Question regarding Lake of Fire

[Molly]

my point is that we are not in a perfect state IMO if we keep going from perfection to imperfection and back again. We will only be in a perfect state when we can remain Christ like in every facet of our being and make-up.

I don't think it is perfection you are talking about so much as complete redemption, and Paul himself echoed this sentiment.


Romans 8:23
And not only they, but ourselves also, which have the firstfruits of the Spirit, even we ourselves groan within ourselves, waiting for the adoption, to wit, the redemption of our body.

[Pierac]

Hey Nathan;

If you believe then that your spirit is complete and perfect then what benifit is there for you since you are still a slave to the carnal flesh? That carnal flesh hasmore power over you than even the sacrifice of the cross, or so it seems you preach.

It almost feels like you're ignoring the bulk of what is being said in order to continue pushing your point.  For one, I never said that I am still a slave to the flesh, I said when I "chose" to live by my reasoning, that choice results in becoming enslaved to the flesh.  Because my mind is very much influence and can be decieved by the things of the flesh.  That's why I believe we are called to walk in the spirit.  "That" is where our authority and perfection is.

Why would Scripture tell us that our minds need to be renewed daily by the word if we are completely perfect in every way? 
Walking in the spirit is walking in the finished works.  I become what I behold.

To understand Spirit, we must first understand scripture! The New Testament as it is written in Greek. The Greek definition is almost exactly the same as the Hebrews.  In the Septuagint the Jews used "pneuma" in Greek in the same way that they used "ruah" in Hebrew.

A. Spirit (ruah & pneuma ) - Breath of life. The vital principle by which the body is animated.

It is the life force that God gives to people and animals which animates their bodies, which gives them life. When He takes it away they die.

Examples:

Psalms 104: 29-30: "When you take away their breath (pneuma), they perish and return to the dust from which they came. When you send forth your breath (pneuma), they are created."

Ecclesiastes 12:7: "And the dust returns to the earth as it once was, and the life breath (pneuma) returns to God who gave it."

Psalms 33:6: "When his spirit (pneuma) departs he returns to his earth; on that day his plans perish."

This definition is extremely important when one interprets a verse such as Luke 23:46:

"Father, into your hands I commend my spirit (pneuma);" and when he said this he breathed his last."

If you use the Greek philosophical definition as most people do, you will arrive at the conclusion that at that moment Jesus' Greek type spirit went to heaven to be with God. This of course is not possible because after three days when Jesus was resurrected, he appeared to Mary of Magdala and told her:

"Stop holding on to me, for I have not yet ascended to the Father" (John 20:17).

If we use the intended Jewish definition of spirit it will make perfect sense. Jesus' breath of life returned to God and he died. This is in accordance with the Scriptures and definition listed above and does not conflict with John 20:17. It is the intended Jewish meaning. A second very important meaning of "spirit" is:

Spirit (ruah) - is often used of a man's mind-set, disposition, or temper. The word is used of one's mind or thinking.

Spirit (pneuma) - the Spirit is said to dwell in the minds  of Christians. purpose.

Paul uses spirit and mind interchangeably as he quotes Isaiah 40:13 in the New Testament. Let's take a look at these verses.

Isaiah 40:13: "Who has directed the spirit of the LORD, or has instructed Him as His counselor?"

Romans 11:34: "Who has known the mind of the Lord, or who has been His counselor?"

1 Corinthians 2:16: "For who has known the mind of the Lord, so as to counsel Him?"

It is clear that for Paul, the spirit of the LORD is the mind of the LORD. These definitions are crucial in order to understand many verses of the Bible. If you are one in spirit with Jesus it means that you are one in mind with Jesus. That you have the same mind-set, the same disposition, that you think the same as he does. This after all is what a Christian strives for, to try to reach the example of faith that Jesus showed us. To be able to discern the will of God as Jesus did so perfectly. We are told to have the same mind, the same attitude as Christ.

Examples:

1 Corinthians 2:16: "But we have the mind of Christ."

Philippians 2:2: "Complete my joy by being of the same mind, with the same love, united in heart, thinking one thing."

