Someone help me, please...

[thinktank]

I enjoy reading your posts, you remind me of shadow, a member who left and then came back, maybe you guys should speak to each other, perhaps.


I am so sick and so tired of being too broke to buy a decent gift to my mother and sister and above all else, I'm sick and tired of having nothing to offer to Jesus. He died for me, on a cross and He bled and suffered like hell for me, He had that Bible sent to me and brought me to the truth of UR and I HAVE NOTHING TO OFFER HIM!!!!
Michelle

Can you make a cup of tea for your mother?




# Matthew 10:42
And if anyone gives even a cup of cold water to one of these little ones who is my disciple, truly I tell you, that person will certainly not lose their reward."
Matthew 10:41-42 (in Context) Matthew 10 (Whole Chapter)

# Mark 9:41
Truly I tell you, anyone who gives you a cup of water in my name because you belong to the Messiah will certainly not lose their reward

[Paul Hazelwood]

I'm not judging or condemning anyone here, but when are you people going to wake up???? 

Well of course you are, but that is ok.   Judgment is not inherantly a bad thing, the bible simply says that you will be judged by the same measure.

One of the things a person goes through when being called out of the institutions of religion is that you want to retain all the convenient teachings that cater to your own beliefs of the things you do good.

Oh you are not a homosexual, so certainly religion got that one right, etc etc etc.....

So you want to retain the callous fundamentalism that you find ok and then hollar and complain that universalists aren't railing on about all the other stuff, satanism, end time, ect ect ect.

Eventually you realize that what a lot of people really want to do is do what has caused all the other denominations to form, they simply want a religion that agrees with them and eveything they want to do and are against.

They want to trade one institution for another.  that is why so many universalists want Rob Bell to take the heat for them, Go Rob,  make christianity into our religion.  Quite sickening actually.  The belief of God saving all mankind hasn't taught a lot of people much of anything.

[Lefein]

Very correct Paul.

[Michelle]

:sigh: My Fundy friend is gonna be real mad at me. But I had to say something. I had to... :sigh: I sent him a message:

" http://www.chacha.com/topic/egyptian-protests/news/are-egyptian-muslims-and-christians-protecting-each-other

http://www.newsdaily.com/stories/tre71h6ka-us-egypt-christians/

http://www.veteranstoday.com/2011/01/12/muslim-human-shields-to-protect-egyptian-christians/

People from different belief systems not trying to kill each other for once makes you disgusted?? I bet you're gonna give me a fire and brimstone speech. Yeah, I'm sure Jesus is gonna punish and torture people for saving lives and praying for their fellow human beings. That whole "endless" punishment thing is bullcrap. God is love and JUSTICE, not injustice. A punishment is not endless and people will be punished according to their deeds, not endlessly and not the same period of time for all faults. And saving lives, praying and loving your neighbor as yourself is not sin. Jesus will cure all of His children from sin, unbelief and false teachings with His purging, refining, infinite love. Some people really need to give up the hate, unforgiveness, pride and self-righteousness. No human being get to decide who should live and who should die, who should be punished and who should be spared. Those who do that act like they're God and blaspheme Him. The Pharissees did just that and Jesus called them hypocrites. No one on this planet is better than anyone else. Especially not those who think they are better than others. The Pharisees don't repent, they say: "Thank God, I'm not like him".

"This is not about us and them.  We are one. This was an attack on Egypt as a whole, and I am standing with the Copts because the only way things will change in this country is if we come together."

This feeling of brotherhood ("One people, one blood") among Egyptians regardless of religion is prominent throughout the country.  It is seen in the pledge of Muslims who will collectively fight the threat of Islamic militants towards an Egypt free from sectarian strife.  It is seen as banners went up depicting mosques and churches, crosses and crescents, together in unity as one."

Didn't God say something about 'Thou Shall not judge'? And 'You shall be judged with the same measure with which you judged'? How about "He who hates his brother and says he loves God is a liar"? Jow about "He who dwelleth in love dwelleth in God and God in him"? Ouch... does it hurt being a hypocrite? Jesus came to die for us while we were still sinners and unbelievers and people are killing each others off!!! And when Christians and Muslims or Christians and Jews finally fight side by side, protect each others and pray for each others, some people come along and say: "This is wrong. They will be "endlessly" punished"??? Yeah, I'm sure Jesus wants the war, violence, bloodsheds and hatred to continue, especially considering the fact that He came to die for us while we were still sinner and unbelievers and fully paid the price with the works of the cross, His absolute and supreme divine saving power and His shed blood. To say that Christianity does not have murderous intent forgets its history and its own theology. With that kind of mentality, you get the Crusades, you get genocide, you get the so-called Salem Witch Trial where innocent women were burned to the stake after being tortured for hours for something they didn't do! And even if they had done it, nothing justifies torture and murder! Do I go around torturing and killing Muslims? I was guilty of practicing false religion in the past and now I'm saved. The Lord saved me. Salvation is 100% of the Lord. I had nothing to do with it. It wasn't choice or my so-called free will that saved me. I was depraved and blind and the disease of sin was far advanced in me. God hears me and know I can testify to that. Once again the people of America are showing that true Christianity is rare indeed in our countries, as a true Christian would feel equally indignant for all peoples being persecuted in Iraq. Then again, a true Christian would never have gone along with this invasion in the first place. Christians who despised and hate Muslims, Jews, pagans or whatever are not true Christians. Jesus said to love one another and to love our neighbor as ourselves, but most people won't put that through their thick skulls. But no. If you love your neighbor as yourself, you will be "endlessly" punished or you will have prayed for that person and loved that person all for nothing because that person will be "endlessly" punished for finite wrongs. Wow, just wow. Yeah, our Heavenly Father would commit such injustice and horror when imperfect human parents would never get along with it. Yeah, because imperfect humans are so better than a God of love who can and will save all. But according to Fundamentalists, He doesn't want to (not loving enough), or worse, He can't (too weak). Pharisaical pride and self-righteousness is the Fundamentalist's biggest problem. "We're good enough, but the rest of the world isn't". Some people just don't get it. It's not about who's good enough, it's about the Father's love and infinite saving power. Paul was totally transformed on the spot and his salvation had nothing to do with choice or free will. He was on his way to murder a bunch of Christians when he was changed on the spot in an instant. Humans are too weak and corrupt to do a single right thing without the grace of God. Yeah, because people save themselves and make that "choice" while they are still depraved and selfish carnal men. Yeah, that makes a lot of sense. The problem with Fundamentalists is they think that salvation is of man and free will. And they have many false doctrine. Like the unbiblical sinner's prayer. And people have to give up their sins to be saved (repentance) and surrender their lives to Christ. And not all KJV-onlyist Fundamentalists fall for that false doctrine. That's from one of your favorite websites:

http://www.jesus-is-savior.com/False%20Doctrines/Lordship%20Salvation/bad_tracts.htm

Repentance is only a change of mind...

