1 John 5:7

[Caffus]

I read this veres today and it is in the YLT..It seems to support the doctrine of the trinity which if true I certainly want the Truth.  1 John 5:7 because three are who are testifying in the heaven, the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit and these three are one

[eaglesway]

I read this veres today and it is in the YLT..It seems to support the doctrine of the trinity which if true I certainly want the Truth.  1 John 5:7 because three are who are testifying in the heaven, the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit and these three are one

The truth of the mystery of the godhead is one of which diverse views are held, and heated discussions have been held. My suggestion is to go to the older threads on it, where you can read all of them.

The verse you quoted can be interpreted in different ways.... so I do not think we need another godhead debate. I will look up the old threads and post them here later. :o)

[jabcat]

here's one recent honkin' long one;

http://tentmaker.org/forum/arguments-against-universal-salvation/re-here's-something-i-just-read/

actually, this one ended up with at least one long-standing member choosing to mostly leave the forum.  :(

[eaglesway]

It is a good thread tho, if you want some indepth info on the dfferent views and are willing to wade through it.

[rosered]

What is the more SURE WORD ?  I know we are to hear what the SPIRIT IS SAYING

Until we even hear what the Spirit is saying to   us , Like Peter he  ,  Knew that Jesus Christ was the son of God    by  the HOLY SPIRIT OF GOD , not flesh and blood  ,  but the faith seed was planted   in Peters heart      and this  he was   beginning to  of his journey that the gates of hell/unseen  and grave      cannot prevail  against   to     SEE   GOD  in his kingdom   

2 peter ...18and we ourselves heard this utterance made from heaven when we were with Him on the holy mountain.


19So we have the prophetic word made more sure, to which you do well to pay attention as to a lamp shining in a dark place, until the day dawns and the morning star arises in your hearts.


20But know this first of all, that no prophecy of Scripture is a matter of one's own interpretation,...

   and now look what Peter shares with us     , his faith has been manifested   as truth     , and  desires   for us to also   

wait an see if the Truth does not set us free !!  the FATHER SON AND HOLY SPIRIT ARE AS ONE   IN HEAVENLIES

AND THE EARTH  AGREE    AS   ONE WITNESS   our proof that we are  of God  , we hear    1 John 3 Children of God
1See how great a love the Father has bestowed on us, that we would be called children of God; and such we are.


For this reason the world does not know us, because it did not know Him.


2Beloved, now we are children of God, and it has not appeared as yet what we will be. We know that when He appears, we will be like Him, because we will see Him just as He is. 3And everyone who has this hope fixed on Him purifies himself, just as He is pure....


this is only my opinion /judgment    as I see it now

   I know I hated to see  Molly go       , I sincerely mean this   and was grieved in my spirit over the  falling out over this   discussion

[eaglesway]

As was I. However, if we cant tow the load we ought not engage the rope.

These kinds of discussions are always difficult. None of us arrive at our beliefs lightly, so it is that in such discussions it will always be as iron sharpens iron. Sparks, collisions and noise. It is just difficult to remain collegial and hypothetical in tone when these religious icons get tested.

That's why I dont want to go there, it's been done, even well done(as in overcooked) and all that clanging aggravates the Lord's ears much in the way "dragon-breath" aggravates His nose :o)

[Tom]

It's my understanding that both the King James and Young's Literal Translation depended on the Textus Receptus, which has the discredited Comma Johanneum, which is why it's also in the Interlinear Scripture Analyzer because that's all it uses now, but The Concordant Version does not have it because it was a forgery perpetrated when Erasmus was conned by the church into including it. You can read the story about it here. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comma_Johanneum That was one of the reasons I quit reading Young's Literal Translation, after I switched to it from the King James Version, and then switched to the Concordant Version.

"For even if so be that there are those being termed gods, whether in heaven or on earth, even as there are many gods and many lords, nevertheless for us there is one God, the Father, out of Whom all is, and we for Him, and one Lord, Jesus Christ, through Whom all is, and we through Him." (1 Corinthians 8:5,6)

[eaglesway]

Hey Tom, I am wondering about Hebrews 11:1. In the Concordant, hypostasis is rendered "assumption". In other versions I have "assurance", "reality", "substance"- and this seems to be a very different take on the thought within the word.

