John 14:6, “I am the way, the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father ex

[chester-blowfold]

so what does this actually mean?

[Lazarus Short]

Jesus the Christ is:

The Way to the Father.

The Truth of the Father.

The Life of the Father.

All will come to the Father through Him in this age or in an age to come, otherwise the Father can never become All in all.  But He will become so, so the theory that this life is your only chance is clearly false.  Anyway, the Bible never says that your eternal (or even age-long) fate is sealed at the death of your carnal body - it is an invention, just as eternal conscious torment in an eternal Hell is an invention (in fact, a 404).

[Seth]

 :thumbsup:

As in Adam all die, even so IN Christ shall all be made alive.

[chester-blowfold]

So are evangelicals reading it wrong when they use it to condemn other faiths? (Christian or non)

[Seth]

Well, "condemnation" implies alot of ugly things especially to do with hell. But they aren't wrong to deny the concept that all gods are the same or that they all lead to the Father. There is only one mediator between God and man.

[jabcat]

So are evangelicals reading it wrong when they use it to condemn other faiths? (Christian or non)

I believe evangelicals have it right in that believing on Jesus is required.  Where they miss it, IMO, is they believe if that doesn't happen in this age, then that's the end of the story - eternal torment.  They miss God's working in the next age, that even though it may be through corrective punishment/discipline, still every knee will eventually bow and every tongue confess Jesus is Lord to the glory of the Father.

[chester-blowfold]

What do Catholics believe?

Are Muslims, Buddhists, Hindus going to be forced to believe in Jesus as son of God or will it be reincarnation where they may come back as a Christian next time?

[darryl]

What do Catholics believe?

Are Muslims, Buddhists, Hindus going to be forced to believe in Jesus as son of God or will it be reincarnation where they may come back as a Christian next time?

I guess after they die they eventually/ ultimately see Jesus for who He is and accept Him as Lord and Savior...like Doubting Thomas did when he saw Jesus after His resurrection.

[rosered]

What do Catholics believe?

Are Muslims, Buddhists, Hindus going to be forced to believe in Jesus as son of God or will it be reincarnation where they may come back as a Christian next time?

I guess after they die they eventually/ ultimately see Jesus for who He is and accept Him as Lord and Savior...like Doubting Thomas did when he saw Jesus after His resurrection.

Most certainly  true !! 

The bible says most   in that day  worshipped the UNKNOWN GOD  and made  a object of their worship  to bow down too   in Acts 17

  Sadly human behavior has not changed   that much  [carnal mind ]  , even with all the grace of God poured out on mankind  ,  that says  , Now there is no more excuse ..  also in Acts 17.

[chester-blowfold]

rosered, acts 17? I've just read it but didn't really get it.
Also how does it compare to Peter chapter 4?

[MichelleSR]

When Jesus says, "I am the way.." I interpret it this way, and I certainly don't understand it all fully, but since He spoke in parables and symbols so much, this is how I see it:

Jesus was the first human being to ever become completely united with God, and He somehow defeated death or created a bridge between us and God so we can all return home to Him.  Notice that even though Jesus never sinned, He still had a human side to him that needed to be sanctified:

"For them I sanctify myself, that they too may be truly sanctified." - John 17:19

Jesus's life also demonstrates the way to of being sanctified and reconciled with God.  How did He do it?  By allowing his human side to completely die.  So our role in believing in Him is living our lives in a way that follows what He did, to the best of our ability, and of course He can help us with that since we can't do it on our own.  We are to allow Him to put to death the things of our fallen human nature.  I don't know if some people have multiple opportunities or lifetimes to do this.  But basically He commanded us to obey Him by loving God and loving your neighbor as yourself.   Since the Bible says that God is Love, and Jesus is also God, than Jesus is love. 

So when He says, "I am the way..." He could basically be saying "Love is the way, the truth, and the life.  No one can know God unless they love."

And his life and teachings showed us what it actually means to love and what it looks like in a practical sense.

I don't know if other religions emphasize the importance of loving and serving one another so much.    Nonetheless, I think that God speaks this truth to everyone, so I wouldn't rule out the possibility of people who grew up with other religious backgrounds from being saved.  I think that assuming all people of other religions don't know God actually can yield some bad fruit because it mentally separates us from them and can make some Christians feel superior to others. 

[jabcat]

What do Catholics believe?

Are Muslims, Buddhists, Hindus going to be forced to believe in Jesus as son of God or will it be reincarnation where they may come back as a Christian next time?

I guess after they die they eventually/ ultimately see Jesus for who He is and accept Him as Lord and Savior...like Doubting Thomas did when he saw Jesus after His resurrection.

Most certainly  true !! 

