Reasons for believing in Universal Salvation through Jesus Christ

[Ross]

God wills that none perish rather that ALL be saved. 2Peter 3 :9

'I declare the end from the beginning, and from long ago what is not yet done, saying: My plan will take place, and I will do all My will'. Isaiah 46:10

The Lord will do ALL His will !.Therefore..what the Lord wills, WILL take place !...absolutely no doubt !. :banana: :banana: :banana: :dsunny: :dsunny: :dsunny:

:thumbsup: :dsunny:

The wisdom of man is foolish and tries to outreason God.

Romans 11;34-36 " For who has known the mind of God?
                             Or who has been His counsellor?
                             Or who has given to God that God must pay him back?
                             For from Him and through Him and to Him are all things.
                             To Him be the glory for all time!"

[darryl]

God wills that none perish rather that ALL be saved. 2Peter 3 :9

'I declare the end from the beginning, and from long ago what is not yet done, saying: My plan will take place, and I will do all My will'. Isaiah 46:10

The Lord will do ALL His will !.Therefore..what the Lord wills, WILL take place !...absolutely no doubt !. :banana: :banana: :banana: :dsunny: :dsunny: :dsunny:

:thumbsup: :dsunny:

The wisdom of man is foolish and tries to outreason God.

Romans 11;34-36 " For who has known the mind of God?
                             Or who has been His counsellor?
                             Or who has given to God that God must pay him back?
                             For from Him and through Him and to Him are all things.
                             To Him be the glory for all time!"

:iagree: :thumbsup: :banana: :banana: :dsunny: :dsunny:

[eaglesway]

 In him we have obtained an inheritance, having been predestined according to the purpose of him who works all things according to the counsel of his will, so that we who were the first to hope in Christ might be to the praise of his glory.

[darryl]

...... so that we who were the first to hope in Christ might be to the praise of his glory.

yes..we are merely the 'first' to hope in Christ (the rest of humanity will follow at some point later )...sadly, Calvinists and Arminianists believe those 'first to hope' will be the only ones to ever hope..the rest, who never 'hope' in this life, will be damned....how they misrepresent God's love and power to save..shame on them.

[eaglesway]

 3And even if our gospel is veiled, it is veiled to those who are perishing, 4in whose case the god of this world has blinded the minds of the unbelieving so that they might not see the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ, who is the image of God. 5For we do not preach ourselves but Christ Jesus as Lord, and ourselves as your bond-servants for Jesus' sake. 6For God, who said, "Light shall shine out of darkness," is the One who has shone in our hearts to give the Light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Christ.

[Dandelion]

The one that I find explains it the best is the fact that death will be the last enemy defeated, which is declared definitively in Revelations.  It doesn't matter what somebody says the 2nd death is.  Spiritual death, physical death or seperation from God.  Each one has to be defeated.  To defeat spiritual death, God must make all spritually alive.  To defeat physical death, God must make all physically alive.  To defeat seperation from God, God would have to bring all into his precense.  I don't see how you could get around that except to deny that the bible claims that death will be defeated.

Amen absolutely Amen ;o)

:thumbsup:  Welcome!

Great point!                :iagree:

D.

[AlfredWang]

Thank you I will look at it :>).  It just seems that throughout the Word, we are told that God will save us all IF we choose to serve Him and accept His Son.  I will read about the demons and Satan and ponder and pray in the Spirit.   Thank you for your response.  Lydia

"Now listen carefully. Here is wisdom beyond its years. When a scientist creates an experiment or machine that malfunctions, is he responsible for the malfunction? Yes. Does he hold the experiment or machine responsible? No. Does he hold God responsible? No. Okay."

This brought me up short in a hurry - It is where the original flaw in reason is inserted in my view.  It is a direct quote from an article on the site you sent me (bible truths).  Adam and Eve were made PERFECT, SATAN was also perfect.  Ezekiel 28:15  "You were perfect in your ways, from the day you were created, until unrighteous was found in you."  Satan made a choice, Adam and Eve were also perfect and made a choice.  Yahweh did not will them to sin.  They chose to do it.  For God to be love, He must give us the right to choose him.  Otherwise we are animals following an instinct.  We can not love without choice.  That made rebellion a possibility.  Gods Sovereignty was challenged.  The case against Him proffered by Satan (false accusation, calling God a liar) had to be resolved.  Satan told them (Adam and Eve) Yahweh was a liar.  Satan said they would be like Him if they ate from the tree God restricted them from.  He only put the tree there to allow them a choice to obey or not.  He gave them everything they could possibly want and only the one restriction to give them a chance to love Him by keeping His commandment.  Remember the scripture in 1John..."for this is what the love of God means..that you keep my commandments..."  It was true in the Garden as well.  What did Yahweh tell them?  If you eat from the tree (He said not to) you will positively die...Period.  He never said they would burn in Hellfire, but they would cease to exist.  I believe they went to the second death Rev. 21:8 because they were perfect and chose to disobey.  That is why Satan also goes to the second death.  All men who died in sin because they were born in sin (imperfection) get a second chance.  But this shows that even perfect humans and angels can choose to rebel.  Yahweh offers salvation to everyone born to our original parents, but they must do their part.  Choose Life.  Lydiah

Copy-n-paste from my Facebook Timeline:

Romans 9:14-16 (My rough cut – with emphasis mine)
God's good will (not humans' freewill) justified by Scripture:
9:14 Then, we will speak [out] what? NO unrighteousness with the God (YHWH)? Become NOT;
9:15 for He utters [to] the Moses, "I will have mercy [unto] whom I may have mercy, and I will have compassion [unto] whom I may have compassion."
9:16 Then, [it is] then not of the [one] desiring, neither of the [one] running, but of the God having mercy.

Exodus 33:19 (ESV – with CORRECTION mine)
And He said, "I will make all my goodness pass before you and will proclaim before you My name 'YHWH.' And I will be gracious to whom I will be gracious, and will show mercy on whom I will show mercy.

Romans 9:17-18 (My rough cut – with emphasis mine)
God's will (not humans' freewill) to the whole world justified by Scripture:
9:17 For the Scripture utters [to] the Pharaoh, "That TO this it I arouse [out] thee, so that I would show forth in you the [dynamic] power of Me, and so that he would be declared the name of Me in all the earth."
9:18 So then [unto] whom He desires, He has mercy; BUT [unto] whom He desires, He hardens.

Exodus 9:13-16 (ESV)
13 Then YHWH said to Moses, "Rise up early in the morning and present yourself before Pharaoh and say to him, 'Thus says YHWH, the Almighty of the Hebrews, "Let My people go, that they may serve Me.
14 ................
15 ................
16 But for this purpose I have raised you (Pharaoh) up, to show you My power, so that My name (YHWH) may be proclaimed in all the earth.

Romans 9:19-21 (My rough cut – with emphasis mine)
God's will/way/trial/etc. should not be challenged!
9:19 Then, you will speak [out] [to] me, "[Then] why yet He finds fault? for who finds fault [with] the preference of His?
19:20 ................
19:21 ................

[AlfredWang]

The one that I find explains it the best is the fact that death will be the last enemy defeated, which is declared definitively in Revelations.  It doesn't matter what somebody says the 2nd death is.  Spiritual death, physical death or seperation from God.  Each one has to be defeated.  To defeat spiritual death, God must make all spritually alive.  To defeat physical death, God must make all physically alive.  To defeat seperation from God, God would have to bring all into his precense.  I don't see how you could get around that except to deny that the bible claims that death will be defeated.

Amen absolutely Amen ;o)

:thumbsup:  Welcome!

Great point!                :iagree:

D.

I also agree.

[darryl]

the Bible repeatedly says Jesus is the Savior of the world..either He is or He is not...hellists call the Bible into question by their stubborn insistence that many if not most will be lost..how can most be lost if He is the savior of the world ?..I prefer to take the Bible at it's word...that, ultimately, ALL will find salvation in and through Jesus Christ. :dsunny:

[eaglesway]

 :banana:

[micah7:9]

 :banana: :dsunny:

[marie glen]

Thank you I will look at it :>).  It just seems that throughout the Word, we are told that God will save us all IF we choose to serve Him and accept His Son.  I will read about the demons and Satan and ponder and pray in the Spirit.   Thank you for your response.  Lydia

"Now listen carefully. Here is wisdom beyond its years. When a scientist creates an experiment or machine that malfunctions, is he responsible for the malfunction? Yes. Does he hold the experiment or machine responsible? No. Does he hold God responsible? No. Okay."