"You see, many people think that they have to give up their sins, reform themselves, make a commitment, turn over a new leaf, clean themselves up, etc. or God won't save them. This is a lie of the devil. Salvation is a free gift (Romans 3:24, 6:23, Ephesians 2:8-9). We don't give up our sins TO get saved, we give up our sins BECAUSE we are saved. You don't give God your life in order to be saved; but you give God your life BECAUSE you ARE saved. The unbiblical teaching of Jack Chick and others that a sinner must be willing to surrender their life to Christ for salvation is a lie of the Devil. Salvation is receiving, not giving."

Another KJV-onlyist Fundamentalist:

http://www.scionofzion.com/decisionism.htm

Another KJV-onlyist Fundamentalist:

http://www.soulwinning.info/wolves/false_brethren.htm

"This is no different than the false teaching today that a sinner must forsake their sinful lifestyle and surrender their life to Christ to be saved, aka, Lordship Salvation. The Apostle Paul addresses the issue by warning the Christians at Galatia about "false brethren" who ADD works to faith alone in Christ. These same "false brethren" abound in our churches today. One of the main reasons we are witnessing the degradation of Biblical theology in these Last Days in because of a slew of corrupt versions of the Bible being sold on the markets nowadays. The New International Version and the English Standard Version of the Bible horribly pervert the Scriptures concerning salvation . . ."

If you use only the 1611 KJV, how come you fell for that false doctrine??? No english translation is perfect and without error. But I still prefer that Bible...

"Satan is subtle, whose purpose is to corrupt the simplicity of the Gospel and lead men into Hell. One must never stray away from the Biblical teaching that eternal life is a free gift (Romans 5:15;6:23), based solely upon the blood sacrifice of Jesus Christ (1st Peter 1:18,19), and that a man's faith is COUNTED for righteousness (Romans 4:5). We need NO self-righteousness of our own, and 'tis a good thing because we have none to offer God (Isaiah 64:6). We are saved by Christ's righteousness (2nd Corinthians 5:21), which is imputed to us at salvation (Romans 4:6). Amen! Anyone who teaches that a sinner MUST make a commitment to live for Christ to be saved, or surrender their will completely to God to be saved, or cease from their sinful lifestyle to be saved, is teaching an utterly false gospel."

Change comes AFTER salvation...

And that all comes, not from Christian Universalists, but from KJV-onlyist Christian Fundamentalists, the eternal damnation believing type, just like yourself. You are guilty of teaching a false gospel. Isn't that what you accused me of? Mmm. According to some KJV-onlyist Fundamentalists like you, that false gospel you're teaching is damnable heresy. Isn't that what you accused me of? And according to your your "ENDLESS" punishment false doctrine, unless you repent, you will not be punished according to your deeds, but ETERNALLY punished for your finite wrongdoings by love Himself who has unlimited saving power. I got you there, didn't I? But I'm not done yet. Now, let's see if the sinner's prayer is a biblical doctrine...

Another Christian Fundamentalist... who seems to enjoy Jonathan Edward's eternal damnation speech:

http://www.bible.ca/g-sinners-prayer.htm

"If you prayed the "sinners prayer" for your salvation, you are still lost in your sins, because it is not what God said to do."

Salvation is 100% of the Lord...

Another KJV-onlyist Fundamentalist who just love to preach the "endless" punishment false doctrine:

http://www.av-1611.com/False_Salvation.html

"Pray the Sinners Prayer" This doctrine is not found anywhere in the Bible."

"Scripture does not teach that salvation is accomplished by having one's sins forgiven. Most Denominations teach the false doctrine of effectual forgiveness. They teach that sins are not forgiven until one believes Jesus died for their sins."

And all that comes from KJV-onlyist Christian Fundamentalists like you. You should start looking into all the false doctrines you believe in...

He's wrong on the "unforgivable" sin though. According to the vast majority of your denomination, the "unforgivable" sin is giving credit to the devil for the miraculous works of the Lord. Like when those men accused Him of casting out demons by Belzebub. Isn't that what you do when you refuse to admit that salvation is 100% of the Lord and has nothing to do with the will of a spiritually dead, depraved, sinful, carnal man?

"Ephesians 2:8 KJV reads "For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast."

HIS faith. Our pathetic, weak, human faith is nothing. Why do you think that's called grace, my friend? Not just because He gave His life for us on the cross, but also, because He gives us HIS faith upon salvation and that is a grace too. Put that through your head once and for all. Nothing, you hear me, NOTHING that we have; faith, strength, love doesn't come from HIM. We have no faith, no strength, no love of our own. We are NOTHING, absolutely NOTHING without Him. It's just like sin. How do you resist temptation? In your own strength? I think not. With HIS strength, HIS faith. Those are all graces...

"Jesus said, Matthew 7:13-14 KJV "Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat: Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it."   

Another piece of scriptures that has been misinterpreted. Jesus was talking to His disciples and prophecizing the destruction of Jerusalem and the end of the mosaic system. Most of the Jews chose to follow their religious leaders (Pharisees) instead of Jesus. They perished or were taken captive. Nothing about "endless" punishment or punishment beyond the grave is imply in that passage. Also, half of the Jews were blinded, that the Gentiles might be saved. But Paul clearly says that Jerusalem will be saved, after all the Gentiles have been saved...

"Proverbs 14:12 KJV "There is a way which seemeth right unto a man, but the end thereof are the ways of death."

Like perishing of a violent death, in this life and this world. He punished many sinners with physical death/destruction in this life and this world, both in the O.T and N.T...

