Did the catholic church make up the distinction between mortal and venial sins?

[jabcat]

Could anyone help me find some evidence that the whole thing was made up by the catholic church?

Please consider this, and see if it helps shed some light on the subject;

Catholic Church announces 7 new deadly sins; Fincher, Freeman and Pitt gear up for sequel talks  March 10, 2008 | Contributed by Nathan Harrison

In an announcement that feels like an Onion headline reject, the Catholic Church has revealed a list of seven additional "mortal sins" created to keep pace with the modern world's wickedness. The Vatican's semi-official newspaper, L'Osservatore Romano, broke the story and the list, which includes (in layman's terms):

   Polluting
   Genetic engineering
   Obscene riches
   Taking & dealing drugs
   Abortion
   Pedophilia
   Causing social injustice
--------------------------------------------------  End quote

What do the scriptures say?  "Jesus Christ is the same yesterday, today, and forever."  Hebrews 13:8

[Beloved Servant]

Obscene riches???

I've been to the Vatican Museum, our guide, more than once, spoke of the pieces as "priceless" and that the value of the collection is incalculable.

[LS]

If anyone "believes in their heart and confesses with their mouth the Lord Jesus"/calls on the name of the Lord to be saved, they are my brother or sister.  

Thank you - that is exactly my belief as well.

[micah7:9]

Catholic religion....Am I the the only one who sees the so what? I am given the understanding that catholic means universal, well we know that aint so. Or is it? When did the catholic "religion" get the handle on just what the Lord had to say in the Book? Just who gave these folk the reins? I for myself find the catholic religion a very confining an abtrusive religion.
Who gave the catholic's all this power in the first place? I may be and perhaps I am, cause I did not go into any studies, so just who and how did the catholic religion become the next power below the the President of the United States? Just who is the catholic church? Im a little bit set back. FYI?  I may be bold, but I know no of no other way to get into it.
Peace and Love Through Jesus

[LS]

Please consider this, and see if it helps shed some light on the subject;

Catholic Church announces 7 new deadly sins; Fincher, Freeman and Pitt gear up for sequel talks  March 10, 2008 | Contributed by Nathan Harrison

In an announcement that feels like an Onion headline reject, the Catholic Church has revealed a list of seven additional "mortal sins" created to keep pace with the modern world's wickedness. The Vatican's semi-official newspaper, L'Osservatore Romano, broke the story and the list, which includes (in layman's terms):

   Polluting
   Genetic engineering
   Obscene riches
   Taking & dealing drugs
   Abortion
   Pedophilia
   Causing social injustice


What do the scriptures say?  "Jesus Christ is the same yesterday, today, and forever."  Hebrews 13:8

Does that really surprise you? What is a common question on boards such as this - "What does this passage mean by a sin that is deadly ... what is that?" or "What is the unforgivable sin?"

How would a church define those or answer the questions without offering examples or guidelines?  

I don't know ...

[Nathan]

It seems to be a bit more than just someone offering a guide line though . . . it seems more like an organization assuming the role of the worlds spiritual authority on matters when all they seem to be doing is building their own tower of Babel all over again. 

Jesus didn't say he would build his church upon doctrine or rules or tradition.  But that he would build his church upon the experience of individual revelation from the Father about the nature of the Son.  The Catholic church seems to emphasize it was Peter he was talking about so they deemed Peter as the first pope.  Which for me, was off target right from the beginning.

I don't pray to dead saints . . .I don't bury a statue of Joseph in my front lawn when I want to sell my house . . . there is a reason why I'm not Catholic.  But it's not just Catholics.  Any person who establishes boundaries in a belief system has missed the whole point of the "free indeed" Jesus spoke of.  Our nature is to be as free as the wind.  We are to be governed by the unpredictable presence of the Holy Spirit that dwells in us.  Religion of any kind, Catholic or Protestant,  has no room for that kind of freedom.