Is there a way to find how the Concordant arrives at its rendering of a word, like a lexicon or dictionary anything?

[jabcat]

hey john, i'll just tack onto your question if i may.  Tom knows much more about the concordant that i do, so maybe he'll clarify.

but my thing i've wondered about the concordant is, and it ties into your point;  i believe i read how the knoch didn't use any one english word for multiple greek words, preferring for each specific greek word to have its own unique english counterpart.  so to me, i've kind of thought a reason some of the words in the concordant might seem "odd" to some is, they may have simply already used the "best" 2 or 3 english words, so then some of those "odd-sounding" one started to come into play.  is that possible?

[Caffus]

I believe The Holy Spirit is the Spirit of God...not a separate person...I think its important, but it is not necessary for belief in UR which I believe without doubt. I read on Gods plan for all...the verse was added. But then verse 8 is supposed to be verse 7 ect. Some UR don't believe Jesus is Divine but I do. So we don't all believe the  same on everything even if we all have the Spirit within. He may teach us His truths at different levels we cant no all till we see Him.

[Caffus]

Now I see why I should study from the Concordent Literal instead of the Youngs..unfortunately the Youngs is the default translation on the lovewins Bible app. :doh:

[Caffus]

I'm in the process of studying on this issue..I will read all that you've posted on it and spend alone time with our Father...when I feel ready all get back to you.  :HeartThrob:

[rosered]

Be blessed in your endeavors Caffus  :Pray:


John 8:58.  Jesus said,  "Truly, Truly, I say to you, before Abraham was born, I am",

https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Gen%201:1,%20John%208:58,%20John%2017:5,%20John%2017:24,%201John%201:1,%20Rev%201:8&version=NIV


I like the simplified    and it can   sure help  sometimes    :HeartThrob:

[Tom]

hey john, i'll just tack onto your question if i may.  Tom knows much more about the concordant that i do, so maybe he'll clarify.

but my thing i've wondered about the concordant is, and it ties into your point;  i believe i read how the knoch didn't use any one english word for multiple greek words, preferring for each specific greek word to have its own unique english counterpart.  so to me, i've kind of thought a reason some of the words in the concordant might seem "odd" to some is, they may have simply already used the "best" 2 or 3 english words, so then some of those "odd-sounding" one started to come into play.  is that possible?

It's called the Concordant Version because word meanings are based on the concordance instead of theological interpretation.

[Tom]

Hey Tom, I am wondering about Hebrews 11:1. In the Concordant, hypostasis is rendered "assumption". In other versions I have "assurance", "reality", "substance"- and this seems to be a very different take on the thought within the word.

Is there a way to find how the Concordant arrives at its rendering of a word, like a lexicon or dictionary anything?

I've read that the word "assumption" seemed to be the best translation according to the concordance. I attached a couple of files to help show that.

[attachment deleted by admin]

[Tom]

I think an accurate translation of scripture makes it clear that the holy spirit of God is the power of God that generated the Christ child in the virgin Mary, inspired the authors of the ancient scriptures, and lives in us believers. The Trinity is simply the philosophy of man established by the Roman Empire for the same reason all church doctrine was, and that is political expediency.

[CHB]

I think an accurate translation of scripture makes it clear that the holy spirit of God is the power of God that generated the Christ child in the virgin Mary, inspired the authors of the ancient scriptures, and lives in us believers. The Trinity is simply the philosophy of man established by the Roman Empire for the same reason all church doctrine was, and that is political expediency.

I agree Tom and I also believe that Christ existed before he was born to the virgin Mary. These two verses  (Rev. 3:14) Says, that Christ was the beginning of the creation of God.  (Col. 1:15) says, he was the firstborn of every creature. In Rev. it mentions him as being the FIRST and the LAST.  So, if Christ was first then he had a beginning. In verse 16 of Col. it says he created all things. So, he existed before any thing else existed if he was the creator.

What if Christ was the first thing that came directly from God, like a birth?  This is why God called him his ONLY begotten Son and why Christ said he was the first of all creation.

CHB

[Seth]

A discussion on the trinity! Like, zoikes! Run Scooby!