This brought me up short in a hurry - It is where the original flaw in reason is inserted in my view.  It is a direct quote from an article on the site you sent me (bible truths).  Adam and Eve were made PERFECT, SATAN was also perfect.  Ezekiel 28:15  "You were perfect in your ways, from the day you were created, until unrighteous was found in you."  Satan made a choice, Adam and Eve were also perfect and made a choice.  Yahweh did not will them to sin.  They chose to do it.  For God to be love, He must give us the right to choose him.  Otherwise we are animals following an instinct.  We can not love without choice.  That made rebellion a possibility.  Gods Sovereignty was challenged.  The case against Him proffered by Satan (false accusation, calling God a liar) had to be resolved.  Satan told them (Adam and Eve) Yahweh was a liar.  Satan said they would be like Him if they ate from the tree God restricted them from.  He only put the tree there to allow them a choice to obey or not.  He gave them everything they could possibly want and only the one restriction to give them a chance to love Him by keeping His commandment.  Remember the scripture in 1John..."for this is what the love of God means..that you keep my commandments..."  It was true in the Garden as well.  What did Yahweh tell them?  If you eat from the tree (He said not to) you will positively die...Period.  He never said they would burn in Hellfire, but they would cease to exist.  I believe they went to the second death Rev. 21:8 because they were perfect and chose to disobey.  That is why Satan also goes to the second death.  All men who died in sin because they were born in sin (imperfection) get a second chance.  But this shows that even perfect humans and angels can choose to rebel.  Yahweh offers salvation to everyone born to our original parents, but they must do their part.  Choose Life.  Lydiah

..Would it be so easy to lose His first persons? (Any persons?) His first children..? So very many forget that He is Perfect! (Surely?!)

How can Perfect lose anything? :HeartThrob: :cloud9:

He has engineered things just as He has - the blueprint being that all will choose Him! Where does it say after death no hope? ...Please tell me anyone and all, if you know of a verse that could be thought to say after death no possibility of hope. I can only think of one - when Jesus told the Pharisees "unless you repent, you will die in your sins". So? Doesn't that simply mean they will rise still in their sins/imperfection/"missing the mark"? To carry it further is to go beyond what was said (imo).

Lately I've been noticing the phrase "agelasting judgment" - now I know this includes "perpetual" as a possibility.. but I've been seeing it as "the agelasting judgment", and "agelasting judgment 'day'" { :dontknow: Can't help it! If I'm wrong about the Great White Throne Judgment being an age (of 500 years) I'll be totally shocked! :mshock: And only at the very end is said "those not believing will go to the 2nd death - ageduring"  -- So if I never heard of Jesus before I died, and I find myself awakened from my grave, and witness and live through the intense review of all things/mankind's history (great 'day' of review to reaLLy drive home the lesson).. and all within and before the glorious radiance of God's holiness and purity.. I'm not going to "believe"? Surely(?) the lesson of this life - the story of each person's life, the same story of all nations and centuries, etc.. The same story and lesson over and over, personal and collective/global.. Apocalypse, the unveiling. In that anything not built upon and in Yahweh cannot stand, remain, endure.. It can only crash and burn.

I didn't mean to be so long winded.. :mblush:
[/i]

Copy-n-paste from my Facebook Timeline:

Romans 9:14-16 (My rough cut – with emphasis mine)
God's good will (not humans' freewill) justified by Scripture:
9:14 Then, we will speak [out] what? NO unrighteousness with the God (YHWH)? Become NOT;
9:15 for He utters [to] the Moses, "I will have mercy [unto] whom I may have mercy, and I will have compassion [unto] whom I may have compassion."
9:16 Then, [it is] then not of the [one] desiring, neither of the [one] running, but of the God having mercy.

Exodus 33:19 (ESV – with CORRECTION mine)
And He said, "I will make all my goodness pass before you and will proclaim before you My name 'YHWH.' And I will be gracious to whom I will be gracious, and will show mercy on whom I will show mercy.

Romans 9:17-18 (My rough cut – with emphasis mine)
God's will (not humans' freewill) to the whole world justified by Scripture:
9:17 For the Scripture utters [to] the Pharaoh, "That TO this it I arouse [out] thee, so that I would show forth in you the [dynamic] power of Me, and so that he would be declared the name of Me in all the earth."
9:18 So then [unto] whom He desires, He has mercy; BUT [unto] whom He desires, He hardens.

