Matthew 10:33

[Cardinal]

Yeah Cardinal i am having a hard time following you.... it just doesn't make sense... you are talking in spiritual terms obviously but i don't get you assumptions and where they are backed scripturally

What we are to judge is the flesh, which never lines up with His Spirit. If we agree with the judgment of the Spirit, we are not denying Him. If we don't agree with the judgment of His Spirit, then we are denying Him. It's not a one time thing, it's a pick up your cross and follow me daily, kind of thing. Blessings....

so this confuses me a bit because it sounds like this last statement has nothing to do with anything and is not pertinent to Matt 10:33 at all.... i am new to this so maybe it's just me...don't mean to step on any toes.

Cheers

Jake

:cloud9: Actually, it is the key to Matt 10:33 and reFORMer's post explained in essence why. Most people think that nearly everything in there is a one time (always either past or future = the two thieves on the cross) event. But with a digging into the words of the Word, a different picture emerges, a DAILY (NOW is the day of your salvation) interaction of the Spirit with man.

We are all a work in progress, an earthen riverbank for the rivers of living water, ie. water that is Spirit and always moving, not stagnant. Because of that, and the fact His Spirit in us is what's moving in us, the way He comes or appears to us, is He has come, He is come, and He is coming. That word used there is an active verb, ie. denoting movement or action, not a passive noun.

So if you understand that, and understand that heaven is state of being, not a geographical place, which Jesus basically said to Nicodemus, I'm standing here talking to you, but I'm in heaven and Paul said let our conversation be from heaven (you can't speak out of a place you've never been before), then you can see that what we read at one time and considered a finite moment in time, was actually a continuing of the Spirit to do a work in the midst of us.

So as I explained in my first post, denying Him is not a one time finite event in time, but a progressive work of the Spirit in teaching us to choose the good and not the evil. Today I may walk in what I've been shown lately (not denying Him), but tomorrow thru the weakness of the flesh, I may give in and not walk in it (denying Him).

He "denies" me to my Father, the same way He denied Jerusalem; He could do no great works there because of their unbelief. Were they cast away forever? No; but for OUR sakes, for a season, until the fulness of the Gentiles comes in.

An evil heart of unbelief is what has to be dealt with in all of us, at many different levels. The progressive work of the Spirit revealing His will to us in all things, is what "uncovers" this heart of unbelief, if we shrink back from walking in what was shown. Blessings....

[Cardinal]

"If the blind lead the blind, they will both fall in the ditch."  "And so they were for evermore," is what we were wrongly taught to add.  But the truth is they are there because they both have something to learn.  One of the first is how to get out of there.  So many beleivers inappropriately universalize or infinitize statements in the Word.  For ever and always, or everybody and everywhere are added when they are not there in the text.

What is not recognized is resurrection is out of death.  We lack understanding of the indestructible and incorruptible.  We fear death as an end in itself, which it never can be.  It is the ground for new life.  We must leave the room we are in to enter into another.  Even the physical law of the conservation of energy teaches us it only changes form.  We are entering into immortal life.  We will accumulate so many experiences of death and transfiguration, at least until we find the rest of faith that He really doesn't forsake us.  What we ultimately are is a special aspect of the Divine nature.  We lay down our lives and take them back again. Consider the many forms Scripture records Jesus has manifest in.  There are at least eight.  Now, enthroned upon high, the ascended head is present in many members here.  Next on the schedule is for this to become manifest, and in such a way that the world (cosmos) begins to be demonstrated as subject to the Glory we've come to radiate.

:cloud9: AMEN  :thumbsup:

[sparrow]

Yeah Cardinal i am having a hard time following you.... it just doesn't make sense... you are talking in spiritual terms obviously but i don't get you assumptions and where they are backed scripturally

What we are to judge is the flesh, which never lines up with His Spirit. If we agree with the judgment of the Spirit, we are not denying Him. If we don't agree with the judgment of His Spirit, then we are denying Him. It's not a one time thing, it's a pick up your cross and follow me daily, kind of thing. Blessings....

so this confuses me a bit because it sounds like this last statement has nothing to do with anything and is not pertinent to Matt 10:33 at all.... i am new to this so maybe it's just me...don't mean to step on any toes.

Cheers

Jake

:cloud9: Actually, it is the key to Matt 10:33 and reFORMer's post explained in essence why. Most people think that nearly everything in there is a one time (always either past or future = the two thieves on the cross) event. But with a digging into the words of the Word, a different picture emerges, a DAILY (NOW is the day of your salvation) interaction of the Spirit with man.

