The elder son

[micah7:9]

In the parable of the son who took his inheritance and spent it wildly, who was the elder son.
In the sense of our spiritual understanding, who does the elder son represent?

[WhiteWings]

Elder = first born = one with authority = one that recieve the inheritance

Elder son is Israel.....
:2c:

[micah7:9]

I reason that the elder son in the religious system, its called the church[not the church as the body of Christ] but what is understood as "church" or the assemblies that get together on a Sunday.

[WhiteWings]

Israel is a religious system too. And it's older. If "church" is the eldest son who/what is the younger son?

[WhiteWings]

I think Rich man an Lazarus is about the same thing.
The rich man had purple clothes. Leadership.
But obviously lost it because Lazarus (gentile imo) took his place in Abrahams bossom.

[micah7:9]

Israel is a religious system and it is older than the christian religion, still they have not heard the call to come out or perhaps Israel has. The elder son is organized religion, I would presume that includes Israel. Many are called but few are chosen, the younger son is the chosen.

[redhotmagma]

those who condemn their brother and are upset with their Father's will to provide undeserved mercy are the elder son

[sheila]

   Righteousness,Justice and MERCY...three really important spiritual qualities   that remain..Just as FAITH,HOPE,LOVE  Remain

     FAITH IN HIS RIGHTEOUSNES...HOPE IN HIS JUSTICE..AND LOVE IN HIS MERCY

[thinktank]

those who condemn their brother and are upset with their Father's will to provide undeserved mercy are the elder son

Will that work the other way around as well?

That in UR, if the elder brother gets saved. But the elder brother is already deemed as Gods son, so are they already saved? in the parable  :dontknow:

[redhotmagma]

tt

are we not all Gods children?  Have we not all one Father? One Lord One Faith One baptism, for from Him, through Him, and to Him are all things

[Molly]

Elder = first born = one with authority = one that recieve the inheritance

Elder son is Israel.....
:2c:

And also the Law [versus Grace], And also Adam/Eve [versus second Adam--flesh versus spirit]

But the elder shall serve the younger.

[thinktank]

tt

are we not all Gods children?  Have we not all one Father? One Lord One Faith One baptism, for from Him, through Him, and to Him are all things

John 8:42
Jesus said unto them, If God were your Father, ye would love me: for I proceeded forth and came from God; neither came I of myself, but he sent me.


Jesus spoke the parable of the elder brother. My question is who is the elder brother?. The pattern of scripture reveals that those who rely on Abraham as their father and look to condemn the gentiles or e.g the blind man that Jesus healed are lost. But in this parable the father says to the son. "son you are ever with me and all things are yours to enjoy"

So who does God regard as son, but yet is someone who is jealous and angry that the younger brother is receiving gifts, yet has done nothing but lived a sinful life.

I said could it be the other way around. That the older brother represents saved beleivers, while the younger brother represents Israel, who lived a sinful life. Jesus aid the first shall be last and the last shall be first. So maybe Israel who are first end up being in Gods kingdom last, but beleivers who are last, end up in Gods kingdom first.

[WhiteWings]

I said could it be the other way around. That the older brother represents saved beleivers, while the younger brother represents Israel, who lived a sinful life. Jesus aid the first shall be last and the last shall be first. So maybe Israel who are first end up being in Gods kingdom last, but beleivers who are last, end up in Gods kingdom first.

TT,

The older brother was first (born) Israel.
But he ran away and found peace after he returned.
The younger brother always was a peace and so was there before the older one returned.

That said.... I don't understand it because the younger son (church) is at least as corrupted as the older son (Isreal)

[jabcat]

tt

are we not all Gods children?  Have we not all one Father? One Lord One Faith One baptism, for from Him, through Him, and to Him are all things

That is interesting and bears further study.  I believe that's likely talking about  believers.  There are multiple scrips showing not all are of the faith, and Jesus told some "you are of your father the devil". 

[jabcat]

P.S.  Those that are saved in this lifetime (and in the time to come) are only saved by grace.  Another reinforcement for that was read this morning - good scrip;  "..through the grace of the Lord Jesus we are believing, to be saved..."   IMO, even believing is a gift.

AFA the OP, interesting comments.  I don't argue the Israel piece of it.  But my personal reaction is, that elder brother can be me - if I'm sitting around with my arms crossed, being critical, judgmental, not being loving and helpful, etc. - in general, having a bad attitude.   :2c:

[Molly]

I said could it be the other way around. That the older brother represents saved beleivers, while the younger brother represents Israel, who lived a sinful life. Jesus aid the first shall be last and the last shall be first. So maybe Israel who are first end up being in Gods kingdom last, but beleivers who are last, end up in Gods kingdom first.

