I hope this is not taken as a continuing of the thread about the "trinity" that I feel has run it's course.
This endeavor is to find, in the Bible, where the Spirit of God/Holy Spirit stands in the whole of what began(as far as where the Book begins) in what the Lord's plan and purpose is/was/will be, and where and how the Spirit/Holy Spirit has a place.
What does "the Bible say or speak" of God's Spirit as being an entity, say as a person (like a individual), or as a separate unique unit?
And, what does "the Bible say" about the Holy Spirit being a person or a separate entity
that works by it's own will, to accomplish whatever it does?
As well, what does "the Bible say" about the Spirit of God or Holy Spirit having a voice in the whole of creation?
How about in Genesis during creation week - "In the beginning God" and "the spirit of God was hovering over the waters"
This is just my opinion. God is omnipresent so there is no place that he is not. When people portray God in a specific place, they use the term the "spirit of God" :Chinscratch:
For me, there is NO place He is not.
I don't want to send by post off thread on post #3 but you said, "during creation week-" just what do you mean by "creation week?"
Should you desire to start another thread for your response, it's fine with me. :dsunny:
By creation week I mean the literal 6 day work of creation and the seventh day of rest which our calendar is based on and which was written in stone by the finger of God for Moses and the people of Israel and Jesus saying, "In the beginning God made them male and female" :Peace2:
Quote from: ded2daworld on July 03, 2013, 12:21:26 AM
By creation week I mean the literal 6 day work of creation and the seventh day of rest which our calendar is based on and which was written in stone by the finger of God for Moses and the people of Israel and Jesus saying, "In the beginning God made them male and female" :Peace2:
Well then my friend and brother in Christ we are not in agreement. I do not accept that calendar and I doubt the publishing of such was done by a "finger" and certainly not "the" finger." :Peace2:
You may disagree with what the bible says all you like. It's OK by me. :Peace2:
Quote from: ded2daworld on July 03, 2013, 06:57:21 AM
You may disagree with what the bible says all you like. It's OK by me. :Peace2:
I try very hard not to disagree with the Bible at all.
So where does the Bible says that there was a creation week or are you assuming that because today it is understood what a week is, and it must certainly be the same In the beginning....?
Why Ded within the questions I posted would you throw in words like "creation week" do you think that by chapter 2 of Genesis that a Firestone Tire calender came in the mail and was hung up on the wall and day 1-7 were just x'ed off?
I mean "You may disagree with what the bible says all you like. It's OK by me. " Just where is my disagreement with the Bible? Then again maybe you should start a thread on "creation week?"
Quote from: ded2daworld on July 03, 2013, 12:07:27 AM
How about in Genesis during creation week - "In the beginning God" and "the spirit of God was hovering over the waters"
This is just my opinion. God is omnipresent so there is no place that he is not. When people portray God in a specific place, they use the term the "spirit of God" :Chinscratch:
I agree with this sentiment.
Quote1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God;
2 this one was in the beginning with God;
3 all things through him did happen, and without him happened not even one thing that hath happened.
4 In him was life, and the life was the light of men,
5 and the light in the darkness did shine, and the darkness did not perceive it.
6 There came a man -- having been sent from God -- whose name [is] John,
7 this one came for testimony, that he might testify about the Light, that all might believe through him;
8 that one was not the Light, but -- that he might testify about the Light.
9 He was the true Light, which doth enlighten every man, coming to the world;
10 in the world he was, and the world through him was made, and the world did not know him:
11 to his own things he came, and his own people did not receive him;
12 but as many as did receive him to them he gave authority to become sons of God -- to those believing in his name,
13 who -- not of blood nor of a will of flesh, nor of a will of man but -- of God were begotten.
14 And the Word became flesh, and did tabernacle among us, and we beheld his glory, glory as of an only begotten of a father, full of grace and truth.
15 John doth testify concerning him, and hath cried, saying, `This was he of whom I said, He who after me is coming, hath come before me, for he was before me;'
16 and out of his fulness did we all receive, and grace over-against grace;
17 for the law through Moses was given, the grace and the truth through Jesus Christ did come;
18 God no one hath ever seen; the only begotten Son, who is on the bosom of the Father -- he did declare.
-John 1:1-18
Jesus Christ is the God of the Old Testament. Christ was present at the creation, Christ was there throughout the entire Old Testament period. No man has EVER seen the face of the Father, God speaks to us through His only begotten Son, Christ Jesus. The Comforter whom Christ speaks of is really Himself in Spirit. He was no longer among them in the FLESH, the parakletos (the Advocate, the Comforter, the Counselor), Jesus Christ in His risen Spirit form is the Holy Spirit
of God.
