A damnationist recently told me that my belief in universal salvations was childish and that I am nothing more than a disordeient child.
Here are they exact words.
" You cry like a baby in the rest of what you said. You're like the spoiled child who whines and has a fit when mommy and daddy don't let him get away with breaking the rules they set for him. You whine, "After all, they are the ones who made the rules I broke. Now they punish me because I disobeyed their stupid rules. I hate them, I hate them - they just want to spoil all my fun." God is just. What you do is childish, immature and deadly. God created Hell for the devil and his angels - it is YOU who choose to follow him into his reward instead of Christ into His.
Typical nonsense from the ET crowd. They all seem to think people believe in UR just so they can sin all they want and not be punished. But I will cut them some slack because when I first heard the idea of UR, that was the first thought that came into my mind. I didn't particularly like the idea that people could sin like hell and still go to heaven, and being a self righteous Catholic, I saw myself as better than those who didn't go to church or believe in God. When I found this site and started reading Gary's works, God sure humbled me and showed me how my righteousness was like a "menstrual rag."
This actually relieved me more than upset me though, and when this UR stuff finally clicked with me, I felt an overwhelming sense of joy and peace and it gave me a greater desire to know God. It took a lot of weight off my shoulder during a time where I was trying very hard to be a good Catholic Christian (praying constantly, fasting, confession, never missing mass, doing silly penances, etc). The last thing I was thinking was "Now that I know God will save me no matter how much I sin, what wild, crazy, and rebellious things should I do this weekend?" A crazy weekend for me is going out to the local bar and grill for wings on Saturday night and playing some darts and pool.
These ETers need to get it through their thick skulls that we fully believe the judgments that the Bible says will take place will take place. However, we know that the Greek word for torment (kolasin?) means to judge with the purpose of chastising and correcting us. The Great White Throne and the Lake of Fire will be beneficial to us, unlike being thrown into a pit of fire for eternity.
Sorry if kolasin wasn't the right word or right spelling. I would look it up, but this is my last post tonight before I go to bed so I didn't feel like checking the accuracy. So please correct me if I erred at all!
I was told that before, by a loved one nonetheless and it hurts, but we must understand that the problem with "Christianity" is that they have been brainwashed into believing that their entire self-worth is based on what they belief, not realizing that scriptures themselves clearly states that faith is a gift God. Thus to question their beliefs is to question their self-worth and you will definitely get a violent reaction, and they will get very defensive, especially in a religion that is so faith-based rather than work-based. Sometimes you need to give them time, and ask God to give them the revelation that He has graciously granted you, understanding that if you were in their positions, you would most likely react the same way. Its frustrating, but that's our calling.
Hi aaronclark1989,
"Hell" as your friend quotes out of context was created for the devil and his angels - NOT for people.
Also, the spoiled child analogy breaks down in that, before Christ, we were slaves to sin. It was our nature and struggle though we might have
done in the flesh, we were helpless in it's grip... AND we were born that way through the inheritance from Adam's sinful blood.
We had no choice and were enemies of God. Since God is the author and finisher of our faith, no one comes to the Father unless brought by the holy spirit,
Faith in Christ alone saves us, God says he has mercy on whom he will and hardens the hearts of those he will, getting saved in this life is not up to us but the work of God. When death overtakes us all, those that did not believe will be brought(dragged) to Christ and again, it will not be up to us, but up to God.
We will have no choice but all will go willingly as "Every knee will bow and every tingue confess that 'Jesus is Lord' to the glory of God the Father."
Keyword being glory since there would be no glory for God if this was a forced confession. "The eyes of the blind will be opened"
How can a blind man be faulted for stumbling around and falling in the dark?
Quote from: ded2daworld on May 29, 2013, 03:39:56 PM
How can a blind man be faulted for stumbling around and falling in the dark?
hey Ded, I think you've hit a nail right on the head with that! I can't help thinking this whole thing (life as we presently know it, and the unfolding path planet earth has taken) was all begun by God Himself, being as He is perfect and can make no mistakes, therefor it all involves His perfect
intent.
When He endowed thinking ability (which includes sooner or later the ability to stray from Perfection, which is God is Perfection, and God is Life). Since he opened this Pandora's box (a whole new world, or tree, of possibilities became) he also built into the whole thing "from the beginning/foundation" the rescue. For to be imperfect is to be the opposite of Life/God. Hence death and all imperfection/suffering came to be. By God's design! (Of course.)
Therefor - -
Quote from: ded2daworld on May 29, 2013, 03:39:56 PM
How can a blind man be faulted for stumbling around and falling in the dark?
and how can ANY blind man be faulted, and suffer horrendously 'for ever' which is impossible to be His intent, and who can prevent HIS intent?.. :thumbsup: :gsmile:
Quote from: jedi1989 on May 29, 2013, 11:19:20 AM
I was told that before, by a loved one nonetheless and it hurts, but we must understand that the problem with "Christianity" is that they have been brainwashed into believing that their entire self-worth is based on what they belief, not realizing that scriptures themselves clearly states that faith is a gift God. Thus to question their beliefs is to question their self-worth and you will definitely get a violent reaction, and they will get very defensive, especially in a religion that is so faith-based rather than work-based. Sometimes you need to give them time, and ask God to give them the revelation that He has graciously granted you, understanding that if you were in their positions, you would most likely react the same way. Its frustrating, but that's our calling.
:hiya: :iagree:
..it makes me a little crazy when Christianity answers a question with "faith" like "blind faith" instead of having the good answer! How often "logic" is left totally out of the equation! The Word + Logic ='s
every answer to every single question of man/woman...
"Patience" absolutely, is called for :thumbsup: a fruit of the Spirit dwelling within.. the fires of the fruit(s) kept burning by the pursuit of Him.. Time spent with Him..