Love will always triumph over hatred, light will always triumph over darkness and Jesus will always triumph over the forces of evil and the disease of sin. Infinite Love Himself will cure us all. I will never doubt the infinite love and infinite saving power of our Heavenly Father...

I could not shut up and not say anything because those Christians and Muslims who have protected each others and prayed for each others are doing the right thing...

"Don't judge, lest ye be judged."

"Love thy neighbor as thyself."

I think about you and pray for you. Take care, beloved brother.

Michelle."

My poor beloved brother, Thomas... Why do you refuse to preach the true Gospel, the Victorious Gospel? I so wish I could share this with you... :sigh: :HeartThrob:

[Michelle]

http://www.chacha.com/topic/egyptian-protests/news/are-egyptian-muslims-and-christians-protecting-each-other

"The Christians felt confident they would be safe from attack while they offered prayers for the dead, because their Muslim countrymen were there to protect them."

Prayers for the dead... They were Christian Universalists, not Fundamentalists... That explains it...

[micah7:9]

Repentance is not "only" a change of mind....it is a change of mind.
I just wonder about where you are at in your salvation walk; it would seem that  you are very knowledgeable about what the Bible says, do you have an idea of what the Bible teaches?
Let me just say this..... I am of the persuasion that "fire and brimstone" are a tool of love and not fear, heat yes, but not fear.
What is it you are looking for? Confirmation that you are where it(whatever that is) and your life is supposed to be. Do want or need affirmation that what you know is what it is? Just what kind of help are you looling for? These folks here, myself included will give you scripture and verse for you to allow the Holy Spirit to work in and for you, but I assure you unless you yeild and give you yourself to what you have been given to seek......you will remain where you are looking in.

[Beloved Servant]

Philippians 2: 3-11

Do nothing from selfishness or conceit, but in humility count others better than yourselves. Let each of you look not only to his own interests, but also to the interests of others. Have this mind among yourselves, which is yours in Christ Jesus, who, though he was in the form of God, did not count equality with God a thing to be grasped, but emptied himself taking the form of a servant, being born in the likeness of men. And being found in human form he humbled himself and became obedient to death even death on a cross.

[Michelle]

http://www.veteranstoday.com/2011/01/12/muslim-human-shields-to-protect-egyptian-christians/

"But the way Egyptians reacted to this terrorist operation has been the real surprise especially to the culprits and conspirators behind the church attack. No riots or clashes between Christians and Muslims took place, only people took to the streets to denounce the shameful attack and to express the everlasting solidarity between Muslims and Christians in Egypt as equal citizens of the same country and who have been living and coexisting in harmony and peace for over 1400 years now."

Did you hear that guys? Christians and Muslims, everlasting solidarity, living and coexisting in harmony and peace for over 1400 years in Egypt!!!! Why can't they just do that in America?

Let's pray... :sigh: :HeartThrob:

"And this is what civilized people do when they confront danger; they embrace each other and protect one another. They rally in demonstrations of love and solidarity yelling out the slogan “we live together or die together."

[micah7:9]

Amen. I must ask, are you accomplishing what you desire here with your posts. They are good and thought invoking, but are you not the one who is asking for help? I have not read all your posts, they are quiet lengthy, and I personally feel you may be attempting you win folks over to whatever you seem to seek help for. thanks and love and peace to you through Jesus

[Michelle]

I came across this as I was doing research:

http://www.scionofzion.com/age.htm

This is utterly disgusting. This is so gross and so vile. I feel so sick to my stomach I feel like I'm gonna throw up. Going as far as to say the aborted baby and the retarded... How can these people live with themselves??? How can they sleep at night??? Twisting scriptures, not studying the Greek and the Hebrew and teaching vile and gross false doctrine... They enjoy teaching that God creates souls and bring people into this world just to throw them away like garbages to be endlessly roasted. As a woman once said, "God don't make no trash." But I never believed that babies and retarded people were guilty. This is NOT true. They are innocent. No only can't they tell good from evil, they are not aware and cannot understand. To think I was one of those E.T preaching Christian make me feel so sick, I've never felt that sick in my entire life... That is something I will NEVER understand. Why God let me believe such a vile, gross lie for years... I led so many people away from Jesus because of that vile and gross false doctrine... I don't even have their email adresses and I doubt they will ever write to me again... And now, Jesus is left to clean the mess... The mess that He Himself created by letting me believe that vile and gross lie for so many years... Not that I'm self-righteous or that I doubt His forgiveness of sins, but I wish I could do something to make up for what I did...

Poor Jesus... Poor people... Poor me... :sigh:

I'm gonna need to listen to some Christian Universalists ministering on Youtube and study some UR material for a few hours to get rid of that awful nausea... :sigh:

[Molly]

wow

"But a funny thing has happened in Egypt in 2011. When Muslim protesters in Tahrir Square drop to the ground to offer their daily prayers, they sometimes find themselves surrounded by Egyptian Christians standing at attention around them to shield them from the stones of attackers. Muslims in turn are offering the same protection to the Egyptian Christians.

While the potential for political change and democracy throughout North Africa and the Middle East seems to be increasing daily, and may have amazing and historic consequences, it just may be that the most important and far reaching change could come from Egyptian Muslims and Egyptian Christians showing the world what it means to be your brother's keeper."

[Michelle]

http://www.tentmaker.org/articles/pastor_confession.html

:crywipe: :crywipe: :crywipe: Poor man... Poor Thomas... Poor endoctrinated and brainwashed people... poor people I've led away from Jesus...

:sorry: :crywipe: :crywipe: Oh, that poor ex Fundamentalist pastor... Jesus, O Great Physician, please cure the poor sin-sick souls...

[pneuma]

Hi Michelle

I absolutely understand what you are going through.   The difficulty you will find is that while we can think the whole bible is true, the issue is where in the bible does it explain that everything you are reading must be literally true in context with a God who ordered all this?

The question I have for you is if the people who wrote the various texts that were one day discoverd and "then" compiled into what we now call the bible meant for those descriptions to be an accurate account of what God did to humans on the earth physically, or,  could it be possible that men used literal things happening around them to depict in the context of story telling in their generation and culture what God does in our hearts and mind spiritually?