Quote from: micah7:9 on July 03, 2013, 02:36:08 PM
Quote from: ded2daworld on July 03, 2013, 06:57:21 AM
You may disagree with what the bible says all you like. It's OK by me. :Peace2:
I try very hard not to disagree with the Bible at all.
So where does the Bible says that there was a creation week or are you assuming that because today it is understood what a week is, and it must certainly be the same In the beginning....?
Why Ded within the questions I posted would you throw in words like "creation week" do you think that by chapter 2 of Genesis that a Firestone Tire calender came in the mail and was hung up on the wall and day 1-7 were just x'ed off?
I mean "You may disagree with what the bible says all you like. It's OK by me. " Just where is my disagreement with the Bible? Then again maybe you should start a thread on "creation week?"
I was an atheist formerly before the Lord called me back into His fold and even before then when I was a "believer" I felt strongly that evolution was the answer. When I was Catholic I believed in Theistic evolution and as an atheist I believed in Darwinism. However when I was called back I feel strongly that God put it on my heart that the account of Genesis is what took place like it is written. However this topic really needs it's own thread.
I have no problem with a literal 24/7 creation week ~6,000 years ago. I also have no problem with a longer span of creation of non-24 hour "days."
"In the beginning..." can also be rendered "By periods..." or "By headships..."
Is there really any reason to use "day" over "age" in Genesis 1, or is it tradition?
The "creation week" as you may want to call it began Gen.1:3 it was not in the beginning, which is the "firstfruits" and as Wayfaring Stranger elluded to, is Jesus Christ. (Col.1: 16,17) who is the firstfruits ICor.15:23.
It was Jesus who spoke Gen 1:3 And God said, Let there be light: Joh 5:37 `And the Father who sent me Himself hath testified concerning me; ye have neither heard His voice at any time, nor His appearance have ye seen;
And as for me, science has proven that the earth is much older that 6,000 years. And Laz is correct "Is there really any reason to use "day" over "age" in Genesis 1, or is it tradition?" I favor the later.
That said, The OP....I hope this is not taken as a continuing of the thread about the "trinity" that I feel has run it's course.
This endeavor is to find, in the Bible, where the Spirit of God/Holy Spirit stands in the whole of what began(as far as where the Book begins) in what the Lord's plan and purpose is/was/will be, and where and how the Spirit/Holy Spirit has a place.
What does "the Bible say or speak" of God's Spirit as being an entity, say as a person (like a individual), or as a separate unique unit?
And, what does "the Bible say" about the Holy Spirit being a person or a separate entity
that works by it's own will, to accomplish whatever it does?
As well, what does "the Bible say" about the Spirit of God or Holy Spirit having a voice in the whole of creation?
Quote from: Lazarus Short on July 06, 2013, 05:09:17 PM
I have no problem with a literal 24/7 creation week ~6,000 years ago. I also have no problem with a longer span of creation of non-24 hour "days."
"In the beginning..." can also be rendered "By periods..." or "By headships..."
Is there really any reason to use "day" over "age" in Genesis 1, or is it tradition?
I have to say that IMO periods and headships do a much better job of keep time than literal 24 hour days.
I believe God knew people would believe long ages, simply because it's "accepted"
I also believe that is why God was clear saying "there was evening and there was morning, the first day" and repeating it for all six days. No one thinks "HMMM, i wonder if Jonah was in the belly of the big fish for 3 days or 3 thousand years.
There is only one reason to doubt they were actual approx. 24 hour days and that is the scientists trying to make evolution "fit" since it requires an extremely long period of time - like forever since it's scientifically impossible.
All of man's reckoning of time and evolution is not based on science at all but speculation.
True science is so creation and evolution and the age of the earth are outside the realm of science. :Peace2:
This does not answer the question but might add something.
John 14
18 I will not leave you comfortless (orphanos bereft of instruction/orphaned): I will come to you.
26 But the Comforter, which is the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.
I believe that as an early follower of Jesus Christ walked around the countryside, over this hill, over that hill, then into a village, and there among the people they would see a stranger, but that stranger would have a flame over his or her head and nobody except followers of Jesus could see that flame - and they would know, of course, that that stranger was no stranger but a friend made "alive" in a way nobody expected.
