WITHOUT the Greek definition of the word "soul," how can that word "soul"[a living creature or to breath] become a euphemsim to the woman of Genesis as a soul as in the Greek sense?
From what I have read, not just on this forum, the woman represents the soul that man must get/win/woo back or at least get back in line for a type of marriage.
I understand the concept, and I find it viable, even followed it for years. I am asking now, just how it evolved or maybe I should say, reveal its self, as such for that identification?
I am asking in all sincerity. :HeartThrob:
In our language, not all of our words have either a feminine or masculine connotation . . .many do, but not all. But I'm told the Hebrew language "does" have every word connected to either a feminine or masuline connotation. . What that means is . . .if you say your name is "Jill" then I know by the feminine conotation of the name that you're a female . . .but if you say your name is "Jack" then that tells me you're a male . . .the word "soul" carries a feminine connotation.
Secondly . . .David even verifies this in Psalms where he states . .
1I will bless the LORD at all times: his praise shall continually be in my mouth.
2 My soul shall make her boast in the LORD: the humble shall hear thereof, and be glad.
3O magnify the LORD with me, and let us exalt his name together.
Quote from: Nathan on December 20, 2011, 02:25:04 AM
In our language, not all of our words have either a feminine or masculine connotation . . .many do, but not all. But I'm told the Hebrew language "does" have every word connected to either a feminine or masuline connotation. . What that means is . . .if you say your name is "Jill" then I know by the feminine conotation of the name that you're a female . . .but if you say your name is "Jack" then that tells me you're a male . . .the word "soul" carries a feminine connotation.
Secondly . . .David even verifies this in Psalms where he states . .
1I will bless the LORD at all times: his praise shall continually be in my mouth.
2 My soul shall make her boast in the LORD: the humble shall hear thereof, and be glad.
3O magnify the LORD with me, and let us exalt his name together.
Oh wow, I had never caught that in the psalms or thought about the feminine/masculine Hebrew words, great points Nathan!
Yes soul is a fem. noun. But not all translations use "her" in that Psa.34:2 I suggest this is how we can slide to create what we think. So, maybe David did not actually "verify" anything as to making the soul a "her." Something to consider rather than build on. Of course it is just my opinion. I do understand that losing the meaning or understanding of what a soul is, from its entrance into the Word, and how the Greek generates or defines a soul to be an entity in and of itself can cause a wondering.
Forgot to add this: no mention of "her" in these translations
Psa 34:2 (33:3) Mi soule schal be preisid in the Lord; mylde men here, and be glad.(Wycliffe 1395)
Psa 34:2 My soul shall make its boast in Jehovah: the meek shall hear, and rejoice.(Darby 1890)
Psa 34:2 My soule shal glory in God: the humble shall heare therof and be glad.(Bishops Bible1568)
Psa 34:2 My soule shall glory in the Lord: the humble shall heare it, and be glad.(Geneva 1587)
Psa 34:2 (34:3) My soul shall glory in the LORD; the humble shall hear thereof, and be glad.(Jewish Publication Society Translation
1917 )
Ps 34:2 My life makes its boast in the Lord; let the humble and afflicted hear and be glad.(Amp. Bible)
Psa.34:2 2 When I boast, it will be about ADONAI; the humble will hear of it and be glad. (Complete Jewish Bible David Stern)
Psa.34: 2 My soul shall make its boast in the Lord; The humble shall hear of it and be glad(New King James 1982)
Psa. 34:2 I will boast only in the Lord; let all who are helpless take heart.(New living Trans.)
Psa. 34:2 My soul makes its boast in the Lord; let the humble hear and be glad. (New Rev. Std.)
Mic,
A ship is also a she :winkgrin:
Check out ISA2
or Strong
נפשׁ
nephesh
BDB Definition:
1) soul, self, life, creature, person, appetite, mind, living being, desire, emotion, passion
1a) that which breathes, the breathing substance or being, soul, the inner being of man
1b) living being
1c) living being (with life in the blood)
1d) the man himself, self, person or individual
1e) seat of the appetites
1f) seat of emotions and passions
1g) activity of mind
1g1) dubious
1h) activity of the will
1h1) dubious
1i) activity of the character
1i1) dubious
Part of Speech: noun feminine
A Related Word by BDB/Strong's Number: from H5314
Same Word by TWOT Number: 1395a
Quote from: micah7:9 on December 20, 2011, 04:09:15 AM
Yes soul is a fem. noun. But not all translations use "her" in that Psa.34:2 I suggest this is how we can slide to create what we think. So, maybe David did not actually "verify" anything as to making the soul a "her." Something to consider rather than build on. Of course it is just my opinion. I do understand that losing the meaning or understanding of what a soul is, from its entrance into the Word, and how the Greek generates or defines a soul to be an entity in and of itself can cause a wondering.
Forgot to add this: no mention of "her" in these translations
Psa 34:2 (33:3) Mi soule schal be preisid in the Lord; mylde men here, and be glad.(Wycliffe 1395)
Psa 34:2 My soul shall make its boast in Jehovah: the meek shall hear, and rejoice.(Darby 1890)
Psa 34:2 My soule shal glory in God: the humble shall heare therof and be glad.(Bishops Bible1568)
Psa 34:2 My soule shall glory in the Lord: the humble shall heare it, and be glad.(Geneva 1587)
Psa 34:2 (34:3) My soul shall glory in the LORD; the humble shall hear thereof, and be glad.(Jewish Publication Society Translation
1917 )
Ps 34:2 My life makes its boast in the Lord; let the humble and afflicted hear and be glad.(Amp. Bible)
Psa.34:2 2 When I boast, it will be about ADONAI; the humble will hear of it and be glad. (Complete Jewish Bible David Stern)
Psa.34: 2 My soul shall make its boast in the Lord; The humble shall hear of it and be glad(New King James 1982)
Psa. 34:2 I will boast only in the Lord; let all who are helpless take heart.(New living Trans.)
Psa. 34:2 My soul makes its boast in the Lord; let the humble hear and be glad. (New Rev. Std.)
First off bro . . .there is no "creating what we think" going on here . . .I share what I see, I create nothing.
Secondly, I don't base what I see on some translation . . .I don't even base it on what's written in a book. I base it on what's written in me . . .it comes from "perspective" not interpretation.
Which leads to the third point. Because lining up the soul with the woman in me and the spirit with the man in me unlocks many more spiritual principles that lead to more depths . . .I choose to embrace what I've shared I see. The pattern just fits the nature of God too well to think that it's a translated error.
:cloud9: :thumbsup: Amen
Dead H4191 A primitive root; to die (literally or figuratively) [can I say to quit breathing and be in order?]
Body H5315 nephesh properly a breathing creature. From H5314
A primitive root; to breathe
Soul H5315 nephesh properly a breathing creature
Now in my opinion, right here the formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul.
That formed man when man becme a living soul, was a body.
And what does the Bible teach is a SOUL?
Numbers 6:6
(ASV) All the days that he separateth himself unto Jehovah he shall not come near to a dead body.
(CLV) All the days of his sequestration to Yahweh he shall not come near a dead soul.
(HOT+) כלH3605 ימיH3117 הזירוH5144 ליהוהH3068 עלH5921 נפשׁH5315 מתH4191 לאH3808 יבא׃H935
(KJV) All the days that he separateth himself unto the LORD he shall come at no dead body.