For instance,  I personally do not believe God ordered the killing of any infant for some good and grand purpose that only he understands.   What I have found out to the best of my knowledge is that ancient cultures who went to war with another tribe would do their best to kill them all,  because they wanted to eliminate children from growing up and gaining the strength to take revenge out on their tribe later on.

Now, Christianity, has taught in various ways that God backed a certain tribe and would condone all of this because he was on their side.  In reality all we see is human nature wanting God to be on our side.   We can even see that on a smaller level where two professional football teams both pray to God to win.   Well, who wins then must of found the greatest favor with God huh?   Nonsense.


What we see is simply our modern human nature translated and taught in an incorrect light causing for the most part the exact problem you have now.  Most Christians have this same problem however their fear of daring to defy tradition completely gets in their way, but rather they step a foot outside the box here and there.


What I believe is that the OT is largely a metaphor.  For instance, if you understand the ancient barbaric ritual of killing a whole tribe due to the nature of the children growing up to seek revenge, then how can we transpose that to what God does?  Well it is fairly simple,  we can find out that sin can manifest itself in our lives through simple and seemingly innocent thoughts,

Adultery for instance can start with a man admiring a womans hair styke.  Simple and innocent to start with but then it can grow to admiring her smooth skin, and so on and so forth.

God would want us to kill those innocent thoughts in some manner in order to protect us from future harm.

So Michelle what I am asking you to try today is to throw out the bathwater and throw the corrupt baby of religious thought out with it, jump out of the box your trapped in and find a whole new world waiting for you.


Take care.

oh oh Paul you just came over to the dark side :laughing7:

[Michelle]

This is interesting. Like everything else, it's BS mixed with truth:

http://terahertzatheist.ca/2008/02/19/i-hate-god/

I'm so sick of the whole stupid "people use their "free will" and send themselves to eternal torture" bullcrap... Decisionists (also known as freewillists)... As if God is not gonna save all mankind... As if man could save Himself...

And above all else, I'm sick and tired of cherry-picking, cafeteria “chrisitians” with a self-righteous, holier than thou attitude who call us "heretics". They sound like a broken record. Can't they sing another freaking tune? Is that the only insult they know? If I hear "heretic" one more time, I'm really gonna break something...

[Michelle]

"oh oh Paul you just came over to the dark side."

If that's the Paul from the Bible you're talking about, you can bet your bottom dollar that he did, since he was a gross misogynist. I'm not even talking about the passage in which God says in the O.T that a woman who give birth to a male child is unclean for a week but if she give birth to a female child she is unclean for two weeks. Shows you how much God is misogynist and how much girls and women are utterly disgusting in his eyes...

"Speak unto the children of Israel, saying, If a woman have conceived seed, and born a MALE child: then she shall be unclean SEVEN DAYS; according to the days of the separation for her infirmity shall she be unclean. And in the eighth day the flesh of his foreskin shall be circumcised. And she shall then continue in the blood of her purifying THIRTY THREE days; she shall touch no hallowed thing, nor come into the sanctuary, until the days of her purifying be fulfilled. But if she bear a FEMALE child, then she shall be unclean TWO WEEKS, as in her separation: and she shall continue in the blood of her purifying SIXTY SIX days. (Leviticus 12:2-5)"

"And the daughter of any priest, if she profane herself by playing the whore, she profaneth her father: SHE SHALL BE BURNT WITH FIRE." (Leviticus 21:9)

So much for such a thing "never even entered His mind" and the condemning of people burning their children to an idol...

"...and the birth of ANY daughter is a loss. (From the New Jerusalem Bible, Ecclesiasticus 22:3)"

In just those three verses, God shows what He thinks of His female children. They are ugly, dirty, disgusting things in His eyes... No wonder Paul was a total misogynist...

As if that wasn't enough, God said only male slaves were to go free, female slaves were to remain enslaved for their entire lives. Most were little girls married to very old men who sexually abused them and God condomned it all:

Exodus 21:7-11
7. "If a man sells his daughter as a female slave, she is not to go free as the male slaves do.
8. "If she is displeasing in the eyes of her master who designated her for himself, then he shall let her be redeemed. He does not have authority to sell her to a foreign people because of his unfairness to her.
9. "If he designates her for his son [Note: "his son" means that the master is either her father's age or even much older!], he shall deal with her according to the custom of daughters.
10. "If he takes to himself another woman, he may not reduce her food, her clothing, or her conjugal rights.
11. "If he will not do these three things for her, then she shall go out for nothing, without payment of money. First of all, did the daughter have any choice to be sold off by her father, married off by her master to either himself or his son? No!

Also, the fact that the master can either marry her or marry her off to his son, means that MOST LIKELY, SHE IS HIS DAUGHTER'S AGE and younger than his son!! So he's probably at least 30+ years older than her. Yet, he himself (her father's age or even MUCH older) can marry her.

Pedophilia all over the Bible and God condomned it:

Girls at the age of 3 were forced into sex in both the Talmud and the Bible. Also, the age consent in US and Europe was as low as 10

1- Pedophilia and killing of "suckling infants" in the Bible!
2- Girls at the age of 3 were forced into sex and marriage in both the Talmud and the Bible.
3- Age consent in our world today only 100 years ago to girls as young as 10.

1- Pedophilia and killing "suckling infants" in the Bible!

Ironically, one of the Bible's 10 pillars or ten Commandments says: "Thou shalt not kill. (Exodus 20:13)." Yet, innocent children and non-virgin women were ordered to be killed by the mass, perhaps in thousands! 3-year old slave girls were also ordered to be raped by Moses.

1- Kill everything that "breathes" from humans and animals!
Deuteronomy 20:16
However, in the cities of the nations the Lord your God is giving you as an inheritance, do not leave alive anything that breathes.

It is certainly the Bible's principle and foundation to kill all humans and animals from the enemy's side. If one wouldn't call that terrorism, war crimes and mass-murdering, then what else should they call it?

2- Suckling infants were executed by the tens of thousands:

1 Samuel 15:2-4
2 Thus saith the LORD of hosts, I remember that which Amalek did to Israel, how he laid wait for him in the way, when he came up from Egypt.
3 Now go and smite Amalek, and utterly destroy all that they have, and spare them not; but slay both man and woman, infant and suckling, ox and sheep, camel and ass.
4 And Saul gathered the people together, and numbered them in Telaim, two hundred thousand footmen, and ten thousand men of Judah.