The bible says most   in that day  worshipped the UNKNOWN GOD  and made  a object of their worship  to bow down too   in Acts 17

  Now there is no more excuse ..  also in Acts 17.

amen.  some Acts 17 notes..Paul was preaching the good news about Jesus and the resurrection...they had religious zeal, but in ignorance..God no longer overlooks such ignorance, but "now he commands all people everywhere to repent...For he has set a day when he will judge the world with justice by the man he has appointed [Jesus]. He has given proof of this to everyone by raising him from the dead."". 

Jesus said HE was the way, and the Father MUST be accessed through Him.  "How can they believe IN HIM who they have not heard.."   Not by works, not by keeping a good conscience, not by following some other religion "with good intentions".    John 1:12 "But to all who did receive Him, to those who believed in His name, He gave the right to become children of God  13 children born not of blood, nor will of the flesh, nor will of man, but born of God."  No room to feel superior there or boast;.  only in the cross of Christ, His love, mercy, grace, goodness, sacrifice - and free gift of salvation.  Not by works, but by grace, lest we should boast (Eph. 2:9)      Jesus also said that if anyone entered any other way they were the same as thieves and robbers.

Jn. 3:16 - ..."whosoever BELIEVES on HIM will not perish".... God's work is of the ages, so through whatever remedial discipline it may take, I believe all will eventually know Him.  But it doesn't happen by accident or by "being good".  All will know Who the Son is, what the cross means, and bow before Him.   :2c:

[rosered]

rosered, acts 17? I've just read it but didn't really get it.
Also how does it compare to Peter chapter 4?

Had wrote you  , but the  Tentmaker site went down    yesterday with a data error    and it was lost

  But yes   Chester   both Acts 17   and Peter 4  do speak on the same   things in my opinion also   .
  I did   read them  yesterday   to refresh  those very scriptures  and be reminded   again , so thank you  :HeartThrob:


James    shared this   , its is   truth  and  light !

amen.  some Acts 17 notes..Paul was preaching the good news about Jesus and the resurrection...they had religious zeal, but in ignorance..God no longer overlooks such ignorance, but "now he commands all people everywhere to repent...For he has set a day when he will judge the world with justice by the man he has appointed [Jesus]. He has given proof of this to everyone by raising him from the dead."". 

Jesus said HE was the way, and the Father MUST be accessed through Him.  "How can they believe IN HIM who they have not heard.."   Not by works, not by keeping a good conscience, not by following some other religion "with good intentions".    John 1:12 "But to all who did receive Him, to those who believed in His name, He gave the right to become children of God  13 children born not of blood, nor will of the flesh, nor will of man, but born of God."  No room to feel superior there or boast;.  only in the cross of Christ, His love, mercy, grace, goodness, sacrifice - and free gift of salvation.  Not by works, but by grace, lest we should boast (Eph. 2:9)      Jesus also said that if anyone entered any other way they were the same as thieves and robbers.

Jn. 3:16 - ..."whosoever BELIEVES on HIM will not perish".... God's work is of the ages, so through whatever remedial discipline it may take, I believe all will eventually know Him.  But it doesn't happen by accident or by "being good".  All will know Who the Son is, what the cross means, and bow before Him.   :2c:

[eaglesway]

amen.  some Acts 17 notes..Paul was preaching the good news about Jesus and the resurrection...they had religious zeal, but in ignorance..God no longer overlooks such ignorance, but "now he commands all people everywhere to repent...For he has set a day when he will judge the world with justice by the man he has appointed [Jesus]. He has given proof of this to everyone by raising him from the dead."".

Jesus said HE was the way, and the Father MUST be accessed through Him.  "How can they believe IN HIM who they have not heard.."   Not by works, not by keeping a good conscience, not by following some other religion "with good intentions".    John 1:12 "But to all who did receive Him, to those who believed in His name, He gave the right to become children of God  13 children born not of blood, nor will of the flesh, nor will of man, but born of God."  No room to feel superior there or boast;.  only in the cross of Christ, His love, mercy, grace, goodness, sacrifice - and free gift of salvation.  Not by works, but by grace, lest we should boast (Eph. 2:9)      Jesus also said that if anyone entered any other way they were the same as thieves and robbers.

Jn. 3:16 - ..."whosoever BELIEVES on HIM will not perish".... God's work is of the ages, so through whatever remedial discipline it may take, I believe all will eventually know Him.  But it doesn't happen by accident or by "being good".  All will know Who the Son is, what the cross means, and bow before Him.   :2c:

Amen!

[darryl]

What do Catholics believe?

Are Muslims, Buddhists, Hindus going to be forced to believe in Jesus as son of God or will it be reincarnation where they may come back as a Christian next time?

I guess after they die they eventually/ ultimately see Jesus for who He is and accept Him as Lord and Savior...like Doubting Thomas did when he saw Jesus after His resurrection.

Most certainly  true !! 

The bible says most   in that day  worshipped the UNKNOWN GOD  and made  a object of their worship  to bow down too   in Acts 17

  Sadly human behavior has not changed   that much  [carnal mind ]  , even with all the grace of God poured out on mankind  ,  that says  , Now there is no more excuse ..  also in Acts 17.