(Rotherham) All the days for which he hath separated himself unto Yahweh to no dead person, shall he go in.
(YLT) `All days of his keeping separate to Jehovah, near a dead person he doth not go;
Call the soul a her or a she, but let it be known, in my opinion, she or her, the person, the body, soul will die dead.
:cloud9: The SOULS under the altar in Revelation crying out.....so you think those are dead bodies under there crying out???
there is an inner man and an outer man. The life of the 'soul' is the blood. no forgiveness comes forth unless blood is poured out. when 'sin' entered
Adam....the blood 'congealed' like that of a dead man. Christ, and the new man in His image quickens/gives life/resurrects...those condemned to die.
scientists have discovered that our blood is actually congealed light. Blood,in the natural feeds and cherishes the body/soul/life present....so,too,
the last Adam,feeds,cherishes and clothes..gives life to our spiritual body. For this reason,Jesus said, 'you must eat my flesh and drink my blood."
Duality= tree of knowledge of good and evil[it is an evil thing death in our clay pot] only God is good....we are double garmeted......
as we bore the image of the corruptible[evil] we shall all also bear the image of the incorruptable[last Adam from heaven]
the body is more than clothes...though man be naked in shame in the dust...he shall be raised up.
One very very important lesson we must all learn from this expierence.....we will never ever be anything other than what our Father makes of us....we are all the work
of His hands....this 'humbling' of His children removes all pride and arrogance,boasting. Appreciating His grace,benevolence and love for us all...and the ceasing
of the worshipping of the works of our own hands...is paramount. Leaving behind all 'airs' of any self-righteousness....and placing faith in Him to do that
for us which we are unable to do on our own...that we will bear the image of the incorruptible last Adam from heaven....This faith in the righteousness of God.
There are those twice dead and those twice born[born in image of corruptible/born again of the incorruptible] Discern the spirits,children
spiritual offspring of God,spiritual offspring of vipers.
man of sin is the image and likeness of satan[corruptible] fallen angels...spirit creatures who kept no their proper dwelling places[subjection to God's will]
new man in Christ is the incorruptible image and likeness of the Father[if you have seen me,you have seen the Father,we are one]
His children are twice born...satans twice dead...no body no spirit...
Father educates all His offspring...He humbles in the dust[corruptible body] and exalts to heavenly places[incorruptible body]
:cloud9: Amen, beautiful.... :thumbsup:
Quote from: sheila on December 28, 2011, 06:00:31 PM
...scientists have discovered that our blood is actually congealed light.
Do you have a link to this information?
...no....I read it about 10 years ago,Beloved. I'll search and see if I can come up with it :thumbsup: :thumbsup:
I 'google' searched blood is congealed light...and a whole lot of things come up,Beloved. the christianforum.com site looks promising....as the others.
I also googled this sheila. I may need to look further, but I didn't see much/any real scientific evidence, and a whole bunch of information about a LD cult started by Gwen Shaw that teaches this. Some even call her teaching occultic. I don't really know much about the blood issue, but it may bear some further investigation. :2c:
:cloud9: I have no problem believing it, simply because all matter is in essence "congealed" or slowed down light, the light that is Spirit. By Him (Christ) and through Him and for Him, were all things created.
Also, a vision of an eclipse He gave me years ago, when I watched as the moon went behind the earth in it's oval eliptical orbit (like a valley), He spoke to me, "Yea, though I walk through the valley of death (earth/flesh dominating spirit) I will fear no evil for the Lord is with me."
When I went to the library to check out a book on astronomy to investigate it, I was stunned to read that when the light from the sun hits the earth during such an event, it blocks out all spectrums of light, save one, which actually refracts or bends around the surface of the earth to hit the moon (symbolic of the redeemed). The color? Why, red, of course. :bigGrin: The color of the blood.
ALL the heavens declare His glory.....Blessings....
Again, I don't know. Maybe it also depends on "technicality", i.e., is it an actual/literal definition, or a spiritual metaphor, etc.
For instance, I personally do have an awe of what would have been Jesus' literal blood, although I realize the most important aspect of it is/was spiritual.
This from J. Preston Eby; :dontknow:
"Let us notice one thing further. The red liquid that ran through the veins and arteries of the body of Jesus is not the blood whose power redeems mankind and all things unto God. There is no biblical basis for attributing any unusual properties to Christ's body fluids. The term "blood of Christ" is far more significant than any magical or mystical power falsely attributed to His physical blood by those who are ignorant of the truth. And here I must speak a word against one of the popular myths that has been widely circulated among God's people. Various teachers have maintained that human blood is in some mysterious way "congealed light." Now that term carries with it a certain kind of mystical aura, and a rather scientific sound. But the truth is that it is neither scientifically founded, scripturally sound, nor spiritually veracious. Blood is composed of the very same chemical and mineral substances of which the earth is made. If blood is "congealed light," then your refrigerator, automobile, house, and a bunch of bananas and a cup of coffee are just as truly congealed light! Blood is mostly water, but in the blood many substances are dissolved and in this fluid float specks of matter that do not dissolve. From the lungs it takes oxygen breathed in, and from the digestive organs it takes food substances and carries these, as well as disease-fighting cells, to all parts of the body. The liquid part of the blood greatly resembles sea water. This liquid part of the blood without all the solid particles, but including the various chemicals in the blood, is called plasma."
Another thought; everything is through, from, and to Him - including our blood. So aren't even the most literal/physical things, in essence, still spiritual in their sum essence? :dunno2:
Quote from: Cardinal on December 28, 2011, 09:35:41 PM
:cloud9: I have no problem believing it, simply because all matter is in essence "congealed" or slowed down light, the light that is Spirit. By Him (Christ) and through Him and for Him, were all things created.
At the right frequency it's possible to walk/phase trough solid objects.
QuoteAlso, a vision of an eclipse He gave me years ago, when I watched as the moon went behind the earth in it's oval eliptical orbit (like a valley), He spoke to me, "Yea, though I walk through the valley of death (earth/flesh dominating spirit) I will fear no evil for the Lord is with me."
When I went to the library to check out a book on astronomy to investigate it, I was stunned to read that when the light from the sun hits the earth during such an event, it blocks out all spectrums of light, save one, which actually refracts or bends around the surface of the earth to hit the moon (symbolic of the redeemed). The color? Why, red, of course. :bigGrin: The color of the blood.
There was one on crucifixion day.
http://www.atam.org/DNA.html
QuoteOur blood is made up of congealed light. In our DNA it has been recently discovered that there are bio-photons
Quote from: WhiteWings on December 29, 2011, 02:19:58 AM
http://www.atam.org/DNA.html
QuoteOur blood is made up of congealed light. In our DNA it has been recently discovered that there are bio-photons
I had seen that site (their main site is age to age ministries/atam.org) and have now looked at it some more. Hmmm....
does all this sound "right"?
some info from TrueLight Ministries;
Have you noticed lately that most of the big names in the Prophetic and Apostolic Movement are increasingly sprinkling the term DNA into their vocabulary?
To understand the seriousness implications of their use of the term DNA, it is important to understand that the Dominionist doctrine embraced by an increasing number of apostate ministries is straight from the occult. From the very seeds of civilization, Gnostic sects and keepers of the Gnostic Kabalistic dogma have spoken of humankind evolving into a God-like being. The Kabbala calls this being the Adam Kadmon, or "God Man." The name "Adam" refers to the entire human race and the term "Kadmon" refers to completion. Thus, Adam Kadmon speaks of a return to our beginning, with all the knowledge, wisdom, and enlightenment of the first "Adam." Those who embrace this doctrine firmly believe we can return to the Garden of Eden by becoming the Adam Kadmon and creating Heaven on Earth.
One becomes Adam Kadmon through activation of the divine nature. When enough of man kind has activated their divine nature we will evolve and become the "Corporate Christ." DNA stands for Divine Nature Activation and it is being tossed around in the Christian community like rice at a wedding. Doing a quick online search using the term DNA activation will return a myriad of occult websites for your perusal.
Adherents of these occultic beliefs claim that the inactivated part of our DNA is preventing us from becoming God. They claim we have the divinity and enlightenment of the Adam Kadmon encoded into our DNA. As more and more of us activate this Divine Nature we will corporately become the Adam Kadmon, return to the Garden, and usher in heaven on earth. Is this starting to sound familiar? It should. It is exactly what the false apostles of the prophets of the New Apostolic Reformation teach. It is also what the New Age teaches. The Dominionists cloak their beliefs and their Luciferian agenda in more palatable terms to appeal to the undiscerning. However, it makes no matter what you wrap cyanide in to make it easier to swallow; it is still going to kill you.
Below is a quote from John Lewis from Age to Age Ministries in which explains the use of this term DNA. Interestingly enough, Age to Age ministries, which I had never heard of prior to my research, claims to be a Christian ministry.
"The 97% of your DNA that's not activated is GOD waiting to be activated in man. You have the information and intelligence of Adam the son of God encoded in your DNA. Access and activation to this information will cause you to live as Adam the God-man in the Garden of your Be-in.
When Divine Nature is completely activated within man, he will be able to naturally transport himself from place to place without the aid of modern transportation. Elijah and Philip in the Bible were only examples of what will become the norm. Jesus said,
As the 97% of unused DNA is activated the 2-Strand double helix becomes a 12 –Strand DNA. Since science doesn't understand the 97%, they don't understand the purpose for the 5 extra pairs of DNA strands (shadow strands).
The 12-Strand DNA represents man coming into his Divineness. Mankind created in the image and likeness of God can be nothing less that God. Every seed must bring forth after its kind. Man is the visible expression of the invisible God. This has been the Creators plan from the beginning to multiply Himself to the point of filling All things.
Organized religion spends time shouting and screaming at their followers convincing them that they are not Gods. It seems to be their mission to deceive their followers into believing they are only human that can not think for themselves. The powers that be realize that if their followers would begin to activate the Divine Nature that would be the end of Organized Religion as we see it today."
I don't understand what's wrong with that, Jab.
It makes perfect sense to me.
I've looked at more of the context of the site...I'm not exactly "shooting them down", NOR saying the person quoted above is right about everything - just suggesting "be careful, check it out, don't just swallow whatever comes along". I realize there are also naysayers on all sides, many with their own agenda, and certainly with their own perspective.
Did you notice this part from the above carefully? "Adherents of these occultic beliefs claim that the inactivated part of our DNA is preventing us from becoming God. They claim we have the divinity and enlightenment of the Adam Kadmon encoded into our DNA. As more and more of us activate this Divine Nature we will corporately become the Adam Kadmon, return to the Garden, and usher in heaven on earth. Is this starting to sound familiar?... It is also what the New Age teaches."
will we be God? can we "activate" anything?
He also says "It is also what the New Age teaches." Often, there's just enough truth mixed in with the deceit to let it "slip through". That's why it's deceitful - we don't notice it. :2c:
Maybe it should read, "As God activates it in us?"
Yes, I believe that's more scriptural, isn't it? But that's not what everyone of that ilk teaches...that's part of what CAN make it more New Age-ish, i.e., man doing the work, making the progress, ascending...vs. God bringing about HIS will. :thumbsup:
Again, I just think we need to be careful, WHILE not quenching the Spirit. Not an easy task...
Discernment.
This guy's probably right about many things. For example, he says Jesus came for all. Good. But then other things sort of set off warning bells for me. I believe it should be "tested", to see if it's of God - not just automatically accepted.
So, back to the blood = congealed light thing. He might be right about that, but in checking things out, I also like to consider the source of the information. So right now we have J. Preston Eby and John Lewis' opinion on it. Is there any 1) solid scientific evidence, and 2) solid scientific evidence that doesn't contradict scripture?
:smile: That's why I don't worry too much about that stuff. I don't know about "being God" or being able to ascend or whatever... I do know that we are becoming one with Him (and each other) and that He is doing His work in us. If the whole 12 strand DNA stuff has anything to do with it it is very cool and it sounds like it very well could be true. The original Scientist is pretty amazing!
No I don't think we can activate our own DNA lol. But, let them knock themselves out trying.
I do think, however, it's a good possibility that this is how God will change us in the 'twinkling of an eye.' He'll just 'flip a switch,' and turn on our DNA.
Adam is called God-man in the garden [or god-man or God's man]. He's called al Adam.
I also believe we are created to be immortal, co-inheritors with Christ, and gods--Y'shuah elohiym.
I see a subtle but HUGE difference between God-man and god-man, and especially God's man. And IMO, that's where deceit can be missed. Take the truth and tweak it JUST a little bit, and that sets the trajectory in the wrong direction.
Given all the other being true that you've said about our DNA, immortality, etc., as both you and Lomarah said and with which I agree, God will be the One doing it, not man as we ascend into our "potential". :2c:
Who knows what they've done behind the scenes. I'm sure they've cloned people because they couldn't resist.
New Age just takes the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob out of the equation [as if they could].
But, a lot of other stuff remains the same.
This site didn't seem to be new age to me, but I read it quickly.
I don't know about the 'congealed light' thing, but I also believe our glorified bodies will not have blood.
Jesus called himself flesh and bones.
Look at my hands and my feet. It is I myself! Touch me and see; a ghost does not have flesh and bones, as you see I have." [Lk 24:39]
Quote from: Molly on December 29, 2011, 04:22:37 AM
Who knows what they've done behind the scenes. I'm sure they've cloned people because they couldn't resist.
New Age just takes the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob out of the equation [as if they could].
But, a lot of other stuff remains the same.
This site didn't seem to be new age to me, but I read it quickly.
yes.
i'm not saying it IS, and I know Tony didn't mean it that way by posting it...just probably several sides to look at, many opinions and sources of info to consider...and IF he says we will be
God and can activate this ascension ourselves, then...
back to my original statement too...don't know about the blood...interesting to consider.
Quote from: Molly on December 29, 2011, 04:30:44 AM
I don't know about the 'congealed light' thing, but I also believe our glorified bodies will not have blood.
Jesus called himself flesh and bones.
Look at my hands and my feet. It is I myself! Touch me and see; a ghost does not have flesh and bones, as you see I have." [Lk 24:39]
Blood is part of a flesh and bones body. If taken to literal it means Jesus had no hair and nails.
I think it's just a idiom.
