Leaving the Institutionalized Fundamentalist Church

[Universalist Catholic]

I had been a free thinker most of my life, but had limited knowledge on the bible.  I did believe that God had a mysterious way of working, and at times the whole reasoning behind the way the universe worked did not always seem to make sense.  However, I had always believed that amidst these confusions, and lack of understandings of his mysterious ways, it was all for some greater purpose, and that in the end everything would work out for the very best.  At some point, I had ran into some bible thumpers, who would quote Scripture to justify some unreasonable ideals, like claiming that Homosexuals were wicked, that one could not get a tattoo, women were insubordinate to men, all great Hindus, Buddhists, Muslims, Jews and Indigenous religious people were doomed to an eternity of torture, while someone who was extremely evil, but Christian went to eternal heaven without any purging of their sins.  This just did not make sense to me, so I had turned to the Catholic Church, because I was aware that they did not take the bible literally, so maybe they could make sense of these nonsense positions made from scripture, not to mention, I was not well equipped to handle this kind of thing.  The Catholicism I had been exposed to in my little Church group was a very modern and liberal form of Catholicism.  They seemed to have this idea that all religions were equal, the Catholic Church in the past has made mistakes, because it is run by man, not everything is evil, pets in heaven, you have to think for yourself.  More Humanistic than hardcore Dogmatic.  At some point, due to stresses from a particularly rough school, I started developing anxiety.  Some point after this had started, I had gotten into hell literature, Big mistake.  I was well aware of the fact many people in the catholic Church did not believe that hell was literal tormenting fires.  However, I had started becoming repulsed by the Fundamentalist view of people being burned into fires forever, just because they were in the wrong religion, or people burning forever, just because they looked at a playboy magazine, ate a grape without paying, spoke back to their parents, etc. as deserving of eternal and unbearable punishment forever and ever.  Once my anxiety had gotten worse, I had gotten into Catholic stuff.  I had read their dogma, and their teachings, and had realized they were nearly as bad as the Fundamentalist Teachings.  Okay, I had dealt with problems about Catholicism before.  However, this time around, I had started becoming a bit clingy to Catholicism, since I had been under the impression that they could take scripture and make sense out of particularly difficult scriptures.  Over the course of time, I had started learning more about Catholicism from websites such as Catholic Answers, Yahoo Answers Catholic Community, ewtn, Catholic doors, and other various Catholic Websites.  Unfortunately, the more I had discovered, the more disturbed I had become.  There was a whole set of Dogma I was not even aware existed, and expected to believe, or be labeled a heretic.  On top of that, I was expected to also accept everything the Catechism taught, which is 2865 statements of faith, which had to be believed, unless the pope changed them.  Where was the room for the mystery and spiritual understanding of God?  However, I started seeking out loopholes in Catholic Doctrine, because I did not want to give up my ability to do my own thinking.  The biggest problem I was dealing with was the Doctrine of Eternal Hell.  The dogma was that the punisments were eternal, so I had taken that to mean that the punishment could be anything, and concluded Annihilation, since it seemed to make the most biblical sense to me.  But having read much of those articles on the internet, I found many of these Catholics to be extremely defensive towards anyone who disagreed with them.  They had seemed to show this extreme holier than thou attitude, with an extreme anti-protestant sentiment, referring to non-Christians as demonic, and the Catholics who were not so fundamentalistic in their thinking as Cafeteria Catholics. Not to mention, they could be extremely legalistic, loveless and judgmental.  They seemed to care more about obedience to the Churches rules and Doctrines, than love.  On top of that, I nearly became brainwashed into thinking that the Spanish Inquisition, the Crusades, the Gallileo "Heresy", and the abuses of the Papacy during the Reformation were justified, or not in anyway the churches fault.  So, I thought these legalistic, rude, bitter, arrogant, and holier than thou's were a poor representation of Catholicism.  My thought was, that Yahoo Answers is just a corrupt website(Thats true), Catholic Answers was another corrupt website, and that the internet Catholics were stuck in the Dark ages.  The truth was, I had been in denial of what the institutionalized Church taught.  This had only lasted about 10 months, but during those 10 months, I had times where I would drift away from the Dogma and doctrine, into believing what the spirit within me told me what was true, and what was not.  For a while, I had been studying with Jehovah's Witnesses, and they take the bible very seriously.  But I had began learning more about the bible, and it was not nearly as legalistic as I had thought, but then, I was just being shown verses without looking at the whole passage of the bible.  But I had been slightly brainwashed into the whole idea that the Church alone had permission to interpret the bible, since they created the bible.  I had still been in denial, but after a refreshing trip to Florida, I had been under this idea that the Church had been an optimistic Church.  So, the spirit was working with me.  In late September, I had gotten into some book, which was part of a series of Catholic Dogma, and the book was referred to as "The Last Things".  It was making reference to heaven, hell, Purgatory and Judgment.  The Hell reference was the worst, making reference to some highly unbiblical references, referring to such idea's as the "Pain of Senses", "Pain of loss", and going on about how this was a very serious matter of faith, because some medieval saints had said so.  Not to mention all the official interpretations made by the Church that was not even in the Catechism.  This ate up all the loopholes for Catholicism, along with a whole series of books of Catholic Dogma.  For about a week and a half, I had tried to understand their dogma, but it just was not making any sense to me.  I started feeling extremely disconnected to "The Truth", thanks to exposure to Sermons from Fr. Corapi, and Fr. Larry Richards, and every other dogmatic statement from Catholic Answers.  All these rules I was being forced to obey, I was feeling like such a Pharisee, but was still in denial, despite the fact that my loopholes for the rules were being filled by the church.  I was having a very difficult time accepting their dogma, along with the belief that their dogma was the absolute truth.  Most of the dogma I was having difficulty with was about Hell, other religions, believing every single teaching, along with their strict rules telling us who to vote for, what we can read, and that whole idea that everything that was remotely fun was wrong.  So, I did not even want to learn anything else, because I did not want to give up my right to reason, but it was really difficult with all this Dogma that made no sense.  I felt more stuck in legalism than spirituality.  After reading some creepy catholic prophecy, I had a major panic attack.  I had actually believed I was in danger, cause now I knew the Truth.  So, that day, I had done some research, and found out I was actually dealing with Generalized anxiety Disorder, and had been dealing this for over a year, which explained that my minds fear system got all goofed up, and made me fear stuff, with not acting reasonable.  (With healthy fear, you would only react with a real threat, and your instincts react without reasoning a plan to avoid danger, but the fear is all goofed up, and you end up goofing up your reasoning ability and not thinking right).  That night, I had felt a little closer to God than I had in over a week.  After getting a psychological evaluation, I began treatment.  I still believed that anxiety was causing me to perceive Catholic Teachings in this negative way, and had nothing to do with Catholicism.  Unfortunately, I was still troubled by Catholic teachings, and the difficulty I was having reasoning all this out.  I had tried to avoid the problem all together, by not looking at any religious literature for a while.  But over that time, I had felt disconnected and confused about everything in my life.  What was troubling me the most was this whole idea that heaven was considered the Church triumphant.  Eternity of being around pharisees? Ugh!  But being in horrible torment forever did not sound fun either.  I was feeling so disconnected with my family and friends, since I had been brainwashed into thinking that these people were the lost, the heathens, the lukewarm, the Cafeteria Catholics, heretics, just cause they did not all believe in everlasting punishment, submission to the pope, or that the Church was infallible.  But many did not practice all those commands, like mortification of the flesh, fasting, rosaries, going to church every week, accepting all the dogma, or go out and evangelize, but all these people did in fact love.  I could sense the love they all had, but had been brainwashed into thinking that this was the works of the world.  But those people whom I was hearing from, like these famous theologians(Scott Hahn, Vinny Flynn, Fr. Larry Richards, Fr. Corapi, the people on Catholic Answers, Yahoo answers, and every other Catholics Apologetics page.), I could not feel any love with them.  All I had felt with them was love of the Religious leaders, the letter of the law and the Catechism.  I felt absolutely no love with them.  All I felt was arrogance, dogmatism, legalism, and this love for the letter of the law.  After I had been finally let down by Mother Angelica and my Pastor,(They both love, but are still stuck in the dogma).  I was not sure where to turn.  One day, I had been in my final week with treatments, so I had been feeling not so stressed.  But God came to me during Art History, and told me to drop my burden.  I had started wondering about this whole Church, and became suspicious as to their authenticity.  That night, I did some research, and found out that the scriptures had references to other Churches set up by other apostles.  I had started to wonder if the Church Jesus had set up was supposed to be some organization, or a spiritual Church for all those who love God and their neighbor.  I had automatically began to felt reconnected with my friends and family, was thinking straight, and I had become more free, just like John 8:32 said would happen.  I was realizing that being, what I newly referred to as a Fundamentalist Catholic, had been some of the worst months of my life.  Before having become a Fundamentalist Catholic, I did not accept all that dogma, and felt much closer to Jesus than I had as a Fundamentalist.  I had begun to learn about early Christianity during the time of Jesus, and how it was a humble religion with a very joyful theme to it.  I had later learned that Constantine took over Christianity, and made it into a political Religion, that would start enforcing Dogma, ordinances, along with banning heresies, and starting new practices that had to be practiced.  Then, I had found out that St. Peter had never went to Rome, and that the whole St. Peter, first Pope myth, was just a rewrite of History to justify the Papacy, and give them permission to decide what was truth, and heresy.  Thats why I had felt so shackled, because I was not dwelling in truth, but having Romes opinions forced on me.  I began to see the truth of Protestantism too.  They believed in the bible alone, but they still seemed legalistic to me.  But, these Fundamentalists Protestant, despite their anti-Catholicism were in fact a continuation of the corruption with Rome, and their faulty bible Translations.  Traditions of Men, Starting with Rome, taking over the Christedom of the East.  Then the Protestant took Western Christian Philosophy, and it developed into Evangelical Protestantism, which was an even bigger mess.  That is how I found Universalism, which is a whole other story.     

