Soul food?

[Nathan]

I was on vacation for two weeks . .thanks for the welcome!!

[micah7:9]

Nathan, Welcome back as well.
I have these two verses that the Bible is very plain on what a soul is. They are what the Bible teachs that man is not 3 parts...body- soul- spirit. ( I ministered that 3 parts of man for over 30 years.)
AndI have not been a believer of the trinity teaching since I left the Lutherans to join the Marines in ' 63. I am poor in math and I could never get 3 out of 1. That said, the body-soul-spirit teaching is a trinity doctrine, and not biblical. That, the Lord showed me just about a year ago.
Gen 2:7  And Jehovah God formeth the man--dust from the ground, and breatheth into his nostrils breath of life, and the man becometh a living creature.1Co 15:45  so also it hath been written, `The first man Adam became a living creature,' the last Adam is for a life-giving spirit,

I have yet to find in the Bible that man was given a soul or has a soul. Each time one reads soul in a verse in can be easily replaced with, "breath, life, living, being"

Peace and Love Through Jesus.

[Beloved Servant]

micah,

We just went through this last week.

Are we made in His Image and likeness?

Does God have a Soul?

Then — so do we.

[thinktank]

Nathan, Welcome back as well.
I have these two verses that the Bible is very plain on what a soul is. They are what the Bible teachs that man is not 3 parts...body- soul- spirit. ( I ministered that 3 parts of man for over 30 years.)
AndI have not been a believer of the trinity teaching since I left the Lutherans to join the Marines in ' 63. I am poor in math and I could never get 3 out of 1. That said, the body-soul-spirit teaching is a trinity doctrine, and not biblical. That, the Lord showed me just about a year ago.
Gen 2:7  And Jehovah God formeth the man--dust from the ground, and breatheth into his nostrils breath of life, and the man becometh a living creature.1Co 15:45  so also it hath been written, `The first man Adam became a living creature,' the last Adam is for a life-giving spirit,

I have yet to find in the Bible that man was given a soul or has a soul. Each time one reads soul in a verse in can be easily replaced with, "breath, life, living, being"

Peace and Love Through Jesus.

I agree but I don't see connection to the trinity teaching, there are also 2 different types of trinity teachings.

When they say body soul and spirit, you could argue that man is a 4 part being body, soul, spirit, head

even 5 part being body, soul, spirit, head, heart. By saying soul they already address spirit and the body, there's no need to go there. So it should be man is a 3 part being, water, blood and spirit or man is a 2 part being body and spirit. I've heard the idea of male and female created he them, but it doesn't explain what female/eve/soul actually is and to me simply explains a principle or shadow of things to come but not an actual reality that we have souls. :2c:

[Cardinal]

 :cloud9: She's the "womb-man".....a helpmeet, used to birth things of spirit out of spirit and into natural. Depending on what spirit, she will reproduce either darkness or light, or until the finishing work is done, a combination of the two. She "births" by giving visibility to the unseen.

Going back to what I've shared about the body (outer court) only doing what it sees it's head (inner court priesthood) do, as I said, the heart of the priesthood must submit to cleansing NOW, because our soul is "birthing" that which we see in the outer court realm, ie. when they see you hate your brother IN YOUR HEART (soul), they go out and kill theirs.

The soul (of the priesthood as well) is reproducing the seed that is planted in it, and if we don't want to partake of the judgment of her sins, it's time to birth the Son. These are spiritual principles, and you're only going to "see" them by quickening of the Spirit. Blessings...

[Lefein]

The body is our garment.  The soul is our collective "mind-will-emotions-etc", our spirit is "Us", you might say.

Gen 12:13  Say, I pray thee, thou art my sister: that it may be well with me for thy sake; and my soul shall live because of thee.

Gen 34:3  And his soul clave unto Dinah the daughter of Jacob, and he loved the damsel, and spake kindly unto the damsel

His body did not cleave yet, neither did his spirit "himself", his mind, and emotions where enamoured by her, to use a life-experience illustration, when you fall into a crush for someone, your emotions do indeed cleave to the person, your will becomes focused on the person, and your mind becomes filled with thoughts about the person, effectively your soul cleaves.  But your spirit, "You" do not cleave to the person, because you have yet to be One Flesh, let alone one Being.

Gen 34:8  And Hamor communed with them, saying, The soul of my son Shechem longeth for your daughter: I pray you give her him to wife.

If they are not one Being, and are not one flesh (having not been married despite the rape of Dinah), then why the longing?  Separation of mind, will, emotions causes longing, where as oneness would eliminate it.

If they are one Being, and are one flesh because they had lain with each other, then there must be an element of separation that is not present in the flesh, or in the Being (spirits) of the two cloven members.  The soul must therefore exist as a separate factor, since it is the longing portion of the man, the continuously longing portion as seen by "long-Eth".