Quote from: WhiteWings on December 29, 2011, 01:42:22 PM
Quote from: Molly on December 29, 2011, 04:30:44 AM
I don't know about the 'congealed light' thing, but I also believe our glorified bodies will not have blood.
Jesus called himself flesh and bones.
Look at my hands and my feet. It is I myself! Touch me and see; a ghost does not have flesh and bones, as you see I have." [Lk 24:39]
Blood is part of a flesh and bones body. If taken to literal it means Jesus had no hair and nails.
I think it's just a idiom.
Flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God.
He poured out his blood for the remission of sin.
This is my blood of the covenant, which is poured out for many for the forgiveness of sins.
--Mat 26:28
Quote from: WhiteWings on December 29, 2011, 02:16:38 AM
Quote from: Cardinal on December 28, 2011, 09:35:41 PM
:cloud9: I have no problem believing it, simply because all matter is in essence "congealed" or slowed down light, the light that is Spirit. By Him (Christ) and through Him and for Him, were all things created.
At the right frequency it's possible to walk/phase trough solid objects.
Yes, I know. I had that sense of no mass to my body, for a few days after my conversion experience and the fast He had me on. My mother turned around watching me gingerly approaching the fridge with my hand, because I wanted to see if it could go through it. I could see my spiritual body through my flesh, as cells of golden light, that were vibrating very fast. Shook her Catholic foundations a bit. :laughing7:
QuoteAlso, a vision of an eclipse He gave me years ago, when I watched as the moon went behind the earth in it's oval eliptical orbit (like a valley), He spoke to me, "Yea, though I walk through the valley of death (earth/flesh dominating spirit) I will fear no evil for the Lord is with me."
When I went to the library to check out a book on astronomy to investigate it, I was stunned to read that when the light from the sun hits the earth during such an event, it blocks out all spectrums of light, save one, which actually refracts or bends around the surface of the earth to hit the moon (symbolic of the redeemed). The color? Why, red, of course. :bigGrin: The color of the blood.
There was one on crucifixion day.
That's because the Redeemer (moon/sons redeemed with silver, the color of the moon, no light of it's own it reflects the light) was "behind/covered by the earth", because the Father could not bear to look upon His Son at that moment. AND because if the Father didn't hide His face from the Son, He couldn't die. My :2c:
:cloud9: Regarding the DNA.....I can kinda see what they're saying, and this is truth in it, but it's just off center enough to be New Age contaminated, because it exalts the spirit that sent it, ie. man. We of ourselves cannot activate anything, nor are we God.
The New Age error simplified, is this equation:
they think 1(Head) = 1(Head), but in reality, it's 1 (the Head/husband) + 1 (the body/wife) = 1.
We were one with Him from the foundation, as a man and his bride are one. We have no glory of our own, but only a reflected glory, which is the lesser glory. ALL glory belongs to Him and Him alone.
He gave me a dream last month about this vainglory spirit that is raised up right now in the body. It was in the garden, and the sons are set to return to the garden now, and it's assignment is to make them fall as it did the first time around.
Eve desired what SHE could perceive to make her wise and like God (even if it had no LIFE of the Spirit in it), instead of what she needed the Spirit to discern. We've all fallen prey to that spirit. My :2c: Blessings...
We are not God, the mistake the New Agers make,
But we have this treasure in jars of clay, to show that the surpassing power belongs to God and not to us. [2Cor 4:7]
wow, a lot of in depth posts here.guys.
the sacredness of blood.....blood and covenants...symbolically blood signifies life and the covenant of life in God...the giver of life. Blood in our heart...
blood on the doorpost..blood sprinkled on the altar...bought with blood..blood money of Judas...the potters field bought with blood..our life redeemed
n through His son's blood.
no agenda here, your posts just have me in awe of the spiritual significance of blood. I had a dream vision a year or so,ago. where copious amounts of blood were coming
forth from my nose[nose signifies discernment of spirits] I never really understood what the spirit was saying about it.
:cloud9: Amen.....Jesus gave up His natural blood, and the Spririt Seed within Him, gave up HIS blood (turned over His kingdom to the Father, ie. into Your hands I commend my SPIRIT). He had to do this or the Comforter could not come, ie. no bearing of much fruit/many-membered seed/sons. This is why He said Abraham's SEED, and not seeds, because Christ is one seed, apportioned to us, ie. the earnest (means portion) of our inheritance. Our inheritance is God Himself.
The job of the Holy Ghost is take us to the cross; some will go kicking and screaming, but ALL will go one way or another. As Sheila said He said to her once, "we can do this the hard way or we can do this the easy way", LOL....
Quote from: Cardinal on December 29, 2011, 03:54:23 PM
:cloud9: Regarding the DNA.....I can kinda see what they're saying, and this is truth in it, but it's just off center enough to be New Age contaminated, because it exalts the spirit that sent it, ie. man. We of ourselves cannot activate anything, nor are we God.
The New Age error simplified, is this equation:
they think 1(Head) = 1(Head), but in reality, it's 1 (the Head/husband) + 1 (the body/wife) = 1.
How does the old man/new man come into this equation? It is no longer I that lives but christ in me?
thanks
:cloud9: What I was referring to, was their twisting of what being one with Him from the foundation means, ie. pre being lowered into vanity. Their view is that oneness means we were/are Him, not that we were/are now in Spirit, one with Him as a man with his bride is. Blessings...
Quote from: jabcat on December 29, 2011, 03:58:28 AM
He also says "It is also what the New Age teaches." Often, there's just enough truth mixed in with the deceit to let it "slip through". That's why it's deceitful - we don't notice it. :2c:
Same site http://www.atam.org/Elul13.html
QuoteJust as people are born under the influence of the 12 Zodiac signs, so are nations and all of nature.
Sounds like astrology. God gave the stars as a way to time things. So astronmy and astrology are related.
Precession (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Axial_precession_(astronomy)) is a concept that perhaps tells us something.
At the same time each year the sun is at the same place in a certain concstelation. (Zodiac sign)
But not exactly. The sun appears to be moving slowly trough the zodiac.
Adam and Eve were created near the point Passover moved from Taurus/Bull to Aries/Ram.
A historian that lived a few decades after Jesus died wrote that God led the Jews out of Egypt when the sun was in Aries.
But near Jesus' death the sun moved into Pices/fishes. Again ONLY considering passover day!
2900 AD the sun will move out of Pices into Aquarius/water bearer/Mark 14:13
Note all mentioned years are just a guideline. Precision: decades.....
http://www.godfire.net/eby/rev-12.html
QuoteVarious teachers have maintained that human blood is in some mysterious way "congealed light." Now that term carries with it a certain kind of mystical aura, and a rather scientific sound. But the truth is that it is neither scientifically founded, scripturally sound, nor spiritually veracious. Blood is composed of the very same chemical and mineral substances of which the earth is made. If blood is "congealed light," then your refrigerator, automobile, house, and a bunch of bananas and a cup of coffee are just as truly congealed light!
REDEFINING THE SOUL
Ever notice all the talk about the soul in church?
"Your soul is in danger of eternal hellfire!"
"Believe in Jesus or you will lose your soul..."
There's an intangible, inexplicable sense about this word in the modern
Christianity. When asked, most Christians will hem haw, trying to explain
the soul as something like this: "A person is both body and soul. The body
is the physical flesh-and-blood temporary 'shell.' The soul is the
nonmaterial, intangible, immortal aspect. At death the soul leaves the
body, and lives on consciously forever in either heaven or hell."
I'm going to make the case that we've been wrong—dead wrong. This
is another critical Bible word that I believe has been way misconstrued
(and mistranslated) to mean something it does not. It has taken on a soul
of it's own, if you will, and the result is that many a soul has been lost in
wrong conclusions (not hell, thankfully)!
What is a Soul?
Translators have made an utter mess of the Greek and Hebrew words
for soul, and as a result, have contributed to the huge distortion of this
once simple word. The Hebrew and Greek words for soul are nephesh and
psuche respectively, both nouns, yet this one little word has been
unbelievably mistranslated as a myriad of other words. Here are but a few
of many: life, death, corpse, heart, endure, myself, desire, greedy, hunger,
heartily, perfume, slave, strength, fish, thirst, throat, mind, suspense, thing—oh
yes, and soul. You'll notice that within the list of words, each of which have
radically different meanings, are also verbs, adjectives, adverbs, and
pronouns.
What is the reason for such sloppy translation? Nephesh and psuche
are translated correctly in all the passages where translators wish to
convey the concept of the immortality of the soul and it's supposed
potential for "everlasting destruction." However, passages that would
nullify the notion of the soul's immortality, when translated correctly, are
masked with an assortment of misleading words. Let's bring some clarity
to the definition of soul using Scripture:
Genesis 2:7: "And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the
ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man
wonder how many other significant things you read that have not been
translated correctly. Certainly by now you have come to realize it happens
frequently.
When Translators Lost Their Souls
The truth about the soul has been almost completely concealed in
modern Bibles. Consider the word translators most often substitute in
place of soul, and that is life. Hebrew and Greek each have a specific word
for life (chayay and zoe, respectively), so there was no need to "improve
on" or interpret the original intent of the writers of Scripture. In fact, there
are many verses where both of these words occur together, showing that
they are not interchangeable. Looking again at the same two verses above:
Genesis 2:7: "And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the
ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life (chayay); and
man BECAME a living (chay) soul (nephesh)" (KJV).
1 Corinthians 15:45: "So also it is written, 'The first man, Adam,
BECAME a living (zoe) soul (psuche). The last Adam became a life
(zoe)-giving spirit."
Now, using the word life in and of itself is not so bad or far off of the
true meaning of soul, but the problem is the way nephesh and psuche
have been calculatingly and intentionally mistranslated, misleading people
to think that the soul is immortal and can be damned forever. Whenever a
passage is about something that carries a negative connotation such as
being lost or destroyed, translators correctly use the word soul. Whenever
a passage conveys temporal existence or carries a positive or neutral
connotation, they swap soul for the word life. To help you understand the
significance of this more clearly, I'm going to give several verse examples.
The italicized and bolded word in each of these verses is soul in the
original text, not life:
Genesis 9:5: "Surely I will require your lifeblood; from every beast I
will require it. And from every man, from every man's brother I will
require the life of man." In order to keep up the fallacy of the immortality
of soul, translators would not be able to give an accurate rendering of this
verse because in context, God requires the death of every soul.
Exodus 4:19: "Now the LORD said to Moses in Midian, 'Go back to
Egypt, for all the men who were seeking your life are dead.'"
Leviticus 17:11: "For the life of the flesh is in the blood, and I have
given it to you on the altar to make atonement for your souls; for it is the
blood by reason of the life that makes atonement." Notice now nephesh
occurs three times in this verse but is translated two different ways at
whim, attempting to convey a completely skewed picture to the reader.
Leviticus 17:14: "As for the life of all flesh, its blood is identified with
its life."
Deuteronomy 19:21: "Thus you shall not show pity: life for life, eye for
eye, tooth for tooth, hand for hand, foot for foot."
Psalm 31:13: "For I have heard the slander of many, terror is on every
side; while they took counsel together against me, they schemed to take
away my life."
Matthew 2:20: "Get up, take the Child [Jesus] and His mother, and go
into the land of Israel; for those who sought the Child's life are dead."
Matthew 6:25: "For this reason I say to you, do not be worried about
your life, as to what you will eat or what you will drink; nor for your
body, as to what you will put on. Is not (the) life more than food, and the
body more than clothing?"
Matthew 10:28: "Do not fear those who kill the body but are unable to
kill the soul; but rather fear Him who is able to destroy both soul and body
in hell (Gehenna)."* Why is soul suddenly translated correctly where it is
speaking of being destroyed, the translator intent suggesting in hell?
Matthew 16:25–26: "For whoever wishes to save his life will lose it; but
whoever loses his life for My sake will find it. For what will it profit a man
if he gains the whole world and forfeits his soul? Or what will a man give
in exchange for his soul?" Again, psuche is used by New Testament
writers four times here, not two! We are told to intentionally lose (give up)
our own soul here in the Greek text, but this would not be good for
Sunday morning theology. Also, the word chosen by translators, "forfeits,"
BECAME a living soul (nephesh)" (KJV).
1 Corinthians 15:45: "So also it is written, 'The first man, Adam,
BECAME a living soul* (psuche). The last Adam became a life-giving
spirit."
According to the Scriptures, a person does not HAVE a soul. Each
person IS a living soul. Your soul is the sum total of you—your body,
mind, will, emotions, and spirit (breath). No one part of it can be separated
from the rest or it is no longer you. You were brought to life as a living
soul. I should briefly mention the concept of "spirit." Our spirit, as I
understand it, is the breath of God that brings us to life and sustains us
until our physical death. In Ecclesiastics 12:7 we learn that, at death, our
spirit goes back to God while our body goes back to the ground, awaiting
resurrection. What about our "soul" at death? Well, since I believe our soul
is the total of us (body, intellect, will, spirit), it is basically put away until
God resurrects us back to life all in one piece again.
Actually, any created creature—man or beast—that has breath and blood
is called a soul, although you might not glean this from reading most
modern translations. For instance, in Genesis 1:20 and 24, where God is
creating the sea and land animals, here is how the original language text
reads, "Then God said, 'Let the waters teem with swarms of living souls
(nephesh)...Let the earth bring forth living souls after their kind."
Feel free to look up the words in a concordance for yourself (or you can
check the Darby Translation on Studylight.org—they translated this
passage correctly).
Pretty nifty, huh? When such mistranslating happens in the very first
chapter of the Bible, twisting such an important concept, it should make you
is a completely blatant, biased (aggravating) mistranslation. It is Strong's
#2210, zemioo, and should be "does damage to" or "suffers loss to."*
Matthew 20:28: "...just as the Son of Man did not come to be served,
but to serve, and to give His life a ransom for many."† Did you know that
Jesus gave His soul for you? This would not be possible based on modern
theological teachings that want you to think the soul is immortal and only
dies when it is eternally damned.
How Soul was Influenced by Greek Mythology
Hopefully by now you see how important it is to scrutinize verses and
themes you have always taken for granted, and you realize also that you
don't have to be a pastor or have a doctorate in theology to see how we've
been misled. And now perhaps you're still wondering where the whole
teaching of the immortal, intangible soul came from, if not from the Bible.