We are all a work in progress, an earthen riverbank for the rivers of living water, ie. water that is Spirit and always moving, not stagnate. Because of that, and the fact His Spirit in us is what's moving in us, the way He comes or appears to us, is He has come, He is come, and He is coming. That word used there is an active verb, ie. denoting movement or action, not a passive noun.

So if you understand that, and understand that heaven is state of being, not a geographical place, which Jesus basically said to Nicodemus, I'm standing here talking to you, but I'm in heaven and Paul said let our conversation be from heaven (you can't speak out of a place you've never been before), then you can see that what we read at one time and considered a finite moment in time, was actually a continuing of the Spirit to do a work in the midst of us.

So as I explained in my first post, denying Him is not a one time finite event in time, but a progressive work of the Spirit in teaching us to choose the good and not the evil. Today I may walk in what I've been shown lately (not denying Him), but tomorrow thru the weakness of the flesh, I may give in and not walk in it (denying Him).

Amen to the bolded, Cardinal.  :thumbsup:

[Molly]

Malachi 3:3
"He will sit as a smelter and purifier of silver, and He will purify the sons of Levi and refine them like gold and silver, so that they may present to the LORD offerings in righteousness.

[Molly]

So if you understand that, and understand that heaven is state of being, not a geographical place, which Jesus basically said to Nicodemus, I'm standing here talking to you, but I'm in heaven and Paul said let our conversation be from heaven (you can't speak out of a place you've never been before), then you can see that what we read at one time and considered a finite moment in time, was actually a continuing of the Spirit to do a work in the midst of us.

12If I have told you earthly things, and ye believe not, how shall ye believe, if I tell you of heavenly things?

13And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven.


--John 3


So his head is in heaven but his feet are on earth--what, then, is his footstool?

[Cardinal]

So all that means is, until our witness of Him in Spirit/heaven and in Truth/earth lines up, He will do no miracles in our "city", because of our unbelief (no witness). Without faith, it is impossible to please God. It takes 2 to witness. Blessings....

What do you mean by this? What type of miracles are you talking about? Are you talking miracles like healing sickness, etc? IF so, are you saying those who are not healed don't have enough faith?  and is your "city" what? Do you mean who you are? And why do you say "truth/earth" What does that mean?
thanks.

:cloud9: The blind shall see, the deaf shall hear, the lame shall walk, the dead are raised, the gospel is preached to the poor. All these things happened literally, but they also happen spiritually. We are becoming in nature as the God we worship. This is why it says.......

John 4:24 KJV
God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.

We tend to think of truth as an abstract concept, as in the absence of a lie, but whatever manifests from His Spirit IS truth, or natural. God, who cannot lie, SPOKE the world/natural into being. This is why the natural bears witness to His Spirit, because indeed it came from Him, and how can He be (in truth or natural manifestation) any less than what He is, in Spirit? Answer; He can't.

Our God is not blind, deaf, dumb, lame, or dead. He sees, He hears, He speaks, He walks, He lives. All of the miracles in done in this realm were necessitated by conditions of the heart/spirit, that were manifested openly in the natural.

This is why He wrote on the ground, when the men were going to stone the woman in adultery. She was the outward manifestation (adultery in the flesh), to the inward spiritual problem, that of Israel's adultery towards God.

This is why when the spiritual problem was dealt with as in........."spirits are subject unto you" = cast out.......they had a nature/name change that manifested in the natural realm.

19  Behold , I give unto you power to tread on serpents and scorpions, and over all the power of the enemy: and nothing shall by any means hurt you.  20 Notwithstanding in this rejoice not, that the spirits are subject unto you; but rather rejoice , because your names are written in heaven.

So whatever He speaks to us as His breath/Spirit, the same has the power to change our natures to line up as the truth of His Spirit. Those of whom it was said, are ever learning but never coming to the knowledge (to know means to be one with, as Adam knew his wife) of the TRUTH, are those that "deny" Him continually, refusing to allow the Spirit of God to conform them into His image, which is TRUTH.

Eve, our stony heart, continues (if we allow "her" to), to be a hearer of the Word, but not a doer, which is why faith (hearer), without works (doer), is, or brings forth, death. She heard the Word but did not walk in it, and so instead of manifesting His truth, she became a lie = corrupted Word.