:thumbsup:

[marie glen]

When Jesus says, "I am the way.." I interpret it this way, and I certainly don't understand it all fully, but since He spoke in parables and symbols so much, this is how I see it:

Jesus was the first human being to ever become completely united with God, and He somehow defeated death or created a bridge between us and God so we can all return home to Him.  Notice that even though Jesus never sinned, He still had a human side to him that needed to be sanctified:

hi Michelle, ...Jesus is also "the firstborn of all creation", the only begotten Son.. the only straight out from God one.. so close in essence and character that they both administer God's Presence, the Holy Spirit.. "THis is the decree, You are my Son" Ps 2. "All things in heaven and earth are being gathered into Jesus" Col 1:20 & Eph 1:10 (or is that vice versa? :gsmile: ) No eternal babysitting for Yahweh/Jehovah.. But all will be fully conformed to the image (character) of His Son. (Yet all of us unique.. how's thAt for genious!? :smile: ) Our heavenly Father is still creating His paradise/perfection. Jesus is the prototype.

"For them I sanctify myself, that they too may be truly sanctified." - John 17:19

Jesus's life also demonstrates the way to of being sanctified and reconciled with God.  How did He do it?  By allowing his human side to completely die.  So our role in believing in Him is living our lives in a way that follows what He did, to the best of our ability, and of course He can help us with that since we can't do it on our own.  We are to allow Him to put to death the things of our fallen human nature.  I don't know if some people have multiple opportunities or lifetimes to do this.  But basically He commanded us to obey Him by loving God and loving your neighbor as yourself.   Since the Bible says that God is Love, and Jesus is also God, than Jesus is love. 

So when He says, "I am the way..." He could basically be saying "Love is the way, the truth, and the life.  No one can know God unless they love."

Love IS the way to live.. But Jesus is the way of reconciliation to God who (imo) IS life.. and every good thing.. I've wondered before if perhaps the life eseesnce of animals aren't reincarnated  :dontknow: but I believe the bible says "it's given unto men once to die" women too :laughing7:

And his life and teachings showed us what it actually means to love and what it looks like in a practical sense.

Amen to that!! :gsmile:

I don't know if other religions emphasize the importance of loving and serving one another so much.    Nonetheless, I think that God speaks this truth to everyone, so I wouldn't rule out the possibility of people who grew up with other religious backgrounds from being saved.  I think that assuming all people of other religions don't know God actually can yield some bad fruit because it mentally separates us from them and can make some Christians feel superior to others.

I believe there is common ground between us and most indigenous faiths.. which I find myself believing were built upon a profound truth someone discovered.. I actually first 'met' God through meditation.. but it was a come and go sort of thing.. Quietly meditating on the mountaintop.. there He was.. back into every day life, there He wasn't.. But it is through Jesus that Yahweh becomes ours.. But I veRy much agree, we should not feel superior.. we all were in unfaith and ignorance.. we all are imperfect and flawed.. except for the grace of God, there go I. "He chose us, not we chose Him"... a lucky throw of the heavenly dice I figure.. simply because for a truth proving drama, you really do need more than on character.. (as in saved in this life as opposed to not yet saved).

God bless!! :gsmile:

..some Acts 17 notes..Paul was preaching the good news about Jesus and the resurrection...they had religious zeal, but in ignorance..God no longer overlooks such ignorance, but "now he commands all people everywhere to repent...For he has set a day when he will judge the world with justice by the man he has appointed [Jesus]. He has given proof of this to everyone by raising him from the dead."".

Jesus said HE was the way, and the Father MUST be accessed through Him.  "How can they believe IN HIM who they have not heard.."   Not by works, not by keeping a good conscience, not by following some other religion "with good intentions".    John 1:12 "But to all who did receive Him, to those who believed in His name, He gave the right to become children of God  13 children born not of blood, nor will of the flesh, nor will of man, but born of God."  No room to feel superior there or boast;.  only in the cross of Christ, His love, mercy, grace, goodness, sacrifice - and free gift of salvation.  Not by works, but by grace, lest we should boast (Eph. 2:9)      Jesus also said that if anyone entered any other way they were the same as thieves and robbers.

Jn. 3:16 - ..."whosoever BELIEVES on HIM will not perish".... God's work is of the ages, so through whatever remedial discipline it may take, I believe all will eventually know Him.  But it doesn't happen by accident or by "being good".  All will know Who the Son is, what the cross means, and bow before Him.   :2c:

:HeartThrob: :cloud9: :dsunny:

[eaglesway]

No one can come to the Father except through Jesus. It is a revelation of Christ crucified that binds us to God.

"As Moses lifted up the serpent on the tree in the wilderness. If I am lifted up from the earth I will draw all men unto me."

