Colossians 1:18 And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence.
But:
John 12:1 Then Jesus six days before the passover came to Bethany, where Lazarus was which had been dead, whom he raised from the dead.
It seems Lazarus rose from the dead before Jesus.
Jesus still lives and Lazarus just died again. So there clearly is a difference.
But can it be proven in a simple way?
I thought about the above when I was searching for some Lazarus an Rich man stuff.
The story is in past tense and Rich man and Lazarus were resurrected. Abraham was also there.
That means at least 3 people went before First Fruit Jesus. That would totally prove it was/is a parable.
So....
good one WW ,
but what is dead ?
and what is living /viable ?
in the sense of this parable ?
Luk 16:31 And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead.
here is what they also pondered and considered what rising from the dead means as we are now lol
And as they came down from the mountain, he charged them that they should tell no man what things they had seen, till the Son of man were risen from the dead.Mar 9:10 And they kept that saying with themselves, questioning one with another what the rising from the dead should mean.
Quote from: rosered on October 22, 2009, 11:20:17 PM
but what is dead ?
and what is living /viable ?
in the sense of this parable ?
I asume you are asking if it means spiritually dead. If so that would also debunk the ET vision on that parable because they believe Rich Man was tortured with real flames.
QuoteLuk 16:31 And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead.
here is what they also pondered and considered what rising from the dead means as we are now lol
Mmm, that would mean double rising from the dead.
They died. Were resurrected to either paradise or hell. But to appear agin on earth they need to be resurrected again.
Or it simply means they could show up on earth in their current state. Jesus was also visible after resurrection.
But that still leaves me with the question that Lazarus, the real man in this world not the one from parable, rose from the dead before Jesus. I think it's extremely unlikely this is about spiritual dead/resurrection because the resurrection of the body of Jesus was the highlight and grand finale of Jesus ministry.
Well... you understand what I mean....
Quote from: WhiteWings on October 22, 2009, 11:34:34 PM
Quote from: rosered on October 22, 2009, 11:20:17 PM
but what is dead ?
and what is living /viable ?
in the sense of this parable ?
I asume you are asking if it means spiritually dead. If so that would also debunk the ET vision on that parable because they believe Rich Man was tortured with real flames.
QuoteLuk 16:31 And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead.
here is what they also pondered and considered what rising from the dead means as we are now lol
Mmm, that would mean double rising from the dead.
They died. Were resurrected to either paradise or hell. But to appear agin on earth they need to be resurrected again.
Or it simply means they could show up on earth in their current state. Jesus was also visible after resurrection.
But that still leaves me with the question that Lazarus, the real man in this world not the one from parable, rose from the dead before Jesus. I think it's extremely unlikely this is about spiritual dead/resurrection because the resurrection of the body of Jesus was the highlight and grand finale of Jesus ministry.
Well... you understand what I mean....
I do understand what you mean ... why was Lazurus risen before Jesus , I thought of the same thing till I remebered Jesus telling them HE IS THE RESSURECTION and the Life , so to me he/Jesus had the power all along , but to make the open show and point to all the world , the Cross and death also came according to plan ..
I also thought of the men on the road with Jesus after he had risen
they did not recognize him , till Jesus opened up their minds /understanding to the scriptures
this burning in their hearts ? a spiritual type or literal type heartburn ?
Luk 24:32 And they said one to another, Did not our heart burn within us, while he talked with us by the way, and while he opened to us the scriptures?
and here is where it gets good , he is not only spirit , but a Body / glorified as well ......
it seems that their JOY is what got in the way of their believing Him ?
And he said unto them, Why are ye troubled? and why do thoughts arise in your hearts?
Luk 24:39 Behold my hands and my feet, that it is I myself:
handle me, and see; for a spirit hath not flesh and bones, as ye see me have.
Luk 24:40 And when he had thus spoken, he shewed them [his] hands and [his] feet.
Luk 24:41 And while they
yet believed not for joy, and wondered, he said unto them, Have ye here any meat?
NASB 41While they still could not believe it because of their joy and amazement, He said to them, "Have you anything here to eat?"
THIS JOY is in every version that seems to get in the way of their faith/ believing ?
thats what seems strange to me bro