1Thessalonians 5:23  And the very God of peace sanctify you wholly; and I pray God your whole spirit and soul and body be preserved blameless unto the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ.

Distinct, and assertive notation of "Spirit -and- Soul -and- Body" as separate entities in the one whole individual.

As for the trinity, the Godhead speaks of that.  The trinity is a synonymous (though limited in the ability to describe) term used to describe God's nature as the Godhead.  If I may ask out of curiousity...if God is not Triune, what is Christ, what is the Holy Spirit?

John 1:1  In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

John 1:14  And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.

John 17:11  And now I am no more in the world, but these are in the world, and I come to thee. Holy Father, keep through thine own name those whom thou hast given me, that they may be one, as we are.

John 4:24  God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.

Mark 5:6-7  But when he saw Jesus afar off, he ran and worshipped him,   And cried with a loud voice, and said, What have I to do with thee, Jesus, thou Son of the most high God? I adjure thee by God, that thou torment me not.

Revelation 22:8-9  And I John saw these things, and heard them. And when I had heard and seen, I fell down to worship before the feet of the angel which shewed me these things. Then saith he unto me, See thou do it not: for I am thy fellowservant, and of thy brethren the prophets, and of them which keep the sayings of this book: worship God.

Matthew 1:18  Now the birth of Jesus Christ was on this wise: When as his mother Mary was espoused to Joseph, before they came together, she was found with child of the Holy Ghost.

Matthew 3:16  And Jesus, when he was baptized, went up straightway out of the water: and, lo, the heavens were opened unto him, and he saw the Spirit of God descending like a dove, and lighting upon him:

Luke 3:22  And the Holy Ghost descended in a bodily shape like a dove upon him, and a voice came from heaven, which said, Thou art my beloved Son; in thee I am well pleased.

Judges 6:34  But the Spirit of the LORD came upon Gideon, and he blew a trumpet; and Abiezer was gathered after him.

John 1:32  And John bare record, saying, I saw the Spirit descending from heaven like a dove, and it abode upon him.

Isaiah 42:1  Behold my servant, whom I uphold; mine elect, in whom my soul delighteth; I have put my spirit upon him: he shall bring forth judgment to the Gentiles.

Matthew 12:31-32  Wherefore I say unto you, All manner of sin and blasphemy shall be forgiven unto men: but the blasphemy against the Holy Ghost shall not be forgiven unto men.  And whosoever speaketh a word against the Son of man, it shall be forgiven him: but whosoever speaketh against the Holy Ghost, it shall not be forgiven him, neither in this world, neither in the world to come.

[micah7:9]

micah,

We just went through this last week.

Are we made in His Image and likeness?

Does God have a Soul?

Then — so do we.

We may have gone through it last week but nothing was shown that man has a soul. Just what do you mean "image and likeness?" What or who is God? Is he not SPIRIT? Soul is NOT spirit.  Does God have a soul? Does He? If man has a soul, when did he get it? If the Bible does not teach that man was given a soul or that man has a soul, then why do we say man has a soul? And is there 1 or 2 scriptures  for what you say?
Words like emotion, appetite, speak of how a living soul reacts to being alive. I believe man is made up of the dust of the ground and His Spirit. At least thats how I read Gen. 2:7 was anything added after that?

[Cardinal]

 :cloud9: Some very good points, Lefein..... :thumbsup: Blessings....

[Beloved Servant]

Spirit is BEING and soul is EXPRESSION.

[micah7:9]

Lefein
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Lefien
    Re: Soul food?
« Reply #30 on: Today at 12:29:38 AM » Quote 

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The body is our garment.  The soul is our collective "mind-will-emotions-etc", our spirit is "Us", you might say.
Can you give me scripture for your thoughts?
This is the 2nd time in the Bible the word soul is used and can be easily be read

Gen 12:13  Say, I pray thee, thou art my sister: that it may be well with me for thy sake; and I will live because of thee.

1Thessalonians 5:23  And the very God of peace sanctify you wholly; and I pray God your whole spirit breath/life and body be preserved blameless unto the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ.

You assume a trinity from mens doctrines not the Word of God.
Mal 3:6  For I am Jehovah, I have not changed, And ye, the sons of Jacob, Ye have not been consumed.
Deu 6:4  `Hear, O Israel, Jehovah our God is one Jehovah;

[micah7:9]

Spirit is BEING and soul is EXPRESSION.

Again, when did the meaning of what a soul is change from Gen.2:7? I understand what you say, and I can see how the meaning, of what you say evolved, I understand the teaching. I also believe that it is in error. I will concede when Ive been shown in the Word of God that man was given a soul, that man has a soul, that a soul is something other than a living/breathing creature "nephesh"a breathing creature
Expression is what emits from a breathing creature.