The Holy Spirit is very powerful and reveals, comforts, instructs or brings to remembrance, but I believe the Holy Spirit is not confined to the recorded forms of manifestation at all. Personally, I believe that if a person has perfect faith in Jesus Christ Himself and can abandon everything and rely solely on Jesus, then the Holy Spirit works in a way that was "unknown" and yet is "restricted" - if I may use that word about a Power without restriction - by lack of faith in Christ and His Power.
Quote from: ded2daworld on July 07, 2013, 12:42:04 AM
I believe God knew people would believe long ages, simply because it's "accepted"
I also believe that is why God was clear saying "there was evening and there was morning, the first day" and repeating it for all six days. No one thinks "HMMM, i wonder if Jonah was in the belly of the big fish for 3 days or 3 thousand years.
There is only one reason to doubt they were actual approx. 24 hour days and that is the scientists trying to make evolution "fit" since it requires an extremely long period of time - like forever since it's scientifically impossible.
All of man's reckoning of time and evolution is not based on science at all but speculation.
True science is so creation and evolution and the age of the earth are outside the realm of science. :Peace2:
"There is only one reason to doubt they were actual approx. 24 hour days and that is the scientists trying to make evolution "fit" since it requires an extremely long period of time - like forever since it's scientifically impossible." (Ded)
The only I reason that I would "doubt" it is because Jesus said it ain't so.
Joh 11:9 Jesus answered, `
Are there not twelve hours in the day? if any one may walk in the day, he doth not stumble, because the light of this world he doth see;
Joh 11:10 and if any one may walk in the night, he stumbleth, because the light is not in him.'
Quote from: lastpost on July 07, 2013, 12:59:35 AM
This does not answer the question but might add something.
John 14
18 I will not leave you comfortless (orphanos bereft of instruction/orphaned): I will come to you.
26 But the Comforter, which is the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.
I believe that as an early follower of Jesus Christ walked around the countryside, over this hill, over that hill, then into a village, and there among the people they would see a stranger, but that stranger would have a flame over his or her head and nobody except followers of Jesus could see that flame - and they would know, of course, that that stranger was no stranger but a friend made "alive" in a way nobody expected.
The Holy Spirit is very powerful and reveals, comforts, instructs or brings to remembrance, but I believe the Holy Spirit is not confined to the recorded forms of manifestation at all. Personally, I believe that if a person has perfect faith in Jesus Christ Himself and can abandon everything and rely solely on Jesus, then the Holy Spirit works in a way that was "unknown" and yet is "restricted" - if I may use that word about a Power without restriction - by lack of faith in Christ and His Power.
I would agree. The only difference is, I would use the word "ordered" rather than "restricted" but that's just me. :dsunny:
Micah said,
"Joh 11:9 Jesus answered, `Are there not twelve hours in the day? if any one may walk in the day, he doth not stumble, because the light of this world he doth see;
Joh 11:10 and if any one may walk in the night, he stumbleth, because the light is not in him.'"
Yes 12 hours in a day and 12 hours in a night. evening and morning one day. :Peace2:
...unless you think Jesus thought the earth only took 12 hours for a full rotation.
Quote from: ded2daworld on July 07, 2013, 02:48:01 AM
Micah said,
"Joh 11:9 Jesus answered, `Are there not twelve hours in the day? if any one may walk in the day, he doth not stumble, because the light of this world he doth see;
Joh 11:10 and if any one may walk in the night, he stumbleth, because the light is not in him.'"
Yes 12 hours in a day and 12 hours in a night. evening and morning one day. :Peace2:
...unless you think Jesus thought the earth only took 12 hours for a full rotation.
What? :sigh:
And by the way, Micah did not say, I believe that was Jesus who said... "
Jesus answered, `Are there not twelve hours in the day? if any one may walk in the day, he doth not stumble, because the light of this world he doth see;
Joh 11:10 and if any one may walk in the night, he stumbleth, because the light is not in him.'"
Where you getting that? As far as 12 hours in a day and 12 hours in a night, we are are talking about the day, not the night. Remember the darkness was chaos, and work is done in the day "yom-age" in the heat. I really like the idea of science proving God. In fact I love it. Has nothing to do with evoliution and making something "fit." Should you hold to the concept of 24 hours in a day and that is your limit, there is a lot of "splainin' " to do.
2 Peter 3
8 But do not forget this one thing, dear friends: With the Lord a day is like a thousand years, and a thousand years are like a day.
IMO this verse shows that time is relative. He may be saying a day but what does a day represent? Anything between one day and a thousand years? Or more?
