people (such as Bullinger) back in those days, without electricity, typewriters, computers, word  processors, shortage of paper (and the cost), quills for pens, etc how they could amass such in depth study and research. mistakes by and large were not allowed like  it is today where we make a mistake and wad the page up, throw it away and grab another piece. 

[Ross]

Difference between the spirit of life and the Holy Spirit. The very things Christ is talking about with Nicodemus when He says about being born again.

[SkyOverCloudNed]

I've come more and more to see that the soul is more the essence of the living person, their sentience - who we are

and scripture tells us that is lost, gone, forgotten upon death.  so the idea that we will remember all in this life seems unlikely.

also, scripture tells us that in the new creation none of the old will be there nor will any of it be remembered.

[SkyOverCloudNed]

if unregenerate man had an immortal soul or, for that matter, even a spirit, that would imply that he is an eternal being and, yet, scripture assures us that only God is immortal thus if man were immortal he would not die and scripture would not be true when it says God alone is immortal.

[Cardinal]

Man is a soul who has a spirit, and lives in a body. We get all 3 made new. Heart, womb, and soul are interchangable words, essentially. Heart = innermost being, just like the innermost chamber of the tabernacle. All three words are "something hollowed out", ie. something made to RECEIVE, as in, to receive SEED.

Eve was Adam's stony heart, removed from him so he could see what was in his heart, face to face, which was an unregerate heart, iniquity was found in him. Adam is the spirit and soul of man in union = He called THEIR name Adam.

God always multiplies by division and He's the only one that can do it that way. Death = division, and life comes out of death, it's a tool for Him to use. Unless a grain of wheat fall to the ground and dies (division of soul and spirit), it abideth alone, but if it dies, it brings forth much fruit (multiplication). We decrease, He increases.

Ezekiel 11:19 KJV
And I will give them one heart, and I will put a new spirit within you; and I will take the stony heart out of their flesh, and will give them an heart of flesh:

Eze. 18:31 Cast away from you all your transgressions, whereby ye have transgressed ; and make you a new heart and a new spirit: for why will ye die , O house of Israel?

Eze. 36:26 A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh.

Revelation 2:17 KJV
He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches; To him that overcometh will I give to eat of the hidden manna, and will give him a white stone (CLEAN VIRGIN SOUL THAT COMES DOWN FROM ABOVE = EVERY GOOD AND PERFECT GIFT COMES FROM ABOVE), and in the stone a new name (NAME MEANS NATURE, A NEW SPIRIT = NEW NATURE) written , which no man knoweth saving he that receiveth it.

That which is made to receive, receives seed, and that seed expresses its nature through that which was made to receive it. My two cents...

[Molly]

2 Thessalonians 2:13-14
But we ought always to thank God for you, brothers loved by the Lord, because from the beginning God chose you to be saved through the sanctifying work of the Spirit and through belief in the truth. He called you to this through our gospel, that you might share in the glory of our Lord Jesus Christ.


Now may the God of peace make you holy in every way, and may your whole spirit [pneuma] and soul [psuche] and body [soma] be kept blameless until our Lord Jesus Christ comes again.
--1 Thess 5:23


1 Thessalonians 2:19 For what is our hope, our joy, or the crown in which we will glory in the presence of our Lord Jesus when he comes? Is it not you?

[SkyOverCloudNed]

This conversation is going to continue going nowhere if we (myself included) insist on propounding personal opinions and misreading scripture.  what WE think or believe is of absolutely no value and has no substantive scriptural validity in the eyes of The Lord. The ONLY thing that counts is not the 7 billion opinions (read: 7 billion rolls of toilet paper) of what The Word of God SHOULD be but; rather, what God says IS so.

[WhiteWings]

Forbidden subject so I just gonna say this once.
I'm no Trinitarian. Neither as one or 3 persons.  Don't know exactly why but my impresion is always that the HS is let's call it Fathers personality.
And part of that is blown in with the breath of life in Genesis.
Then what is starting to believe? Or recieving the HS? Just looking at the Pentecost event it looks like a strong external force entering the body. Was that really what happend or did God just give  agood show for a special event?
It's said we look trough a glass darkly. We are veiled. We are bound to disobedience.
When reading those things I always get the impression:
We = "what we think we are"     -    "veil, glass etc"

Meaning becoming holy doesn't mean recieving something good but losing something bad.
A refiners fire and a fullars soap remove junk. It doesn't add purity.
So perhaps the toungues of fire at pentecost didn't reall invade the bodies, but schredded veils and cleaned the glass.