[Molly]

1 Samuel 18:1
And it came to pass, when he had made an end of speaking unto Saul, that the soul of Jonathan was knit with the soul of David, and Jonathan loved him as his own soul.



"was knit"

H7194
קשׁר
qâshar
kaw-shar'
A primitive root; to tie, physically (gird, confine, compact) or mentally (in love, league): - bind (up), (make a) conspire (-acy, -ator), join together, knit, stronger, work [treason].



I believe this a prototype of what will be happening with us.  Our souls will be knit together with the soul of Jesus.   This is the 144,000 virgins who follow the lamb wherever he goes. Their souls have been knit together with the soul of Christ who gave his soul for us.


45For even the Son of man came not to be ministered unto, but to minister, and to give his life [soul, nephesh] a ransom for many.
--Mark 10


...when thou shalt make his soul an offering for sin, he shall see his seed, he shall prolong his days, and the pleasure of the LORD shall prosper in his hand.

--Isa 53:10

[Beloved Servant]

Here micah,
You like Preston's writings:
www.kingdombiblestudies.org/Echoes/echoes29.htm

[micah7:9]

1 Samuel 18:1
And it came to pass, when he had made an end of speaking unto Saul, that the soul of Jonathan was knit with the soul of David, and Jonathan loved him as his own soul.
   Replace soul with "life."


"was knit"

H7194
קשׁר
qâshar
kaw-shar'
A primitive root; to tie, physically (gird, confine, compact) or mentally (in love, league): - bind (up), (make a) conspire (-acy, -ator), join together, knit, stronger, work [treason].



I believe this a prototype of what will be happening with us.  Our souls will be knit together with the soul of Jesus.   This is the 144,000 virgins who follow the lamb wherever he goes. Their souls have been knit together with the soul of Christ who gave his soul for us.

"Our Life will be knit together with the LIFE of Jesus"


45For even the Son of man came not to be ministered unto, but to minister, and to give his life [soul, nephesh] HIS BREATH, HIS LIFE a ransom for many.
--Mark 10


...when thou shalt make his soul an offering for sin, he shall see his seed, he shall prolong his days, and the pleasure of the LORD shall prosper in his hand.

--Isa 53:10

Pro 4:7  The first thing is wisdom--get wisdom, And with all thy getting get understanding.

[micah7:9]

Here micah,
You like Preston's writings:
www.kingdombiblestudies.org/Echoes/echoes29.htm

I have read and studied Br. Eby for many years, and I have read again the Echos of the Garden. I read it last year hoping to find out more about what was revealed to me. But no.
"Having said all this, let us now apply this beautiful truth spiritually and internally, to Christ the Bridegroom in our spirit, and to us the bride in our soul. Spiritually, this means that as long as we walk in imperfection and duplicity THE SPIRIT IS GIVEN HEADSHIP OVER THE SOUL. The soul is commanded to be under obedience and is to be subjected under the authority of the spirit." Eby

[micah7:9]

Here Bro. Eby tells it well, but how does he get to what he wrote previously? He explains very clearly that soul is a living creature. How did he make a soul something other than what he showed it was here?
"When the spiritual man was lowered into the form of the earth man, the scripture explains that "And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul" (Gen 2:7). From the Greek the statement reads, "The first man Adam was made a zoe psuche (living soul)" (I Cor. 15:45). The wonderful simplification of this statement is missed by nearly all who read it or comment upon it. There are two primary words that are translated "life" in our English Bibles – zoe and psuche. Turn your concordance and you will find the Greek word zoe translated life as many or more times than you will find psuche so translated. And zoe is the word that is always translated "eternal" or "eonian" life. The reason for this, as distinguished from psuche (not, animal life) is that zoe is always used to denote spiritual, or everlasting life. Zoe is the life of God. "In Him was Zoe; and the Zoe was the light of men" (Jn. 1:4). "And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of Zoe; and man became a living soul" (John 5:26). Pusche is natural soul life. This life, Zoe, is the life Jesus promised to give to man when He said, "I give unto them eternal life (Zoe), and they shall never perish." Psuche on the other hand, is the life Jesus said we must lay down or lose in order to gain Zoe life. "Then said Jesus unto his disciples, If any man will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me. For whosoever will save his life shall lose it: and whosoever will lose his life for my sake shall find it." (Mat. 16:24-25). In the Hebrew text the statement reads, "... and behold, man became a nephesh chaya." The Hebrew word nephesh means "spirit," while chaya, which is derived from the root chai meaning "life," is the generic term for "animal" or "creature." Only man embodies both earthly and divine characteristics which are combined together in such a unique and majestic manner."  End Quote

[micah7:9]

I know and believe Gen.1:27 is prophetic and spiritual, and how he explains the process is good, but as much as I respect Bro. Eby he has shown nothing of what is taught today, in fact he CONFIRMS that soul is a living breathing creature and not a seperate enity of its self.
I have only found this teaching of soul being, the woman, a seperate part of man, that it is the soul that must be won over, in the teachings of men. I followed it, but that does not change what Gen.2:7 and I Cor. 15:45 teaches.

