Meningitis kills over 1,100 West Africans
By Laura MacInnis GENEVA (Reuters) - One third of the world's stockpiled meningitis vaccine doses have been dispatched to West Africa where an outbreak has killed more than 1,100 people since January, the World Health Organisation (WHO) said on Friday.
Quote from: Taffy on March 27, 2009, 10:17:57 PM
Meningitis kills over 1,100 West Africans
By Laura MacInnis GENEVA (Reuters) - One third of the world's stockpiled meningitis vaccine doses have been dispatched to West Africa where an outbreak has killed more than 1,100 people since January, the World Health Organisation (WHO) said on Friday.
These are things I wish we could solve. I like your thread title, we can get comfortable over here and lose perspective whether it's about nations who want to destroy or why a country has a higher rate of illness because of their conditions or economic status.
Is it true, that a countries government (or rebels that government cannot control) of some of these 3rd world areas hinders the advancement of medical supplies in these areas?
QuoteIs it true, that a countries government (or rebels that government cannot control) of some of these 3rd world areas hinders the advancement of medical supplies in these areas?
Corruption is rife, especially within the Countries of Africa, NOTHING gets done unless money is exchanged via the back hand.
so indeed Paul YES.
"Seven states have unemployment rates that topped 10 percent last month. That's up from four states in January."
Ooops...that's here.
It's just going to get worse, it seems, if this is what is happening in the rich countries.
Quote from: Molly on March 27, 2009, 10:39:10 PM
"Seven states have unemployment rates that topped 10 percent last month. That's up from four states in January."
Ooops...that's here.
It's just going to get worse, it seems, if this is what is happening in the rich countries.
Molly .Forget the illusion, The states havent been RICH for years,...your national DEBT speaks for itself.
your wealth. LIKE most western Countries have been forged from LESSER countries WHO now, like the Chinesse have a foot hold...You guys make me laugh , you believe to MUCH of your OWN press, WELL, in general that is... :icon_flower:
Quote from: Taffy on March 27, 2009, 10:35:23 PM
NOTHING gets done unless money is exchanged via the back hand.
:secret: Money's all it takes? Really? Minimal paperwork? :JCThink:
Quote from: martincisneros on March 27, 2009, 10:44:08 PM
Quote from: Taffy on March 27, 2009, 10:35:23 PM
NOTHING gets done unless money is exchanged via the back hand.
:secret: Money's all it takes? Really? Minimal paperwork? :JCThink:
:mblush:
yes , REAL poverty, where the next meal maybe your last, REAL money speaks in these Countries...But as we KNOW, todays BREAD will not be suffice...
im not just talking Government but , ground floor, police , forces, et all...
Lagos in Nigeria, the capital of, is just a LOVELY place.....
but THERE again, you ever heard of it?
Quote from: Taffy on March 27, 2009, 10:35:23 PM
QuoteIs it true, that a countries government (or rebels that government cannot control) of some of these 3rd world areas hinders the advancement of medical supplies in these areas?
Corruption is rife, especially within the Countries of Africa, NOTHING gets done unless money is exchanged via the back hand.
so indeed Paul YES.
And that I really suspected, it is often this type of thing that I wonder over. I watch the tv where Christian organizations are asking for money to go and help these types of things.
I have seen them doing this as far back as I can remember (for me at least 30 years) and I think that I am not opposed to this intention of help, but I never see any tangible results except the implications of Christians who promote it.
So the question is, what is a reasonable solution? People critisize me for the things I may approve of militarily, and it may be a battle front to complicated to engage in with the military. Possibly too much civilian damage to accomplish the goal.
So what do people see as a solution that has evidence of working?
Quote from: Taffy on March 27, 2009, 10:43:47 PM
Quote from: Molly on March 27, 2009, 10:39:10 PM
"Seven states have unemployment rates that topped 10 percent last month. That's up from four states in January."
Ooops...that's here.
It's just going to get worse, it seems, if this is what is happening in the rich countries.
Molly .Forget the illusion, The states havent been RICH for years,...your national DEBT speaks for itself.
your wealth. LIKE most western Countries have been forged from LESSER countries WHO now, like the Chinesse have a foot hold...You guys make me laugh , you believe to MUCH of your OWN press, WELL, in general that is... :icon_flower:
Yeah. I just meant relatively speaking. Maybe I should have said, least poor.
Quote from: Paul Hazelwood on March 27, 2009, 10:51:02 PM
Quote from: Taffy on March 27, 2009, 10:35:23 PM
QuoteIs it true, that a countries government (or rebels that government cannot control) of some of these 3rd world areas hinders the advancement of medical supplies in these areas?
Corruption is rife, especially within the Countries of Africa, NOTHING gets done unless money is exchanged via the back hand.
so indeed Paul YES.
And that I really suspected, it is often this type of thing that I wonder over. I watch the tv where Christian organizations are asking for money to go and help these types of things.
I have seen them doing this as far back as I can remember (for me at least 30 years) and I think that I am not opposed to this intention of help, but I never see any tangible results except the implications of Christians who promote it.
So the question is, what is a reasonable solution? People critisize me for the things I may approve of militarily, and it may be a battle front to complicated to engage in with the military. Possibly too much civilian damage to accomplish the goal.
So what do people see as a solution that has evidence of working?
Personally Paul, for the many seasons ive been on the Net and the MANY Americans IVE come to Know, Very few really seem to Understand what goes on beyond YOUR shores....
Most walk about with their HEAD up their ARSE, spoon fed...not their fault...but thats the way Ive been led to see it after these yrs.
I got a Story for you-,..In my yrs gone by,ive met a few folk, shall we say , one at least is a High ranking officer come the SAS, who once was connected to government officials both sides of OUR waters...
Once on Vacation with him and his Family, we talked some of THE IRA, ,..I must keep this SIMPLE and short....shall we say? CERTAIN governments ARE ALLOWED to stay IN POWER for more than JUST one reason, First ,TIS best the DEVIL you KNOW,as those who would take over WOULD\are KNOWN to be worse..EVEN SADDAM was Set HIMSELF as puppet government for the benefit of the WEST, until HE GOT to BIG for his britches...
SO, even thou they VIOLATE to serve their own end, their allowed to do so..BUT ONLY UNTIL
Tis ONLY when they as a COUNTRY, STEP on the TOES of OURS, and breach the limited Liberty there Given....they get THRASHED.
STUFF this , for the BENEFIT of MANKIND, tis done WITH THE SELF preservation of our COUNTRIES...IN particular those who are APT TO lose MOST...dont take much figuring does it....
Paul, I dont get involved with Politics as rule, never do, But By golly, of late, Ive seen some garbage written, politics Just annoy ya.
Blessings :icon_flower:
G
QuoteI should have said, least poor
Gotcha Molly :icon_flower:
Sounds like you're pretty bitter towards Americans...like you said, maybe a lot of folks' perspective isn't their/our fault...I just think it's hard to really know what anyone's life is like without walking in their shoes...even those that hate America perhaps. I do think though it's very good to learn and care...and then Paul, as you say, what in the world can be done about it? I know many people in the States give A LOT to charities, feed the poor, feed the children, rescue missions, etc...however, I imagine we could all do more. Is it a bigger problem than "we" can solve? As in, we give, help, and pray, but in the end it will have to be a Divine solution?
