Wicked little ET'ers.

[jesushandsarekindhands]

Everytime i see a man or woman preach love on the internet, or universalism, what do i see underneath their life-giving text from the ET'ers?

"IDIOT"
"ANTICHRIST"
"MAY GOD TURN UP THE FLAMES FOR YOU IN THE DARKEST SWEATIEST PITS OF HELL!"
"BLASPHEMER"
"YOUR POSSESSED BY SATAN"
"YOU ARE A DEVIL"

Etc etc....Basically the same things people said about Jesus.

It really shows me what is going on in their hearts when i see those comments and consantly reaffirms that Im on the right track by being a universalist.

So thank you ET'ers, your HATE made me run from you and to God. 

[natcat86]

Amen Brother,

I was in Boarders today and started to read the first page of Letter to a Christian Nation by Sam Harris and it just affirmed to me the damage caused by the false doctrine of ET. If God is real and all around us, everything was made by, for and through Him then people should be able to find sense in it. Atheists find sense in the idea of a God who is love (love is patient) but runs out of patience after our short lives and then subjects us eternal torment because His love fails to overcome our evillness (love never fails).

No wonder intelligent people like Sam Harris, Chris Hitchins, Richard Dawkins find the ETers idea of God so illogical and fabricated, it is!

For me the people who spout the hateful stuff you have highlighted have the same mentality of those who say God planted dinosaur bones as a test of our faith. If you are vocal in your belief that there were no dinosaurs even in the face of the evidence there were you must have real faith, you havent denied Christ and so He will not deny you. If you can say God will allow sin and suffereing to continue to those who He loved so much He sent His own Son to save, God's will is not as strong as ours, even in the face of the evidence (the bible!!!! ) you must have loads of faith!!!

In my church when you question people about hell they quote, "Wont the Judge of all judge justly" and I say, yeah exactly, even men hardly give a life sentence that actually means life, the death pentily is judged inhumane by most developed nations, but God will torture forever his own creation????, then they just kind cop out with phrases like, well he gives us all a chance, its not God who sends us to hell, people send themselves through rejecting Him. So I say, what about the fact that one day "Every knee will bow and every tongue confess that Jesus Christ is Lord to the Glory of God, after that when EVERYONE has done exactly what you did the night you became a christian, who will be left to reject Him..... then we're back to "Well at the end of the day its all up to God (make my excuses and leave)" .... :BangHead:

The saddest thing is the ones who are the most hateful are the ones who think they are the most in favour with God but really they are the ones who need Him the most!

:sigh:

[jesushandsarekindhands]

Natcat i fully agree, especially when you say that the most hateful ones think they are the most favoured of God, yet in reality; need him the most.

I have seen so many Christians walk around with that self-righteous smugness...They may as well say to everyone what they are thinking because i can see it in their eyes....

"Im going to heaven and your going to hell haha!" 
I bet they think that if someone is nasty to them one day they sit their thinking -
"Well i wont share the gospel with him/her, i WANT them to goto hell, teach them for messing with me, a great pillar of the Christian community that i am!"

I have seen this boastfulness quite a lot in the 'Christian' world, and it truly is sickening, especially when in reality, the whores and scum of the Earth are entering the Kingdom of God before them (The last will be first), and these self-righteous ones are in for 'a good dose of wrath'...Its them that will be GLAD that God's wrath (their idea of hell) is NOT eternal!  It's them that will be thankful in that day! 

These same people say "I will pray for you", if you tell them they are wrong...They are so decieved by the deceiver they don't even know they are deceived, they stink of self-righteousness and even hate (although they don't even realize it).

Thank God Jesus is nothing like them, indeed if Jesus walked into their church tommorow, they wouldnt know who he was -  they would probably have him thrown out.

Nevertheless, i will continue to love them to the best of my human ability, but quite frankly, like Jesus, i'd rather sit with whores, junkies and sinners (or at least people who know they are sinners), than spend my time in the company of someone so self-righteous that it makes me feel physically sick.

[sven]

at city-data some ET'ers make jokes about hell, one can get angry with them, but I don't hate them, I've begun to see them as kind of immature bullies, like children who abuse animals, wo torment little kitties or puppies just for fun, you don't hate children for something like that but it's cruel and inacceptable and you can get very angry about it.

Of course not all ET'ers make fun about it, I think some earnestly wish it would not be true, but such people I do not accuse.

[CHB]

Hi,

I try to see the ET'r like this.   They only know what God has given them to know. We were all,...or most of us were...where they are now at one time. Just thank God he has shown us a better way and pray for them that God will show them what he has shown us. Maybe God will use us to show them the truth, maybe not, but just pray for them. Paul said we have nothing to boast about because what we have we didn't get it on our own. Paul said "what do we have that wasn't given to us".  Didn't Jesus say that when we are persecuted that the persecutors will think that they do God service. Some of these people honestly think that we are influenced by Satan.