TT,

The older brother was first (born) Israel.
But he ran away and found peace after he returned.
The younger brother always was a peace and so was there before the older one returned.

That said.... I don't understand it because the younger son (church) is at least as corrupted as the older son (Isreal)

The younger son is the ekklesia, called out ones, saved by grace.

They would also be Gentiles.

[Beloved Servant]

I see that, too, Jabcat, that not all are of the brethren.

Though they talk it they do not walk it.

Anyone feel like having beers tonight?

Coffee and cigarettes?

Hollywood movie or just a little R-rated TV?

Some cynical reading or conspiracy theories?

Gossip, witchcraft and mind control?

And the ubiquitous pornography that just "happened" to pop up while searching the internet for "something else."

[micah7:9]

P.S.  Those that are saved in this lifetime (and in the time to come) are only saved by grace.  Another reinforcement for that was read this morning - good scrip;  "..through the grace of the Lord Jesus we are believing, to be saved..."   IMO, even believing is a gift.

AFA the OP, interesting comments.  I don't argue the Israel piece of it.  But my personal reaction is, that elder brother can be me - if I'm sitting around with my arms crossed, being critical, judgmental, not being loving and helpful, etc. - in general, having a bad attitude.   :2c:

" But my personal reaction is, that elder brother can be me - if I'm sitting around with my arms crossed, being critical, judgmental, not being loving and helpful, etc. - in general, having a bad attitude.   :2c:"

Glory! Amen.

[Beloved Servant]

That is interesting and bears further study.  I believe that's likely talking about believers.  There are multiple scrips showing not all are of the faith, and Jesus told some "you are of your father the devil."

Glory! Amen.

[thinktank]

I said could it be the other way around. That the older brother represents saved beleivers, while the younger brother represents Israel, who lived a sinful life. Jesus aid the first shall be last and the last shall be first. So maybe Israel who are first end up being in Gods kingdom last, but beleivers who are last, end up in Gods kingdom first.

TT,

The older brother was first (born) Israel.
But he ran away and found peace after he returned.
The younger brother always was a peace and so was there before the older one returned.

That said.... I don't understand it because the younger son (church) is at least as corrupted as the older son (Isreal)

That's the accepted story, I can reason that, because of the context of Israel being born first. But Israel in part rejected the messiah, Paul went to the gentiles.

I think there is a scripture that says they the tax collectors go in before you.

The believers are covered by the blood, accepted the messiah and the messiah leads them to godliness, to the kingdom of God.

But Israel who reject the messiah are not living in Gods kingdom, but the scriptures say that eventually all Israel will be saved, that the gentiles lead them to jealousy.

[jabcat]

if I'm sitting around with my arms crossed, being critical, judgmental, not being loving and helpful, etc. - in general, having a bad attitude.   :2c:"

Glory! Amen.

That is interesting and bears further study.  I believe that's likely talking about believers.  There are multiple scrips showing not all are of the faith, and Jesus told some "you are of your father the devil."

Glory! Amen.

micah and David, an old song from when I was a child comes to mind;  Remind Me Dear Lord 

Nothing good have i done
to deserve God's own Son
I'm not worthy of the scars
in His hands
yet he chose the road to Calvary
to die in my stead
why He loved me i can't understand


(bluegrass)     http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rdT5BK-eqVY

Blessings, James.

[Beloved Servant]

"to die in my stead"


That is a lie from the bowels of satan.
While He did die for us in was BY NO MEANS INSTEAD OF US.
We must go to the cross, pick it up and follow Him.
He is the pattern.

[jabcat]

glad you liked it  :laughing7: 

though i understand what you're saying, another way to look at that is, He did die so you wouldn't be dead forever - either literally, or spiritually ("in your trespasses and sins").  it was His resurrection that conquered death for us.

but I'm not looking for an argument.  i think there's still a blessing to be had in the overall message of the song.  if anyone doesn't like it, that's ok. 

[Beloved Servant]

That phrase can not stand alone.
It is the exact same technique used of the serpent all the way back to Genesis.

[Molly]

Praise ye the LORD. Sing to the LORD a new song, and his praise in the congregation of saints.
--Psa 149:1



2Let Israel rejoice in him that made him: let the children of Zion be joyful in their King.

3Let them praise his name in the dance: let them sing praises unto him with the timbrel and harp.

4For the LORD taketh pleasure in his people: he will beautify the meek with salvation.

5Let the saints be joyful in glory: let them sing aloud upon their beds.

6Let the high praises of God be in their mouth, and a two-edged sword in their hand;