When Jesus comes back!

[Jock]

Eaglesway, here is a link to a debate about nuclear power and a guy who is a UN puppet. Helen Caldicot is well up on who is who. The UN is such a corrupt and dangerous outfit ( It's a corporation). People should know more about these things. Like the Federal Reserve, Bank of England, etc.

Spiritual wickedness in high places!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pb5HItRpDY8

Jock

[eaglesway]

absolutely true.

I know some folks disagree with me on this, but the function of the prophets in Israel was to expose wickedness in high places, corruption, inequity, injustice. To cry out for the plight of the poor and to shout from the houssetops corrupt things practised in secret. I believe one of the reasons Christianity in America and the West is so disrespected is because they turn a blind eye to the corruption of anyone who plays to their hot-button items like abortion, gay marriage, Israel, etc.- leaving the corrupt to further corrupt and thieves to steal more and more.

I believe that function of the prophets is still our function today.

[dajomaco]

Canadians in BC are rushing out to buy loads of Iodine tabs and the government health agency put a stop to it, cuz it could cause a serious problem.

Not true.

[Jock]

Hi Dajomaco

Wikipedia: see what you think?   Due to a run on potassium iodide tablets in pharmacies in Western Canada, Canadian Prime Minister Stephen Harper, issued statements on 15 March of reassurance that Canada was not at risk from the fallout, and that taking the iodine tablets was unnecessary. British Columbia's health officer Dr. Perry Kendall, urged residents not to stockpile the tablets.[53][54]

[Jock]

Eaglesway,

again, I agree.

"I believe that function of the prophets is still our function today" I know that the prophets spoke to Israel of her sin and they also spoke concerning things to come, which is all a consequence of sin.

Jock

[eaglesway]

The actual fukushima nuclear plant disaster has not stopped happening yet. There are new leaks, worse than the old leaks, with potentially more disastrous effects that the original meltdown itself. This is an epochal event of biblical and apocalyptic dimensions- the public just doesnt know it yet. Worst case estimates are that parts of the aleutian islands, hawaii and pockets in the west coast of canada and the U.S could become inhabitable over the next decade. There is disagreement over the final radioactive count that will accumulate, because they have not stopped the contaminated water from pouring into the Pacific, so all the data is not in- but anyone who wants to know can research alternative news reports on the internet and find out that it is WAY worse than our government or the mass media will tell us. The linked article is no small time glory seeking radical report, it is National Geographic magazine, and its just a blurb. The radioactivity at Fukushima IS STILL GOING UP. Tepco does not have the situation under control and nothing short of an international intervention can stop what has become an open ended boondoggle of massive proportions by this prideful and deceitful company and government in Japan.

news.nationalgeographic.com/energy/2013/08/130821-fukushima-latest-leak-how-is-it-different/

[Jock]

Yes, Fukushima is an apocalypse. These governments, the Japanese and US are playing this down so that they can continue receiving mega bucks from the NRC. They have declared a 12 mile exclusion zone (only 12 miles) for Fukushima residents whose children are already presenting with lumps in their thyroid glands.. Stephen Harper saying that Canada will not experience any fallout "LIAR"!!

If reactor no 4 melts down, they are talking about evacuating Tokyo! We'll see what takes place?

I'll read the link you sent, here's another happy little story for you.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E_Cz39TUTQs

Jock.

[marie glen]

I did a study some time ago.  Paul expected the soon return of Jesus.  Can't remember but it seems that the soon return of Jesus is what is taught in the Bible.

Revelation talks of the things that were to soon come to pass.

Christians don't like this topic much.  Wonder why?

.

Because they don't understand it?

[marie glen]

When Jesus comes back what is going to happen?

Personally I'm not focused on the return of Christ.  The present life in Christ is where my attention is.  Wonder why I avoid the topic?  Not saying it is right.........just a fact.