Quote from: jabcat on March 27, 2009, 11:29:49 PM
Sounds like you're pretty bitter towards Americans...like you said, maybe a lot of folks' perspective isn't their/our fault...I just think it's hard to really know what anyone's life is like without walking in their shoes...even those that hate America perhaps. I do think though it's very good to learn and care...and then Paul, as you say, what in the world can be done about it? I know many people in the States give A LOT to charities, feed the poor, feed the children, rescue missions, etc. Is it a bigger problem than "we" can solve? As in, we give, help, and pray, but in the end it will be a Divine solution?
No James ,NOT bitter , far from IT, just the boundary structure I mentoned in another thread...Thats all bro, ya KNOW, maybe BEGIN TO see BEYOND...Ya cant blame folk for ignorance Bud.
:icon_flower:
Thanks for the clarification, sorry if I misunderstood/mis-reacted. We have been a blessed nation, but we're trying really hard to mess it up...I've been reminded a lot lately of an old, old song..."if we forget God, our nation is doomed"...
I'll go a little further...MY OPINION...I think America has been protected and even surrounded in mercy as a nation...I think that's been God's plan, and also because (even though we've obviously been and have done wrong about a lot of things, including many things about God..read, religion) as a general rule, many Americans have sought God (as they understood Him) tried to please Him (as they understood) and have believed on Jesus for salvation (as they understood)...Again, MY OPINION, some won't agree, but the more we try to get rid of God and as a nation spit in His face, again, I believe we will reap what we sow.
I think that's good, we do need to see other's burdens and attempt to help. I'm very guilty of often not doing that, and myself as well as our nation probably is often self-occupied. I think you're right...maybe we are getting a wake-up call, if it's not too late...and I will back up from sounding like we aren't accountable for our ignorance or lack of caring...I think we will be held accountable for that and reap what we sow. I do isolate myself and am not thankful, caring, helpful enough. God forgive me.
It has been estimated that if all available cultivatable land and sustainable sea resources were yielding optimally the earth could provide for 13 trillion people. That's 12 trillion, 995 billion more than at present, or, 2,500 times the present 5 billion population.
The real problem in the world is not lack of resources. It is bad politics and bad religion.
The neighbor down the street collects guns to be sure there won't be any trouble. He makes illegal booze and pimps his kids for money. He thinks "straight" guys like me are the reason why he can't get ahead. He ignores the fact that, when I've hired him, he refuses to do what I ask him to and does it his own way instead. While I just have enough to get by, he thinks I'm wealthy. It isn't totally clear why; but, perhaps it's because I paint my house and keep up the yard, which he doesn't. What I have (and he thinks it is a lot) has been robbed from him, or so he thinks. We're supposed to be prejudiced. If I give him something I know he needs, just to bless him, he thinks it's to placate my conscience for having enslaved his people. He doesn't know I've several times lost everything for standing up for the oppressed, neither does he see what he does as oppression. Rather, it's a false standard from a Bible full of errors that afflicts him. I seek to serve God and love man. He hardly relates to God, unless He's in terrible trouble, which happens to him because of getting drunk and using drugs all the time. Ordinarily he curses and mistreats other people in his life, often getting into fights. He thinks one of the biggest sources of trouble in His life is people like me who believe in the Bible. We only use it to cover up our wrong doing and use it to rip off ignorant people.
I'm sure you can draw the analogy.
QuoteThe real problem in the world is not lack of resources. It is bad politics and bad religion
To keep it SIMPLE....YES!!!!!!!!! :icon_flower:
Quote from: jabcat on March 27, 2009, 11:34:39 PM
Thanks for the clarification, sorry if I misunderstood/mis-reacted. We have been a blessed nation, but we're trying really hard to mess it up...I've been reminded a lot lately of an old, old song..."if we forget God, our nation is doomed"...
No Apology necessary Bro....alls COOL! :icon_flower: :thumbsup:
Well, here's some more thoughts from this side of the pond :happy3: ...even though I could pull my hair out over things this nation does, and even though I see much decay and immorality and perceive us trying to rip God from the fabric of our society, and even though I think much/most of our government is corrupt/inept/elitist (from the head down)...and even though I often think of moving out of the country...I still find myself reacting to be s/w defensive of her...I guess in part, because on some level, "America" is "me" :dontknow:...but THEN, I have to admit, I have my own levels of ignorance, own levels of not caring or doing enough...so we really can't get too self-righteous about it either way, can we? :Sparkletooth:
Sorry, but another thought...I think things that are so "awful", such as what's occurring in many places as you mention, is indeed painful and upsetting...what we know about human behavior is, we often try to block out those type things to avoid the discomfort...HOWEVER, in some respects then, Jesus calls us to overcome that and take on some discomfort, doesn't He? I can't add to Jesus' words, but a statement I like is "comfort the afflicted, and afflict the comfortable".
Quote from: jabcat on March 27, 2009, 11:56:50 PM
Well, here's some more thoughts from this side of the pond :happy3: ...even though I could pull my hair out over things this nation does, and even though I see much decay and immorality and perceive us trying to rip God from the fabric of our society, and even though I think much/most of our government is corrupt/inept/elitist (from the head down)...and even though I often think of moving out of the country...I still find myself reacting to be s/w defensive of her...I guess in part, because on some level, "America" is "me" :dontknow:...but THEN, I have to admit, I have my own levels of ignorance, own levels of not caring or doing enough...so we really can't get too self-righteous about it either way, can we? :Sparkletooth:
Yeah Bud, But ya Know what Im saying in general is TRUE in the MAIN... :icon_king:
:icon_flower:
I think you misunderstood...I'm talking about ME not being able to think "I may do all these things to help, so I'm OK"...I'm admitting I'm NOT...it's still filthy rags and there's much more to do...
Quote from: jabcat on March 28, 2009, 12:04:54 AM
I think you misunderstood...I'm talking about ME not being able to think "I may do all these things to help, so I'm OK"...I'm admitting I'm NOT...it's still filthy rags and there's much more to do...
which wouldnt be for the first time James, Excuse me,thanks for clarifing :icon_flower:
I could've said it better...I see why you thought that...thanks.
Genocide anyone?
A Darfuri Speaks Out: Sudan's President Treats My People Like Bargaining Chips
Mohamed Suleiman - March 18, 2009
The Huffington Post
On March 4th 2009, the International Criminal Court issued a warrant for the arrest of President of Sudan Omer Al-Bashir. Within hours, Al-Bashir ordered 13 humanitarian aid groups out from Darfur and Sudan. This was not a mere reactionary move. The regime in Khartoum is comprised of a very calculating gang. That is the secret of their survival for almost 20 years in power. The expulsion of the humanitarian aid groups is meant to present the international community with tough choices. It is the start of the scenario of "Let's talk."