This is more than just a doctrine of "good works", this is the means by which we LIVE or have HIS LIFE, because corrupted Word is another image, and He will not give His glory to another image. This is why it says.......

Matthew 4:4 KJV
But he answered and said , It is written , Man shall not live by bread (letter) alone, but by every word (His breath) that proceedeth out of the mouth of God.

Blessings.....

[sparrow]

So all that means is, until our witness of Him in Spirit/heaven and in Truth/earth lines up, He will do no miracles in our "city", because of our unbelief (no witness). Without faith, it is impossible to please God. It takes 2 to witness. Blessings....

What do you mean by this? What type of miracles are you talking about? Are you talking miracles like healing sickness, etc? IF so, are you saying those who are not healed don't have enough faith?  and is your "city" what? Do you mean who you are? And why do you say "truth/earth" What does that mean?
thanks.

:cloud9: The blind shall see, the deaf shall hear, the lame shall walk, the dead are raised, the gospel is preached to the poor. All these things happened literally, but they also happen spiritually. We are becoming in nature as the God we worship. This is why it says.......

John 4:24 KJV
God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.

We tend to think of truth as an abstract concept, as in the absence of a lie, but whatever manifests from His Spirit IS truth, or natural. God, who cannot lie, SPOKE the world/natural into being. This is why the natural bears witness to His Spirit, because indeed it came from Him, and how can He be (in truth or natural manifestation) any less than what He is, in Spirit? Answer; He can't.

Our God is not blind, deaf, dumb, lame, or dead. He sees, He hears, He speaks, He walks, He lives. All of the miracles in done in this realm were necessitated by conditions of the heart/spirit, that were manifested openly in the natural.

This is why He wrote on the ground, when the men were going to stone the woman in adultery. She was the outward manifestation (adultery in the flesh), to the inward spiritual problem, that of Israel's adultery towards God.

This is why when the spiritual problem was dealt with as in........."spirits are subject unto you" = cast out.......they had a nature/name change that manifested in the natural realm.

19  Behold , I give unto you power to tread on serpents and scorpions, and over all the power of the enemy: and nothing shall by any means hurt you.  20 Notwithstanding in this rejoice not, that the spirits are subject unto you; but rather rejoice , because your names are written in heaven.

So whatever He speaks to us as His breath/Spirit, the same has the power to change our natures to line up as the truth of His Spirit. Those of whom it was said, are ever learning but never coming to the knowledge (to know means to be one with, as Adam knew his wife) of the TRUTH, are those that "deny" Him continually, refusing to allow the Spirit of God to conform them into His image, which is TRUTH.

Eve, our stony heart, continues (if we allow "her" to), to be a hearer of the Word, but not a doer, which is why faith (hearer), without works (doer), is, or brings forth, death. She heard the Word but did not walk in it, and so instead of manifesting His truth, she became a lie = corrupted Word.

This is more than just a doctrine of "good works", this is the means by which we LIVE or have HIS LIFE, because corrupted Word is another image, and He will not give His glory to another image. This is why it says.......

Matthew 4:4 KJV
But he answered and said , It is written , Man shall not live by bread (letter) alone, but by every word (His breath) that proceedeth out of the mouth of God.

Blessings.....

so... What do you mean by this? What type of miracles are you talking about? Are you talking miracles like healing sickness, etc? IF so, are you saying those who are not healed don't have enough faith?  and is your "city" what? Do you mean who you are? And why do you say "truth/earth" What does that mean?  :laughing7:

Hey Cardinal.. I'll go back to what you just wrote. But you can just answer these questions in simple terms first?

[Cardinal]

So if you understand that, and understand that heaven is state of being, not a geographical place, which Jesus basically said to Nicodemus, I'm standing here talking to you, but I'm in heaven and Paul said let our conversation be from heaven (you can't speak out of a place you've never been before), then you can see that what we read at one time and considered a finite moment in time, was actually a continuing of the Spirit to do a work in the midst of us.

12If I have told you earthly things, and ye believe not, how shall ye believe, if I tell you of heavenly things?

13And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven.


--John 3


So his head is in heaven but his feet are on earth--what, then, is his footstool?

:cloud9: Thanks Molly.......Amen, it says He was IN HEAVEN, not that He had to die to "GO" there. His footstool is His enemies in the earth. Spiritually speaking, they are what enabled Him to walk on the water. Blessings....

[Zeek]

So all that means is, until our witness of Him in Spirit/heaven and in Truth/earth lines up, He will do no miracles in our "city", because of our unbelief (no witness). Without faith, it is impossible to please God. It takes 2 to witness. Blessings....