1 Peter 4:1: "Therefore, since Christ suffered in the flesh, arm yourself with the same attitude, for whoever suffers in the flesh has broken with sin, so as not to spend what remains of one's life on human desires, but on the will of God."

Philippians 2:5: "Have among yourselves the same attitudethat is also yours in Christ Jesus."

With these definitions we can better understand a verse like

1 Corinthians 7:17: "But he who unites himself with the Lord is one with him in spirit." In other words, whoever unites himself with the Lord is one with him in mind, mind-set, attitude, thinking, or in purpose, which are all synonymous. Here are some other examples. Try substituting one of the given definitions where it says "spirit" and you will get a clearer meaning of the verse.

Numbers 5:14: "Or if a man is overcome by a spirit of jealousy."


Galatians 6:1: "Even if a person is caught in some transgression, you who are spiritual should correct that one with the spirit of gentleness."

1 Corinthians 2:12: "We have not received the spirit of the world but the Spirit that is from God."

Deuteronomy 34:9: "Now Joshua, son of Nun, was filled with the spirit of wisdom."

Genesis 41:8: "Next morning his spirit was agitated."

This definition of "spirit" is still very popular even among our own society. A article in Flying Careers magazine was about how some pilots volunteer their time for such programs as Young Eagles or Angel Flight. The title of the article was "The Spirit of Volunteering." Another way of saying the same thing is, "The mind-set of Volunteering." A paragraph in the article says, "Many organizations provide opportunities for those in the spirit." This phrase sounds like something right out of the New Testament, but as we all know, the writer is simply saying that many organizations provide opportunities for those in the right frame of mind.

With this understanding, and by comparing some other verses we can now comprehend more fully what Jesus meant when he told Nicodemus in John 3:3-5:



"No one can see the kingdom of God unless he is born again" ...no one can enter the kingdom of God unless he is born of water and spirit"

Jesus is telling Nicodemus that unless you make a commitment to God (which is demonstrated by baptism) and be born again of the mind, you will not enter the kingdom of God. Our minds have to be born again, they have to think differently than they did when they followed the flesh. Our minds have to be renewed in order to be able to discern and follow the will of God.

Romans 12:2: "Do not conform yourself to this age but be transformed by the renewal of your mind, that you may discern what is the will of God."

Ephesians 4:23: "And be renewed in the spirit (purpose) of your minds."

2 Corinthians 4:16: "Although our outer self is wasting away, our inner self (spirit i.e. mind) is being renewed day by day."



Colossians 3:9-10: "Stop lying to one another, since you have taken off the old self with its practices and have put on the new self (new mind),which is being renewed, for knowledge in the image of its creator."

Romans 7:6: "Dead to what held us captive, so that we may serve in the newness of the spirit (mind) and not under the obsolete law. You will notice that in many of the verses that we are reading, the adjectives that are attributed to renewal are adjectives that are associated with our minds, such as knowledge, discern, etc.

The new covenant that Jesus ushered in is of the mind and not the letter. The Mosaic covenant was of the letter. The majority of the people followed it in my opinion, because of fear of the consequences and not because they truly believed that the law was good. This is why they had such hardships in the desert for forty years. They kept reverting to their pagan ways that they had adopted in Egypt. They had not truly accepted the law within their minds. Let me give you an example: I do not steal because in my mind I believe it to be wrong, and not because I fear the penalty of being caught stealing. There are people who do not steal simply because they do not want to end up in prison. Lets suppose that the government said that on a given Friday stealing will not be considered a crime. I still would not steal because God's law is in me.

But you can be sure that there would be a lot of people who normally do not steal that on Friday would steal because God's law is not in them. Here are a few examples:

Jeremiah 31:31-33: "The days are coming, says the LORD, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and the house of Judah. It will not be like the covenant (Mosaic covenant) I made with their fathers the day I took them by the hand to lead them forth from the land of Egypt... But this is the covenant (ushered in by Jesus) which I will make with the house of Israel after those days, says the LORD. I will place my law within them, and write it upon their hearts."

Hebrews 8:10: "I will put my laws in their minds."

2 Corinthians 3:5-6: "Rather, our qualification comes from God, who has indeed qualified us as ministers of a new covenant, not of the letter but of spirit"(of the mind).

Romans 2:28: "One is not a Jew (follower of God in this context) outwardly. True circumcision is not outward, in the flesh. Rather, one is a Jew inwardly, and circumcision is of the heart, in the spirit, not the letter."

Romans 7:25: "Therefore, I myself, with my mind, serve the law of God, but with my flesh, the law of sin." Christianity is a war in fought in our minds. The war is between good and evil. We strive to follow the will of God over the will of our flesh.

Romans 7:22-23: "For I take delight in the law of God, in my inner self (mind), but I see in my members another principle at war with the law of my mind, taking me captive to the law of sin that dwells in my members."

Romans 7:25: "I myself, with my mind serve the law of God but, with my flesh, the law of sin."

This understanding of spirit in relation to the mind is essential if one is going to understand what Paul meant when he said in Romans 8:9:

"Whoever does not have the Spirit of Christ does not belong to him. But if Christ is in you."

What does Paul mean when he says "Whoever does not have the Spirit of Christ does not belong to him?" Are we suppose to have a Greek-type spirit of Jesus living inside of us along with God's Spirit? Are we like a shell housing all these different spirits, our own spirit, God's Spirit, and Jesus' spirit? Of course not. What Paul is saying is that whoever does not have the mind-set or mind of Christ does not belong to him. Remember earlier how it was shown that we are to have the mind of Christ. If we believe his word, his teachings on the kingdom of God we will have the same mind-set as he does, we will be of one mind. This is how Christ is in us. His word, his teachings are in us. When we have Christ in us we have the knowledge of God's plan of salvation (the gospel) for us, our hope for glory. Christ dwells in us through our faith in his words.

John 15:7: "If you remain in me (Jesus) and my words remain in you."

Colossians 3:16: "Let the word of Christ dwell in you richly."

Ephesians 3:17: "And that Christ may dwell in your hearts through faith."

2 Corinthians 11:10: "By the truth of Christ (his words) that is in me."

Colossians 1:17: "It is Christ in you, the hope for glory."

Ephesians 4:21: "assuming that you have heard of him (Jesus) and were taught in him, as truth is in him."

Colossians 2:6: "So, as you received Christ Jesus the Lord, walk in him, rooted in him and built upon him and established in the faith as you were taught."


This is the Jewish meaning of Christ dwelling in us. It is vastly different from the Greek philosophical point of view our Churches teach today!

Paul

[Molly]

It is something miraculous though, Paul.  It's not like I listen to Jesus speak and decide in my mind, that makes sense, I'll agree with that.  We are often called to go against what looks like our own best interests.  Try telling all those rich bankers not to steal and see how far you get.  [Not far, I've tried it.]

Just the phrases used show it is a gift and a miracle--born from above, the firstborn of many brothers, --that something profound has happened and that everything has changed.  We now belong to a new family.  We are a different species, a new man.  Homo sapiens sapiens novus.  


Revelation 21:5
And he that sat upon the throne said, Behold, I make all things new. And he said unto me, Write: for these words are true and faithful.

[claypot]

All I know for sure is that right now when I stub my toe I experience pain, when money starts running low I get worried, when I hear of others in pain and misery I feel for them.

Knowing (a real renewal of my mind) that God is working in us to do and to will of His good pleasure has brought me so much peace lately. It really has. I believe Jesus knew this yet He cried and got frustrated and was tormented, and not in the flesh only, but He had peace within, real peace, the kind you can't buy at Walmart.

Molly, I think it was you who said it, what I am talking about is full redemption. Heaven to me is not a partial redemption.

cp

[claypot]

 

All I know for sure is that right now when I stub my toe I experience pain, when money starts running low I get worried, when I hear of others in pain and misery I feel for them.

Knowing (a real renewal of my mind) that God is working in us to do and to will of His good pleasure has brought me so much peace lately. It really has. I believe Jesus knew this yet He cried and got frustrated and was tormented, and not in the flesh only, but He had peace within, real peace, the kind you can't buy at Walmart.