Khartoum is very good in negotiating its way out of troubles. Al-Bashir's bargaining chips here are the lives of 4.7 millions Darfuris. Yes, they are his citizens in the first place, but they also have been his hostages for six years. Some observers say that most of the influential individuals around Al-Bashir are western educated. These individuals understand exactly how the international community thinks, but the international community does not understand how the government of Sudan thinks.
Over the last six years, I have seen and felt the systematic destruction of the once wonderful society I grew up in. Al-Bashir, after killing hundreds of thousands of my people and burning their homes, confined those who managed to stay alive in sub-human shelters called camps in Darfur and Eastern Chad. Their misery didn't end there. Deprived of security and peace, they found the humanitarian aid groups were the only means of survival.
http://www.ourpledge.org/
sobering Post Molly :icon_flower:
something worth considering though is that before the United States of America was even founded the sun shown upon all men alike and the rain fell upon all men alike, the Nations were experiencing much the same good things and much the same evil things of conflict and division as today with politics and religion around the world, the Sun doesn't shine nor the rain fall according to a schedule placed by the political or religious views of the United States of America or any other Nation, We can trust God has placed the Sun and the rain to do that without mans help. While God is not a respecter of persons is he then a respecter of Nations?
Reformer put it very simply: "The problem in the world isn't with the lack of resources. It is bad politics and religion" And I agree, though I might add that the problem is politics and religion trusting in man for its head.
Peace,
Fire Walker
Quote from: Taffy on March 27, 2009, 11:13:48 PM
Quote from: Paul Hazelwood on March 27, 2009, 10:51:02 PM
Quote from: Taffy on March 27, 2009, 10:35:23 PM
QuoteIs it true, that a countries government (or rebels that government cannot control) of some of these 3rd world areas hinders the advancement of medical supplies in these areas?
Corruption is rife, especially within the Countries of Africa, NOTHING gets done unless money is exchanged via the back hand.
so indeed Paul YES.
And that I really suspected, it is often this type of thing that I wonder over. I watch the tv where Christian organizations are asking for money to go and help these types of things.
I have seen them doing this as far back as I can remember (for me at least 30 years) and I think that I am not opposed to this intention of help, but I never see any tangible results except the implications of Christians who promote it.
So the question is, what is a reasonable solution? People critisize me for the things I may approve of militarily, and it may be a battle front to complicated to engage in with the military. Possibly too much civilian damage to accomplish the goal.
So what do people see as a solution that has evidence of working?
Personally Paul, for the many seasons ive been on the Net and the MANY Americans IVE come to Know, Very few really seem to Understand what goes on beyond YOUR shores....
Most walk about with their HEAD up their ARSE, spoon fed...not their fault...but thats the way Ive been led to see it after these yrs.
I got a Story for you-,..In my yrs gone by,ive met a few folk, shall we say , one at least is a High ranking officer come the SAS, who once was connected to government officials both sides of OUR waters...
Once on Vacation with him and his Family, we talked some of THE IRA, ,..I must keep this SIMPLE and short....shall we say? CERTAIN governments ARE ALLOWED to stay IN POWER for more than JUST one reason, First ,TIS best the DEVIL you KNOW,as those who would take over WOULD\are KNOWN to be worse..EVEN SADDAM was Set HIMSELF as puppet government for the benefit of the WEST, until HE GOT to BIG for his britches...
SO, even thou they VIOLATE to serve their own end, their allowed to do so..BUT ONLY UNTIL
Tis ONLY when they as a COUNTRY, STEP on the TOES of OURS, and breach the limited Liberty there Given....they get THRASHED.
STUFF this , for the BENEFIT of MANKIND, tis done WITH THE SELF preservation of our COUNTRIES...IN particular those who are APT TO lose MOST...dont take much figuring does it....
Paul, I dont get involved with Politics as rule, never do, But By golly, of late, Ive seen some garbage written, politics Just annoy ya.
Blessings :icon_flower:
G
I get ya Taffy, but now what?
I can feel sad for that, what am I to do over here? What would something an american could do that would make all the critics think our heads aren't up are ass?
Don't get me wrong, I am not angry as I type this with your comments. I just see it from a standpoint that we have become soft in some ways as believers because we can pick out a few verses in the bible and get all warm and fuzzy so it is thought that any action beyond praying and crying and feeling bad about something is wrong.
So, I'm with ya, as much as those who call me nuke lover want to go tit for tat, I have yet to hear a solution from them other than some emotional trip that has never worked for anything more than invoking emotion, paranoia and fear.
Oh they get mad at the powers that be, fear we are losing our freedoms , but this country isn't even anywhere close to what the poorer places in the world have to deal with.
The poorest time in my life when I skipped every other days meals to make sure my kids ate good was STILL RICH to some people in the world. And I'll skip meals now if it can help make someone elses life a bit better, but I do it to those I meet in my personal life where I can actually affect something. Christians often thinks we just need to give more money. Sorry, 3 decades of seeing the outreaches to other countries solve little to nothing have not reasoned my support for something that just becomes an emotional plea over here and I feel it lines the pockets of some good for nothing minister in the process.
So, great I'd love to talk about a solution and I'll send letters to politicians with those ideas to solve those problems. I send letters now, but as an individual I have little power of myself to go beyond the borders of my country to fix anything and I refuse to be made to feel guilty as if I am a part of any of it.
So, solutions, people, solutions. What are they?
:cloud9: I think of what He said, "the poor you will have with you always".....I don't think we will ever be able to completely fix that until He appears. Which is not to say we shouldn't continue to try, just that I don't think it was meant for us to do it, because it's going to be His to completely fix. Blessings....
Ya know more Paul.. :icon_flower: Thanks for being CANDID AND UPFRONT. :icon_flower:
ya Kind of a Guy who seems to wear his heart on his sleeve some..having experienced some along the way,and are NOT to afraid to share it...well BUD ya not got me looking down on ya for sure... :HeartThrob:
But In what we speak of Of bud, Theres TRULY little wee can do other than MAYBE TOUCH those within our Reach and to whom we are led to do so.
For me thats as much as we can do....
WE ARE not the solution to the END, we\man will never be so.....
Again got to go with Card,...HES the SOLUTION TO ALL.
QuoteOh they get mad at the powers that be, fear we are losing our freedoms , but this country isn't even anywhere close to what the poorer places in the world have to deal with.
Its just at times when ya mentioned suffering,,tis all relative to what we experience...FOR INSTANCE-.
some get peeved not having the right amount of anchovies on their pizza and relate that to BE suffering, and then there are those who not having eaten for days wouldnt care if the pizza was someone left overs..:icon_flower:
alls relative P.....
again for mine, helps to look at the suffering MANY go through beyond the shores, which for many come the western world cant even relate...OR DONT WISH TO
Blessings Bud
:icon_flower:
Quote from: fire walker on March 29, 2009, 07:19:54 AM
something worth considering though is that before the United States of America was even founded the sun shown upon all men alike and the rain fell upon all men alike, the Nations were experiencing much the same good things and much the same evil things of conflict and division as today with politics and religion around the world, the Sun doesn't shine nor the rain fall according to a schedule placed by the political or religious views of the United States of America or any other Nation, We can trust God has placed the Sun and the rain to do that without mans help. While God is not a respecter of persons is he then a respecter of Nations?