What do you mean by this? What type of miracles are you talking about? Are you talking miracles like healing sickness, etc? IF so, are you saying those who are not healed don't have enough faith?  and is your "city" what? Do you mean who you are? And why do you say "truth/earth" What does that mean?
thanks.

:cloud9: The blind shall see, the deaf shall hear, the lame shall walk, the dead are raised, the gospel is preached to the poor. All these things happened literally, but they also happen spiritually. We are becoming in nature as the God we worship. This is why it says.......

John 4:24 KJV
God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.

We tend to think of truth as an abstract concept, as in the absence of a lie, but whatever manifests from His Spirit IS truth, or natural. God, who cannot lie, SPOKE the world/natural into being. This is why the natural bears witness to His Spirit, because indeed it came from Him, and how can He be (in truth or natural manifestation) any less than what He is, in Spirit? Answer; He can't.

Our God is not blind, deaf, dumb, lame, or dead. He sees, He hears, He speaks, He walks, He lives. All of the miracles in done in this realm were necessitated by conditions of the heart/spirit, that were manifested openly in the natural.

This is why He wrote on the ground, when the men were going to stone the woman in adultery. She was the outward manifestation (adultery in the flesh), to the inward spiritual problem, that of Israel's adultery towards God.

This is why when the spiritual problem was dealt with as in........."spirits are subject unto you" = cast out.......they had a nature/name change that manifested in the natural realm.

19  Behold , I give unto you power to tread on serpents and scorpions, and over all the power of the enemy: and nothing shall by any means hurt you.  20 Notwithstanding in this rejoice not, that the spirits are subject unto you; but rather rejoice , because your names are written in heaven.

So whatever He speaks to us as His breath/Spirit, the same has the power to change our natures to line up as the truth of His Spirit. Those of whom it was said, are ever learning but never coming to the knowledge (to know means to be one with, as Adam knew his wife) of the TRUTH, are those that "deny" Him continually, refusing to allow the Spirit of God to conform them into His image, which is TRUTH.

Eve, our stony heart, continues (if we allow "her" to), to be a hearer of the Word, but not a doer, which is why faith (hearer), without works (doer), is, or brings forth, death. She heard the Word but did not walk in it, and so instead of manifesting His truth, she became a lie = corrupted Word.

This is more than just a doctrine of "good works", this is the means by which we LIVE or have HIS LIFE, because corrupted Word is another image, and He will not give His glory to another image. This is why it says.......

Matthew 4:4 KJV
But he answered and said , It is written , Man shall not live by bread (letter) alone, but by every word (His breath) that proceedeth out of the mouth of God.

Blessings.....

Act 17:28  For in him we live, and move, and have our being; as certain also of your own poets have said, For we are also his offspring.

for in SPIRIT, (I AM)  we live, move, and have our being (manifest in the "natural", (that I AM). 

I AM (Spirit) that I AM (manifest).

In the beginning was the word,   

Isa 55:11  So shall my word be that goeth forth out of my mouth: it shall not return unto me void, but it shall accomplish that which I please, and it shall prosper in the thing whereto I sent it.

[Zeek]

Joh 10:30  I and my Father are one.

Joh 14:28  ......for my Father is greater than I.


Jesus, the expression/manifestation of the father are one (I am that I am), but is only manifest from the one greater (father/Spirit).

Joh 10:25  Jesus answered them, I told you, and ye believed not: the works that I do in my Father's name, they bear witness of me.

[Molly]

Joh 10:30  I and my Father are one.

Joh 14:28  ......for my Father is greater than I.


Jesus, the expression/manifestation of the father are one (I am that I am), but is only manifest from the one greater (father/Spirit).

Joh 10:25  Jesus answered them, I told you, and ye believed not: the works that I do in my Father's name, they bear witness of me.

The works bear witness to Jesus that he is completely aligned with the Father [as the Son] because the works are the works of the Father done through him.

"This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased."

--Mat 3:17

[rosered]

Believe you  not that I am in the Father, and the Father in me?


the words that I speak unto you I speak not of myself: but the Father that dwells in me, he does the works. 


Jhn 14:11   Believe me that I [am] in the Father, and the Father in me: or else believe me for the very works' sake. 


Jhn 14:12 ¶ Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believes on me, the works that I do shall he do also; and greater [works] than these shall he do; because I go unto my Father. 


Jhn 14:13   And whatsoever ye shall ask in my name, that will I do, that the Father may be glorified in the Son. 


Jhn 14:14   If you shall ask any thing in my name, I will do [it]. 


Jhn 14:15 ¶ If you love me, keep my commandments. 


  anyone  glorifying God  in what good  WORK is done is a witness and declaring the same Glory as Jesus Christ ... :icon_flower:

   :HeartThrob:

[Cardinal]

 :cloud9: Amen guys  :thumbsup:

[Thoughtmocker]

Cardinal,
Thank you for your clarification....that help me very much but... i must ask this question... How do i relate this scripture to my friend who has asked me to explain universalism in light of this scripture in pure easy to understand terms.

The previous posts are helpful but if i was to read that scripture in context it would still read as Jesus is dis-owning those who disown him which seems to mean that i am being sent out of the presence of God.

I am having a hard time explaining this scripture to myself if i have to leave it's contexts and move into explanations involving spirit, flesh and rivers of life etc...
What did Jesus mean when he said this and if he meant what he said does it not imply a finality to his statement which in turn flies in the face of universalism?

I think what i am hearing is that i can deny jesus all i want in this life or the next but eventually i will acknowledge him before all men and jesus will then acknowledge me before God? if that is the case then i have more troubles then i expected i would with that answer based on other scriptures.

[Zeek]

I think verses like these are tough to understand if we look at them as "post mortem" scriptures.

This article gives a different perspective. 

http://pantelism.com/ResurrectionofCondemnation.htm

[Pierac]

Mat 10:33 "But whoever denies Me before men, I will also deny him before My Father who is in heaven.

Indeed, otherwise the whole human race would reign with him for a thousand years!

Rev 20:4  Then I saw thrones, and they sat on them, and judgment was given to them. And I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded because of their testimony of Jesus and because of the word of God, and those who had not worshiped the beast or his image, and had not received the mark on their forehead and on their hand; and they came to life and reigned with Christ for a thousand years.

Rev 20:5  The rest of the dead did not come to life until the thousand years were completed. This is the first resurrection.

Rev 20:6  Blessed and holy is the one who has a part in the first resurrection; over these the second death has no power, but they will be priests of God and of Christ and will reign with Him for a thousand years.

Yet, we know... Php 2:10  so that at the name of Jesus EVERY KNEE WILL BOW, of those who are in heaven and on earth and under the earth

:thumbsup:
Paul

[rosered]

Mat 10:33 "But whoever denies Me before men, I will also deny him before My Father who is in heaven.

Indeed, otherwise the whole human race would reign with him for a thousand years!

Rev 20:4  Then I saw thrones, and they sat on them, and judgment was given to them. And I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded because of their testimony of Jesus and because of the word of God, and those who had not worshiped the beast or his image, and had not received the mark on their forehead and on their hand; and they came to life and reigned with Christ for a thousand years.

Rev 20:5  The rest of the dead did not come to life until the thousand years were completed. This is the first resurrection.

Rev 20:6  Blessed and holy is the one who has a part in the first resurrection; over these the second death has no power, but they will be priests of God and of Christ and will reign with Him for a thousand years.

Yet, we know... Php 2:10  so that at the name of Jesus EVERY KNEE WILL BOW, of those who are in heaven and on earth and under the earth

:thumbsup:
Paul

Amen  Paul !
     no longer a prisioner of death ,  no harm to Those in Christ  Body  :HeartThrob: already        the Heavens and earth and below cannot contain HIM If ye abide in me, and my words abide in you, ye shall ask what ye will, and it shall be done unto you. 


Jhn 15:8   Herein is my Father glorified, that you   bear much fruit; so shall you be my disciples. 


Jhn 15:9 ¶ As the Father has  loved me, so have I loved you: continue  in my love. 


Jhn 15:10   If ye keep my commandments, you  shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love. 


Jhn 15:11  These things have I spoken unto you, that my joy might remain in you, and [that] your joy might be full.  


Jhn 15:12   This is my commandment, That ye love one another, as I have loved you. 


Jhn 15:13   Greater love has  no man than this, that a man lay down his life for his friends. 

[peacemaker]

I would suggest that this is based on judgment, calling attention to a specific point: Objecting to or against something is to deny an allegation, declaring that the contrary is true; challenging it as false (that of another's statement, or their motives). In truth, there is nothing concealed that will not be revealed, or hidden (motives) that will not be made known. After all, a man's enemies are those of his own household?