[Beloved Servant]

OK, that's great, and that's how it is to you. I can respect that.

What I don't understand is why it is such a thorn in your side.

Are you looking for an audience, approval, confirmation or just venting?

I think they call it a "rant" on the internet. lol.

You seem angry and unpeaceful.

[micah7:9]

OK, that's great, and that's how it is to you. I can respect that.

What I don't understand is why it is such a thorn in your side.

Are you looking for an audience, approval, confirmation or just venting?

I think they call it a "rant" on the internet. lol.

You seem angry and unpeaceful.

Perhaps frustrated. But since it by majority rule that man has a soul, I am going to leave it lie.
I have found out that old habits are hard to break.
Peace and Love Through Jesus

[Nathan]

I to have changed from the idea of the trinity as well in that I don't beleive there is a separation between God, Jesus and the Holy Ghost.  I belive God "is" the compilation of the Father, Son and Holy Spirit.  Each of those manifest in their own separate ways, but they are all the same God.  

I also see that the tabernacle of Moses is a replica, it's a natural illustration of a spiritual reality in that there are three main compartments "within" the tabernacle as a whole.  I do see how that outer court resembles the body in that it is illuminated with "natural" light, not to mention both the altar of sacrifice and laver are elementary levels of relationship leading to the intimacy with the Father.

The inner court is illuminated by "cultivated" light.  It was up to the priests (man) to maintain the fire, bread, wine it was all based on labor, works and physical activity, much like the soul is directly connected to our five senses.

And the holy of holies resembles the core of God's nature. It's illuminated by spiritual light.   It's where his presense dwells.  It resembles the living quarters of the spirit.  It's the Sabbath realm of Life.

So as there are three major charateristics to the makeup of God, we are his offspring and made of his image on several levels, then I still see man as a spirit living in a body, which manifests a soul through which our personality operates.  It has the capability to live in the flesh while walking in the spirit because it's a result of spirit living in flesh.

Words "can" lead you "to" truth, but only the spirit can usher us in it.  So while I do give importance to what I read, it's the sound that I now pursue for what to see and what to hear.  What I read will change according to what I've already seen.  When the Word written in our hearts says something that transforms our thinking, then as we read Scripture, we read "through" what the spirit already revealed to our hearts, which then makes old words manifest new understanding.

[Beloved Servant]

That is beautiful, Nathan.

[Cardinal]

 :cloud9: Amen Nathan, good word......and for what it's worth, Micah, I didn't learn about the soul from men, prior to Him speaking to me about 5 times one day "male and female made He THEM", which came with the understanding, I thought the soul and spirit were the same thing until that day when He "hounded" me to press in on that. Blessings....

[micah7:9]

:cloud9: Amen Nathan, good word......and for what it's worth, Micah, I didn't learn about the soul from men, prior to Him speaking to me about 5 times one day "male and female made He THEM", which came with the understanding, I thought the soul and spirit were the same thing until that day when He "hounded" me to press in on that. Blessings....

I have no problem with male and female created He them, never have. I never thought the soul and spirit were the same that is not what the Bible teaches. Why would anyone think that soul and spirit are the same?

[Nathan]

I've seen often times in Scripture where it says "soul" but the definition seems to indicate spirit so I guess I could see people blending the two.  I myself assumed when death occurs that my soul and spirit would continue on, that only my body would die, but it never really meshed and I didn't know any other way to see it . . .now of course I see it differently but there really isn't a lot of understanding out there when it comes to defining what the soul is.  That's mainly why I found this topic to be as interesting as it's been.  I've learned a lot just in this short time it's been discussed lated on the forum.

[micah7:9]

The only reason I can see why soul and spirit can be blended in is because we have over looked what from the very beginning the Word of God tells us what a soul is, and man built on what we imagined the soul to be.

Gen 2:7  And Jehovah God formeth the man--dust from the ground, and breatheth into his nostrils breath of life,(that would be His Spirit same as 1:2)
and the man(formed from the dust of the ground)
becometh a living creature.(soul)

We can see beyond any doubt that the dust of the ground is the body of man
The breath of life is the Spirit of God
And that Spirit brings the formed dust(the body) to life(a living soul.)

At least that is how I have begun to understand it. I dont have any intent of causing
discord, that is certainly not my desire.