I am curious to what Jesus means when He calls the Church of Sardis /red ones . The name "Sardis" means "escaping ones" or "those who come out" you have a name but you are dead ?
Like they are sleeping and there is a verse that Paul also warns about some '' sick and sleeping in the church/ escaping ones '' , those whom accepted Jesus Christ
and Hebrews 6 mentions leaving behind those carnal baby things and repentance of dead works /deeds and press on into maturity being the seven EYES Spirits in the Seven Churches Isaiah 11
Are they the red spots in the Love Feasts , the WHITE ROBE GATHERING , they appear Holy before men and have a good reputation as ALIVE , but Jesus says you are dead to MY FATHER/GOD , not Our Father ?
Saying this because its Jesus own words that says If they change they will be given White to wear as a covering and judges this church this is His judgments and if they receive His Righteousness
Does this still apply to us to this day ?
Revelation 3 Expanded Bible (EXB)
To the Church in Sardis
3 "Write this to the ·angel [messenger; see 1:20] of the church in ·Sardis [C the capital of the Roman province of Lydia in western Asia Minor]:
"The One [C the resurrected Jesus] who has the ·seven spirits [C referring either to angels or to the "sevenfold Spirit"—the Holy Spirit portrayed in his perfection; 1:4]
and the seven stars [1:16] says ·this [ these things]:
I know ·what you do [your works]. ·People say [ You have a name/reputation] that you are alive, but really you are dead.
2 Wake up! Strengthen what you have left ·before it dies completely [or which is about to die].
I have found that ·what you are doing is less than what my God wants [ your works are incompleted/unfulfilled before my God].
3 So ·do not forget [L remember] what you have received and heard. Obey it, and ·change your hearts and lives [repent].
·So you must wake up, or [L But if you do not wake up,]
I will come like a thief, and you will not know ·when [L at what hour] I will come ·to [upon; against] you.
4 But you have a ·few [few people; L few names] there in Sardis who have kept their clothes ·unstained [unsoiled; undefiled], so they will walk with me ·and will wear white clothes [L in white], because they are worthy.
5 Those who ·win the victory [overcome; conquer] will be dressed in white clothes like them.
And I will ·not [never; C an emphatic negation] erase [wipe out; blot out] their names from the ·book [scroll] of life [Ex. 32:32–33; Ps. 69:28; Dan. 12:1],
but I will ·say they belong to me [L confess their names] before my Father and before his angels. 6 Everyone who has ears should ·listen to [hear; obey] what the Spirit says to the churches.
Have your name blotted out is the same as not being His ?
Because your name is on the lambs book of Life for it to be blotted out by Him correct?
I was wondering how to make the scriptures compare with scriptures
what if the 7 candlesticks /churches are the are what we are to overcome in them for those rewards Jesus announces ,
and this is for the race Paul speaks of are the high calling Philippians 3 , 14I press on toward the goal for the prize of the upward call of God in Christ Jesus.
15 Let us therefore, as many as are perfect/complete , have this attitude; and if in anything you have a different attitude, God will reveal that also to you;
Each Light is of the 7 IN BRIGHTER LIGHT in Isaiah 11 that Jesus Christ received in HOLY SPIRIT FULNESS [7 EYES]
A ·new branch [sprout; shoot; C the Messiah] will grow
from the stump of Jesse [C king David's father; the Messiah will restore David's royal line];
a branch will ·come [sprout; or bear fruit]
from his roots.
2 The Spirit of the Lord will rest upon him 1[1 Sam. 16:13; Matt. 3:16 Then ·heaven [the sky/heavens] opened, and he saw God's Spirit ·coming down [descending and lighting/settling] on him like a dove]. the pouring out of Holy Spirit and fire on the day of pentecost,,, The rest Jesus speaks of in Him /Sabbath 7 th day fulness rest from your labours and works follow
The Spirit will give him 2 wisdom and 3 understanding, ·4 guidance [counsel] and 5 power.
The Spirit ·will teach him 6 to know [L of knowledge] and 7·respect [the fear of] the Lord.