I doubt if anyone has brought this up, but it seems to me, if Jesus' 1st advent fulfilled Israel's ancient Spring Holy Days -

was the [ 1 ] "Passover Lamb" -

was the [ 2 ] "Unleavened Bread" sinless in the oven/the grave for 3 nights and days -

and was the [ 3 ] "Firstfruit" lone sheaf of wheat waved in the air /  rose & ascended

Then it seems logic to me, that His long 2nd advent of 3 main peaks -

[peak - 1] = Return with fire and angels -

[peak - 2] = Day Of Judgment (DOJ) -

and "Tabernacles" - [peak - 3] = God will now "tabernacle" with man - Rev 21:3 (upon earth made new)

  --- would be represented by the Fall Feasts oF -

[ 1 ] Trumpets - (ten days until number 2)

[ 2 ] DOA (day of atonement) - (five days until number 3)

and - [ 3 ]  Tabernacles

..........................................surely? :smile:    (ten days separating fall holy days 1 and 2
                                                                    (five days separating fall holy days 2 and 3)

iF 1000 yrs separate peak 1 of the second advent from peak 2 - how many years separate peak 2 (DOJ) from peak 3 (God will Tabernacle w/ man)? iF the Fall Holy Days prophesy the 2nd advent?

oR iF the millenium lasts 1000yrs... how long will DOJ/DOA last?

but i don't think any will see it until some authority writes it in a book.. same old..

[marie glen]

pestilence including chemical.. the fourth horse and rider, 'hell' the grave follows after him, including the mass grave follows after him.. kills 1/4..

from rev chapter 6 of course, where the seals are described as a blend of what they are when 1st start their ride/progression/gallop and what they are at the 'end'. This "seals" (pun intended) the vision, one of at least two locks. (By describing so very early in the narrative, things which occur very late on planet Earth.)

[rosered]

Eaglesway,

again, I agree.

"I believe that function of the prophets is still our function today" I know that the prophets spoke to Israel of her sin and they also spoke concerning things to come, which is all a consequence of sin.

Jock

  I agree too in the sense of    the testimony of Jesus is the Spirit of Prophecy / revealing Truth    and anyone   who is hid in Christ  IS   declaring this truth   
  many gifts same Spirit   1COR 12

[Jock]

You're right, Rose.

A believer must look at those things (Fukushima) in the Spirit, all the while desiring Christ's view of them.

Cheers


Jock.   :2c:

[rosered]

You're right, Rose.

A believer must look at those things (Fukushima) in the Spirit, all the while desiring Christ's view of them.

Cheers


Jock.   :2c:

:friendstu:   

   NLT 2Cr 13:3 I will give you all the proof you want that Christ speaks through me. Christ is not weak when he deals with you; he is powerful among you. 


2Cr 13:4 Although he was crucified in weakness, he now lives by the power of God. We, too, are weak, just as Christ was, but when we deal with you we will be alive with him and will have God's power. 
2Cr 13:5 Examine yourselves to see if your faith is genuine. Test yourselves. Surely you know that Jesus Christ is among you ; if not, you have failed the test of genuine faith. 


2Cr 13:6 As you test yourselves, I hope you will recognize that we have not failed the test of apostolic authority. 


2Cr 13:7 We pray to God that you will not do what is wrong by refusing our correction. I hope we won't need to demonstrate our authority when we arrive. Do the right thing before we come—even if that makes it look like we have failed to demonstrate our authority. 


2Cr 13:8 For we cannot oppose the truth, but must always stand for the truth.    :thumbsup:

[ed]

Add to the confusion.

http://www.ra-el.org/
http://www.ra-el.org/faq.html
http://www.ra-el.org/evidence.html

.

[eaglesway]

pestilence including chemical.. the fourth horse and rider, 'hell' the grave follows after him, including the mass grave follows after him.. kills 1/4..

from rev chapter 6 of course, where the seals are described as a blend of what they are when 1st start their ride/progression/gallop and what they are at the 'end'. This "seals" (pun intended) the vision, one of at least two locks. (By describing so very early in the narrative, things which occur very late on planet Earth.)

and yet John is instructed, do not seal the scroll for the time is at hand............it was unsealed somewhere between 60-90 AD, it has been open ever since :o)

[rosered]

  Amen Bro John !!    Lamb  of God    loosing the seals    :angel5:

I doubt if anyone has brought this up, but it seems to me, if Jesus' 1st advent fulfilled Israel's ancient Spring Holy Days -

was the [ 1 ] "Passover Lamb" -

was the [ 2 ] "Unleavened Bread" sinless in the oven/the grave for 3 nights and days -

and was the [ 3 ] "Firstfruit" lone sheaf of wheat waved in the air /  rose & ascended

Then it seems logic to me, that His long 2nd advent of 3 main peaks -

[peak - 1] = Return with fire and angels -

[peak - 2] = Day Of Judgment (DOJ) -

and "Tabernacles" - [peak - 3] = God will now "tabernacle" with man - Rev 21:3 (upon earth made new)

  --- would be represented by the Fall Feasts oF -

[ 1 ] Trumpets - (ten days until number 2)

[ 2 ] DOA (day of atonement) - (five days until number 3)

and - [ 3 ]  Tabernacles

  I have been studying  on those 3  Feast days     Passover ,  Trumpets and  Tabernacles  and   do see Jesus Christ fulfilling them      Marie !!