"He disavows that which has been attributed to him; disclaiming any association."

Makes one wonder about all the so called, professing teachers?  However, if we endure (to hold out against), we will reign with Him; but if we deny Him, He also will deny us, as in withholding something?

Consider: "whosoever gives to (not receiving from) one of these little ones, even a cold cup of water to drink, he shall not lose his reward."

Judgment begins within the temple; the house of God.

Not everyone who says; 'Lord, Lord,' will enter the kingdom of heaven (having the power of truth), but he who does the will of my Father who is in heaven will enter. Many will say to me on that day, 'Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, cast out demons, and perform many miracles?'  And then I will declare to them, 'I never knew you; depart from me, you who practice lawlessness.'

Those who misunderstood the Scriptures will be overthrown from a deposition of mental and emotional control, as the old is passing away; the journey from death to life. Many are near sighted, seeing only that which serves their own selfish concerns, and/or the elements of fear (survival), denying the Lord of Glory; "Cock-a-doodle-do."

But when the wind (Spirit) blows over the people who have planted themselves on their pulpits of carnal lust, greed and power it is the end of them, there is no going back to their unfortified position of falsehood.

A red sky in morning, take warning; for the rising of the sun (dawn) is shining and on a cloud of witnesses He will come (in every age).

You are beautiful beyond description, too marvelous for words, too wonderful for comprehension, like nothing ever seen or heard. Who can grasp your infinite wisdom? Who can fathom the depths of your love?

I stand in awe of you, and in the resurrection from dead works.

[willieH]

willieH: Hi TM, :welcome: to TM --  :laughing7:

Hi Everybody,

i am new to all this but i had a friend who quoted this scripture and it stumped me.

33But whoever disowns me before men, I will disown him before my Father in heaven.

Deos anyone have any thoughts on how they would respond to that?

Cheers

jake

Scripture answers this question...

(1) SALVATION is the work of GOD -- ALONE = Eph 2:8-9
(2) No man CAN come to CHRIST, except GOD draw him = John 6:44 & 65
(3) No man CAN come to YHVH, except through CHRIST = John 14:6
(4) Confession of the NAME of CHRIST is necessary to be saved = Rom 10:13
(5) No man CAN confess the NAME of JESUS as Lord  except by the Holy Spirit = 1 Cor 12:3

In other words... we are NOT saved by ANYTHING that -- WE -- do --  :mnah:

It is ALL done -- ALL done by GOD... and --

GOD is NO RESPECTER of PERSONS [perfectly impartial to ALL] --

Acts 10:34 --
2 Sam 14:14 --
Job 34:19 --
Eph 6:9 --
Rom 2:11 --
Mark 12:14 --
Gal 2:6 --
Prov 28:21 --
Col 3:25 --
2 Chron 19:7

And here they COME!  --->

 :bowing: JESUS.... & the gang! ................ :boogie:  :bgdance:  :Egyptdance2: :banana: :egyptdance: :boydance: :friendstu:  :icon_king:  :dsunny: :reachout: :hiya: :rocker :love4: :cheerleader: :happytired: :curtsey: :girlangel: :gpg:  :cloud9: :happygrin: :happy3: :thumbsup: :girlheart: :king: :ginlove:  :boyheart: ...................... and even these guys ........  :drunken_smilie:  :beerburp: :beach: :Shoot: :tongue: :icon_farao: :tease: :punish: :duck: :Gtantrum: :hammerhead: :btantrum: :blahgreen: :eyebrow: :angry1: :Party:


...willieH (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v122/somebody614/grouphug2.gif)

[Raggedy Anne]

Hey,

  Personally ,I can't read that scripture without taking into account this....

   as you have done unto the least of these my brothers,soyou have done unto me.

   these both are in regard to the throne judgement...

   

  He died for the sins of all...deny one of the least..deny Christ.

  give a cold cup of water of eternal life to the least..as good as giving it to Christ.

  Deny the free gift of eternal life to one of the least,same as doing it to Him

now, there are those who gave Him vinegar and gall...they condemned an innocent man..called Him accursed of God

so, when you do that to any man,the least of these my brethern, you do it to Him...you do that when you tell them
they are guilty before God ;when God has sent His son to redeem them back and is not counting their sin against them

  you crucify a man for the sin in his flesh, you crucify Christ


for He died for the sins of all men

Amen, Sheila.    We deny Christ by not showing grace to others.   It's so much more than a lip service thing.

Anne