3 ·This king will be glad to [L He will gladly/with delight] ·obey [revere; fear] the Lord.
He will not judge by ·the way things look [appearances; L the vision of his eyes]
or decide by ·what he hears [L the hearing of his ears].
4 But he will judge the poor ·honestly [with justice/righteousness];
he will be ·fair [upright; just; fair] in his decisions for the ·poor [oppressed; meek] people of the ·land [or earth].
·At his command evil people will be punished [L He will strike the earth with the rod/scepter of his mouth],
and by ·his words the wicked will be put to death [L the breath of his lips he will slay the wicked].
5 ·Goodness [Righteousness; Justice] will be like a belt around his waist,
and ·fairness [faithfulness; integrity] like a belt around his ·hips [waist; T loins].
7 churches in Revelation are held in Jesus hand
no one can take them out of my hand John 10
...27"My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me; 28and I give eternal life to them, and they will never perish; and no one will snatch them out of My hand. 29"My Father, who has given them to Me, is greater than all; and no one is able to snatch them out of the Father's hand.
Hi Rose ..... I know it has been over three months since you posted this and I have no idea where the Lord has taken you with it ..... but if you have not yet come to an understanding of your opening question about the Church of Sardis being called red ones ..... I believe it has to go back to the beginning in Genesis where the nature of Adam is called ruddy/red
Good to see you posting Jugghead !!!
Thanks , yes it has actually been a year and 3 months since posting this !! :laughing7:
I know that the more simplicity in Christ the better the clarity now!!
I have seen the Adam , Edom root word ruddy /red but not that connection , so thanks
Anything more to add would be appreciated :dsunny:
For me ..... I understand it in this way ..... we know that Christ has put to death the "nature" of Adam, but also, that nature casts a shadow, the spirit of Adam being a shadow to the nature of Adam "the flesh"
This is what I believe we see in religion, despite the fact that by Christ we have all been delivered from bondage (the nature of Adam by its death) the shadow (or residue) still lingers ..... and by the lingering of that spirit it has an effect of works on people ..... that they have to still do something rather than getting away from that spirit (that residue).
For you already know that we do not enter into His rest if we are still one (married) to the shadow rather than His Spirit who is in Christ
I hope to clarify , to understand your post clearer Jugghead ,,,
God knew from the start making what is weak to show His strength/ power and Glory to ALL ..
For me understanding this would be in Adam , I honestly see this as a fall from grace temporarily , Adams eating the tree of knowledge of good and evil opened up
Death and the power of satan /adversity to destroy the good though violence /bloodshed red ones ,,,, the serpent of Old is a red dragon [BEAST]
Every vile thing that opposes the HOLY SPIRIT , The law come as the shadow to put to death the deeds of the flesh and show man that there is NO GOOD THING IN THEM , we have the dead works of Babylon as proof of that
Still killing the prophets sent by God as a warning of the destruction to come doing evil from the heart of mankind and the evil that was found in him , this weakness intensified though the law [Romans 6.7 8] , the innocent for the guilty , that started with Cain and Abel
And will end in Christ Jesus the CROSS OF JESUS CHRIST is the turning around , the the path that leads to Life [ tree of life ]
The shadow of the good things to come would be sending HIS SON / LAST [ hear HIM ] and should respect HIM ,
For me can only satan accuse over the Body of Moses [ the law and body of death in Jude ] That only JESUS CHRIST THE LORD OF THE DEAD AND LIVING CAN REBUKE ,,,,
for me this is the Judgment and we have the foretelling , as it was and is and will be , as some are still bound in death / bondage to sin , and some are still bound under the Law and some are in Christ a new creation
For me personally I do believe that JESUS COME TO DESTROY the WORKS OF SATAN by rebuke and Judgment in mercy on all whom come with bended knee and surrender of will /desire , and do believe the tearing down of Babylon is also the last finished work of the LORD JESUS CHRIST BY THE SPIRIT and power of God His word is a fire and So is His Holy Spirit and fire , the world is on fire spiritually speaking to me in destruction , no flesh pleases God ,and the seed is Christ / Word is a fire and if the Lord of Sabbath /armies of heaven had not left us this seed we would all be as Sodom and Gomorrah , flying dust and ashes
and the very result of this is dust and ashes the serpents food when the flesh is done away with in Christ , the serpent will starve and burn out .