Molly, I think it was you who said it, what I am talking about is full redemption. Heaven to me is not a partial redemption.

cp

and imo, it will always be a "partial redemption" as long as you are identified with an external world changing in order to be at "full peace". 

I understand Zeek and how can I not identify with this external world when I stub my toe and feel pain? In Christ I firmly believe I am saved yet in the very real now I hurt and stumble. I can't imagine the now away, can I? Can you?

I don't understand the last part of your sentence.................'changing in order to be at full peace'. What are you saying here Zeek?

cp

[Molly]

and imo, it will always be a "partial redemption" as long as you are identified with an external world changing in order to be at "full peace".  

Since you mentioned it--


1And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand.

2And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years,

3And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season.

--Rev 20



I believe those angels are men.  I keep watching for them.



"angels"

H4397
מלאך
mal'âk
mal-awk'
From an unused root meaning to despatch as a deputy; a messenger; specifically of God, that is, an angel (also a prophet, priest or teacher): - ambassador, angel, king, messenger.

[claypot]

All I know for sure is that right now when I stub my toe I experience pain, when money starts running low I get worried, when I hear of others in pain and misery I feel for them.

Knowing (a real renewal of my mind) that God is working in us to do and to will of His good pleasure has brought me so much peace lately. It really has. I believe Jesus knew this yet He cried and got frustrated and was tormented, and not in the flesh only, but He had peace within, real peace, the kind you can't buy at Walmart.

Molly, I think it was you who said it, what I am talking about is full redemption. Heaven to me is not a partial redemption.

cp

and imo, it will always be a "partial redemption" as long as you are identified with an external world changing in order to be at "full peace". 

I understand Zeek and how can I not identify with this external world when I stub my toe and feel pain? In Christ I firmly believe I am saved yet in the very real now I hurt and stumble. I can't imagine the now away, can I? Can you?

It seems you are saying, when there is no more "stimulus (external world)" to cause pain and suffering, then heaven will be "full".  ? 

It's imo, not the pain of stubbing your toe that is the problem, it's the judgment of it that keeps one in "partial redemption".  The "judgment of it" as "right/wrong, or incomplete" and the "hope" for it to be different that keeps one in "sickness".

I'm saying when there is no more pain then my redemption will be complete. Do you experience pain now Zeek? Do you shed tears now?

And God shall wipe away all  tears  from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain : for the former things are passed away.rev 21.4

The "attachment" I'm talking about is not the "feeling of the pain", but rather the judgment of it.  The "need/desire" for it to be different than what it is. 

Hope deferred makes the heart sick.

I do have a desire to have no pain. I don't like pain nor do I like seeing it in my fellow humans. I can imagine or wish it away but it is still there, if not for me it is for others. Even Jesus wept.

make any sense?  or am I off on some tangent, reading into this conversation/thread from my own weird perspective?

Zeek, we are 2 people seeking to understand each other so we can better understand God. I hate to say it in the midst of this particular discussion but we are trying to undo our imperfections through sharing here so neither one of us is totally right or wrong. To me you are a very insightful person so if you are off on a tangent then I am right with ya Brother.

cp

[claypot]

 

I can't imagine the now away, can I? Can you?

No, but you can be aware of "the part of you" that is trying to "wish it away", that "wants to have it be different", and realize that that "part of you" is impermanent; and will "change" as soon as something "good" happens in your life.   and realize that the part of you that is tossed back and forth like the waves, is not "you".  It's the "old man" still struggling to have life. 

There is a "true you" that is one with the Father and at peace.  But for HIM to be revealed; imo; requires awareness of the "old man's voice".  Sin in me, but not me. 

a double minded man is "unstable" in all his ways. 
   

I hear ya Zeek. I am putting off the old man while putting on the new. I am doing this as I type. I am doing it yet it is a work in progress by none other than God Himself for it is He who is working in me to will and to do of His good pleasure.

I don't see myself nor anyone else as double minded who is doing this putting off and on but I do see it as a 'double' kind of work. Again I see it as a done deal and I see it as a work in progress. It is done, as Jesus said on the cross, yet I am living it out as I type.

cp

[claypot]

 

and imo, it will always be a "partial redemption" as long as you are identified with an external world changing in order to be at "full peace". 

Since you mentioned it--

1And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand.

2And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years,

3And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season.

--Rev 20



I believe those angels are men.  I keep watching for them.

Good stuff Molly. I see the angels as pure divine thoughts within my mind. Creating the mind of Christ within our beings. These Godly thoughts will cast down every evil imagination of our hearts.

I too keep watching for them to spring up in my being. Because it is God who is at work in me doing as He desires, it's like I'm watching a Master Painter do His work. It's amazing when He paints a brush stroke and I SEE it!

cp

[claypot]

 

Do you experience pain now Zeek? Do you shed tears now?

Being in pain and being sad---NO

Experiencing pain and sadness---Yes


God imo is not sad, not in pain, but does experience sadness and pain.

No more tears imo, is a reference to who I AM, not what I experience.

Interesting deductions and I will think on these more, thanks Zeek.

I know who I am in Christ and I know what I am experiencing now. HMMMMMM. I do experience complete bliss at times yet I do experience 'less than bliss' often enough. I guess my whole point here is, no matter how you put it, I will be completely redeemed when I don't go back and forth between putting off the old man and putting on the new.

cp

[claypot]

and imo, it will always be a "partial redemption" as long as you are identified with an external world changing in order to be at "full peace". 

Since you mentioned it--

1And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand.

2And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years,

3And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season.

--Rev 20



I believe those angels are men.  I keep watching for them.

Good stuff Molly. I see the angels as pure divine thoughts within my mind. Creating the mind of Christ within our beings. These Godly thoughts will cast down every evil imagination of our hearts.
I too keep watching for them to spring up in my being. Because it is God who is at work in me doing as He desires, it's like I'm watching a Master Painter do His work. It's amazing when He paints a brush stroke and I SEE it!

cp

see, imo; you are identyfing with "our heart" as the "old heart".  that's imo a lie

I hear ya Zeek but in my mind I was identifying 'our hearts' with the 'old man' that I am putting off and have put off 'in Christ'.

Zeek, are you putting off the old man and putting on the new?

cp

[claypot]

I can't "put off" what is already "off", but I can be aware of it's presence. 

I understand Zeek but with me I seem to be in a constant state of putting off the old and putting on the new. I see myself as having totally put off the old in a 'big picture' way yet I see myself still struggling right now as I live and breathe in this mortal coil.

cp

[Nathan]

The enablement to have things "put off" is definitely accounted for through the finished work of the cross.  Just as God stated that Eve would "desire" after Adam, but that he would "rule" over her, the same exact thing God said to Cain about the sin that was waiting at the door but he, Cain, would "rule" over it.

Neither Adam, nor Cain ruled over what they were given authority to rule over.  They "had" the authority, but they didn't "exercise" that authority.  I wholly believe I have the authority to cast off the old man.  But I also believe, for me to become the overcomer that God has proclaimed me to be, I need and want to exercise that authority to throw off that old man in me.  Heck, sometimes the old man shows up and "I" the inner me, the consiousness of me, I'm not even aware that it's happening until the spirit quickens the inner me of what's transpiring.

But yeah, the authority is always at our disposal, we just need to engage in it and exercise it where needed.

[claypot]

The enablement to have things "put off" is definitely accounted for through the finished work of the cross.  Just as God stated that Eve would "desire" after Adam, but that he would "rule" over her, the same exact thing God said to Cain about the sin that was waiting at the door but he, Cain, would "rule" over it.

Neither Adam, nor Cain ruled over what they were given authority to rule over.  They "had" the authority, but they didn't "exercise" that authority.  I wholly believe I have the authority to cast off the old man.  But I also believe, for me to become the overcomer that God has proclaimed me to be, I need and want to exercise that authority to throw off that old man in me.  Heck, sometimes the old man shows up and "I" the inner me, the consiousness of me, I'm not even aware that it's happening until the spirit quickens the inner me of what's transpiring.

But yeah, the authority is always at our disposal, we just need to engage in it and exercise it where needed.

God will accomplish it in you Brother. He will and you will be doing what you desire and more.

cp

[Dallas]

Let me ask you now, after death when you think you will recieve a body that is without sin, what will be different that you have now? As you said, perfect in spirit already, what will be different? Not a physical end, but a continuing on forever right?

So will be different?


Dallas, how do you know what I think?

I have to go and I don't know if I responded to your questions properly. Please re-ask if I missed anything. I value your thoughts.

cp

I don't pretend to know what you think, but I do remember you agreeing that when we die we get a body of perfection, again not assuming, but just reading what you say and responding to it.

Also, the reason I am at peace, isn't because I have tranquility, but because I'm not at war. Peace when it was penned was a military term, it wasn't till much later and a cuture removed that peace incorporated the other meanings...peace was a military term to describe not being at war.

I am not at war, with God and He is not at war with me...I am at peace. I may stubb my toe and feel pain, but that won't remove my peace.

[willieH]

Do you experience pain now Zeek? Do you shed tears now?

Being in pain and being sad---NO

Experiencing pain and sadness---Yes


God imo is not sad, not in pain, but does experience sadness and pain.

No more tears imo, is a reference to who I AM, not what I experience.

Hmmm... just curious...

How can anyone "EXPERIENCE" PAIN and yet, ...NOT be "IN" IT?  :Chinscratch:

...willieH  :HeartThrob:

[Dallas]

Hmmm... just curious...

How can anyone "EXPERIENCE" PAIN and yet, ...NOT be "IN" IT?

:thumbsup:

I think Commander Data did?

[Beloved Servant]

...pure fiction.

[willieH]

Hmmm... just curious...

How can anyone "EXPERIENCE" PAIN and yet, ...NOT be "IN" IT?

:thumbsup:

I think Commander Data did?

:laughing7:  ...so, a "nonexistent" is the only one?  :laughhand:

Even then... did "it" [cmdr. data] really "experience" ...it?  :LH:

Or was "it" just programmed to SIMULATE "experiencing" ...it?  :JCThink: :mrflo:

...willieH   :laugh:

[reFORMer]

Enough pain and you can't identify with anything else but the pain.  I know by experience.  God can come and bring you above it or deliver you from it in several ways.  But, the idea that pain is optional to our awareness, you can just think about something else, is a vain imagination from lack of experience.

[willieH]

willieH: Hi reFormer...  :cloud9:

Enough pain and you can't identify with anything else but the pain.  I know by experience.  God can come and bring you above it or deliver you from it in several ways.  But, the idea that pain is optional to our awareness, you can just think about something else, is a vain imagination from lack of experience.

:nod: ...I agree completely with this reF...   :ok:

Just have an intrusive surgery... or an absessed tooth... or a limb lost to a shark bite... or developed (latter stage), CANCER, ...with no pain suppressing medications... and see if you can sidestep such "PAIN"...

Many speak from the voice of INEXPERIENCE... concerning, being ...IN PAIN...  :sigh:

...willieH  :HeartThrob:

[reFORMer]

Do you know what it means to be IN DENIAL?

[Nathan]

Enough pain and you can't identify with anything else but the pain.  I know by experience.  God can come and bring you above it or deliver you from it in several ways.  But, the idea that pain is optional to our awareness, you can just think about something else, is a vain imagination from lack of experience.

Not sure I fully agree in the sense that by concentraiting your mind on one "focal point" must have some degree of affect, otherwise it would not be the fundamental teaching nurses give to every expecting mother as they prepare for the pain of childbirth.  I don't know if I could say your mind can eliminate all pain, but I do believe the natural mind can inflate it and make it worse than what it actually is.

[CHB]

(Rom. 8:22) For we know that the WHOLE CREATION GROANETH AND TRAVAILETH IN PAIN TOGETHER UNTIL NOW.

Paul said to those who believed as he did that "not only they, but ourselves also, which have the firstfruits of the Spirit, EVEN WE OURSELVES GROAN WITHIN OURSELVES, WAITING FOR THE ADOPTION TO WIT, THE REDEMPTION OF OUR BODY.

CHB

[reFORMer]

I like what one writer in the old Soviet Union said.  "Don't believe anything I say; because, when they torture me, I'll say anything they want me to."