[eaglesway]

Add to the confusion.

http://www.ra-el.org/
http://www.ra-el.org/faq.html
http://www.ra-el.org/evidence.html

.

So funny.

[WhiteWings]

and yet John is instructed, do not seal the scroll for the time is at hand............it was unsealed somewhere between 60-90 AD, it has been open ever since :o)

To seal means to conclude a writing. Leaving a book unsealed means isn't done yet.
And that fits quite nicely with history like 5 kings have come and stuff like Christians wanting to be Jews etc.
The bulk of Revelation was written in the 60's. But the book wasn't sealed/completed then. Nothing happened for 30 years. Then then in the late 90's he received the last information. Finished/sealed the book. Not long after  that he was executed for his faith.

[eaglesway]

I think that is incorrect.

IMO to seal means to bind the revelation for a future time, like the words Paul heard in the 3rd heaven that he was not allowed to utter, or like the 7 thunders.

To veil it, in other words.

"Go your way Daniel for these words are sealed and concealed until the end time." (Dan 12:4)

It was sealed because it wasnt "open to public knowledge"-yet. 

It was unsealed because it was time to be published to those "who have ears to hear what the Spirit is saying to the ecclessia.".

Then, to John......"Do not seal up the scroll for the time is at hand".... as in "Repent for the kingdom of heaven is at hand". Here. Now. Open. Available.

Daniles book was sealed until the end times. The Lamb opened it for John, in the end times. John recorded it for us-  It is open, if we can hear,

[WhiteWings]

I think that is incorrect.

IMO to seal means to bind

Seal and bind have different meanings in Hebrew. The difference isn't huge, but still there is a difference.

http://tentmaker.org/forum/christian-life/the-new-testament-was-written-in-hebrew-(not-greek)/msg136783/#msg136783

See it like this:
A government is planning to write 200 laws. Every law written binds the citizens a little more. When law #200 is bound the book is finished/sealed.


A Ketubah/wedding contract is a good example of seals. Seals are a wrong translation because it's where signatures. But that isn't of much importance now.
The Ketubah contained several sections. Family trees, anecdotes, legal stuff like dowry, etc.
Each section ended with a seal/signature.

Yeah, the Revelation is for a future time (or not depending on certain views).

It was sealed because it wasnt "open to public knowledge"-yet.

But not understanding something or writing about future events isn't sealing. When I was born, I couldn't read. Did that mean all book in the library are sealed in the way you understand it? Nope. The library still contains many books I don't understand because my education doesn't span 500 professions. Are those books sealed the way you understand it? No, it's just me not understanding them.

Then, to John......"Do not seal up the scroll for the time is at hand"

The Lamb opened it for John, in the end times. John recorded it for us-  It is open, if we can hear,

How can Jesus open/unseal a book that's already open/unsealed?

So when John was told not to seal it, he understood it as "more will come"

If you would have used "veiled" instead of "sealed" I would have agreed much more. But not as in purposely blinded. Jesus came to fulfill the law. Meaning He came to lift the veil. But that doesn't mean God always intended His Law was never understood until Jesus arrived.

John was also sealing the Bible as a whole.

[marie glen]

hi!  :hiya:  this is how I think of it,

Revelation 20:6 - Young's Literal Translation (YLT) "Happy and holy [is] he who is having part in the first rising.." "This is the First Resurrection."

Revelation 20:5-15 - New American Standard Bible (NASB) "The rest of the dead did" (do) "not come to life until the thousand years were" (are) "completed.."

John 8:20-21,24 - (YLT) - "Jesus spake in the treasury" (to the Pharisees) "teaching in the temple, and no one seized him, because his hour had not yet come; therefore said Jesus again to them, `I go away, and ye will seek me, and in your sin ye shall die; whither I go, ye are not able to come.. ...I said, therefore, to you, that ye shall die in your sins, for if ye may not believe that I am [he], ye shall die in your sins.'

Matthew 8:11-12 - (NASB) "I say to you that many will come from east and west, and recline at the table with Abraham, Isaac and Jacob in the kingdom of heaven; but the sons of the kingdom will be cast out into the outer darkness; in that place there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth."