[jabcat]

Don't throw out the baby with the bathwater.  There is still things that are wicked (maybe even some things the "Bible thumpers" were right about), but perhaps in a greater or different context than is often presented.  Seek God, ask Him for truth, and I don't believe He will ever lead us into anything that's opposed to accurately translated, Spirit revealed, rightly divided scripture. 

[Universalist Catholic]

Don't throw out the baby with the bathwater.  There is still things that are wicked (maybe even some things the "Bible thumpers" were right about), but perhaps in a greater or different context than is often presented.  Seek God, ask Him for truth, and I don't believe He will ever lead us into anything that's opposed to accurately translated, Spirit revealed, rightly divided scripture. 

I still have another part of my testimony I would like to publish.  Its about how I came to Universalism, and learned about the real bible.

[WhiteWings]

I still have another part of my testimony I would like to publish.  Its about how I came to Universalism, and learned about the real bible.

Please post it  :thumbsup:

[lizzybeth]

I had a lot of the same issues you dealt with. I still deal with them when I'm particularity insecure.

This may seem over simplified... but the honest to best way I've found to deal with stuff like this is to just talk to Jesus about it personally. I told Jesus all of the stuff that I had problems with, and I told him how I believed some stuff that other Christians didn't (like NDE's, OBEs, reincarnation...)... I asked him to forgive me if my beliefs were wrong... and to love me even though I was so imperfect, and was at times this ball of anxiety and questions. Feeling this sense of love and peace wash over me, and knowing how Jesus love and accepted me, even if I interpreted things differently, even if I happened to be wrong on some things, was a great salve to my soul.

[Beloved Servant]

Lizzybeth, You are a ray of light!

[jabcat]

Lizzy, as long as you're willing to ask Him to show you His truths, and admit there are things you don't know for sure, so won't "lock in and swear up and down" and close your mind and heart to His Spirit revealing to you.  Also "search the scriptures daily to see if these things be so" as Paul said of the Berean group in the scriptures.

I'd say we all have things we don't know, struggle with, understand.  We all "see through a glass darkly".  There are things that don't set well with my carnal mind, my feelings, or my logic - and though I do believe in logic and emotions, for me the bottom line is trying to know and understand "what sayeth the Lord"...then my SELF needs to be changed, reformed, renewed by His Spirit and Word, rather than me forcing them into my own belief system and comfort level.  Sometimes it's painful and "goes against the grain" - but I believe that's part of the Potter re-shaping the clay - and He knows how to make us EXACTLY what He wants.

[lizzybeth]

That's basically what I try to do. I don't think I've ever told Jesus that I know something for *certain*. Almost all of my talks with him are me basically going "well... what about this, Jesus... (this being whatever thing I'm fixated on at that time) I believe this could be true... maybe on some level I believe it is true... but if it's not please forgive me for being wrong. I know I'm not perfect, but I'm trying to find the truth to the best of my ability, even if it is imperfect".

Edit: I'm not sure I'm allowed to express some beliefs I have here, so I'll respect that. :grin:

[jabcat]

Lizzy, we're all learning, and there's many good folks here who will be a helping hand to you - and it appears you'll be willing to also be one to us.  Thanks, be blessed.