When the serpent was lifted up, the sting was cured, the poison destroyed, the dying ended for all who saw it.

"If anyone believes in me they have passed from death unto life"

"O Death where is thy sting?!" "Death is swallowed up by immortality".

Biblical Universalists believe that all will bow the knee before Jesus Christ- every single one. Whether in this life or in the next,  no one comes to the Father except through Him.

So, in short, it means JUST WHAT HE SAID :O)

Phil 2:9 For this reason also, God highly exalted Him, and bestowed on Him the name which is above every name, 10 so that at the name of Jesus every knee will bow, of those who are in heaven and on earth and under the earth, 11 and that every tongue will confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.

[ps]

eaglesway wrote:

Phil 2:9 For this reason also, God highly exalted Him, and bestowed on Him the name which is above every name, 10 so that at the name of Jesus every knee will bow, of those who are in heaven and on earth and under the earth, 11 and that every tongue will confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.

and

Biblical Universalists believe that all will bow the knee before Jesus Christ- every single one. Whether in this life or in the next,  no one comes to the Father except through Him.

So, in short, it means JUST WHAT HE SAID :O)

Yes, but that is not necessarily the same as what you indicate.

Have you considered the context, both contextually and topically?

Was he really speaking about all mankind? 

Or, was he speaking about all those of a kindred spirit with himself and the Philippians, those who have believed, and repented, as had he and the Phillipians.

Contextually, he was addressing the Phillipians, whom we understand to be believers.  Preceding v11 in v5-8, he instructs the Philippians to "Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus .. took upon him the form of a servant ... And ... he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross"...

and following in v12 he continues "Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling."

So, there is nothing there to indicate the "every knee" applies to all mankind, he is definitely addressing the Philippians (and others of similar mindset whom he might wish to 'receive' the letter.)

Further consider the wider topical context of all bowing the knee, which can be seen in Romans 14:12 (and Is 45:23).

In Romans 14:12 can be seen "every knee show bow ... and every tongue confess ", but the whole passage surrounding it in Rom 14:4-13 is addressed to believers, and their interactions with one another, and v13 "... every one of us shall give account of himself to God", thus speaking of the confession being of believers giving account of themselves to God, definitely using the verse with a perspective narrower than all mankind.

Now consider Is 45:23 - does that verse and its surrounding passage seem to indicate anything wider than those who believe? 

Isaiah 45:21-24 does appear to more explicitly address a wider audience, but dividing them into two groups, those who "look unto me" and those who "are incensed against him". 

And it seems that it is those who "look unto him" who will bow the knee and confess, while those who are incensed against him, contrastingly, will be put to shame.

From Is 45:21-24

Isa 45

v21 Tell ye, and bring them near; yea, let them take counsel together: who hath declared this from ancient time? who hath told it from that time? have not I the LORD? and there is no God else beside me; a just God and a Saviour; there is none beside me.

v22 Look unto me, and be ye saved, all the ends of the earth: for I am God, and there is none else.

v23 I have sworn by myself, the word is gone out of my mouth in righteousness, and shall not return, That unto me every knee shall bow, every tongue shall swear.

v24 Surely, shall one say, in the LORD have I righteousness and strength: even to him shall men come; and all that are incensed against him shall be ashamed.

So, it appears that topically, across three separate passages, the 'every' is that of believers, those who look to God for salvation - not to 'every' individual regardless of their relationship with God and His son.

As an aside, there are those who make much of the next verse v25 "In the LORD shall all the seed of Israel be justified, and shall glory" or that which is probably quoting it that 'all Israel shall be saved" - but seem to ignore that Paul makes it pretty clear, also in Romans, 9:6 "But it is not as though the word of God has failed. For they are not all Israel who are descended from Israel;", thus also there referring not to the physical descendants of Israel, but to those who are of the faith of Abraham.

[darryl]

eaglesway wrote:

Phil 2:9 For this reason also, God highly exalted Him, and bestowed on Him the name which is above every name, 10 so that at the name of Jesus every knee will bow, of those who are in heaven and on earth and under the earth, 11 and that every tongue will confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.

and

Biblical Universalists believe that all will bow the knee before Jesus Christ- every single one. Whether in this life or in the next,  no one comes to the Father except through Him.

So, in short, it means JUST WHAT HE SAID :O)

Yes, but that is not necessarily the same as what you indicate.

Have you considered the context, both contextually and topically?

Was he really speaking about all mankind? 

Or, was he speaking about all those of a kindred spirit with himself and the Philippians, those who have believed, and repented, as had he and the Phillipians.

Contextually, he was addressing the Phillipians, whom we understand to be believers.  Preceding v11 in v5-8, he instructs the Philippians to "Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus .. took upon him the form of a servant ... And ... he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross"...

and following in v12 he continues "Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling."

So, there is nothing there to indicate the "every knee" applies to all mankind, he is definitely addressing the Philippians (and others of similar mindset whom he might wish to 'receive' the letter.)

Further consider the wider topical context of all bowing the knee, which can be seen in Romans 14:12 (and Is 45:23).

In Romans 14:12 can be seen "every knee show bow ... and every tongue confess ", but the whole passage surrounding it in Rom 14:4-13 is addressed to believers, and their interactions with one another, and v13 "... every one of us shall give account of himself to God", thus speaking of the confession being of believers giving account of themselves to God, definitely using the verse with a perspective narrower than all mankind.

Now consider Is 45:23 - does that verse and its surrounding passage seem to indicate anything wider than those who believe? 

Isaiah 45:21-24 does appear to more explicitly address a wider audience, but dividing them into two groups, those who "look unto me" and those who "are incensed against him". 

And it seems that it is those who "look unto him" who will bow the knee and confess, while those who are incensed against him, contrastingly, will be put to shame.

From Is 45:21-24

Isa 45

v21 Tell ye, and bring them near; yea, let them take counsel together: who hath declared this from ancient time? who hath told it from that time? have not I the LORD? and there is no God else beside me; a just God and a Saviour; there is none beside me.

v22 Look unto me, and be ye saved, all the ends of the earth: for I am God, and there is none else.

v23 I have sworn by myself, the word is gone out of my mouth in righteousness, and shall not return, That unto me every knee shall bow, every tongue shall swear.

v24 Surely, shall one say, in the LORD have I righteousness and strength: even to him shall men come; and all that are incensed against him shall be ashamed.

So, it appears that topically, across three separate passages, the 'every' is that of believers, those who look to God for salvation - not to 'every' individual regardless of their relationship with God and His son.

As an aside, there are those who make much of the next verse v25 "In the LORD shall all the seed of Israel be justified, and shall glory" or that which is probably quoting it that 'all Israel shall be saved" - but seem to ignore that Paul makes it pretty clear, also in Romans, 9:6 "But it is not as though the word of God has failed. For they are not all Israel who are descended from Israel;", thus also there referring not to the physical descendants of Israel, but to those who are of the faith of Abraham.

9For this reason also, God highly exalted Him, and bestowed on Him the name which is above every name, 10so that at the name of Jesus EVERY KNEE WILL BOW, of those who are in heaven and on earth and under the earth, 11and that every tongue will confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father...so, Paul is referring  exclusively to the Philippian believers ?....are you serious ?...this passage obviously has a far broader application than merely the Philippians when it refers to  those who are in heaven and on earth and under the earth... Romans 14:12 is quoting Is45 which you admit has a broader application......and it doesn't say they'll be put to shame...it says they'll be ashamed...as they should be...like a son caught out and chastized is ashamed..the son is still in the family though.
BTW, how do you explain the other passages supporting a universalist reading of Phil 2:9 and Romans 14:12 such as 1 Corinthians 15:22, For as in Adam all die, so in Christ all will be made alive....or Romans 5:19 For just as through the disobedience of the one man the many were made sinners, so also through the obedience of the one man the many will be made righteous...the 'many made sinners' here is every human being..the many made righteous is every human being.

[Dandelion]

Christ is the way to follow; the road to knowing God, the Father; to understanding why Jesus came, what He came to do, and why; the way to faith,trust, praise, prayer and worship of God; the way to knowing how to live our lives and how to die, in His love; the way to Heaven, our home.

Christ is the truth.....there is only one truth and God is the truth of all ages, places, and people. We are not talking about relativism here, we are talking about one truth for the entire universe, which rests in God alone. His word is truth and Jesus is His word, incarnate.

Christ is the life.....in Him we live and move and have our being. Our goal is to be part of the body of Christ. He gave His life for us, and we in turn, are a living sacrifice, who offer our life to God, to do His will, always. When we accept that we must die to ourselves, as Christ did, then He will be our righteousness. Our sins will be forgiven, and we will be called children of the Most High. We will be saved by grace, through our faith in Jesus.

For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith--and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God--Ephesians 2:8


66From that time on, many of His disciples turned back and no longer accompanied Him. 67So Jesus asked the Twelve, "Do you want to leave too?"

68Simon Peter replied, "Lord, to whom would we go? You have the words of eternal life. 69We believe and know that You are the Holy One of God." John 6:68 - 69

D.

[eaglesway]

eaglesway wrote:

Phil 2:9 For this reason also, God highly exalted Him, and bestowed on Him the name which is above every name, 10 so that at the name of Jesus every knee will bow, of those who are in heaven and on earth and under the earth, 11 and that every tongue will confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.

and

Biblical Universalists believe that all will bow the knee before Jesus Christ- every single one. Whether in this life or in the next,  no one comes to the Father except through Him.

So, in short, it means JUST WHAT HE SAID :O)

Yes, but that is not necessarily the same as what you indicate.

Have you considered the context, both contextually and topically?

Was he really speaking about all mankind? 