[jabcat]

Please consider this, and see if it helps shed some light on the subject;

Catholic Church announces 7 new deadly sins; Fincher, Freeman and Pitt gear up for sequel talks  March 10, 2008 | Contributed by Nathan Harrison

In an announcement that feels like an Onion headline reject, the Catholic Church has revealed a list of seven additional "mortal sins" created to keep pace with the modern world's wickedness. The Vatican's semi-official newspaper, L'Osservatore Romano, broke the story and the list, which includes (in layman's terms):

   Polluting
   Genetic engineering
   Obscene riches
   Taking & dealing drugs
   Abortion
   Pedophilia
   Causing social injustice


What do the scriptures say?  "Jesus Christ is the same yesterday, today, and forever."  Hebrews 13:8

Does that really surprise you? What is a common question on boards such as this - "What does this passage mean by a sin that is deadly ... what is that?" or "What is the unforgivable sin?"

How would a church define those or answer the questions without offering examples or guidelines?  

I don't know ...

I didn't say I was surprised.  Perhaps a little disgusted.  I'll quote what Gary Amirault stated some time back - "I don't like to see the sheep getting abused".

Polluting, now defined by the "Catholic Church" as a deadly/mortal sin - as of 2 years ago, 2008 - can now doom me to eternal hell...  I understand that's what a mortal sin supposedly is.  IMO, it's part of the angst given by way of example in the opening question to this thread.  So according to that opening question, this is something one should put their trust in, be in turmoil about, wonder if one might not be able to get forgiveness for?  I see that as a problem.

I don't see this as benign, as being similar to a discussion or an otherwise seeking of the truth.  I believe it's an edict, a "church" law, meant to be accepted as direct from God - and lived by or literally go to hell.  

I'd suggest a related pertinent question is, "who's the church"?  Peace.

[LS]

Maybe a pertinent question is, "who's the church"?

Does anyone think the answer to that is anything other than the body of believers?  I sure don't.

But "churches" isn't a wrong thing either.  From the beginning believers gathered to worship - Paul wrote his letters to the church of Corinth, the congregation at Colossae, etc. The NT also describes how some of the organizing came about, assigning people to take care of different needs in the community (Acts 6) and later giving guidelines for those who would be deacons, etc.

I don't judge people who belong to different denominations, nor those who don't attend any organized church. I am in the best place for me at this time and trust the Holy Spirit has placed each of you where you are as well. 

I honestly never intend to argue; I'm sorry if I have been argumentative. I only meant to answer the original poster's question as best I could.

[jabcat]

Your spirit's good brother, sorry for my intensity and being an offense, but I admit, my blood boils a little when it comes to huge institutions ruling over people unjustly - and especially in the name of God.

Now, personally, I don't condemn you.  I couldn't if I wanted to.  We each stand before God individually.  Where God has you right now is between you and Him.  He'll lead you where He wants you to go.  I just know that He spoke clearly to me to come out of the institution of religion.  If He hasn't done that yet to you, again, that's between you and God.  He has a plan and directs your steps.  I'm so far from being perfected/matured myself it's not even funny.  Well, actually it is sometimes - as in pitiful.

As you wish to answer the opening question, that's also what I'm attempting.   :high5:.  I'd hate for our brother Dane to live in condemnation when it's totally uncalled for, based on man-made fabrication.   :2c:

[peacemaker]

Jewish Laws...
Catholic Laws...
State Laws...

In California; you couldn't wear blue jeans (Levi's) after 5:00 p.m.?
In Oregon; when you were released from prison, they are/were to give you a horse and a six-shooter?
In Arizona; you cannot be seen naked in your own house by a family member (you would be labeled a sex offender)?

Probably, an embarrassment at worst?

Don't interpret this in the wrong light, some laws are necessary. However, many are absurdity at best.

"Throw out the wine, no dancing with your wife; and get a hair cut."

peacemaker

[jabcat]

Probably, an embarrassment at worst?

:mblush:    :laugh2:

I'd hate for our brother Dane to live in condemnation when it's totally uncalled for, based on man-made fabrication.   :2c:

P.S. Brother LS,  I believe some are bothered much more than others over some of the "ancillary" stuff, while others may either not have the emotional/mental disposition to obsess over them, or be matured to the point of being able to sift through it, take what's useful, and toss out what's not.  I'm no judge, but your footing may be quite sound, while another may spend sleepless nights and end up in despair over matters such as those being discussed.    :2c:



Paraphrasing our Savior, "My peace I give to you, not as the world gives - and the world can't take it away".

Blessings, James.

[jabcat]

Clarifying - the individuals within those organizations are my dear brothers and sisters.  The organizations/institutions themselves, not quite so fond of.

But when the Father sends the Advocate as my representative--that is, the Holy Spirit--he will teach you everything and will remind you of everything I have told you.  John 14:26

:bigGrin:

[thinktank]

Could anyone help me find some evidence that the whole thing was made up by the catholic church?

Please consider this, and see if it helps shed some light on the subject;

Catholic Church announces 7 new deadly sins; Fincher, Freeman and Pitt gear up for sequel talks  March 10, 2008 | Contributed by Nathan Harrison

In an announcement that feels like an Onion headline reject, the Catholic Church has revealed a list of seven additional "mortal sins" created to keep pace with the modern world's wickedness. The Vatican's semi-official newspaper, L'Osservatore Romano, broke the story and the list, which includes (in layman's terms):

   Polluting
   Genetic engineering
   Obscene riches
   Taking & dealing drugs
   Abortion
   Pedophilia
   Causing social injustice
--------------------------------------------------  End quote

What do the scriptures say?  "Jesus Christ is the same yesterday, today, and forever."  Hebrews 13:8

Jesus is the same but also not, all things become new in Christ Jesus. but sins in the eyes of man have changed over the years, like these above. Some people might think that causing pollution is not a sin, and genetic engineering. Although obscene riches, that is an old sin I don't know why they add that, and in any case having obscene riches is not a sin, for God is the richest person in the universe, he holds all the gold, silver and cattle, also his servant Solomon was one of the richest man alive. It is only a sin when one hordes, dishonest and thieves, like Zacharias did during Jesus time.
The problem I think with listing sins like this is when it become to much like the laws during the time of Pharisses, who use it to condemn others but do nothing to help out.

[LS]

Clarifying - the individuals within those organizations are my dear brothers and sisters. 

Also in the interest of clarifying - I would be your sister in Christ.   :cloud9:

[Universalist Catholic]

Yes, Mortal and Venial Sin were created by the Church.  I remember when I first learned about mortal and venial sin, and I was like what.  The church makes everything out to be a mortal sin, gossip, sexual thoughts, lying, pretty much everything someone would do.  I was actually pretty angry about that teaching, considering most of the things classified as mortal sins were in no way deserving of Eternal Torture.  But they explained that the ignorant got a free pass, but we no longer had one, cause the priest told us and now were responsible for our actions.  Go figure.  Now I do not endorse any of those things.  After some research I've done, I found that Augustine was pretty strict when it came to sin.  He had a belief that everything was a sin.  But I had always been perturbed by his theology.  But I realized how silly this stuff was when I was in tenth grade, and knew nothing about the bible. 

[shawn]

Yes, lets scare people into recycling with threats of eternal fire.  Makes perfect sense to me.  :mshock:

[Universalist Catholic]

It seems to be a bit more than just someone offering a guide line though . . . it seems more like an organization assuming the role of the worlds spiritual authority on matters when all they seem to be doing is building their own tower of Babel all over again. 

Jesus didn't say he would build his church upon doctrine or rules or tradition.  But that he would build his church upon the experience of individual revelation from the Father about the nature of the Son.  The Catholic church seems to emphasize it was Peter he was talking about so they deemed Peter as the first pope.  Which for me, was off target right from the beginning.

I don't pray to dead saints . . .I don't bury a statue of Joseph in my front lawn when I want to sell my house . . . there is a reason why I'm not Catholic.  But it's not just Catholics.  Any person who establishes boundaries in a belief system has missed the whole point of the "free indeed" Jesus spoke of.  Our nature is to be as free as the wind.  We are to be governed by the unpredictable presence of the Holy Spirit that dwells in us.  Religion of any kind, Catholic or Protestant,  has no room for that kind of freedom.

Peter was never even in Rome.

[WhiteWings]

Peter was never even in Rome.

Exactly.

[Nathan]

Not sure I'm following you . . .are you saying "Because" Peter was never in Rome he could not be considered a Pope?  Or are you saying because Peter was never in Rome the Catholics couldn't be saying he's the first pope?

[Universalist Catholic]

Not sure I'm following you . . .are you saying "Because" Peter was never in Rome he could not be considered a Pope?  Or are you saying because Peter was never in Rome the Catholics couldn't be saying he's the first pope?

That he was never a pope in the first place.  So that would mean that their popes were not something instituted by Jesus, and have no more authority than Martin Luther.