A praise for dashing little children against rocks as a form of revenge:

Psalm 137:8-9
8 O daughter of Babylon, O destroyed one, O the happiness of him who repayeth to thee thy deed, That thou hast done to us.
9 O the happiness of him who doth seize, And hath dashed thy sucklings on the rock!

3- The Pedophilic Verses against 3-year old girls:

The pedophilic Biblical verses are Numbers 31:17-18 and Numbers 31:35-40. Below, you will see DETAILED HISTORY on these SPECIFIC verses from the Jewish Talmud explaining the pedophilia that took place against the 3-year old slave girls under the direct command of Moses.

While Christians are not obligated to follow the laws of the Talmud in their social lives, but the historical FACTS that exist in the Talmud about the Biblical verses Numbers 31:17-18 and Numbers 31:35-40 below, and how the "BIBLE FOLLOWERS" during those days were mostly pedophiles who literally forced sex on 3-year old girls after Moses' supposed 'Divine' order is clear indication that the Bible condones pedophilia.

As shown in the quotes below:
"....The Tannaïtic Midrash Sifre to Numbers in §157 comments on the above quoted commandment of MOSES to kill the Midianite women as well as the male children...."

"....According to the Tannaïte Rabbis, MOSES therefore had ordered the Israelites to kill all women older than three years and a day, because they were "suitable for having sexual relations." [138]...."

"Said Rabbi Joseph, "Come and take note: A girl three years and one day old is betrothed by intercourse....."

"A girl three years and one day old is betrothed by intercourse. "A girl three years old may be betrothed through an act of sexual intercourse," the words of R. Meir. And sages say, "Three years and one day old."....."

The Quotes and Proofs for Pedophilia Please pay attention to the bolded and underlined parts below:
The following was taken from http://www.infidels.org/library/mode...l/judaism.html regarding Numbers 31:17-18 in the Bible:

"They fought against Midian, as the LORD commanded Moses, and killed every man........Now kill all the boys [innocent kids]. And kill every woman who has slept with a man, but save for yourselves every girl who has never slept with a man. (Numbers 31:7,17-18)"

In other translations, it's not "girls", but women "CHILDREN"...

Read the whole thing yourself:

http://www.turntoislam.com/forum/showthread.php?t=36979

A girl or woman who was menstruating in both the Bible and Talmud was considered unclean and she had to be rejected for as long as she was considered unclean, separated from the people. As if she even asked to be born, as if she ever asked to have a body that did things she didn't even asked for. She was created that way and God condemned and punished it by ordering rejection and separation. He is the one to blame for creating women that way and HIS victims get the punishment. A man who slept with a menstruating woman was to be slaughtered...

It would've been better if God had never created women. Three-years old little girls wouldn't be marry off to just about any old man and raped by those old pervert schmucks and women wouldn't be called unclean things just because because they bleed every month and have no control over that. They wouldn't be put through child traffic, slavery and pedophilia. God condomn it all... Even today in some countries, that kind of thing is still going on and God condomn it. It's all in the scriptures... There is no excuse for women's abuse, pedophilia and dashing babies against rocks...

The Bible even says that in the "end", God will expose all secret, hidden things for the whole world to see. The whole human race and the whole angelic race will see every detail of everyone's personal, private lives. Every single person on the planet who has been defiled, raped, polluted (just like me) will see this part of his or her life exposed for everyone to see, will see his or her shame exposed to the entire human race and entire angelic race. No detail of anyone's private life will remain private. All sins will be exposed for the entire two races to see, apparently that includes all supposedly "forgiven and not remembered" sin. So much for true forgiveness, since ALL secret, hidden things (private lives) will be exposed for the entire two races to see. Every single person that has been raped will see their shame, defileness and uncleaness exposed for the whole world to see. ALL secret, hidden things will be exposed. All committed sins that have supposedly been forgiven and forgotten will be brought up. There's even a passage in the scriptures that says God will silence the whole world and then make everyone's lives flash before their eyes so that they relive every disgusting sins they have ever committed from the day they were born. And I've read testimonies saying that it includes supposedly forgiven, forgotten sins that are supposedly covered by the blood of Christ. And since people's memory will be made not to forget anything ever again, made perfect and immortal, people will never forget what they have seen and what they know. It will be an everlasting shame, forever. Nowhere to run, nowhere to hide, everyone will always remember and everyone will know. Forever. You can come across a person thirty years later and he will have forgotten you, your name or something that happened to you. But people will NEVER forget what they have seen on that day. There will be nowhere to run or hide, to escape the shame and no detail of any private life will be remain private. God is way too sick and evil to keep it between Him and the sinner and deal with everyone individually. And one can wonder, if ALL things are exposed, which includes all forgiven and forgotten sin, then why did He died on the cross since forgiven and forgotten is a lie and everything will be brought up?

Mark 4:22 Things are hidden temporarily only as a means to revelation.] For there is NOTHING hidden except to be revealed, nor is anything [temporarily] kept secret except in order that it may be made known. (Amplified)

Mark 4:22 For EVERYTHING that is hidden will eventually be brought into the open, and every secret will be brought to light.

And doubtless you recall the words of Christ: "There is NOTHING hid, which shall not be manifested; neither was anything kept secret, but that it should come abroad." Mark 4:22

EVEN CONCERNING THE REDEEMED ONES of this age God’s Word is that when the Lord comes
He will bring to light the hidden things of darkness, and will make manifest the counsels of the
hearts. I Corinthians 4:5.

http://bible.org/illustration/which-hidden-will-be-revealed

So much for forgiveness and forgetting... There is no forgivenes and not remembering the forgiven sins as some passages supposedly say. Everything will be brought up again. That's not forgiven and forgotten. So dying on the cross to supposedly forgive and forget all sins is nothing but a gross lie???? When things are forgiven and forgotten you don't bring them up again. And you don't expose every tiny detail of everyone's private lives for the whole world to see when you REALLY are love. That's hatred and evil... That's sick and gross...

