Lowered?

[Molly]

I also think it is quite possible that Adam was not lower than the angels till he "fell"/ was lowered because he "ate" from the tree of KOGAE(knowledge of good and evil :o) Jesus, being born of a woman, born under law, born into fallen mortal flesh was thus "lowered" into commonality with our estate so that he could redeem us from it, tasting death for every man.

.

But if Adam was an 'angel,' wouldn't that make him originally a spiritual being?

Sequence of events in Gen 2:

water goes up from the earth [baptism by water]

God forms Man from the dust and breathes into his nostrils [baptism by Holy Spirit]

God creates plants in the garden.

Trees, including two special trees.

A river which parts into four heads.

Every beast of the field and fowl of the air.

Eve.


Interesting?

[Molly]

Think of this--

God creates a clay man who is given the status of angels[sons of God] in dominion and likeness and image of God.

That must have really burned Satan and his minions.  Satan to self--It will take me two seconds to dispatch of this clay man and take over his dominion. 

But, what Satan didn't know was this--we were chosen in Christ before the casting down of the kosmos.   Satan didn't know who he was dealing with.  He was dealing with a clay man hidden in Christ.


For it seems to me that God has put us apostles on display at the end of the procession, like men condemned to die in the arena. We have been made a spectacle to the whole universe, to angels as well as to men.
--1 Cor 4:9

[sheila]

 :thumbsup:

     .....and remember,,Jesus Christ and the Father are ONE Spirit.....and so,too,Adam..until partaking of the tokogae...and an evil spirit/sin as we

  know it,entered in[enemy sowed tares]....Satan coveted to raise himself above the stars of heaven[angels] and above Father's chosen  for

  Dominion on earth.

    Actually satan has a big problem....IT IS THE SPIRIT OF THE ALMIGHTY IN MAN....HE HAS ATTACKED GOD  GREATER IS HE THAT IS IN YOU

   THAN HE THAT IS IN THE WORLD

   1 Peter 1;20  He was chosen before the creation of the world,but was revealed in these last times for your sake.Through him you beleive in God,

  who raised him from the dead and glorified him,and so your faith and hope are in GOD.

   

[Beloved Servant]

entered in, or was it there all the time?
perhaps we're just witnessing the time it took dominion.
remember, you/me are the "earth," and self-will eclipses the Son until the Day Star rises in your heart. Then you are Light inside and out!

[sheila]

    Zech 1;15   I was only an little angry,but they added to the calamity.

    Isaaih 47;6  I was angry with my people,and desecrated my inheritance, I gave them into your hand and you showed them no mercy. Even

  on the aged you laid a very heavy yoke

   Jer 46;28  I will discipline you but only with justice; I will not let you go entirely unpunished

[Beloved Servant]

Justice, an iron rod, but above all this MERCY.


Sacrifice and offering thou didst not desire; mine ears hast thou opened: burnt offering and sin offering hast thou not required.
But go and learn what this means: 'I desire mercy, not sacrifice.' For I have not come to call the righteous, but sinners."

[Beloved Servant]

Who am I that you are mindful of me?

[micah7:9]

Gen 3:19  In the sweat of thy face shalt thou eat bread, till thou return unto the ground; for out of it wast thou taken: for dust thou art, and unto dust shalt thou return.

Now that was the Lord God who said that. Does He not know what He did? "DUST" you are.

[Beloved Servant]

He was talking to Adam, not Christ.
Now, who am I that you are mindful of me!
Praise God; we are the Body of Christ.

[eaglesway]

I also think it is quite possible that Adam was not lower than the angels till he "fell"/ was lowered because he "ate" from the tree of KOGAE(knowledge of good and evil :o) Jesus, being born of a woman, born under law, born into fallen mortal flesh was thus "lowered" into commonality with our estate so that he could redeem us from it, tasting death for every man.

.

But if Adam was an 'angel,' wouldn't that make him originally a spiritual being?

Sequence of events in Gen 2:

water goes up from the earth [baptism by water]

God forms Man from the dust and breathes into his nostrils [baptism by Holy Spirit]

God creates plants in the garden.

Trees, including two special trees.

A river which parts into four heads.

Every beast of the field and fowl of the air.

Eve.


Interesting?

Where does it say Adam was an angel :o)  Its a fine "if" but, I havent seen that in the word.

[micah7:9]

He was talking to Adam, not Christ.
Now, who am I that you are mindful of me!
Praise God; we are the Body of Christ.

Aint that the whole point of Gen. 3:19?

[Molly]

Actually satan has a big problem....IT IS THE SPIRIT OF THE ALMIGHTY IN MAN....HE HAS ATTACKED GOD  GREATER IS HE THAT IS IN YOU

   THAN HE THAT IS IN THE WORLD

Yes!

