the soul

[micah7:9]

I think a very important questions: What does became mean? Became= H1961
A primitive root (compare H1933); to exist, that is, be or become, come to pass (always emphatic, and not a mere copula or auxiliary): - beacon, X altogether, be (-come, accomplished, committed, like), break, cause, come (to pass), continue, do, faint, fall, + follow, happen, X have, last, pertain, quit (one-) self, require, X use.

a] Man was just literally dead  man ?  No, man WAS NOT YET (so he werent dead)
b] Man did live, like all animals, but was taken to a higher level. Nope, the Book dont say that.;
Gen 1:20  And God saith, `Let the waters teem with the teeming living creature, and fowl let fly on the earth on the face of the expanse of the heavens.'
Gen 1:21  And God prepareth the great monsters, and every living creature that is creeping, which the waters have teemed with, after their kind, and every fowl with wing, after its kind, and God seeth that it is good.
They were already life- alive He had not  FORMED them yet. (Gen. 1:27) souls already waiting  they were resting in the spoken word.
Now here is what the Word of God  reads..... Gen 2:7 man was FORMED and BECAME A LIVING SOUL..LET ME SAY THAT AGAIN! MAN BECAME A LIVING SOUL. Man was NOT given a soul, he became a living soul...a SOUL is a living creature. PERIOD!!!!!!!

 If, or should you desire to build theorys and doctrines, let it be known that man is a living soul and man was not given a soul. Nor were any of the animals or fowl given a soul....they all are souls!  My  :2c:

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[micah7:9]

But that doesn't answer what the former state was. The former state was he wasnt

He became an adult doesn't me he wasn't alive before that. In fact he has lived 21 year before that point.  all?Now I do not understand this latter statement at

So was the "became of man" the first step in a process?
Or
Was the "became of man" an upgrade from a previous state.

Just what do you want me to make up for answer, so that my answer will not be as ill begot as the question?

[WhiteWings]

Just what do you want me to make up for answer

I just want a normal discussion. That seems not to be possible so bye bye.

[micah7:9]

Just what do you want me to make up for answer

I just want a normal discussion. That seems not to be possible so bye bye.

I keep quoting the Bible and my discussion is not normal?  Man is a living soul does that bother you? The book of Genesis states in chapter 2 verse 7 that man became a living soul, when the Lord Gods breath was blown into him. It does not state that man was given a soul. Now if we can begin from there I know by the grace of God we can build on a sound and solid foundation and reach understanding of His Word.

[micah7:9]

Just what do you want me to make up for answer

I just want a normal discussion. That seems not to be possible so bye bye.

WhiteWings do you find my questions wrong or is it me? It just feels like Im dumb and you are not. I just hear your words and they seem to look down on me.

[WhiteWings]

WhiteWings do you find my questions wrong or is it me?

No, actually I find many of your questions good ones.

It just feels like Im dumb and you are not.

That's your feeling. I never wrote such a thing.

I just hear your words and they seem to look down on me.

I just read the Bible differently that most, likely all, on this forum. So my questions are different than you may be used to. I bet that discussion on a Catholic forum often take another direction as on say a Protestant forum. Different backgrounds. And my religious background is: totally nothing. A few months before my first post on this forum I never have even touched a Bible or any other religious material.
When I read verses I read words. Not doctrines. And that seems be problematic to you. But am I to blame for that? I think not...

So for me it doesn't matter if man only has 1 soul or 10 souls. If the text reads 1 soul. Great. If the text reads 10 souls great too. I'm not forced into a certain direction because in the past the pope said one soul or pastor Brimstone said 4 souls.
:dontknow:

[Molly]

So for me it doesn't matter if man only has 1 soul or 10 souls. If the text reads 1 soul. Great. If the text reads 10 souls great too.

But, a little common sense is also called for here.  If the text did say you had 10 souls, would you believe it?  But nothing that specific is ever said.

I think it's reasonable to believe that all living, sentient creatures have a soul, even the animals [maybe even the plants].  But, man is so far unique in that he can achieve higher levels of consciousness within his lifetime [even go from death to life].  This doesn't mean he is moving from one soul to another.   Although my dog clearly has a personality, and can understand just about everything I say,  I would never argue that he could compete with man.  On the other hand,  that's his appeal.  He is without guile.

I see the soul as the enduring part of a being--that which is allowed to attain immortality.



1 Corinthians 13:11
When I was a child, I spake as a child, I understood as a child, I thought as a child: but when I became a man, I put away childish things.

[Cardinal]

 :cloud9: It's like this, for my  :2c:...... The two shall become one that peacemaker quoted means the soul shall become one with the Spirit. We are spirit, soul, and body, according to the NT. He divides asunder soul from spirit in the NT.

