God has a solid form?

[Nathan]

I'll be a bit moe definitive . . Yes God is solid . ..no he's not . . . .there.  He is all in all . . .first and last . . .visible and invisible . . .crazy topic . . .
Jesus is that SPIRIT and where the Spirit of of the Lord is, there is liberty . . .is liberty visible or invisible?  Is is solid??  Is it vapor?  Define liberty, you'll find God at it's core.

[jabcat]

.crazy topic . . .

You'll notice for once that I haven't as yet joined in.  Give me time...   :laugh:

[WhiteWings]

The Jews were well aware of two Yahweh's--one visible, one invisible.

They didn't believe in two Gods.
Early Roman church taught binity instead of trinity; I wonder if that's related.
Anyway I never saw any hint that ancient (or modern) Jews believes in two Gods.
Perhaps they believed in God in steam and ice form as you call it. But that's the same God.
Remember why exactly it was blasphemy that Jesus said He was the son of God. It wasn't really the son part of it. It was because it implies He was also a God. By lack of a better word; God is a species. Offspring is always of the same species. So Jesus declared Himself God. And that was totally impossible because they firmly believe(d) that there is just one God.
I wonder how Jews view the seemingly conficting verses. Christians can use trinity or two persons to explain away the problem.
But how would Jews do it?

[WhiteWings]

The ancient Hebrews had no problem with the different manifestations of the One God.  They knew ice, water, steam are different manifestations of the same thing.

Was God ice when He walked in the Garden of Eden?

I think Eden was a special case because it is a spiritual place to begin with and Adam and Eve,  although human, were allowed to be in this place inhabited by God, but also by other spiritual beings, such as the Nachash.  I also think that Adam and Eve at that time had spiritual abilities and powers of discernment that man lost when he experienced the fall.   Remember, Adam was originally given dominion over the earth. His rightful habitation was eden.

The meaning of garden comes closest to farm land. Adam and Eve did work for food. The land outside the garden was also good farmland. God cursed the earth and then thorns and weed began to grow. If that was already the case outside Eden no curse was needed at all. So whole earth was a bit Eden like. That would mean everyone/thing lived in the spiritual place.
Note that Adam and Eve lived in the Holy of Holies and just were kicked out to the holies.

So, I don't think calling Eden a spiritual place is the answer to this topic.

[Molly]

The Jews were well aware of two Yahweh's--one visible, one invisible.

They didn't believe in two Gods.
Early Roman church taught binity instead of trinity; I wonder if that's related.
Anyway I never saw any hint that ancient (or modern) Jews believes in two Gods.
Perhaps they believed in God in steam and ice form as you call it. But that's the same God.
Remember why exactly it was blasphemy that Jesus said He was the son of God. It wasn't really the son part of it. It was because it implies He was also a God. By lack of a better word; God is a species. Offspring is always of the same species. So Jesus declared Himself God. And that was totally impossible because they firmly believe(d) that there is just one God.
I wonder how Jews view the seemingly conficting verses. Christians can use trinity or two persons to explain away the problem.
But how would Jews do it?

I was searching around for something to explain this better and found this article.  It references the Targum which indicates how the Jews were to understand these passages in the Bible.
What is it lawyers state about hearsay?  I don't offer this for the truthfulness but for the state of mind.



Author: Rabbi Michael 'Mordechai' Silver
The following was sent to the mailing list of a Messianic believer. It is very interseting because here, from someone who understands the language of the Old Testament we see that the Word is clearly called YHWH (Jehovah).

___________________________________________

This should help to clarify some confusion in the area of understanding the SHEMA when it says that YHVH is Echad. In the scriptures, "God the Father" is given the title of YHVH. Also, the WORD of YHVH (the Messiah) is also given the title of YHVH. How / Why? Because they are echad (a compound unity) and not Yachid (exclusively singular of each other). So, in scripture we sometimes see multiple YHVH's in the text. Below are some examples.

                                  **********************************************************

The Targums were authoritative Aramaic paraphrases of the books of the Tenach which were read in the synagogues along with the Hebrew of the Torah and Haftorah readings. Often when the Targums come to passages where YHWH is anthropomorphisised or seen, or where two or more YHWHs are indicated by the text, the Targums will substitute "The Word [Memra] of YHWH" for YHWH. For further understanding on the Targums see here.

