I Cornithians 1 thru 5

[SQ]

1 Corinthians 5
Expel the Immoral Brother!
1It is actually reported that there is sexual immorality among you, and of a kind that does not occur even among pagans: A man has his father's wife. 2And you are proud! Shouldn't you rather have been filled with grief and have put out of your fellowship the man who did this? 3Even though I am not physically present, I am with you in spirit. And I have already passed judgment on the one who did this, just as if I were present. 4When you are assembled in the name of our Lord Jesus and I am with you in spirit, and the power of our Lord Jesus is present, 5hand this man over to Satan, so that the sinful nature[a] may be destroyed and his spirit saved on the day of the Lord.


What is Paul talking about when he says hand this man over to Satan so his sinful nature may be destroyed?
When pauls says this it appears Satan is the destroyer of immoral behaviour.  :dontknow:

[friendofmankind]

I think its the same type of thing that happened to Job.
God sent Satan to cause Job various distresses, many of which had to do with his body being covered in boils, weakened etc, all for the better 'outcome'.

When I am weak I am strong.
He who has suffered in the flesh is done with sin.

That type of thing.

[rosered]

 ''

  Hi SQ,
good question  sis
  and like  your reply Marc

  the first thing I thought of was  in Matt  12 Mark 3 and Luke 11

  when  Satan  is against/divison  satan his house cannot stand .. 

   when the Lord is our protection and we  draw near to Him ,,
any type of guilt or sin makes us not so free to draw near to the Lord
  happened alot of my life  growing up , getting past that  , was  Gods grace sis  being a slave to sin is not   freeing , but very binding , this man because of his own desire  with sin ,  being weak in the flesh , yet the flesh is ruling over his spirit   has caused a division in the church  and has  Paul exposing this openly , him being  made  an example  ....
   here is what the NLT  says  in Matt 12 , and it makes sense to me

24 But when the Pharisees heard about the miracle, they said, "No wonder he can cast out demons. He gets his power from Satan, the prince of demons."

25 Jesus knew their thoughts and replied, "Any kingdom divided by civil war is doomed. A town or family splintered by feuding will fall apart.

  26 And if Satan is casting out Satan, he is divided and fighting against himself.

His own kingdom will not survive.

27 And if I am empowered by Satan, what about your own exorcists?




  They cast out demons, too, so they will condemn you for what you have said.


28 But if I am casting out demons by the Spirit of God, then the Kingdom of God has arrived among you.


29 For who is powerful enough to enter the house of a strong man like Satan and plunder his goods?
 
Only someone even stronger—someone who could tie him up and then plunder his house.

30 "Anyone who isn't with me opposes me, and anyone who isn't working with me is actually working against me.


  we know God is stronger so eventually this man will be saved by the grace of God in the end   and satan will have an end in this mans  life after sin becomes so uttely sinful in his life and heart ..    Paul speaks of this in Romans  7

  hope this makes sense to you some  how .. :icon_flower:

[SQ]

Thanks friendofmankind and rosered you both gave me some thoughts to consider.
rosered seems most of my life one thing gets solved, then there is something else to get out of the way.
I believe what you are saying we have to have this fleshly desires destroyed, those things that are not of God.
We are happy to sin but the sin is removed one lust at a time maybe it could be desire for more material things or jealousy or porn or backbiting fleshly things.
Paul may have been saying let this man go his way do his thing and in time he will be saved by destroying the lusts of the flesh am I right?
Paul maybe was saying let him go and eventually he will be sick of the flesh.
If this be so I understand.
I am happy but it has been a rough ride.
Is this what is being an overcomer one thing at a time until you look back and think I am so thankful you God have destroyed my flesh of this or that. It is all God doing.  :HeartThrob:

[rosered]

Paul may have been saying let this man go his way do his thing and in time he will be saved by destroying the lusts of the flesh am I right?

  Hi sis , Yes I think your right about that ..
   sin  works death in us , the old man has to die [ as this is  Gods requirement  , promise even  for wages of sin is death  ]as the new man  is strengthed daily in the Lord whom all power and wisdom of God is through Jesus Christ ..  He is our everything  , we are hopeless/ helpless  without Him and His  help  , grace etc ..

[SQ]

Paul may have been saying let this man go his way do his thing and in time he will be saved by destroying the lusts of the flesh am I right?

 Hi sis , Yes I think your right about that ..
  sin  works death in us , the old man has to die [ as this is  Gods requirement  , promise even  for wages of sin is death  ]as the new man  is strengthed daily in the Lord whom all power and wisdom of God is through Jesus Christ ..  He is our everything  , we are hopeless/ helpless  without Him and His  help  , grace etc ..

Isn't that AMAZING the experience of destruction of the flesh to bring us to the point that we die, sin has no power once we are dead to it.
That just floors me. Lol so simple but so hard to see until you finally see.  :girlheart:



I didn't mean to bold all of that

[SQ]

Must be stuck!

[Jerm]

This is excommunication.  Christians today have become so individualistic that the thought of being "kicked out of the Church" is viewed with contempt and the response is usually "I'll just go to another church."  This wasn't an option back in the day.  To be secluded from the community of faith was a horrible punishment to endure.  However, as is the nature of God, this was not punishment for punishment's sake.  Notice that Paul says this is done in hope that this man might be saved.  When done in the right manner and with the right motivation, excommunication is actually an act of grace.  It is intended to help not to harm.

[SQ]

Interesting point Jerm,sure would be a humbling experience to be excommunicated and not able to go to another church.
He would be a marked man back in the day.

[friendofmankind]

This is such an interesting post.

I can honestly say from experience, when you have greatly suffered...Sin does seem to lose all of its attractiveness...When your really ill, all you want to is get better...to love and to laugh, with greater gusto than ever before...Whether there is a God or not, whether there is a reward or not...You just want to love and help people...To do things that are really worthwhile consumes your every thought.

In my experience anyway.

[Beloved Servant]

It takes an affliction — to work(s) a compassion

[rosered]

  good stuff guys ,
 keeps this interesting  :thumbsup:      Yes Jerm , excomunication, thought of    the Amish   in these parts  have an age 16 that the children  can leave   and than go out in the world  but have no part with their family , its a choice ,  they can come back home to humble  beginings   at any time  and  leave the world behind ,  sort of a prodical  son type  thing :icon_flower:

 :icon_flower:

[SQ]

I have to ask..Is satan used by God?
It appears to me there is some good in all of us but also some bad.
Satan is he real or just the beast within us?
There was someplace in the Bible, can't recall now where I read, we just can't believe this is satan we say is this the man?
This leads me to think we could be exposed, Satan is in us.
Satan is not believed to be man by most.

When Paul excommunicated the man from his church seems like he was saying let him go until he gets sick of himself then he will return back after he no longer has the desire to live his life in this way.

[rosered]

I have to ask..Is satan used by God?
It appears to me there is some good in all of us but also some bad.
Satan is he real or just the beast within us?
There was someplace in the Bible, can't recall now where I read, we just can't believe this is satan we say is this the man?
This leads me to think we could be exposed, Satan is in us.
Satan is not believed to be man by most.

When Paul excommunicated the man from his church seems like he was saying let him go until he gets sick of himself then he will return back after he no longer has the desire to live his life in this way.

good point SIS ,  about  that , when the man bound by sin , is  sick of the death he will return and repent from his ways  back  to God who saves with mercy
and  I believe your talking about Isaiah 14  is this the man whom shook the nations ??     the lucifer thing ..  light bearer

  it is the son of dawn / king of babylon , seems its a KJV  error  with a latin  name lucifer ??  some call satan ??

  its confusing to me  actually
  here is the  NLT  Isaiah   14   staring with verse  12 "How you are fallen from heaven,
      O shining star, son of the morning!
   You have been thrown down to the earth,
      you who destroyed the nations of the world.
13 For you said to yourself,
      'I will ascend to heaven and set my throne above God's stars.
   I will preside on the mountain of the gods
      far away in the north. 14 I will climb to the highest heavens
      and be like the Most High.'
15 Instead, you will be brought down to the place of the dead,
      down to its lowest depths.
16 Everyone there will stare at you and ask,
   'Can this be the one who shook the earth
      and made the kingdoms of the world tremble?
17 Is this the one who destroyed the world
      and made it into a wasteland?
   Is this the king who demolished the world's greatest cities
      and had no mercy on his prisoners?'


   many translations but this  New Living translations is a favorite    right now ...

KJV  Isa 14:12 How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! [how] art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations!  Lucifer = "light-bearer"

1) shining one, morning star, Lucifer

a) of the king of Babylon and Satan (fig.)

2) (TWOT) 'Helel' describing the king of Babylon
For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north: 


Isa 14:14   I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will be like the most High. 


Isa 14:15   Yet thou shalt be brought down to hell, to the sides of the pit. 


Isa 14:16   They that see thee shall narrowly look upon thee, [and] consider thee, [saying, Is] this the man that made the earth to tremble, that did shake kingdoms; 

Isa 14:17   [That] made the world as a wilderness, and destroyed the cities thereof; [that] opened not the house of his prisoners? 


    IS this the place you are  thinking about ?
  or am I mistaken . :mblush:
  :icon_flower:

[Molly]

Isa 14:16   They that see thee shall narrowly look upon thee, [and] consider thee, [saying, Is] this the man that made the earth to tremble, that did shake kingdoms;

Satan can enter into a man, as we are told specifically about Judas.

  John 13:27
As soon as Judas took the bread, Satan entered into him.



Our Lord Jesus is also called 'a man.'


31Because he hath appointed a day, in the which he will judge the world in righteousness by that man whom he hath ordained; whereof he hath given assurance unto all men, in that he hath raised him from the dead.

--Act 17

[SQ]

Thanks rosered that is the scripture Isa.14:16. Lucifer and Satan are different then.
I suppose king of babylon is not Satan it is a bit confusing?