CHB

[sparrow]

Hi,

I try to see the ET'r like this.   They only know what God has given them to know. We were all,...or most of us were...where they are now at one time. Just thank God he has shown us a better way and pray for them that God will show them what he has shown us. Maybe God will use us to show them the truth, maybe not, but just pray for them. Paul said we have nothing to boast about because what we have we didn't get it on our own. Paul said "what do we have that wasn't given to us".  Didn't Jesus say that when we are persecuted that the persecutors will think that they do God service. Some of these people honestly think that we are influenced by Satan.

CHB

Amen.

[natcat86]

Hi,

I try to see the ET'r like this.   They only know what God has given them to know. We were all,...or most of us were...where they are now at one time. Just thank God he has shown us a better way and pray for them that God will show them what he has shown us. Maybe God will use us to show them the truth, maybe not, but just pray for them. Paul said we have nothing to boast about because what we have we didn't get it on our own. Paul said "what do we have that wasn't given to us".  Didn't Jesus say that when we are persecuted that the persecutors will think that they do God service. Some of these people honestly think that we are influenced by Satan.

CHB

You're right CBH, after thought my initial reaction when thinking about ETers is anger when it should be love.  :mblush: I pray God will give me more humility, grace and patience. But in my experience He does it by making us spend time with those who challenge us. Thanks for posting that CHB, its made me think.

Nat

[Gab]

Hi,

I try to see the ET'r like this.   They only know what God has given them to know. We were all,...or most of us were...where they are now at one time. Just thank God he has shown us a better way and pray for them that God will show them what he has shown us. Maybe God will use us to show them the truth, maybe not, but just pray for them. Paul said we have nothing to boast about because what we have we didn't get it on our own. Paul said "what do we have that wasn't given to us".  Didn't Jesus say that when we are persecuted that the persecutors will think that they do God service. Some of these people honestly think that we are influenced by Satan.

CHB

As I've said in the past, I think that it's of paramount importance to understand those with whom you interact, and I think that this is no different.  Consider for a moment the situation where the doctrine of eternal torment was actually true, and then think about the implications of that.  If you saw people telling others that they will not be lost forever if they aren't saved at death - which, I can assure you, will cause at least some people who believed purely out of fear to turn away from their faith if we convince them of our reading of the Bible - and you truly believed that anyone brought to a belief in that doctrine will suffer eternal hellfire, then would not the loving thing to do to be to oppose those doctrines?  And would it not seem terribly Satanic for people to willfully lead people away from that salvation that only comes through the belief that one must be saved by Christ before death?  Under this light, the claims that we, who (to them) are trying to lead everyone away from salvation, are under the influence of Satan, do not seem very strange at all.

I do not believe we do anyone any service - not ourselves, nor others - when we point the finger and call other people wicked.  God knows who is truly wicked and who is not.  We don't.  Our job is simply to spread the love of God to all, regardless of what we may think of their ways or their views.  We are the sowers of the seed, not the tenders to the soil.

[jesushandsarekindhands]

Hi,

I try to see the ET'r like this.   They only know what God has given them to know. We were all,...or most of us were...where they are now at one time. Just thank God he has shown us a better way and pray for them that God will show them what he has shown us. Maybe God will use us to show them the truth, maybe not, but just pray for them. Paul said we have nothing to boast about because what we have we didn't get it on our own. Paul said "what do we have that wasn't given to us".  Didn't Jesus say that when we are persecuted that the persecutors will think that they do God service. Some of these people honestly think that we are influenced by Satan.

CHB

As I've said in the past, I think that it's of paramount importance to understand those with whom you interact, and I think that this is no different.  Consider for a moment the situation where the doctrine of eternal torment was actually true, and then think about the implications of that.  If you saw people telling others that they will not be lost forever if they aren't saved at death - which, I can assure you, will cause at least some people who believed purely out of fear to turn away from their faith if we convince them of our reading of the Bible - and you truly believed that anyone brought to a belief in that doctrine will suffer eternal hellfire, then would not the loving thing to do to be to oppose those doctrines?  And would it not seem terribly Satanic for people to willfully lead people away from that salvation that only comes through the belief that one must be saved by Christ before death?  Under this light, the claims that we, who (to them) are trying to lead everyone away from salvation, are under the influence of Satan, do not seem very strange at all.

I do not believe we do anyone any service - not ourselves, nor others - when we point the finger and call other people wicked.  God knows who is truly wicked and who is not.  We don't.  Our job is simply to spread the love of God to all, regardless of what we may think of their ways or their views.  We are the sowers of the seed, not the tenders to the soil.

Hi Gab, i understand what you are saying but you have misunderstood me a little.

It's not wicked that ET'ers believe what they believe, (or maybe it is wicked to believe that God burns people forever?  Thats another subject), what is certainly wicked is when they point fingers at others, calling them 'satanic' and 'devils' and 'idiots' when they dont even know the person they are talking too and have not researched things enough to make a judgement about what they are talking about.