For example in Gen. 19:24 the Tenach has:

And YHVH rained brimstone and fire upon Sodom and upon Gomorrah, from YHVH, from the heavens.
(Original Bible Project preliminary edition)

The Hebrew grammar here indicates that one YHWH rains fire from another YHWH. But Targum Jonathan substitutes "The Word of YHWH/the L-RD" for the first of the two YHWHs as follows:

And the Word of the YHWH caused to descend upon the peoples of Sodom and Gommorah, brimstone and fire from the YHWH in heaven.

In another example the Torah has:

Ex. 24:1a (YHWH is the speaker, see Ex. 20:1-2) "Now He [YHWH] said to Moses, "come up to YHWH..."

But Targum Jonathan paraphrases the speaker in Ex. 20:1 with the substitution "the Word [Memra] of YHWH" in place of "YHWH."

And the Word of the Lord spoke all these glorious words...

So it would seem that one of these entities called "YHWH" in these Torah passages was actually understood by the Targumists as being the "Word of YHWH." It was, according to Targum Onkelos, this Word of YHWH that Abraham trusted in:

And Abraham trusted in the Word [Memra] of YHWH, and He counted it to him for righteousness. (Targum Onkelos Gen. 15:6)

Moreover Abraham prayed in the name of the Word of YHWH:

And Abraham worshipped and prayed in the name of the Word [Memra] of YHWH, and said, "You are YHWH who does see, but You cannot be seen." (Jerusalem Targum Gen. 22:14)

Note that here Abraham prays "in the name of the Word of YHWH" to the YHWH who "cannot be seen." Here two YHWHs are very apparent. Abraham is praying in the name of the Word of YHWH but is praying to the YHWH who cannot be seen. This idea is reinforced elsewhere as follows:

And Hagar praised and prayed in the name of the Word [Memra] Of YHWH who had revealed Himself to her (Jerusalem Targum Gen. 16:3)

It was this Word of YHWH that Jacob also trusted in:

And Jacob vowed a vow, saying, "If the Word [Memra] of YHWH will be my support, and will keep me in the way that I go, and will give me bread to eat, and raiment to put on, so that I come again to my father's house in peace; then shall the Word [Memra] of YHWH be my Elohim." (Targum Onkelos on Gen. 28:20-21)

King David also urged Israel to trust in the Word of Yah as the Targum of Psalm 62 reads:

"Trust in the Word of Yah at all times, O people of the house of Israel! Pour out before Him the sighings of your heart; Say, Elohim is our trust forever." (Targum on Psalm 62:9)

This "Word of YHWH" was, according to Targum Jonathan, the Creator:

"And the Word [Memra] of YHWH created man in his likeness, in the likeness of YHWH, YHWH created, male and female created He them." (Targ. Jonathan Gen. 1:27)

This idea is also put forward in the Jerusalem Targum:

'And the Word [Memra] of YHWH said to Moses: "I am He who said unto the world 'Be!' and it was: and who in the future shall say to it 'Be!' and it shall be." And He said: "Thus you shall say to the children of Israel: 'I Am' has sent me to you."' (Jerusalem Targum Ex. 3:14)

The Fragmentary Targum of the Torah also expresses that the Word of YHWH was the Creator:

'The first night, when the "Word of YHWH" was revealed to the world in order to create it, the world was desolate and void,and darkness spread over the face of the abyss and the "Word of the Lord" was bright and illuminating and He called it the first night.' (Fragmentary Targum Ex. 12:42)

That the Word of YHWH was the Creator can also be seen in the Tenach itself:

"By the Word of YHWH were the heavens made, And all the hosts of them by the Spirit of His mouth." (Ps. 33:6)

The Word was also the covenant maker. For example the Noachdic covenant was between the Word and all mankind:

'And YHWH said to Noah, "This is the token of the covenant which I have established between My Word [Memra] and between all flesh that is upon the earth.' (Targum Onkelos Gen. 9:17)