God is sick and merciless... He will expose every tiny detail of everyone's private lives for the entire two races to see instead of keeping it between the sinner and Himself and deal with everyone individually and ALL things, that includes from birth, even ALL things that have supposedly been "fogiven and forgotten" will be exposed... So much for God is love... How could I ever love Him after all the horrible, disgusting things He has condomned and how He will expose every tiny detail of everyone's private lives for the whole world to see, including beatings, rapes and the supposedly forgiven sins? There are even scriptures saying that saints will judge the world. First, we will be judged by Him, then we will be forced to examine every detail of each others' lives and judge each others. The saints will judge the world... Gary even said in one of his articles: "If hell is real will you judge your relatives or friends to hell?" Do you really want to judge anyone, to judge, condemn and punish? Me, I will not do any harm to anyone, I will never obey him in this, I'd rather take even the worst kind of punishment then judge, condemn, punish and harm people. I will never sentence anyone to anything... So much for "don't judge"...

25For he that hath, to him shall be given: and he that hath not, from him shall be taken even that which he hath. (KJV)

The rich will become even more rich and the poor will be even more robbed. So much for it's harder for a camel to fit into a needle's chast than for a rich person to enter even... Since I have not, being nearly poor myself, I guess everything will be taken from me... God clearly despised all poor... and put people into two categories, the "have" and the "have not". Is He better than any sinner?

Mark 4:24 25For to him who has will more be given; and from him who has nothing, even what he has will be taken away (by force) (Amplified)

Since God was a misogynist who condomn the rape and sexual abuses of little girls, no wonder Paul was a misogynist too. Blaming the original sin and the fall of mankind on women alone, saying that women were created second, sinned first, should keep silent, never teach, veil their heads, wear SHAMEFACEDNESS... Women had absolutely no right and no freedom, much less freedom of speech... Paul even lie in the Bible. He said that women shall be saved through Childbearing when only Christ's blood sacrifice on the cross saves. Isn't that a gross lie? Bearing children is work and humans can't save themselves. Salvation by work is a lie too. The catholic church used that verse to force women into having children by the dozens, forbidding contraception and birth control. Marriage and having children is a personal choice. The earth is overpopulate and poverty is everywhere, the earth certainly doesn't need to be populate or repopulate like before and after the flood. The catholic church even excommunicated women who didn't bear children and threatened them with eternal torment in hell. Paul even go as far as to say that a woman's body belongs to her husband and he has total power over it and the other way around. As if our bodies were objects and the possessions and properties of someone else. Did you know that God in the Bible calls raping a woman "humbling" her? There is even a passage in the Bible in which a woman is given over to men to be raped and then when she gets home, he chops her to pieces and the person telling the story says it's a warning to everyone. Nice. Misogyny is all over the Bible and God condomns it. I'm sorry but between that and the horrors of the O.T, I've had it with the scriptures. I will keep studying the TM UR material, but I dropped Bible study entirely. I just can't cope with scriptures anymore. And God is seriously not making anything better for Himself. The more I get to know Him, the more I wish I didn't. How could I ever love such a sick, merciless monster who gets women and three years old little girls raped, order little girls to be sold into slavery, married to very old men who abuse them, order men to "humble" women and consider little girls to be pollution and totally unclean and disgusting when male are just as sinful and unclean? I'm really starting to wonder if I'd better off as an atheist. I've walked away from God years ago. I've came back to Him and I can't say that things are getting any better for me. I'm a horrified, tortured, tormented soul andthe scriptures seem as dark and evil as the world around me. Everything is dark and evil. My heart will always be broken, horrified. My soul will always be tormented, damaged and sick. I will always have this spiritual disease, this horror and this pain rotting me from the inside out. I don't doubt the revelation I received about the truth of UR, but all the rest, for what it's worth. Scriptures only damage me further. Is good and love all a lie and an illusion? I would ask you to pray for me, but He will not listen. When it comes to me, He just doesn't answer. It seems that there is never any kind of answer or explanation for any of this. I hurt like hell and everything is dark and bad. WHY, Jesus, WHY???? DON'T YOU DARE TO TOUCH MY FACE AND STOP TALKING TO ME, JUST LEAVE ME ALONE!!!! I DON'T WANT TO TALK TO YOU, JESUS!!!!

[Molly]

Michelle, I don't see anything in the Bible condoning pedophilia.

The Talmud is something altogether different and does not concern me in any way.  I consider the Talmud among what Jesus called 'the teachings of men'.

Mark 7:13
Making the word of God of none effect through your tradition, which ye have delivered: and many such like things do ye.

[Nathan]

Michelle, there seems to be a lot of condemnation and bitterness in many of your posts.  Much of your acussational ranting is really unwarrarnted.  In "your" reasoning God despises women over men.  But none of your comments involve spiritual vision.  Even Scripture itself states that things written are types and shadows.  When Jesus spoke, he spoke in parables, which is the same as types and shadows.  In other words, what you see on the surface isn't the core of the message being told.  The message lies beneath the literalization of the words being written.  Paul calls it a mystery, which it is to our minds because it's not "for" our minds, but instead, it's intended to be received into our "spiriti". 

Your mind is demanding answers because, according to your mind, the way you're reading it, it appears to you to be a bunch of lies.  The truth is, God sees both male and femail as one.  They are "man".  But the symbolism there is, man represents spirit and soul/mind represents woman.  The laws of purification are representing the fact that the mind requires more effort to cleanse than your spirit. 

This extends from other posts of yours one of which that comes to mind is your accusation that because all "you" see is doom and gloom around you, God must be lying when we say he sees you through love rather than judgment.  Your mind . . .OUR mind can't grasp all that God is and the logic through which God operates in.  His logic is not the same as our logic because he is from above, an ascended place and we are born from below, which is flesh.  You can't use flesh logic to comprehend spiritual truth.  And when people try to answer your questions, you're not going to receive or accept them because you're not looking at things from His perspective.

The truth is, ALL our sin is cast as far as the east is from the west, which is to say . . it's out of our existence.  Our eyes will continue to see our sin as long as we are looking at life from a fallen state.  But when we let go of who we are and embrace who "he" proclaims us to be, we'll be able to see life where there is death and light where there is darkness.  And love where there is now bitterness.  Count it ALL joy.