Reformer put it very simply: "The problem in the world isn't with the lack of resources. It is bad politics and religion" And I agree, though I might add that the problem is politics and religion trusting in man for its head.
Peace,
Fire Walker
Sorry Firewalker, SEEMS I missed this-
For mine- Nations are No more than the individual, , ALL power WHICH is given, is given from above, but even so, NOT all power is utilised to the GOOD..BuT even within that..all comes together FOR THE GOOD
:icon_flower:
QuoteSo, solutions, people, solutions. What are they?
How about we take our country back? For starters.
Quote from: Molly on March 30, 2009, 04:25:21 AM
QuoteSo, solutions, people, solutions. What are they?
How about we take our country back? For starters.
ok, let me say something. I have been critisized for voting for Obama and that is letting our country go, but, why I voted for him is something most have not taken the time to see.
Whether or not anyone agrees I voted for Obama because he was not willing to just pull the trigger on another country so quickly where mccain seemed to want business as usual where we show our military might as a chip on the shoulder daring the world to knock it off.
So if someone says to me lets take our country back, that was a reasoning I have had, we have spread ourselves to thin in the world waging wars where it was not thought out, the religious nature of who we are supposedly helping was not considered.
It was actually as Taffy put it, a bunch of politicians and military people with their head up their arse thinking we were the center of the universe and everyone would just love us so much. I knew that nothing is ever that easy so it was doomed to be a big mess based on that alone.
So to me alot of the ideas about taking our country back is that one of them is to get rid of the religious delusion that people think we need to have in this country. But then that starts a whole nother debate.
Taking our country back will do what for those in africa?
:cloud9: I got an email today with a site page listing 800 FEMA camps that have recently been established to hold hundreds of thousands of people in the event that martial law is declared. I have a gut feeling they know our economy is going to collapse completely and they are preparing for anarchy that will follow such a calamity. So much as I would like to think we could, at this point I don't think we can get our country back. Our only hope is the Lord to take care of us. My :2c: Blessings...
Quoteok, let me say something. I have been critisized for voting for Obama and that is letting our country go, but, why I voted for him is something most have not taken the time to see.
He's irrelevant. What is relevant is us. And, that is Congress. For starters.
QuoteTaking our country back will do what for those in africa?
Physician, heal thyself.
Quote from: Cardinal on March 30, 2009, 07:50:47 AM
:cloud9: I got an email today with a site page listing 800 FEMA camps that have recently been established to hold hundreds of thousands of people in the event that martial law is declared. I have a gut feeling they know our economy is going to collapse completely and they are preparing for anarchy that will follow such a calamity. So much as I would like to think we could, at this point I don't think we can get our country back. Our only hope is the Lord to take care of us. My :2c: Blessings...
You know Card how hard it is to often really know the validity of what we're hearing, but I've heard the same rumblings...that supposedly the detention centers are being set up for illegal aliens, but that that is a front for the true purpose...citizens. Also, hearing about the "shadow government" that's being set up, people being placed in positions of authority that can be directly responsive to Obama's directives rather than through usual channels. I know this thread is about "outside america", but boy Taf, we've got quite a bit going on
here now... :sigh: And I hear you Paul on Africa (etc.)..it's all pretty big...
Mol, how to take back Congress? Celente is talking about tax revolts, civil actions, but what do you think that would look like?
TAF, want to split the last few posts off to, perhaps, the Economy thread I started? Then anyone that wants to discuss this and related topics, such as PREPARATION can do so there...and those that don't can continue to tend to this and other topics :thumbsup:.
nah James, let it roll, :thumbsup:
:icon_flower:
Quote from: Molly on March 30, 2009, 08:05:47 AM
Physician, heal thyself.
Your saying it is africa's problem?
Quote from: Molly on March 30, 2009, 08:05:47 AM
What is relevant is us. And, that is Congress. For starters.
Yes, I voted for congressmen in my district. ok, now what?
QuoteThe states havent been RICH for years,...
Because thou sayest, I am rich, and increased with goods, and have need of nothing; and knowest not that thou art wretched, and miserable, and poor, and blind, and naked: :sigh:
I would say the worse thing about the US is an outcome of the way we do church. There are almost no public gathering places. Where do people who live in a given area hang out and communicate with each other? It doesn't exist. The possibility of it happening at church gatherings is slim. A "Layman" is not allowed to influence other laymen.
It is defiance of the first commandment, having other "Subjectors" (Elohim) beside Him, other mediators, that creates an approving atmosphere for dictators. It is preventing the other great commandmant like unto the first, on which hangs all the law and prophets, not allowing the free one-anothering in our meetings that results in our condition of isolation, impotence and irrelevance. This is also how very many of us experience our society. It is inaccessible. We cannot change it. Generally, not only does our presence makes no difference to the outcome of a church gathering, but our having been here makes no difference to society at large. We are taught this is just a problem with our perception. It is only subjective. I'm sure it is real. However I subjectively respond to it, what I'm responding to is there.
Is this true of people in other countries? How much of the church in other countries is like this? Do they find they are alienated from their society? Surely for many it is like that only to a much greater degree: escaping warfare, stuck in prison for being a believer and the like.
Quote from: reFORMer on March 31, 2009, 01:54:38 AM
I would say the worse thing about the US is an outcome of the way we do church. There are almost no public gathering places. Generally, not only does our presence makes no difference to the outcome of a church gathering, but our having been here makes no difference to society at large.
Is this true of people in other countries? How much of the church in other countries is like this?
and just sitting staring at the back of other people's heads, and the one guy elevated on the platform?
Quote from: Paul Hazelwood on March 29, 2009, 09:52:22 AM
So, solutions, people, solutions. What are they?
I can think of a few....
If America is the greatest nation on earth, the biggest, the best, the most civil, most free, most blessed...(add your favourite acronym) then I say...
America should act as the benevolent "big brother" to other nations...
instead of flying in your surges of troops (name your favourite occupied country here) to make war on the local people, whether it is afghanistan, iraq, pakistan, somalia, sudan...spending trillions and trillions of dollars to kill people, drive them from their homes, take their fathers and brothers captive etc etc...why not fly in and erect water purification plants (to kill all waterborne diseases like cholera for instance), build schools, sewerage treatment plants, clinics...etc etc
now...you may ask? why should we spend our money on these people?
well, you're currently spending it so your troops can murder them...you are raping all their natural resources whether it is wood from the forests, buying blood diamonds, taking the gold out the ground and selling it at astronomical amounts while the miner himself struggles to feed his family...in fact, in many parts of the world people work for food only
this is the same in the mining sector, petroleum sector...most industries established by western companies/governments
o blessed america....why don't you bless the rest of the world as God has blessed you?
Quote from: noname on March 31, 2009, 01:07:23 PM
o blessed america....why don't you bless the rest of the world as God has blessed you?