In his book, The Subversion of Christianity, French author Jacques Ellul
explains:
"A familiar example of the mutation to which revelation was
actually subjected is its contamination by the Greek idea of the
immortality of the soul. I will briefly recall it. In Jewish thought death
is total. There is no immortal soul, no division of body and soul. Paul's
thinking is Jewish in this regard. ...The soul is as mortal as the body.
But there is a resurrection. Out of the nothingness that human life
becomes, God creates anew the being that was dead. There is a
creation by grace; there is no immortal soul intrinsic to us. Greek
philosophy, however, introduces among theologians the idea of the
immortal soul. The belief was widespread in popular religion and it
was integrated into Christianity. But it is a total perversion.
Everything is not now dependent on the grace of God, and assurance
of immortality comes to be evaluated by virtues and works. All
Christian thinking is led astray by this initial mutation that comes
through Greek philosophy and Near Eastern cults.
"An ardent work brings to light this type of deformation. Louis
Rougier, in his L'Astronomie et Religion en Occident (Paris: PUF, 1980),
shows how belief in the soul's celestial immortality arose in the second
half of the fifth century B.C. on the basis of astronomy. Pythagorean
astronomy radically transformed the idea of the destiny of the soul
held by Mediterranean peoples. For the notion of a vital breath that
dissipates at death, for belief in a survival of shades wandering about
in the subterranean realm of the dead, it substitutes the notion of a
soul of celestial substance exiled in this world. This idea completely
contaminates biblical thinking, gradually replaces the affirmation of
the resurrection, and transforms the kingdom of the dead into the
kingdom of God.
"Successive generations have reinterpreted Scripture and
modeled it after their own cultures, thus moving society further from
the truth of the original gospel. The church also perverted the gospel
message, for instead of simply doing away with pagan practice and
belief, it reconstituted the sacred, set up its own religious forms, and
thus resacralized the world."63
Historian and archeologist, Keith Stump, provides some additional
information on where the idea of immortality of soul originated, even
before the Greeks:
"The idea of an 'immortal soul' long predates the founding of
today's major religions. The ancient Greek historian Herodotus (5th
century B.C.) tells us in his History that the ancient Egyptians were the
first to teach that the soul of man is separable from the body, and
immortal. This Egyptian idea was centuries before Judaism,
Hinduism, Buddhism, Christianity and Islam came onto the scene.
"The pagan Greeks got the concept of an immortal soul from the
Egyptians! The foremost advocate among the ancient Greeks of the
idea of an 'immortal soul' was the Athenian philosopher Plato (428–
348 B.C.), the pupil of Socrates. ...It was Plato who popularized the
immortal soul concept throughout the Greek world. [Ancient Greek
and Roman writers] suggest that he may have simply popularized
what he knew to be a fiction as a means of keeping the citizenry in line
through the fear of mysterious 'unseen things' beyond this life.
"The immortal soul concept, in other words, was a necessary companion
doctrine to the doctrine of the terrible torments of parts of Hades or hell. Such
fearsome teachings, some philosophers thought, were necessary to scare the
masses into being good citizens.
Plato and the Jews
"The Jewish communities of antiquity were deeply influenced by
Greek philosophical ideas. Many will suppose that the Platonic view
of the soul imprisoned in the flesh would have been nothing new to
the Jews. But notice the testimony of Jewish scholars themselves:
"'The belief that the soul continues its existence after the
dissolution of the body is...nowhere expressly taught in Holy
Scripture. ...The belief in the immortality of the soul came to the Jews
from contact with Greek thought and chiefly through the philosophy
of Plato its principle exponent, who was led to it through Orphic and
Eleusinian mysteries in which Babylonian and Egyptian views were
strangely blended' (The Jewish Encyclopedia article, 'Immortality of the
Soul').
"But what of the professing Christian world? Certainly here we
should find the doctrine of an immortal soul independent of any
Greek influence. Now consider this fact: Many of the early theologians
and scholars of the professing Christian religion—including such men
as Origen, Tertullian, and Augustine—were closely associated with
Platonism.
"Tertullian (A.D. 155–220), for example, wrote: 'For some things
are known even by nature: the immortality of the soul, for instance, is
held by many...I may use, therefore, the opinion of Plato, when he
declares: "Every soul is immortal"' (The Ante-Nicene Fathers, vol. III).
"Augustine of Hippo (A.D. 354–430)—held to be the greatest
thinker of Christian antiquity—also taught the immaterial and
spiritual nature of the human soul. But notice the source of his
teachings. The Encyclopedia Britannica states, '[Augustine] fused the
religion of the New Testament with the Platonic tradition of Greek
philosophy.'
228 REDEFINING THE SOUL
"Why should those early professing Christian scholars have
resorted to the opinions of a pagan Greek philosopher? Could it be
that the immortal soul doctrine is not clearly supported in Christian
Scripture? Throughout the centuries of professing Christianity,
innumerable sermons have been preached and countless pamphlets
written purporting to prove the soul's immortality. Upon careful and
open-minded examination, they are all found to be riddled with
surprising error. ...The doctrine of the immortal soul is built on a
foundation of biblical mistranslations, false premises, and sloppy
scholarship. Few had the spiritual courage to take a fresh,
unprejudiced look at the question and accept the true Bible teaching.
For when the false doctrine of the immortal soul is toppled, along with
it falls the equally pagan and false concept of heaven and hell—one of
the cornerstones of traditional Christianity!"64
Every Soul Must Die
God declares that every soul must die (Gen. 9:4–5). In reality, this is the
curse of Adam, not eternal separation from God or eternal death. Adam
brought the death of soul, or the death of every living, breathing, warmblooded
person (and animal). And when you understand this, it is easy to
see that the gift Jesus brought to all mankind is life back from the dead
through resurrection.
"So then as through one transgression there resulted condemnation to
all men, even so through one act of righteousness there resulted
justification of life to all men" (Romans 5:18).
"We know love by this, that He laid down His soul for us; and we
ought to lay down our souls for the brethren" (1 John 3:16, MLT).
Once so muddled and misleading, now such a simple, beautiful truth.
We've made quite a journey together, but we're not quite finished yet!
Now that we've come to the end of our Hebrew perspectives, I'd like to
share some of my recent reflections with you—my own personal take on
The Story. Through some unexpected life parallels, I feel like I've come to
see a glimpse of the heavenly Parent's heart. These thoughts, however
humanly flawed, have continued to favorably transform my view of God
and life.
:happyclap: :dsunny: :banana: :eek:
I WAS TOLD I HAD TWO SOULS..ONE THE IMAGE OF THE CORRUPT ONE...THE OTHER MADE
IN THE IMAGE OF THE INCORRUPTIBLE ONE. THE SOUL THAT IS SINNING WILL DIE....
THE OTHER ONE LIVE FOREVER................IT WAS A GREAT MERCY OF FATHER THAT WE NOT
REMAIN IN THE CORRUPT IMAGE FOREVER....BUT BE SET FREE FROM IT
I GIVE YOU JESUS WORDS..LAZARUS SLEEPS..I GO TO AWAKEN HIM.......
LORD...WHO SOWED THE TARES?..AN ENEMY HAS DONE THIS.........GOD SOWED WHEAT IN THE FEILD...
THE SEED OF THE TRUE BREAD FROM HEAVEN[FOR THE LAMB WAS SLAIN BEFORE THE FOUNDING OF
THE WORLD] WE ARE ALL SEED OF THAT BREAD FROM HEAVEN SOWN IN THE EARTH..LIFE-GIVING
SPIRIT...THIS IS THE HIDDEN MANNA-THE BREAD OF THE LITTLE CHILDREN OF THE KINGDOM
TO HIM WHO OVERCOMES..I WILL GIVE SOME OF THE HIDDEN MANNA.
THE FIELD HAS BOTH IN IT...LIFE AND DEATH..CORRUPT AND INCORRUPT
DO YOU NOT KNOW..THAT UNLESS A SEED OF WHEAT FALL TO THE EARTH AND DIE...
IT CAN NOT BEAR FRUIT UNTO HEAVEN
CHRIST IN YOU..THE HOPE OF GLORY...CHRIST=ZOE=LIFE-GIVING SPIRIT IN YOU....
YOU HAVE NO LIFE IN YOURSELF[FALL TO EARTH AND DIE] YOU MUST REMAIN IN ME[REMNANT]
I AM BRINGING IN MY SERVANT SPROUT..=WHEAT UP OUT OF SOIL AND BEARING FRUIT TO HEAVEN=
WHEAT IN STOREHOUSE=BREAD IN MY HOUSE
FOR YOU HAVE BEEN WITH ME FROM THE BEGINNING= IN THE BEGINNING GOD SAID...
LET US MAKE MAN IN OUR IMAGE AND LIKENESS...............
OF THE SAME LUMP....VESSEL OF HONOUR VESSEL OF DISHONOUR
"I WAS TOLD I HAD TWO SOULS." shelia
You was told wrong.........UNLESS you have a verse of scripture to show that to be so. In fact, show me a scripture or verse that says you were given ONE soul.
though our outer man perish,yet our inner man is renewed day by day.....
double souled. =soul that is sinning will die and Christ in us the new man
outer man inner man=two souls very distinct from one another
there is a terrestial and a celestial.......now you are the body of Christ...if we are to have
the mind of Christ and the body of Christ. and spirit of Christ.....then He has given us His soul
but someone may ask, How are the dead raised? With what kind of body will they come?
How FOOLISH!!! WHAT YOU SOW DOES NOT COME TO LIFE UNLESS IT DIES...
WHEN YOU SOW YOU DO NOT PLANT THE BODY THAT WILL BE, BUT JUST A SEED
PERHAPS OF WHEAT OR OF SOMETHING ELSE[TARE?]..BUT GOD GIVES IT A BODY
AS HE HAS DETERMINED...AND TO EACH KIND OF SEED HE GIVES IT'S OWN BODY
....IT IS SOWN A NATURAL BODY..IT IS RAISED A SPIRITUAL BODY
NOTICE TWO BODIES? TWO MINDS= ADVERSARY OR cHRIST..TWO HEARTS TWO SPIRITS
TWO SOULS
Quote from: micah7:9 on September 28, 2012, 12:27:46 AM
:happyclap: :dsunny: :banana: :eek:
Now never assume people don't answer your questions Micah :punish:
Just be patient because it can take a year :gimmefive:
Hmmm two soles, How blessed are the feet of them ;o)
Many have the view that the soul is immortal and separate from the body. However, the Bible provides a different understanding. Of the soul, the Bible says that it can be "cut off" or put to death, at Leviticus 7:20, saying: "But the soul that eateth of the flesh of the sacrifice of peace offerings, that pertain unto the Lord, having his uncleanness upon him, even that soul shall be cut off from his people."(King James Bible)
Thus it can eat, for verse 25 also says: "For whosoever eateth the fat of the beast, of which men offer an offering made by fire unto the Lord, even the soul that eateth it shall be cut off from his people", that the soul can "be afflicted" at Leviticus 16:29, that God condemns it for "eating blood" at Leviticus 17:10 and 12, that the soul can touch something "unclean" and be "unclean" itself, at Leviticus 22:6, that it can be purchased, at Leviticus 22:11, that it works and can be destroyed (therefore not immortal), at Leviticus 23:30, that it can " pine away" at Leviticus 26:16, that animals are souls at Numbers 31:28, that it has a desire to eat at Deuteronomy 12:15 and 20, that the soul can crave for "oxen...sheep...wine" at Deuteronomy 14:26, that Joshua destroyed all the souls of Makkedah at Joshua 10:28, that it has blood at Jeremiah 2:34 and that it is not immortal, for Peter said: "And it shall come to pass, that every soul, which will not hear that prophet, shall be destroyed from among the people."(Acts 3:23 King James Bible)
Hence, just what is the soul ? What is it that eats, that can touch something, that can be "afflicted", that can be "destroyed" ? The soul is us as a person, with all our feelings and desires, with blood flowing through our veins. Hence, at Genesis 2:7, of Adam the Scripture says that "the Lord God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul." (King James Bible)
The apostle Paul reiterated this at 1 Corinthians 15:45, saying that "And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit."(King James Bible) Therefore, God did not place a soul in Adam, but rather, he "became a living soul". Before God "breathed into his nostrils the breath of life", Adam was a dead soul.
At Ezekiel 18:4, it says that the "Behold, all souls are mine; as the soul of the father, so also the soul of the son is mine: the soul that sinneth, it shall die."(King James Bible) Thus, we as souls, sin, and eventually die. The Hebrew word for soul is ne´phesh (Greek psy·khe´ ) and evidently comes from a root meaning "breathe" and in a literal sense ne´phesh could be rendered as "a breather."
The word soul can also be rendered as a person's life, for Jesus said that " And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell (hades, Greek)."(Matt 10:28 King James Bible) Thus, one's future life or "soul" or you as a person being resurrected is dependent upon not fearing those who can "kill the body" or present life.
However, Greek philosophers, such as Socrates (469-399 B.C.E.), Plato (428-347 B.C.E.) and Aristotle (384-322 B.C.E.) of Athens, Greece, promoted the belief of the immortality of the soul. Greek philosophical teachings later influenced so-called Christians to also promote the religious belief in the immortality of the soul, such as the writer of the apocryphal writing of the Wisdom of Solomon, employing Platonic terminology in advancing the doctrine of the immortality of the human soul.
Greek Orthodox Metropolitan Methodius of Pisidia wrote the book The Hellenic Pedestal of Christianity in order to show that Greek culture and philosophy provided the infrastructure of modern "Christian" thought. In that book, he unhesitantly admits: "Almost all the prominent Church Fathers considered the Greek elements most useful, and they borrowed them from the Greek classical antiquity, using them as a means to understand and correctly express the Christian truths."
Plato quotes Socrates as saying: "The soul, . . . if it departs pure, dragging with it nothing of the body, . . . goes away into that which is like itself, into the invisible, divine, immortal, and wise, and when it arrives there it is happy, freed from error and folly and fear . . . and all the other human ills, and . . . lives in truth through all after time with the gods."—Phaedo, 80, D, E; 81, A. This false religious teaching influenced Jewish thinking, along with the idea of an underworld place of torment after death.
:welcome:
Quote from: jaareshiah on October 18, 2012, 05:07:19 AM
Hence, just what is the soul ? What is it that eats, that can touch something, that can be "afflicted", that can be "destroyed" ? The soul is us as a person, with all our feelings and desires, with blood flowing through our veins.
Clear list of verses; but what about this one?
Mat 10:28 Do not be afraid of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul. Rather, be afraid of the One who can destroy both soul and body in hell.
If the soul is a person then what is that verse about? Replacing the word soul with body in that verse gives an odd reading.
Quote from: eaglesway on September 30, 2012, 05:13:17 AM
Hmmm two soles, How blessed are the feet of them ;o)
:winkgrin:
Quote from: WhiteWings on October 18, 2012, 08:17:01 AM
:welcome:
Quote from: jaareshiah on October 18, 2012, 05:07:19 AM
Hence, just what is the soul ? What is it that eats, that can touch something, that can be "afflicted", that can be "destroyed" ? The soul is us as a person, with all our feelings and desires, with blood flowing through our veins.
Clear list of verses; but what about this one?
Mat 10:28 Do not be afraid of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul. Rather, be afraid of the One who can destroy both soul and body in hell.
If the soul is a person then what is that verse about? Replacing the word soul with body in that verse gives an odd reading.
:2c: :2c: :2c: :2c: :2c: :2c: :2c: :2c:
it is the soul and the body of the person. A person is composed of spirit soul and body. the heart of the person is the place where the three are joined in one. the heart is the throne, if Jesus sits on it then there is glory in the temple. The spirit of God floods the temple. The temple is the heart(golden altar of incense) the holy of holies(the spirit) the holy place(the soul) the outer court(the body). For those who live in the outer court there are sacrifices a plenty and bloodshed all over the place. But Paul exhorts , Yield your body as a living sacrifice.....(move up the stairs to the holy place) be not conformed to this world(carnal-outer court) rather be transformed by the renewing of your mind (Lampstand and fellowship/shewbread in the holy place)....so that you may prove what the will of God is, what is good acceptable and perfect( the fire consumes the acceptable offering, the glory fills the temple) and so proceed into the holy of holies - "walk in the spirit" so that you do not fulfill the lusts of the flesh. walking in the spirit is living in the holy of holies, renewed in the spirit of your mind, transformed into the image of Christ from a broken and a contrite heart.
So your view is that soul in not the body?
About the rest of your post (where the throne is) are, as usual, different views.
No, I believe the soul is in the body, equivalent to the middle court of the temple
Quote from: WhiteWings on October 18, 2012, 08:48:02 AM
So your view is that soul in not the body?
About the rest of your post (where the throne is) are, as usual, different views.
:2c: :2c: :2c: :2c: :2c: :2c:
Not really so different. Many hold that the heart is the highest seat of consciousness in man. Paul speaks of "the eyes of your heart" being enlightened. In the same letter he speaks of "being strengthened with might by His spirit in your inner man".
Blessed are the pure in heart, for they shall see God, and, "love the Lord your God with all your heart(kardia), mind(dionia deep meditation) and soul(psuche)
We know that "where your heart is there will your treasure be also". The eye is the "window" of the soul. We see flames in Jesus eyes because the Spirit has completely filled His soul and His heart is perfect in zeal for God.
"having your hearts cleaned from an evil consciousness and your bodies washed with pure water" we have bold access into the holy place (Hebrews)
Of course, I am not at all interested in establishing a systematic theology for the construction of the inner man. I am just sharing some things I see through a glass darkly.
The consciousness of man is in the heart(eyes of the heart enlightened, heart cleansed from an evil consciousness)
The will of man is in the heart(where your heart is there will your treasure be also)
A broken and a contrite heart cleanses the spirit(Create in me a clean heart of God and renew a right spirit within me)
The LORD is nigh unto them that are of a broken heart; and saveth such as be of a contrite spirit.
(Psa 34:18)
Psa 77:6 I call to remembrance my song in the night: I commune with mine own heart: and my spirit made diligent search.
Pro 15:13 A merry heart maketh a cheerful countenance: but by sorrow of the heart the spirit is broken.
Eze 11:19 And I will give them one heart, and I will put a new spirit within you; and I will take the stony heart out of their flesh, and will give them an heart of flesh:
Heb 4:12 For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner(making manifest) of the thoughts and intents of the heart.
The soul and the spirit can be divided asunder and indeed must be before the secrets of the heart are manifest. Three things here in this verse- soul, spirit, heart. connected yet different, perhaps as the lungs , brain and heart are to the body, so the spirit soul and heart are to the BEING.
If one lives for physical pleasure and appetites they are living in the flesh, under the dominion of the body.
If one lives for the "pride of the eyes and the pride of life and the pleasures of the mind" they are living under the dominion of the soul(this wisdom is not from below but is earthly, "soulish(psuche) and demonic").
If a person yields there body as a living sacrifice and is transformed by the spirit as they behold His face because their "eye is single" and "the whole body is full of light" then they are living under the dominion of the spirit, walking in the spirit, because
their heart is right and their treasure is in Christ and the kingdom of God.
It is as the heart that decides the matter.....and where our heart is there will our treasure be and where our treasure is there we will find ourselves for good or ill- eventually.
Watchman Nee wrote a book called "The Release of the Spirit- good on this
George Warnock wrote on this in "Feast of Tabernacles"- available free online somehwere thru google
Quote from: WhiteWings on October 18, 2012, 08:17:01 AM
:welcome:
Quote from: jaareshiah on October 18, 2012, 05:07:19 AM
Hence, just what is the soul ? What is it that eats, that can touch something, that can be "afflicted", that can be "destroyed" ? The soul is us as a person, with all our feelings and desires, with blood flowing through our veins.
Clear list of verses; but what about this one?
Mat 10:28 Do not be afraid of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul. Rather, be afraid of the One who can destroy both soul and body in hell.
If the soul is a person then what is that verse about? Replacing the word soul with body in that verse gives an odd reading.
At Matthew 10:28, Jesus used language that assists a person to understand the need to be loyal to Jehovah God, saying "not (to) become fearful of those who can kill the body (our life prospects now, we as a person now) but cannot kill the soul (the future prospect that we as person after death, will be resurrected); but rather be in fear of him that can destroy soul and body (our life now as well any hope of living in the future when die) in Gehenna (or everlasting destruction)".
Hence, Jesus said to not to "become fearful" of those who can kill us now, but cannot take away our future life by means of a resurrection from the dead. Rather, we should "be in fear of him (Jehovah God) that can destroy soul and body in Gehenna", whereby once we die, there is
no future prospect of ever living again.
Satan and his agents are bent on creating fear in those loyal to God, threatening some of them with death unless they quit loyally serving Jehovah God. Satan has used the political governments (and continues to do so), which is his creation as a "wild beast".(Rev 13:1, 2) It is Jehovah alone who is worthy of our fear, our profound awe and respect.
Jesus never allowed fear of death to hinder him from doing his Father's work of making known "the good news of the kingdom".(Luke 8:1) The Pharisees tried to instill fear into Jesus, saying to him: "Get out and be on your way from here, because Herod wants to kill you", Jesus responded: "Go, and tell that fox, ' Look ! I am casting out demons and accomplishing healing today and tomorrow, and on the the third day I shall be finished."(Luke 13:31, 32)
On the "third day", Jesus was arrested by the order of the Jewish religious leaders (Matt 26:47) and was impaled the following day.(Matt 27:35) He never became "fearful of those who can kill the body but cannot kill the soul."