This is the short version without tons of scripture , but there is scripture lots of testimonies speaks the same things in CHRIST , His testimony is the Spirit of prophecy that our fellow brethren hold in their bosom by faith in GOD and have overcome the world by the LORD JESUS CHRIST IN THEM Same seed / same son of God ...
perhaps related to the woman riding on the scarlet beast...and one must remain for a short while........compromised church?
going to google more on Sardis....... :thumbsup:
dead=Christian in name only-void of the spirit......?virgins who run out of oil..light gone out...........
escaped from Jerusalem..but didn't make it to the wedding feast?
hi Rose,
did you say there's a verse which says red spots at your feasts.. oh I'm just being lazy.. it must be the verse in Jude.. I'll have to come back tomorrow.. (if I leave a post here, I'll be able to find the thread tomorrow if it's not on the forum home list, as you've gotten me interested..)
:hiya:
Hi Marie
I was taking the red spots as drops of blood , or drunken violence against the white robes as , pure white is holy clean
I was thinking about the scripture , Though your sins be red as crimson , you will be makes white as wool ..
I believe that spots are just certains behaviors and beliefs in mankind that are not permissible , that Paul speaks of such being the idols of worship the false prophets deceivers etc drunken wrathful and NOT SOBER ...
Like the man at the wedding feast but with no garment covering in the blood of Christ [ white robe ] he was exposed as a red '' rock '' one sinful state still under the law of death and' they Bind him hand and foot, and throw him into the outer darkness; in that place there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.'...
this could be the spots in your love feast to me ..to me the love feasts is the union in Christ and they are the rock that is not our ROCK Jesus Christ
I was surprised to see ''rock'' in the definitions for spots stoney heart perhaps ?
Young's Literal Translation
These are in your love-feasts craggy rocks; feasting together with you, without fear shepherding themselves; clouds without water, by winds carried about; trees autumnal, without fruit, twice dead, rooted up;
Isaiah 63Young's Literal Translation (YLT)
63 `Who [is] this coming from Edom? With dyed garments from Bozrah?
This that is honourable in his clothing, Travelling in the abundance of his power?' -- `
I, speaking in righteousness, mighty to save.'
2 `Wherefore [is] thy clothing red? And thy garments as treading in a wine fat?'
3 -- `A wine-press I have trodden by myself, And of the peoples there is no one with me,
And I tread them in mine anger, And I trample them in my fury, Sprinkled is their strength on my garments, And all my clothing I have polluted.
4 For the day of vengeance [is] in my heart, And the year of my redeemed hath come.
5 And I look attentively, and there is none helping, And I am astonished that there is none supporting, And give salvation to me doth mine own arm. And my wrath -- it hath supported me.
6 And I tread down peoples in mine anger, And I make them drunk in my fury, And I bring down to earth their strength.
Isaiah 63New Revised Standard Version (NRSV)
Vengeance on Edom
63 "Who is this that comes from Edom,
from Bozrah in garments stained crimson?
Who is this so splendidly robed,
marching in his great might?"
"It is I, announcing vindication,
mighty to save."
2 "Why are your robes red,
and your garments like theirs who tread the wine press?"
3 "I have trodden the wine press alone,
and from the peoples no one was with me;
I trod them in my anger
and trampled them in my wrath;
their juice spattered on my garments,
and stained all my robes.
4 For the day of vengeance was in my heart,
and the year for my redeeming work had come.
5 I looked, but there was no helper;
I stared, but there was no one to sustain me;
so my own arm brought me victory,
and my wrath sustained me.