The Word also made the Abrahamic covenant as Targum Onkelos also paraphrases:

"And I will establish my covenant between My Word [Memra] and between you." (Targum Onkelos Gen. 17:7)

The Word of YHWH was also the giver of the Mosaic Covenant and the Torah as the Jerusalem Targum (as quoted above) makes the Torah giver "the Word of YHWH" in Ex. 20:1. It was to the Word that Jacob turned to for salvation:

'Our father Jacob said: "My soul does not wait for salvation such as that wrought by Gideon, the son of Joash, for that was but temporal; neither for a salvation like that of Samson, which was only transitory; but for that salvation which You have promised to come, through Your Word unto Your people, the children of Israel; for your salvation my soul hopes."' (Targum Jonathan Gen. 49:18)

That the Word of YHWH is the savior is expressed elsewhere:

"But Israel shall be saved by the Word of YHWH with an everlasting salvation. By the Word of YHWH shall all the seed of Israel be justified." (Targum Jonathan Is. 45:17, 25)

"But I will have mercy upon the house of Judah, and I will save them by the Word of YHWH, their Elohim." (Targum Jonathan Hosea 1:7)

Speaking of the Memra Gershom Scholem states:

...the memra-- the paraphrase used in the Targumim, the Aramaic Bible translations, to refer to God's word. The memra is not merely a linguistic device for overcoming the problem of biblical anthropomorphisms; it has theological significance in its own right. The memra....is.... a world-permeating force, a reality in the world of matter or mind, the emmanent aspect of Elohim, holding all things under its ominpresent sway. On the Mystical Shape of the Godhead: Basic Concepts in the Kabbalah, by Gershom Scholem pg 181-182.

All of this sheds much light on Yochanan 1:1 (John 1:1):

"In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with Elohim, and the Word was Elohim."

http://www.reachouttrust.org/articlePDFView.php?id=119

[Molly]

PS  I just want to say that it is very exciting to me to be able to voice that Jesus is all over the Old Testament.  It is something I have known for a long time [shown to me by the HS] but I never get a chance to share it, and particularly because no one knows what I am talking about when I try.

So I hope others will start to enjoy this also and begin to understand the glory of our our Lord, Yahshua Ha Mashiach, Jesus the Christ.

[jabcat]

PS  I just want to say that it is very exciting to me to be able to voice that Jesus is all over the Old Testament.  It is something I have known for a long time [shown to me by the HS] but I never get a chance to share it, and particularly because no one knows what I am talking about when I try.

So I hope others will start to enjoy this also and begin to understand the glory of our our Lord, Yehshua Ha Mashiach, Jesus the Christ.

Been getting a little glimpse of that recently Molly.   :Yesss:

[Molly]

16 I Jesus have sent mine angel to testify unto you these things in the churches. I am the root and the offspring of David, ...
--Rev 22


If then David calls him 'Lord,' how can he be his son?"

--Mat 22:45


17And the Spirit and the bride say, Come. And let him that heareth say, Come. And let him that is athirst come. And whosoever will, let him take the water of life freely.
--Rev 22

[Molly]

21And the LORD appeared again in Shiloh: for the LORD revealed himself to Samuel in Shiloh by the word of the LORD.
--1 Sam 3


"Shiloh"

H7887
שׁלו    שׁילו    שׁלה    שׁילה
shı̂ylôh  shilôh  shı̂ylô  shilô
(1,2,3 & 4) shee-lo'
From the same as H7886; Shiloh, a place in Palestine: - Shiloh.


H7886
שׁילה
shı̂ylôh
shee-lo'
From H7951; tranquil; Shiloh, an epithet of the Messiah: - Shiloh.


These people were seeing and talking to Jesus.  :Sparkletooth:

[WhiteWings]

#29 is interesting it sorta confirms my thought expressed in http://www.tentmaker.org/forum/members_lounge/john_335_or_is_it_really_god_many_verses_are_9489.0.html

Gonna try to find more on the 2 YHWHs

[Molly]

Psalm 8:4
What is man [enosh], that thou art mindful of him? and the son of man [adam], that thou visitest him?