I give up. Why a christian would want to make the scripture different than what it plainly says is beyond me. And "evening, morning, the first day...etc" is even more plain than Jonah being in the belly of the whale for three days. No one ever says, "I wonder if the Lord meant to say 3,000 years or maybe being in the belly of the whale was symbolic of three ages.
The only reason people quibble over genesis one is they have been led to believe the pseudo scientific research which speculates long ages of time. As a former science teacher, I know and many scientist know that speculative science (that which cannot be tested, observed and repeated is just that - speculation.
There is a good reason NO christian 200 years ago believed the earth was more than 6,000 years, it's because they didn't try to "blend" scripture with science though scripture is 100% scientifically accurate and disagreement with scripture is speculation and cannot be proven even though many scientist talk as if its a proven fact.
The Lord may have many things to say to me but one of them won't be, "Why didn't you believe the scripture I gave you?" because I use the "Island man" test.
If a person grew up on a deserted Island with no outside influences but could read. Given a bible, what would he take it to me on any particular verse? :Chinscratch:
Does anyone believe that the OT is just literal stories without spiritual revelation?
Since this thread has jumped to the "creation week." And that some believe in a 6 day creation how shall we restart? :HeartThrob: :dsunny:
Just what is a "day-yom (be hot; a day (as the warm hours)-age? Jesus said that a "day" was 12 hours, so we are not talking of Night H3915 properly a twist (away of the light), that is, night; figuratively adversity: - ([mid-]) night (season).
Darkness H2822 the dark; hence (literally) darkness; figuratively misery, destruction, death, ignorance, sorrow, wickedness: - dark (-ness), night, obscurity.
They are true stories with spiritual signifigance... When you KNOW Jesus knew there were 24 hours in a day and ignore the obvious reference of day being short for daylight...well play all you want, make scriptures say whatever you want, interpret so it fits in with what you believe, say scripture doesn't mean what it says. say God meant to say something else other than what he said, have fun! :thumbsup:
" When you KNOW Jesus knew there were 24 hours in a day and ignore the obvious ..."
I don't KNOW any such thing, Jesus said, 12 hours in a day, and should Jesus have that knowledge of 24 hours in a day, He did not use it to explain what He was speaking of. And for you, yes 24 hours in a day is obvious. :Peace2:
Here is a question. For what reason would God in the beginning, create with the obvious logic of a 24 hour day that logical carnal man would find obvious? As for what I have read in the Bible God has never worked in the obvious of man's carnal thoughts. I have found nothing that He has done to be obvious, and should it be so obvious to man, why the need for revelation by the Spirit?
All I am offering is that since man and his theology just puts a seal of approval on something, don't just make it so.
And as for science, for me all science proves is the Greatness of the Lord God I believe in. I do not believe in evolution or Darwinism. :dsunny:
IMO
I lean more toward the Idea that we do not know unless the Spirit
reveal it to us how long a day is.
There were two days that past before the Sun and the Moon where created.
Ded how could you tell how long the first day was if there was no such thing as a Sun.
Because the bible says "there was evening and there was morning, the first day" and when God said, "let there be light," it wasn't necessary for the sun to be in place for light to be shining on the earth until the fourth day when the sun, moon and stars were created.
The bible says when there are a new heavens and earth, there will not be a sun, for all will be lit by the glory of God himself. :dsunny:
Personally I don't believe that the Light and the sun have anything to do with what the Creator was doing. Beside when you look at it from what is considered "nature's law," God had grass and fruits growing before the sun.
A 6 day 24 hour creation week, is, I will offer, as, say weak. :Chinscratch:
Why would all powerful and all mighty God (Yahweh) need thousands of years to create? [He already displayed His great patience, imo, by waiting so very long, for the 1st bound to occur rebel thought - very long time, because when there was 'only' the Father, the Son and the angels, surely there wasn't thAt much to go astray about! hence.. loong wait]
But, the main thing is, if evolution is true as to origins, why would Yahweh say death entered the world through sin, and, before then, "behold, it was all good". No death.
That's if the thousands of years believed is for evolution.. which takes, so they say millions, er, now that's billions, of years of "death" before the 1st man and woman.
There's actually many ways of dating the earth, which suggest a much younger one than the scientists (man) prefer, and actually only a handful of ones which suggest the millions/billions/trillions/infinity of years needed for 'evolution' to be the origin of life..
Other than that, imo, the millions/trillions are not needed.