[Dandelion]

It is best not to take discussions on any matters, probably especially Spiritual matters, personally.

I think it good to remember:

...11Put on the full armor of God, so that you will be able to stand firm against the schemes of the devil. 12For our struggle is not against flesh and blood, but against the rulers, against the powers, against the world forces of this darkness, against the spiritual forces of wickedness in the heavenly places. ....Ephesians 6: 11- 12

:Peace2:

[eaglesway]

 :thumbsup:

It is best not to take discussions on any matters, probably especially Spiritual matters, personally.

I think it good to remember:

...11Put on the full armor of God, so that you will be able to stand firm against the schemes of the devil. 12For our struggle is not against flesh and blood, but against the rulers, against the powers, against the world forces of this darkness, against the spiritual forces of wickedness in the heavenly places. ....Ephesians 6: 11- 12

:Peace2:

[ed]

A discussion on the trinity! Like, zoikes! Run Scooby!

:laugh:

Way ahead of you!

:LH:

[CHB]

Just giving my opinion like everyone else, no discussion on my part, don't have the time. Just one of the topics I have studied a lot on.  The reason I post is, I think maybe something I might say may benefit someone out there in cyber space:Peace2:

CHB

[Caffus]

Well..theres a verse in the Concordent Literal in Mathew where Jesus says to baptize in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the holy spirit. Even if the Holy Spirit were not a person I believe the Holy Spirit should be held with much respect.  I pray to our Father on Jesus name and worship our Father.  Seems like the Holy Spirit is the Fathers Spirit and also Jesus's Spirit at times...but I dont understand that veres or how the Holy Spirit is greived ect...may be unexplainable.  Right now ...I dont need any scolding..Im getting to much from ET believers already...is painful

[rosered]

Well..theres a verse in the Concordent Literal in Mathew where Jesus says to baptize in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the holy spirit. Even if the Holy Spirit were not a person I believe the Holy Spirit should be held with much respect.  I pray to our Father on Jesus name and worship our Father.  Seems like the Holy Spirit is the Fathers Spirit and also Jesus's Spirit at times...but I dont understand that veres or how the Holy Spirit is greived ect...may be unexplainable.  Right now ...I dont need any scolding..Im getting to much from ET believers already...is painful

   Hi Caffus   ,
You were sent out as lambs  among wolves  , with you own witness and testimony of Jesus you are  carrying in your own heart     , your treasures of heaven to all that would   hear .....

Being rejected is the same sufferings Jesus experienced    as well and none is above His master     

  Just remember   Gods grace is sufficient      for you , Paul had to deal with a messenger of satan to buffet him    , struck him blows   all the time and prayed 3 times for God to remove that thorn in the flesh    apparently it bothered Paul to have his carnal side riled up      as painful   , like wound that was open to   hurt and pain ''reminding him of his  affliction''    but learned though the many revealtions of Jesus Christ to  be  content with his weaknesses and  suffering for the cause of Christ   sake

    For me grieving the Spirit    , is the same as   quenching the Spirit  , the Light and fire in you   for the Lord is    trying to be smothered out      by carnal men

where the air is not flowing  ''the breath of God ''      same as trying to put to death   the CHRIST IN YOU that hope of glory

   the Word of God   

I hope this helps some

   remember    little lambs and sheep to slaughter ,     the same LAMB OF GOD  is symbolic     of the  innocent being sacrificed for the guilty   

and obedience is  better than sacrifice     

  their disobedience only brings judgment on their own heads ,        the same as crushing satan / adversity head , authority .   under your feet shortly    ,  the feet are those  who have shod   their feet with the teaching of Jesus peace     

sent to those who should hear and  believe , the very WORD OF GOD judges  us all        the tongue is a world of fire     

  but those whom  God calls are   HIS own ..   Psalms 104  O Lord, My God, You are Very Great
...3He lays the beams of His upper chambers in the waters;


He makes the clouds His chariot

; He walks upon the wings of the wind; 4He makes the winds/spirits  His messengers/angels , Flaming fire His ministers. 5He established the earth upon its foundations, So that it will not totter forever and ever.         


God bless you  richly    ....

[Caffus]

Thank you Rose, God bless you too  :HeartThrob: