Quick little topic for specific input

[jabcat]

Hi guys.  I read this recently and a couple of things got my attention as related to UR.  Would anyone have any specific insights/input into this?

17and if Christ has not been raised, your faith is worthless; you are still in your sins.
18Then those also who have fallen asleep in Christ have perished.

I had originally asked; "What do you think 'perished' is addressing here?  Dead to not live again?  Punishment of whatever sort, until....?  And Jesus fixed it?  But what do you think 'it' is, here?"      I looked, and it is from apollumi, which is translated as "lost, lost to be found/restored, as in the lost coin or lost sheep of the house of Israel"....pretty much answers that...

Then,
19If we have hoped in Christ in this life only, we are of all men most to be pitied.
The Order of Resurrection
20But now Christ has been raised from the dead, the first fruits of those who are asleep.
21For since by a man came death, by a man also came the resurrection of the dead.
22For as in Adam all die, so also in Christ all will be made alive.
23But each in his own order: Christ the first fruits, after that those who are Christ's at His coming,
24then comes the end, when He hands over the kingdom to the God and Father, when He has abolished all rule and all authority and power.
25For He must reign until He has put all His enemies under His feet.
26The last enemy that will be abolished is death.
27For HE HAS PUT ALL THINGS IN SUBJECTION UNDER HIS FEET But when He says, "All things are put in subjection," it is evident that He is excepted who put all things in subjection to Him.
28When all things are subjected to Him, then the Son Himself also will be subjected to the One who subjected all things to Him, so that God may be all in all.

This is one of my favorite UR verses.  It hit me today though, where does it specifically show the step of "the rest of humanity" in these verses?  There's verse 22 that does say "all", which I understand is the greek word that literally does mean ALL, and not some or a piece of the all.  So we have this;
23A Christ,
23B those who are Christ's (at His coming)
24 then the end, when He hands over the kingdom
25 all enemies under His feet
26 death abolished
27 again, the ALL word...all things unto subjection
28 God is All in All

Besides the use of the word 'all', doesn't it seem like there's a specific step "that's not obviously there", i.e., where the rest of humanity is saved?  Is it more implied than clearly stated?  And if so, maybe that's all part of God's plan of veiling and revealing.

[WhiteWings]

Besides the use of the word 'all', doesn't it seem like there's a specific step "that's not obviously there", i.e., where the rest of humanity is saved?  Is it more implied than clearly stated?  And if so, maybe that's all part of God's plan of veiling and revealing.

I think nothing in your OP proves or disproves that all are saved.
It speaks about order of things. Several groups that are not 100% of humanity. From that the only thing you can learn is that an unknow number of people that are in Christ will be saved.

IMO the all can mean 100% but just as well the people mentioned in the various group.
Elsewhere there are verses that are more direct and tell about the purpose Jesus birth. But that's to far of topic I think.

[jabcat]

Well, that's kind of what hit me.  This is a popular passage of scripture that's used when trying to share UR, several/many authors use it.  I've used it myself.  But if there's something there besides the 'all' (which some say is a totally inclusive word  (ov pantav) then it seems I'm not quite seeing it clearly right now. 

I agree, seems to me there's some other scriptures that are more direct than this...  Like this one I just copied from a J. Preston Eby article...I Tim. 2:1-6: "I exhort therefore, that, first of all, SUPPLICATIONS, PRAYERS, INTERCESSIONS, AND GIVING OF THANKS be made for A-L-L  M-E-N ... for this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour; Who WILL HAVE ALL MEN TO BE SAVED, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth."

[WhiteWings]

My attempt.....

Verses are edited for easier reading. Just pruned the tree of words a bit....

1
Making a certain part predestined for hell and other for Heaven isn't impartial.
The verses listed below show that God at least gives the same chance to 100% of His creation.


Psalm 145:9  The LORD is good to all: and his tender mercies are over all his works
Acts 10:34 Of a truth I perceive that God is no respecter of persons:
Romans 2:11  For there is no respect of persons with God.
Romans 10:12  or there is no difference between the Jew and the Greek: for the same Lord over all is rich unto all that call upon him.
Galatians 2:6  But of these who seemed to be somewhat, (whatsoever they were, it maketh no matter to me: God accepteth no man's person:)....
Ephesians 6:9  .... knowing that your Master  also is in heaven; neither is there respect of persons with him.
Colossians 3:25  But he that doeth wrong shall receive for the wrong which he hath done: and there is no respect of persons.
1 Timothy 2:3-4  For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour;  Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.
James 3:17  But the wisdom that is from above is first pure, .... without partiality, and without hypocrisy.
1 Peter 1:17  And if ye call on the Father, who without respect of persons judgeth according to every man's work, pass the time of your sojourning here in fear:


2
In this section a small selection of 'all verses'  I have.
This is a selection that tells us what Father actually would like to see as an end result. God wanting something on itself is a big pointer...

Colossians 1:19-20  or it pleased the Father .... to reconcile all things unto himself (=God); by him,
=> reconcile = bring back a former state of harmony => 95% of humanity in hell isn't a (former) state of harmony.

John 3:17 God sent his Son into the world, not to condemn the world, but to save the world.
=> 100% of humanity because only that is impartial.

A fair argument is that not everyone grabs the chances offered and signs hi/her own doom.
Maybe there are some verses that adress this.


3
This section shows that Father sends Son with a task of saving people

John 3:35  The Father loveth the Son, and hath given all things into his hand.
=> God gives full control to Jesus
John 17:2  As thou hast given him power over all flesh, that he should give eternal life to as many as thou hast given him.
Matthew 1:21  And she shall bring forth a son, and thou shalt call his name JESUS: for he shall save his people from their sins.
=> The task of Jesus is to give eternal life to all things (=mankind)
John 6:37  All that the Father giveth me shall come to me; and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out.
=> And Jesus accomplishes His task

Quite often is said that Jesus only saves those who are "His"
a] An elect group.
b] The group He saved from the temptation of satan.

I think all will agree Father has full ownership over 100% of creation.
To group a] I would like to say Father gives full ownership to Jesus. Not just a few percent.
To group b] I would like to say satan owns nothing. At best he aquired things by stealing them but Jesus still is the rightful owner.

So "His" is 100% of creation.


Summary.

Section #1
- Father repeats over and over again He has no elect and treats 100% of creation with the same standards.
- The same verses show that grace, love and forgiveness are large factors in that process of equality

Section #2
- This section shows the intentions of Father are good.
- His aim/desire is to save not to cast in hell.

Section #3
- Father sends Son to save all.
- Jesus says He fully completes His task.


Many more verses I can put in each section but I think this is quite good as a start.

[aspiring son]

My attempt.....

Verses are edited for easier reading. Just pruned the tree of words a bit....

1
Making a certain part predestined for hell and other for Heaven isn't impartial.
The verses listed below show that God at least gives the same chance to 100% of His creation.


Psalm 145:9  The LORD is good to all: and his tender mercies are over all his works
Acts 10:34 Of a truth I perceive that God is no respecter of persons:
Romans 2:11  For there is no respect of persons with God.
Romans 10:12  or there is no difference between the Jew and the Greek: for the same Lord over all is rich unto all that call upon him.
Galatians 2:6  But of these who seemed to be somewhat, (whatsoever they were, it maketh no matter to me: God accepteth no man's person:)....
Ephesians 6:9  .... knowing that your Master  also is in heaven; neither is there respect of persons with him.
Colossians 3:25  But he that doeth wrong shall receive for the wrong which he hath done: and there is no respect of persons.
1 Timothy 2:3-4  For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour;  Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.
James 3:17  But the wisdom that is from above is first pure, .... without partiality, and without hypocrisy.
1 Peter 1:17  And if ye call on the Father, who without respect of persons judgeth according to every man's work, pass the time of your sojourning here in fear:


2
In this section a small selection of 'all verses'  I have.
This is a selection that tells us what Father actually would like to see as an end result. God wanting something on itself is a big pointer...

Colossians 1:19-20  or it pleased the Father .... to reconcile all things unto himself (=God); by him,
=> reconcile = bring back a former state of harmony => 95% of humanity in hell isn't a (former) state of harmony.

John 3:17 God sent his Son into the world, not to condemn the world, but to save the world.
=> 100% of humanity because only that is impartial.

A fair argument is that not everyone grabs the chances offered and signs hi/her own doom.
Maybe there are some verses that adress this.


3
This section shows that Father sends Son with a task of saving people

John 3:35  The Father loveth the Son, and hath given all things into his hand.
=> God gives full control to Jesus
John 17:2  As thou hast given him power over all flesh, that he should give eternal life to as many as thou hast given him.
Matthew 1:21  And she shall bring forth a son, and thou shalt call his name JESUS: for he shall save his people from their sins.
=> The task of Jesus is to give eternal life to all things (=mankind)
John 6:37  All that the Father giveth me shall come to me; and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out.
=> And Jesus accomplishes His task

Quite often is said that Jesus only saves those who are "His"
a] An elect group.
b] The group He saved from the temptation of satan.

I think all will agree Father has full ownership over 100% of creation.
To group a] I would like to say Father gives full ownership to Jesus. Not just a few percent.
To group b] I would like to say satan owns nothing. At best he aquired things by stealing them but Jesus still is the rightful owner.

So "His" is 100% of creation.


Summary.

Section #1
- Father repeats over and over again He has no elect and treats 100% of creation with the same standards.
- The same verses show that grace, love and forgiveness are large factors in that process of equality

Section #2
- This section shows the intentions of Father are good.
- His aim/desire is to save not to cast in hell.

Section #3
- Father sends Son to save all.
- Jesus says He fully completes His task.


Many more verses I can put in each section but I think this is quite good as a start.

Good post WW.The problem with ET believers is that they say they agree that God has full control over everything, but in their arguments they say; just not our eternal destination!

Jab- I think in 1 Cor 15 that the rest of humanity is tied up with "the end". The last enemy is death. To me it signifies that that is Christ's greatest enemy, not unbelivers. Everything is subjected under him before death. Though it doesn't say" then the rest of humanity", it could signify the total purpose of Christ's mission. Unbelivers are Dead in their sins- Christ came to destroy, (abolish, do away with) DEATH. Hope this helps. I too have thought about these verses that way, this is what I've come up with after some thought on them.

Grace and Peace

Brandon

[WhiteWings]

Jab- I think in 1 Cor 15 that the rest of humanity is tied up with "the end". The last enemy is death. To me it signifies that that is Christ's greatest enemy, not unbelivers.

I read that differently. Wages of sin is death. Without sin death is powerless.


1 Corinthians 15:55   55 O death, where is thy sting? O grave, where is thy victory?
1 Corinthians 15:56   The sting of death is sin; and the strength of sin is the law.
Death=sting=victory of sin
Death = victorious sting of sin.

1 Corinthians 15:55   55 O death, where is thy sting? O grave, where is thy victory?
If there is no more victory for death it it can mean any of the following:
a] Death is no longer the wages of sin.
b] Sinning is not possible anymore.
c] Resurrecting people that died in sin.

Matthew 18:3  ...Except ye be converted, and become as little children, ye shall not enter into the kingdom of heaven.
This verse states that sinful nature won't enter Heaven.
That means no one will enter heaven and death has its victory.
So all combined I conclude that the stings will be removed and people enter Heaven.

Everything is subjected under him before death. Though it doesn't say" then the rest of humanity", it could signify the total purpose of Christ's mission. Unbelivers are Dead in their sins- Christ came to destroy, (abolish, do away with) DEATH. Hope this helps. I too have thought about these verses that way, this is what I've come up with after some thought on them.

That statement has the same weakness as my earlier post.
God wants something and sends Jesus on a mission to get it. But then the ET simply says Jesus doesn't fully complete the task.

[aspiring son]

To that WW I would bring up 1 tim 4-10 Jesus the saviour of all men especiallythose who believe. if it were only believers, why not say-"Jesus the saviour of all that believe?

[sheila]

  I think it's in the REVEALATIONS OF CHRIST[annoint]

Ch 7 is the sealing of 144,000 and then AFTER they are sealed

there is a great multitude that no man can number[coz as sands

of sea and stars of heaven]come out of great tribulation


   In Ch 14,showing the Victory in spirit of 144,000 on Mt Zion

  singing new song...firstfruits followed shortly by hour of

judgement,Babylons fall and HARVEST OF THE EARTH.


  Ch 19 the great multitude in heaven shouting praises to God

for judging the harlot who corrupted the earth and avenging

their blood [come out of great ribulation]


  They are invited to the wedding supper which ARE THE TRUE

WORDS OF GOD [SALVATION OF ALL]

[martincisneros]

24then comes the end

Interesting phrase in the Greek. Thomas Talbott drew my attention to this one in "The Inescapable Love of God" and then later I found at least one translation that'll put it in there:

24After that comes the end (the completion), when He delivers over the kingdom to God the Father after rendering inoperative and abolishing every [other] rule and every authority and power. (Amplified Bible)

Christ the first fruits, then those that are Christ's at His coming, then the completion.  It's only a controversial way of translating it from the standpoint of where it goes in this one passage 'cause it's grounds for saying there's an unquestionably conclusive statement in the New Testament if they don't fight tooth and nail against this one.  Translate it "then the rest" from any other ancient Greek manuscript and you don't get the crows squacking.  Can't remember which Calvinist site that I was reading something Postmillenial from and they alluded to it in passing that supposedly you're wanting to read that into that, either in reaction to Talbott for having said that or previous generations of Universalists throwing it in their faces to their chagrin.

[WhiteWings]

To that WW I would bring up 1 tim 4-10 Jesus the saviour of all men especiallythose who believe. if it were only believers, why not say-"Jesus the saviour of all that believe?

Because there is a debate on what especially means.

Some say means "only the believers" or "that is the believers" or "that means the believers"
So the actully say: "Jesus the saviour of all that believe"

Some say believers in the first place but not excluding unbelievers.
That includes all believers but what does it say about the unbelievers?
The unbelievers are mentioned separately from the saved group.
So possibly not all of them are saved.
Neither does it say what believers and/or unbelievers are saved from

The only thing that can be concluded from that verse is that:
a] There are 2 groups.
b] Believers are saved.
c] What becomes of some/all unbelievers is unknown.
d] What people are saved from is unknown too.

IMO it's very wrong to look beyond the words of a verse.
Of course speculating is part of a good study.
But speculation without verses to backup yours speculation never becomes proof...

[martincisneros]

When you come bring the cloak which I left at Troas with Carpus, and the books, especially the parchments. (2Timothy 4:13)  Same word in the Greek as the passage about Jesus the Saviour of all men, especially of those that believe.  Paul in 2Timothy 4:13 wasn't requesting only the parchments, but that they'd especially be brought along with everything else he'd left behind somewhere.

[WhiteWings]

So the sinners are the parchments.
Well you know the drill by now.... :laughing7:
a] The parchements where already burned/lost
b] They forgot to bring them along
c] The one who has the parchements (satan) refuses to give them back.
d] Especially has a different meaning in different verses...

Etc :winkgrin:

[willieH]

willieH: Hi Jab... :hithere:

Hi guys.  I read this recently and a couple of things got my attention as related to UR.  Would anyone have any specific insights/input into this?

19If we have hoped in Christ in this life only, we are of all men most to be pitied.
The Order of Resurrection
20But now Christ has been raised from the dead, the first fruits of those who are asleep.
21For since by a man came death, by a man also came the resurrection of the dead.
22For as in Adam all die, so also in Christ all will be made alive.
23But each in his own order: Christ the first fruits, after that those who are Christ's at His coming,
24then comes the end, when He hands over the kingdom to the God and Father, when He has abolished all rule and all authority and power.
25For He must reign until He has put all His enemies under His feet.
26The last enemy that will be abolished is death.
27For HE HAS PUT ALL THINGS IN SUBJECTION UNDER HIS FEET But when He says, "All things are put in subjection," it is evident that He is excepted who put all things in subjection to Him.
28When all things are subjected to Him, then the Son Himself also will be subjected to the One who subjected all things to Him, so that God may be all in all.

This is one of my favorite UR verses.  It hit me today though, where does it specifically show the step of "the rest of humanity" in these verses?  There's verse 22 that does say "all", which I understand is the greek word that literally does mean ALL, and not some or a piece of the all.  So we have this;
23A Christ,
23B those who are Christ's (at His coming)
24 then the end, when He hands over the kingdom
25 all enemies under His feet
26 death abolished
27 again, the ALL word...all things unto subjection
28 God is All in All

Besides the use of the word 'all', doesn't it seem like there's a specific step "that's not obviously there", i.e., where the rest of humanity is saved?  Is it more implied than clearly stated?  And if so, maybe that's all part of God's plan of veiling and revealing.

The "rest of humanity" are INCLUDED in those that are CHRIST's:

We must us ask ourselves, ...who are, ...CHRIST's?   :dontknow:

Heb 2:9 ...but we see JESUS who was made a little lower than the angels for the suffering of DEATH, crowned with GLORY and HONOR, that HE by the GRACE of God, should TASTE DEATH, ...for ...EVERY MAN.

There is a crown (not a hat of defeat) of GLORY and HONOR for CHRIST which TASTED DEATH for EACH and EVERY MAN...  That CROWN represents ALL that He DIED for...

EVERY MAN is CHRIST's, James...

The "enemies" which are put under His feet, are those things which separated (all) MEN from the HOLINESS of GOD and the HOLINESS of His WORD...

MEN are not, and never were, GOD's enemies!  We are HIS CHILDREN... which He SO LOVES!

The "enemies" of GOD are those things which, in the process of the KNOWLEDGE, cause a separation (in time) of HIS CHILDREN, ...from their FATHER...

If DEATH is abolished, then it no longer exists as an entity which HOLDS MEN captive within it...

DEATH is the absence of LIFE... When ALL THINGS are reconciled to the LIVING GOD, then DEATH ceases to exist because ALL are again LIVING...

...willieH  :HeartThrob:

[sheila]

 Love that,Willie!

  Declare His GLORY!!!


                      Amen!

[sheila]

 this WORD come to mind

   When the disciples heard this,they were greatly astonished

   and asked ' WHO THEN CAN BE SAVED?"   Jesus looked at

  then and said ;WITH MAN THIS IS IMPOSSIBLE,BUT

    WITH GOD "ALL THINGS" ARE POSSIBLE"


   Ephesians 4;15  Instead,speaking the TRUTH in LOVE

   we will in ALL THINGS grow up into HIM,who is the head

    that is,CHRIST


   Living as children of Light

.....v18  they are darkened in their understanding and seperated

  from the LIFE OF GOD...because of the ignorance that is in

  them DUE TO THE HARDENING OF THEIR HEARTS


   you know nothing other than hard-heartedness would keep

someone from REJOICING IN MANKINDS SALVATION AND

  DELIVERANCE INTO THE KINGDOM OF HIS LOVE

  He will, in His own time and manner remove the stony hearts

of men...and place a new spirit and heart there...

  THAT KEEPS THE ROYAL LAW OF LOVE IN SPIRIT


   BE HOLY[LOVE]

   

[legoman]

Just a note on Hebrews 2:9

Heb 2:9 But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels for the suffering of death, crowned with glory and honour; that he by the grace of God should taste death for every man.

The ETer will not accept this though.  CONTEXT they say... look at verse 10:

Heb 2:10 For it became him, for whom are all things, and by whom are all things, in bringing many sons unto glory, to make the captain of their salvation perfect through sufferings.

The ETer will conclude "every man" in verse 9 only means "many sons" ie. not every man.

This seems a bit silly to me.  If verse 9 didn't mean every man, it could have just as easily said "some men".  Now barring the confusion of saying "every man" when clearly it didn't mean "every man"

How do we explain this from a UR perspective?  A couple of possible ways:
1.  "many sons" doesn't necessarily mean less than "all".  ie. see Romans 5:19
2.  Heb 2:10 is only talking about the elect - those are the "many sons" brought to glory - doesn't say anything about the non-elect.  (Would that be a possible interpretation?)

Peace.

[legoman]

So we have this;
23A Christ,
23B those who are Christ's (at His coming)
24 then the end, when He hands over the kingdom
25 all enemies under His feet
26 death abolished
27 again, the ALL word...all things unto subjection
28 God is All in All

Besides the use of the word 'all', doesn't it seem like there's a specific step "that's not obviously there", i.e., where the rest of humanity is saved?  Is it more implied than clearly stated?  And if so, maybe that's all part of God's plan of veiling and revealing.