Or, was he speaking about all those of a kindred spirit with himself and the Philippians, those who have believed, and repented, as had he and the Phillipians.

Contextually, he was addressing the Phillipians, whom we understand to be believers.  Preceding v11 in v5-8, he instructs the Philippians to "Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus .. took upon him the form of a servant ... And ... he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross"...

and following in v12 he continues "Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling."

So, there is nothing there to indicate the "every knee" applies to all mankind, he is definitely addressing the Philippians (and others of similar mindset whom he might wish to 'receive' the letter.)

Further consider the wider topical context of all bowing the knee, which can be seen in Romans 14:12 (and Is 45:23).

In Romans 14:12 can be seen "every knee show bow ... and every tongue confess ", but the whole passage surrounding it in Rom 14:4-13 is addressed to believers, and their interactions with one another, and v13 "... every one of us shall give account of himself to God", thus speaking of the confession being of believers giving account of themselves to God, definitely using the verse with a perspective narrower than all mankind.

Now consider Is 45:23 - does that verse and its surrounding passage seem to indicate anything wider than those who believe? 

Isaiah 45:21-24 does appear to more explicitly address a wider audience, but dividing them into two groups, those who "look unto me" and those who "are incensed against him". 

And it seems that it is those who "look unto him" who will bow the knee and confess, while those who are incensed against him, contrastingly, will be put to shame.

From Is 45:21-24

Isa 45

v21 Tell ye, and bring them near; yea, let them take counsel together: who hath declared this from ancient time? who hath told it from that time? have not I the LORD? and there is no God else beside me; a just God and a Saviour; there is none beside me.

v22 Look unto me, and be ye saved, all the ends of the earth: for I am God, and there is none else.

v23 I have sworn by myself, the word is gone out of my mouth in righteousness, and shall not return, That unto me every knee shall bow, every tongue shall swear.

v24 Surely, shall one say, in the LORD have I righteousness and strength: even to him shall men come; and all that are incensed against him shall be ashamed.

So, it appears that topically, across three separate passages, the 'every' is that of believers, those who look to God for salvation - not to 'every' individual regardless of their relationship with God and His son.

As an aside, there are those who make much of the next verse v25 "In the LORD shall all the seed of Israel be justified, and shall glory" or that which is probably quoting it that 'all Israel shall be saved" - but seem to ignore that Paul makes it pretty clear, also in Romans, 9:6 "But it is not as though the word of God has failed. For they are not all Israel who are descended from Israel;", thus also there referring not to the physical descendants of Israel, but to those who are of the faith of Abraham.

Topically andd contextually yes, Paul was speaking of all mankind- not just to the Phillipians.

"....every knee shall bow WETHER IN HEAVEN OR ON EARTH OR UNDER THE EARTH, and evey tongue confess, that Jesus Christ is Lord TO THE GLORY OF GOD THE FATHER."

The topic is the result of His exaltation as Lord..

Topical context must be set from all the scriptures on a topic.

"If I am lifted up from the earth I will draw ALL MEN UNTO ME."

Jesus' words agree with the topic and set the context.

2 For as in Adam all die, so also in Christ shall all be made alive. 23 But each in his own order: Christ the firstfruits, then at his coming those who belong to Christ. 24 Then comes the end, when he delivers the kingdom to God the Father after destroying every rule and every authority and power. 25 For he must reign until he has put all his enemies under his feet. 26 The last enemy to be destroyed is death. 27 For "God[c] has put all things in subjection under his feet." But when it says, "all things are put in subjection," it is plain that he is excepted who put all things in subjection under him. 28 When all things are subjected to him, then the Son himself will also be subjected to him who put all things in subjection under him, that God may be all in all.

For he must reign until he has put all his enemies under his feet.

If Paul stopped there, then maybe, as most believers in eternal torment assert, every knee bows before being cast into hell as a sort of last "in your face, so there" forced submission by God. But paul doesnt stop there

When all things are subjected to him, then the Son himself will also be subjected to him who put all things in subjection under him, that God may be all in all. 1 Cor 15

The topic is what will be the result of Jesus becoming Lord. The context is consistent- the same writer dscussing the same topic. This establishes topical context.

Every adversary will become a part of the all in all after being subjected to Christ- NOT thrown into an endless torment of "hell".

Further context is established here...

9 making knownto us the mystery of his will, according to his purpose, which he set forth in Christ 10 as a plan for the fullness of time, to unite all things in him, things in heaven and things on earth. Eph 1:9

His(God the Father) purpose in Christ is to unite all things in him(Christ). This is "a plan for the fulness of times".

Same writer saying the same thing ALL THINGS IN HEAVEN AND EARTH WILL BE UNITED IN CHRIST.

Not Buddha, Not Allah, Not Hell- in the Lord Jesus Christ, Savior of all.

And here as well....

The Son is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation. 16 For in him all thingswere created: things in heaven and on earth , visible and invisible, whether thrones or powers or rulers or authorities; all things have been created through him and for him. 17 He is before all things, and in him all things hold together. 18 And he is the head of the body, the church; he is the beginning and the firstborn from among the dead, so that in everything he might have the supremacy. 19 For God was pleased to have all his fullness dwell in him, 20 and through him to reconcile to himself all things, whether things on earth or things in heaven, by making peace through his blood, shed on the cross. Col 1

And finally here...

I consider that our present sufferings are not worth comparing with the glory that will be revealed in us. 19 For the creation waits in eager expectation for the children of God to be revealed. 20 For the creation was subjected to frustration, not by its own choice, but by the will of the one who subjected it, in hope 21 that the creation itself will be liberated from its bondage to decay and brought into the freedom and glory of the children of God.

22 We know that the whole creation has been groaning as in the pains of childbirth right up to the present time. Rom 8

Our resurrection is not for the destruction of everyone but us!

It is for the restoration of all things, as Peter proclaimed on the day of Pentecost, speaking of Jesus, exalted as Lord...

"Whom the heavens must receive ubtil the period of the restoration of all things spoken of by all the holy prophets from ancient times" Acts 3:19

Same topic, more context, different writer speaking the SAME MESSAGE.

For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God— 9 not by works, so that no one can boast. 10 For we are God's handiwork, created in Christ Jesus to do good works, which God prepared in advance for us to do.Eph 2

The whole creation eagerly awaits the revelation of the children of God because we will set the whole creation free from futility in the world to come.

Although I am less than the least of all the Lord's people, this grace was given me: to preach to the Gentiles the boundless riches of Christ, 9 and to make plain to everyone the administration of this mystery, which for ages past was kept hidden in God, who created all things. 10 His intent was that now, through the church, the manifold wisdom of God should be made known to the rulers and authorities in the heavenly realms, 11 according to his eternal purpose that he accomplished in Christ Jesus our Lord. Eph 3

That eternal purpose was explained at the beginning of the same letter, just a few paragraphs back... "a plan(administration kjv) for the fulness of times, to unite all things in Him, things in heaven and earth."

The context in Ephesians alone is tremendous. The conext in all Pauls writings becomes immense. The context through out the scriptures is even greater.

If Jesus does not save all, He never becomes Lord of all, He never draws all men unto Himself. The scriptures are not fulfilled.

[ps]

This post focuses on the immediate context of John 12:32, i.e. the passage containing it, starting at John 12:20 (also previously covered here.)

Topical context must be set from all the scriptures on a topic.

Which in the case of John 12:32 includes the immediate/local context of verses starting at v20.

"If I am lifted up from the earth I will draw ALL MEN UNTO ME."

yes, from John 12:32

Jesus' words agree with the topic and set the context.

The immediate contextual context indicates that v32 topical context is not that of 'all men' everywhere withOUT qualification.

The discourse from the written record is prompted when greeks wish to see Jesus, and this is part of his response to that inquiry.

The contextual context is defined by the larger passage starting from v20, with qualifiers given in v25,26 that those who love Jesus and are serving him, whatever people group they may be from (Jews and non-Jews, referencing the inquiry by the greeks), are servants which are to be where he is.

The 'men' is not explicitly written, the word used is more simply an inclusive something, with the something often implied from (local) context, as in this verse.  (The KJV generally italicizes the 'men' indicating it is not really present in the original source.)

Men probably would have been better replaced with 'my servants' or 'those serving me'.

The contextual setting provides the topical context for the 'all' of v32, that of those losing their life in this world, loving and serving Jesus, following him, who will thereby keep their life, and are the 'all' who are to be with him where he is.

v20,21 - greeks come to philip
v22 - philip goes to andrew, andrew and philip tell Jesus
v23 - Jesus begins to answer
v24 - Jesus speaking of his death
v25,26 - "He that loveth his life shall lose it, and he that hateth his life in this world shall keep it to life eternal.  If any man serve me, let him follow me; and where I am there shall also my servant be: if any man serve me, him will my Father honour."
v27 - 31 ...
v32 - "And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me."

Thereby, with v32 indicating something similar to
'And I, when/whenever I am lifted up from the earth, will draw all my servants [who are to be where I am] unto me.'

[darryl]

Thereby, with v32 indicating something similar to
'And I, when/whenever I am lifted up from the earth, will draw all my servants [who are to be where I am] unto me.'

you are adding to the text...tread carefully...it's dire sin to add to the text...if Jesus meant 'my servants', He would have said 'my servants'...surely, concerning such an important matter as our eternal destiny, Jesus would have removed any doubt simply by saying 'my servants', rather than saying  'all' (which, if Jesus really meant 'my servants', is misleading and Jesus would never mislead us ) ....the fact He said 'all' and not 'my servants' is very telling for those with eyes to see.