But we have this treasure in earthen vessels, so that the surpassing greatness of the power will be of God and not from ourselves.

--2 Cor 4:7

[micah7:9]

Consider this verse  1Co 15:16  For if the dead are not raised, neither hath Christ been raised:

[eaglesway]

Slain before the foundation of the world

We were chosen in Him before [pro] the casting down [katabole] of the world.

The lamb was slain from [apo] the casting down [katabole] of the world.


In other words, the way I read it, the casting down of the world is what caused the lamb to be slain.  Satan was a murderer from the beginning.

The way I read it, the lamb slain was the first thought(logos) of God in the expression/revelation of the divine nature to the creation, and it was within the original eudokia(kind intention) of His purpose to gather all things in one in Christ. :o) And these are all perspectives of a truth perhaps to great for us to fully intellectualize of course.

[sheila]

   there are only two wills...the will of the adversary[evil] and the will of God[good]   the will of one  enters and leads us into perdition.[murderer]

..and the will of the other enters us and brings us forth from it[to tol/eternal life] Man's will,as we know it, comes from these two sources/spirits.

   God says we can not serve two masters...the wages of one is death..the free gift of the other is eternal life

[Molly]

I also think it is quite possible that Adam was not lower than the angels till he "fell"/ was lowered because he "ate" from the tree of KOGAE(knowledge of good and evil :o) Jesus, being born of a woman, born under law, born into fallen mortal flesh was thus "lowered" into commonality with our estate so that he could redeem us from it, tasting death for every man.

.

But if Adam was an 'angel,' wouldn't that make him originally a spiritual being?

Sequence of events in Gen 2:

water goes up from the earth [baptism by water]

God forms Man from the dust and breathes into his nostrils [baptism by Holy Spirit]

God creates plants in the garden.

Trees, including two special trees.

A river which parts into four heads.

Every beast of the field and fowl of the air.

Eve.


Interesting?

Where does it say Adam was an angel :o)  Its a fine "if" but, I havent seen that in the word.

I was just responding to what you said, 'it is quite possible that Adam was not lower than the angels until he fell.."  So, I put 'angel' in quotes.  I think I understood you to be saying that Adam might have been on the same level as angels.  And, I asked--wouldnt that make him a spiritual being?

[sheila]

    the book of Enoch records that God said He created man a secound angel...if you can receive this.

[Molly]

    the book of Enoch records that God said He created man a secound angel...if you can receive this.

What is a 'second' angel?

[micah7:9]

   there are only two wills...the will of the adversary[evil] and the will of God[good]   the will of one  enters and leads us into perdition.[murderer]

..and the will of the other enters us and brings us forth from it[to tol/eternal life] Man's will,as we know it, comes from these two sources/spirits.

   God says we can not serve two masters...the wages of one is death..the free gift of the other is eternal life

Im not sure where you get some of your information but to say,"there are only two wills," and giving the adversary credit for one, is what I consider to be blasphemy! There is only ONE WILL and that is The Fathers Will.

[Beloved Servant]

...leaving all else simply a candle in the wind.

[micah7:9]

    the book of Enoch records that God said He created man a secound angel...if you can receive this.

Stop with the book of enoch, ["if you can receive this"] please. As far as I know we are dealing with information from 66 books.
Im not trying to cause disturbance but I do not feel the book of enoch or the book of mary, or thomas (all are good reading) but have no input or do they?

[sheila]

    DISOBEDIANCE HAS A WILL OF IT'S OWN...and it is Not of the Father.

    But,I'm sorry...I just realized this is taboo...and I do not deserve to stir up contention. I will speak no further of it out of respect for the administrators

[Molly]

    the book of Enoch records that God said He created man a secound angel...if you can receive this.

Stop with the book of enoch, ["if you can receive this"] please. As far as I know we are dealing with information from 66 books.
Im not trying to cause disturbance but I do not feel the book of enoch or the book of mary, or thomas (all are good reading) but have no input or do they?

Our Bible refers to the book of Enoch.  So I would think Sheila could also.

[Beloved Servant]

    DISOBEDIANCE HAS A WILL OF IT'S OWN...and it is Not of the Father.

It's the pride of life.

[eaglesway]

I have no problem with these concepts. the second angel, etc. I think it is an error to teach them as foundational or expect others to receive them when there is another reasonable interpretation of the scriptures. I tend to agree with micah on the 66 books tho. I certainly would not seek to overturn someone elses belief in something seen through a glass darkly on the basis of things wrtten in apocraphal books.