I think Martin touched on this above.  There is no step missing, but due to the translation/cultural/language issues, it is not obvious.

The key is in verse 24.  KJV has it as a new sentence:
24 Then cometh the end...

NIV is even worse as it sounds like "the end of the word/age/time":
24 Then the end will come...

YLT gives a clearer description.  Notice verse 23 and 24 is all one thought:
23 and each in his proper order, a first-fruit Christ, afterwards those who are the Christ's, in his presence,
24 then -- the end, when he may deliver up the reign to God, even the Father, when he may have made useless all rule, and all authority and power --

Some relevant definitions for "the end":
- termination, the limit at which a thing ceases to be (always of the end of some act or state, but not of the end of a period of time)
- the end - the last in any succession or series
- that by which a thing is finished, its close, issue
- the end to which all things relate, the aim, purpose


So we have 3 groups, in their own order:
1. Christ the "first-fruit" of the firstfruits
2. Those who are Christs - the firstfruits
3. The end - the rest/termination/limit of the list, last in a series, ie. everyone else.  THERE IT IS!

[Cardinal]

So we have 3 groups, in their own order:
1. Christ the "first-fruit" of the firstfruits
2. Those who are Christs - the firstfruits
3. The end - the rest/termination/limit of the list, last in a series, ie. everyone else.  THERE IT IS!

:cloud9:  Yes, looks like this to me......

1. Christ the "first-fruit" of the firstfruits (Holy of Holies)

2. Those who are Christs - the firstfruits (Inner court)

3. The end - the rest/termination/limit of the list,
    last in a series, ie. everyone else. (Outer court) 

[legoman]

So we have 3 groups, in their own order:
1. Christ the "first-fruit" of the firstfruits
2. Those who are Christs - the firstfruits
3. The end - the rest/termination/limit of the list, last in a series, ie. everyone else.  THERE IT IS!

:cloud9:  Yes, looks like this to me......

1. Christ the "first-fruit" of the firstfruits (Holy of Holies)

2. Those who are Christs - the firstfruits (Inner court)

3. The end - the rest/termination/limit of the list,
    last in a series, ie. everyone else. (Outer court) 

Yes this is the "tabernacle" type isn't it? ie. inner/outer court etc.

Also can be viewed as a harvest "type".  See http://bible-truths.com/lake4.html

1.  The Wave Sheaf (Feast of passover) - represents Christ
2.  The firstfruits (Feast of weeks) - represents the elect
3.  End of year harvest (Feast of tabernacles) - represents the vast majority of unbelievers finally being saved

So should we expect God will reap a small crop in #1 and #2, and then when #3 comes around, God has a GIANT CROP FAILURE?  I don't think so!  :Sparkletooth:

God's year-end harvest will be the biggest of the bunch, all will praise and rejoice!

[jabcat]

!

So we have 3 groups, in their own order:
1. Christ the "first-fruit" of the firstfruits
2. Those who are Christs - the firstfruits
3. The end - the rest/termination/limit of the list, last in a series, ie. everyone else.  THERE IT IS!

:cloud9:  Yes, looks like this to me......

1. Christ the "first-fruit" of the firstfruits (Holy of Holies)

2. Those who are Christs - the firstfruits (Inner court)

3. The end - the rest/termination/limit of the list,
    last in a series, ie. everyone else. (Outer court) 

Yes this is the "tabernacle" type isn't it? ie. inner/outer court etc.

Also can be viewed as a harvest "type".  See http://bible-truths.com/lake4.html

1.  The Wave Sheaf (Feast of passover) - represents Christ
2.  The firstfruits (Feast of weeks) - represents the elect
3.  End of year harvest (Feast of tabernacles) - represents the vast majority of unbelievers finally being saved

So should we expect God will reap a small crop in #1 and #2, and then when #3 comes around, God has a GIANT CROP FAILURE?  I don't think so!  :Sparkletooth:

God's year-end harvest will be the biggest of the bunch, all will praise and rejoice!

Alright, good stuff guys.  When I see particularly useful info, I copy it and save in my files for later study and use.  This is a keeper, thanks!