This world is full of trials and tribulation.  Full of people falling short.  Full of everything that is flesh.  But we're to BE OF GOOD CHEER . . .we're to walk in celebration not because of all the sludge or that we've got our head in the sand from what's going on around us . . .but because we can see PAST the sludge and see that the power of Christ has already OVERCOME this world . . .we're not part of it . . we're in it, but we're not part OF it.  Fix your eyes on things that are eternal and these things around us that are temporal will no longer have any power over us.

[jabcat]

Michelle, please check you PM's and follow through on the suggestions.  Thanks.

James.

[Michelle]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3-hV8cIzo7Q

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lCByHBwb340

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=npJzAzBqc_Q

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g3zVJkHOb00

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zMjPhHVIOKk

Obama's secret agenda:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=biVYKkFkbYs

False Christ (heretic is more like it):

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sn4nppx1cuE

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sn4nppx1cuE

That man is a devil... And people totally fall for it. Tons of them, saying he is God and giving their money and possessions to him... God sent them a strong delusion that they might believe a lie because they had no love of the truth...

Total proof of the NWO master plan:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_rU5df2yTsw

Lauryn Hill exposing the industry (This one will bring tears to your eyes):

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UiF_G13VM5o

Mind-controlled cops:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tYzXSwdHVlE

They're projecting those holograms from the satellites in space. Wanna see what Project Blue Beam could do just last year? You better sit down first:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pyQv18_hiTs&NR=1

Still think it's a joke? Now imagine a hundred of those fake demons running all over town, along with a hundred REAL evil spirits unleashed by satanists. I've been researching this stuff for months. They try to confuse us all the time so that we can't tell the real evil spirits from the fake ones (holograms). And their holograms just keep getting more and more realistic every year... TradeMark Holograms make the holographic images... Blue Beam, is the name of the Project... You have heard the sound of the fake helicopter in that other video I've posted. Images and sounds from space satellites. It will be extremely realistic... The journalist Serge Monast and many other people were silenced for good when they tried to expose this... But Serge Monast succeeded before he was killed with a fake heart attack...

Different videos of this just keep showing up all over Youtube:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xh3bODlZAJc&NR=1

Now, imagine that you hear a telepathic voice in your head that speak from the inside of you. Think I'm a nutcase? Think this is a joke? Everything on this planet, including us are made of electromagnetic energy. Even our brainwaves. Not only can they create holograms, they can, with different frequency of electromagnetic energy, induce hallucinations, beam voices into your heads and control your emotions. They can induce panic, fear, anxiety, depression, heavy sorrow. They can control people's behavior. They can make people angry, aggressive, commit any kind of crime, murder, suicide. I suggest that you seriously  study these things. Be prepared 'cause anything could happen. They really have the technology to do this, they are doing it and they are satanists. They have demonic help.

The NWO plans for CHRISTIANS:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Idoj_H4L4jk&NR=1

I just want to say that Satan is not the "Morning Star". That's a lie from the infamous, satanic NIV Bible. Satan is "the Son of the Morning". "The Morning Star" is God/Jesus. The NIV was written to make Satan/Lucifer and Jesus out to be one and the same. A gross, satanic lie...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Idoj_H4L4jk&NR=1

Don't be deceived...

[CHB]

Michelle, there seems to be a lot of condemnation and bitterness in many of your posts.  Much of your acussational ranting is really unwarrarnted.  In "your" reasoning God despises women over men.  But none of your comments involve spiritual vision.  Even Scripture itself states that things written are types and shadows.  When Jesus spoke, he spoke in parables, which is the same as types and shadows.  In other words, what you see on the surface isn't the core of the message being told.  The message lies beneath the literalization of the words being written.  Paul calls it a mystery, which it is to our minds because it's not "for" our minds, but instead, it's intended to be received into our "spiriti". 

Your mind is demanding answers because, according to your mind, the way you're reading it, it appears to you to be a bunch of lies.  The truth is, God sees both male and femail as one.  They are "man".  But the symbolism there is, man represents spirit and soul/mind represents woman.  The laws of purification are representing the fact that the mind requires more effort to cleanse than your spirit. 

This extends from other posts of yours one of which that comes to mind is your accusation that because all "you" see is doom and gloom around you, God must be lying when we say he sees you through love rather than judgment.  Your mind . . .OUR mind can't grasp all that God is and the logic through which God operates in.  His logic is not the same as our logic because he is from above, an ascended place and we are born from below, which is flesh.  You can't use flesh logic to comprehend spiritual truth.  And when people try to answer your questions, you're not going to receive or accept them because you're not looking at things from His perspective.

The truth is, ALL our sin is cast as far as the east is from the west, which is to say . . it's out of our existence.  Our eyes will continue to see our sin as long as we are looking at life from a fallen state.  But when we let go of who we are and embrace who "he" proclaims us to be, we'll be able to see life where there is death and light where there is darkness.  And love where there is now bitterness.  Count it ALL joy.

This world is full of trials and tribulation.  Full of people falling short.  Full of everything that is flesh.  But we're to BE OF GOOD CHEER . . .we're to walk in celebration not because of all the sludge or that we've got our head in the sand from what's going on around us . . .but because we can see PAST the sludge and see that the power of Christ has already OVERCOME this world . . .we're not part of it . . we're in it, but we're not part OF it.  Fix your eyes on things that are eternal and these things around us that are temporal will no longer have any power over us.

Nathan, I was thinking the same thing. 

Set your mind on things above and not on the things here on earth.  (Phil. 4:8) Finally brethern, whatsoever things are true, honest, just, pure, lovely, and of a good report, and if there be any virtue and praise, think on these things.

CHB

[Miriam]

"oh oh Paul you just came over to the dark side."

If that's the Paul from the Bible you're talking about, you can bet your bottom dollar that he did, since he was a gross misogynist

Michelle, my dear troubled sister, I don't think you're even aware of what's really going on here. Pneuma was addressing a poster called Paul. The name of the person posting here, that pneuma was addressing, is Paul Hazelwood.

You don't need to ask us to pray for you, because we are already. Please take a break from all this stuff you are reading on the Internet. Is there someone in real life who is supportive that you can talk to?

I can see people are also trying to help you with private messages. Please listen. These people care about you. God does too.