Exodus 9:13-16 (ESV)
13 Then YHWH said to Moses, "Rise up early in the morning and present yourself before Pharaoh and say to him, 'Thus says YHWH, the Almighty of the Hebrews, "Let My people go, that they may serve Me.
14 ................
15 ................
16 But for this purpose I have raised you (Pharaoh) up, to show you My power, so that My name (YHWH) may be proclaimed in all the earth.

Romans 9:19-21 (My rough cut – with emphasis mine)
God's will/way/trial/etc. should not be challenged!
9:19 Then, you will speak [out] [to] me, "[Then] why yet He finds fault? for who finds fault [with] the preference of His?
19:20 ................
19:21 ................

:thumbsup: :thumbsup: :HeartThrob:

Why are there tares?

...."so that My name (YHWH) may be proclaimed in all the earth."


It's so 'simple' really.. to be a rational creature is to, sooner or later, have the ability to make choices. But He surely is both life and perfection, so to choose anything in any small way, in thought, word or deed, which differs with what He chooses, and we become imperfect, the opposite of life. The very real potential for the world and for every one of us, is to perish. But "God is the savior of all". Jesus being "the savior of the world". (Such a simple message and lesson, but so obscured!! Presently, that is. :gsmile: )

'They' forget, perfect makes no mistakes, can lose nothing.. He's perfectly able to bring about, cause to happen, fashion it, that ultimately all choose Him/Life/Perfection. ..At the same time? I believe there will be plenty of weeping and gnashing of teeth in outer darkness (for a time) for those most despicable of human abusers. History.. is such a sad lesson..

[marie glen]

the Bible repeatedly says Jesus is the Savior of the world..either He is or He is not...hellists call the Bible into question by their stubborn insistence that many if not most will be lost..how can most be lost if He is the savior of the world ?..I prefer to take the Bible at it's word...that, ultimately, ALL will find salvation in and through Jesus Christ. :dsunny:

:thumbsup: :thumbsup: Amen! :smile:

[darryl]

n discussing eschatology from a UR standpoint we must ask ourselves some questions 1) does want to save ALL ?..answer = yes 2 Peter 3:9 ►The Lord is not slow concerning his promise, as some count slowness; but is patient with us, not  willing (act. in Greek, 'Boulomenos' = resolutely resolving ) that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance. God resolutely resolves to save ALL. 2) has God got the power and ability to save all ?....answer =yes, with God ALL things are possible  ( Matthew 19:26 )....3) does God always get what He wants ? answer= yes, Psalm 135:6 ►The LORD does whatever pleases him, in the heavens and on the earth, in the seas and all their depths.2 Chronicles 20:6► He said:Yahweh, the God of our ancestors, are You not the God who is in heaven,and do You not rule over all the kingdoms of the nations? Power and might are in Your hand, and no one can stand against You.Job 42:2►I know that You can do /anything and no plan of Yours can be thwarted.4) is the will of a person to reject God stronger than God's will to save them ?...answer= No, we have already seen that it's God's resolve to save all and noone can stand against Him......in this world a persons will is 'Fallen' like every thing else, as a result of the Fall....a persons will is affected by external circumstances, upbringing, matters beyond someones control...after death the Lord will heal the Will, restore it (the Bible talks about the restoration of ALL things ) so after death , unlike now, a person will be able to recognize just who Jesus is and will reach out to the 'Father of spirits' (Hebrews 12:9 ) in repentance through the Lord Jesus Christ and be reconciled.BTW, the Bible doesn't say anywhere that this present life is our only chance to find and accept Christ....it says after death 'the judgement' not eternal hell or annihilation.

[Andrew]

Hi DARYL

That's a very well-thought out argument for UR. I'm not sure how one would argue against against your points and conclusion as you backed up everything with the Word of God and you seem to cover all possible objections.

Thanks for that. It gives me more hope in UR

but then I wonder about the idea that God cannot act outside His Law and what if His Law is that unrepetant sin has to be eternally punished?   



Andrew     

[darryl]

John 1:29 Young's Literal Translation
'on the morrow John seeth Jesus coming unto him, and saith, 'Lo, the Lamb of God, who is taking away the sin of the world';
TAKING AWAY = Strongs Concordance no. 142 [e]   αἴρων=airōn
airōn =   taking away   αἴρων= Verb – Present Participle Active-
Jesus is actively taking away the sin of the world !.....I believe this could mean each new generation,replacing the prior one, experiences it's sin 'taken away', in a very real sense.This blows me away !.