When Yahweh "makes a new heavens and a new earth" will it take thousands of years? :Peace2:
When the millions of sleeping in death believers are resurrected, will it take God a thousand years? or the blink/twinkling of the eye?
And when the trillions of nonbelieving dead are resurrected, will that take another thousands of years?
Note: I think folks confuse 'evolution' and natural selection, which can also be called macro evolution, which does occur. Changes, adaptations do occur [atheistic theology assumes "intelligent design" denies change :rolllol: ]
When bacteria 'evolves' immunity to antibiotic, it's not that it grew new traits. It's that the non-immune bacteria dies, and the immune bacteria multiplies. This is separation of traits "already present" not the developing of new.
jes sayin' :smile: :hiya:
Also, compromising with atheistic 'science' as to origins (which once we actually study it, in many opinions, is no "science" at all!!!) Compromising with man's adult fairy tale will not accomplish any good will. And is compromising God's Word, I don't think people can get their teeth into a diluted word, thus folks are falling away from the faith in droves.. education has undermined truth.
1 Corinthians 2:5
King James Version (KJV)
5 That your faith should not stand in the wisdom of men, but in the power of God.
Why would Yahweh need more than 6 evenings and mornings? :smile: And if He spent longer, why make it sound like it only took 6 evenings and mornings? Saying at the end of the description of each day "an evening and a morning, a day"
Genesis 1:5
Young's Literal Translation (YLT)
5 and God calleth to the light `Day,' and to the darkness He hath called `Night;' and there is an evening, and there is a morning -- day one.
YOM
Alright, let's cover some more things about day. Day is used to represent many things other than, even the daylight part of a 24-hour solar cycle. Day is used to represent the word 'time' 67 times in the Old Testament. It just means time.
Genesis 4:3: And in the process of time (yom) it came to pass. Cane brought forth...
In the process of yom, days. It's the word day. Day and days 2,291 times always comes from the word yom, it's pronounced like home, not yum. So in the process of time. If you say in the process of days it came to pass, well you would understand it. But time fits better.
In Deuteronomy 10:10 it speaks about the time.
Deu 10:10 And I stayed in the mount, according to the first time (yom), forty days and forty nights;
Where it talks about forever or for the eon many times, Isaiah 30.
Isa 30:8 Now go, write it before them in a table, and note it in a book, that it may be for the time (yom) to come forever and ever:
It's yom, day. Day can be used many ways.
1Kings 1:1 Now king David was old and stricken in years (yom)...
David was old and stricken in years. The word is yom. He was stricken in yom.
Gen 41:1 And it came to pass at the end of two full years (yom)...
Gen 47:28 And Jacob lived in the land of Egypt seventeen years: so the whole age (yom) of Jacob was a hundred forty and seven years.
The whole age of Jacob. It's yom. The yom of Jacob.
It's used to mean the word ago or always or season.
Joshua 24:7 ...and ye dwelt in the wilderness a long season (yom).
They dwelt in the wilderness a long season, a long yom.
This word is used all kinds of ways that never ever insinuates 24-hours.
In Chronicles it's translated to the word 'chronicles' 37 times in the Old Testament. It's translated 'continually' or 'continuance' and 'ever' or 'evermore,' that's King James talk.
So yom is not for a 24-hour period. It stands for time in general, days, weeks, months, years, eons, ages.
Another interesting verse is Genesis 1.
Gen 1:14 And God said, Let there be lights in the firmament of the heaven to divide the day (yom) from the night;
How about that. Is a day and a night, a day? No, God divided them. They're two different things. He divided the day from the night, how can they be the same thing? So when He says, "and the evening and the morning were day one," that could be millions or billions of years. There is no time limit set on that whatsoever. None.
The impact crater in Wetumpka, Alabama It was only about 10 years ago that Alabama University or one of those in the geology department got funds and so on. They did core drillings down from the parapet wall and they established once and for all, yes indeed this was an impact crater. They dated it 83 million years ago, that impact crater hit.
The ocean (at that time) was right there at Wetumpka. They are not sure if it hit on shore or out in the water slightly off shore, but right there is the dividing line. If you look at a topographical of Alabama or the United States you will see, it will be in yellow sweeping up there towards Wetumpka and Montgomery and they call that the Coastal plateau. That was all under water. Actually when you go back a little further than that, a couple of hundred million years ago and the ocean went all the way through the center of the United States and up to Canada, it was a giant waterway. It was maybe 800 miles wide, right through the middle of the United States. That was all ocean at one time.
Then we have these large ones (craters). Now the reason they believe that Chicxulub in the Yucatan... you know where the Yucatan Peninsula is, there between South America and the United States. The reason they think that may be responsible for the demise of the dinosaurs is that they know from other ways of dating that the dinosaurs died out about 65 million years ago. The Chicxulub impact crater dates to 65 millions years ago. So we not only have the extinction of the dinosaurs, we've got the smoking gun. So could an impact like that have destroyed all these huge beasts? Absolutely.
Time is an expression of God that man can measure.
God can not be measured .
God can use time in a way that man can not measure.
We will have to guess as to what time it is.
Quote from: marie glen on July 08, 2013, 05:19:12 PM
1 Corinthians 2:5
King James Version (KJV)
5 That your faith should not stand in the wisdom of men, but in the power of God.
Why would Yahweh need more than 6 evenings and mornings? :smile: And if He spent longer, why make it sound like it only took 6 evenings and mornings? Saying at the end of the description of each day "an evening and a morning, a day"
Genesis 1:5
Young's Literal Translation (YLT)
5 and God calleth to the light `Day,' and to the darkness He hath called `Night;' and there is an evening, and there is a morning -- day one.
Do not let this one fact escape your notice beloved, with the Lord one day is like a thousand years and a thousand years is like one day". 1 Pet 4:8
We are always quantifying the unquantifiable :o)
Quote from: dajomaco on July 09, 2013, 12:12:06 AM
Time is an expression of God that man can measure.
God can not be measured .
God can use time in a way that man can not measure.
We will have to guess as to what time it is.
Amen my friend! Amen. :dsunny:
I do not understand why people/believers find it so anti- Bible should The Creator have done what He did outside of man's comprehension of what a day/yom/age/years is?
It seems like such a small and closed mind. When science comes to the point where they can not explain things in the rational mind, they kick around the idea of a Higher Intelligence. And that is good.
In all my reading and study, science has proven the Lord God I believe in, more than all the religious denominations and their theologies combined. I believe in what is called the Bible, I believe in Jesus Christ the Savoir of the whole World and the more science is stumpted and has to fall back on that thought, I rejoice! :HeartThrob: :banana: :dsunny:
:iagree:
I see this topic of creation that snuck in here is a sticky one. As for me, should it continue and don't really care one way or another, but when I once believed in the fundamentalist view of a 6-24 hr day creation, and I really read the Genesis account, there were just too much many questions that raised doubt. Questions around time and order. And the Lord God is all about time and order. :2c:
Quote from: micah7:9 on July 09, 2013, 06:23:20 PM
I see this topic of creation that snuck in here is a sticky one. As for me, should it continue and don't really care one way or another, but when I once believed in the fundamentalist view of a 6-24 hr day creation, and I really read the Genesis account, there were just too much many questions that raised doubt. Questions around time and order. And the Lord God is all about time and order. :2c:
Some people are locked into the literal translations and can't see outside of the religious box. The theory of literal translations over allegorical or better yet spiritual translations is best left to the Holy Spirit to divide. :banana:
I hope this is not taken as a continuing of the thread about the "trinity" that I feel has run it's course.
This endeavor is to find, in the Bible, where the Spirit of God/Holy Spirit stands in the whole of what began(as far as where the Book begins) in what the Lord's plan and purpose is/was/will be, and where and how the Spirit/Holy Spirit has a place.
I think one of the places that the holy spirit is always is in the truth.
When I have recently discussed the creation week or the beginning.
I told Ron(a science guy ) you know me I am not insane or nuts LOL .
So when I tell you, how I think everything got started, I want you
to believe, that what I am telling you. Is what I actually believe in my heart.
I asked him to tell me what he believed not what this guy or that guy's opinion are
but what he actually believed .
I told him that we would not dissect what I believed or what he believed
until next time we meet.
I told him that God a supreme intelligence, spoke and the world came into existence.
I believe science is close to Identifying his voice in there study of atomic partials.
Ron when expressing and trying describe the beginning said that we come from nothing.
Later when we talked more about it, his stance was that no one could know.
He started mocking (softly) the idea that there was a God.
I had nothing to say about his believes.
I think IMO that if I tell some one what I believe and not defend it.
That they will have more opportunity search what they actually believe.
They will have nothing to defend.
I tease Ron when I see him " hey what are you doing"
he replies "nothing" I say "that's a good boy serving your God"
Not having to prove you are right is a blessing that the Lord has given me
that I did not ask for .He has opened my eyes to the raw power of the
Spirit of truth.