So, what prevents the money being sent now for humanitarian aid from making a difference?
I will reasonably look at a point if it is reasonably addressed. While people want to make a platform for the ills of america they over look the things that we are doing and need to address why they are not enough.
So nows your chance.
:cloud9: I agree noname. And it might seem a trifle oversimplified, but I'd say the answer is because our country is not being run by genuine Christians. I'm sure a lot of them mouth the word at election time, particularly in the Bible belt, but actions speak louder than words and there are very few of them I personally wouldn't like to see evicted from office. But that's just my opinion........Blessings....
Quote from: jabcat on March 31, 2009, 06:09:31 AM
Quote from: reFORMer on March 31, 2009, 01:54:38 AM
I would say the worse thing about the US is an outcome of the way we do church. There are almost no public gathering places. Generally, not only does our presence makes no difference to the outcome of a church gathering, but our having been here makes no difference to society at large.
Is this true of people in other countries? How much of the church in other countries is like this?
and just sitting staring at the back of other people's heads, and the one guy elevated on the platform?
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Too many do church like Reverand Jim Jones did, the leaders are elevated (exhalted and Idolized) by their religiously
indoctrinated followers to the place of being God.
Jim Jones was even endorsed by President
Carter, of course that was when Reverand Jones was doing all his good works he said the "Lord prepared for him to do" while he was still preaching to building his flock up in numbers before the Jones town masacre, just goes to reveal how folks can be blinded and deceived by the false light of religion placing their trust and faith in a man, religion and politics , Idolatry.
I would say that this involves people outside of America because he ended up in taking his church members to another land beyond America where his prison camp named Jones town patheticly refered to as his church was waiting for the sheep. Over 900 people including many children and families perished at the hands of Jim Jones and his religion, this fits right in with the Roman Churches crusades and inquisitions which effected Nations all around the world.
Peace,
Fir Walker
Quoteo blessed america....why don't you bless the rest of the world as God has blessed you?
One easy answer is that the people have lost control of their government. This is true in England, too, as well as all of Europe.
You can see that the present fellow was elected for change, i.e. to stop war, as well as the current sitting congress, and look what they do---more war.
The american people have lost all discernment--they can no longer discern liars and profiteers--they believe lies time and time again--they think they are boxed in to vote only for two parties, neither of which they ever like [by design].
But, in hope, they keep trying and keep getting disappointed because insanity is doing the same thing and expecting different results.
But, people are starting to wake up now--if not to the wrong conclusions or too late. Thirty five thousand of them marched in London on Monday. And, they are saying to themselves--How did this happen?
Quote from: Molly on March 31, 2009, 10:37:50 PM
Quoteo blessed america....why don't you bless the rest of the world as God has blessed you?
One easy answer is that the people have lost control of their government. This is true in England, too, as well as all of Europe.
You can see that the present fellow was elected for change, i.e. to stop war, as well as the current sitting congress, and look what they do---more war.
The american people have lost all discernment--they can no longer discern liars and profiteers--they believe lies time and time again--they think they are boxed in to vote only for two parties, neither of which they ever like [by design].
But, in hope, they keep trying and keep getting disappointed because insanity is doing the same thing and expecting different results.
But, people are starting to wake up now--if not to the wrong conclusions or too late. Thirty five thousand of them marched in London on Monday. And, they are saying to themselves--How did this happen?
France is calling for a world/international "czar" of finance, and Obama has taken out ads internationally asking for cooperation...I'm still very much in "re-grouping" mode from all my orthodox influence on many "end-times" matters (and many other things) so does anyone else find this concerning, or at least very interesting?
:cloud9: YES, I find it concerning. At the very least, they are doing self-fulfilling prophecy, because THEY have been indoctrinated that this is what the end "means" is going to happen. Did you ever consider that we spoke it so much for generations, maybe we spoke it into being?
There are actually some people in the world that think if they bring about this "end time scenario", they will hasten the appearance of Christ to get them out of the mess! It's mad, anyway you look at it, the carnal beastly mind is only getting more and more insane as his light grows dimmer from serving sin. Blessings....
Read the book 1984. Orwell saw a template of their goals and wrote that book to warn people.
You can read it for free online, btw.
:cloud9: I think I did read it before I came to the Lord, actually. But I was unaware he saw their "blueprints" beforehand. That would make sense as to why he was so "prophetic" almost. Hmmm..... :mshock:
Alright, lets back up and be specific here.
Lets be specific about this issue of disease in Africa. This is nothing new and the state of american government does not explain anything, especially past efforts.
For the last 30 years I have heard about these troubles overseas, for 30 years I have heard Christians talk about missions and humanitarian aid and education for africa to solve this issue and after 30 years the excuse of our current affairs within the last 8 years is unacceptable, that is not the problem. And if it actually is, then please explain the time warp principal that caused the last 8 years to affect thge prior 30 years or even long before that. That should really be a great note to read.
I'm asking anyone, but especially those that stand up so quickly and point at America and our government but never really have anything to say to explain why the efforts that have been peaceful have not worked for that specific issue during the time in which I have heard that America has used our resources, money and blessing to try to help.
What is the problem that it has not helped. And what will cause it to help.
:cloud9: Well, I'm going to say something and it may shock some as it did me when He dropped it into my Spirit, but throwing money at people that are in judgment for idolatry does little to help their condition and ultimately is only a temporary fix in the natural for what is inherently a spiritual condition.
God has set up a system whereby the pressures exerted force man to find HIM. It is possible therefore in our well-doing that is NOT led of the Spirit, to alleviate the temporal conditions of man without fixing the root of the problem by leading them to life-changing, life-sustaining, RELATIONSHIP with Christ, which only necessitates that we do it all over again and again.
It creates a dependency, just like ONLY bringing people to Christ and not being willing or able to teach them how to walk IN Christ and mature in Christ, creates a dependent generation of pew sitters that never mature.
This has been the overall root problem of why we still have to battle the descendants of Ham in the middle east, over and over again, because we go in and obliterate dictators and free the people, only for them to PEACEFULLY, live in sin and ignorance of the savior for a season. This is why our military or anyone's military will NEVER bring true lasting peace anywhere in the world, because they themselves, if they have it, are not (officially) allowed to share it. My :2c: Blessings....
Orwell was off line by setting dates, beyond that much of what he wrote about in the approach to his 1984 prophetic view concerning the doings of man have actualy
come to pass though at a later time, thing is we don't walk in fear of these things because our eyes are on the one above. at the same time though for me as I see it to put my head in the sand and wear rose colored glasses and deny that such things have, may or can occur would be the same as to deny there is evil in the world or that there are doers of evil in power in high places in the world, to say there has never been, is not or shall not be powers of darkness in high places would not be truthful, their is an end to these in Gods time not mans, we actualy do wrestle with the principalities, powers of darkness and spiritual wickedness in high places within ourselves and out in the world, not flesh and blood, the Lord himself wrestled with these same things just as we do, he was tempted like all men, yet he knew it was not flesh and blood because it is spiritual, he is from above we are from below, That to me points to the things above, he did not give in to those who tempted him to become a worldly leader or King of the Jews while on Earth because his work is from above, spiritual and not of this world, not just beyond America and all other Countries, it is beyond this world , he prepared a place for us, until then we are as wayfaring strangers passing through a foriegn land. I believe it.