Just my thoughts.

[lomarah]

You know what Wings, I wonder about that, this is something I'm not sure about, do we get a NEW spirit and soul, like completely OTHER than what we are? That doesn't make sense to me, what you said makes more sense, about the fuller's soap and all that. He MAKES all things new... He makes us new... what does that mean?? When I think of something "new" I think of just that - something "new"! Like a new toy, a new car... but to make us new, what does that mean??

Oh the mysteries of God lol!

[eaglesway]

This conversation is going to continue going nowhere if we (myself included) insist on propounding personal opinions and misreading scripture.  what WE think or believe is of absolutely no value and has no substantive scriptural validity in the eyes of The Lord. The ONLY thing that counts is not the 7 billion opinions (read: 7 billion rolls of toilet paper) of what The Word of God SHOULD be but; rather, what God says IS so.

On this forum it is all about our opinions, since no one has the very word of God here- and no one is the unique arbiter of everyone elses opinions and wether or not they have merit.

[lomarah]

This conversation is going to continue going nowhere if we (myself included) insist on propounding personal opinions and misreading scripture.  what WE think or believe is of absolutely no value and has no substantive scriptural validity in the eyes of The Lord. The ONLY thing that counts is not the 7 billion opinions (read: 7 billion rolls of toilet paper) of what The Word of God SHOULD be but; rather, what God says IS so.

On this forum it is all about our opinions, since no one has the very word of God here- and no one is the unique arbiter of everyone elses opinions and wether or not they have merit.

:thumbsup:

[Molly]

Romans 12:2
And do not be fashioned according to this age, but be transformed by the renewing (anakainosis) of the mind that you may prove what the will of God is, that which is good and well pleasing and perfect.

Titus 3:5
He saved us, through the washing of regeneration and the renewing (anakainosis) of the Holy Spirit.

Regeneration--we are spiritually reborn every day by the Holy Spirit.

We are made new, re-newed, every day by the Holy Spirit.

Anakainoo means to make fresh[implied through repetition] :

23 And be renewed in the spirit of your mind;
--Eph 4:23

The manna must be collected and eaten every day.

In this way, we are transformed.


49 Your fathers did eat manna in the wilderness, and are dead.
John 6:50 But here is the bread that comes down from heaven, which a man may eat and not die.

[Molly]

Jesus replied, "No one who puts his hand to the plow and looks back is fit for service in the kingdom of God."

--Luke 9:62


13 Brothers, I do not consider myself yet to have taken hold of it. But one thing I do: Forgetting what is behind and straining toward what is ahead,

14 I press toward the mark for the prize of the high calling of God in Christ Jesus.

15 Let us therefore, as many as be perfect, be thus minded: and if in any thing ye be otherwise minded, God shall reveal even this unto you.

--Phil 3

[redhotmagma]

Forbidden subject so I just gonna say this once.
I'm no Trinitarian. Neither as one or 3 persons.  Don't know exactly why but my impresion is always that the HS is let's call it Fathers personality.
And part of that is blown in with the breath of life in Genesis.
Then what is starting to believe? Or recieving the HS? Just looking at the Pentecost event it looks like a strong external force entering the body. Was that really what happend or did God just give  agood show for a special event?
It's said we look trough a glass darkly. We are veiled. We are bound to disobedience.
When reading those things I always get the impression:
We = "what we think we are"     -    "veil, glass etc"

Meaning becoming holy doesn't mean recieving something good but losing something bad.
A refiners fire and a fullars soap remove junk. It doesn't add purity.
So perhaps the toungues of fire at pentecost didn't reall invade the bodies, but schredded veils and cleaned the glass.

Just my thoughts.

:thumbsup:
Isa 25
And He will destroy on this mountain The surface of the covering cast over all people, And the veil that is spread over all nations.  He will swallow up death forever.

All creation waits with eager longing for the unveiling of the sons of God.
The unveiling of Jesus Christ that was given to him by God.