[Michelle]

Repentance is not "only" a change of mind....it is a change of mind.
I just wonder about where you are at in your salvation walk; it would seem that  you are very knowledgeable about what the Bible says, do you have an idea of what the Bible teaches?
Let me just say this..... I am of the persuasion that "fire and brimstone" are a tool of love and not fear, heat yes, but not fear.
What is it you are looking for? Confirmation that you are where it(whatever that is) and your life is supposed to be. Do want or need affirmation that what you know is what it is? Just what kind of help are you looling for? These folks here, myself included will give you scripture and verse for you to allow the Holy Spirit to work in and for you, but I assure you unless you yeild and give you yourself to what you have been given to seek......you will remain where you are looking in.

I didn't mean "only", I meant "simply". As if you  never made any mistake too. It happens to anyone to use the wrong words and I had a lot of things in mind. And just so you know Micah, I never said that the lake of fire was a tool of fear. I was quoting from a message I sent to my Fundy friend and I was quite depressed. He keeps calling me a heretic and say that I'm spreading false teachings, but he's the one doing that, not me. A lot of Fundies don't agree with his theology and his false teachings are nowhere to be found in scriptures. He brainwashed me for months, but I've done research and found out that he was guilty of the very things he accused me of, false teachings and heresy. I love my friend. I'm only trying to show him that what he learned and what he is teaching is unscriptural...

[Michelle]

I enjoy reading your posts, you remind me of shadow, a member who left and then came back, maybe you guys should speak to each other, perhaps.


I am so sick and so tired of being too broke to buy a decent gift to my mother and sister and above all else, I'm sick and tired of having nothing to offer to Jesus. He died for me, on a cross and He bled and suffered like hell for me, He had that Bible sent to me and brought me to the truth of UR and I HAVE NOTHING TO OFFER HIM!!!!
Michelle

Can you make a cup of tea for your mother?




# Matthew 10:42
And if anyone gives even a cup of cold water to one of these little ones who is my disciple, truly I tell you, that person will certainly not lose their reward."
Matthew 10:41-42 (in Context) Matthew 10 (Whole Chapter)

# Mark 9:41
Truly I tell you, anyone who gives you a cup of water in my name because you belong to the Messiah will certainly not lose their reward

Problem is... she's an unsaved...

[Michelle]

I'm not judging or condemning anyone here, but when are you people going to wake up???? 

Well of course you are, but that is ok.   Judgment is not inherantly a bad thing, the bible simply says that you will be judged by the same measure.

One of the things a person goes through when being called out of the institutions of religion is that you want to retain all the convenient teachings that cater to your own beliefs of the things you do good.

Oh you are not a homosexual, so certainly religion got that one right, etc etc etc.....

So you want to retain the callous fundamentalism that you find ok and then hollar and complain that universalists aren't railing on about all the other stuff, satanism, end time, ect ect ect.

Eventually you realize that what a lot of people really want to do is do what has caused all the other denominations to form, they simply want a religion that agrees with them and eveything they want to do and are against.

They want to trade one institution for another.  that is why so many universalists want Rob Bell to take the heat for them, Go Rob,  make christianity into our religion.  Quite sickening actually.  The belief of God saving all mankind hasn't taught a lot of people much of anything.

If you don't think homosexuality is a sin and an abomination in the eyes of God, just look into the Bibles. The modern versions are even more clear about that than the KJV. The Bible is very clear about this. God created man for woman and woman for man. He created Adam and Eve, not Adam and Steve or Eve and Lisa. God says it's an abomination. It's a perversion from Satan to turn people into deviants and keep humans from reproducing. God clearly says that those who don't repent will undergo some punishment in the lake of fire. Also asl just about any deliverance pastor, that's the work of evil spirits. I was guilty of that kind of attraction. I renounced, repented and I was healed because nothing is impossible to Jesus. If people were really born like that or had some kind of genetic or hormonal problem, God would not say that they will undergo punishment. God wouldn't punish people for the way he created them. It is unnatural and the Bible clearly list it among the sins that send some to the LOF to undergo punishment. About satanism... and the end time, no one knows the day or the hour. Nobody. But you must admit that those satanists are up to something. It's not about the Fundies. I've been studying the stuff for months and I know it's very real and serious. It takes a lot to convince me. If you didn't do serious research about it, how would you know? So again, with all due respect, I ask you. Have you studied it? It's like a Fundy who says that Christian Universalism is a total heresy and a gross lie. What would be the first thing you would say to that person? "Have you studied it out yourself? Have you done serious research?" If you think it's a nutcase's conspiracy theory, I can't force you to see the truth, but I advise you to do serious research on the subject. People have been harm and killed and their families too, more children disappear every year and lots of people say they have seen "UFOs" and strange things in the sky, not to mention 200 earthquakes in the space of only one month and that was years ago, there have been much more of them since then. I could show you some serious videos that would make your hair neck stand up. I know it's true and serious. It's all over the newspapers these days. Japan, the government of my country discussing and signing stuff with Obama, The eathquakes and tsunami...


Luke 10:18, Jesus said, "I beheld Satan as lightning fall from heaven." Did you know that "Baraq" means lightning in Hebrew? Check Strong's Concordance. "lightning and high place" (baraq ubamah). What does that tell you? That guy is the antichrist... One of many...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bcbloBA2Lek

Check the Hebrew yourself and find out...

Subliminal messaging. (Obama and a crowd chanting: "Thank you, Satan"):

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V-TMKUea87E&feature=related 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hi-V_ilJu0w&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aPZdLqGG7HY&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LS53I-k_T4o&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wqvVuiHW_ZA&feature=related

Still think I'm a conspiracy theorist nutcase?

[Lefein]

Everyone will be saved.  Jesus will win.  The Earth and everyone in it will be made righteous, perfect, and good.

Why are you worried about a shadow government (if it even exists) that isn't going to last more than a blip of a second in the scope of Eternity?  And more than that - why are you worried about it at all?  Considering that everything will be put under Christ in subject to His Governance; and not only that...but the Earth and Universe and the rest of it will be pretty much rolled up like a burning scroll --- again, Everyone will be saved.  Jesus will win.  The Earth and everyone in it will be made righteous, perfect, and good. --- why are you worried?