the lower parts of the earth?

[marie glen]

Why do so many assume "the lower parts of the earth" to be a pit called 'hell'? Why hasn't science found this pit? Yes, Jesus in death descended to the lower parts of the earth - the grave, and dust of!

Ephesians 4:9

New Revised Standard Version (NRSV)

9 (When it says, "He ascended," what does it mean but that he had also descended into the lower parts of the earth?

He rose..

[englishman]

Marie glen, I remmember a ET going into there into scritures and jewish writings as though it was jewish belief that there was a place where our spirits go when we die, and I found scriptures to prove we returned to God, but he insisted there was a lower underworld or hades where even when Korah and his lot in the rebellion against Moses, where taken in the lowest part of the earth when the earth broke open. He kept quoting from The steps of the Messiah  by Fruchenbaun, now I might have the wrong pronunciation, I can probably find it I think i downloaded it, it was really biased, he quoted all the offspring of Abraham went to their familly grave and went to live in the paradise of God and they were contininually added, this teaching goes to great lengths to prove, there is a paradise that the righteous go to when they are dead and the wicked go to a suffering state just like the Luke 16 parable of the richman and lazarus and both parties are living in this limbo untill the judgment day.
It goes on to say that the thief would be in paradise litterally when Jesus was on the cross.

I believe the dead no nothing nor can they praise God and Job knew that one day he would see the face of God, but with all the references to Psalms, Eccliesiates and Job, They say the spirits are eternal so it has to function, I dont believe that, but they are alive with referance to God and he can tranfigure them if he wants, but we are told not to seek them for they are in Gods rest and you will be calling demons to speak.

1 Peter 3:19 i believe took place after 3 nights in hades, the angels and fallen angels in earthly and heavenly realm would have known about his victory but the spirits I believe applied to in this verse are the ones in Tartarus, the lower parts of the earth, I believe this could be another understood name for the prison of the angels who left their heavenly station and took on the bodies of men in the times before the flood, and we know they have been in prison bonds from Jude 6, but I dont believe this prison has been for men, but I do see the purpose that they should know that their judgment should continue but I also believe that hope was given to them, for he willingly offered his sacrifice for all.

I can see you want a overview of all of Gods plan, i am seeking it too, especially the book of Revelation its hard work I'm not sure I want to look into this subject deeply, but I hope someone and your self will encourage us :Chinscratch:

[sheila]

imo He descended to the lowest parts of the earth when He came to be in Mary's womb. Psalms 139;15  My frame was

not hidden from you when I was made in the secret place.When I was woven togather in the depths of the earth,your eyes saw my

  unformed body.   King Jmes says 'lowest parts of the earth"  that was the descent...intoa vessel that would taste death

for every man.

    I am from above[spirit descended] you are from below[carnal man/corruptible image vs last man/Adam quickening spirit.]

     what is born of the flesh is flesh[lowest parts of earth] what is born of the spirit is spirit.[born from above]


          Psalms 139;8  If I go up to heaven,you aare there,if I make my bed in the depths[lowest parts] of the earth,you are there.

   first Adam natural man[from below]  Last Adam a quickening spirit[from above]

[jabcat]

I don't know, but I wonder if it could mean both things..his descending into this life (His fleshly birth as sheila points out) but also the grave.  :dunno2:   I really don't know the specific Greek and Hebrew that was used in every possible passage vs. how it may have been translated ini various translations.  However, I agree - it doesn't mean a place of eternal torment, i.e., the made up word "hell".    Good points made, things to consider and study further perhaps.  I didn't know/recall the Psalm passage.    :thumbsup:  Blessings.

[CHB]

imo He descended to the lowest parts of the earth when He came to be in Mary's womb. Psalms 139;15  My frame was

not hidden from you when I was made in the secret place.When I was woven togather in the depths of the earth,your eyes saw my

Since it says that man is of the earth, maybe it is referring to this? We are of the earth and our stomach would be the lower part of us which is of the earth.

Is this what you are saying sheila?

CHB

[sheila]

I think your'e right Jab, coz desending into flesh....was also His death......I lay it down willingly..in order to take it back up again.

    Thou hast prepared a body for me.....Jesus Christ...the firstborn from the dead.    and Paul's words...this body undergoing

   this death.....   a spirit hath not flesh and blood...[flesh and blood can not please God] to the dust ye shall return,and the spirit

will return unto God.   those asleep in the dust shall rise...quickening spirit shall make your mortal[body of death] bodies alive

that which is mortal must be swllowed up of immortality.   It makes the term..clothed in Christ..take on a new perspective

for me.......Quick![quickening spirit]  Bring out a robe,the best,and put it on him!    for this son of mine was dead nd is

alive again.

   another aspect...Jesus presenting Himself to John for baptism in the Jordan[descend] before He began His preaching

ministry[preach gospel to those in hell]  remebering no other man had life in himself...surely His gospel was preached to the

dead[thus death spread to all men]  those in prison..through fear of death...but the son shall set ye free and ye shall be

free indeed.

   just some things I am pondering.

[sheila]

CHB....... :thumbsup:      those whose god is their belly.   repentance in dust and ashes...I am from above..you are from below


  the nations aare but dust on the scales.  do not be as the nations..what shall I eat..what shall I wear...is not the body

more than food and clothes.  Look at the lilies of the feild....the Father clothed them.

[anna274]

imo He descended to the lowest parts of the earth when He came to be in Mary's womb. Psalms 139;15  My frame was

not hidden from you when I was made in the secret place.When I was woven togather in the depths of the earth,your eyes saw my

  unformed body.   King Jmes says 'lowest parts of the earth"  that was the descent...intoa vessel that would taste death

for every man.

    I am from above[spirit descended] you are from below[carnal man/corruptible image vs last man/Adam quickening spirit.]

     what is born of the flesh is flesh[lowest parts of earth] what is born of the spirit is spirit.[born from above]


          Psalms 139;8  If I go up to heaven,you aare there,if I make my bed in the depths[lowest parts] of the earth,you are there.

   first Adam natural man[from below]  Last Adam a quickening spirit[from above]

Sheila, I read this with great interest as Psalm 139 had become a prayerful inner-searching... now your post kind of opened a window for me... I want to pursue it a bit further...  especially verse 15.   I may have to file  this new "insight" for a few days.  Sometimes, I feel like a glutton... so much spiritual food to eat and I try to eat it all...

[sheila]

 :laugh:    He knows how to prepare a spiritual feast,alright!!  Pours out so much blessing we haven't room for it all!

[marie glen]

Just think of it!Jesus was perfect.. there was nothing impure in Him.. the grave (dissolution, decay, fading away, and imperfection its cause) had no hold on Him! He could descend to the lowest part of the Earth, the dust of the grave - this is what it means when the curse is to be on your belly in the dust.. Micah(?I think it was said this about someone in prophecy.. about a nation? the lowest one can go, not accounting for "the abyss" (of how far down one with rationality/choice can go)

Oh, no! I'm writing like I think.. all over the place.. rofL

..so simple.. so beautiful in its simplicity.. Everything about God and ultimate reality, aka, what He is creating.. is utter simplicity.. so good.. so pure.. (so blissful..)

[WhiteWings]

imo He descended to the lowest parts of the earth when He came to be in Mary's womb. Psalms 139;15  My frame was

not hidden from you when I was made in the secret place.When I was woven togather in the depths of the earth,your eyes saw my

  unformed body.   King Jmes says 'lowest parts of the earth"  that was the descent...intoa vessel that would taste death

for every man.

    I am from above[spirit descended] you are from below[carnal man/corruptible image vs last man/Adam quickening spirit.]

     what is born of the flesh is flesh[lowest parts of earth] what is born of the spirit is spirit.[born from above]


          Psalms 139;8  If I go up to heaven,you aare there,if I make my bed in the depths[lowest parts] of the earth,you are there.

   first Adam natural man[from below]  Last Adam a quickening spirit[from above]

That aligns a bit with the view His 3 days in the grave where (also) His ministry. The captives set free are the Jews that believed Him.
But that doesn't answer all of the question.
If there is a lower part of the earth there is also a higher part.

[sheila]

   yeah, and Cyrus,the annointed one..served as an example of the Christ.....make straight paths.....filling in the valleys

  melting the mountains...a highway there.......making one man of the two[man from above/man from below]