"thou visitest" him

H6485
פּקד
pâqad
paw-kad'
A primitive root; to visit (with friendly or hostile intent); by analogy to oversee, muster, charge, care for, miss, deposit, etc.: - appoint, X at all, avenge, bestow, (appoint to have the, give a) charge, commit, count, deliver to keep, be empty, enjoin, go see, hurt, do judgment, lack, lay up look, make X by any means, miss, number, officer, (make) overseer have (the) oversight, punish, reckon, (call to) remember (-brance), set (over), sum, X surely, visit, want.


1Therefore we ought to give the more earnest heed to the things which we have heard, lest at any time we should let them slip.

2For if the word spoken by angels was stedfast, and every transgression and disobedience received a just recompence of reward;

3How shall we escape, if we neglect so great salvation; which at the first began to be spoken by the Lord, and was confirmed unto us by them that heard him;

4God also bearing them witness, both with signs and wonders, and with divers miracles, and gifts of the Holy Ghost, according to his own will?

5For unto the angels hath he not put in subjection the world to come, whereof we speak.

6But one in a certain place testified, saying, What is man, that thou art mindful of him? or the son of man that thou visitest him?

7Thou madest him a little lower than the angels; thou crownedst him with glory and honour, and didst set him over the works of thy hands:

8Thou hast put all things in subjection under his feet. For in that he put all in subjection under him, he left nothing that is not put under him. But now we see not yet all things put under him.

9But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels for the suffering of death, crowned with glory and honour; that he by the grace of God should taste death for every man.

10For it became him, for whom are all things, and by whom are all things, in bringing many sons unto glory, to make the captain of their salvation perfect through sufferings.

11For both he that sanctifieth and they who are sanctified are all of one: for which cause he is not ashamed to call them brethren,

12Saying, I will declare thy name unto my brethren, in the midst of the church will I sing praise unto thee.

13And again, I will put my trust in him. And again, Behold I and the children which God hath given me.

14Forasmuch then as the children are partakers of flesh and blood, he also himself likewise took part of the same; that through death he might destroy him that had the power of death, that is, the devil;

15And deliver them who through fear of death were all their lifetime subject to bondage.

16For verily he took not on him the nature of angels; but he took on him the seed of Abraham.

17Wherefore in all things it behoved him to be made like unto his brethren, that he might be a merciful and faithful high priest in things pertaining to God, to make reconciliation for the sins of the people.

18For in that he himself hath suffered being tempted, he is able to succour them that are tempted.

--Heb 2

[WhiteWings]

Molly,

From your friend Michael  :winkgrin:
All 2601 verses with plural Elohim
Plural

More info and vids here
Old Testament scholar Michael Heiser discussed the Biblical evidence for this in the fascinating video below. He argues against the rabbinic view that Yahweh appears in two modes, a younger one and an older one. He sees the evidence as supporting a Christological interpretation that the second Yahweh refers to Jesus. This, he claims, is why the early church could see no discrepancy in claiming Jesus was part of the Godhead. But there is a third interpretation. These people were polytheistic to the core for much of their history, my view. See what you think:  http://vimeo.com/8792424http://www.byt-yhwh.org/yahwehisone.htmlhttp://www.abarim-publications.com/Meaning/YHWH.html

[Molly]

25And there was a voice from the firmament that was over their heads, when they stood, and had let down their wings.

26And above the firmament that was over their heads was the likeness of a throne, as the appearance of a sapphire stone: and upon the likeness of the throne was the likeness as the appearance of a man above upon it.

27And I saw as the colour of amber, as the appearance of fire round about within it, from the appearance of his loins even upward, and from the appearance of his loins even downward, I saw as it were the appearance of fire, and it had brightness round about.

28As the appearance of the bow that is in the cloud in the day of rain, so was the appearance of the brightness round about. This was the appearance of the likeness of the glory of the LORD. And when I saw it, I fell upon my face, and I heard a voice of one that spake.

--Eze 1



1And he said unto me, Son of man, stand upon thy feet, and I will speak unto thee.

2And the spirit entered into me when he spake unto me, and set me upon my feet, that I heard him that spake unto me.

3And he said unto me, Son of man, I send thee to the children of Israel, to a rebellious nation that hath rebelled against me: they and their fathers have transgressed against me, even unto this very day.

4For they are impudent children and stiffhearted. I do send thee unto them; and thou shalt say unto them, Thus saith the Lord GOD.

--Eze 2



Jesus

[Molly]

John 1:18 (English Standard Version)
18(A) No one has ever seen God;(B) the only God,[a] who is at the Father's side,(b)(C) he has made him known.


Footnotes:
a.John 1:18 Or the only One, who is God; some manuscripts the only Son
b.John 1:18 Greek in the bosom of the Father

[Molly]

These people were polytheistic to the core for much of their history, my view.

No they weren't polytheistic.  They knew the other cultures around them were worshipping other gods [as they do today], they knew there were multiple spiritual beings in the heavens--look at some of the things Paul writes--they even worshipped these other gods themselves at times when they were in rebellion--look at the golden calf.  But, the theology of the Bible is clear and is monotheistic--they believed in and worshipped one God, creator of heaven and earth--YHWH--as do Christians today.

Hear, O Israel: The LORD our God is one LORD.—Deuteronomy 6:4

Thou shalt have no other gods before me.—Exodus 20:3

[WhiteWings]

Memra

Despite the influence of Greek philosophy during the Second
Temple period, the Jewish writers ofthe New Testament
clearly relied primarily on early rabbinic methods of interpreta-
tion. An example can be seen in the theology of the New
Testament Logos, the Word. Early Jewish theologians had de-
veloped an ,entire philosophy around what they called Memra,
or the Word of God, to which they ascribed six particular at-
tributes. In John 1:1-18, we see these same six attributes
ascribed to the Logos. Notice how John associates these Memra
attributes with Jesus, the Messiah.

The first of these attributes of Memra was that it was some-
times distinct from and sometimes the same as God. Likewise,
John 1:1 says, "1n the beginning was the Word, and the Word
was with God, and the Word was God."

The second was that Memra was the agent of creation,
hence John 1:3 says, "All things were made by him."

The third was that Memra was the agent of salvation, hence
John 1:12 says, "But as many as received him, to them gave he
power to become the sons of God."

The fourth of these attributes of the Memra was that Memra
was the agent of Theophany. This attribute is seen in John 1:14,
which says, "The Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us."
According to Dr. Jack Sternberg, "John is saying that in Jesus,
Who is the Word, and the Glory of God, in Him, we beheld the
Shekhinah Glory, as Jesus became the Agent of Theophany, the
visible presence of God, as was the Memra of the Old Testa-
ment."'

The fifth was that Memra was the agent of covenant sign-
ing, hence John 1:17 compares the covenant of grace and truth
through Christ to the covenants of Abraham and Moses.

The sixth was that Memra was the agent of revelation. This
attribute can be seen in John 1:18, which states that no man has
seen God at any time, but that it is the Son who declares, or
reveals, him. The writings of John confirm that his understand-
ing of Memra was 100 percent Hebraic. He affirms that Jesus
fulfills all six attributes and all Jewish expectations of Memra.

[Molly]

Judg 6:22-23 "And when Gideon perceived that he was an angel of the LORD, Gideon said, Alas, O Lord GOD! for because I have seen an angel of the LORD face to face. {23} And the LORD said unto him, Peace be unto thee; fear not: thou shalt not die."



Isa 6:5 "Then said I, Woe is me! for I am undone; because I am a man of unclean lips, and I dwell in the midst of a people of unclean lips: for mine eyes have seen the King, the LORD of hosts."



Jesus

[Molly]

The writings of John confirm that his understand-
ing of Memra was 100 percent Hebraic. He affirms that Jesus
fulfills all six attributes and all Jewish expectations of Memra.

I have to hand it to you, ww.  You are a quick study.  Are you sure you're not a messianic Jew? :Sparkletooth:


14And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.

--John 1

[redhotmagma]

ww, those 6 aspects of the memra are the active principle of the Godhead that I was talking about in the other post, regarding the nature of Christ.

Its kind of like the Father is the energy source which then flows through the Son, the energy being the Fathers will. Thus "I have come to do the will of my Father"

Its kind of cool to see it laid out like that, especially coming from a pre-christian thought process.  A lot of times when I'm trying to verbalize the purpose/nature of Christ and Father, I come to those same categories of distinctness, and oneness, but unable to pinpoint all of it like that.  Great thread here

Molly keep up those great references of the Son/ The Word :happy3:

[Molly]

Genesis 15
1After these things the word of the LORD came unto Abram in a vision, saying, Fear not, Abram: I am thy shield, and thy exceeding great reward.

2And Abram said, LORD God, what wilt thou give me, seeing I go childless, and the steward of my house is this Eliezer of Damascus?

3And Abram said, Behold, to me thou hast given no seed: and, lo, one born in my house is mine heir.

4And, behold, the word of the LORD came unto him, saying, This shall not be thine heir; but he that shall come forth out of thine own bowels shall be thine heir.

5And he brought him forth abroad, and said, Look now toward heaven, and tell the stars, if thou be able to number them: and he said unto him, So shall thy seed be.

6And he believed in the LORD; and he counted it to him for righteousness.

[thinktank]

The Jews were well aware of two Yahweh's--one visible, one invisible.

They didn't believe in two Gods.
Early Roman church taught binity instead of trinity; I wonder if that's related.
Anyway I never saw any hint that ancient (or modern) Jews believes in two Gods.
Perhaps they believed in God in steam and ice form as you call it. But that's the same God.
Remember why exactly it was blasphemy that Jesus said He was the son of God. It wasn't really the son part of it. It was because it implies He was also a God. By lack of a better word; God is a species. Offspring is always of the same species. So Jesus declared Himself God. And that was totally impossible because they firmly believe(d) that there is just one God.
I wonder how Jews view the seemingly conficting verses. Christians can use trinity or two persons to explain away the problem.
But how would Jews do it?

Sure about the parts in bold?. Didn't the accusers say' because you being a man makest thyself God'.

Perhaps it was less about the issue that there is more than one God but rather, because he being a man says he's God. In some ways that is the very argument that people today have against Jesus.

Jesus said the scriptures testify of me, but you refuse to come to me to have life.

But it's an interesting question whitewings as to what did the Jews believe concerning the number of deity. Some were aware that the messiah was to come, so those in the know how, must have also read about there being a Son of God, or as the old testament calls Him the Lord or the God of Israel.
It would be interesting to find if there is a references to the different Gods, so far I have recognized that LORD all capitals is refering to the father, while Lord is the Son, but maybe not in All cases. Also recognize that the Father is called the Highest or the almighty in the old testament.



I have seen the Jews explanation of the conflicting verse, it can be very convincing. I've also seen a Muslim criticize and explain the verses that was even more convincing, but faith wins and scripture restored.

[Molly]

One of the first extra-Biblical places we see the idea of God having a son is in the Targums. The Targums were the Hebrew Scriptures loosely translated into Aramaic. Aramaic was the common language of the Jews both before and after Christ. Hebrew was the temple language. Most of the people did not speak Hebrew as a language of communication. And so in the synagogues the Scriptures would be read in Hebrew and then in Aramaic.

Take note on how Genesis 1:1 is translated in one of the Targums: "From the beginning with wisdom the Memra of the Lord created and perfected the heavens and the earth." The Neofiti Targum actually has it this way; "From the beginning with wisdom the son of the Lord created and perfected the heavens and the earth."

The term 'Memra' is the Aramaic word that translates into Greek as 'Logos.' So we see that the idea of a son and logos were not foreign to the Jews during the time of Christ. Memra is used extensively in the Targum translations. [There were a number of Targums. They contained the various modes of thinking of the peoples before and during the time of Christ.]

Here are some samplings from the Targums. Every time you see the term Memra, simply think Logos, or the Word, or think, 'Jesus' Himself.

Gen1:27 - "And the Memra of the Lord created the man in his own likeness; in a likeness from before the Lord he created him; male and his partner he created them."

Gen2:8 - "And the Lord God had planted a garden in Eden from the beginning and he placed there the first Adam." (Recall Paul spoke of the first and the last Adam.)

Gen3:8 - "And they heard the sound of the Memra of the Lord God walking within the garden in the breeze of the day..."

Gen12:7 - "And the Memra of the Lord was revealed to Abram and said to him: 'To your sons I will give this land.' ..."

Gen15:6 - "And Abram believed in the name of the Memra of the Lord and it was reckoned to him as righteousness."

The one thing to keep in view is that the term Memra spoke of personality. It was the Jewish way of relating to the unseen God, in saying that the Most High God did all His personal communication and revelation through the one called 'the Memra.'

....

The early Jewish believers took what was commonly taught in Judaism of the day, and brought Jesus into the picture. This allows us to see how much of the ancient theology of the Jews was on course with the truth of Jesus Christ.

But you find these early Jewish concepts not only in the New Testament writings, but also in other writings of the early believers. Here are sampling from the Ante-Nicene writings:

[Epistle to Diognetus a.d. 130] "...God Himself, who is almighty, the Creator of all things, and invisible, has sent from heaven, and placed among men, Him who is the truth, and the holy and incomprehensible Word..."

.....

http://www.christianchallenge.org/hebraic-foundations/HF139.html

[Molly]

1 Kings 17
1And Elijah the Tishbite, who was of the inhabitants of Gilead, said unto Ahab, As the LORD God of Israel liveth, before whom I stand, there shall not be dew nor rain these years, but according to my word.

2And the word of the LORD came unto him, saying,

3Get thee hence, and turn thee eastward, and hide thyself by the brook Cherith, that is before Jordan.

4And it shall be, that thou shalt drink of the brook; and I have commanded the ravens to feed thee there.

5So he went and did according unto the word of the LORD: for he went and dwelt by the brook Cherith, that is before Jordan.

6And the ravens brought him bread and flesh in the morning, and bread and flesh in the evening; and he drank of the brook

[micah7:9]

I understand that God can use solid forms, the first chapter of Genesis teaches that to me as does all the vary places where God communicates with His creation, so in that reasoning yes, but I must stand on the words of Jesus....

Joh 4:24 God is spirit, and those who are worshiping Him must be worshiping in spirit and truth."

And as I posted in another place....What is spirit? I believe that would be a better quest. I believe , but do not understand yet... that The Spirit of Gen. 1:2 is  subsatance, I believe that Jesus was that substance(and I do not mean His flesh body.)

I believe that should those have ears to hear, must and will HEAR, what the SPIRIT is saying.

[WhiteWings]

The Jews were well aware of two Yahweh's--one visible, one invisible.

They didn't believe in two Gods.
Early Roman church taught binity instead of trinity; I wonder if that's related.
Anyway I never saw any hint that ancient (or modern) Jews believes in two Gods.
Perhaps they believed in God in steam and ice form as you call it. But that's the same God.
Remember why exactly it was blasphemy that Jesus said He was the son of God. It wasn't really the son part of it. It was because it implies He was also a God. By lack of a better word; God is a species. Offspring is always of the same species. So Jesus declared Himself God. And that was totally impossible because they firmly believe(d) that there is just one God.
I wonder how Jews view the seemingly conficting verses. Christians can use trinity or two persons to explain away the problem.
But how would Jews do it?

Sure about the parts in bold?. Didn't the accusers say' because you being a man makest thyself God'.

Calling yourself son doesn't make you a god.
Calling yourself Son of God makes you a God. The offspring of a horse is a horse. The offspring of a human is a human. The offspring of  a God is a God.

Perhaps it was less about the issue that there is more than one God but rather, because he being a man says he's God.

That's very hard to answer. Say you meet someone who claims to be the son of God (Jesus).
Would you call it blasphemy because you don't believe God has a son or because you don't believ that person is the son of God?

It would be interesting to find if there is a references to the different Gods, so far I have recognized that LORD all capitals is refering to the father, while Lord is the Son, but maybe not in All cases. Also recognize that the Father is called the Highest or the almighty in the old testament.

I can't read Hebrew so I have no way of checking if the Hebrew text uses caps or not. I doubt ancient Hebrew has caps.