I forgot when Satan entered Judas.
Molly, so Satan is an actual character.
I have been going back and forth with this  scriptures point to Satan as being real not evil within.
I am in over my head!!  :laughing7:

[rosered]

  Hi Sis,  I join you in the confusion  :grin:

Seems satan and the devil have  power in the earth and  in  death ?

best example is Jesus  telling Peter  , get behind me satan  :sigh:


Mat 16:23 But he turned, and said unto Peter, Get thee behind me, Satan: thou art an offence unto me: for thou savourest not the things that be of God, but those that be of men.
savourest   Strong's G5426 - phroneō   is a verb that   means


  1) to have understanding, be wise

2) to feel, to think

a) to have an opinion of one's self, think of one's self,  :dontknow:

, not let one's opinion (though just) of himself exceed the bounds of modesty

b) to think or judge what one's opinion is

c) to be of the same mind i.e. agreed together, cherish the same views, be harmonious

3) to direct one's mind to a thing, to seek, to strive for

a) to seek one's interest or advantage

b) to be of one's party, side with him (in public affairs)

seems Peter was siding with satan by the above  definitions   or spoke though him / Peter ? not so sure on how to look at that sis .

   Satan here Strong's G4567 - Satanas  which  means by strongs definition 

  1) adversary (one who opposes another in purpose or act), the name given to

a) the prince of evil spirits, the inveterate adversary of God and Christ

1) he incites apostasy from God and to sin

2) circumventing men by his wiles

3) the worshippers of idols are said to be under his control

4) by his demons he is able to take possession of men and inflict them with diseases

5) by God's assistance he is overcome

6) on Christ's return from heaven he will be bound with chains for a thousand years, but when the thousand years are finished he will walk the earth in yet greater power, but shortly after will be given over to eternal punishment

b) a Satan-like man

   Now satan seems to have tempted Christ in Matt 4   and here the  verses  says   satan has this power over death   by FEAR  to those in bondage to sin

and that Jesus  destroys him/ satan  though  His death and to me frees us from  that same bondage to sin  ....we than become Christs possesion

  :HeartThrob:

Hbr 2:14 Forasmuch then as the children are partakers of flesh and blood, he also himself likewise took part of the same; that through death he might destroy him that had the power of death, that is, the devil; 
And deliver them who through fear of death were all their lifetime subject to bondage.

[WhiteWings]

Thanks rosered that is the scripture Isa.14:16. Lucifer and Satan are different then I suppose king of babylon is not Satan it is a bit confusing?

The king was the fallen star.

I forgot when Satan entered Judas.
Molly so Satan is an actual character.

Not saying Molly is wrong but not only characters can enter someone.
You can just as well say "a bad idea", "sinful intentions", etc

I have been going back and forth with this  scriptures point to Satan as being real not evil within.

Satan also did go back and forth in Job.

I think an important question is: Is "person" satan omni present?
God is. But satan. If satan is a being he must be because many people at the same time are sining.

[SQ]

 Thanks WW, rosered thanks.
I need to stick with the important stuff.
We belong to Christ, so I am going to leave it at that.  :HeartThrob:

[rosered]

Thanks WW, rosered thanks.
I need to stick with the important stuff.
We belong to Christ, so I am going to leave it at that.  :HeartThrob:

:thumbsup:   amen sis amen!!!  :HeartThrob:   

  Paul loved being bound to Christ ! :icon_flower:  we as well  :thumbsup:
Rom 1:1 ¶ Paul, a servant of Jesus Christ, called [to be] an apostle, separated unto the gospel of God, 



Strong's G1401 - doulos
1) a slave, bondman, man of servile condition

a) a slave

b) metaph., one who gives himself up to another's will those whose service is used by Christ in extending and advancing his cause among men

c) devoted to another to the disregard of one's own interests

2) a servant, attendant

[Jerm]

 good stuff guys ,
 keeps this interesting  :thumbsup:      Yes Jerm , excomunication, thought of    the Amish   in these parts  have an age 16 that the children  can leave   and than go out in the world  but have no part with their family , its a choice ,  they can come back home to humble  beginings   at any time  and  leave the world behind ,  sort of a prodical  son type  thing :icon_flower:

 :icon_flower:

Yep, it's called Rumspringa.  I had to do a research project on rites of passage and I did a little research on this tradition.  An interesting note is that after seeing everything the "modern world" has to offer, the vast majority of Amish teenagers choose to stay in their communities.

[rosered]

 :thumbsup:     no doubt Bro being rooted and grounded in Love  along with correction   works every time  or most of the  time,  if we have any wisdom/ understanding  at all   , seems to be a hard lesson   through experience   though  :winkgrin:

  Thanks for the feedback  :icon_flower:

[peacemaker]

Satan, an adversary is a being; a human being who opposes himself, or others.

"To be or not to be is the ultimate question."

peacemaker

[peacemaker]

:Book: In the case of Job, it was the accusations of a vagabond which were
presented to the King through the children and brought before the judge.

peacemaker

[reFORMer]

Whether good or bad, a lot of things people are into just rattle around in their heads.  Once the spiritual power relating to that thing in your head and heart shows up it is quite a different matter.  Like there is believing without seeing much results, then "faith with power" starts working wonders, so wickedness empowered by Satan is much more destructive and obviously something to escape than the many petty sins of which the average boring man is guilty.  Those who continue pressing into the realm of God do aquire powers it is best to respect and of great benefit to seek out..