The soul is the feminine receptive part, the spirit is the authority that plants seed. Male and female is one of the witnesses of that. Male and female created Him THEM.

The Spirit does not have human thought, human emotions, human will, or human desires, so where do those things come from? The body of dust?

What it means when He said man became a living soul, is that He for His purposes, gave life to something that had no part of Him until He breathed in the spark that gave it life or quickened it. He gives every man a measure of faith to receive Him and that spark is the measure of faith.

If you want to start a fire on some dirt, you have to have something to burn because dirt doesn't burn. Blessings....

[Beloved Servant]

dirt don't burn!    lol

[Cardinal]

 :cloud9: But we know the chaff from the seed does, doesn't it.... :winkgrin:

Although I suppose as super high temperatures it would burn to change form, mirroring the glorified body, eh?

[Beloved Servant]

Who can burn with everlasting fire?

[Molly]

The two shall become one that peacemaker quoted means the soul shall become one with the Spirit. We are spirit, soul, and body, according to the NT. He divides asunder soul from spirit in the NT.

The soul is the feminine receptive part, the spirit is the authority that plants seed. Male and female is one of the witnesses of that.Male and female created Him THEM.

Are you distinguishing between the spirit of man and the Spirit of God?  Why would he divide asunder the spirit and soul?

[WhiteWings]

So for me it doesn't matter if man only has 1 soul or 10 souls. If the text reads 1 soul. Great. If the text reads 10 souls great too.

But, a little common sense is also called for here.  If the text did say you had 10 souls, would you believe it?  But nothing that specific is ever said.

I would investigate. Is there more proof for 10 souls? 10 souls is a bit obvious; but 1 spirit + 1 animal soul + 1 human soul are already more possible reading various Hebrew words from soul/spirit. So if finally we found solid proof of only 1 spirit and that it; well I wouldn't be disappointed with it. Neither if it turns out we have 1 soul and one spirit. It really doesn't matter to me.

I think it's reasonable to believe that all living, sentient creatures have a soul, even the animals

I posted this link earlier in this thread. Yes animals have souls. http://www.pickle-publishing.com/papers/soul-and-spirit.htm

[maybe even the plants].

That's a question I once started a topic on. Blood seems to equal life. Animals have souls. Etc. But plants are never (?) mentioned. BTW plants have awareness.

But, man is so far unique in that he can achieve higher levels of consciousness within his lifetime [even go from death to life].

Just because he's a better animal or be cause God gave him something extra?

This doesn't mean he is moving from one soul to another.

I never claimed that. And if some post seems to say that I take back those words.

I see the soul as the enduring part of a being--that which is allowed to attain immortality.

So animals get immortality too because they have a soul?

1 Corinthians 13:11
When I was a child, I spake as a child, I understood as a child, I thought as a child: but when I became a man, I put away childish things.

No more fun. Just hard work and problems. :laughing7:

[Beloved Servant]

Isn't that what He did when He took Adam's rib?

[Beloved Servant]

He put the man to sleep and gave guidance of the 5 senses to the soul.
A divorce and a marriage, hmmm... just thought of that.

[Molly]

So animals get immortality too because they have a soul?

MartinCisneros always said so.  I didn't think so at first, but that was before I fell in love with a few animals.  Now I think God loves all his creation independently and personally--so why not?  Why wouldn't he want to save the most precious personalities he has created--each one unique?

Just because he's a better animal or be cause God gave him something extra?

God's specific intent was creating man in his own image and likeness.  So, man is special.  But if some men consider the rest of men beasts with a beast-like soul, then they can justify doing anything to them--especially since they consider they have dominion over beasts.  That was never God's intent.  I am convinced there are men who think this way and justify their actions by saying they are gods and the rest of us are beasts.  It's always been so in human history.  Like I said, this is very dangerous thinking.

[Molly]

He put the man to sleep and gave guidance of the 5 senses to the soul.
A divorce and a marriage, hmmm... just thought of that.

Yes, and at the same time, divided soul and spirit [adam and eve], so the soul [Eve] began acting independently of the spirit and depending on the input from the carnal senses to determine truth, giving rise to a type of soulish spirit--called the carnal mind.

It makes a lot of sense.

[Cardinal]

The two shall become one that peacemaker quoted means the soul shall become one with the Spirit. We are spirit, soul, and body, according to the NT. He divides asunder soul from spirit in the NT.

The soul is the feminine receptive part, the spirit is the authority that plants seed. Male and female is one of the witnesses of that.Male and female created Him THEM.