Peace,
Fire Walker
some of us have touched on throwing money at the problem...and yes, when one does that there are a few unscrupulous people who would catch that before it reaches those it was intended for...
i'm rethinking, instead of combat troops on ground...why not have people trained to create peace instead of war...why not send in the army engineer's battalions for starters to build bridges (literally and figuretively)...people on the ground need to see the "change" they've been hearing about...
I've been in the military as well and I know how quickly facilities can be set up...water purification plants, shelter, medical facilities...just think if a few battalions do this to really show the heart of America (which I think is still there even though being depressed by the federal government)...don't you guys think this could bring REAL change to people's lives?
like Jesus said...give without wanting anything in return...if one has enough...shouldn't one share? on a personal and national level?
:cloud9: I think that would be an excellent idea if they were also trained to build spiritual bridges. :thumbsup: Blessings....
Quote from: noname on April 01, 2009, 09:24:18 AM
I've been in the military as well and I know how quickly facilities can be set up...water purification plants, shelter, medical facilities...just think if a few battalions do this to really show the heart of America (which I think is still there even though being depressed by the federal government)...don't you guys think this could bring REAL change to people's lives?
So, what do you do when the countries government allows this but militants within the country that the government can not control want to come and take over the facilities you just built?
The world does what it does including the USA.
men will continue to rise up and think they can fix things.
the beast rises in the sea of humanity claiming to be God.
as men continue to think they can fix the problems and ""save"" the earth it will wax worse and worse.
iniquity will continue war will continue till the end, let not your love wax cold.
either physically or supernaturally ONLY God thru Christ will it be fixed.
LOVE is the only answer we have at this point, so let us pursue love with all dilligence to the peole we come into contact each day.
i beseech you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that ye present your bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, [which is] your reasonable service.
God bless
chuckt.
Quote from: chuckt on April 01, 2009, 03:59:11 PM
The world does what it does including the USA.
men will continue to rise up and think they can fix things.
the beast rises in the sea of humanity claiming to be God.
as men continue to think they can fix the problems and ""save"" the earth it will wax worse and worse.
iniquity will continue war will continue till the end, let not your love wax cold.
either physically or supernaturally ONLY God thru Christ will it be fixed.
LOVE is the only answer we have at this point, so let us pursue love with all dilligence to the peole we come into contact each day.
i beseech you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that ye present your bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, [which is] your reasonable service.
God bless
chuckt.
Depends on what fixing is expected. Things can change, but it is the unrealistic manner of change many people expect and subsequently use to see failure.
Quote from: Paul Hazelwood on April 01, 2009, 04:14:34 PM
Quote from: chuckt on April 01, 2009, 03:59:11 PM
The world does what it does including the USA.
men will continue to rise up and think they can fix things.
the beast rises in the sea of humanity claiming to be God.
as men continue to think they can fix the problems and ""save"" the earth it will wax worse and worse.
iniquity will continue war will continue till the end, let not your love wax cold.
either physically or supernaturally ONLY God thru Christ will it be fixed.
LOVE is the only answer we have at this point, so let us pursue love with all dilligence to the peole we come into contact each day.
i beseech you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that ye present your bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, [which is] your reasonable service.
God bless
chuckt.
Depends on what fixing is expected. Things can change, but it is the unrealistic manner of change many people expect and subsequently use to see failure.
the world thinks it can fix it by the power of men.
question:
is it gods plan to change the world? and if so is he to do it thru ""christianity" and conversion to it?
chuckt
Quote from: chuckt on April 01, 2009, 04:41:56 PM
the world thinks it can fix it by the power of men.
question:
is it gods plan to change the world? and if so is he to do it thru ""christianity" and conversion to it?
chuckt
Well some things man does a fine job with in the reality of what is observable and it also does a fine job of deflating and deterring people from trying.
Christianity can bite me, I am talking about a specific situation that men can talk about and offer solutions too.
The troubles in africa is not about "fixing the world" it is about what can be done to make a difference and why the efforts we hear about that people promote as the "peaceful" solution do not work.
Do you think a starving disease ridden person gives a crap about some missionary holding a bible telling them God loves them and that will make then feel better?
Do we say "Sorry people of africa" us americans don't really give a crap about you because we have our own troubles. But God loves you (smile).
Is the answer as simple as its Gods plan that the people of africa suffer so suck it up? I mean what are you really saying here?
Quote from: Cardinal on April 01, 2009, 02:37:32 AM
God has set up a system whereby the pressures exerted force man to find HIM. It is possible therefore in our well-doing that is NOT led of the Spirit, to alleviate the temporal conditions of man without fixing the root of the problem by leading them to life-changing, life-sustaining, RELATIONSHIP with Christ, which only necessitates that we do it all over again and again.
You touch upon a problem then of believers agreeing on what actions prove that someone is led by the spirit.
The nauseating (to me) sermon of 35,000 souls a day pouring into hell because Christians were not reaching those who have never heard the name of Jesus fast enough was applauded by people who then appeared not to be nauseated by such false teachings.
So what would the picture of a universalist mission program be?
To me it would be to do as much as we can without trying to convert and bring false hope to starving and disease ridden people.
The united states is far from being disease free or hunger free, that does not mean our efforts to improve things are in vain.
According to "Christianity" and possibly some universalists, we should be able to send missionaries to people work with them to convince them about Jesus Christ and that will change the world.
What I am saying is that my 30 years of observation has seen no such results in any significant manner, if at all from the message that people teach along the lines of believing and receiving. Their out is that they did their job but everyone else is not doing theirs. I say hogwash, I think the message is flawed since there are a lot of spoken claims that people do this and that, all these healings excorsisms and such, but in 33,000 christian denominations if even 1 person in all those 33,000 spots around the world was excersizing the true brunt of what they assert then we would not only hear these claims in internet forums and "religious" publications.
What I have seen is that when people act for the mere sake of acting, more things happen then if man asserts they represent God in any manner while they are acting.
I personally have done things for people and never witnessed to them, just helped and went about my business. That is not me propping myself up, it is the point that i think we should act first with wreckless abandon and let God fill the voids rather than assert that we have captured this power of the spirit that we can wield with our physical body like some wizard.
Quote from: Paul Hazelwood on April 01, 2009, 05:17:20 PM
Quote from: chuckt on April 01, 2009, 04:41:56 PM
the world thinks it can fix it by the power of men.
question:
is it gods plan to change the world? and if so is he to do it thru ""christianity" and conversion to it?
chuckt
Well some things man does a fine job with in the reality of what is observable and it also does a fine job of deflating and deterring people from trying.
Christianity can bite me, I am talking about a specific situation that men can talk about and offer solutions too.