[eaglesway]

This post focuses on the immediate context of John 12:32, i.e. the passage containing it, starting at John 12:20 (also previously covered here.)

Topical context must be set from all the scriptures on a topic.

Which in the case of John 12:32 includes the immediate/local context of verses starting at v20.

"If I am lifted up from the earth I will draw ALL MEN UNTO ME."

yes, from John 12:32

Jesus' words agree with the topic and set the context.

The immediate contextual context indicates that v32 topical context is not that of 'all men' everywhere withOUT qualification.

The discourse from the written record is prompted when greeks wish to see Jesus, and this is part of his response to that inquiry.

The contextual context is defined by the larger passage starting from v20, with qualifiers given in v25,26 that those who love Jesus and are serving him, whatever people group they may be from (Jews and non-Jews, referencing the inquiry by the greeks), are servants which are to be where he is.

The 'men' is not explicitly written, the word used is more simply an inclusive something, with the something often implied from (local) context, as in this verse.  (The KJV generally italicizes the 'men' indicating it is not really present in the original source.)

Men probably would have been better replaced with 'my servants' or 'those serving me'.

The contextual setting provides the topical context for the 'all' of v32, that of those losing their life in this world, loving and serving Jesus, following him, who will thereby keep their life, and are the 'all' who are to be with him where he is.

v20,21 - greeks come to philip
v22 - philip goes to andrew, andrew and philip tell Jesus
v23 - Jesus begins to answer
v24 - Jesus speaking of his death
v25,26 - "He that loveth his life shall lose it, and he that hateth his life in this world shall keep it to life eternal.  If any man serve me, let him follow me; and where I am there shall also my servant be: if any man serve me, him will my Father honour."
v27 - 31 ...
v32 - "And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me."

Thereby, with v32 indicating something similar to
'And I, when/whenever I am lifted up from the earth, will draw all my servants [who are to be where I am] unto me.'

I have a different opinion of that, and I believe it is confirmed by scriptures(pas) you will not read. All of the verses I posted create context. You want to respond with one verse and even that one is mis appropriated by you. Jesus says simply.

"If I am lifted up from the earth I will draw all men unto me." Period. It is and unqualified all, just as in Phil 2:10 "every(pas) knee shall bow and all the other verses I quoted. Pan, from pas, all- inclusive of all.

"As in Adam all(pas) died so also in Christ shall all(pan) be made alive"

Especially in Col 1 Paul explains what "all"(pas) is.

15He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of all(pas) creation. 16For by Him all(pas) things were created, both in the heavens and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities—all(pas) things have been created through Him and for Him. 17He is before all(pas) things, and in Him all(pas) things hold together. 18He is also head of the body, the church; and He is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead, so that He Himself will come to have first place in everything(pas). 19For it was the Father's good pleasure for all(pas) the fullness to dwell in Him, 20and through Him to reconcile all(pas) things to Himself, having made peace through the blood of His cross; through Him, I say, whether things on earth or things in heaven.

Pas, pan, panta- a;; tenses of the same word, pas- meaning all, with no subsets unless displayed in the context.

For instance, if I say "all the figs in the basket are ripe"- the subset, "in the basket" sets a limit, but the limit is still defined by "all", "every"- fig in the basket. If one says, "All figs grow on trees"- there is no subset, the statement defines all figs that are, ever were, ever will be.

So it is in Colossians 1, and all those other verses I listed- which you clearly do not regard with the respect due scripture.

All that He created.(John 1 Nothing thar was made was made without Him)

All that He is before.(If He created all things He is before all things- everything....that is why it is called "CREATION"

All things that hold together in Him. (Heb 1:1-3 all things hold together by the word of His power)

So when it says "and so it pleased the Father to make all(pas) the fulness dwell in Him and to reconcile all(pas) things in heaven and in earth to Himself", it means the same "all things listed above will eventually be reconciled".

Everything meaning every one.

[CST]

I find it interesting here that PS is denying that the 'all' in the phrase '"and I, when I am lifted up from the earth, will draw all men to myself."' means literally all when it clearly does. I find it interesting because while I've always seen it as indicating everyone I've never been able to see it as the great statement for UR as others here have and have had to use much stronger terms for my support for UR like those in Romans, Corinthians and Timothy. On the point here I remember that Jesus has also told us: '"Again, the kingdom of heaven is like a net which was thrown into the sea and gathered fish of every kind; when it was full, men drew it ashore and sat down and sorted the good into vessels but threw away the bad. So it will be at the close of the age. The angels will come out and separate the evil from the righteous, and throw them into the furnace of fire; there men will weep and gnash their teeth." (Matthew 13:47-50)

Because of the weight of the term 'draw' in what Jesus says in John, I can't help connecting it to what He does here in Matthew. I find it interesting that PS tries to deny Jesus means all here when He says all, it suggest PS is determined to promote ET but doesn't know his Bible.