[aspiring son]

The old testament feasts are a great interpretation of what 1 cor 15 is saying spiritually.

willieH: Hi Jab... :hithere:

Hi guys.  I read this recently and a couple of things got my attention as related to UR.  Would anyone have any specific insights/input into this?

19If we have hoped in Christ in this life only, we are of all men most to be pitied.
The Order of Resurrection
20But now Christ has been raised from the dead, the first fruits of those who are asleep.
21For since by a man came death, by a man also came the resurrection of the dead.
22For as in Adam all die, so also in Christ all will be made alive.
23But each in his own order: Christ the first fruits, after that those who are Christ's at His coming,
24then comes the end, when He hands over the kingdom to the God and Father, when He has abolished all rule and all authority and power.
25For He must reign until He has put all His enemies under His feet.
26The last enemy that will be abolished is death.
27For HE HAS PUT ALL THINGS IN SUBJECTION UNDER HIS FEET But when He says, "All things are put in subjection," it is evident that He is excepted who put all things in subjection to Him.
28When all things are subjected to Him, then the Son Himself also will be subjected to the One who subjected all things to Him, so that God may be all in all.

This is one of my favorite UR verses.  It hit me today though, where does it specifically show the step of "the rest of humanity" in these verses?  There's verse 22 that does say "all", which I understand is the greek word that literally does mean ALL, and not some or a piece of the all.  So we have this;
23A Christ,
23B those who are Christ's (at His coming)
24 then the end, when He hands over the kingdom
25 all enemies under His feet
26 death abolished
27 again, the ALL word...all things unto subjection
28 God is All in All

Besides the use of the word 'all', doesn't it seem like there's a specific step "that's not obviously there", i.e., where the rest of humanity is saved?  Is it more implied than clearly stated?  And if so, maybe that's all part of God's plan of veiling and revealing.

The "rest of humanity" are INCLUDED in those that are CHRIST's:

We must us ask ourselves, ...who are, ...CHRIST's?   :dontknow:

Heb 2:9 ...but we see JESUS who was made a little lower than the angels for the suffering of DEATH, crowned with GLORY and HONOR, that HE by the GRACE of God, should TASTE DEATH, ...for ...EVERY MAN.

There is a crown (not a hat of defeat) of GLORY and HONOR for CHRIST which TASTED DEATH for EACH and EVERY MAN...  That CROWN represents ALL that He DIED for...

EVERY MAN is CHRIST's, James...

The "enemies" which are put under His feet, are those things which separated (all) MEN from the HOLINESS of GOD and the HOLINESS of His WORD...

MEN are not, and never were, GOD's enemies!  We are HIS CHILDREN... which He SO LOVES!

The "enemies" of GOD are those things which, in the process of the KNOWLEDGE, cause a separation (in time) of HIS CHILDREN, ...from their FATHER...

If DEATH is abolished, then it no longer exists as an entity which HOLDS MEN captive within it...

DEATH is the absence of LIFE... When ALL THINGS are reconciled to the LIVING GOD, then DEATH ceases to exist because ALL are again LIVING...

...willieH  :HeartThrob:

AMEN !

Grace and peace,

Brandon

[Doc]

To that WW I would bring up 1 tim 4-10 Jesus the saviour of all men especiallythose who believe. if it were only believers, why not say-"Jesus the saviour of all that believe?

Because there is a debate on what especially means.

Some say means "only the believers" or "that is the believers" or "that means the believers"
So the actully say: "Jesus the saviour of all that believe"

Some say believers in the first place but not excluding unbelievers.
That includes all believers but what does it say about the unbelievers?
The unbelievers are mentioned separately from the saved group.
So possibly not all of them are saved.
Neither does it say what believers and/or unbelievers are saved from

The only thing that can be concluded from that verse is that:
a] There are 2 groups.
b] Believers are saved.
c] What becomes of some/all unbelievers is unknown.
d] What people are saved from is unknown too.

IMO it's very wrong to look beyond the words of a verse.
Of course speculating is part of a good study.
But speculation without verses to backup yours speculation never becomes proof...

The only reason there's a debate on what especially means, is because they can't accept the plain truth of the statement. They're trying to make it say what it does not say. Especially does not mean exclusively.