The troubles in africa is not about "fixing the world" it is about what can be done to make a difference and why the efforts we hear about that people promote as the "peaceful" solution do not work.
Do you think a starving disease ridden person gives a crap about some missionary holding a bible telling them God loves them and that will make then feel better?
Do we say "Sorry people of africa" us americans don't really give a crap about you because we have our own troubles. But God loves you (smile).
Is the answer as simple as its Gods plan that the people of africa suffer so suck it up? I mean what are you really saying here?
im saying the poor will always be among us. you want me to boast? i give to the poor and the cause of the hungry. do i know how much of my money actually makes it?
i feel real sorry for the poor souls in africa, i also feel real sorry for the poor souls here in my backyard.
when YOU can come up with a way to feed all of africa and continue to feed them till the sun burns out, GOD BLESS YOU>
i percieve america gives alot and does alot for the people of africa, can we do more? always, can we fix it 100% HELL NO!
To think we men of america can fix the woes of africa is indeed pitifull.
i care less about the bible thumpers also and wasnt even part of my subject.
I CAN ONLT DO WHAT I CAN DO.
ONCE YOU FIX ONE COUNTRIES PROBLEMS ANOTHER ONE COMES RIGHT BEHIND IT.
WE will NOT fix this world. im not saying nmot to do our part in helping and feeding the hungry!God bless
chuckt
Quote from: chuckt on April 01, 2009, 06:48:29 PM
Quote from: Paul Hazelwood on April 01, 2009, 05:17:20 PM
Quote from: chuckt on April 01, 2009, 04:41:56 PM
the world thinks it can fix it by the power of men.
question:
is it gods plan to change the world? and if so is he to do it thru ""christianity" and conversion to it?
chuckt
Well some things man does a fine job with in the reality of what is observable and it also does a fine job of deflating and deterring people from trying.
Christianity can bite me, I am talking about a specific situation that men can talk about and offer solutions too.
The troubles in africa is not about "fixing the world" it is about what can be done to make a difference and why the efforts we hear about that people promote as the "peaceful" solution do not work.
Do you think a starving disease ridden person gives a crap about some missionary holding a bible telling them God loves them and that will make then feel better?
Do we say "Sorry people of africa" us americans don't really give a crap about you because we have our own troubles. But God loves you (smile).
Is the answer as simple as its Gods plan that the people of africa suffer so suck it up? I mean what are you really saying here?
im saying the poor will always be among us. you want me to boast? i give to the poor and the cause of the hungry. do i know how much of my money actually makes it?
i feel real sorry for the poor souls in africa, i also feel real sorry for the poor souls here in my backyard.
when YOU can come up with a way to feed all of africa and continue to feed them till the sun burns out, GOD BLESS YOU>
i percieve america gives alot and does alot for the people of africa, can we do more? always, can we fix it 100% HELL NO!
To think we men of america can fix the woes of africa is indeed pitifull.
i care less about the bible thumpers also and wasnt even part of my subject.
I CAN ONLT DO WHAT I CAN DO.
ONCE YOU FIX ONE COUNTRIES PROBLEMS ANOTHER ONE COMES RIGHT BEHIND IT.
WE will NOT fix this world. im not saying nmot to do our part in helping and feeding the hungry!
God bless
chuckt
Your right, we cannot fix the "world" and there is no promise that we can, we can however, do what we can with what we have to work with.
That is the point I am working on getting across, the ney sayers seem to think america doesn't care. I disagree, I think america often does things because reality is an issue.
I think there are those that believe we have the means to fix it if we would only do things a certain way, I think they do not know what they are talking about.
I also agree that we should always try. What I ask of the neysayers is if our military presence and our meddling in the affairs of other countries is not the way to go about it, I can reasonably understand some of those things.
What is not being explained is that america DOES try to peacfully intervene and they are not explaining why those efforts appear to be futile.
QuoteYour right, we cannot fix the "world" and there is no promise that we can, we can however, do what we can with what we have to work with.
why didnt you say so :LH: yes i wish i personally could do more also.....
QuoteThat is the point I am working on getting across, the ney sayers seem to think america doesn't care. I disagree, I think america often does things because reality is an issue.
oh yes i agree very much here!
Paul,
i am sorry if we got our messages cross as it seems me and you are in agreement here. and thanks for the reply, spot on. :ok:
God bless
chuckt :hithere:
No problem chuck, all is good.
Quote from: Paul Hazelwood on April 01, 2009, 05:41:38 PM
So what would the picture of a universalist mission program be?
To me it would be to do as much as we can without trying to convert and bring false hope to starving and disease ridden people.
:cloud9: That's exactly what they HAVE been doing and it clearly doesn't work.
According to "Christianity" and possibly some universalists, we should be able to send missionaries to people work with them to convince them about Jesus Christ and that will change the world.
:cloud9: A mere handful of Spirit filled men changed the world in their generation and there's no reason to think another handful couldn't, if they were TRULY Spirit filled.
The main problem in trying to get anything done is lack of funds and that is a direct result of the condition that exists in this country, which is the separation of church and State that is overboard and discriminatory towards only Christians.
In the line of work I was previously in, I was told that if I spoke the name of Jesus I'd be fired on the spot because they get government money.
What I am saying is that my 30 years of observation has seen no such results in any significant manner, if at all from the message that people teach along the lines of believing and receiving. Their out is that they did their job but everyone else is not doing theirs. I say hogwash, I think the message is flawed since there are a lot of spoken claims that people do this and that, all these healings excorsisms and such, but in 33,000 christian denominations if even 1 person in all those 33,000 spots around the world was excersizing the true brunt of what they assert then we would not only hear these claims in internet forums and "religious" publications.
:cloud9: Not necessarily. In our "modern rational" age and way of looking at things, if you go around professing to be doing these things to too many people outside of the ones you're actually ministering to, you run the risk of being ostracized in a big way, and as well as becoming possible fodder for potential lawsuits. Sometimes you have to be wise as a serpent in your dealings with people.
I had a friend a few years back who was having such success with getting people back in their right mind after delivering them of the demons that made them "crazy", she was banned from going to a mental hospital as a chaplain because they told her they had had a board meeting over her, and she was costing them too much money from having to release people.
And this is not to say that everyone in such a setting is demonized and that there are no chemical and biological reasons for their illnesses, only that NOT ALL are in there for those reasons alone.
What I have seen is that when people act for the mere sake of acting, more things happen then if man asserts they represent God in any manner while they are acting.
I personally have done things for people and never witnessed to them, just helped and went about my business. That is not me propping myself up, it is the point that i think we should act first with wreckless abandon and let God fill the voids rather than assert that we have captured this power of the spirit that we can wield with our physical body like some wizard.
:cloud9: Those that have been baptized in the Spirit of God, which means they are anointed (set apart for service) for these very works (they shall cast out devils the first and second days as the Lord said), have NO POWER apart from Him and can ONLY do His perfect will, and so there is no danger of "wielding" anything "like some wizard". Blessings....
I see what your saying cardinal and sorry that I don't buy it, not that your lying or anything, but I see what I see.