The same things happened in Jesus's day when they accused him of sorcery etc.  Jesus wasn't too happy about it either.

So it may look like im pointing fingers at the ET'ers belief, but I'm not.
What im pointing fingers at is the ET'ers (or indeed anyone) who calls someone an 'idiot', or demon, having little knowledge of the person he/she is accusing or about the subject of discussion.
Doing such things is not making a 'proper' judgement, and by their fruits (when they call people idiots they don't even know), shall we know them.  The spirit is peace, love, harmony etc etc.

[Gab]

Hi Gab, i understand what you are saying but you have misunderstood me a little.

It's not wicked that ET'ers believe what they believe, (or maybe it is wicked to believe that God burns people forever?  Thats another subject), what is certainly wicked is when they point fingers at others, calling them 'satanic' and 'devils' and 'idiots' when they dont even know the person they are talking too and have not researched things enough to make a judgement about what they are talking about.

The same things happened in Jesus's day when they accused him of sorcery etc.  Jesus wasn't too happy about it either.

So it may look like im pointing fingers at the ET'ers belief, but I'm not.
What im pointing fingers at is the ET'ers (or indeed anyone) who calls someone an 'idiot', or demon, having little knowledge of the person he/she is accusing or about the subject of discussion.
Doing such things is not making a 'proper' judgement, and by their fruits (when they call people idiots they don't even know), shall we know them.  The spirit is peace, love, harmony etc etc.

But that's what I'm saying.  To them, we are leading everyone we can away from Jesus and towards eternal damnation.  If that really was what we were doing, would that not be positively Satanic?  And would they not be absolutely right to oppose us with every fiber of their being?

We look at what we know and find their claims to be rather silly.  But if one instead understands the way they view it, I contend that their accusations make perfect sense, really.  This understanding may not allow us to change their views, but it certainly will help us love them as we ought to when we recognize that they are not evil or wicked - they are merely misguided souls who know not what they do, who will meet with the same portion of God's love in the end as anyone else.

[sparrow]

This understanding may not allow us to change their views, but it certainly will help us love them as we ought to when we recognize that they are not evil or wicked - they are merely misguided souls who know not what they do, who will meet with the same portion of God's love in the end as anyone else.

Yes. I totally agree with this.

[jesushandsarekindhands]

Hi Gab, i understand what you are saying but you have misunderstood me a little.

It's not wicked that ET'ers believe what they believe, (or maybe it is wicked to believe that God burns people forever?  Thats another subject), what is certainly wicked is when they point fingers at others, calling them 'satanic' and 'devils' and 'idiots' when they dont even know the person they are talking too and have not researched things enough to make a judgement about what they are talking about.

The same things happened in Jesus's day when they accused him of sorcery etc.  Jesus wasn't too happy about it either.

So it may look like im pointing fingers at the ET'ers belief, but I'm not.
What im pointing fingers at is the ET'ers (or indeed anyone) who calls someone an 'idiot', or demon, having little knowledge of the person he/she is accusing or about the subject of discussion.
Doing such things is not making a 'proper' judgement, and by their fruits (when they call people idiots they don't even know), shall we know them.  The spirit is peace, love, harmony etc etc.

But that's what I'm saying.  To them, we are leading everyone we can away from Jesus and towards eternal damnation.  If that really was what we were doing, would that not be positively Satanic?  And would they not be absolutely right to oppose us with every fiber of their being?

We look at what we know and find their claims to be rather silly.  But if one instead understands the way they view it, I contend that their accusations make perfect sense, really.  This understanding may not allow us to change their views, but it certainly will help us love them as we ought to when we recognize that they are not evil or wicked - they are merely misguided souls who know not what they do, who will meet with the same portion of God's love in the end as anyone else.

Well Gab i disagree again.

Universalists do lead people to Christ.

They still maintain that Jesus came in the flesh, that he is the son of God and to believe in him is eternal life.

They are not telling people -
'Dont worry everything will be fine in the end', they are saying that if they believe upon Jesus they will NOT come into God's judgment, and they preach what is biblical, much more so than the ET'ers who have a wrong perception of God, love, judgment, eternity and hell because they refuse to accept the original languages the Scriptures were penned in, but instead they rely upon man's innacurate translations.

Once again, i NEVER claimed that an ETers beliefs were evil, I have no idea why people keep twisting my words, what i said was that ANYONE who calls someone a devil or an idiot with lack of knowledge on the person or the subject, is wicked, be they an Eter, Universalist, Buddha, Muslim or anything else.

We know that when someone calls someone names without having any knowledge about that person or the subject then they are not of the spirit, which again, is love, peace etc.  So by these peoples fruits we know they are not from God anyway, for if they loved they would not brand someone they did not even know as an 'idiot' in a horrible mocking way on utube or anywhere else.