Revelation 22:10-16 - (YLT) - "And he saith to me, `Thou mayest not seal the words of the prophecy of this scroll, because the time is nigh;" (always nigh! whether the 'end' collectively as prophesied, or the 'end' personally at death) "he who is unrighteous -- let him be unrighteous still, and he who is filthy -- let him be filthy still, and he who is righteous -- let him be declared righteous still, and he who is sanctified -- let him be sanctified still: And lo, I come quickly, and my reward [is] with me, to render to each as his work shall be; I am the Alpha and the Omega -- the Beginning and End -- the First and the Last. `Happy are those doing His commands that the authority shall be theirs unto the tree of the life, and by the gates they may enter into the city; and without [are] the dogs, and the sorcerers, and the whoremongers, and the murderers, and the idolaters, and every one who is loving and is doing a lie. `I, Jesus did send my messenger to testify to you these things concerning the assemblies; I am the root and the offspring of David, the bright and morning star!"

Revelation 2:7 - (NKJV) - "He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches. To him who overcomes I will give to eat from the tree of life, which is in the midst of the Paradise of God."

Revelation 13:9 - (YLT) "if any one hath an ear -- let him hear."

20:7-15 - (YLT) "And when the thousand years be finished, the Adversary shall be loosed out of his prison, and he shall go forth to lead the nations astray, that are in the four corners of the earth -- Gog and Magog -- to gather them together to war, of whom the number [is] as the sand of the sea; and they did go up over the breadth of the land, and did surround the camp of the saints, and the beloved city, and there came down fire from God out of the heaven, and devoured them; and the Devil, who is leading them astray, was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where [are] the beast and the false prophet" (not men! but two institutions of men) "and they shall be tormented day and night -- to the ages of the ages" ("for aion and aion" in the original Greek). "And I saw a great white throne, and Him who is sitting upon it, from whose face the earth and the heaven did flee away, and place was not found for them; and I saw the dead, small and great, standing before God, and scrolls were opened, and another scroll was opened, which is that of the life, and the dead were judged out of the things written in the scrolls -- according to their works; and the sea did give up those dead in it, and the death and the hades did give up the dead in them, and they were judged, each one according to their works; and the death and the hades were cast to the lake of the fire -- this [is] the second death; and if any one was not found" (by then!?) "written in the scroll of the life, he was cast to the lake of the fire."

:2c: :Peace2:

[sheila]

Paul spke of his hope to attain to the first resurrection...somehow......it is interesting to note that the secound resurrection

  is the resurrection of the righteous and wicked[good/evil mix] which is death..or lacking the fullness of the sanctification

   and [ w]holiness] of the first...[the prince of this world comes and he has nothing in me[wickedness]

   indeed the Lord will come and seperate the people[righteous from the wicked] and will appear a secound time apart/seperate

  from sin.

    seeing in part=partial sanctification............face to face..and being just like Him= mature total sanctification...........


     I have many things yet to declare to you..but at present ye can not bear them.........

   the mind of Christ  is the fullness [w]holeness..that the sons and daughters have to grow into.

    with the law..it is..or it isn't ...as defined by the law[is man wicked or righteous?] with grace there is change and growth=

  sown a natural body,raised a spiritual..the body that is sown is not the same body that is raised up[changed]....I think it

is for this reason..more then anything else...... satan seeks t kill the 'manchild' in it's infancy..before it is raised up in power.

          we see Paul's lament..the good that I wish to do..I do not do..the evil I desire not to do,I do[righteous/wicked mix]

   who shall deliver me from this body undergoing this death.


     Job 1;6  One day the sons of God[angels] come to present themselves before the Lord,and satan/sin appeared with them.

     [the children of the resurrection are like the angels]....[satn as prosecutor/accusor]


   now..one day the sons of God will  come to present themselves before the Lord[all men]..and Christ will appear with them

...and He will seperate what is no part of him..from His people..  He is our advocte/our saviour/our defender...He will rebuke

  Satan[the Lord rebuke thee satan] is this not a branch plucked from the fire? He will order...remove from off him his filthy

garments[vile] put a clean turban[mind] on his head and clean garments[this is what happens to those at the wedding feast

that are thrown oout for not having a wedding garment]   Don't you know Him yet? 

[eaglesway]

I think that is incorrect.

IMO to seal means to bind

Seal and bind have different meanings in Hebrew. The difference isn't huge, but still there is a difference.

http://tentmaker.org/forum/christian-life/the-new-testament-was-written-in-hebrew-(not-greek)/msg136783/#msg136783

See it like this:
A government is planning to write 200 laws. Every law written binds the citizens a little more. When law #200 is bound the book is finished/sealed.


A Ketubah/wedding contract is a good example of seals. Seals are a wrong translation because it's where signatures. But that isn't of much importance now.
The Ketubah contained several sections. Family trees, anecdotes, legal stuff like dowry, etc.
Each section ended with a seal/signature.

Yeah, the Revelation is for a future time (or not depending on certain views).

It was sealed because it wasnt "open to public knowledge"-yet.

But not understanding something or writing about future events isn't sealing. When I was born, I couldn't read. Did that mean all book in the library are sealed in the way you understand it? Nope. The library still contains many books I don't understand because my education doesn't span 500 professions. Are those books sealed the way you understand it? No, it's just me not understanding them.

Then, to John......"Do not seal up the scroll for the time is at hand"

The Lamb opened it for John, in the end times. John recorded it for us-  It is open, if we can hear,

How can Jesus open/unseal a book that's already open/unsealed?

So when John was told not to seal it, he understood it as "more will come"

If you would have used "veiled" instead of "sealed" I would have agreed much more. But not as in purposely blinded. Jesus came to fulfill the law. Meaning He came to lift the veil. But that doesn't mean God always intended His Law was never understood until Jesus arrived.

John was also sealing the Bible as a whole.

These are just discussions, but it does appear to me that you are using reasonings based on contemporary language to supercede what the scriptures plainly say.

Daniel was told to seal the scroll because it was not yet time.

John was told not to seal it because the time was "at hand".

I think this is about receiving the revelation given, not appealing to revelation yet to come- not to say that the word isnt ever new in each generation- there is, nevertheless, a complete revelation for the ecclessia who have ears to hear in the apocalypse of John. Jesus says over and over again in it- it is to the ecclessia of God. It opens with Him walking among the Lampstands- this is the theme of the introduction which opens up into seven letters to the seven gatherings. What follows in the openng of the seals is full of revelation contemporary in every generation since then, pictures of heavenly realities- for all who have ears to hear, and eyes opened to see, it has been unsealed.

As long as the scroll is sealed, it is unable to be opened. To me this is a bound scroll but there is no need to belabor such a fine point.


Jesus opened the seals. It is right there in Revelation chapter 5. John took dictation, so to speak. Revelation is largely, the contents of the sealed scroll

The language is also clear.


It doesnt say, "Seal not the scroll because there is more to come"

It says  "Do not seal up the words of the prophecy of this book (scroll)because the time is at hand"

It is a stretch, imo, to take the words- "Do not seal up the words of this scroll" and make them mean "Seal up all the writings with this scroll".

[micah7:9]

I read all the time in different places of religious speak[and have for years and found myself awaiting] that of Jesus coming back and His second coming. I was reading years ago the writings of J. Preston Eby, who I have found very important in my walk. Well, Bro. Eby established for me a very outstanding point which I have been given to hold and have found a "rock" in my foundation.
Joh_14:16  and I will ask the Father, and another Comforter He will give to you, that he may remain with you--to the age;
Joh_14:26  and the Comforter, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, he will teach you all things, and remind you of all things that I said to you.
Joh_15:26  `And when the Comforter may come, whom I will send to you from the Father--the Spirit of truth, who from the Father doth come forth, he will testify of me;
Joh_16:7  `But I tell you the truth; it is better for you that I go away, for if I may not go away, the Comforter will not come unto you, and if I go on, I will send Him unto you;

And thus informing me as well as telling me that Jesus Christ came again(a second time) and as Revelation confirms Rev 1:8  `I am the Alpha and the Omega, beginning and end, saith the Lord, who is, and who was, and who is coming--the Almighty.'
I, await Jesus Christ, I do not await His "second" coming.  Jesus Christ is always COMING...ALWAYS. Yet religion, theology,denominations all proclaim a "second" coming. I know I must stand alone with my faith...but happy at His many comings. :dsunny:

[WhiteWings]

These are just discussions, but it does appear to me that you are using reasonings based on contemporary language to supercede what the scriptures plainly say.

Scripture says is based on language.
Reading things any other way is inserting doctrine. It doesn't contradict Scripture. But it can mean Scripture says something else than what commonly is assumed.