Why is it that it appears that these spirit filled men claim such success only to be defeated by mere man and his laws?
Why does that power not distribute and win over those who would "ostrasize"? How am I to believe such stories of men spirit filled so easily defeated?
Quote from: Paul Hazelwood on April 01, 2009, 09:59:27 PM
I see what your saying cardinal and sorry that I don't buy it, not that your lying or anything, but I see what I see.
Why is it that it appears that these spirit filled men claim such success only to be defeated by mere man and his laws?
:cloud9: I totally understand your disbelief Paul, if you've never been exposed to anything like what I'm telling you. I would have never believed it, either, if the Lord had not manifested in this way with me and others I was around in the beginning of my walk with Him.
But there again, as I said earlier, it's a matter of being led by His Spirit and being wise as a serpent. HE is the choreographer, and our steps are ordered by Him. He once let me cause a "quiet" stir in a nursing home I filled in briefly at. You are not told anything about the patients, and therefore I had no idea what I had walked into the first night, in the first room I went in.
The patient was naked, tongue hanging out of her mouth (side effect of psychotropic drug use), totally incontinent.
She looked at me and plainly said, "Help me, I'm in hell."
I said, "Praise God, that's what I'm here for."
And she went back to non-stop, nonsensical, garbled, repetitive speech. I asked the Lord to let me cast out anything that was not of His Spirit and there against His perfect will for her, and then did so. I then asked her to within herself, TO HIM, ask Him to be Lord of her life. Then I cleaned her up and dressed her. I then asked her if she was hungry and she told me she was, and she went back to her normal speech. So I went out to the nurse's station and asked her if I could give the woman in room 1 something to eat (it was late evening).
The nurse said, "How do you know she wants it?"
I said, "She told me."
The nurse said, "I'll be there in 5 minutes, get her a nutritional drink."
So I go back in to the patient, and I thought, if she can repeat things, I'll have her sing with me a song I had just learned. It went J-E-S-U-S, you are my everything, J-E-S-U-S, my everything.
I didn't think she'd remember it more than 5 seconds, LOL,; my "bad". So when the nurse came in, the patient was lying dressed, hands folded, drinking her drink, and singing in between gulps.
I was stunned to look up and see the nurse frozen in the doorway, tears streaming down her face. She stood there for about 2 minutes, then hollered for the aide on duty, which besides me and the nurse, was the only staff on duty. I thought, "Oh, Lord, I'm fired now, she just called for a witness (over the song)!"
Turns out, when they both stopped crying, they told me the woman could not speak anything intelligently, and would require 3 people to hold her down to clean and feed her, as she fought like a tomcat. They wrongly assumed I'd start at the end of the list of rooms they gave me (so as to be closer to the other worker since I was new) and I went to the beginning on the other side of the building. So I had no idea, no warning, but God knew was what needed.
The woman had been in an institution for 40 years, and had not spoken in 20. The nurse, by the grace of God, was a Baptist and didn't turn me in, keeping our "secret" and smiling when all the other nurses remarked over this woman's amazing recovery and talkativeness. She told them she had been raped for years in the institution. The patient said, "They didn't think I knew what they were doing, but I did."
She was hospitalized with pneumonia before I came back on shift. The nurse told me of the woman's restored ability to talk intelligently and that she had asked my name and told her to tell me she loved me. She slipped into a coma and did not come out of it, while in the hospital. But the woman passed AT PEACE, and to GOD be all the glory.
Why does that power not distribute and win over those who would "ostrasize"? How am I to believe such stories of men spirit filled so easily defeated?
:cloud9: It's not a question of defeat, but as I said before God has a plan for each individual, and He will not empower us to do anything beyond that plan at that exact point in time.
I hope to live to see and envision a day in the not too distant future, when the sons of God will be fully exposed, from being fully filled and anointed with the Spirit without measure, just as their elder brother was, and then they will turn the world upside down again. Blessings...
Quote from: Paul Hazelwood on April 01, 2009, 09:59:27 PM
I see what your saying cardinal and sorry that I don't buy it, not that your lying or anything, but I see what I see.
Why is it that it appears that these spirit filled men claim such success only to be defeated by mere man and his laws?
Why does that power not distribute and win over those who would "ostrasize"? How am I to believe such stories of men spirit filled so easily defeated?
Really, that, in part, is the story of the crucifixion of Christ. He was despised, rejected of men...they hated Him without a cause. If He was of God, why didn't God save Him? "He saved others; but, Himself He cannot save," is what the people at the cross said.
Look at the story of Elijah. Israel knew how he had stopped the rain, called down fire, slew the priests of Baal. Yet, Jesus pointed out, when He was at His home town (where they tried to kill Him), that, "There were many leppers in Israel in the days of Elijah; but, only one, Naaman, a Syrian [so a "gentile"] was healed."
I would add that most of what happens among Godly people is VERY under reported. Research a while back yielded a whole book on the nature of those in media. One figure I remember was 9 out of 10 journalists had never been in a church building, even to get out of the rain. Yet, they all felt they were responsible to induce their public to think like themselves.
Here is a similar observation in Scripture: "You convict, you murder the just; he is not resisting you." (James 5:6, CLV) I know when they were going to pray in the garden on the night of His arrest Jesus asked if those with Him had a sword and they said they did. He answered them, "That's sufficient." There is a place allowed for those following Jesus to take up arms. Yet, the Christians in 2,000 years of history have never even had an army. The Knights Templar were the closest thing to it. Anyway, it is a big subject you've raised.
Quote from: Cardinal on April 02, 2009, 01:17:47 AM
I totally understand your disbelief Paul, if you've never been exposed to anything like what I'm telling you. I would have never believed it, either, if the Lord had not manifested in this way with me and others I was around in the beginning of my walk with Him.
It is not about my disbelief actually, I am at the mercy of your words, if I have misunderstood you I apologize.
You wrote the following in the note that I responded to.
QuoteA mere handful of Spirit filled men changed the world in their generation and there's no reason to think another handful couldn't, if they were TRULY Spirit filled.
The issue I see is that this assertion is made, then following that you appear to be talking about examples of spirit filled men in the modern day as if what you have seen or experienced was people TRULY spirit filled..
I may be misunderstanding what your getting at.
:cloud9: Well, I guess what I'm trying to explain (badly) is that we are in the in-part realm, BUT, at His direction even in only being endowed IN-PART, we are still used in this day and age to do some of the things that Jesus did.
BUT; the in-part realm, the two days He was talking about, is coming to a close, in which we must choose to allow Him to finish the work in us, that we may be FULLY FILLED, FULLY ANOINTED, as our elder brother was, to do the GREATER WORKS He said we would do. Blessings....
QuoteGod has set up a system whereby the pressures exerted force man to find HIM.
:icon_flower:
Card :icon_flower:
Sure enjoyed your uplifting posts on this thread, specailly that of the speechless patient... :HeartThrob:
AWESOME :icon_flower:
:cloud9: Yes, God is amazing and exciting; there is no way you could NOT want to walk with Him if you are witnessing His power and mercy. Blessings....