Are you distinguishing between the spirit of man and the Spirit of God?  Why would he divide asunder the spirit and soul?

:cloud9: So "Adam" can see what's in his heart, and deal with it according to the Spirit of God and His righteousness. The offering had to be washed (washing of the Word), and then consumed by fire (our God is a consuming fire).

The washing of the Word cleanses, but the fire cleanses and purifies, and so that all is left is one new man, like the 4th man in the fire, a Son of God.

The first Adam was ruled by his soul (wife), he was supposed to keep his "wife" silent in church (his temple) instead she spoke.

Just saw something new as I typed that last line. Wow. The soul/womb has creative power, made in the image of the One who creates by speaking everything into existance. Out of the abundance of the heart the mouth speaks.

The "mouth" of the heart of soulish man that speaks/CREATES is as the mouth of the WOMB that gives birth. I knew the woman that had the issue of blood, the blood was the soul giving life, but never saw this last part before. Praise You Lord.

Dear God, it's the HARVEST of what we speak, that is why we are to speak through the life of the Spirit, and not the "life" of the soul/flesh, because both are capable of creating a harvest. We reap what we sow. Knew this in principle, but He's breathing more life into it today....wow.

The second Adam was ruled by the Spirit He was one with. Blessings...

[Cardinal]

He put the man to sleep and gave guidance of the 5 senses to the soul.
A divorce and a marriage, hmmm... just thought of that.

:cloud9:  :thumbsup:

[Molly]

Just saw something new as I typed that last line. Wow. The soul/womb has creative power, made in the image of the One who creates by speaking everything into existance. Out of the abundance of the heart the mouth speaks.

The "mouth" of the heart of soulish man that speaks/CREATES is as the mouth of the WOMB that gives birth. I knew the woman that had the issue of blood, the blood was the soul giving life, but never saw this last part before. Praise You Lord.

Dear God, it's the HARVEST of what we speak, that is why we are to speak through the life of the Spirit, and not the "life" of the soul/flesh, because both are capable of creating a harvest. We reap what we sow. Knew this in principle, but He's breathing more life into it today....wow.

Yes, wow.  

Psalm 113:9
He maketh the barren woman to keep house, and to be a joyful mother of children. Praise ye the LORD.

[Cardinal]

 :cloud9: That's why when He comes, His reward is with Him. Children are a reward of the Lord. Our soul is to birth a SON! The firstfruits of the womb that bears, the firstfruits receives a double portion of inheritance = soul and spirit back in Holy union.

Conversely, if they didn't lay their soul on the altar, go thru the fire, they keep the wood, stubble, ect., having produced an Ishmael instead of an Isaac.  

[WhiteWings]

God's specific intent was creating man in his own image and likeness.  So, man is special.  But if some men consider the rest of men beasts with a beast-like soul, then they can justify doing anything to them--especially since they consider they have dominion over beasts.  That was never God's intent.  I am convinced there are men who think this way and justify their actions by saying they are gods and the rest of us are beasts.  It's always been so in human history.  Like I said, this is very dangerous thinking.

That's not correct. If a man only has a beast-soul it's a beast. So when you look like a man you are a men.  All have men have  a soul.
Except those who sold it to the devil  :winkgrin:

[Cardinal]

 :cloud9: Yes creation and animals have a soul. The creation is as His "wife", the lesser glory, she witnesses by reflecting His glory, just as the moon reflects the Sun's light. That's why ALL OF CREATION is waiting on the manifestation of the sons of God (Romans 8).

That's also why they were taken into the ark of Noah. God could have just made new animals after the water receded, but it wouldn't have been according to the pattern of salvation for all creation. Blessings...

PS. Got to leave for a couple of hours, but be back later to meditate on this some more......

[Molly]

:cloud9: That's why when He comes, His reward is with Him. Children are a reward of the Lord. Our soul is to birth a SON! The firstfruits of the womb that bears, the firstfruits receives a double portion of inheritance = soul and spirit back in Holy union.

Conversely, if they didn't lay their soul on the altar, go thru the fire, they keep the wood, stubble, ect., having produced an Ishmael instead of an Isaac.  

Sarah was barren, Rachel was barren, but Sarah gives birth to the son of the promise, and Rachel gives birth to Joseph and Benjamin, son of the right hand.


Isaiah 54:1
Sing, O barren, thou that didst not bear; break forth into singing, and cry aloud, thou that didst not travail with child: for more are the children of the desolate than the children of the married wife, saith the LORD.

[Beloved Servant]

That's why I've been saying, though perhaps no one caught it...


That he will "appear" in our mouth!

The Word of God made flesh in us!