6 I trampled down peoples in my anger,
I crushed them in my wrath,
and I poured out their lifeblood on the earth."
comparing both translations here .... both are beneficial for me anyways :friendstu:
Jesus teaches the way of peace and fruits of the Holy Spirit , it seems that those still under the law are prey when they turn around and are trampled down by the violent and drunken ones and the LORD is their helper ... I can certainly see this as a judgment of Christ IN THE EARTH of the two stones ,
from a dark /black heart to white / acquitted one free (someone) from a criminal charge by a verdict of not guilty.
"she was acquitted on all counts"
synonyms: clear, exonerate, find innocent, absolve; More
2.
conduct oneself or perform in a specified way
Our hearts are judged by the Law
two tables of stone
Jesus always says make the tree good and its fruit or make the tree corrupt a tree is known by its fruit
We know the law is good by exposing the evil and putting to death the deeds of the flesh that wars against the Spirit , till the perfect comes , being Christ an the tree of Life , giving life from the dead ..
Things can get so deep in meanings and symbolisms Marie , there is so much to learn !!!
Love ya sister !!!!!! :HeartThrob:
Hi Rose, just wondering, I have done some searching and I cannot find a direct connection between Sardis and red ones, just wondering how you made the connection?
Quote from: jugghead on January 25, 2016, 04:12:11 PM
Hi Rose, just wondering, I have done some searching and I cannot find a direct connection between Sardis and red ones, just wondering how you made the connection?
Found it is the strongs and in another bible dictionary...
here is a few called out ones , red ones http://www.bibletools.org/index.cfm/fuseaction/Def.show/RTD/Easton/ID/3223 (http://www.bibletools.org/index.cfm/fuseaction/Def.show/RTD/Easton/ID/3223)
http://classic.net.bible.org/dictionary.php?word=Sardis (http://classic.net.bible.org/dictionary.php?word=Sardis)
Strike post number four by me ..... I think I may now see what you are asking. Escaping the mindset (or mind) of the world, but since religion is the only place they think they can find God (or the understanding of Him), they may have escaped the mind of the world only to become captive to the mind of men when it comes to understanding God rather than being taken captive by the mind of Christ.
Why "red ones"? Is it a sprinkling of the blood of Christ? and by it they are given a desire to know God but seek it from men rather than the Father, the one true source. This desire becomes a desire to work rather than a desire to know God.
For most Christians they ask how can I be a better Christian rather than How can I know God better? We know ..... as we get to better know Him we are made better automatically ..... getting to know Him is the imparting of Himself to us which purifies us.
Quote from: jugghead on January 25, 2016, 05:31:16 PM
Strike post number four by me ..... I think I may now see what you are asking. Escaping the mindset (or mind) of the world, but since religion is the only place they think they can find God (or the understanding of Him), they may have escaped the mind of the world only to become captive to the mind of men when it comes to understanding God rather than being taken captive by the mind of Christ.
Why "red ones"? Is it a sprinkling of the blood of Christ? and by it they are given a desire to know God but seek it from men rather than the Father, the one true source. This desire becomes a desire to work rather than a desire to know God.
For most Christians they ask how can I be a better Christian rather than How can I know God better? We know ..... as we get to better know Him we are made better automatically ..... getting to know Him is the imparting of Himself to us which purifies us.
:thumbsup: Thanks brother ,Amen to know God is to LIVE .. though Jesus Christ our gift of great grace to mankind .
I agree we are running a race as Paul says I always wondered if those 7 hills /rulers where the woman sits and rides the beast [ red beast ] being Babylon that the five foolish virgins went to buy of and missed out on the return of Christ whom come in the night as all 10 slept , but those with Holy Oil were able to attend the marriage supper of the Lamb ..
When Jesus warns buy of Me in Revelation that golden oil [Holy Spirit that supplies the 7 lamps .. the 5 wise were given this understanding in Rev 2 an 3 as what to do and
what we are to overcome in Christ whom has given us the 7 churches [ eyes of of Light 7 SPIRITS OF GOD ] in Christ right hand of power
I have considered both in these studies in the past 18 months :dsunny: God bless