Hello from Finland!

[LJ]

Hello!

Nice to have found this forum in my search on the internet for people that belief certain things like i do - not that i found much!

I believe that all will be saved even though most will go to the lake of fire.

I am not a trinitarian and pray only to the father in the name of jesus christ the nazarene. Not to talk much about my one god believe i just want to add i believe that before jesus christ was born on the earth he was the archangel of god called 'word of god' who is gods first creation and that thru him everything was created (on command of the father).

To come back to the savation of all:
I believe that the lake of fire is the gehenna (unliteral translation: hell) and that it is a place where the ones who go there will be imprisoned and pay their debs to god.
Also i do believe the second dead (lake of fire) is a place of torment and after one withers away there (second dead, debt paid) Lord Jesus will resurrect that person or fallen angel for life the the new heaven and earth (after 1000 year kingdom of christ on this earth).

At the moment i´m quite alone with my believes here in finland and without a congregation. I cant even find someone to baptize me so severe is the situation.

[marie glen]

Hello! LJ from Finland! :hiya: And welcome to tentmaker! You will find a lot in common with all of us here.. We may differ on some small details of belief about the ages to come (or other things), but the big thing of course, is the belief in the wholly victorious salvation/gospel of God! And the removal of reading His Word(s) through the false prism of Et/eternal torment! (Which reading becomes more and more obviously UR!)

:welcome: And God bless!

[rosered]

      :iagree:  with Marie !! 


       Welcome LJ Hope you found a place to rest in hope ... :dsunny: 

  Ask the Lord Jesus to baptise you in HOLY SPIRIT & FIRE brother ..
 

  Matt 3 10The ax lies ready at the root of the trees, and every tree that does not produce good fruit will be cut down and thrown into the fire.

11I baptize you with water for repentance, but after me will come One more powerful than I,


whose sandals I am not worthy to carry.

He will baptize you with the Holy Spirit and with fire.

12His winnowing fork is in His hand to clear His threshing floor and to gather His wheat into the barn;

but He will burn up the chaff with unquenchable fire."...

Being   a new creature in Christ  you will be chastened and loved !! 

   Hebrews 12 God Disciplines His Sons

4In your struggle against sin, you have not yet resisted to the point of shedding your blood. 5And you have forgotten the exhortation that addresses you as sons:

"My son, do not make light of the Lord's discipline,

or lose heart when He rebukes you.

6For the Lord disciplines the one He loves,

and He chastises everyone He receives as a son."

7Endure suffering as discipline; God is treating you as sons.


For what son is not disciplined by his father? 8If you do not experience discipline like everyone else, then you are illegitimate children and not true sons.

9Furthermore, we have all had earthly fathers who disciplined us, and we respected them. Should we not much more submit to the Father of our spirits and live?

10Our fathers disciplined us for a short time as they thought best, but God disciplines us for our good, so that we may share in His holiness. 11No discipline seems enjoyable at the time, but painful. Later on, however, it yields a peaceful harvest of righteousness to those who have been trained by it.     :HeartThrob:

12Therefore strengthen your limp hands and weak knees. 13Make straight paths for your feet, so that the lame will not be debilitated, but rather healed.


  God bless you with more of Him   

[CST]

I believe that the lake of fire is the gehenna (unliteral translation: hell) and that it is a place where the ones who go there will be imprisoned and pay their debs to god.

OK, people cannot pay their debt to God it is impossible, He made us, gave us our lives and everything we have and since this is none returnable the only way to even try to pay the debt is to do good, only good and nothing but good. Instead we all sin and when we do we fail to pay our debt to God and it becomes utterly unmeatable. Jesus died to pay our debt which we could not and never will be able to pay (among other reasons) which saves us from perdition. Which I admit causes a fair few problems but it's clearly correct. That's what redemption is.

[marie glen]

Amen, Rose! And CST!

The "debt" we owe, I believe is in this verse - "the wages" (outcome/result, imo) "of sin is death" - If the debt was an afterlife fiery punishment, Jesus would have had to endure that, but what He endured was death.

I do believe there is plenty of fiery 'punishment' which I think is more accurately consequences and results.. And is "corrective"/i.e., correction. In that w/o God all can only "crash and burn" as the saying goes.. both individually and collective or national. Even if the correction is not comprehended until afterlife (on 'day' of Judgment? which is what I believe - that most - not "chosen" ("by lot"/chance/God's choice, not ours) to come to the faith during this brief lifetime - will repent and be reconciled on that 'day'/age; like Israel's annual/collective "Day of Atonement") with perhaps some few totally hard cases which may require more stringent convincing than rising in His radiant (consuming fire) presence and witnessing a 'day' of judgment of all things.. [the 'real' day of atonement, typified by the annual, being DOA for the DOA? Day Of Atonement for those who rise "still in their sins"/doa]
    :Peace2: :gsmile:

[LJ]

Sure Jesus Christ payed the debt of mankind but for those that go to the lake of fire i think it only means that after punishment it will be possible for them to be resurrected for heaven. If there was no cruxifiction of Jesus Christ it might only be possible to annihilate them instead.

That sinners gonna pay their debts (amout that they sinned) in the lake of fire and only after that come out of the punishment is told in matt 5:25
"Settle matters quickly with your adversary who is taking you to court. Do it while you are still together on the way, or your adversary may hand you over to the judge, and the judge may hand you over to the officer, and you may be thrown into prison. 26 Truly I tell you, you will not get out until you have paid the last penny.

I understand that this way:
adversary: satan?
judge: lord jesus
officers: might be angels that throw in the lake of fire?
prison: lake of fire
pennies: debt

[CST]

Yes, but not really. God gives out of His love and abundant generosity and expects nothing back but would much prefer us to use the gifts responsibly. Human pride and cynicism, however, won't accept this and insists we 'pay our own way' even when we can't and won't believe any being could actually really be that generous without having some secret agenda. So Jesus meets us where we are as they say and acts in accordance with the human narrative because the God narrative He is actually acting on behalf of is far beyond our comprehension.

Well, at least that's how I understand it.

[Lazarus Short]

Welcome, LJ!  I'm happy to see that your English is quite good, and that your journey has brought you here, the best little corner of the www!  :friendstu: