Are there a lot of Christians who believe in reincarnation? Because I do, and I always have. The way I see it, being saved does not mean saved from hell, but saved from the endless cycle of rebirths. I know that this will most likely be a controversial opinion in a Christian forum, but my beliefs are influenced by Eastern philosophy, and I would like to know if anybody here shares this belief.
Here's a thread that may be helpful to give some views of various members, and some folks will probably comment as well.
My brief comment; "it is appointed unto man once to die"
http://tentmaker.org/forum/christian-life/reincarnation-a-devil's-lie-is-it-acceptable-from-a-christian-point-of-view/msg112338/#msg112338
Reincarnation, aka, re-incarceration. It literally means, being made flesh again.
I recall the most telling thing from the New Testament on this subject comes from the Gospel of John, where Nicodemus came to Jesus, who told him that a man needed to be "born again" to see the kingdom of God. Nicodemus brought up reincarnation, and here Jesus had a perfect opportunity to expound on the subject, but He did not speak of physical re-birth, but of being reborn spiritually. I see that spiritual re-birth as resurrection, followed by glorification.
The fact that Jesus did't mention it, isn't much proof of anything.
Jesus was focussed on the spiritual.
Hi t35lacoil,
I too am coming round to the idea of reincarnation. Maybe that is what the second death is, coming back in another body.
When christians say that this teaching is from the devil, i feel that is a bit condescending to faiths that believe in this doctrine. In other words if you don't understand something, just say it's from the devil and that solves it, question solved.
Godbless
Nancy
Hi Nancy (and others). I think in some cases you are certainly right about Christians attributing things they do not understand to the devil. I have personally been told that I'm speaking under the power of satan many times by the religious. (I'm starting to get used to it lol...) In this case though I believe with all my heart that the doctrine of reincarnation really IS a lie. The reason I believe this is because my friend has had much experience with evil spirits, of which the Lord told her reincarnation is one. And in her words "a particularly nasty one". I'm telling you this because I'm concerned and I don't want you to be in bondage to this spirit. I'm pretty sure her testimoney is in that other thread if you want to read it. Her name is Cardinal. Blessings.
Quote from: WhiteWings on September 06, 2012, 10:28:20 AM
The fact that Jesus did't mention it, isn't much proof of anything.
Jesus was focussed on the spiritual.
Remember these words of Jesus, and I take them as a key in the New Testament: "If it were not so, I would have told you." I note that Nicodemus brought up the subject, and Jesus brushed it aside as (presumably) irrelevant, and yes, went on to other spiritual matters.
Quote from: Lazarus Short on September 07, 2012, 03:57:27 PM
Quote from: WhiteWings on September 06, 2012, 10:28:20 AM
The fact that Jesus did't mention it, isn't much proof of anything.
Jesus was focussed on the spiritual.
Remember these words of Jesus, and I take them as a key in the New Testament: "If it were not so, I would have told you."
That's just a reference to His own reborn words.
That reference doesn't prove or disprove anything.
I like what Nathan said in Feb. 2011 in the linked thread.
" I believe the idea of reincarnation is man's conclusion to God's spiirtual purposes. I do believe that we "become" a new creation. But I don't believe that we'll become a different form, that comes back as a different form, that comes back as a different form. and I definitely don't agree that we'll come back anything less than human. We were created in God's image . . .animals, objects are not God's image . . .
I don't see how reincarnation magnifies the cross. I see it turn more into a distraction from the cross than anything. What it seems to do mostly is raise more questions. Questions often lead to distractions. By pursuing all the knowledge that's out there on reincarnation, does it lead me closer to, further from or no change at all with my relationship with the Father?"
I say a hearty AMEN!
Hi there,
You mention that the Lord said that reincarnation is a lie. The trouble i have with this is that there is a well known catholic lady who received the marks of stigmata and she said that Jesus gave her a vision in which people were being tormented in hell.
Now i'm not saying the Cardinal didn't receive a revelation from God but what do you believe when people start saying the God told them this or that and especially when people say to us who believe in UR that it is the devil who is giving us this message.
Godbless
Nancy
Hi Nancy...what are the benefits to reincarnation?If there is no blessing for today,what is the use of this knowledge.Does it build up and edify, there has to be some gain to it????
just asking(cause we all are asking new challenging questions)
blessings
Hey Nancy. :) I'm going to give you my reasons but I think it requires a bit of my life story so bear with me a bit here lol.
I hear what you're saying for sure. I struggled for a long time trying to figure out who was telling the truth, who was lying, and who was being deceived of those who claimed to have revelations from God. The thing is before church doctrine such as calvinism started being driven into my head, I could hear Him quite well. I knew His voice and His nature and I was learning from Him. But I started listening to the preachers and teachers instead of His voice. I have no idea why... thinking back it's like, DUH, that was stupid lol! So instead of believing in His loving voice, I started to believe what the preachers said: He "chose" me to go to heaven and most of my family to go to hell. (None of my immediate family were Christians at that time.) I stopped being able to discern His voice very well because I had such a skewed view of His nature. Anyhow, I got to the point where I just couldn't bear the thought of hell anymore, it was after my daughter was born, I just couldn't imagine God ever letting her burn forever (or even for a short amount of time), I knew in my heart it wasn't right, I knew that it wasn't love, yet there were all these books and NDE's and visions that people claimed to have had about this horrible, fiery, tormenting place where God supposedly either throws or allows mankind to be thrown into. So I cried out to Him, "Lord what is the truth??? If hell is somehow good please show me!" I hadn't even thought about Universal Reconciliation, it had never occurred to me that was even an option. But I went to the library shortly after that prayer and randomly picked up three books. Each of those books either openly taught or hinted at Universal Reconciliation. There was nothing on the cover or description that would suggest any of those books even had anything about UR in them. I was like, OOOOOKAY I get it Lord lol!
Shortly after that there was a link on the side of my email to a website by a man who claimed to hear from the Lord. One of the things he claimed was that God wanted him to share that all people would eventually be saved, no matter how much persecution he had to get over that doctrine. (And as I'm sure you can guess, he likely gets a lot.) His website said "From the Voice of the Lord". At first I was VERY hesitant, I almost didn't read it because I had read so many people who claimed to hear from God who were very obviously crazy or worse... But I gave it a go and what he had to say really resonated with my spirit. It was like I had FINALLY found what I was looking for. (His website is hallvworthington.com in case you're wondering.)
Anyhow, at that time I was also reading here on TM. I started paying close attention to what Cardinal had to say because even though most of it went completely over my head, a lot of it also resonated with my spirit. I started searching her posts and realized, WOW, she is saying the exact same things as Hall is saying on his site, and she also claims to hear from God directly! Not only did Card have the same revelations from God that Hall had, she also had the signs and wonders to go with it. (God has healed people through her, given her words of prophecy, words of knowledge, discerning others thoughts, etc, etc.) But more than that, as I got to know the both of them, one thing REALLY stood out and that was that they both had the love that Christians are supposed to have! (By the way, they have never met, never talked, never emailed, nothing. Yet they both hear the same things from the Lord.) I started realizing that there are many more people who hear from God and they also teach the same things. It was like a major lightbulb moment for me and I was so excited lol.
The major thing for me is, both Hall and Cardinal taught that we need to go to Him ourselves to be taught of Him ourselves. HE is the teacher, and HE will lead us into all truth! It was like "OOOOHHHHHH YEAHHHHH!!!" LOL. Because that is what I had been doing at the start of my Christian walk. Once I left the church and started going to God again for truth, He started to show me the same things He has shown Cardinal and Hall, and He is beginning to free me from things that are holding me in bondage, which Hall and Card said He could do.
I now know Cardinal very well, she is one of my dearest friends and I believe every word of what she says, because a) she has the experiences to back up what she is saying, b) she has the love that Christ said His true followers would have, c) she has been shown the exact same things as Hall and others, and d) because God has shown me many of the same things He has shown her.
As for the stigmata woman; I have no idea what sort of a sign that is... I mean in the Bible His disciples signs were healing people, casting out demons, those sorts of things, not things such as stigmata marks, you know what I mean? To me now, it is fairly easy to see who is real and who is fake. The Lord will show us all of these things. :)
God bless you as well!
:HeartThrob:
The fact that a unclean spirit is referenced as reincarnation, doesn't mean the end of the whole concept.
e.g a curse is usually evil, but Christ himself cursed the fig tree.
A unclean spirit of reincarnation is probably tied to other stuff like paganism etc.
But the concept of reincarnation can be biblical, just that we don't not see that word in the bible, so there are no "christian" words considered pure, like trinity devised.
Quote from: thinktank on September 11, 2012, 01:28:30 AM
But the concept of reincarnation can be biblical
Bob Marley, I was afraid you were going to say that :winkgrin:
Where's the evidence it's Biblical? IMO, the cross takes care of that, through the work of the Holy Spirit. If it's appointed unto man once to die, and since it's the blood of Jesus through being given faith to believe on Him that cleanses and saves, why would coming back and coming back as something else be a necessity or even useful? How does that fit with the finished redemptive work of the cross?
Blessings, James.
Depends on the interpretation of several verses.
If we all preexisted a in heaven doesn't that mean we are reincarnated right now?
What about John Baptist being Elijah.
Quote from: WhiteWings on September 11, 2012, 07:15:04 AM
Depends on the interpretation of several verses.
If we all preexisted a in heaven doesn't that mean we are reincarnated right now?
What about John Baptist being Elijah.
I don't think so. I believe it would mean we are
incarnated [taking bodily form for the first time], not
reincarnated [returning
again to a bodily form].
I don't believe John the Baptist was Elijah. According to Luke 1:13-17, he came in the
spirit of Elijah - he was a
type of, not
the Elijah. When they asked him in John 1:19-21 if he was Elijah, and again, if he was the prophet, he answered them "no".
Reincarnation is the religious or philosophical concept that the soul or spirit, after biological death, begins a new life in a new body that may be human, animal or spiritual depending on the moral quality of the previous life's actions. This doctrine is a central tenet of the Indian religions...The word "reincarnation" derives from Latin, literally meaning, "entering the flesh again". The Greek equivalent metempsychosis roughly corresponds to the common English phrase "transmigration of the soul" and also usually connotes reincarnation after death. Many Christians regard Jesus as a divine incarnation. Most Christians believe that Jesus will come again in the Second Coming, although this is not a reincarnation. wikipedia
re•in•car•na•tion
1.
the belief that the soul, upon death of the body, comes back to earth in another body or form.
2.
rebirth of the soul in a new body.
3.
a new incarnation or embodiment, as of a person. Dictionary.com
Given what I said earlier about Jesus, who declined to confirm reincarnation, I did remember this morning Ezekiel's vision of the valley of dry bones (Ezekiel, chapter 37). The bones came together and acquired, sinew, flesh, skin, and finally breath. This happened under the direction of YHVH, (Behold the Hand, Behold the Nail) that is to say, Jesus, so there should be no contradiction between dem bones and the conversation with Nicodemus. If we take Ezekiel's vision literally, it is a form of reincarnation, or becoming flesh again. The difference between this and Hinduism lies in whether immortality of the soul is true or not. I take Hinduism's version of reincarnation as implying that we are always alive, but Ezekiel's version of reincarnation of reincarnation implies that we are quite dead between one set of flesh and the next. Of course, resurrection comes under the latter, I think, and what is resurrection but being made flesh again, admittedly in a Mark II version of the flesh?
Quote from: Lazarus Short on September 11, 2012, 05:51:09 PM
Given what I said earlier about Jesus, who declined to confirm reincarnation, I did remember this morning Ezekiel's vision of the valley of dry bones (Ezekiel, chapter 37). The bones came together and acquired, sinew, flesh, skin, and finally breath. This happened under the direction of YHVH, (Behold the Hand, Behold the Nail) that is to say, Jesus, so there should be no contradiction between dem bones and the conversation with Nicodemus. If we take Ezekiel's vision literally, it is a form of reincarnation, or becoming flesh again. The difference between this and Hinduism lies in whether immortality of the soul is true or not. I take Hinduism's version of reincarnation as implying that we are always alive, but Ezekiel's version of reincarnation of reincarnation implies that we are quite dead between one set of flesh and the next. Of course, resurrection comes under the latter, I think, and what is resurrection but being made flesh again, admittedly in a Mark II version of the flesh?
I've never studied the valley of dry bones in detail. Were those literally the same people? Could it have been symbolic/metaphoric language describing a renaissance, a renewal? Whether or not, yes, there is still the issue of resurrection in general. I personally see that as very specific, i.e., YHWH working a specific, direct miracle - transforming something, renewing something. Not some general plan of God that involves coming back, coming back, "to get it right". IMO, that occurring means the cross and Jesus' finished work there was insufficient. That's why I believe the cross takes care of the [generally understood] concept of reincarnation.
Quote from: Lazarus Short on September 11, 2012, 05:51:09 PM
Given what I said earlier about Jesus, who declined to confirm reincarnation, I did remember this morning Ezekiel's vision of the valley of dry bones (Ezekiel, chapter 37). The bones came together and acquired, sinew, flesh, skin, and finally breath. This happened under the direction of YHVH, (Behold the Hand, Behold the Nail) that is to say, Jesus, so there should be no contradiction between dem bones and the conversation with Nicodemus. If we take Ezekiel's vision literally, it is a form of reincarnation, or becoming flesh again. The difference between this and Hinduism lies in whether immortality of the soul is true or not. I take Hinduism's version of reincarnation as implying that we are always alive, but Ezekiel's version of reincarnation of reincarnation implies that we are quite dead between one set of flesh and the next. Of course, resurrection comes under the latter, I think, and what is resurrection but being made flesh again, admittedly in a Mark II version of the flesh?
I see this ision as the resurection, which kind of mutes reincarnation.
the resurrection is the putting on of Christ's glory. we are hidden in him,from wrath/death.
DO NOT BE AFRAID I AM THE FIRST AND THE LAST I AM THE LIVING ONE I WAS DEAD AND BEHOLD I AM ALIVE FOR EVER AND EVER
AND I HOLD THE KEYS OF DEATH AND HADES
Quote from: Nancy on September 08, 2012, 12:06:32 AM
Hi there,
You mention that the Lord said that reincarnation is a lie. The trouble i have with this is that there is a well known catholic lady who received the marks of stigmata and she said that <b>Jesus gave her a vision in which people were being tormented in hell.</b>
Now i'm not saying the Cardinal didn't receive a revelation from God but what do you believe when people start saying the God told them this or that and especially when people say to us who believe in UR that it is <b>the devil who is giving us this message.</b>
Godbless
Nancy
For me, IMO, this could just be a misinterpretation of the vision, it could be just a graphic image in what religion does to those who do not understand the ways of God.
As for the other part, again IMO, we all have the capability of having the spirit of the devil (a false accuser) in us and if we have all been chosen to come to the knowledge of the truth, do we not become a false accuser if we say to another that does not understand <i><b>"yet"</b></i>(but will in due time) that they will be punished forever because of their own lack of understanding?
This is why I believe we all have to continually examine ourselves and watch what we say and to who we say it, and that is because since the definition of words varies from person to person, it is in that, that division is caused and the separation continues.
Most Americans don't realize it but a true hindu from India does NOT see re-incarnation as a good thing.
To them it is a penalty for not doing everything right. Only when they have led a "wonderful" life are they freed from the penalty of reincarnation.
More problems with reincarnation:
1. We could not be reincarnated as animals and be true to the bible (made in the image of God)
2. Less than even 1% of humans even imagine or think or remember anything at all of a previous life.
(Do you think someone like Hitler could come back as a cockroach and think, "Oh yeah, I'm a cockroach now because I was a terrible person my last life) (time to work my way back up again.
3. No matter how many times we are re-incarnated (if true) we are still helpless sinners in need of a saviour. Since we all sin, we never "do better"
And as I think Jabcat mentioned, "It is appointed unto men once to die, then the judgment."
Quote from: ded2daworld on September 19, 2012, 09:32:33 PM
Most Americans don't realize it but a true hindu from India does NOT see re-incarnation as a good thing.
To them it is a penalty for not doing everything right. Only when they have led a "wonderful" life are they freed from the penalty of reincarnation.
We could not be reincarnated as animals and be true to the bible (made in the image of God)
No matter how many times we are re-incarnated (if true) we are still helpless sinners in need of a saviour. Since we all sin, we never "do better"
"It is appointed unto men once to die, then the judgment."
:thumbsup:
satan serpents sentence was to eat dust all the days of his life...and that is what he does until he and all his offspring is cast into lof.
these spirits have possessed many men's bodies over time...they have knowledge of that person they entered flesh of and possessed......
and as far as that lying stigmata sign of satan..he can cause seizures too,epeileptic fits,blindness...and lying visions on anyone....
you will know a tree by it's fruit...follow demoney..follow those who rule now...the falling away of christendom happened long ago...
appointed to man once to die...but demons are chained under the earth awaiting execution...they devour our flesh/dust and do not rise
but return to the dust of another fleshly body.....the abyss...when a star of heaven falls to earth and satan posseses it..it comes up out of the abyss
[under the earth] and is set free to deceive that man and it does..it wars against the truth of the camp of the Holy city
p.s. what was the original identity of the spirit in operation that put the wounds on Christ. If ye have done it unto one of these little ones
that beleive in me..ye have done it to me.
Wow sheila VERY enlightening post for me, thank you! I had never thought of that before, the evil spirits possessing men's bodies and giving them memories of another person's life. That seriously explains a lot.
Very interesting thread! :dsunny:
:thumbsup: makes great sense
Herods swelling words of deceit as reincarnation of John the Baptist
Mar 8:15 And he charged them, saying, Take heed, beware of the leaven of the Pharisees, and [of] the leaven of Herod
zyme G 2219 1) leaven
2) metaph. of inveterate mental and moral corruption, viewed in its tendency to infect others
Leaven is applied to that substance which is small in quantity, yet thoroughly pervades a thing by its influence. The NT uses it in both a positive (cf. Mat 13:33) or negative sense (e.g., "a little leaven leaveneth the whole lump").
.Mar 6:14 ¶ And king Herod heard [of him]; (for his name was spread abroad:) and he said, That John the Baptist was risen from the dead, and therefore mighty works do shew forth themselves in him. Mar 6:16 But when Herod heard [thereof], he said, It is John, whom I beheaded: he is risen from the dead.
we know now that only those risen are in Christ , Only Christ has risen and we are hid in His body the true church /union
Amen,sister!!!
truth is so very very important.....why it is written...the TRUTH SHALL SET YOU FREE
God is spirit...and His worshippers must worship Him in spirit and truth
no lie originates with the truth
1 John 5;6 This is the one who came by water and blood-Jesus Christ. He did not come by water only
but by water and blood. And it is the Spirit who testifies,
BECAUSE THE SPIRIT IS THE TRUTH
For these are three that tesify..the Spirit and the water and the blood.....
and the three are in agreement......
Anyone who believes in the son of God...Has His testimony in his heart....
Anyone who does Not believe God has made him out to be a liar,because He does not believe
the testimony God has given about His son...
AND THIS IS THE TESTIMONY.............GOD HAS GIVEN US ETERNAL LIFE
AND THIS LIFE IS IN HIS SON
HE WHO HAS THE SON HAS LIFE.....HE WHO DOES NOT HAVE THE SON OF GOD DOES NOT
the Shepherds and the angels
'DO NOT BE AFRAID, I BRING YOU GOOD NEWS OF GREAT JOY THAT WILL BE FOR ALL THE PEOPLE
TODAY IN THE TOWN OF DAVID, A SAVIOUR HAS BEEN BORN TO YOU[MANKIND]
HE IS CHRIST THE LORD!
SUDDENLY A GREAT COMPANY OF THE HEAVENLY HOSTS APPEARED WITH THE ANGEL,
AND PRAISED GOD SAYING
GLORY TO GOD ON HIGHEST!! AND ON EARTH PEACE TO MEN ON WHOM HIS FAVOUR RESTS
NOW THERE WAS A MAN IN jERUSALEM CALLED SIMEON..HE WAS WAITING FOR...
THE CONSOLATION OF ISREAL,AND THE HOLY SPIRIT WAS ON HIM...
THE GREAT MAGNITUDE AND SCOPE OF GOD'S GIFT OF HIS SON TO US IS OFTEN
WAY OVER THE HEAD OF THOSE FROM BELOW
AND TO THOSE WHO ARE BLIND EVEN IF IT BE RIGHT IN FRONT OF YOUR FACE...
YOU MUST BE 'BORN AGAIN' FROM ABOVE
A GREAT AND WONDROUS SIGN APPEARED IN HEAVEN.....A WOMAN CLOTHED WITH THE SUN
AND THE MOON UNDER HER FEET AND A CROWN OF 12 STARS ON HER HEAD....
,
SHE WAS PREGNANT AND CRIED OUT IN PAIN AS SHE WAS ABOUT TO BE DELIVERED
Let me put this post in here so I won't forget to get back here when it's not so late and I can participate.
It's NEVER too late with reincarnation, Reformer :laughing7:
Just come back and try again!
Wow! What a devilish idea.
If reincarnation is true I see it as another method for God to save all.
That God delays his coming until as many souls as possible are saved, from Gods wrath, ready to be revealed from heaven.
It would also mean earth gets more and more empty because in the end everyone but a few have be saved. It's getting more and more crowded...
How would that work with someone like Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, David?
They were all saved, did they have to come back after Jesus was born and do it the "right way?"
Quote from: ded2daworld on October 08, 2012, 06:53:17 PM
How would that work with someone like Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, David?
They were all saved, did they have to come back after Jesus was born and do it the "right way?"
Not sure. Hebrews seem to suggest that they did not receive the promise, that they were waiting for something better to arrive. A new covenant for them to operate under?
I just don't see re-incarnation serving any purpose.
Ezekial - "the dead no nothing"
All the (over 400) references to ancestors. Coulsd a man be his own ancestor?
NO biblical reference to "you were this person in a past life" or you are being rewarded/punished for what you did in a past life.
Only a couple of verses can possibly be stretched to imply reincarnation and they all refer to Melchizedek. Almost all authorites agree Melchizidek was a Christophany. (An appearance on earth by Christ before his earthly birth)
Similar to (Gen 18) when the three (angels)referred to as Lords, speak and act in unison(three being the number of God) called God, meet with Abraham. Later God leaves and Abraham is still standing there with God. Still later, Jehovah (God) on earth calls down fire and brimstone on Sodom and Gomorrah FROM Jehovah God in heaven.
legion says 'we are many" God says..'I AM" Christ says 'WE ARE ONE"...it is to satisfy the two or three wittnesses
to establish a matter where-ever two or three are joined in my name[one] I am there.
Quote from: ded2daworld on October 09, 2012, 08:40:58 PM
Almost all authorites agree Melchizidek was a Christophany. (An appearance on earth by Christ before his earthly birth)
I maintain that Melchizidek was none other than Shem - proof is not absolute, but Shem is a good candidate. Evidence in the Book of Jasher shows that Shem was in that area at that time.
That's a bit off topic. As for "re-incarceration," remember that God told Adam and Eve that they would die if they ate the fruit, not that they would have to keep coming back until they knew better than to eat the fruit. In most theological discussions, it's usually best to go to Genesis.
THE LAMB WAS SLAIN BEFORE THE FOUNDING OF THE EARTH..AND HIS SPIRIT AND LIFE IS SEEN
AND SPOKEN OF THROUGHOUT IT. FAITHFUL AND TRUE WITTNESS OF GOD'S WORD..COME
IN FLESH AS SPIRITUAL 'SEED' GENERATION THROUGH GENERATION..BEFORE ABRAHAM I WAS
AND MET HIM WITH BREAD AND WINE. HE WAS THE SEED OF THE WOMAN IN THE GARDEN
OF WHICH GOD TESTIFIED.HE TOLD HAAGAR TO RETURN AN SUBMIT TO SARAH..AND SHE SAID
I HAVE SEEN THE ONE WHO SEE'S ME'
.HE WAS THE REDEEMER TO JOB..WHO SAID'I HAD HEARD OF YOU BUT NOW I SEE YOU"
...WITHOUT BEGINNING..WITHOUT END.....THE VERY IMAGE AND LIKENESS
OF HIS FATHER. ALIVE BEFORE HE MANIFESTED IN FLESH AND WAS CRUCIFIED..AND ALIVE
FOREVER AND EVER...HE FILLS THE HEAVENS,HE IS THE MOUNTAIN THAT FILLS THE EARTH..HE IS
WALKING THROUGH WALLS..HE IS A WALL OF FIRE!..............
IN THE BEGINNING WAS THE WORD..AND THE WORD WAS WITH GOD, AND THAT WORD WAS GOD
HE WAS WITH GOD IN THE BEGINNING.... THROUGH HIM ALL THINGS WERE MADE..WITHOUT HIM
NOTHING WAS MADE. IN HIM WAS LIFE..AND THAT LIFE WAS THE LIGHT OF MEN
Origen teached reincarnation.
He is one of the earliest believer/writer in salvation of all men.
Quote from: thinktank on October 16, 2012, 12:57:58 AM
Origen teached reincarnation.
He is one of the earliest believer/writer in salvation of all men.
One out of two ain't bad. :happygrin:
Quote from: Lazarus Short on October 12, 2012, 08:33:41 PM
That's a bit off topic. As for "re-incarceration," remember that God told Adam and Eve that they would die if they ate the fruit, not that they would have to keep coming back until they knew better than to eat the fruit.
Yes, the work of the cross is the center of the Gospel, and it's what cleanses and saves - not living multiple lives to get better at good works or become a better person.
I don't believe in reincarnation...but I do believe this......so too, those borne along of the spirit...
no-one knows from whence they come..or where they are going............for sure Elijah has come...
and will come again
imo just as the spirit of satan comes in flesh again and again..as false-prophet..anti-christ..beast
dragon and original serpent...always working at cross-purposes to the will of God. So,too,the spirit
of God has come as truthful prophet and wittnes.s,spirit of christ/holy spirit,son of God and son
of man.as Melchezedek priest of deathless life
tow distinct spirit manifestations in this good/evil exercize.....one is death bringing spirit to mnkind
one is life-giving spirit to mankind
Quote from: jabcat on October 16, 2012, 01:58:05 AM
Quote from: thinktank on October 16, 2012, 12:57:58 AM
Origen teached reincarnation.
He is one of the earliest believer/writer in salvation of all men.
One out of two ain't bad. :happygrin:
just saying that there are men of God who believed this, its not just a Eastern philosophy.
Quote from: jabcat on October 16, 2012, 02:08:46 AM
Quote from: Lazarus Short on October 12, 2012, 08:33:41 PM
That's a bit off topic. As for "re-incarceration," remember that God told Adam and Eve that they would die if they ate the fruit, not that they would have to keep coming back until they knew better than to eat the fruit.
Yes, the work of the cross is the center of the Gospel, and it's what cleanses and saves - not living multiple lives to get better at good works or become a better person.
Reincarnation would give multiple opportunities for a soul to hear the good news. Increasing theri chance of being saved, before the great judgment.
Also this came to me, what of the scripture that speaks of those who do good and evil, will each have a body according to their works.
what if (During the millenium)an evil person will have to reincarnate into a crooked body, while those who did good are rewarded with a healthy and powerful abilities.
Quote from: thinktank on October 17, 2012, 01:17:08 AM
Quote from: jabcat on October 16, 2012, 01:58:05 AM
Quote from: thinktank on October 16, 2012, 12:57:58 AM
Origen teached reincarnation.
He is one of the earliest believer/writer in salvation of all men.
One out of two ain't bad. :happygrin:
just saying that there are men of God who believed this, its not just a Eastern philosophy.
:smile:
oh my no post here for 120 days
and here i was about to comment that it is good to see more positive interest in reincarnation..or so it seems in terms of what i had noted
on some earlier visits to tentmaker.org..but it seems i might need to post elsewhere
if the powers that be of tentmaker.org have accepted reincarnation
along the lines even of the edgar cayce material :)
:cloud9: Well, I for one don't accept it. Doubt you will find many on here who do. I see it as a works-based false religion of sorts. My :2c: Blessings....
i think reincarnation is part of biblical salvation but not presently emphasized in the bible
perhaps in that as the edgar cayce material says i think
it had become a problem for many in that they put off what they should be doing
or over dwelt on past issues and didnt focus on the present as well as they should..
thus some of the references were taken out and this was allowed by the holy spirit
for the good of the church....
part of the reasoning for reincarnation is i think
that the testing and nurturing of growth and development of the soul
is best accomplished in the set up that was made for that vary purpose
this earth
and thus it would be a waste of divine energy not to use the earth
for such...
I believe the work of the cross is sufficient.
Quote from: josh on April 24, 2014, 01:20:08 PM
on some earlier visits to tentmaker.org..but it seems i might need to post elsewhere
if the powers that be of tentmaker.org have accepted reincarnation
along the lines even of the edgar cayce material :)
The "powers that be" (whoever that is - Gary for one) have not "accepted reincarnation".
By Edgar Cayce I suppose you mean the psychic occultist? The man described as "The Occult Medicine of Edgar Cayce W.D.
(Witch Doctor)"? If so, no on that one too. Hope that helps.
Resurrection is true, which is defined as, someone having any sin which results in death, like Original Sin, which we?re all born with. Those who believe in Christ with faith alone in this life are resurrected from Sheol, the realm of the dead. Those who did not believe in Christ with faith alone in this life, will stay in Sheol until they are convinced to believe in Jesus with faith alone and are saved.
1 Cor. 15:22 "Since by man came death, by man also came the resurrection of the dead. For as in Adam ALL died, even so in Christ ALL shall be made alive."
Reincarnation, as defined as works salvation, which is, someone somehow escaping Sheol without faith alone in Christ is false. The only way we can be free from the Realm of the Dead, aka death, is to trust in Jesus Christ with faith only, no works salvation. When someone dies they cannot come back to life without Christ. It?s only Jesus Christ who raises the dead. And eventually, everyone will believe in Christ and be raised from the dead.
Hebrews 9:27 Just as people are destined to die once, and after that to face judgment.
1 Samuel 2:6 The Lord kills and he gives life, he sends down to Sheol, he can bring the dead up again.
The word ?again? here shows that the people in Sheol only died one time due to sin. Because the only way to be raised from the dead is through faith alone in Jesus. And when we believe in Jesus, we are permanently saved, we cannot lose our salvation! So when we are brought back to life after death, resurrected, we stay alive permanently.
Christ only died one time on the cross, and then was resurrected 3 days later, because He paid for the wages of sin, which is a one time death. Jesus did not have to keep coming back to life and dying over and over again, He only died once.
Essentially it follows this flow chart.
Man created -> Man dies from sin -> Man in Sheol -> Man Believes in Christ -> Man made alive permanently.
Christ exists -> Christ died for sin -> Christ preaches to the dead -> Christ convinces Man to believe in Him -> Christ gives permanent life to man.
PSALM 139:8 If I go up to the heavens, you are there; if I make my bed in Sheol, you are there.
Bed singular, one bed.